in_nomine-digest Thursday, November 15 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2445 In this digest: Re: IN> Existance of Magog IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2444 IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2444 Re: IN> Re: Magog Re: IN>Shedite Princes (was eMagog) IN> Re: Speaking of Canon Rulings ... Re: IN>Shedite Princes (was Magog) Re: IN> Re: Magog IN> Kyriotate AA's Re: IN> Existance of Magog Re: IN> Re: Magog Re: IN> Re: Magog Re: IN> Song of Overlooking Re: IN> Re: Magog Re: IN> Project - Silence Re: IN> Re: Magog IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! IN> Another HTML test Re: IN> Another HTML test Re: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! Re: IN> Re:Legal Demons Re: IN> Re:Legal Demons Re: IN> Existance of Magog Re: IN> Song of Overlooking IN> Lilim DP's Re: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! Re: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! Re: IN> Lilim DP's ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 00:14:45 -0600 From: toadpooka@juno.com Subject: Re: IN> Existance of Magog I think the way IN is handled is the best possible compromise in the ages-old "metaplot" debate. On one hand, people like having events happen in their games, rather than being a world in stasis, but some are worried about books they've already bought becoming obsolete when the plot advances. Say if there was an adventure in which Nybbas was killed. I'd be a little miffed that I bought Superiors 2, but I'd also be upset that no future books will take his (rather extensive) influence in Hell into account. Granted, I can diverge from canon wherever I want, but most people want to keep some canon around for kicks. Having a storyline (Cycle) diverge from the "snapshot world" presented in the main books, change things radically, then not be considered canon works wonderfully for me. The Revelations events make their own canon; if you've played through those, you have enough to go on from there. If you don't, you'll still have other tihngs that don't rule your collection out. I'd love to see other Cycle series' come out, but I understand how they're not hte most marketable books in the world. Adventures are hard enough to sell, but adventures that depend on 4 other $20 books to be run? Has anyone made their own Cycle-type campaigns and put them online? I'm thinking of writing my current campaign up as one; a path that would leave the world very different, but in all would make a new version of the IN setting in the end. From Whom It May Concern, Rich Ranallo "Rock and Roll will be the new planetary culture, believe it or not." - -Prof. Michio Kaku ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2001 22:44:20 -0800 From: "Christopher Hughes" Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2444 - --=_9EC45B5A.48295B51 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Thank you for politely informing me of these issues. I will answer them = in order. 1) I don't know about this e-mail, but I did try a very short message a = couple of days ago (Titled "HTML Test") and that didn't happen. I don't = know if it's due to the length or the duration of time it was up or what, = but if anyone knows or thinks they do, I will do my best to prevent it in = the future. I'm using Novell GroupWise for future reference. 2& 3) I will no longer use that signature while posting to this list. I eagerly await your ideas :-) Chris et alia < Subject: Posting (Was Re: IN> Oduma (long first post)) This sounds like an interesting idea, but before I respond to it (in a=20 different post), there are three things that I feel obliged to bring up. 1) You seem to be posting in both text and HTML, or attaching an HTML=20 version of the email to the email itself. (With Eudora, I'm not quite=20 sure.) Please make sure that you're posting only in text; attaching = files=20 is also frowned upon. 2) Your signature is somewhat excessive in length. A message footer = should=20 never really be longer than four lines in length. 3) Your signature contains what seems to be inappropriate language. = Please=20 be aware that vulgarity like that isn't particularly welcome here. The list rules should have been sent to you when you subscribed (and = please=20 let the list moderator, Elizabeth McCoy, know if they weren't - you can = get=20 them by sending an email to majordomo@lists.io.com with "info in_nomine-l"= =20 in the body); they can also be found at=20 www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/listrules.html (which does contain some text=20 which the majordomo version does not - Beth, please note!). Cheers, EDG>> Fighting for War is like Fucking for Peace, They Are Us, We Are Them, Peace in Afghanistan! Not Jobless, Not Worthless, Just Homeless. By Flower, Bush, and Tree, Wherever you go, Whoever you be, Blessed be, Chris Hughes Stacey Everheart, Flurp, Grok Amiri, Tristissima. - --=_9EC45B5A.48295B51 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="TEXT.htm"
Thank you for politely informing me of these issues.  I will answer them in order.
 
1) I don't know about this e-mail, but I did try a very short message a couple of days ago (Titled "HTML Test") and that didn't happen.  I don't know if it's due to the length or the duration of time it was up or what, but if anyone knows or thinks they do, I will do my best to prevent it in the future.  I'm using Novell GroupWise for future reference.
2& 3) I will no longer use that signature while posting to this list.
 
I eagerly await your ideas :-)
 
Chris et alia
 
<<Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2001 23:37:24 -0500
From: EDG <anthoch@earlham.edu>
Subject: Posting (Was Re: IN> Oduma (long first post))

This sounds like an interesting idea, but before I respond to it (in a
different post), there are three things that I feel obliged to bring up.

1) You seem to be posting in both text and HTML, or attaching an HTML
version of the email to the email itself. (With Eudora, I'm not quite
sure.)  Please make sure that you're posting only in text; attaching files
is also frowned upon.

2) Your signature is somewhat excessive in length.  A message footer should
never really be longer than four lines in length.

3) Your signature contains what seems to be inappropriate language.  Please
be aware that vulgarity like that isn't particularly welcome here.

The list rules should have been sent to you when you subscribed (and please
let the list moderator, Elizabeth McCoy, know if they weren't - you can get
them by sending an email to majordomo@lists.io.com with "info in_nomine-l"
in the body); they can also be found at
www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/listrules.html (which does contain some text
which the majordomo version does not - Beth, please note!).

Cheers,
EDG>>
 
Fighting for War is like Fucking for Peace,
They Are Us,
We Are Them,
Peace in Afghanistan!
 
Not Jobless,
Not Worthless,
Just Homeless.
 
By Flower, Bush, and Tree,
Wherever you go,
Whoever you be,
Blessed be,
Chris Hughes
Stacey Everheart,
Flurp,
Grok Amiri,
Tristissima.
- --=_9EC45B5A.48295B51-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2001 22:48:10 -0800 From: "Christopher Hughes" Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2444 - --=_FBA13E3E.9EFF8D87 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline I apologize for my signature in the last message. Evidently, my command = didn't take on that e-mail. It has taken now and that signature will not = be seen again. - --=_FBA13E3E.9EFF8D87 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="TEXT.htm"
I apologize for my signature in the last message.  Evidently, my command didn't take on that e-mail.  It has taken now and that signature will not be seen again.
- --=_FBA13E3E.9EFF8D87-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2001 23:34:48 -0800 From: daiv Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magog On Wednesday, November 14, 2001, at 05:07 PM, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >> Heaven needs more Kyriotates (one! Count him!) and maybe Elohim. > > That should be, "One! Count them!" I mean, we're talking _Jordi_ there. > Jordi in a class by themself... O:> > > > And yes, I'm in a weird mood right now... I was going to point out that Jordis' Kyriotate attunement, plus his Superior Status, means that he can possess a lot. And then, I thought of something. What if, there really is only One Kyriotate? All kyriotates are just Jordi pulling a superior level Multi-tasking, the likes of which have never been seen before? Shedim are Just undercover agents. They can posses more than one at a time, but the choose because it would violate their cover. Or is that just weird? -Daiv hammer and anvil breath sweat fire and iron forge a destiny ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 07:55:24 -0000 From: "I. Inayat" Subject: Re: IN>Shedite Princes (was eMagog) - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 6:19 AM Subject: Re: IN>Shedite Princes (was eMagog) > I'm surprised at the number of Calabite Princes. Most of them seem > pretty bent for destruction; I wouldn't think enough would survive long > enough to reach Princedom. > While I've been into IN for a few years, I've only recently begun eating > supplements. Who are all these extra Princes? I just finished Superiors > 4, so I know about Alaemon, Mammon, and Fleurity...Who're the others? Balseraph - Baal, Mammon (and Lucifer) Djinn - Asmodeus, Beleth Calabite - Belial, Haagenti, Valefor, and Furfur (Prince of Hardcore, introduced in Night Music.) Habbalite - Fleurity, Vapula Shedim - Malphas, Saminga (Magog was the Prince of Cruelty, in The Final Trumpet.) Impudite - Andrealphus, Kobal, Nybbas (Lilith is human, while Kronos is... something else altogether. /Nominally/, to the rest of Hell - except for Lucifer - he's a Balseraph.) Alaemon... keeps his own secrets. There're a number of possibilites about who - or what - he really is; the truth (or something approaching it) was revealed in Feast of Blades, the adventure with the GM's Screen. As best anyone can tell, though, he /is/ an Impudite. There were a number of dead or disappeared Princes - most of them have got mentions, but no writeups, in canon. Beelzebub, first Prince of Corruption (killed by Uriel), Legion, the Shedite /second/ Prince of Corruption (killed by Raphael), Vephar, Calabite Prince of the Sea (killed by Oannes, Archangel of the Waters), Mariel, Princess of Oblivion (eaten by Haagenti), Gebbeleth, the Balseraph first Prince of Secrets (disappeared), Genubath, Calabite Prince of Rapine (disappeared, Valefor took his place), Makatiel, Habbalite Prince of Disease (destroyed by Asmodeus and Dominic's combined forces), Meserach, Djinn Prince of Sloth (eaten by Haagenti). Imran ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 08:12:52 +0000 From: "Jonathan Walton" Subject: IN> Re: Speaking of Canon Rulings ... >>Will we ever get one on the current existence/nonexistence of Magog? >Can't think why we'd need to... O:> I only ask because it would doubtlessly mean something to Gabriel, at least. If the embodiment of Cruelty _is_ still out there, and she can't do anything about it, it could concievably push her even further towards the edge. Still, I agree with David that SJ would never again waste pages with a reference to him. Too bad, since, as single-minded Demon Princes go, he's a pretty interesting character. Later. Jonathan _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 07:24:32 -0600 From: "Cthulhu" Subject: Re: IN>Shedite Princes (was Magog) toadpooka@juno.com wrote: >While I've been into IN for a few years, I've only recently begun eating >supplements. Who are all these extra Princes? I just finished Superiors >4, so I know about Alaemon, Mammon, and Fleurity...Who're the others? Furfur is the Calabite Prince of Hardcore, featured in R1: Night Music (along with the original Fleurity writeup, iirc). Magog is the DP (I forget his Band) of Cruelty, who was bound on earth by the Host very shortly after Falling, and remained there until the end of the Revelations Cycle, whereupon he was (probably) killed. Beyond the three you've mentioned, I don't think that there are any more cannon DPs who've been given writeups, though there are quite a few dead/missing ones. Cthulhu _____________________________________________ Free email with personality! Over 200 domains! http://www.MyOwnEmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 05:54:56 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magog - --- "William J. Keith" wrote: > Why are there no Lilim Princesses? [snip] > Is there some reason they can't be raised? Does Lucifer > have some > motivation not to do so? Or is Mommy keeping the > competition down? I have a write-up for a Lilim Princess almost done -- gotta finish her history. Stay tuned. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 06:05:12 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: IN> Kyriotate AA's - --- daiv wrote: > What if, there really is only One Kyriotate? All > kyriotates are > just Jordi pulling a superior level Multi-tasking, the > likes of which > have never been seen before? Shedim are Just undercover > agents. They can > posses more than one at a time, but the choose because it > would violate their cover. Or Jordi, the One Kyriotate, has a Superior-level case of MPD and some of his aspects have Fallen. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Find the one for you at Yahoo! Personals http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 09:28:08 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Existance of Magog Sean Gallagher wrote: > There seems to be a general reluctance to advance the setting > in any significant way. I think these things are left dangling as deliberate plot-hooks for GMs. You can have Magog rise from oblivion in YOUR campaign, if that's what you want, but SJG doesn't want other GMs to feel constrained. It might be different if the various additions to the setting actually moved through a significant and satisfying plot, but otherwise (or even not otherwise), it's a risk. Lots of people complain about such changes in the White Wolf "World of Darkness," I gather, and Traveller's "New Era" effort just about slew the series. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 09:42:38 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magog William J. Keith wrote: > Why are there no Lilim Princesses? > Is there some reason they can't be raised? Does Lucifer have some > motivation not to do so? Or is Mommy keeping the competition down? > Mmm, ruthless.... There's no known canonical reason they can't happen, but: - in-game reason: Yes, Mommy is probably worried that such a Princess could break her Lilim-manufaturing monopoly. - out-of-game reason: There are only 14 or Principalities to go around, and balseraphs, calabim, shedim, and impudites are just too generally plausible, thus crowding out lilim, who are sort-of-represented by Lilith herself. (After all, even if she's not technically a demon, she still has the central Lilim schtick of Needs and Geases, and is even the top infernal expert on these, barring Lucifer.) Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 09:46:17 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magog daiv wrote: > What if, there really is only One Kyriotate? All kyriotates are > just Jordi pulling a superior level Multi-tasking, the likes of which > have never been seen before? Shedim are Just undercover agents. Or Shedim are bits of Jordi that flake off and, because they're *supposed* to be parts of The Kyriotate, immediately fall. (Except for Hell-born Shedim, obviously.) This makes redemption for Shedim turn into a semi-pantheistic merging with the One True Kyrio. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 09:52:24 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Song of Overlooking I am reminded of the (super)natural camouflage enjoyed by Death and other personifications, in Pratchett's "Diskworld" series. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 10:00:03 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magog Michael Walton wrote: > > --- "William J. Keith" wrote: > > Why are there no Lilim Princesses? > I have a write-up for a Lilim Princess almost done -- > gotta finish her history. Stay tuned. I wrote up a Lilim Princess of Death (who succeeded to the Word by seducing Saminga into suicide), back in 1999, and can re-post her if anyone on the list didn't catch it first time and is interested. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 10:07:11 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Project - Silence William J. Keith wrote: > Imagine a Hall of the Library, like a vast ruined cityscape, bearing > chunks of wall with graffiti on them.... [Much great etc.] And stretches of pavement with hop-scotch layouts, parking lot directions, and so on. And windows with stuff written in condensation. And rank on rank of refrigerators bearing shopping lists and kid-art. Hey, it's no worse than those chunks of pyramid and ziggaurat they got in at first... Lovely images. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 10:37:09 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magog From: "Earl Wajenberg" > daiv wrote: > > > What if, there really is only One Kyriotate? All kyriotates are > > just Jordi pulling a superior level Multi-tasking, the likes of which > > have never been seen before? Shedim are Just undercover agents. > > Or Shedim are bits of Jordi that flake off and, because they're > *supposed* to be parts of The Kyriotate, immediately fall. (Except > for Hell-born Shedim, obviously.) Either way, that would also explain why Shedim are unable to possess more than one host at a time quite nicely. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2001 00:48:42 +0800 From: Manny Nepomuceno Subject: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! Hey, I'm sorry for posting off-topic but I got this strange e-mail early this morning. I thought it might spark something in some of the people on the list. I have absolutely no idea what the author was on when he/she/it wrote it, but I imagine that it's highly illegal. If anyone can help clear this up I'd really appreciate it; my curiosity's killing me. ;) Manny Neps http://www.geocities.com/angeloffools >To: >From: >Subject: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! >Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 00:28:11 >X-Rcpt-To: >X-DPOP: Version number supressed > >If you are a time traveler or alien disguised as human and or have the >technology to travel >physically through time I need your help! > >Also if you are from any of the following planets and can help me as mentioned >please reply: >Vadikar,Nefarious,Tralfamadore,Valnator,Travers,Edenad > >I come to you for help, and need a way of doing this in the following way >exactly in such a way >that there will be little or no danger. I come to you in peace. Trust and >honesty is an >absolutely must!! > > >My life has been severely tampered with and cursed. >I have suffered tremendously and am now dying! >I need to be able to: > >Travel physically back in time. > >Rewind my life (including my age). > >Be able to (remember what I know now) so that I can prevent my life from being >tampered with >again after I go back. > >I am in great danger and need this immediately! > >Only if you are a time traveler or nice alien and have this technology please >send me a >(separate) email to: > >Robby0809@aol.com > > >Thanks ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 08:42:13 -0800 From: "Christopher Hughes" Subject: IN> Another HTML test How about now? Any HTML? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 10:52:25 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Another HTML test From: "Christopher Hughes" > How about now? Any HTML? It's fixed. :) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 12:39:15 -0500 From: Cameron McCurry Subject: Re: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! > If anyone can help clear this up I'd really appreciate it; my curiosity's killing > me. The side of me that can appreciate Kobal's approach in life is *really* straining to get out at this point... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 13:46:46 -0500 (EST) From: ydobyns@princeton.edu Subject: Re: IN> Re:Legal Demons On Thu, 15 Nov 2001, james walker wrote: > > > - --- Charles Phipps wrote: > >> It annoys > >> Laurence to no end that America among others considers > >> demons U.S. citazens > >> who pay their taxes and don't break laws. > > > From: Michael Walton > > An all-too-plausible reaction on the part of America, I'm > > afraid. More precisely, I can believe that the American > > government would do such a thing. > Preferable to "Lynch on Sight" orders! Imagine how many mundanes would be > killed accidentally! Besides which, I would argue that the attitude is not only plausible, but both legally and ethically correct. For starters, US law would presumably regard demons as "U.S. citizens who pay their taxes and don't break laws" if and ONLY if they are, in fact, U.S. citizens; do, in fact, pay their taxes; and have not, as far as can be determined, break laws. Leaving aside the issue that points 2 and 3 are somewhat uncharacteristic behavior for demons, there is no visible legal reason why somebody who behaves like a law-abiding citizen shouldn't be treated as such. The fact that it is a nonhuman, supernatural being motivated by an abiding malice toward all humanity is and should be irrelevant to its treatment -- as long as it isn't *expressing* its malevolence by *actions*. And as soon as it does start acting like a demon, there will usually be laws against what it's trying to do. York Dobyns ydobyns@princeton.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 11:55:21 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Re:Legal Demons From: > > For starters, US law would presumably regard demons as "U.S. citizens who > pay their taxes and don't break laws" if and ONLY if they are, in fact, > U.S. citizens; do, in fact, pay their taxes; and have not, as far as can > be determined, break laws. So those with roles might be safe, but the others would be viewed as illegal aliens of the worst sort. "we're from INS, division 6." "Not the Infernal Neutralisation Service again!" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 13:06:09 -0500 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> Existance of Magog > Has anyone made their own Cycle-type campaigns and put them online? I'm > thinking of writing my current campaign up as one; a path that would > leave the world very different, but in all would make a new version of > the IN setting in the end. Sort of. I have it outlined in my head, and am currently running my players through it. I was heavily influenced by _Babylon 5_ and as a result I'm doing a similar five-year story arc. By the time the campaign runs its course I expect to have kicked the anthill over and turned the setting into something that is still fun and playable, yet unrecognizable to anyone who hasn't read our summaries of what's gone before. Right now, we're on the last few episodes of Season 2, and the players have that lovely "Oh Christ, we're *screwed*" expression on their faces. Eli has declared that he's the Second Coming, and therefore God -- and lots of angels, including some of the PCs, believe him. The Tsayadim are in Los Angeles, slaughtering demons in ritualistic fashion to gain Purity attunements, and it's believed that they've started worshipping Uriel. The resident Prophet of the group thinks that the Second Rebellion will occur as a holy war between worshippers of Eli and worshippers of Uriel. Of course, she has problems of her own; when she's not having visions or experiencing stigmata, she must find the Second Witness of Revelations before time runs out, and her life is being complicated by En-Babel, the Second Beast, a human with the ability to spoof angelic resonances (resonance ECM, in a way.) Then there's that mysterious stranger in a Wermacht gray longcoat with a fondness for Claymore mines and hollowpoint bullets tipped with *the Blood of Christ* ...... Mentioning the Vapulan Jormungandr at this point would make it far too confusing, so I'll stop. :) Yeah, it's nuts. Maybe, when it's finished, I can write it up. If I haven't forgotten it, gone insane, or been lynched by my players. - -- Casca "Yes, but we have lovely fish here!" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 10:21:32 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Song of Overlooking Gah! I would definitely adjust that duration to minutes instead of hours. Otherwise it gets abusive real quick. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Find the one for you at Yahoo! Personals http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 10:28:16 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: IN> Lilim DP's - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > I wrote up a Lilim Princess of Death (who succeeded to > the Word > by seducing Saminga into suicide), back in 1999, and can > re-post > her if anyone on the list didn't catch it first time and > is interested. Count me in! ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Find the one for you at Yahoo! Personals http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 12:24:19 -0600 From: toadpooka@juno.com Subject: Re: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! I understand your confusion upon recieving this, but what makes you think that it's "Highly illegal?" On Fri, 16 Nov 2001 00:48:42 +0800 Manny Nepomuceno writes: > I have absolutely no idea what the author was on when he/she/it > wrote it, but I imagine that it's highly illegal. If anyone can help clear > this up I'd really appreciate it; my curiosity's killing me. From Whom It May Concern, Rich Ranallo "Rock and Roll will be the new planetary culture, believe it or not." - -Prof. Michio Kaku ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 13:36:10 -0500 (EST) From: Eileen Catherine Krasowski Subject: Re: IN> [off-topic] Fwd: Time travelers PLEASE HELP!!!!!! The substance the author was smoking, I imagine... On Thu, 15 Nov 2001 toadpooka@juno.com wrote: > I understand your confusion upon recieving this, but what makes you think > that it's "Highly illegal?" > > On Fri, 16 Nov 2001 00:48:42 +0800 Manny Nepomuceno > writes: > > I have absolutely no idea what the author was on when he/she/it > > wrote it, but I imagine that it's highly illegal. If anyone can help > clear > > this up I'd really appreciate it; my curiosity's killing me. > > >From Whom It May Concern, > Rich Ranallo > > "Rock and Roll will be the new planetary culture, believe it or not." > -Prof. Michio Kaku > - -- "We can do no great things; only small things with great love." -Mother Teresa ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 13:41:50 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Lilim DP's Back by a popular request: Azazel, Superior Spirit of Death "Death is the great equalizer." === Then he shall take the two goats, and set them before the LORD at the door of the tent of meeting; and Aaron shall cast lots upon the two goats, one lot for the LORD and the other lot for Azazel. And Aaron shall present the goat on which the lot fell for the LORD, and offer it as a sin offering; but the goat on which the lot fell for Azazel shall be presented alive before the LORD to make atonement over it, that it may be sent away into the wilderness to Azazel. -- Leviticus 16:7-10 The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss. ... They had as king over them, the angel of the Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon. -- Revelation 9:1,11 And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time. -- Revelation 20:1-3 === Anchor Balseraph: "And now, Nybbas News Network brings you our exclusive interview with Azazel, the newly crowned Princess of Death. We now join our ace investigative reporter Hackenflast, in Abaddon." Cut to view of an Impudite in an Armani suit, looking Solemn. Behind him is a dimly lit hall in Gothic architecture, composed of bumpy white things, presumably bones. Miscellaneous demons and damned souls are hithering and thithering, but a number of them are going over the architecture with measuring tapes, taking notes on clip boards. A lot of them look scared (very normal in Hell), but even more look bewildered (not that abnormal) and a few even look hopeful (very odd). Hackenflast: "Thank you, Toadpipe. Your Highnesses, your disgraces, my thorns, shadies and gentledevils, and damned scum everywhere, it is my great honor to introduce the newest horn in Hell's crown, Azazel, Lilite Princess of Death." The Shedite holding the camera (*and* the lights *and* the mike boom) squelches forward and around a corner. Hackenflast tries to back up suavely, but trips over the bumpy floor and has to flap his wings to keep his balance. The corner turn reveals a much grander hallway, filled with very still demons, centered on a large, pale throne. A black goat sits on it. As the camera approaches, leaving the Impudite behind for the moment, the goat rises and turns into a skeleton in a black robe. It comes down the steps and gives a gracious nod, simultaneously morphing into a cute young woman in a black evening gown and an even darker nimbus, her hair and eyes shiny black, her skin stark white. She smiles. Very warmly. Hackenflast, oiling back into the frame: "Your Highness, thank you so much for granting this interview." Azazel: "Not at all. I want to make my position clear." (A balseraph in the crowd behind her is seen to roll all of its eyes.) "Ask your questions" Hackenflast: "Your Highness, this is an enormous surprise to the infernal public, of course. Would you be willing to tell us anything about how you acceeded to the Word of Death?" Azazel (smiles): "I'd be happy to. I'll even tell you the trick, since it'll never work again. I inherited the Word from Saminga. He left it to me in his Last Will and Testament. With the last of his will, actually..." Hackenflast: "So Saminga is-- is indeed--?" Azazel: "Dead. By suicide." (Again the smile.) Hackenflast: "And can Your Highness give any motive for this suicide?" Azazel: "Saminga was particularly wary, you know, of any of his Servitors growing too powerful. I am a Free Lilite, but I often did work for him. He often sent me to reduce the power of his minions. In many cases of Wordbound death-demons, I did so by introducing them to a new vice: Force-burning. They can increase their Word Forces by deliberately destroying one of their other Forces, thus consumately serving their Word. In effect, they convert a non-Word Force into a Word Forces." Hackenflast: "But how can a mere demon do that? Doesn't that take the intervention of--" Azazel: "A Superior. Yes. Saminga himself. I persuaded his, um, overgrown Wordbound into coming to him voluntarily, to have their Forces burned. Rearranged, really. They lost something, yes, but they gained in Word-power, and in their Master's favor. Those that he didn't decide to destroy outright, of course." Hackenflast: "And Saminga fell victim to this himself?" Azazel (purrs): "Mm-hm. Did I mention that the experience is ecstatic? For a Death-worded. Might also work for Gluttony. Maybe even Fire. Think about it, kids.... But, yes, old Saminga got in the habit of occasionally sawing off one of his own Forces and giggling as he watched his Word grow. I think people have noticed that, for instance, in recent years, his Ethereal powers weren't all you might expect in a Prince.... As his judgement weakened, he began to rely on me more. Finally, he was almost all Word, just one *leeettle* speck of Celestial Force left. He *so* wanted to be *all* Word, nothing but his Word -- think about *that*, all my peers out there. But a Word's not a Word if there's no one to hold it. So I persuaded him, as his last act, as he became nothing but Word, to give himself to me. "And here I am." Hackenflast (swallows drily, twice, before getting out): "And Lucifer has confirmed this ... final gift?" Azazel (shrugs): "We've never met." Hackenflast (wobbles visibly): "Would you-- Would Your Highness care to tell our viewers about your background?" Azazel: "Sure. As I said, I'm a Free. I worked off all my birth geases a long, long time ago. I've stayed in the black, geas-wise, for most of the time since, and I've never, *never* taken service with any Prince, though I have, over the millenia, done jobs for almost all of them. That kept the Game off my neck. Not that they haven't hastled me about once a decade, or more. (Hi, out there, Asmodeus!) I suppose--" (World-weary sigh.) "--it's because I also took jobs for ethereals and for Heaven. But, hey, Free is Free. Hit jobs, mostly. That made it natural that a lot of my work was for Saminga. And I was *so* reliable. And not even Worded. Made him feel safe. And I want all of *you* to feel safe, too. Rest assured, I'm even *more* reliable than ever!" (She blows a kiss at the camera. There's a burst of static.) (Straightens and smiles brightly into the camera.) "And now for the product pitch: Death is under new management. It's clean, quick, and efficient. It's not about rot anymore; it's about results. And it's for hire. "Do you have people standing in your way? We'll move them aside. Just come in and talk about the price. "Or are you at the end of your rope? After all, you're in Hell! Well, we can make your second death completely painless, even ecstatic. Deutero-euthanasia! Your ticket out of an eternity of misery! Even if you're a shut-in, our agents will be contacting you. So have hope! (Sorry, Beleth.) "And, last, but not least, I'm hiring." (Beams into the camera.) Hackenflast: "Th-th-thank you, Your Highness." Azazel: "Sure. Come by, when it gets to be too much." === Azazel (whose name means either "goat-god" or simply "removal") is a very old demon, one of the first Lilim created by Lilith, and far older than the late Saminga. She even predates much of the Principality system in Hell. She has long been a poster-demon for Free Lilim, a creditor, not a debtor, so Free she even deals with Heaven, even to the point of going 50-50 with God and getting a yearly goat sacrificed to her by divine decree -- said goat to run free in the wilderness. Asmodeus and Dominic would both like to label Azazel as a Gray Renegade, and would have offed her long ago, except that (1) on the infernal side, she's a Free and thus has no Superior to be Renegade *from* (certainly not Lilith, who's quite pleased with her), and (2) on the heavenly side, she apparently has that "in" with God or at least the Seraphim Council, probably for services rendered in the way of some smiting, way back when. Now, as just described, Azazel has supplanted Saminga. The story she told the Media demons was the truth, as far as it went. But of course only the Seraphim Council and Lucifer can go around handing out Words. Them and One other. Azazel was not sure her seduction of Saminga would really win the Word of Death for her, but she was willing to gamble, since at least she would rid the universe of Saminga, whom Azazel hated for all the usual reasons people hated Saminga. At the crucial moment, Azazel was quite unable to absorb Saminga's Word Forces, even with the cooperation of the deceasing Prince. But there was an Intervention. A tall shadow stepped out of the other darkness and Azazel faced Azrael, the Outcast Grigori Archangel of Death, who offered her a partnership. Azazel accepted. Lucifer is NOT pleased. He knows, of course, that *he* didn't hand Saminga's Word to Azazel, though he has no idea how she got that Word. And he knows how pale a shade of black Azazel seemed to be. He has considered the possibilities that God or the Seraphim Council gave her the Word, or that she actually did get it from Saminga on her own, by her own methods. All of these possibilities are bad news, but the last would be the least bad. As far as Lucifer's concerned, Azazel is a Renegade now, but he hasn't told anyone else. He doesn't want it known that there can *be* Renegade Princes. He may tell Kronos and Asmodeus soon, but it may be a long time before the information travels any further. Or he may let everyone think this is a Cunning Plan of his own. That might be safer, and even useful in keeping the other Princes off balance. *Sigh.* Saminga was *so* easy to control. Lucifer also knows quite well about the prophecy in Revelation, about the Abaddon angel that will imprison him in the Abyss for a thousand years, between Armageddon and the Last Judgement. Meanwhile, none of the other Princes are at all happy about Azazel going poaching among their damned souls with offers of celestial euthanasia, or stealing away their servitors, though some find her a distinct improvement over Saminga in other ways. Azazel has made lots of changes in Abaddon. First of all, she's remodeling that palace of bones into something much more modernistic, in obsidian. And Abaddon has begun *sinking*, or something. There are cliffs at the boundaries, getting higher all the time. Probably people will start calling it "the Abyss" soon. At the bottom, Abaddon has become an endless desert of silver sand. The damned huddle on it or wander over it, each totally alone, never coming in sight of another human soul. Sometimes, they encounter demons; if they are lucky, it's one of Azazel's mercy killers, with an offer of oblivion (which they can take or leave). Azazel's also changing how Abaddon runs. She's out of the Undead business, for one thing. She doesn't stop others from making them, but she won't strip-mine Forces out of damned souls for grafting into new Undead. When Saminga's supply of extra Forces is gone, that'll be it. Any new Undead won't get that extra Force at their creation. Instead, Azazel harvests forces by Second Death, her specialty celestial euthanasia, offered to damned souls (and demons) who would rather cease to be than continue in Hell. She keeps all the resultant Forces. She also gets the Forces from the soul-killed victims of her hit demons. These Forces she uses to make more servitors. Like most Lilim, she doesn't like Shedim, and so far hasn't made any. Rumors are already circulating that this first Lilite Demon Princess has made -- or at least has tried to make -- her own Lilim, duplicating her mother's trick. Both versions of the rumor remain unconfirmed. DISSONANCE CONDITION It is dissonant for Death servitors to attempt a soul-kill on the Corporeal or Ethereal planes. BAND ATTUNEMENTS Azazel appears to be re-tuning Saminga's old servitors and making new ones on a highly individualized basis. Perhaps she is still experimenting. There are no set Band attunements yet. SERVITOR ATTUNEMENTS Most of Azazel's servitors have one or more of three jobs: mercy killers, hit artists, or "coroners." None of them cause Disturbance when they kill. Mercy Killers Mercy killers are the ones who offer second death to the despairing, almost always in Hell, though they *could* dismantle a soul on Earth. Since they must infiltrate the domains of other Princes, who don't *want* their Essence-generating vicitms killed, they must be consumate sneaks, and have the Songs and skills necessary for that task. Each also has an artifact made by Azazel or one of her trained crafters, which delivers an ecstatic celestial death and stores the Forces within itself. This artifact is almost always in the form of a weapon. The mercy killer then returns to Abaddon and delivers the Forces to Azazel. Hit Artists Hit artists have similar skills and do the same thing, only their victims are not volunteers. Also, hit artists work for hire, getting paid in geases, Essence, money, or whatever. It is perfectly according to Hoyle (or according to Azazel) to spare a victim who offers you better pay to do so. However, hit artists must split their pay with Azazel 50-50 or suffer dissonance (and her displeasure). The same applies to any mercy killers who get paid for their services. Hit artists only do corporeal kills on the Corporeal Plane, and only soul-kills on the Celestial Plane, Hell. Attempting soul-kills on the Corporeal Plane produces dissonance. This looks like it might be a sort of natural law for her new spin of the Word of Death (or so Azazel hopes), but it's really because Azazel is, after all, on a secret mission for God. Coroners The so-called "coroners" practice a sort of inverted Rite, called Death Certificate. Other Rites get Essence from the Superior. Coroners generate two points of Essence by performing their Death Certificate Rite at the corporeal death of an animal or person. Physically, this usually amounts to noting the death in a little black book, e.g.: Mrs. Emma Parkins, 87, 4411 Huguenot-Velloon Drive, Empheusa, California, 2001/04/15, 22:07, heart failure or raccoon, U.S. Hwy 93, near exit 2, 2001/05/01, around midnight, roadkill This is in addition to the diffuse Essence that the natural processes of death channel through Azazel's Tethers from the corporeal realm. Coroners get to keep one of the two Essence points for themselves, but if they try to keep the other, they get dissonance. It is entirely up to the individual coroner, whether or not they cause the death in question. They have Songs for divining upcoming likely deaths and for invisibility. Azazel and Azrael intend, as their long-range plan, that Abaddon shall sink ever deeper, away from the rest of Hell, until it becomes a third celestial domain, a neutral black hole, a realm of pure removal. If they are clever and lucky (and blessed?), it will happen gradually, and be accomplished before Lucifer realizes. Then Abaddon becomes a refuge for the Grigori and other Outcasts, and for any Renegade demons who want to come. And the two Spirits of Death settle down to wait, preparing for the day when Abaddon becomes Lucifer's prison. DISTINCTIONS Azazel has not given out any distinctions yet. POLITICS Heaven and the rest of Hell are surprised, of course. Both have a wait-and-see attitude. Both tend toward cautious optimism. Blandine: "Less horror attached to death, that's clearly good. But not if it makes death more attractive." David: "She's weakened the cohesion of Hell. Good. And it doesn't look like she'll be any more trouble than Saminga. Maybe less." Dominic: "The Word of Death was run by something stupid and repulsive. Now the Word-holder is clever and seductive. We should be wary and not put excess weight on her old bargain with God, which I never understood." Eli: "Well, *that* was creative. Cool move. Cool lady. I hope she can keep her cool down there." Gabriel: "The star takes up the key. The locust king is crowned." Janus: "What a gas! She conned Saminga out of his Word and his life! She'll clearly shake things up down there. That's gotta be good." Jean: "It will be interesting to see if she can make her own Lilim." Jordi: "She's one of the few who know how to accept an animal sacrifice. I don't care if her servitors draw Essence from tallying animal deaths, so long as they don't cause them." Laurence: "She was the most honorable demon I ever knew. I hope some of that survives her elevation." Marc: "A business-woman, clearly. Usually, a clever opponent is worse than a stupid one, but in this case, we may have an easier time of it, since she seems to lack Saminga's blind malice." Michael: "We'll face weaker undead and Hell will have a higher rate of soul mortality. That much is an improvement." Novalis: "Never a friend of peace. But at least she can be bought off." Yves: [No comment.] Andrealphus: "At *last* we are rid of that disgusting Shedite! And did you notice how she did it? You can clearly see my training at work there. But her mercy killers better not try selling their death-ecstasy here in Shal-Mari." Asmodeus: "So the Renegade has returned to us, in an elegant move. Or has she? Any new Prince must be thoroughly investigated, but this one even more so." Baal: "Saminga supported my Word. But as long as Azazel does the same, I will accept her just as readily. She could clearly make a better ally if she chooses to. But let's see her ferocity first. Let her mercy killers come; they will only weed out the ones with no stomach for fighting." Beleth: "The Word of Death run intelligently. Now *that's* scary." Belial: "She wants to steal my fuel! You think I'm gonna put up with that?! And as for burning chunks of myself to stoke up my Word, you think I'm gonna fall for-- Hm..." Haagenti: "She wants to eat my lunch! You think I'm gonna put up with that?! And as for eating chunks of myself to fatten up my Word, you think I'm gonna fall for-- Hm..." Kobal: "What an exit for old Sammy! I like this kid's style. Just as long as she doesn't try to cut into my audience share." Kronos: "The rotting idiot has met his Fate. Good riddance. Clearly, this one knows how to draw victims to herself. She could be very useful, if she'll exert herself." Lilith: "You go, girl! The first Daughter Princess! About time!" Malphas: "Her hit artists are an excellent tool for the Word of Factions. Her mercy killers-- what place has mercy here?" Nybbas: "Finally! I've said for *centuries* that Death could be given more glamour, and it looks like this girl can do it. As for her mercy killers, I'm not worried; I have my audience sewed up." Valefor: "What a gas! She conned Saminga out of his Word and his life! But if she tries to run her scams on my turf, I'm ready for her." Vapula: "A facinating display of technique. As for all the fuss about mercy killers -- tut! I have to do the same in my dissection studies and tests to destruction. There are always more damned, and it's no more than they deserve." RITES The inverted Coroner rite, part of the Coroner attunement. See above. CHANCE TO SUMMON: 4 SUMMONING MODIFIERS: +1: a death in progress +2: a Coroner rite in progress +3: an offer of 10 or more Essence +4: an offer of 3 or more Forces (*not* necessarily your own, though those will do...) +5: an offer of a recruit ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2445 ********************************