in_nomine-digest Wednesday, November 21 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2455 In this digest: Re: IN> Eli Solution Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion Re: IN> Eli Solution IN> Aliens! (was Re: Eli Solution) Re: IN> Eli Solution Re: IN> Eli Solution Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question Re: IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question Re: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 IN> Revised Chora Attunements Re: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 IN> First Hunt Re: IN> First Hunt Re: IN> First Hunt IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Re: Something Different Re: IN> Re: Blessed Advantage Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question Re: IN> IPG/APG Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion Re: IN> Revised Chora Attunements IN> IN Anime Re: IN> IN Anime Re: IN> Prj. Silence - Captive Vignette Pt 4 (end) IN> Chora's Shedim IN> Eli's favorite form, was:Something Different IN> Re: Alternate Lucifers. IN> Re: Another Question - Forces. Re: IN> IN Anime IN>"Are you sure?" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:26:45 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Eli Solution By the way, what do the faux-alien races in your setting look like? Are they Star-Trekky heavily-made-up humanoids? Or uplifted chimps, dolphins, raccoons, octopi, parrots, etc.? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:35:31 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion David Edelstein wrote: > I was speaking more of those who think spiritual entitites are all > around us and meddling in Earthly affairs on a daily basis -- Jack > Chick exemplifies the type. I see. No, my own position was summarized neatly by C. S. Lewis, who advised Christians to think of angels and demons on Earth the way a sensible citizen would think of spies in his country in a time of war. You know there are some out there, but you don't believe every rumor of them that you hear, and you don't expect to encounter them in daily life. > and the more literal-minded would be suspicious, because there > are plenty of admonitions (in the Bible and in traditional Christian > folklore) to be wary of demons masquerading as saints, angels, and the > like to fool the faithful. "No doubt you have practiced transforming yourself into an angel of light as a parade ground exercise. Now is the time to do it in the face of the Enemy." -- quote from memory from "The Screwtape Letters" by C. S. Lewis, who was, in turn, alluding to just such a warning in one of Paul's letters. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:42:35 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> Eli Solution I think that is a very elegant solution. > >Furthermore, Eli may show up at the Seraphim Council, >wave aside Dominic (to whom he can now present a decent >case) and ask for a whole slew of new Wordbound, one for >each created race. Jordi may tie himself in knots (one of >his better party tricks). > >Earl Thanks! I also like the idea of the Wordbound, each one for the created race. It makes a lot of sense. Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:38:50 -0500 From: "Robb Kidd" Subject: IN> Aliens! (was Re: Eli Solution) Jeffery Watkins wrote: > I was surfing the IN sites and a possible solution for my AA of the created > life forms, which are the Alien life forms in my IN Space game, came to me. > I want to bounce it off the list for feedback. How about Eli's word covering > this? He is all about life and its creation and it is a work of humanity in > the game I am running. It could also be another reason he is often missing > from Heaven, there are a lot of new life and new civilizations out there for > him to visit. Thought? Additions? Could be a good reason. Me? In a IN:Space setting, I'd probably make alien celestials, too. They could be analogs of the choirs and bands we all know and love, but seen through lenses appropriate to the alien life form(s). Bal/Seraphim types would be changed the least, while Mercurians/Impudites would understand the aliens they are associated with more than they would their "fellow" choir/bandmates. The celestial heirarchies would be different as well with alien cultures valuing Word concepts differently. So, even Heaven and Hell would have their alien versions, the planes only intersecting in the ineffable Upper Heavens and Deep Hells. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:44:32 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> Eli Solution Furthermore, Eli may show up at the Seraphim Council, >wave aside Dominic (to whom he can now present a decent >case) and ask for a whole slew of new Wordbound, one for >each created race. Jordi may tie himself in knots (one of >his better party tricks). > >Earl Okay, this thought just won't leave me alone...I can see it now, since there are created races, several could be from fiction, can you imagine the Angel of Klingons...okay funny silly thought, but I had to share. Seeking forgiveness, Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:46:57 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> Eli Solution By the way, what do the faux-alien races in your setting look like? >Are they Star-Trekky heavily-made-up humanoids? Or uplifted >chimps, dolphins, raccoons, octopi, parrots, etc.? > >Earl A little of all of the above. One race, the Mandashawan (yes, from 5th element) are major time travellers themselves and were 'instructed' to go forth and create a variety of races. Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 10:48:17 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > When a Superior creates a celestial, does it burn Essence > to > create the celestial, which is menasured in Forces, or > does > it burn Essence to create Forces which exist > independently > until assembled into a celestial, or does it forage for > pre- > existing loose Forces that it then assembles? The Liber Canticorum implies the third option in the description for the Celestial Songs of Creation and Life. There's a line in there to the effect of, "only a Superior can manipulate loose Forces in that manner." ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 10:52:52 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different I'm definitely a purist. Breaking canon requires one to expend a certain amount of effort reinventing the wheel, setting- or mechanics-wise. By using canon I can put that energy into doing things (i.e. local setting, campaign-appropriate NPC's and campaign-specific house rules) that the publishers can't do for me. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:56:38 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question >--- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > When a Superior creates a celestial, does it burn Essence > > to > > create the celestial, which is measured in Forces, or > > does > > it burn Essence to create Forces which exist > > independently > > until assembled into a celestial, or does it forage for > > pre- > > existing loose Forces that it then assembles? > > The Liber Canticorum implies the third option in the >description for the Celestial Songs of Creation and Life. >There's a line in there to the effect of, "only a Superior >can manipulate loose Forces in that manner." Here is another way you might want to think about it. Let me preface this with stating that I do use Silhouette and so adapted allot, in that game Forces are Harmonies that are complex manifestations of the Symphony. So every being is composed of more or less complex Harmonies. Superiors weave or compose such Harmonies that are present in the Symphony. They give them structure from their 'free-floating' melodies in the Symphony. Just another view, Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 08:19:02 +1300 From: "Terry Jackson" Subject: Re: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 > > Chora > > Habbalite Prince of Affliction > > I like the origin, though I'm at a loss as to how Chora >got his Word (Lucifer sure didn't grant it, and I don't >recall anything about God handing out Words to demons...). Well the story, which really was up to interpretation had the little brazialian girl as Lucifer who had decided to give Makatiel another chance. I've been reading a lot of Harman so that probably is why it didn't make a clear statement after every paragraph. > > Djinn: Stalkers of Affliction become the affliction of > > their attuned. When > > attuned to a victim, they can never be rid of any > > affliction. > > I assume that should read, "...that victim may never be >rid of any affliction," to be precise? Yup, you got it. > > Calabim: Calabim of Affliction can channel the > > afflictions of others into > > his own Discord and then amplify the affects of his > > natural Resonance. > > This is _nasty_. I like. Thanks. Think of the combinations with the Balseraph Attunement for real munchkinisim. > > Habbalah: Habbalah of Affliction are all given the power > > of a Wordbound demon of Affliction. > > This one doesn't seem right to me. If a demon wants an Attunement from >a lesser Word-bound, he can deal with the >other demon for it without bothering with this Attunement. >Unless demons of Affliction are restricted from holding >such Attunements without the Habbalah of Affliction >Attunement, and I see no reason why that should be so. This was a last minute change. I didn't want to give out the standard "Habbalah get a new emotion to inflict or enchance." What was said though was that ALL of Chora's Wordbound are Habbalah. There are no other choirs who hold Words under him at the moment. I envisioned Chora micromanaging his Habbalah. > > Lilim: Can read afflictions in a persons eyes. > > This one's good, too. > > > Shedim: Corrupters of Affliction are an affliction in themselves. > This is WAY too powerful. How so? So they don't create Disturbance with Songs or Attunements... they still blast the Symphony by going Celestial and doing damage with said Song or Attunement. For Shedim, who in most of my games don't really go around Songslinging that much this seemed like a good touch. And since you feel sick when you see a Shedite I added the Symphonic sickness drawback to this attunement. > > Impudites: Contagion. They spread physical afflictions > > from one person to > > another. Instead of Charming/Stealing they can if they > > choose take a part > > of a known affliction into themselves and pass it onto > > another person. > >This works unless your campaign uses the Decani >(Saminga's minor Band, which was posted to this list); this Attunement is >almost identical to the Decani Resonance. Yeah well.... never saw that one. This was original until you pointed *that* out :P > > Walking Wounded: > >Much munchkin potential, but the visible effects tone it down a bit. Gotta keep them business somehow! > > Storm of Convulsion: > >This is better. It should be noted that the Essence >expenditure means that this Attunement creates a >Disturbance. Done. Affliction Magnet: > >Again, way too powerful. No way that the duration should be permanent -- >stuff like that is the province of at least >Captain-level Distinctions. Speaking of which... Hmmm. Again, a toss between this and a Distinction. I might reorder them. I haven't tested this in play yet. But I can see where you're coming from. Going up against X-schmuck who payed 10CP for his attunement or a Captain who obviously fits the campaign power level. Yeah, good point. I'll change it. > > Knight of Affliction > >This makes more sense as a Servitor Attunement; it's >pretty weak for a Distinction. > > > Captain of Creeping Malignance > > I would've put this as the Knight Distinction, but that's >just me. > > > (Baron of?) The Afflicted > > Except for the effect on Body Hits (which is too much >bookkeeping, IMO), this is good. Yeah. Going on this I'll reorder the Distinctions and put Affliction Magnet as the Captain level one. And no, the Baron level Distinction was supposed to be just The Afflicted. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 08:29:01 +1300 From: "Terry Jackson" Subject: IN> Revised Chora Attunements Balseraph: Can create a feeling of sickness within a human. The CD indicates the severity of the sickness with 1 being mild head fuzz and 6 being bedridden nausea. The feeling will not actually do any damage and will wear off after CD hours. This cannot be applied to the same person twice within a 24 hour period. The human will gain the Disadvantage at a level equal to the CD. This is a "lie" to the Seraph Resonance. Djinn: Stalkers of Affliction become the affliction of their attuned. When attuned to a victim, the victim can never be rid of any affliction. They can't be cured of their gastroenteritis or unblock their nose. If the Djinn gets a permanent attunement to the subject he may choose to surpress/activate the afflication at any time he wishes. Calabim: Calabim of Affliction can channel the afflictions of others into his own Discord and then amplify the affects of his natural Resonance. If anyone is within Corp Forces of the Calabite and has any Discord or Disadvantage he can ADD the level of their Discord to his Resonance roll. The Calabite will however be affected by the Discord/Disadvantage for a number of hours equal to his Resonance CD +1 for every Discord/Disadvantage channelled. On a failed roll or a 111 the Calabite *gains* the Discord as his own. If this takes him over level/6 then choose another and add the remaining levels to that. Habbalah: Habbalah of Affliction are all given the power of a Wordbound demon of Affliction. All of Chora's Wordbounds are Habbalah and are all bound to a kind of Affliction. For example. Joziel is granted this Attunement and is put into service of Zackariah the Demon of Younger Syblings. He gains the Demon of Younger Syblings attunement and can never have it removed expect my Chora himself. Normally Chora will assign a Habbalah, but in some cases he will grant a request to be placed in service to a specific kind of Affliction. *** Or they have the ability to create the feeling of Nausea within a person. On a failed Will roll they vomit or dry wretch a number of times equal to the CD. *** Lilim: Can read afflictions in a persons eyes. They get them all mental, physical, spiritual, sociological. If they can make a deal relating to their affliction the victim gets no resistance roll to counter a Lilim calling in the favour. Shedim: Corrupters of Affliction are an affliction in themselves. They afflict the Symphony with their twisted outlook on reality. They cause no Base Disturbance when they use any Song or Attunement, they will still cause Distrubance from any Damage caused by the Song. However because of this they no longer regenerate Essence naturally and can only gain it from rites. The Symphony also seems "sick" around these beings. Anyone who detects a disturbance created by these beings will automatically know he is a Demon of Affliction. Impudites: Contagion. They spread physical afflictions from one person to another. Instead of Charming/Stealing they can if they choose take a part of a known affliction into themselves and pass it onto another person. With a Resonance roll they "Steal" a little bit of that persons problem, the person is unaware of the transfer and otherwise unnaffected. The next person the Taker touches is then afflicted at the original level divided by 2. This only affects humans and is permanent until healed. Servitor Attunements: Walking Wounded: The Demon feels no pain from wounds inflicted upon him. He also cannot be stunned from the effects of damage. The wounds bleed openly and he will never be affected by the loss of blood. Natural healing or medicine have no effect on this demon, he must heal using a Song. Storm of Convulsion: The Demon summons up a whirlwind of coughing, wretching violence and hurls it at a target. When affected by this the target can do nothing by cough and gag. They can still Dodge but at a -2 penalty. A Will roll negates. It lasts for a number of rounds equal to the Essence spent (min 1). This does cause a Disturbance = to the Essence Spent. Mutilation: The Demon can manifest the symptoms of any Affliction he wants and apply it to his vessel Distinctions: Knight of Affliction Knights can see Afflictions in the Forces around them. They automatically detect within Celestial Forces yards any Discord or Disadvantage and its level. They can also sense any affliction that doesn't have an associated Disadvantage or Discord... such as Diahorea. Captain of Creeping Malignance By spending 7 Essence and touching the target the Demon passes on an attraction to every disease, malady and inconvienience that they target could encounter. For the rest of that persons life they will catch every cold, pick up the HepB from the toilet seat and be the target of every telemarketing campaign. This is resisted at the beginning of every week with a STR roll. The CD must beat or equal the Demons Celestial Forces in order for it to wear off, the attunement is negated if this is done. Anything affecting that person will remain until it is cured or has run its course. This will affect Celestials, there are Songs that turn them into carriers after all. Besides, Malakim of Judgement just *love* getting calls from AT&T. The Afflicted Within (Celestial Forces) yards this Demon is a conduit of suffering. Where he walks people become cold, weak and more suseptable to disease and damage. For every full minute spent in this radius everyone must make a STR roll. If passed then no ill effect is noticed except for a slight chill. If failed the CD reduces the STR of the victim. When the STR reaches 0 the Demon can choose an effect, Nausea, fever, cold sweats, sneezing and apply it to that victim for Celestial Forces hours. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:36:30 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Rebirth Pt 2 From: "Terry Jackson" > > > > > Shedim: Corrupters of Affliction are an affliction in themselves. > > > This is WAY too powerful. > > How so? So they don't create Disturbance with Songs or Attunements... That gives them an always-on version of the song of celestial shields. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 20:05:03 -0000 From: "Stephen McIlvenna" Subject: IN> First Hunt After lurking on the mailing lists for a good number of months, following just about every link on the In Nomine website and buying more game books that I usually purchase in a year, I have just finished playing through my first In Nomine adventure. It seemed only right that I share the results with this audience, given how much enjoyment I have taken from your own shared creations. You can find the details at http://www.btinternet.com/~s.mci/innomine/inindex.html The adventure write up is in the Angels of Midway section. It's not quite finished yet and hopefully I will be adding more stuff over the coming weeks and months, but please drop by and have a look at what's there and let me know what you think. Be gentle, it's my first time. Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 15:14:22 -0500 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> First Hunt Wow. An utterly fantastic site. Thank you for posting it here. I had just skimmed it and I loved what I saw. Well, off to read instead of skim. Thanks again. Jeffery _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 15:16:54 -0500 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> First Hunt > Be gentle, it's my first time. Interesting. I think that's the first time I've seen the Apostle's Creed on a role-playing page. :) I also like your Laurence. Very close to my own. - -- Casca My Larry speaks in King James English, which sounds cool when it's scripted but is damn hard to do on the fly. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:20:51 -0800 From: "Christopher Hughes" Subject: IN> Re: Something Different <<<> Oddly enough, I am. Oh, I'm fiddling with the odd > house rule or two, but I haven't derailed canon yet. Derailing canon is fun. Diverting the tracks so the train crashes into a cliff is even more fun. >:) Seriously, there's a perverted joy I get in twisting canon to suit my own sick sense of theme and continuity. How many other GMs out there feel this way? I'm interested in finding the Vanilla-to-Fudge ratio among IN GMs. - - -- Casca >>> Well, as I'm sure is evidenced by my posted setting idea of Oduma (about which I still haven't received any respons ::pout::), I am very Fudge. :-) Chris et alia ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 15:58:08 -0500 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different >Seriously, there's a perverted joy I get in twisting canon to suit my own >sick sense of theme and continuity. How many other GMs out there feel this >way? I'm interested in finding the Vanilla-to-Fudge ratio among IN GMs. > >-- Casca It's still early in my game, but so far I am making every effort to be canon for a Bright, Mid-to-High Contrast game. I do slip over stuff that requires a dice roll occasionally, but mostly for effect. The only change I know for certain that I'm going to make to canon (and it hasn't entered the game yet) is that Yves' Divine Logic Servitor Attunement won't exist, or will exist in very altered form. I've briefly ranted about "giving angels the Balseraph resonance" on the list before. ;^) William ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 13:40:44 -0800 From: "Bevan Thomas" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different If, or when, I start up an In Nomine campaign, the biggest changes I would make would be a little more background than rules. Biggest change would be sorcery would be neutral, as opposed to relatively Infernal. Certain superiors like Dominic and Laurence would be totally opposed to it of course, but guys like Eli would have no problem with it. Oh, and Eli's favored human form would be Black. He'd look more or less like Bob Marley. - -Bevan - ------- "We've always been under siege. The 'Real World' keeps shoving us into corners -- so we've built some worlds of our own. Now whoever's controlling this... wants to take those worlds away. Well, I call that interplanetary war." -T. Campbell, "Fans: the Fandom Menace" _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 15:59:01 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Re: Something Different At 7:30 PM -0800 11/20/01, Maurice Lane wrote: >--- Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >> But, mind, not everyone uses the canon. O:> > >Oddly enough, I am. Oh, I'm fiddling with the odd >house rule or two, but I haven't derailed canon yet. But let there be any gray areas, and *cough*tattered*cough* you go romping about in them like an Ofanite of Flowers on Jolt... (Am I saying that's a bad thing? I'm just stating fact, here...) (Then again, there is Khalid, Lilim Archangel, IIRC...?) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 16:04:24 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Re: Blessed Advantage At 9:49 AM +1100 11/21/01, james walker wrote: >> From: David Edelstein >> james walker wrote: >>> If you actually want to help people, you ask the question - where are my >>> talents most useful? For someone with Blessed,[...] >> This assumes people KNOW they are Blessed. [...] >True enough - however, by the time they are adults, any human with a Will of >8 is going to know that they are 'naturals' at persuading people to do >things; and *most* people with Blessed are going to know that they are >difficult to persuade. [...] So they're going to go into retail, as salesthings. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 16:06:08 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Ooh, ooh! Another Question At 3:53 PM -0800 11/20/01, Jim Burzelic wrote: >In a celestial battle are the forces destroyed as in >no more as in the Symphony has gotten smaller? Or do >they return to the Symphonic pool that is Potential? Good question for Elohim to debate. I suspect that they either return to the Symphony -- or get shredded up into little ur-Force bits, go back into the Symphony, and eventually stick to other little ur-Force bits and become stray Forces again. The distinction is fairly meaningless to most celestials except Superiors (who probably like to know these things) and Elohim (who often just like to Know Stuff). O:> Canon? Probably not. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 16:31:19 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> IPG/APG At 7:29 AM -0600 11/21/01, Cthulhu wrote: >Elizabeth McCoy wrote: [...] >>In a way. Though I'd call that planned obselescence of the Rev Cycle... > >But it's still kinda useful for the Heaven & Hell stuff, not to mention the >Marches. And when those two sell out... Quite seriously, I've done some page counts, and I could pack the actual _Marches_ and _Heaven & Hell_ material into one book and still have a couple dozen pages at _least_. More if it were a 144 page book. The idea strongly tempts. >>I'd be inclined, myself, to ditch the Fruition stuff from a second >>edition of the APG, and simply refer _both_ books to the Liber >>Canticorum for all the exact mechanics. > >Yepyep. It's a plan. >To be honest, I had been hooping for some additional details on >Nephallim or Gorgons when I found the Fruition details, but I guess I'm >just going to have to go buy the CPG when I can scrape together some cash... Sorry -- so much background, so little space. O:/ (If you write articles for Pyramid, you can get paid in credit -- and credit-rates are higher than real-cash rates. Then you can order from warehouse23...) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 16:08:39 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Re: Angels and Religion At 10:22 PM -0600 11/20/01, David Edelstein wrote: [...] >What would a Christian think? Probably that he was being confronted with >a supernatural being of some sort -- but the fact that that supernatural >being can quote Bible verses wouldn't likely be immediately convincing >to anyone with intelligence that the creature is necessarily an angel. Using the not-necessarily-so interpretation that Numinous Corpus: Wings grants wings appropriate to Choir... ....our Malakim often have a hard time explaining that "black wings does NOT equal Fallen angel"... Just another little thing to make your PCs' lives harder. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 14:46:46 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Revised Chora Attunements Yeah, these are more like it. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "Love is an exploding cigar which we willingy smoke." -- Linda Barry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 17:14:02 -0600 From: Andrew Hackard Subject: IN> IN Anime I just saw the new cover for In Nomine Anime. It's very, very cool. It's also very, very red. Too bad we won't have anyone in the office who can post a new version of it until next week (muahahaha) . . . Let's play Mad Libs -- fill in the blanks with appropriate (or not) nouns: Big ______, Fiery ______ - -- Human history becomes more and more a | hackard@io.com race between education and catastrophe. | - -- H.G. Wells ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 17:52:38 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> IN Anime From: "Andrew Hackard" > > Let's play Mad Libs -- fill in the blanks with appropriate (or not) nouns: Big Eyes, Fiery Sword ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 21:42:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: Re: IN> Prj. Silence - Captive Vignette Pt 4 (end) On Tue, 20 Nov 2001, Tony Zbaraschuk wrote: > .... wow! > > The whole thing was really, really, good. > > Encore! Encore! I missed part 4! Damn my ISP and their mail problems... Michael, could I talk you into resending a copy to me directly? I'd appreciate it. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian, Q4B4L! Meow! And finally, a special message to \|/ ____ \|/ anyone who thinks I give a damn... ~@-/ oO \-@~ /_( \__/ )_\ \__U_/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 13:30:58 +1300 From: "Terry Jackson" Subject: IN> Chora's Shedim Ok. Having gone over it again I think I am changing the Shedite attunement to this: Shedim: Shedim have the ability to insert themselves in an Affliction of their hosts and stay there. This completely conceals them from any prying Resonance, Attunement or Song and frees the hosts mind up. They still need to corrupt the host unless they possess the Affliction for the entire 24 hour period. They can also "move" the affliction to another part of the persons body as long as they follow a recognised path through the persons body. They cannot move external Afflictions, only internal ones. With a Will roll the Shedite can also "shield" the affliction from any treatment targeting it. These Shedim gain no Dissonance from having a host die because of their tampering with their Afflictions. If there are multiple instances of the same Affliction, the Shedite can only take over one at a time. How's this? Alex _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 00:40:07 +0000 From: "R L" Subject: IN> Eli's favorite form, was:Something Different >Oh, and Eli's favored human form would be Black. He'd look more or less >like >Bob Marley. Seen "Bedazzled". I imagine Eli as the black guy in the prison that is later portrayed as God. Both the way he talks, as well as the way he acts pretty much fits my image of Eli. Ron _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 11:40:35 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Re: Alternate Lucifers. > From: "Christopher Hughes" wrote: > << take on the advice Lilith would have got. Still, a very different world. Eve > is probably never created (no point, after Lilith is finished 'playing' with > Adam), Lilith wanders the world - maybe under the protection given to Cain. > In this scenario, Dominic probably Falls; likely Jordi as well. >>>> > > This one I'm not sure I understand (owning only 4 IN books). Why would Eve > never be creted? Why does Lilith get so much more importance here? Why > would Dominic and Jordi Fall? According to the legends of Lilith, Eve was created as a replacement when Lilith walks out. Even if Adam survives whatever Lilith does to him while Shedite possessed, a replacement isn't necessary as Lilith is still in Eden, becoming increasingly evil. (And of course, if/when she leaves, he's not going to want a replacement!) Dominic came close to Falling, when tempted by Lucifer (S1 p41) - if Lilith's evil actions cannot be punished due to a Divine order, that's going to sway him closer to a Fall. Jordi is also a Kyriotate, and was the first Superior to object to humanity; the opposition before the Fall to humanity will be the Kyriotates acting together - so 'pack loyalty', and therefore his Word, would nudge Jordi closer to a Fall. James. P.S. You're getting digests, yes? Try to remember to change the subject titles when you 'reply' - it makes it easier for people to know what the post is about. Cheers. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 11:51:08 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Re: Another Question - Forces. > From: Earl Wajenberg > Jim Burzelic wrote: > >> In a celestial battle are the forces destroyed as in >> no more as in the Symphony has gotten smaller? Or do >> they return to the Symphonic pool that is Potential? > > It's not certain the question has meaning. The Symphony > may have an infinite number of Forces, or the potential > for producing them. > Also, there may not be any way of > tracking an individual Force; Forces may not have any > individuality, any more than money does. (Oh *coins* and > *bills* have individuality, but if you deposit ten bucks > in a checking account, then withdraw five, are any of those > five the same as the ten you put in? The question has no > meaning. Electrons, etc., are the same, by the way.) Actually, it's very important: Both sides are trying to destroy the other. If Forces simply recycle, soul killing an opposing Celestial hasn't achieved anything; the Forces return to the appropriate realm and form new relievers/demonlings. Using your analogy, it's like mugging someone and then putting the money back in their account. If Forces *don't* recycle, then the War can be won on the battlefield, by destroying the opposition. If they do, the only way to win is to Redeem/Trip every opposing Celestial. Soul killing remains a tactics useful when dealing with opponents who won't change sides, as the Forces will form into being who are hopefully easier to convert. Something that isn't hammered home is that (either way) ensuring that a mundane goes to Heaven/Hell is as effective as stripping 5 Forces from an opponent in Celestial combat, as you've reduced/increased Hell's supply by an equal amount. If Forces recycle, then human Fate/Destinies are the most cost effective way of shifting the balance of power. How many humans die every day? How many of them go to Heaven or Hell? A few thousand? So, that's 20-25 thousand Forces every day, as a guesstimate. Makes the carnage of the battles between Celestial look completely irrelevant. Cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 20:31:33 -0500 From: Mike Bruner Subject: Re: IN> IN Anime At 05:14 PM 11/21/01 -0600, you wrote: >I just saw the new cover for In Nomine Anime. It's very, very cool. It's >also very, very red. Too bad we won't have anyone in the office who can >post a new version of it until next week (muahahaha) . . . > >Let's play Mad Libs -- fill in the blanks with appropriate (or not) nouns: > >Big ______, Fiery ______ *blush* Given the diseased minds on this group, Mad Libs might not be a good thing to suggest (especially THOSE particular words). - -- Mike Bruner-- mbruner18@home.com I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me at once. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 22:15:55 -0500 From: Mike Bruner Subject: IN>"Are you sure?" As promised a while back... Wregan Calabite of Factions Baron of Inner Torment Demon of Scepticism Corporeal Forces: 3 Strength: 5 Agility: 7 Ethereal Forces: 6 Intelligence: 12 Precision: 12 Celestial Forces: 5 Will: 9 Perception: 11 Skills: Artistry/4, Biology/2, Chemistry/2, Computer Operation/1, Detect Lies/6, Dodge/3, Driving/1, Emote/5, Engineering/1, Fast-Talk/6, Fighting/3, various Knowledge skills/2, Language(English)/4, Lying/6, Ranged Weapon(pistol)/1, Savoir-Faire/3 Songs: Charm (Ethereal/4, Celestial/5), Deception (Ethereal/6, others/4), Entropy (Ethereal/3, Celestial/3), Form (Celestial/3), Healing (All/2), Nemesis (All/4), NC: Tongue/6, Opening (Ethereal/3, Celestial/5), Revulsion (Ethereal/3), Self (Corporeal/4, Ethereal/2), Truth (Corporeal/4, Ethereal/2) Attunements: Calabim of Factions, Balseraph of Factions, Impudite of Factions, Habbalah of Factions, Calabim of Secrets, Imbroglio, Polarize, Rant of Scorn (Kobal), Subliminal (Nybbas) Resources: Role/5 (Thomas Warner, journalist and professional "debunker", Status 5), Vessel/2 Discord: Doubtful (Ethereal/3) - Subject must make a Will roll penalized by Discord level to avoid disbelieving something told or shown to him by another. Unlike Paranoia, the subject will tend to imagine "more plausible" explanations as opposed to fanciful ones when disbelieving and need not assume the target is actually lying (although with demons that IS a fairly plausible bet). Demon of Scepticism: Wregan can implant doubts in someone's mind as to the truth of one of their beliefs with a successful Will roll (with the check digit determining the level of disillusionment the person will feel). Targets resist with Will; the strength of the targets belief in the particular person/idea and any proof Wregan may offer will affect the roll accordingly (i.e. asking someone to doubt the fidelity of their spouse of 20 years might be at a very high bonus to resist, but showing a doctored photo of the spouse being intimate with another could reduce or even eliminate the bonus entirely). Truly powerful beliefs, such as an angel's loyalty to God, may not be affected at all without some form of persuasion offered, and even then tend to be at strong penalties. Note that Wregan cannot implant a new belief with this power like Balseraphs, only destroy a held one, and a target can eventually regain belief normally (i.e. if a person acts in trustworthy fashion, the target can once again regain trust in that person after sufficient evidence for it). This power may also be utilized in combat as a standard Will power. If the target fails to resist, he must hesitate for a turn reconsidering his actions. Word Forces: 12 Rites: standard Factions, Prevent someone from achieving destiny (Kronos), Destroy the only evidence of a crime (Alaemon), Be a guest on a daytime talk show (Nybbas, but only +1 Essence), Cause an individual to lose faith in a closely held belief, Disprove an offered opinion (Word) Wregan is one of those demons who's been around an awfully long time; many old-time demons joke he was pooh-poohing Cassandra's prophetic cries in Troy (Wregan maintains he was actually questioning the logic of bringing a large wooden horse made by enemies into the gates). Most of his history in Malphas's service was mixed due to his Calabite Discord; while it made him great at spotting the holes in plans, it tended to get him in trouble with senior demons who did not like having their designs questioned by their inferiors. However, his luck underwent a dramatic shift approximately 150 years ago. While serving out yet another punishment detail as door keeper in Malphas's realm, his traditionally boring duties were enlivened by the appearance of a dark imposing figure in a burst of fire and brimstone accompanied by a chorus of damned screams, who casually walked upon the immediately bowed backs of all the lesser demons and damned souls present (all of whom chanted "Hail, Lucifer, He Who Will Be New God to all Creation" in the most ancient dialects of Helltongue that chill all men's souls to hear) to the front desk, where he politely identified himself as Lucifer, the Prince of Darkness, Father of Lies, etc., etc., to see Malphas. Wregan leaned over and asked for some proof of this, noting "Hey, you can never be sure!" in response to the raised eyebrow he received in reply. An amused Lucifer promptly "proved his identity" by granting the Word of Scepticism to the demon. Upon his elevation to the Wordbound, Wregan's fortunes began to change dramatically for the better. Given the rise in his value, Malphas had no choice but to start favoring him more to protect this resource in his service. In addition, as Wregan learned to master his abilities, he became greatly valued for his use in covering up the activities of the War, for who better to protect the secret of the existence of demons and their plans than one who can convince mortals that there has to be a more "realistic" reason behind what they saw? Demons being demons, virtually everybody who is anybody in the Infernal Realms has had need of him at some time or another, leading to his collecting a substantial number of Songs, Attunements, and similar in payment. Of considerable more alarm to the Host is his convincing angels to Fall/Jump as a hobby ("Not like it's a HARD position to poke holes in"), at which he is disturbing successful. Indeed, Khalid is becoming outright alarmed at the existence of one who he sees as potentially the ultimate negation of his Word, and along with Dominic has been quietly pushing for more militant action against him for some time now. Wregan also has his enemies in Hell as well, particularly Malphas, who has become more and more irritated as Wregan gains the attention and favor of so many of Hell's other Princes. With all they keep gifting Wregan with, he's had to struggle to keep up in order to maintain Wregan's allegiance; worse, he's proven valuable enough that if he did leave Malphas would probably have to make it a friendly break in order to keep the possibility of still employing him on occasion. A few assassination attempts have already been made, but Wregan's eye for subtle problems in things and the assistance of others who owe him favors look to make it virtually impossible to kill the bastard, all of which gives Malphas a grating headache which he would be pleased if someone removed. As for Wregan himself, it would seem like he has many options open to him. Certainly several Princes have offered to take him on in more permanent fashion; Alaemon and Nybbas, in particular, see great value in one who can eliminate the value of a witness or destroy inconvenient beliefs to make way for your own, and Kronos could always use someone who destroys faith. But there's always the problem that a new employer would also inevitably show suspicion and then turn on him as well. Or perhaps go it on his own? His Word is certainly strong and and growing stronger in this world where doubting all you are told and know is held up as a great virtue; heck, his current Role actually lets him make a living doing nothing else but that, and when before was such a thing possible? Still, Scepticism is a Word which will inevitably reach its limits; maybe he could evolve his Word to one more suitable to a Princedom such as Nihilism, Disbelief, or Doubt, but all of the new choices he's considered have potential defects in their meanings. *sigh* There may appear to be many possible paths, but each of them has so many loose flagstones to trip on. Still, once one breaks down the beliefs that block your path, there's much room to rise in; after all, did not Lucifer start his rise to power by asking the right questions?... - -- Mike Bruner-- mbruner18@home.com I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me at once. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2455 ********************************