in_nomine-digest Monday, June 17 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2677 In this digest: Re: IN> Living Artifact IN> IN review IN> IN review Re: IN> IN review Re: IN> IN review Re: IN> Dominic's Kitten RE: IN> Shamanism: Limits set (ds1) IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) Re: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) Re: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) Re: IN> Shamanism: Limits set (ds1) Re: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) IN> Livig Artifact IN> fan material IN> Mr Pumpkinhead RE: IN> Jumpin' Malakim! Re: IN> Livig Artifact Re: IN> Mr Pumpkinhead IN> Jumping Malakim ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 06:21:08 -0700 (PDT) From: W S Subject: Re: IN> Living Artifact Hmm... Honestly, I'd probally make such a character as a totally mundane, six or seven Forces Soldier of Eli who has MAYBE been granted Eli's Mecurian of Creation (Talisman Creation) attunment and the Songs of Form (especially Celestial). Rationalize as in order to invest full life into this creation, Eli gave it one of his own Forces, spice to taste, work into party, serve at 98 degrees, constantly hunt with people who WANT that much primordial clay. :) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 18:56:04 +0000 From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: IN> IN review http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_3170.html - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com pl312993@oak.cats.ohiou.edu http://www.geocities.com/perrylloyd/ "And that's the hardest thing for a human being to do - be wrong. Do you know that people would rather die than be wrong?" - --from A Matter For Men by David Gerrold _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos est le moyen le plus simple de partager et d'imprimer vos photos : http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 18:59:01 +0000 From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: IN> IN review http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_3170.html - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com pl312993@oak.cats.ohiou.edu http://www.geocities.com/perrylloyd/ "And that's the hardest thing for a human being to do - be wrong. Do you know that people would rather die than be wrong?" - --from A Matter For Men by David Gerrold _________________________________________________________________ Discutez en ligne avec vos amis, essayez MSN Messenger : http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 15:05:13 -0400 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> IN review At 06:56 PM 6/16/02 +0000, you wrote: >http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_3170.html That's enough, Perry. Period. - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:11:56 -0700 From: Kish Subject: Re: IN> IN review Perry Lloyd wrote: > > http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_3170.html > There is a difference between an IN review and an INS/MV review. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 19:17:08 +0000 From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Dominic's Kitten >>And what is its name? I have seen three or four different stories >>mentioning >>the kitten and each calls it by a different name. > > The name is whatever the writer thinks it should be. Of course, there >is >a certain futility of naming an animal that won't come when you call it. Dominic's cat won't come to him when he calls it? Weird, all my cats do. You'd think an Archangel would have the skills to build rapport with an animal, what with those /so powerful they don't have stats/ characteristics. 8) Then again, it -is- Dominic. - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com pl312993@oak.cats.ohiou.edu http://www.geocities.com/perrylloyd/ "And that's the hardest thing for a human being to do - be wrong. Do you know that people would rather die than be wrong?" - --from A Matter For Men by David Gerrold _________________________________________________________________ T鬩chargez MSN Explorer gratuitement ࠬ'adresse http://explorer.msn.fr/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 19:27:33 +0000 From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: RE: IN> Shamanism: Limits set (ds1) >>and the way you've written it would probably send Dominic into >>toxic shock. > >*chuckle* >Find a cult that dominic hasnt had a screaming hissy fit at. How about ... a Jewish cult (known today as Early Christians, iirc) that gained political power with it's acceptance by the Romans. Of course, in the American game, I can see no reason for Dominic -NOT- to have had a hissy fit over the early Christian cult, given their rejection of standard rules and tenants of the Jewish faith. Why Dominic converted to Christianity in the American game I have no idea, barring being told by God himself or meeting Jesus - both of which appear to be impossible in the American game ... tho I suppose that being told by Yves might be good enough. - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com pl312993@oak.cats.ohiou.edu http://www.geocities.com/perrylloyd/ "And that's the hardest thing for a human being to do - be wrong. Do you know that people would rather die than be wrong?" - --from A Matter For Men by David Gerrold _________________________________________________________________ Discutez en ligne avec vos amis, essayez MSN Messenger : http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 21:43:45 -0400 From: "S.D." Subject: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) So I just saw the movie for the first time (technically third as I watched it three times in a row... ^^) and got to thinking about the casting. I know it's been done before, but hey. ^^ Bethany: Child of the Grigori. Just because they're the only humans *born* with unique abilities. Though I could see Eli's descendant via Song of Fruition really easily. All presuming the background given in the movie is wrong. Bartleby: They say he's a Grigori, but I think he's a Mercurian. He knows *way* too much about people to fit default IN Watcher, I think. And it explains why he goes nuts after the one scene despite being sane until then. Not sure about Word, though oddly, I can see Trade and War the easiest. Loki: I'm thinking archaic Lightning, modern Fire, or War, just because the Word fits those three best. For Choir, I can see Malakite (obvious reasons, though it creates Problems with Azrael and the whole Outcast thing) or dissonant Elohite (hey, Jean was archaic-interpretation Lightning once...) Serendipity: *Clearly* a Creationer; my bet is Seraph or Malakite (see scenes with Azrael.) Azrael: Balseraph ex-Creationer, possibly ex-Dreamer. With a couple young Shedim as sidekicks (the Stygian Triplets.) Lately... Dark Humor, I think. (Though the Golgothan is really more Haagenti's brand of comedy...) Did I miss any angels/demons/etc? ~S.D. Ryukage ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "...remember: even God has a sense of humor. Just look at the Platypus." Kevin Smith, disclaimer at the beginning of 'Dogma' ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 18:00:25 -0800 From: "Brian Rogers" Subject: Re: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) I remember we had this discussion in depth when the movie first came out. A lot of interesting ideas. I saw a lot of ideas about Jay and Silent Bob being Soldiers of this or that. Never cared for that. I always liked the idea that they were just a couple of regular unboosted guys who got caught up in the whole mess. Brian - ----- Original Message ----- From: "S.D." Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 21:43:45 -0400 To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Subject: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) > So I just saw the movie for the first time (technically third as I watched it three times in a row... ^^) and got to thinking about the casting. I know it's been done before, but hey. ^^ > - -- __________________________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup Save up to $160 by signing up for NetZero Platinum Internet service. http://www.netzero.net/?refcd=N2P0602NEP8 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 19:09:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) - --- Brian Rogers wrote: > I saw a lot of ideas about > Jay and Silent Bob being Soldiers of this or that. Never > cared for that. I always liked the idea that they were > just a couple of regular unboosted guys who got caught up > in the whole mess. Likewise (though Metatron does refer to them as Prophets). As for Golgothans, reconsider the origin that is given for them. That's more Saminga's line than Haagenti's. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 02:19:53 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Shamanism: Limits set (ds1) Perry Lloyd wrote: > Why > Dominic converted to Christianity in the American game I have no idea, He didn't. As for his reasoning behind supporting the RCC, it's been thoroughly explained, I believe. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 22:24:50 -0400 From: "S.D." Subject: Re: IN> Dogma (mild spoilers) > As for Golgothans, reconsider the origin that is given >for them. That's more Saminga's line than Haagenti's. I was thinking Haagenti's brand of *humor*, as opposed to Kobal's. But Saminga does fit best. And Azrael *is* typically an/the angel of Death... maybe Bal of Dark Humor IST Saminga, with the Stygians as the Kobalite-aid and the Golgothan as the Samingan-aid? ...and now I'm getting mental images of Amnesiatic!Eli as Jay, Bob, or Rufus. [blink] ~S.D. Ryukage ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "I saw an angel in the marble, and carved until I set him free." Michaelangelo ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 11:57:10 +0930 From: "G N E Z D A" Subject: IN> Livig Artifact This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0063_01C215F6.1C65FFE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Okay, how's about this? :) He'd be generated in all respects as a 7-force saint, and use all normal = saint rules, with regards to vessel, force increases, etc. Perhaps he emits an aura of gentleness, so has the equivelant of the = Seraph of Novalis attunement. He might have either the Elohim of Mercurian of Eli attunements, or = maybe just the enchantment skill. Also, I might allow him to use the = Ofanim Ethereal song of Speed, thus enabling him to carve things = *really* fast (I imagine him to be the sort of person who always walks = around with a piece of wood and chisel, who can be tracked easily by the = wood shavings he leaves behind... :)). Perhaps Transubstantiation too, but probably not. I was also thinking of giving him (and allowing him to use) the = Corporeal song of Life, so he can create living artifacts himself and, = since he is primordial clay, he doesn't need to find any, he just pulls = it off himself. Effectively he would be the equivelant of one level of = clay per force he has, but then he must use his own forces to create = life (ie he loses a force, and gives it to his creation). Perhaps I'll also give him extra problems with regards to celestials = tracking him and spotting him, effectively they are tracking an = artifact, not a soul, so perhaps he'd be easier to find or something? = Definitely identifiable as an artifact. Also, since he is effectively seven levels of clay, can you imagine all = the unscrupulous celestials and humans who would be after this much = clay??? :) So, what do you guys think? Too powerful or not? The other GM and myself = have always had a policy that the GM is allowed more creative license = for their PCs (since we know everything from the books anyway, and that = way we can set up adventures to do with our characters) but the PCs = should always be the 'main guys'. So, the more powerful the GM-PC is, = the more low-key he should be played, so it doesn't steal from the other = PC's 'thunder'. :) Opinions, comments? :) Milan - ------=_NextPart_000_0063_01C215F6.1C65FFE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Okay, how's about this? :) He'd be generated in all respects as a = 7-force=20 saint, and use all normal saint rules, with regards to vessel, force = increases,=20 etc. Perhaps he emits an aura of gentleness, = so has the=20 equivelant of the Seraph of Novalis attunement. He might have either the Elohim of = Mercurian of Eli=20 attunements, or maybe just the enchantment skill. Also, I might allow = him to use=20 the Ofanim Ethereal song of Speed, thus enabling him to carve things = *really*=20 fast (I imagine him to be the sort of person who always walks around = with a=20 piece of wood and chisel, who can be tracked easily by the wood shavings = he=20 leaves behind... :)). Perhaps Transubstantiation too, but = probably=20 not. I was also thinking of giving him (and = allowing him=20 to use) the Corporeal song of Life, so he can create living artifacts = himself=20 and, since he is primordial clay, he doesn't need to find any, he just = pulls it=20 off himself. Effectively he would be the equivelant of one level of clay = per=20 force he has, but then he must use his own forces to create life (ie he = loses a=20 force, and gives it to his creation). Perhaps I'll also give him extra = problems with=20 regards to celestials tracking him and spotting him, effectively they = are=20 tracking an artifact, not a soul, so perhaps he'd be easier to find or=20 something? Definitely identifiable as an artifact. Also, since he is effectively seven = levels of clay,=20 can you imagine all the unscrupulous celestials and humans who would be = after=20 this much clay??? :) So, what do you guys think? Too = powerful or not?=20 The other GM and myself have always had a policy that the GM is allowed = more=20 creative license for their PCs (since we know everything from the books = anyway,=20 and that way we can set up adventures to do with our characters) but the = PCs=20 should always be the 'main guys'. So, the more powerful the GM-PC is, = the more=20 low-key he should be played, so it doesn't steal from the other PC's = 'thunder'.=20 :) Opinions, comments? :) Milan - ------=_NextPart_000_0063_01C215F6.1C65FFE0-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 05:01:35 +0000 From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: IN> fan material I really liked the Liber Servitorum, if I'm not mistaken, much of that book came from us fans (myself included). Did the book do well? If so, if there any potential, and this is directed more at the higher ups here, for other fan-driven/created books? maybe like: * complete adventures, not necessarily connected * alternate timelines/histories/and write-ups for the 'dead' Superiors * plot/adventures hooks by Superior (one book for Angels, one for Demons), maybe like secret organizations and the like, not unlike those in the Superiors books, but all together so that there's something for everyone. * fan art? I dunno. It's not like we haven't talked about this sort of thing before ... Hell, I'd pay $25 for a copy of Dark Victory complemented with art (for instance). Sure, I could stuff about it free on-line, just like I can get a lot of stuff free on-line, but there's nothing quite like holding a book in your hand with inspiring art-work to boot. - -shrug- - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com pl312993@oak.cats.ohiou.edu http://www.geocities.com/perrylloyd/ "And that's the hardest thing for a human being to do - be wrong. Do you know that people would rather die than be wrong?" - --from A Matter For Men by David Gerrold _________________________________________________________________ Discutez en ligne avec vos amis, essayez MSN Messenger : http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 18:11:58 +0930 From: "G N E Z D A" Subject: IN> Mr Pumpkinhead This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C2162A.78858910 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hmm... okay, how's about this addition to the Clay artifact... I was thinking of giving him a pumpkin for a head and hair made out of = steel wool. I was informed by someone on Brass and Steel mush that there = was a character with a pumpkin for a head in a Lewis Carroll story? I = actually had the idea without ever hearing of that. The idea came to me = about five years ago for a character in a miniatures wargame who's kind = of like a living scarecrow but with steel wool for hair. Then I thought, = why don't I incorporate that idea into this character? I also wanted him = to seem a little unhinged because the guy who created him was either = *very* seriously dissonant during creation, or else he had already = Fallen and not realised it yet. Anyway, then I really got thinking... (I know, I'm scared too ;)). Get = rid of the idea about him being really gentle and peaceful. Instead he's = the opposite (well, he's still a 'nice' guy but not that peaceful...). The celestial who created him (The Cobbler, sounds familiar to some?... = ;)) was a Menunim in service to Creation. You could think of him as = being almost like one of Santa's elves; he goes around making toys for = kids. This would naturally be a combination Blandine/Eli thing. The = thing is, he was about to Fall when he started creating Mr Pumpkinhead = and, by the time he had finished the creation he had already become a = Pachadim. Mr Pumpkinhead was made out of primordial clay, but a few of = The Cobbler's forces (now Pachadim forces) were used to bring him life.=20 Now he is a living artifact who has some of the personalities of a = pachadim, but he is still made out of primordial clay. I see primordial = clay as being basically pure creation, pure potential. The primordial = clay part of his creation urges him to create things, make beautiful = works of art, wonderful sculptures, etc. Unfortunately, the pachadim = part of his nature always corrupts and warps these creations, and = encourages him to scare children, etc.=20 So, you've got this character who sincerely tries to do the right thing, = loves sculpting, etc but everything he does always goes wrong and, = rather than inspiring people with the beauty of his work, he instead = scares them. What do you think? :) - ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C2162A.78858910 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hmm... okay, how's about this addition = to the Clay=20 artifact... I was thinking of giving him a pumpkin = for a head=20 and hair made out of steel wool. I was informed by someone on Brass and = Steel=20 mush that there was a character with a pumpkin for a head in a Lewis = Carroll=20 story? I actually had the idea without ever hearing of that. The idea = came to me=20 about five years ago for a character in a miniatures wargame who's kind = of like=20 a living scarecrow but with steel wool for hair. Then I thought, why = don't I=20 incorporate that idea into this character? I also wanted him to seem a = little=20 unhinged because the guy who created him was either *very* seriously = dissonant=20 during creation, or else he had already Fallen and not realised it=20 yet. Anyway, then I really got thinking... = (I know, I'm=20 scared too ;)). Get rid of the idea about him being really gentle and = peaceful.=20 Instead he's the opposite (well, he's still a 'nice' guy but not that=20 peaceful...). The celestial who created him (The = Cobbler, sounds=20 familiar to some?... ;)) was a Menunim in service to Creation. You could = think=20 of him as being almost like one of Santa's elves; he goes around making = toys for=20 kids. This would naturally be a combination Blandine/Eli thing. The = thing is, he=20 was about to Fall when he started creating Mr Pumpkinhead and, by the = time he=20 had finished the creation he had already become a Pachadim. Mr = Pumpkinhead was=20 made out of primordial clay, but a few of The Cobbler's forces (now = Pachadim=20 forces) were used to bring him life. Now he is a living artifact who has = some of the=20 personalities of a pachadim, but he is still made out of primordial = clay. I see=20 primordial clay as being basically pure creation, pure potential. The = primordial=20 clay part of his creation urges him to create things, make beautiful = works of=20 art, wonderful sculptures, etc. Unfortunately, the pachadim part of his = nature=20 always corrupts and warps these creations, and encourages him to scare = children,=20 etc. So, you've got this character who = sincerely tries=20 to do the right thing, loves sculpting, etc but everything he does = always goes=20 wrong and, rather than inspiring people with the beauty of his work, he = instead=20 scares them. What do you think? = :) - ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C2162A.78858910-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 06:42:28 -0400 From: "Bergeron, Robert F., DS1(SW)" Subject: RE: IN> Jumpin' Malakim! What happens when you jump a Malakim? He kicks your arse! - -----Original Message----- From: W S [mailto:snowcrash1775@yahoo.com] WS Malakite of Fate Angel of Socratic Logic. 'What'dya mean Malakites can't serve Fate?' Who just had another awful idea. Dark Malakim are insane, Discord wracked monsters... and they can't Fall... but what if a Malakim were to try and Jump? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 05:40:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Livig Artifact - --- G N E Z D A wrote: > He'd be generated in all respects as a 7-force saint, and > use all normal saint rules, with regards to vessel, force > increases, etc. Sounds good. > Perhaps he emits an aura of gentleness, so has the > equivelant of the Seraph of Novalis attunement. I don't see any justification for this, myself. > He might have either the Elohim of Mercurian of Eli > attunements, or maybe just the enchantment skill. Enchantment alone should be enough. > Also, I > might allow him to use the Ofanim Ethereal song of Speed, > thus enabling him to carve things *really* fast IIRC, that Song requires the Ofanite Resonance (if you want to remain within canon, at least). > Perhaps Transubstantiation too, but probably not. Some of the stuff that you mention later in your post almost requires this. > I was also thinking of giving him (and allowing him to > use) the Corporeal song of Life, so he can create living > artifacts himself and, since he is primordial clay, he > doesn't need to find any, he just pulls it off himself. > Effectively he would be the equivelant of one level of > clay per force he has, but then he must use his own > forces to create life (ie he loses a force, and gives it > to his creation). This is way cool. I think you should keep it. > Also, since he is effectively seven levels of clay, can > you imagine all the unscrupulous celestials and humans > who would be after this much clay??? :) Any GM who didn't take advantage of this is just not paying attention. 0:> ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 05:43:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Mr Pumpkinhead - --- G N E Z D A wrote: > Now he is a living artifact who has some of the > personalities of a pachadim, but he is still made out of > primordial clay. I see primordial clay as being basically > pure creation, pure potential. The primordial clay part > of his creation urges him to create things, make > beautiful works of art, wonderful sculptures, etc. > Unfortunately, the pachadim part of his nature always > corrupts and warps these creations, and encourages him to > scare children, etc. Another way to go with this is the "scared straight" method; he uses his Pachadite tendencies to identify bad children and scare them into reforming. It would take something like that to keep Christopher off his back. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 06:42:45 -0700 (PDT) From: W S Subject: IN> Jumping Malakim >From the mind that brought Sheddite of the Sword... About once a year, a Malakite gets highly dissonant. Bad luck and poor choices, combined with simple probability and population ensure this, and it's still lower than with any other Choir. About once a decade, this Malakite decides to not simply turn himself in for destruction. Their Discord may compel them to live, or perhaps... well, motivations fade into one another over the centuries. They become Outcasts. Once every few decades, these Outcast Malakim are not destroyed within a year of their Heart's being broken. Once every century or so, a surviving Outcast Malakim is found by some demons. Once every few centuries, these demons do not simply have a grand time plucking the Malakites' pretty black wings. Those few surviving Malakim get handed over to their respective Princes. Now, captured by Hell and in violation of one of their central Oaths, they begin growing simply increasingly dissonant. Eventually, just to find some release, at the urging of a Prince, they try to Jump. The Prince will often provide some assistance. It never works. The Malakite's Forces unravel rather than join the Infernal band. Sometimes, however, the Malakite is found by Lilith instead of another Prince. And no one understands bindings better than the Princess of Freedom. She can, at great cost, remove the Oaths that bind a Malakite. These newly freed Malakim often try to Jump. Again, their Forces unravel. However, even while remaining angels, /freed/ Malakim can be... altered. A Demonic Superior can invest a personal Force or two to attune the ruined Virtue to their Infernal Word. Hell rarely has more than two such creatures working for it at the same time- usally Kronos and Lilith, although Lilith usally loans her Malakite to others (for a Helluva Geas, of course- and they cost a lot more to buy than to rent). Even so... after thousands of years, almost every elderly Prince has had a Malakite so attuned to their Word. Only the relativly younger Princes (Haggenati, Nybass, Vapula, Alaemon, Fleurity, Furfur, etcetc) haven't- and it's a Top Priority for several. Heaven doesn't talk about these... things. Dominic hunts them ruthlessly, and Uriel nearly tore his Cathedral down when he first heard of them- made worse by the fact that the first to teeter so close to Falling was one of his own. Most angels consider them as little more than nonsense and rumors spread by the infernal. But still. It is possible to say 'Fallen Malakite' in the perfect Heavenly language. - --- Malakite of Freedom: Lilith doesn't 'grant' this attunment, and is frankly frustrated at it's existance. But all four of 'her' Malakim have demonstrated it. By taking a number of Soul Hits equal to the level of a Geas, they can remove it from another. And by losing a full Force, they can remove one Oath from another Malakite. Malakite of Fate: Kronos has had two such creatures- both solipists to the extreme, rationalizing their near Fall from Grace and present state as inevitable, a part of the divine plan. Ironically, God seems to agree- both of them became Prophets, albiet highly sporadically (rather than Gabriel's always on connection). Kronos kept them locked away, in the lowest part of the Archives- only one has been soul killed so far, and only at great cost. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2677 ********************************