in_nomine-digest Saturday, February 23 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2555 In this digest: IN> Sorry about the double post... :( IN> Re: IN Time Travel Re: IN> Re:Jordi's view of humanity IN> Softened Archangels IN> Re:Superhero books worth stripping for In content. IN> Why didn't Jordi Fall? IN> Re:Jordi IN> Blood! Part I Re: IN> Cherub of Fire Re: IN> Thanks was Cherub of Fire Re: IN> Cherub of Fire Re: IN> Cherub of Fire Re: IN> Blood! Part I Re: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players Re: IN> Blood! Part I Re: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players IN> The Oz-Uriel Connection Re: IN> Heck, *I* think that it's weird... Re: IN> Cherub of Fire RE: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players IN> Scorched Re: IN> The Angels of Fear ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 22:32:43 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: IN> Sorry about the double post... :( Don't why it happened, but I'm sorry that it did anyway. Moe ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 01/01/02(this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games http://sports.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 01:45:36 -0500 From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" Subject: IN> Re: IN Time Travel >Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 05:40:03 +0000 >From: "Jonathan Walton" >Subject: IN> Re: IN Time Travel >Seriously, I've got a massive stack of notes for fleshing out the "In >Nomine/Continuum" ideas I was playing with earlier, actually making it into >a playable concept, but have yet to find a block of time to work on it. >Still, the logo is done :) One of these days I'll get some content to go >with "In Nomine Continuum: Good & Evil, Life & Death, Time & Space" ... "But... Superior, just how is it that we can do this?" "Further information is not available here." Brings 'Superior Ineffability' to a whole new degree. =) Seriously, IN and Continuum sounds like a pretty heavy merger. I'm certainly intrigued. =) If this becomes one of those 32-pagers, I'd still be interested. (Then again, I'm the one who wants to merge Aria, Continuum, and Everway.) - --- ============================================================ Jonathan McDermott http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com - ------------------------------------------------------------ "And now I feel that... feel that I've been there. I didn't need this. Can somebody help me breathe?" - Nickelback, "Breathe" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:46:39 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: Re: IN> Re:Jordi's view of humanity > From: David Edelstein > james walker wrote: >> Firstly, this is going to mean that many of the First Fallen have a lot > of> time for Jordi. > > Except that Jordi has little time for them. And they couldn't care less > about the parts of creation that Jordi DOES think are special. Precisely; they don't really interact, so the Balseraphs can persuade themselves that Jordi is prove that they're telling the truth. >> Secondly, if humans are the only animals who go to Hell, then >> exterminating> humanity would be an efficient way of interdicting Hell's > >supply of Forces. > > Of course the same might be true of Heaven. ? Only if you're playing a game so dark that Heaven is also breaking humans down as a supply of Forces. James. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 13:13:59 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Softened Archangels >> All of those Archangels have been "softened" since then, and so will >> Jordi, I should imagine, when/if he ever gets an expanded writeup. > > I suppose so. Remember some months back, when there were a great many posts > asking how anyone could run a demonic chronicle? The more "softened" the > side of Heaven becomes, the more difficult it becomes to do so. This may not > be a concern to any of you, but it makes running IN less fun for me, as I > enjoy mixed or demonic chronicles as much as angelic ones. I've found that running Angelic groups as very White, and demonic ones as Grey, works well. I justify that (given that all the games take place in the same universe) by pointing out that Malakim have been killing off the worst demons for the last 22,000 years: demons are slowly evolving away from evil, and demons make a point of not being the most evil demon in the region so that the angels hunt down someone else first, giving them time to run. Of course, this is only happening on earth, so the PC's will normally be 'greyer' than demons who haven't been assigned to Corporeal duties. Cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 13:15:47 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Re:Superhero books worth stripping for In content. > Who'd ever have thought that a superhero RPG would have so much IN-useful > atmosphere? On that topic, remember to plunder Bargainers & Coventers from Brave New World: very useful for Sorcerers and Soldiers of God respectively. Cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 13:26:06 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Why didn't Jordi Fall? > Any thoughts on why, in canon, Jordi decided not to side with the > Lightbringer? The Rebellion seems to have Jordi's name written all over it. 1) God is the pack Alpha - his decision goes. 2) Jordi was to smart to risk having Michael thump him again. 3) Lucifer's arguments were about angels being better than humans; Jordi was i) uninterested in ego massages and ii) realised that Lucifer would also despise all other animals - his argument that humans are "just" animals implies that animals aren't important. 4) sooner or later, humans will become extinct; annoying as he considered the race, such a temporary problem isn't worth getting worked up about. 5) his Allies, Novalis & Eli, opposed the Rebellion 6)Possibly he wasn't even there, and didn't find out until afterwards! He doesn't spend a lot of time in the Council Towers, after all. 7) - as an Archangel who can be expected to have a lot of sympathy for Lucifer's cause, and remains loyal to God, Jordi is in an excellent political position. He has more Allies & Associates than any other Archangel, has no real demonic enemy, and is continually courted by Heaven's Factions. His current choice grants him more influence than any other option. cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 13:47:52 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: IN> Re:Jordi > There's also the game problem that as written it's hard to imagine how to > integrate his servitors into most IN games easily. If their boss doesn't > have many interests in human society, why should he have people there? The > only justifications for doing so seem to boil down to one-note > "eco-terrorism/enviromental activism", unlike other angels, whose Words are > more flexibly defined so they allow for more reasons they might be > somewhere. They just don't overlap enough with the other angels. Okay, the basic problem is that there isn't a lot to work with - merely the basic write-up in the base book. However, in my own games I expect a Servitor of Animals in an Urban environment to do the following: gather information from pets - not just about demonic activities, but mundane problems: a pet is in an ideal situation to know about domestic violence, child abuse, etc. A Jordian in a bird's Vessel can fly from backyard to backyard talking to the dogs - and a dog's sense of smell allows them to give the angel a very high degree of information on what the resident humans are feeling...this allows me to vary the pace and mix some "deal with ordinary folks" plotlines in with the "save the world from demonic plot X" standards. Look after the strays. "Look after" can mean different things, of course; anything from feeding them to finding them homes to having them desexed. This immediately brings them into conflict with the Sorcerers who want to use the strays as sacrifices. Deal with cases of cruelty to animals - stamp out dogfights, for example. Decide what to do about zombified animals. Sure, they shouldn't exist, but if that zombi sparrow has returned to help it's mate feed it's chicks, what then? Work closely with angels of Creation, Children and Flowers in joint projects "saving the world". Kick demonic butt. Angels of Animals are very good at this, and the War faction angels are going to be continually courting the Jordians in an attempt to get them onside - and with good reason: Tether of Gluttony in a restaurant? Get a Kyriotate of Animals to have a slew of cockroach hosts run through the dining area during dinner - problem solved. Avoid kicking Demonic butt. Jordi is well aware of what happens to animals who get involved in warfare - European horses still haven't recovered from the Napoleonic Wars - and is Hostile to Michael and David for this reason. The Peace faction angels will *always* have orders to "help the Jordians avoid being drafted into some futile battle - as such, any angel of animals will be fought over by the two factions. Joridans don't "overlap" with other angels - other angels come courting them becuase of their usefulness/importance. Cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 16:04:28 +0800 From: Manny Nepomuceno Subject: IN> Blood! Part I Hey, Just something I was kicking around for a while. I'll do the Demon Princes and minor Superiors later. Unless someone else wants to do them. Hehehe ;) ;) Manny Neps http://www.geocities.com/angeloffools/ On occasion, a Superior encased in mortal flesh can find himself beset by foes of enough strength to shed blood before they can be dealt with. Although mortal alchemists have been, so far, deprived of the taste of a Superior's blood, these are some of the conjectural effects that a mortal would experience should he...er...imbibe. Blandine: The drinker gains the ability to dream lucidly, at least for the next 24 hours. However, he also begins to feel very, very sad. This lasts...forever. David: The Archangel of Stone has never shed a drop of blood (his mortal vessel is, after all, made of stone). However, if he did possess blood, and if a mortal did by some improbable chance partake of it, that mortal would gain a natural protection from the elements for 24 hours...while also developing a bad case of arthritis and lockjaw for the same amount of time. Dominic: The drinker gains the Detect Lies skill at level 2 for 24 hours, at the cost of his sense of humor. Eli: The blood of the Archangel of Creation boosts, naturally, one's creativity in any artistic endeavor for the next 24 hours. It also produces some far-out hallucinogenic effects, although that may be due to other substances floating around in it. Gabriel: Whosoever drinks of the blood of the Archangel of Fire shall become a prophet for the duration of 24 hours (if the drinker is already a prophet, the visions increase in clarity and frequency). For some reason, even after 24 hours in a freezer, Gabriel's blood still scalds the tongue. Janus: The blood of the Archangel of the Wind speeds up a person's perception of time. Suddenly the world appears to be...moving...very...slowly. He also develops kleptomania. Jean: For 24 hours, technology obeys the man who drinks of the blood of the Archangel of Lightning. Computers don't crash. VCRs program themselves. However, he wipes magnetic storage media (tapes, diskettes, hard drives) with a touch. Jordi: The drinker becomes a lycanthrope for a full week after drinking. Laurence: Oddly enough, Laurence's blood grants Charisma +3. It also acts like an undetectable, irresistible mating call for every creature of the appropriate persuasion in the vicinity. Unfortunately, it also inflicts the Clueless disadvantage at level 2, which will vanish along with the other effects of the blood. Marc: The drinker gains Savior/Faire/2 for the next 24 hours. While it lasts, though, everything he owns will seem so...tacky. Michael: The blood of warriors flows through the veins of the Archangel of War. Anyone drinking his blood immediately goes into bloodlust (froth and drool optional). Females who imbibe the blood of Michael grow hair in interesting places. Novalis: The blood of the Archangel of Flowers tastes like tree sap with a fruity tang. The air begins to smell fresher. The sunlight seems brighter. Flowers bloom underfoot. While these effects last, the drinker is unable to engage in violence, or eat anything at all. The only thing he will be able to keep down is water. These effects last for 24 hours, after which he will discover strange fungi growing on his body. Yves: In a brilliant flash of insight, the secrets of the universe unfold, and everything becomes clear. The consumer is filled with a sense of peace and total acceptance, but is shocked to discover, not five seconds afterwards, that he has forgotten the experience. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:50:14 +0800 From: Manny Nepomuceno Subject: Re: IN> Cherub of Fire Hey, Was thinking about the dissonance conditions for Gabriel's servitors. I lent out S3 to a friend and don't know if this was already answered...but what's there to keep a mortal who was already punished from being punished again? For example, John Doe betrayed someone's trust three months ago. Cherub of Fire Aaron sees him, punishes him by um...burning his house down. Two weeks later, Cherub of Fire Bill sees him, and punishes him by destroying his car. Another week later, Cherub of Fire Charlie sees him and beats him senseless...all this in one month...which means he still has eight more to go. This _is_ possible in canon, yes? If so, I can see another reason why Dominic has issues with Gabriel. ;) Manny Nepomuceno http://www.geocities.com/angeloffools ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:35:39 +0100 From: "Donato Ranzato" Subject: Re: IN> Thanks was Cherub of Fire To everybody that replied: A big thanks for all your tips and suggestions. I have now a better idea how much the character's resonance can influence the campaign and how I can limit it when necessary. Thanks also to Manny for his great tips on fun charges for Cherubs. As William pointed out I think Gabriel's attunements have too much to do with punishing and not enough with inspiration. Hopefully William can finish his archaic list of attunements to fix this "problem". Donato ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:47:52 +0100 From: "Donato Ranzato" Subject: Re: IN> Cherub of Fire From: "Manny Nepomuceno" > For example, John Doe betrayed someone's trust three months ago. Cherub of > Fire Aaron sees him, punishes him by um...burning his house down. Two > weeks later, Cherub of Fire Bill sees him, and punishes him by destroying > his car. Another week later, Cherub of Fire Charlie sees him and beats him > senseless...all this in one month...which means he still has eight more to go. LOL! That man must be the unluckiest man alive :-) I guess that somehow the punishment gets rid of the "betrayer" aura. But another problem is that it is entirely up to the Cherub to come up with a fit punishment. The wife that has betrayed her husband might have her car burned down by one Cherub but be burned alive by another. There is nothing in the rules that gives servitors of Fire a list of reasonable punishments for certain "crimes" or the punishments (from Gabriel) if they go overboard. Also, one Cherub might punish the woman by burning her car and then another Cherub might come along, find out that she was already punished but conclude that -in his eyes- the punishment was not severe enough. Donato ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:36:30 -0500 From: Eric Eves Subject: Re: IN> Cherub of Fire > Also, one Cherub might punish the woman by burning her car and then another > Cherub might come along, find out that she was already punished but conclude > that -in his eyes- the punishment was not severe enough. Or on the other hand, he could decide that the Cherub that punished the person made the punishment /too/ severe, perhaps even, well, /cruel?/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:50:45 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Blood! Part I Very cute. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 15:56:24 From: "Daniel Gallagher" Subject: Re: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players Janet, Since you weren't able to play in my game last year, do you think that I could play in yours? Daniel _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 16:06:43 From: "Daniel Gallagher" Subject: Re: IN> Blood! Part I Interesting, however Jean needs different a drawback. It's no good to have an obediant computer if once you touch it the hard drive goes, or to program VCR's only to find the tape blank the next time you use it. Otherwise, good job! Are the DP's next? Daniel _________________________________________________________________ Join the world s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 16:20:03 +0000 From: "Janet Anderson" Subject: Re: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players Certainly. Send me some character concepts. (Which one was yours?) Janet _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:49:16 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: IN> The Oz-Uriel Connection A few months ago, someone on the list had a funny series of encounters between various celestials and Uriel, returned from the Upper Heavens in the identity of Ozma of Oz. I'm sorry, I forget the author. I was just now purusing the Oz timeline on the website of the International Wizard of Oz Club (www.ozclub.org), where I found the following datum: 1987 "A new Hebrew translation of The Wizard of Oz , translated by Uriel Ofek, editor of the Israeli Encyclopedia of Children's Literature, is published in Israel following Ofek's death." So, was the author of Uriel-as-Ozma aware of this, or is it just synchronicity amusing itself again? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 10:49:38 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Heck, *I* think that it's weird... - --- Maurice Lane wrote: > Punster (Corporeal) (1pt/level) Gee, I just can't imagine what inspired this. Were you dealing with a friendly neighborhood type, or did someone put a shock to your system? 0:> > Evil Overlord (Ethereal) (3pt/level) LOL! > Fashion Victim (Ethereal) (1/pt level) See above. > Four-colored Glasses (Ethereal) (3pt/level) This is the funniest of the lot. Mad props to you. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "In a world without women, what would men become?" "Scarce, ma'am. Mighty scarce." -- Mark Twain __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games http://sports.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 15:36:02 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Cherub of Fire At 12:50 PM +0800 2/21/02, Manny Nepomuceno wrote: [Why Cruel People's Lives Suck when angels of Fire are around...] >This _is_ possible in canon, yes? If so, I can see another reason why >Dominic has issues with Gabriel. It's certainly not explicitly forbidden, that I recall. Unlikely, mind you, unless you have a LOT of angels, and particularly Fire Servitors, in the area... But not forbidden. If you don't like that idea, then it could be deemed that once punished, the Choir Attunement will no longer spot that person (unless he does it again). Why does it work that way? It's Symphonically ineffable. Me, I think it's amusing, and so rare that ruling on it would just deprive people of fun. O:> - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 15:06:22 -0600 From: "Alex Rojas" Subject: RE: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players Greetings! I saw your request for players, and thought I would respond. Actually, I was wondering if you would let me lurk, on your game. I only recently heard about this game from a friend, and haven't been able to find the rule book at any local stores. But the stuff I have read about it has peeked my interest. If a player drops out in the future, then maybe I would like to join your game, but until then, I would like to lurk. - --Alex Rojas - -----Original Message----- From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com [mailto:owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com] On Behalf Of Janet Anderson Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 9:16 PM To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Subject: IN> Updated call for IN PBEM players The schedule of my Bright, High Contrast, almost entirely canon PBEM has changed. It's now Monday and Wednesday from 9:00 to 11:30 pm EST. I still need players. Janet Anderson ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 06:26:31 +0000 From: "Jonathan Walton" Subject: IN> Scorched Was putting the finishing touches on a steampunked Vapulean Superior Victory when an interesting thought struck me from behind and refused to be ignored. (I apologize in advance if any smartquotes escaped my wrath.) Scorched Vapula refuses to even acknowledge rumors about The Scorched Earth. After all, everyone knows Vapula refuses to allow Calabim into his ranks. The Habbalite Prince announces his hatred of Destroyers to anyone who will listen to him. Put in terms of an analogy, "Vapula : Calabim :: Maurice : Belial". In fact, speaking of Belial, the only one of the Freaks that the Prince of Technology can stand to be around, the difference in attitude is likely thanks to Baal's influence on the Prince of Fire. Even the blazing inferno can be tempered with time, it seems. However, Vapula's toleration of a fellow Demon Prince and co-worker should not, by any means, be taken as him warming up to the Destroyers. No, Technology's Media Relations Office (founded by Nybbas before his rise to Princedom) is quick to rebut any rumors that imply a chance in policy. Vapula, they insist, hates Calabim. Utterly. Despises the sorry SOBs. Yes, he always has. Why? They're indiscriminately destructive. Next question. Oh, sure, from time to time you may see a Calabite hanging around the edges of Tartarus, but those are just Servitors of Fire who happen to be in the area. Vapula and Belial maintain close relations. What do you expect, for the Prince of Technology to say "Sorry, Fiery One, but your bandmates aren't allowed to set foot in my domain"? That would go down well. You'd lose a servitor just delivering the message. Yes, indeed, sometimes these "bystanders" are allowed to participate in certain aspects of device testing, especially of explosives and other weapons of mass destruction. Their expertise in these areas is invaluable in the developmental process. No, they have no other responsibilities. No, there has never been a Calabite even on temporary loan to Technology's service, though some Destroyers serving Fire and the War do _appear_ to hold relative positions in Vapula's hierarchy. These are just the misconceptions of those unfamiliar with the way our organization works. Yes, it _is_ possible that Word-bound of Fire or the War working alongside Technology could have any number of Calabim servitors. I'm afraid the Prince has no control over the employment practices of his fellow Superiors. No, these definitely DO NOT receive assignments from _any_ servitor of Technology, much less Vapula himself. That's absurd. Yes, I am perfectly aware of my Superior's dissonance conditions. What is your point? I don't see the connection. Yes, again it is POSSIBLE for a demon to accept the dissonance from mishandling VapuTech devices and information, choosing not to attempt a timely recovery. However, the Prince would be very, VERY displeased with such servitors. I'm sure you would not be hearing from them any time soon. Your questions are becoming more and more hypothetical and unlikely. Again, yes, I grant the POSSIBILITY that mishandled materials might be left on any one of the three planes, in danger of being misused by whoever stumbled across them. Yes, Vapula does indeed have contingency plans for making sure such problems, IF they occur _at all_, never worsen. Yes, in most cases this involves destruction of the materials in question, along with any remain evidence of their existence. Yes, I said "destruction." No, servitors of other Words would never be considered for such operations. I'm afraid that's not even a remote possibility. How could we trust them when our own people had already mishandled the materials? Yes, any operatives would most definitely occupy a special elite position within the structure of Technology's forces. No, I'm afraid I'm not authorized to divulge any information on any elite units within Vapula's command hierarchy. That does not come under my jurisdiction. Yes, such "containment" units would probably require the utmost secrecy and security, so as to be most effective in their work. No, I'm afraid I don't pay attention to rumors. Sorry. No, I'm sorry, any rumors regarding any elite units that Technology may or may not have are unverifiable at this point. Yes, this is the official policy put down from Vapula himself. I'm afraid there's really nothing I can do abou- The Scorched Earth? I'm sure I don't know what you're talking about. This press conference is over. Now. Later. Jonathan P.S. Of course, in most cases, Vapula assigns Balseraphs to work directly with the Media. However, on this particular day there was a slip up and they got a Djinn. ;) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 03:39:18 +0800 From: Manny Nepomuceno Subject: Re: IN> The Angels of Fear Hey, > I like, Manny. Question: do the Angels of Fear still >have Fear Attunements, or have they all been completely >attuned to Dreams? Thanks. As for the question, that would be the GM's call, but if it were up to me I'd say that they were all completely angels of Dreams. ;) Manny Neps http://www.geocities.com/angeloffools/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2555 ********************************