in_nomine-digest Wednesday, November 21 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2454 In this digest: Re: IN> Re: IN: Newbie Re: IN> Re: IN: Newbie Re: IN> Re: Newbie Re: IN> Re: Something Different IN> Re: Blessed IN> Re: Angels and Religion Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion Re: IN> Re: Blessed Re: IN> Prj. Silence - Captive Vignette Pt 4 (end) Re: IN> Lilim Princess? Re: IN> Where? Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question Re: IN> Re: Blessed IN> Rebirth Pt 1 Re: IN> Newbie Re: IN> Re: Blessed Advantage Re: IN> Newbie IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2453 IN> Rebirth Pt 2 Re: IN> Re: Blessed Re: IN> Re: Something Different IN> IPG/APG Re: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 Re: IN> Leilani pt 1 RE: IN> Abiressia Part III Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2453 IN> Raziel? Vocatiel? Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question Re: IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Raziel? Vocatiel? Re: IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion IN> Eli Solution Re: IN> Eli Solution Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 19:50:27 -0500 From: "Brian R. Boyko" Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN: Newbie At 09:03 AM 11/20/01 -0600, you wrote: >Brian R. Boyko wrote: > > >Well, with In Nomine - the core rulebook is really all you need, unlike > >some games in the WoD line - (Mage & GTTT comes to mind) Although there's > >only so much stuff you can cram into the core book. > >Sorry, GTTT? I just can't work out what that is. Guide to the Technocracy - Mage gives you a pretty good idea of how to create Mage characters - but if you want antagonists that have more depth than drop targets, GTTT is almost essential. There's an exception to this - - Mage 2nd edition (not revised) had the necessary information to run a Mage chronicle - and many prefer the 2nd edition rules to the third edition ones. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 19:51:10 -0500 From: "Brian R. Boyko" Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN: Newbie At 03:37 PM 11/20/01 +0000, you wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: Cthulhu >To: >Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 3:03 PM >Subject: IN> Re: IN: Newbie > > > > Brian R. Boyko wrote: > > > > >Well, with In Nomine - the core rulebook is really all you need, unlike > > >some games in the WoD line - (Mage & GTTT comes to mind) Although there's > > >only so much stuff you can cram into the core book. > > > > Sorry, GTTT? I just can't work out what that is. > > > > Silly Cthulhu > >Either Guide to the Technocracy or Guide to the Traditions (both share the >same >acronym - GttT. Usually differentiated as GttTech and GttTrad). Not sure which >he means. oh, Guide to the Traditions *did* come out, didn't it? Guess I can't call it GTTT anymore. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 01:08:33 +0000 (GMT) From: Rhodri James Subject: Re: IN> Re: Newbie In article , Alison Lowe wrote: > Thanks for all your help guys! Plus, I'm gonna appologise for not > trimming my last post -- especially for you guys who get the daily > digest. Feel free to chastise and rant as much as you wish, not > trimming is one of the worst Internet Sins. Our pleasure, honestly. Not that I helped, I was too busy being creatively nasty all weekend and I'd have ended up ranting at you without being helpful, which didn't strike me as very fair. However, if you're inviting... Can I put out a personal plea to people in general (not just getting at you Alison, honest :-) not to top post. If you insert your comments after the relevant bit of text you are quoting then it is so much easier for readers to pick up the context, and so much easier to remember to trim! - -- Rhodri James *-* Wildebeeste herder to the masses If you don't know who I work for, you can't misattribute my words to them ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 19:30:09 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different - --- Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > But, mind, not everyone uses the canon. O:> Oddly enough, I am. Oh, I'm fiddling with the odd house rule or two, but I haven't derailed canon yet. Moe ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 11/13/01(this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 14:54:58 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Re: Blessed > Michael Walton wrote: >> - --- james walker wrote: >> If you actually want to help people, you ask the question >> - where are my >> talents most useful? For someone with Blessed, the >> obvious options are law, >> politics and audit. As such, even those who are motivated >> by noble desires will be funneled into those careers. > > This reeks of personal bias. Mother Theresa was neither > a lawyer nor a politician. [snip] So what? Seriously? What makes you think she had the Advantage? That she strove for holiness? Again, so what? How holy are Mummies? Vampires? Sorcerers? Soldiers of Hell? They're not. They can have the Blessed Advantage. Holiness is not a prerequisite for the Advantage. Quoting from the description: "their blessing sometimes makes them *more* selfish than average" They are "blessed" in the sense of "fortunate". > As I said before, the > Blessed Advantage is useful for _leaders_, No, it's useful if you have to resist Fast-Talk, Seduction, Songs and Resonances. None of the individuals you listed needed the increased resistance. Some of them *may* have had the Advantage, but as it would not have been particularly useful for them, there is no reason to assume that they did. Their lifestyles would make it more likely that they would acquire during their lives, true; but that isn't relevant to a discussion about those who are born with it. James. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 15:07:08 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Re: Angels and Religion > Michael Walton wrote: >>- --- james walker wrote: >> More worryingly, in one of Paul's Letters, it says that a >> demon/ the >> demonically possessed cannot say "Christ is Lord"; a >> demon doing so and >> pointing out the relevant passage in the Bible is going >> to have a a massive >> advantage when dealing with any Christian. > > No. Only with those who actually know the Bible -- which > most do not, despite protestations to the contrary. I repeat: "pointing out the relevant passage". Any demon who needs to deal with Christians is likely to memorise the Chapter & verse. The fact that the demon appears to know the Bible better than his victim will simply add to the effect. > From: David Edelstein > Michael Walton wrote: >> No. Only with those who actually know the Bible > > And only with those who take it literally as well. A person blinks into existence in front of you. They demonstrate other supernatural powers. They claim to be an angel, and use a Biblical text to "prove" that they aren't a demon. How "metaphorical" would you consider the Bible to be at this point? :-) >> damienw[et]juno.com wrote: > That sounds entirely reasonable to me, too; One of the points of IN, > (IMO) is that many of the details of the realities of Heaven and Hell > have been lost or distorted in earthly religions, although many of the > *essentials* are correct. Perhaps Paul ran into such a Balseraph and > generalized the experience to all demons, or some such thing, in the In > Nomine universe. Now THAT is an interesting idea. If the founders of the early religions faced different bands of demons, it would explain the variations in belief about them, and the similarities as well... James. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 22:22:09 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion james walker wrote: > I repeat: "pointing out the relevant passage". Any demon who needs to deal > with Christians is likely to memorise the Chapter & verse. The fact that the > demon appears to know the Bible better than his victim will simply add to > the effect. Most Christians will be familiar with the saying "Even the Devil can quote scripture"... > A person blinks into existence in front of you. They demonstrate other > supernatural powers. They claim to be an angel, and use a Biblical text to > "prove" that they aren't a demon. How "metaphorical" would you consider the > Bible to be at this point? :-) Me personally? Being an atheist, I'd consider lots of other hypotheses more likely than angels or demons. What would a Christian think? Probably that he was being confronted with a supernatural being of some sort -- but the fact that that supernatural being can quote Bible verses wouldn't likely be immediately convincing to anyone with intelligence that the creature is necessarily an angel. (Indeed, Christians predisposed to believe in literal angels and demons who manifest corporeally on Earth tend to be the more paranoid types, who would probably suspect a demon masquerading as an angel and trying to deceive believers.) - -David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 22:23:34 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Re: Blessed james walker wrote: > They are "blessed" in the sense of "fortunate". No, they are blessed in the sense of "touched by higher powers." - -David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 20:48:34 -0800 From: Tony Zbaraschuk Subject: Re: IN> Prj. Silence - Captive Vignette Pt 4 (end) ..... wow! The whole thing was really, really, good. Encore! Encore! Tony Z - -- "The King with half the East at heel is marched from lands of morning; His fighters drink the rivers up, their shafts benight the air, And he that stays will die for naught, and home there's no returning." The Spartans on the sea-wet rock sat down and combed their hair.--A.E. Housman ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 21:14:55 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Lilim Princess? - --- Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > If it's under 10K on your system, then don't sweat it too > much. Danke schoen! > (2nd one came in at 8K, BTW.) Huh. And I clocked it at 6.6k at home. Go figure. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 21:18:43 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Where? - --- Jim Burzelic wrote: > Which books contain info on Raphael and Legion and > their battle? The APG and the IPG are the best sources, IMO. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 21:19:32 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question - --- Jim Burzelic wrote: > In a celestial battle are the forces destroyed as in > no more as in the Symphony has gotten smaller? Or do > they return to the Symphonic pool that is Potential? IIRC, the Forces are recycled into the Symphony. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 21:26:51 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Re: Blessed - --- james walker wrote: > What makes you think she had the Advantage? That she > strove for holiness? That's the usual way for people who aren't born Blessed to become that way. That's canon, I believe. > Holiness is not a prerequisite for the Advantage. Quite so. I wouldn't call Bob Dylan holy. > No, it's useful if you have to resist Fast-Talk, > Seduction, Songs and Resonances. That's a game effect, but being Blessed is more than game mechanics. Blessed persons -- and it says this in the description of the Advantage -- have an innate resistance to having their free will tampered with. This means that they are even freer than most Mortals when it comes to making choices. Thus, Heaven and Hell have a harder time influencing such people toward their Destinies or Fates, respectively. And Blessed individuals don't become that way because it's useful; the usefulness is a mere side effect of the real value of Blessedness; that one has greater assurance that one's moral choices -- for good or ill -- are truly one's own. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 19:26:13 +1300 From: "Terry Jackson" Subject: IN> Rebirth Pt 1 What someone said about Makatiel's Remnant sparked off a thought today. I was remembering what happened to Megatron...... *** Brazil The day dripped off his skin. Each breath choked in his lungs as they fought off the moisture. Ragged gasps for the most part, each one more laboured than the last. Shattered memories collided with one another in his mind, drawing him closer and closer to the source of his pain. Unconsciously he had coughed deliberatly on the last person to ask him if he was alright. Somehow it felt like the right thing to do. The secretary was taken aback when the wreck of a man walked in. "Can I help you sir? You look terrible, here, have a seat. I'll get a doctor for you immediately. Can you fill this out please?" He looked at her with weeping eyes and took her clipboard from her. His fingers slipped around the pen and he started at the top.... the field sneered back at him in a mocking tone. NAME:. If only he could remember. The pretty young thing behind the desk with her suntouched olive skin rose again. His mind screamed at him that such beauty only belongs to the almighty, but it had been a long time since such thoughts meant anything to him. "Can I take that sir? Oh, are you having trouble with your name? Here, I'll take care of that for you. Just fill out this section here." Bitch. Unworthy. Godless Whore. He shook his head slowly so as not to aggrevate the sores on his neck. The sections she had indicated were. KNOWN AFFLICTIONS:. "Indeed" His husky voice surprised him enough that he almost remembered his former glory. A kingdom of pestilence, an empire of plague. Gone. All gone. Slowly and with the inevitability of a coming shower he wrote. I........AM........MAK.....MAKA....... "Sir? Are you writing your name in that column? No that belongs up here." She indicated with a perfect finger. "MAKATIEL! I AM MAKATIEL." She took the clipboard from him and frowned a little before folding the clipboard under her arm. As she leant down towards him he could smell the waft of summer flowers. "No, no. Not Makatiel anymore." The ragged figure in the stained bomber jacket looked straight into her eyes. And in those eyes, he found his new beginning. *** _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 08:04:48 +0000 From: "A C" Subject: Re: IN> Newbie Welcome ! ;))) I suggest you APG (Angelic Player Guide), DPG (Demon Player Guide) for starting but if you want playing saints, soldiers characters and so on... CPG (Corporeal Player Guide) is a MUST !! ;) Bye, Grey _________________________________________________________________ Scarica GRATUITAMENTE MSN Explorer all'indirizzo http://explorer.msn.it/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 08:16:57 +0000 From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Blessed Advantage >True enough - however, by the time they are adults, any human with a Will >of >8 is going to know that they are 'naturals' at persuading people to do >things; and *most* people with Blessed are going to know that they are >difficult to persuade. The exceptions are those who have a below average >Will. > I'd always assumed that Blessed implied .. well.. _Blessed_, as in good and noble and specially blessed by God. Also, it's people with Fast Talk who are good at persuading others. People with high Will are just more difficult to persuade. jo _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 08:17:10 +0000 From: "A C" Subject: Re: IN> Newbie I've made an error in my previous mail. I intended "Infernal Palyer Guide" (IPG) and not Demon etc... A LIE....a step closer to fall... Ok I'm a Balseraph ! SIGH !! :))) Bye newly, Grey (Balseraph of Guide) >From: "A C" >Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: Re: IN> Newbie >Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 08:04:48 +0000 > > > >Welcome ! ;))) > >I suggest you APG (Angelic Player Guide), DPG (Demon Player Guide) for >starting but if you want playing saints, soldiers characters and so on... >CPG (Corporeal Player Guide) is a MUST !! ;) > >Bye, Grey > > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Scarica GRATUITAMENTE MSN Explorer all'indirizzo >http://explorer.msn.it/intl.asp > _________________________________________________________________ Scarica GRATUITAMENTE MSN Explorer all'indirizzo http://explorer.msn.it/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 00:27:13 -0800 From: "Christopher Hughes" Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2453 <<>> This one I'm not sure I understand (owning only 4 IN books). Why would Eve never be creted? Why does Lilith get so much more importance here? Why would Dominic and Jordi Fall? Confused, Chris et alia ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 22:46:17 +1300 From: "Terry Jackson" Subject: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 Chora Habbalite Prince of Affliction "The world is afflicted and I am its Cancer." Servitor Attunements: Balseraph: Can create a feeling of sickness within a human. The CD indicates the severity of the sickness with 1 being mild head fuzz and 6 being bedridden nausea. The feeling will not actually do any damage and will wear off after CD hours. This cannot be applied to the same person twice within a 24 hour period. The human will gain the Disadvantage at a level equal to the CD. This is a "lie" to the Seraph Resonance. Djinn: Stalkers of Affliction become the affliction of their attuned. When attuned to a victim, they can never be rid of any affliction. They can't be cured of their gastroenteritis or unblock their nose. If the Djinn gets a permanent attunement to the subject he may choose to surpress/activate the afflication at any time he wishes. Calabim: Calabim of Affliction can channel the afflictions of others into his own Discord and then amplify the affects of his natural Resonance. If anyone is within Corp Forces of the Calabite and has any Discord or Disadvantage he can ADD the level of their Discord to his Resonance roll. The Calabite will however be affected by the Discord/Disadvantage for a number of hours equal to his Resonance CD +1 for every Discord/Disadvantage channelled. On a failed roll or a 111 the Calabite *gains* the Discord as his own. If this takes him over level/6 then choose another and add the remaining levels to that. Habbalah: Habbalah of Affliction are all given the power of a Wordbound demon of Affliction. All of Chora's Wordbounds are Habbalah and are all bound to a kind of Affliction. For example. Joziel is granted this Attunement and is put into service of Zackariah the Demon of Younger Syblings. He gains the Demon of Younger Syblings attunement and can never have it removed expect my Chora himself. Normally Chora will assign a Habbalah, but in some cases he will grant a request to be placed in service to a specific kind of Affliction. Lilim: Can read afflictions in a persons eyes. They get them all mental, physical, spiritual, sociological. If they can make a deal relating to their affliction the victim gets no resistance roll to counter a Lilim calling in the favour. Shedim: Corrupters of Affliction are an affliction in themselves. They afflict the Symphony with their twisted outlook on reality. They cause no Disturbance when they use any Song or Attunement. However because of this they no longer regenerate Essence naturally and can only gain it from rites. The Symphony also seems "sick" around these beings. Anyone who detects a disturbance created by these beings will automatically know he is a Demon of Affliction. Impudites: Contagion. They spread physical afflictions from one person to another. Instead of Charming/Stealing they can if they choose take a part of a known affliction into themselves and pass it onto another person. With a Resonance roll they "Steal" a little bit of that persons problem, the person is unaware of the transfer and otherwise unnaffected. The next person the Taker touches is then afflicted at the original level divided by 2. This only affects humans and is permanent until healed. Servitor Attunements: Walking Wounded: The Demon feels no pain from wounds inflicted upon him. He also cannot be stunned from the effects of damage. The wounds bleed openly and he will never be affected by the loss of blood. Natural healing or medicine have no effect on this demon, he must heal using a Song. Storm of Convulsion: The Demon summons up a whirlwind of coughing, wretching violence and hurls it at a target. When affected by this the target can do nothing by cough and gag. They can still Dodge but at a -2 penalty. A Will roll negates. It lasts for a number of rounds equal to the Essence spent (min 1) Affliction Magnet: By spending 7 Essence and touching the target the Demon passes on an attraction to every disease, malady and inconvienience that they target could encounter. For the rest of that persons life they will catch every cold, pick up the HepB from the toilet seat and be the target of every telemarketing campaign. This is resisted at the beginning of every week with a STR roll. The CD must beat or equal the Demons Celestial Forces in order for it to wear off. Anything affecting that person will remain until it is cured or has run its course. This will affect Celestials, there are Songs that turn them into carriers after all. Besides, Malakim of Judgement just *love* getting calls from AT&T. Distinctions: Knight of Affliction The Demon can manifest the symptoms of any Affliction he wants and apply it to his vessel Captain of Creeping Malignance Captains can see Afflictions in the Forces around them. They automatically detect within Celestial Forces yards any Discord or Disadvantage and its level. They can also sense any affliction that doesn't have an associated Disadvantage or Discord... such as Diahorea. The Afflicted Within (Celestial Forces) yards this Demon is a conduit of suffering. Where he walks people become cold, weak and more suseptable to disease and damage. For every full minute spent in this radius everyone must make a STR roll. If passed then no ill effect is noticed except for a slight chill. If failed the CD reduces the STR of the victim. When the STR reaches 0 the Demon can choose an effect, Nausea, fever, cold sweats, sneezing and apply it to that victim for Celestial Forces hours. Also, halve the targets actual STR for purposes of calculating body hits. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:48:02 +0000 From: "R L" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Blessed >How holy are Mummies? Vampires? Sorcerers? Soldiers of Hell? > >They're not. They can have the Blessed Advantage. Holiness is not a >prerequisite for the Advantage. In my game, I would turn it around and call them "damned", not blessed, with the same game mechanics... Quoting from the description: >"their blessing sometimes makes them *more* selfish than average" As in will-strong, hard to persuade, difficult to convince... >They are "blessed" in the sense of "fortunate". Why would "fortunate" affect Will? Ron _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:51:05 +0000 From: "R L" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different > > But, mind, not everyone uses the canon. O:> > >Oddly enough, I am. Oh, I'm fiddling with the odd >house rule or two, but I haven't derailed canon yet. IMO, if it don't fit into my game; screw canon. I'm GM'ing for the mood and the story, and my games often transcends or combines several RPG's in one session. I just use what I like and discard the rest... :) Seems to work out so fare. Ron _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 07:29:51 -0600 From: "Cthulhu" Subject: IN> IPG/APG Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >Now, if there were a great outcry to cut the fiction from the IPG... I *liked* the fiction in it, to be honest, and had been hoping for something similar in the APG. But that's just because I like the ballad of Marcus and Nicole, and I can appreciate needing the space for other stuff. >(And then there're the people who _do_ get both the APG and the IPG, >and gripe seriously that there's ANY repeated material. Got that >arguement, too.) Which I can understand ... very hard to find any middleground in this kind of situation. >In a way. Though I'd call that planned obselescence of the Rev Cycle... But it's still kinda useful for the Heaven & Hell stuff, not to mention the Marches. >I'd be inclined, myself, to ditch the Fruition stuff from a second >edition of the APG, and simply refer _both_ books to the Liber >Canticorum for all the exact mechanics. Yepyep. To be honest, I had been hooping for some additional details on Nephallim or Gorgons when I found the Fruition details, but I guess I'm just going to have to go buy the CPG when I can scrape together some cash... danke Cthulhu _____________________________________________ Free email with personality! Over 200 domains! http://www.MyOwnEmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 05:50:10 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 - --- Terry Jackson wrote: > Chora > Habbalite Prince of Affliction I like the origin, though I'm at a loss as to how Chora got his Word (Lucifer sure didn't grant it, and I don't recall anything about God handing out Words to demons...). Anyhoo, my 2 cents on the Attunements: > Balseraph: Can create a feeling of sickness within a > human. [snip] This is a "lie" to the Seraph > Resonance. That last is a nice touch. > Djinn: Stalkers of Affliction become the affliction of > their attuned. When > attuned to a victim, they can never be rid of any > affliction. I assume that should read, "...that victim may never be rid of any affliction," to be precise? > Calabim: Calabim of Affliction can channel the > afflictions of others into > his own Discord and then amplify the affects of his > natural Resonance. This is _nasty_. I like. > Habbalah: Habbalah of Affliction are all given the power > of a Wordbound demon of Affliction. This one doesn't seem right to me. If a demon wants an Attunement from a lesser Word-bound, he can deal with the other demon for it without bothering with this Attunement. Unless demons of Affliction are restricted from holding such Attunements without the Habbalah of Affliction Attunement, and I see no reason why that should be so. > Lilim: Can read afflictions in a persons eyes. This one's good, too. > Shedim: Corrupters of Affliction are an affliction in > themselves. This is WAY too powerful. > Impudites: Contagion. They spread physical afflictions > from one person to > another. Instead of Charming/Stealing they can if they > choose take a part > of a known affliction into themselves and pass it onto > another person. This works unless your campaign uses the Decani (Saminga's minor Band, which was posted to this list); this Attunement is almost identical to the Decani Resonance. > Walking Wounded: Much munchkin potential, but the visible effects tone it down a bit. > Storm of Convulsion: This is better. It should be noted that the Essence expenditure means that this Attunement creates a Disturbance. > Affliction Magnet: Again, way too powerful. No way that the duration should be permanent -- stuff like that is the province of at least Captain-level Distinctions. Speaking of which... > Knight of Affliction This makes more sense as a Servitor Attunement; it's pretty weak for a Distinction. > Captain of Creeping Malignance I would've put this as the Knight Distinction, but that's just me. > (Baron of?) The Afflicted Except for the effect on Body Hits (which is too much bookkeeping, IMO), this is good. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 05:56:41 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Leilani pt 1 - --- Manny Nepomuceno wrote: > Leilani > Seraph Archangel of the Heavens I love the fact that you included the archaic Choir Attunements (I confess that I liked them better than the modern ones). One quibble; why is the Mercurian Attunement the same as that of Bright Lilim? ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 10:11:38 -0500 From: "Brook Freeman" Subject: RE: IN> Abiressia Part III Last one; feedback appreciated! Raziel: No thought, all action -- easy to misdirect. In her desire to be ruled by instinct, she forgets how easily instincts can be fooled. _If he's not a Superior, he's prey rather than predator_. Vocatiel: All those voices, so little to say. What a sadly limited being. _Whenever Haagenti works up the nerve to dine on Archangel, I'll be happy to help him hunt this pathetic piece of soul-meat_. Raziel? Vocatiel? Who are they? Where are they written up? Brook ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 09:23:06 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #2453 From: "Christopher Hughes" > << take on the advice Lilith would have got. Still, a very different world. Eve > is probably never created (no point, after Lilith is finished 'playing' with > Adam), Lilith wanders the world - maybe under the protection given to Cain. > In this scenario, Dominic probably Falls; likely Jordi as well. > >>> > > This one I'm not sure I understand (owning only 4 IN books). Why would > Eve never be creted? Why does Lilith get so much more importance here? > Why would Dominic and Jordi Fall? Not sure why either of those two would fall, but the inference I drew was that Lucifer would have posessed Lilith, and used her to kill Adam. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 08:12:15 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: IN> Raziel? Vocatiel? - --- Brook Freeman wrote: > Raziel? Vocatiel? Who are they? Where are they written > up? Oops! Forgot to remove those; they're in the original document. Those are two of the Superiors which I've written up and posted to the list. A complete listing of my non-canon Superiors (because I do refer to them in other work): *Abiressia, Lilim Princess of the Wild; *Azrael, Elohite Archangel of Death (completed but not posted yet); *Pazuzu, Shedite Princess of Plagues; *Penemuel, Habbalite Prince of the Mind (still working on his history); *Raziel, Ofanite Archangel of Mysteries; *Vocatiel, Mercurian Archangel of Communication. Note that Raziel and Pazuzu exist in canon; their status as Superiors is the primary change that I made. You might be able to find all this stuff in the archives. If not, let me know and I'll send it to you privately. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:17:18 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question Jim Burzelic wrote: > In a celestial battle are the forces destroyed as in > no more as in the Symphony has gotten smaller? Or do > they return to the Symphonic pool that is Potential? It's not certain the question has meaning. The Symphony may have an infinite number of Forces, or the potential for producing them. Also, there may not be any way of tracking an individual Force; Forces may not have any individuality, any more than money does. (Oh *coins* and *bills* have individuality, but if you deposit ten bucks in a checking account, then withdraw five, are any of those five the same as the ten you put in? The question has no meaning. Electrons, etc., are the same, by the way.) It's not even addressed, in canon, where Forces come from. When a Superior creates a celestial, does it burn Essence to create the celestial, which is menasured in Forces, or does it burn Essence to create Forces which exist independently until assembled into a celestial, or does it forage for pre- existing loose Forces that it then assembles? I doubt that these delicate points are touched on except as hints from wording that indicate the assumption in the back of Derek Pearcy's mind at the moment he wrote. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:21:57 -0500 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different > Oddly enough, I am. Oh, I'm fiddling with the odd > house rule or two, but I haven't derailed canon yet. Derailing canon is fun. Diverting the tracks so the train crashes into a cliff is even more fun. >:) Seriously, there's a perverted joy I get in twisting canon to suit my own sick sense of theme and continuity. How many other GMs out there feel this way? I'm interested in finding the Vanilla-to-Fudge ratio among IN GMs. - -- Casca Who keeps meaning to do a writeup of his first canon-breaker, The Eden Ban. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 11:27:46 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Raziel? Vocatiel? Michael Walton wrote: > Note that Raziel and Pazuzu exist in canon; their status > as Superiors is the primary change that I made. You might > be able to find all this stuff in the archives. http://www.amadan.org/Innomine/Raziel.html - -David ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:44:28 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different From what I have posted, I don't think there is any doubt I have diverted big-time from canon. It will be interesting to see the ration. Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:51:40 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion David Edelstein wrote: > (Indeed, Christians predisposed to believe in literal angels and > demons who manifest corporeally on Earth tend to be the more paranoid > types, who would probably suspect a demon masquerading as an angel > and trying to deceive believers.) Speaking and just such a Christian -- though I think the corporeal occurences are probably VERY rare, and I hope I'm not paranoid -- I would recall Paul's admonition to "test the spirits." This would lead me to be on the lookout for any morally suspect behavior, and to do a lot of prayer and probably try a test exorcism. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:59:54 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: IN> Eli Solution Hi all, I was surfing the IN sites and a possible solution for my AA of the created life forms, which are the Alien life forms in my IN Space game, came to me. I want to bounce it off the list for feedback. How about Eli's word covering this? He is all about life and its creation and it is a work of humanity in the game I am running. It could also be another reason he is often missing from Heaven, there are a lot of new life and new civilizations out there for him to visit. Thought? Additions? Thanks in advance, Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:23:01 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Eli Solution I think that is a very elegant solution. Furthermore, Eli may show up at the Seraphim Council, wave aside Dominic (to whom he can now present a decent case) and ask for a whole slew of new Wordbound, one for each created race. Jordi may tie himself in knots (one of his better party tricks). Earl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:29:43 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion Earl Wajenberg wrote: > Speaking and just such a Christian -- though I think the corporeal > occurences are probably VERY rare, and I hope I'm not paranoid -- > I would recall Paul's admonition to "test the spirits." This would > lead me to be on the lookout for any morally suspect behavior, > and to do a lot of prayer and probably try a test exorcism. Sorry -- I probably should have added some more qualifiers there. I know that most Christians do believe that angels and demons exist in some form and theoretically could manifest corporeally (though I think most Christians believe in them more as abstract concepts and would be shocked into another worldview if they actually MET an angel or demon!). I was speaking more of those who think spiritual entitites are all around us and meddling in Earthly affairs on a daily basis -- Jack Chick exemplifies the type. James seems to believe that a supernatural being appearing out of thin air and quoting Bible verses could immediately convince a Christian that he's an angel. I'm pointing out that the less literal-minded believers would be able to think of all kinds of other possibilities and so wouldn't immediately assume the critter is an angel just because it says it is, and the more literal-minded would be suspicious, because there are plenty of admonitions (in the Bible and in traditional Christian folklore) to be wary of demons masquerading as saints, angels, and the like to fool the faithful. Those who aren't very bright would be easily convinced, but dim people are pretty easy to convince of anything. - -David ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2454 ********************************