in_nomine-digest Thursday, September 27 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2393 In this digest: Re: IN> Grammar Re: IN> Grammar Re: IN> In Nomine Chicago IN> Judge Stark - Pt 1 IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 Re: IN> Grammar Re: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 Re: IN> Needs Re: IN> Grammar Re: IN> Superior vs Superior Re: IN> Superior vs Superior Re: IN> Needs Re: IN> Re: I want to be a Skulker IN> Balseraphs and Lies (was Re: Needs) Re: IN> Needs IN> Superior Soap Opera RE: IN> Superior vs Superior Re: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Re: IN> Grammar Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Re: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 Re: IN> Grammar Re: IN> Superior vs Superior Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Re: IN> The INC (Private replies ONLY) IN> Well, crap. IN> While I still have everyone's attention.... Re: IN> Grammar ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 13:04:14 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Grammar Jo Hart wrote: > > I think the singular of 'Shedim' in Hebrew is almost certainly 'Shed.' Okay. I admit, I know nothing. Any ideas on the singular of "lilim"? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 10:54:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Grammar - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > An interesting and possibly more accurate alternative to > "Malakite" for the singular of "Malakim." Malakh is the original term (I don't remember whether it's Hebrew or Arabic; possibly both). > the singulars for "Lilim" and "Shedim" are probably > "Leili" and "Shedu"? The singular for Shedim is definitely Shedu. I don't know from Lilim. 0:> ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 The next time someones says "Talk is cheap," remind them of how much Oprah Winfrey makes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:06:47 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine Chicago Very nice history summary. Only... I see on your page that "Accompanied by a Servitor of Janus, Christopher Columbus sails to the Americas in 1742." Is that a typo? Especially since the American Revolution happens on schedule in 1776, a bare 34 years later... Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:13:36 From: "Michael Cleveland" Subject: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 1 "It is a proven fact that the servants of the Hyena of Heaven are a weak and timid lot with no true stomach for battle." The cloaked Seraph who was being spoken to raised an eye to look over at the Malakite who had spoken to him. Lounging in the lower branches of a tree on the dueling grounds, he was beginning to tire of the sniping and whispers that constantly accompanied his entry into the area of Heaven controlled by War. Still, he had a friend to meet, and friendship required sacrifices at times... Looking down at the black-winged angel beneath him, he spoke softly. "It is my personal opinion that you have absolutely no room to speak, seeing as how you have yet to make your first foray onto Earth. Perhaps you should return to your trainer and make the necessary preparations to become qualified to go there and find out what battle truly is." The Malakite raised his voice slightly. "Are you saying that I don't have what it takes?" "I did not say that, trainee Rubric. Were I of a mind to say such a thing, I assure you that I would say it with much more volume and in such a way that most of your classmates would not be able to help but overhear it." Taking a slightly more condescending tone, "You should head back and pretend to be the big, bad agent of destruction and fear around someone younger who might believe you. Your trainer is coming this way, and I intend to speak to someone competent, rather than you." Rubric glared up at the Judge for a moment more before stalking off, muttering under his breath. He paused in his cursing as he passed a scarred and grizzled Cherub, then continued on towards a group of other young warriors who were commiserating at the edge of the field. The winged cheetah looked back at the group for a moment before he leapt up into the tree beside the Seraph. The two of them sat there for a moment in silence before the Cherub spoke. "I take it that Rubric and the other trainees have been giving you a hard time, Starkariel?" The Seraph twisted his coils around, popping the vertebrae in his spine audibly. "Not that I did not expect otherwise. The Most Just warned me to anticipate less than a warm response here in the Groves. Of course, it is not like either of us are not used to chilly responses from certain portions of the Host. Alberich, you know I..." He paused for a moment to collect his thoughts while the Cherub looked on with a knowing smile. "Since you are one of Michael's trainers, I am typically loathe to comment on your students. However..." Alberich cocked his head slightly. "Rubric getting on your nerves with his comments about Judgment too, Stark? Boy's an idiot. I reported him last week to training command - boy made a boast that all servitors of Judgment were no better than the Hyena that they served, and that he could take any of them under any conditions. Judge Memnoch took him up on the challenge and had to be carried off the field." Stark trained all of his eyes on Alberich and rose up slightly. "He did that to Memnoch? I know that the Dueling Field stops all killing blows and heals people once they leave here, but Memnoch is still emotionally scarred by the beating he got. Several people wanted to bring in 'the responsible party', but he refused to tell who did it." He turned to face the pack of students horsing around in the field. "You know that he is guilty of several charges, Alberich. Something needs to be done about him." The Cherub sighed before speaking. "I know, but my thought has been that if he's taken to the tribunal, it'll only make him more bitter. Worse, it might cause his attitudes to rub off on the rest of the class. I'm not quite sure what to do with him, but I'll take care of it. If he wasn't the most popular and most talented member of the group, it'd be easier..." Wrapping his tail around the tree branch, Stark threw himself toward the ground, releasing his grip and flaring his wings just in time to land on the ground. He turned back to look up at the startled Cherub, and raised a wingtip towards his friend. "Let me save you the trouble. If he is the best you have, then this will not take long..." "Stark, what are you thinking?" Starkariel looked up at Alberich for a moment, and then winked. "Trust me." Alberich started making his way down from the tree. "You know, I hated it when you said that even when we were still in Hell. Redeeming doesn't make it any less unsettling, you know?" As Alberich reached the ground, Stark's disembodied voice entered his head. "Hey, you believed me when I still worked for Kronos, and I was a Balseraph for crying out loud. I am telling you that you can trust me, Alberich. Believe me, I will not bring him in for trial, and I will not hurt him. Not permanently, anyway." (continued in next post) Michael Cleveland Gulf Coast Geotech _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:14:33 From: "Michael Cleveland" Subject: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 Rubric was in the process of flirting with another Malakite when he felt a light tap on his shoulder and heard a soft tenor voice behind him. "Excuse me, but are you the same Rubric that offered an open challenge to any Judge under any conditions?" Rubric rolled his eyes slightly. "Yes, I -" He choked off the end of his sentence as he felt a pair of fangs sinking into the side of his neck and his feet flying over his head momentarily before slamming down on his back. As Alberich made his way to the trainee's portion of the field, the rest of the class looked on with surprise and no small amount of horror as their classmate was beaten and tossed around the field like a rag doll by a screaming Seraph wearing the traditional cloak of a Judge. Some of them began backing up as the Judge's sentences began to be punctuated by sickeningly loud and wet cracking sounds and correspondingly agonized screams from the Malakite. "To the charge of turning your back on a self-avowed opponent - GUILTY! To the charge of arrogance without ability to back up your boasts - GUILTY! To the charge of displaying pride in your abilities when none is warranted - GUILTY! To the charge of failing to evaluate an opponent's capabilities before issuing an open challenge - GUILTY! And to the charge of displaying a lack of faith in Almighty God by questioning his choice for the Archangel of Judgment, I find you guilty, Guilty, GUILTY!!!" Throwing the broken and bloody Malakite towards the rest of his classmates, Starkariel slithered over to loom over the gasping and sobbing angel. "Your sentence is to remember this for the rest of your life. When you speak about your prowess in battle, remember that the first time you truly faced it against an opponent who was not a trainer sworn not to hurt you, you lost. I sentence you to remember that a Judge, someone you thought incapable of harming you, left you beaten and incapable of defending yourself. Here, your wounds will heal once you drag yourself off the field, but once you get to Earth, you will not get that luxury. And I sentence you to remember how you feel right this second, humiliated and in pain. Maybe now you can learn how to show mercy, now that you have learned how to suffer." Raising his voice slightly, he called out, "Now, does anyone else care to try his or her luck?" As he lifted his head to look at the training class, he saw the rest of the class standing at attention and Alberich pointing behind him. "Actually, I think the good Archangels behind you would be willing to take their shot at it." Stark swallowed quietly and then slowly turned around to face the two serpentine figures looming over him. Looking upward at the Archangels of War and Judgment, he straightened himself up before speaking. "Ah. Good afternoon, your Graces. How might I serve you?" Michael bent down to look directly into the eyes of Starkariel. "Judge Stark, might I ask what precisely you thought you were doing to my servitor in my groves?" After a second of hesitation and an eye towards the cloaked Archangel beside him, "I was assisting Trainer Alberich in correcting a minor aberration in young Rubric's preconceived notions about the servitors of Judgment. I was also aware of certain charges that would soon be brought against your servitor, and I chose to help him deal with the underlying problems that were their cause before it became necessary to formally charge him. Furthermore, a formal trial would only have had negative effects on his classes' morale and would have set his training schedule back. I thought it best to handle it privately, rather than waste the time and resources of both organizations." Michael kept his eyes firmly locked on the Judge. "So you thought it in the best interests of War and Judgment to beat my servitor within an inch of his life?" "These are your groves, and their properties are well known. His life was never in doubt, sir. Rubric was guilty of several crimes that would have necessitated a stay in the tribunals if he had been formally charged. And with all due respect, sir - he had made an open challenge to any servitor of Judgment under any conditions. He cannot make the challenge with the stipulation 'under any conditions' and then cry foul when someone takes him up on it, sir. Had I accosted him outside the groves, I would rightly agree that a wrong had been committed, but inside the grove he could not be permanently harmed." Starkariel chewed his 'lip' for a moment, and then spoke again. "Whether I risk your censure or not, I feel that my actions were just in their stated context. I will not back away from that, sir." Dominic spoke quietly. "You feel that this is a correct interpretation of my word?" Stark closed his eyes for a moment then looked at his Archangel. "In this context, yes." Dominic and Michael looked at each other silently for a moment, then the Archangel of war looked down at the young trainees who still stood at attention. "Class, two lessons should be learned from this incident. The first lesson, which Judge Starkariel pointed out to Rubric so effectively, is that one should never make blanket assumptions about an opponent. Although Judgment is seldom found on the true front lines, there are certain people in their organization who are quite capable of holding their own in a fight. Always be wary of an opponent - do not let their preferred modes of operation cloud your ability to properly analyze their capabilities." Dominic then spoke. "The second lesson to be learned is that, when dealing with a member of the Host, you should not judge their worthiness by their Archangel. Many members of the Host were once demons, and as such have a certain perspective that those of us who have known only the light of Heaven can be hard-pressed to match. Your trainer, Alberich, openly admits that he was once a servitor of Asmodeus, and as such you pay special attention to his words regarding the Horde. Not all redeemed make themselves known as openly. Judge Starkariel is a good example of this." He turned to look at Rubric, who had managed to crawl off the field and was leaning against a tree as his wounds slowly closed. "You should consider yourself well trained by this experience, Rubric. Your opponent was once known as Starkelenath, a Captain of Fate who was personally responsible for the Fall of over two dozen angels, including your trainer, and the soul-deaths of over a hundred others. You can never tell who or what someone was before they came to their senses, so never judge prematurely." Dominic then turned to Michael. "Starkariel will be back later once his weekly debriefing is complete. I trust that if you have anything to say to him, it will wait." (to be continued tomorrow) Michael Cleveland Gulf Coast Geotech _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:19:35 +0000 From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Grammar >From: Michael Walton >Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: Re: IN> Grammar >Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 10:54:38 -0700 (PDT) > > >--- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > An interesting and possibly more accurate alternative to > > "Malakite" for the singular of "Malakim." > > Malakh is the original term (I don't remember whether >it's Hebrew or Arabic; possibly both). > > > the singulars for "Lilim" and "Shedim" are probably > > "Leili" and "Shedu"? > > The singular for Shedim is definitely Shedu. > That doesn't sound like a hebrew word (although shedim definitely is). It might be babylonian. I think this is the point at which the origins of these hebrew demons start to get very confused, because I've heard that lilith was originally babylonian also. jo _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:58:44 -0400 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 Bravo! Bravo! Marvelous feel-good-story! It was also a nice slice of life in the heavens. I look forward to the next instalment. Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:01:18 -0500 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Needs At 12:53 PM 9/27/01 +0300, you wrote: >I'm starting a demonic campaign. I've got at least two Lilim PCs and >possibly a >third one, too. I don't have a problem with the Needs of humans (yet!:)), but >the demonic Needs are another matter. Could someone who has a Lilim (or two >or three) in their campaigns tell me how to get to the demonic mindset >enough to >think what a demon Needs? I can imagine what a demon wants, but that's not >what >a Lilim resonate. At their most basic, demons are simple creature, and their needs are based on their Band. Balseraphs need to lie; Calabim need to destroy; Shedim need to corrupt. However, I imagine that's a bit *too* basic. Keep in mind that Needs can take the form of "I need X so that (or lest) Y". In other words, you could catch a demon of Fate who Needs to have that document on his boss's desk yesterday so that he doesn't get torn into his component Forces. Your Lilim could then employ a Balseraph to convince the boss that it *was* there yesterday (for long enough for the original demon to get put on Earth duty, anyway). Of course, at that point the suitably demonic thing to do is collect the geas from the now-Earthside demon and then direct his boss to his last known location. ;) >Also, how well do the Lilim know each other? I realize that it can depend >on how >old the Lilim in question is, but would they know which Prince their sisters >work for or what special skills they have? I would imagine that at least the >Free know each other and that other Lilim know which ones are Free. This is primarily at the discretion of the GM. I imagine that there are Lilim who keep in touch with the Guildhall on a regular basis and know the names of most of the currently-employed Lilim, as well as the Free and Bright ones. However, there are also those who have been on Earth duty for several decades and not even *seen* the Guildhall in at least that long. It's really up to you. >One of the Lilim is a Asmodean. Could the other Lilim know that? How easy >is it >for Asmodeans to find out about the other PCs past? The first is at the character's discretion. On the one hand, it's a dangerous proposition to tell them - they might decide to kill the Asmodean (and pin the blame on the passing Shedite) - but it's also possible to work it into a major power play, with the Gamester quickly exerting the influence she has with the Game to get the others to obey her. As for the second, that's again a GM-discretion case. I'd allow a Knowledge (The Files or The Archives) check, -1 for every Force that the target has beyond the searcher's. (In other words, if a 9-Force Impudite is looking for information on a 12-Force Calabite, he'd be searching at - -3.) However, I'd only allow this when they had access to the Files. - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:04:30 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Grammar From: "Jo Hart" > > I think the singular of 'Shedim' in Hebrew is almost > certainly 'Shed.' So Arthur "Two Sheds" Jackson would be a particularly cunning demon, then? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:17:56 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Superior vs Superior At 1:04 AM -0700 9/27/01, Perry Lloyd wrote: [...] >I felt a moment of severe uncertainty : when to do when two beings of >undefined but incredible power come into a situation where conflict could >arise . . . Have the Servitors Celestial Motioned out of the area, invoke lots of Symphonic disturbance, and later each Superior appears unto his or her Servitors and implies (or states, in Michael's case) his or her victory. O:> Well, Michael might be griping about the tooth-marks on his axe... >Any thoughts/experiences ? You've seen most of my old stand-bys if you've read the GMG (and some that aren't mine, of course, and some that are parallel evolution, and some that I got from there that are _now_ my old stand-bys...). - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:40:47 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Superior vs Superior At 10:04 AM -0500 9/27/01, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >Terry Jackson wrote: > >> Both fighters were so fast and in >> tune with one another that all the servitors saw was Laurence and Baal >> standing inches away from each other, developing cuts and bruises >> once in a while.... then Laurence collapses and Baal vanishes. > >Neat. So who won? Collapsing doesn't sound good, but if Baal won, >why did he vanish? It might have been a pyrhic (gads, that's probably not spelled right) victory for him. I.e., he was about two heartbeats away from collapsing as well, which wouldn't have looked good. (My take would be that Laurence did a kamikaze shot, and paid for it (what's another vessel to a black- wing?), and Baal bamfed out to regroup and replenish his Essence reserves before some reliever came over and kicked him.) But I wasn't there, and it's not my campaign. (In the Soap Opera*, through guile and amazing die rolls, one of our Swordie Brights** managed to -- in a duel with Andrealphus -- actually get in a solid arm-shot on him. He's been too busy to hold a grudge, but she's in heavy-training now in case of repeat challenges...) [* The Superior Soap Opera is _SO_ non-canon as to be mindboggling. But it does come up with some amusing bits here and there. Such as Bright Blade of the Moon (firstborn Daughter of the Forces of the Archangel of the Sword) challenging Andrealphus, Prince of Lust, to a duel... and getting her sisters, Jade (Daughter of the Forces of a bunch of Creationers including the Malakite Angel of Sculpting) and the Angel of Comfortable Fasionable Clothing, to help her out. She wore an outfit of ribbons that looked as if it would totally disintegrate if the right one were cut, and Andre spent most of the duel fighting her outfit, not her; she snipped the "key ribbon" herself, and in a cloud of unravelling ribbons, did a final no-holding-back lunge -- and to the amazement of all, the parry was not _quite_ quick enough. **Bright Blade of the Moon and Wind of Honor. Lilith made a joke about making Laurence a Lilim. Yves and Jean talked him into it (with the concept that her payment, in Forces, would possibly bleed memetics into her). She went through with the process (even though it'd been a _joke_). Later, thinking he wouldn't call her bluff _again_, she offered a second time. So there are two Sword-Daughters.] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 15:13:01 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Needs At 12:53 PM +0300 9/27/01, Mervi Hamalainen wrote: >[...] Could someone who has a Lilim (or two >or three) in their campaigns tell me how to get to the demonic mindset enough to >think what a demon Needs? I can imagine what a demon wants, but that's not what >a Lilim resonate. No, no -- Lilim get "what would get the person feeling that he owed the giver." So what someone _wants_ can also be used. (If you pick up the Liber Servitorum, there's an appendix in the back with a lot of potential Needs (as well as fates, destinies, and dis/honorable deeds). Don't get the LS for _just_ that tight-packed paragraph, but if you happen to want it anyway, there's another use for it.) >Also, how well do the Lilim know each other? It's generally worked out that many Lilim have at least _heard_ of one another -- they network, and a sister might have skills that another sister could use. At least, that's what I've seen, and there's some of that going into proto-canon someday. >One of the Lilim is a Asmodean. Could the other Lilim know that? How easy is it >for Asmodeans to find out about the other PCs past? This is up to the GM. If a Lilim _wants_ to conceal herself, she can use a fake name (either another, more solitary, sister's, or a made-up one who's been "quiet" or "in Limbo" for a while), a fake Prince, etc. If she's the sort to be "open" about her job, though ("Hi! I'm from the Game! I'm here to help you!"), that's okay -- there are probably open Gamesters around, to betra--er... tattl--ah... report potential traitors to. Having one of those be a Lilim is probably perfectly reasonable -- she can spot if the people talking to her _need_ to cover something up, or have someone removed from the area. (This is subject to GM whim, and/or resonating at penalties, as per the IPG.) Finding out about pasts... again, GM whim. Even if the Game has a lot of information (i.e., is scary!), the PC might not get access to it easily, or would have to trade favors to do so. You might simply roll a general reaction roll (i.e., under a 6, with penalties or bonuses as you see fit) whenever she tries to "look up someone's file." If she's got a _target_ to research/watch/bring in, I generally make my Game scary by actually giving them good briefings on the targets. That help? - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:14:28 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Re: I want to be a Skulker At 2:22 PM +1100 9/27/01, james walker wrote: [...] >Well done. Even if the DP's can't make Skulkers, they can breed them, if Remember -- the Children of the Grigori are _human_, not proto-Grigori. (Though that was an idea that I was batting around for a while, it got shot down. Darn. Here, I let it fly free to be used by you twisted people.) Therefore, the Children of Fallen Grigori would also be human -- though probably a lot more likely to be Nephalim. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 15:20:06 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Balseraphs and Lies (was Re: Needs) At 2:01 PM -0500 9/27/01, EDG wrote: >At 12:53 PM 9/27/01 +0300, you wrote: > >>[...] what a demon Needs? I can imagine what a demon wants, but that's not >>what a Lilim resonate. > >At their most basic, demons are simple creature, and their needs are based >on their Band. Balseraphs need to lie; Remember -- Balseraphs don't lie! They change the universe around them! Just ask one... O:> - --Beth Then she says, "Telepathic assault is illegal here." Mallory says "I think you'll find it was not telepathic in the least." Amberlynn says, "Oh? Then what was it?" Mallory says "The universe changed, to suit my whim." Amberlynn says, "Mind-control is illegal." Mallory says "And if you were threatened with physical violence? Economic deprivation? Loss of your family or friends? These are all 'mind control'." Amberlynn points at Mallory. "That falls into the weapon category. _Telling_ someone to do something and twisting their brains is telepathic assault and I'm going to complain to my bioguard company." Mallory says "Your bioguard company did nothing wrong, if I understand the term correctly." Mallory says "Your mind was not controlled. Your protection did not fail. The universe itself merely changed." - --Mallory, Balseraph of the War, goes time-traveling in the forward direction, possibly with a little sideways mixed in. Gotta watch those IOU History Field Trip relics. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:17:23 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Needs From: "EDG" > > At their most basic, demons are simple creature, and their needs are based > on their Band. Balseraphs need to lie; I would disagree slightly with this - Since Balseraphs don't believe they are lying, I would write that as "Balseraphs need to convince others of what the truth *really* is." ;;;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 15:33:22 -0400 From: "S.D." Subject: IN> Superior Soap Opera I've been hearing about the Superior Soap Opera a lot on this ML, and I was wondering just what *is* it? RP, IN-based fic, what? Also, is there any website with records and the like (and if so, can someone link me)? Thanks. ~S.D. Ryukage http://fly.to/sd_nexus/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "I have a week-Geas to play tour guide to a gerbil that Needs to have a Britney Spears-esque pop singer get stripped in public." Me, over IRC, describing the situation my Bright Lilim of Wind was dealing with at the time ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 15:57:07 -0400 From: "Adams, David" Subject: RE: IN> Superior vs Superior [* The Superior Soap Opera is _SO_ non-canon as to be mindboggling. Exactly where can someone find out more about the Superior Soap Opera? Dave Recalling the marriage of Luke and Laura and picturing Laurence and Blandine in their places. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 16:07:02 -0400 From: Cameron McCurry Subject: Re: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 I think the "Reading of the Charges" and the "Pronouncing Sentence" was some of the funniest stuff I have read about a Dominican. Nicely done! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 16:28:02 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Not that what I do in my game has any bearing on reality, mind, but I thought some folks might be interested that I have declared the singular of Lilim to be "Lilot, rhymes with harlot." Also, I'd like to take this opportunity to suggest a few naming changes to be made for IN 2nd edition. 1) Please, please, PLEASE change the Djinn to something more, oh, *demonic*. I rather like Pachadim, except for the fact that they're a minor Band. 2.) Impudites become Incubi/Succubi. 3.) Something to replace the aforementioned Mercurian. Pipe dreams, I know.. - -- Casca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 16:46:01 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Eric Bertish wrote: > > Not that what I do in my game has any bearing on reality, mind, but I > thought some folks might be interested that I have declared the > singular of Lilim to be "Lilot, rhymes with harlot." There's always "Lilite," too, for those that don't like "lili" and "lilu." Where'd you get "lilot"? > 1) Please, please, PLEASE change the Djinn to something more, oh, > *demonic*. Ifrits? > 3.) Something to replace the aforementioned Mercurian. There's the whole "Dictionary of Angels" to browse through. > Pipe dreams, I know.. I share them. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 17:05:33 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature Eric Bertish wrote: > 1) Please, please, PLEASE change the Djinn to something more, oh, > *demonic*. *I'd* like to free up the name "djinn" for use for a prominent race of Ethereals, the Arabic elf-equivalents. (And, by the way, "djinn" is a PLURAL. The SINGULAR is "djinni," or, for the females, "djinna.") Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 17:21:06 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature > There's always "Lilite," too, for those that don't like "lili" and > "lilu." Where'd you get "lilot"? I seem to recall Jo saying a while back that it was an acceptable Hebraic ending. The "rhymes with harlot" I came up with myself, because it fits. ;) > > 1) Please, please, PLEASE change the Djinn to something more, oh, > > *demonic*. > > Ifrits? That, at least, has Abrahamic connotations, as I believe ifrit is the muslim word for demon. If I'm wrong, correct me.. That said, I'm not a big fan of ifrit, either. But I could live with it. > > Pipe dreams, I know.. > > I share them. I knew there was a reason I liked you, Earl. ;) If you're ever in the DC area, give me a holler. - -- Casca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:53:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Grammar - --- Prodigal wrote: > So Arthur "Two Sheds" Jackson would be a particularly > cunning demon, then? That also makes eating Country Crock Shed Spred a dangerous thing... ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 The next time someones says "Talk is cheap," remind them of how much Oprah Winfrey makes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:57:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature - --- Eric Bertish wrote: > 1) Please, please, PLEASE change the Djinn to something > more, oh, *demonic*. In Middle Eastern mythology (some versions, at least), djinn _are_ demons. > 2.) Impudites become Incubi/Succubi. Nah. In Hell, Incubus/Succubus is a job description, not a Band. > 3.) Something to replace the aforementioned Mercurian. I'm with you on this one. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 The next time someones says "Talk is cheap," remind them of how much Oprah Winfrey makes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 15:12:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Judge Stark - Pt 2 - --- Michael Cleveland wrote: > > "To the charge of turning your back on a self-avowed > opponent - GUILTY! To > the charge of arrogance without ability to back up your > boasts - GUILTY! To > the charge of displaying pride in your abilities when > none is warranted - > GUILTY! To the charge of failing to evaluate an > opponent's capabilities > before issuing an open challenge - GUILTY! And to the > charge of displaying a > lack of faith in Almighty God by questioning his choice > for the Archangel of > Judgment, I find you guilty, Guilty, GUILTY!!!" !!! ROACLMWO! ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 The next time someones says "Talk is cheap," remind them of how much Oprah Winfrey makes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 17:12:54 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Grammar From: "Michael Walton" > > --- Prodigal wrote: > > So Arthur "Two Sheds" Jackson would be a particularly > > cunning demon, then? > > That also makes eating Country Crock Shed Spred a > dangerous thing... And snakes' ability to Shed their skin conclusive proof of their demonic nature. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 19:51:20 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: Re: IN> Superior vs Superior On Thu, 27 Sep 2001, Perry Lloyd wrote: > Hey, when characters (encompassing both NPCs and PCs) invoke more than one > superior who oppose one another, how do you handle it ? Good storytelling. Very, very few Superiors are willing to casually go toe-to-toe with each other in mortal combat just because they happen to run into each other. It completely depends on which two Superiors, and the circumstances involving the summoning. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian, Q4B4L! Meow! Ummon asked: "The world is such a wide world, why do you answer a bell and don ceremonial robes?" (Zen Koan) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:35:23 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> The singular of Lilim and other nomenclature > > In Middle Eastern mythology (some versions, at least), > djinn _are_ demons. Last I checked, they were of the mischevious/malicious spirit sort, rather like faeries. > > 2.) Impudites become Incubi/Succubi. > > Nah. In Hell, Incubus/Succubus is a job description, not > a Band. I thought Bands *were* job descriptions, with your Superior modifying how you performed said function. > > 3.) Something to replace the aforementioned Mercurian. > > I'm with you on this one. Yeah, but I've noticed that for all the agreement, no one (myself included) has brought forth a suggestion. - -- Casca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:48:32 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> The INC (Private replies ONLY) As I suggested before, you might want to talk with Robb Kidd (rkidd@ncmec.org) about helping with the site. He's done some fantastic work with cascading stylesheets, and maybe if you split the effort between the two of you the updates would go up that much faster. Also, I have it on good authority that Eric Burns is rather peeved that none of his stuff has ever made it onto the INC. In the interest of goodwill, might I suggest that you find an item worthy of uploading and make it a priority? - -- Casca PS: When you get caught up on the backlog, I *might* be willing to help you keep on schedule like I did in the past. I do not intend for you to beg; I phrase it that way because I don't know if my time will permit, and I'd prefer to be asked when the time is right rather than make a committment now that I might not be able to adhere to later on. Also, I would want several assurances that my ass would NOT be in a sling should there be a repeat of unpleasantness, and I expect it might take some time to get those assurances. To reiterate: You and I are cool, but I still resent Beth for raking me over the fucking coals. - -- C. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:51:43 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: IN> Well, crap. Yep, it looks like I just poseted a private email to the list, and it looks like one that'll generate a fair amount of heat for me. So let me say this now while I have the chance: I do not apologize for what I said. I stand behind it 100%. I do, however, regret that I was sloppy enough to post it a public forum. If the comments contained therein get me booted from the list, so be it. - -- Casca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:54:58 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: IN> While I still have everyone's attention.... .... I'd like to remind people that you have only until the end of the month to vote for the Iron Rev 4 entries. Everyone, including the authors, is encouraged to vote, especially since only one person has voted. Rock the vote. - -- Casca Private emails only, please. The irony would be far too great for any of us.... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 16:13:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Grammar - --- Jo Hart wrote: > That doesn't sound like a hebrew word (although shedim > definitely is). It might be babylonian. Or Assyrian. Not sure -- those mythologies borrowed from each other pretty freely. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 The next time someones says "Talk is cheap," remind them of how much Oprah Winfrey makes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2393 ********************************