in_nomine-digest Thursday, June 20 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2681 In this digest: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker Re: IN> Lilith's Body ROT-13 Celestials (was Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form?) IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker IN> Credit where credit is due (or not) Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. Re: IN> Dominic, without the Hood (RE: Ethnic backgrounds) Re: IN> Dominic, without the Hood (RE: Ethnic backgrounds) Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. IN> The T-Shirt Re: IN> Lilith's Body Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker Re: IN> Credit where credit is due (or not) IN> Jumping Malakim... IN> New Group IN> Ethnic backgrounds of the little guys IN> Beleth's celesstial form? Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... IN> Lilim Geasa Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? Re: IN> Ethnic backgrounds of the little guys Re: IN> Lilith's Body RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... Re: IN> Ethnic backgrounds of the little guys Re: IN> Lilith's Body Re: IN> Lilith's Body ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 20:15:26 -0400 (EDT) From: jamoge@wm.edu Subject: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker Hello all. Sorry for o.t. question, but there's something I've noticed on this listserv that I haven't seen on either of the others that I've been on. Maybe it's just me and the outlook express I use, but I've seen Moe and just recently Beth space out the letters sub when used in a sentence. For instance saying s u bdued instead of subdued. Is there a computer reason? An injoke? A glitch that has followed me from my school computer to my home pc? Again, sorry about the off topic nature of this query. I'll let you get back to the debate about what skin color a Superior should have. On that topic, I'd have to say that I never really thought about it, except that in every single mental image of Laurence I've ever had, I never once succeeded in giving him black hair. He's blond. He's permanently blond in my mind. Don't know why. Just is. Josh ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 20:26:43 -0400 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker At 08:15 PM 6/19/02 -0400, you wrote: >in a sentence. For instance saying s u bdued instead It's because of the way Majordomo is set up for this list; occasionally it'll catch "s u b" (without the spaces) and think that it's a s u bscription request, rather than an actual post, and send it to Beth instead of to the list. Spacing the letters is a way to get around that. - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 20:32:24 -0400 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> Lilith's Body > "Hmmmmmmm, let's see. I've got this GREAT Korean body that would fit >PERFECTLY in this chi pao...though it'd not be as snug on the top, or as >impressive, as it would be on my greek bod...then again, that vessel's also >got WAY too much hip for that dress...ooooh! That bit of faux-Amerind suede >lingerie would net me a slew of Geases, with a wink...I think I'll take >it..." >> >> >Kamika-Z I've had a tantalizing little notion in the back of my head for a while, and it's that Lilith *can't* have Vessels. She only has the one human body she was "born" into, like every other human. Oh, she can use a Superior-level Song of Form to make it look like anything she wants; but just that one. And Superior multitasking? Well, she can think about a dozen things at once; she can project a handful of bits of consciousness about the globe with Projection; and she can even use some Superior-level Songs of Motion, Sensation, and Light to give a really good impression that there's a body there; but, in the end, only one real body, lounging in Hell or walking on Earth. Just an idea for people to play with. William ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 21:14:54 -0400 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: ROT-13 Celestials (was Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form?) > 2. I thought that when in celestial form, the shape, appendages or lack > thereof, etc. was irrelevant to snuggling or anything else the celestial > wanted to do (otherwise, how would Seraphim or Ofanim do anything that > required hands?). Oh my God, Ruthie is SO going to kill me..... but that's such a perfect straight line, I can't *not* take it. A few weeks ago, my GF Ruth was musing on Celestial sex (don't ask!) and, for some reason, she brought up a Seraph-Ofanite pairing. She speculated that the Seraph would twine through the Ofanite's rings, thus giving the Wheel a sense of "satisfying fullness" and at the same time restricting its motion just enough to be "scary-nice". What the Seraph gets out of it is rather predictable, if you're inclined to be Freudian. Go on, try to get that image out of your head. - -- Casca "Many people hear voices when no-one is there. Some of them are called mad and are shut up in rooms where they stare at the walls all day. Others are called writers and they do pretty much the same thing." --Margaret Chittenden, writer ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 22:43:31 -0400 From: EDG Subject: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. Please. :) - -EDG Oddly, these artifacts actually appear in the wild. It takes special conditions, though: a Tether to Flowers, taken over by either Nightmares or Technology, will produce them. They tend to grow in boxes; all of these relics like dark, dry breeding grounds. Also, none of them appear anywhere but the Corporeal realm - and they can't be removed from the corporeal. They always appear at level 6, and never cost character points: their short duration and limited powers eliminate that need. Unless otherwise noted, each relic has a permanent duration, with two exceptions: if the user takes *any* damage in Body Hits, the effect wears off immediately and the artifact disappears forever, and if the item is removed, it vanishes utterly. Finally, with the exception of the Magic Mushroom, these items cannot be used at the same time; one must be removed (destroying it) before another can be used. The Magic Mushroom Magic Mushrooms are Relics with the Celestial Song of Form: they alter the user's size, doubling his height. Although powerful, they are strictly single-use, and must be consumed in order to be used. The Fire Flower A Fire Flower is a potent weapon: anyone carrying one of these can use a modified Celestial Song of Light, tossing tiny fireballs at the rate of one per round. The fireballs deal the user's Celestial Forces in Body Hits; they will bounce off any surface they encounter until they hit living tissue (at which point they deal their damage and vanish), but have an effective range of twenty yards. The Autumn Leaf Autumn Leaves are simply the initial form of these objects; when activated, they turn into a pair of raccoon ears on a headband, and a raccoon tail on a belt. They grant the wearer the power to fly (via the Corporeal Song of Motion), but unless he gets a *really* good running start (at least 30 yards), he must make a Will roll every round to avoid drifting back to the ground. (If he gets the start, he can fly without making a Will roll for 6 rounds; after that, the device functions as normal.) The tail can also be used as a weapon; it functions as a club with an Accuracy of -3. The Tanuki Suit This is actually a giant raccoon suit which the wearer must don before it activates. Not only does it grant the same powers as the Autumn Leaf, it also - if the wearer makes a separate Will roll, and continues making Will rolls every round the secondary power is active - turns to stone. This immediately causes the wearer to drop to the nearest flat surface directly below him, but grants 12 levels of Protection while the power is in effect. The Frog Suit This suit, like the Tanuki Suit, must be worn to be effective; it impedes the user's ability to move in any way but hopping on land, and removes any ability to use weapons at all (although Fighting, at -3, may still be used), but underwater, the wearer can move without impediment, taking no penalties to movement, Strength, or Agility for being underwater. (Fighting is still at -2, though, and no weapons may be used.) The Hammer Suit Again, this must be worn to be effective. The user gains 12 levels of Protection - but must make a Will roll to activate them, and each round he wishes to maintain them - and the ability to throw lethal hammers, which appear out of nowhere (the suit actually has a considerable number Scabbarded). These have Power +1, but must be thrown; they cannot be used as melee weapons. The Accuracy of each hammer is -2. The Power Wing This item takes the initial form of a miniature plush bird's wing; however, once activated, it takes the same form as the Autumn Leaf. It allows the user to fly indefinitely (using the Corporeal Song of Motion), without needing a running start or Will rolls. Unfortunately, its power lasts only for five minutes, at which point it vanishes utterly. The Sunlit Cape A Sunlit Cape is much like an Autumn Leaf, though the two will *never* be found in the same Tether. It allows the wearer to fly for 6 rounds if he gets a running start (again, 30 yards or better), to float down from heights without taking damage (decrease the speed by which the wearer falls by 2/3), and to catch updrafts (with a successful Perception roll) during flight, which will extend the duration of the flight by as many rounds as the user can continue to make Perception rolls. It can also be used as a weapon; treat it as a club with Accuracy --. Starman Starman is that most prized of all combat relics: it grants total invulnerability to the user. However, it only lasts for three combat rounds, and takes effect immediately upon being touched. While in use, a character affected by Starman's invulnerability glows incandescently. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 22:00:29 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. From: "EDG" > Please. :) So you're trying for the Word of Mario, eh? ;) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 20:11:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. - --- EDG wrote: > Please. :) > > -EDG Well, that was a tad weird-ass gonzo. Possibly even a tad and a half.* ;) Moe "No room to talk" Lane *So, if this shows up in the Saturday game, do you think that the mob would go after you or me first? ;) ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 04/13/02(this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 20:14:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker - --- jamoge@wm.edu wrote: > On that topic, I'd have to say that I never really > thought about it, except that in every single mental > > image of Laurence I've ever had, I never once > succeeded > in giving him black hair. He's blond. He's > permanently blond in my mind. Don't know why. Just > > is. Is he carrying a surfboard*? Moe *Yes, I know, the vision of Laurence as a California surfer is kind of painful. Then again, so is In Nomine as seen through the lens of a 1950's beach movie musical. Sorry about that. ;) ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 04/13/02(this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:22:15 -0400 From: EDG Subject: IN> Credit where credit is due (or not) At 08:11 PM 6/19/02 -0700, you wrote: >*So, if this shows up in the Saturday game, do you >think that the mob would go after you or me first? ;) Depends. Do you think they'd notice that I posted it before you stole it? ;) - -EDG The Credit The Credit is a coin, marked with the numeral 1 on the heads side and the words "Imperial Credit" and an embossed starfield on the other. Its designer had a sense of humor, you see. Each Credit can, for 1 Essence, be imbued with the essence of an idea that the user has come up with. Whoever has the Credit then *takes* the credit for the idea - or takes the blame - in the public eye, regardless of what source the idea appears to come from. The Credit is useful in that it can be very easily secreted around a victim's body, or substituted in with change (it's a silver coin about the size of a quarter). It's theorized, in fact, that these relics were first developed to get revenge on servitors of the Wind and Theft with the Swipe attunement; a change purse with one of these in it will inevitably draw blame to the holder. The duration on the Credit's effect is one hour for each level the relic has as a resource; after that it needs another Essence, and another idea, to be activated again. (No price on these; no LRel, and this should be more a MacGuffin than anything else. Slip it into a PC's pocket or in with his change and watch the fun begin...) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 22:27:17 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker From: "Maurice Lane" > > > > image of Laurence I've ever had, I never once > > succeeded in giving him black hair. He's blond. > > He's permanently blond in my mind. Don't > > know why. Just is. > > Is he carrying a surfboard*? I may never get the image of Laurence, Herald of Galactus out of my head now. > *Yes, I know, the vision of Laurence as a California > surfer is kind of painful. Then again, so is In > Nomine as seen through the lens of a 1950's beach > movie musical. So Laurence is the stalwart young hero of the movie, with Blandine as his dreamy love interest. Michael is the former champion surfer who now spends most of his time not working in the surf shop giving Laurence pointers. And the whole "Beach Blanket Heaven" thing is starting to scare me, so I'll stop now... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:29:40 -0400 From: Michael Nutt Subject: Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. Moe Lane, threat to the very nature of reality, wrote: > *So, if this shows up in the Saturday game, do you > think that the mob would go after you or me first? ;) Speaking as one of the players in the Saturday game, I think we would have enough Holy Wrath to go around. :) - -- Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 04:01:44 +0000 From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Dominic, without the Hood (RE: Ethnic backgrounds) >>I've generally thought of Blandine as a snow-leopard, and Beleth as >>some mutation of a panther. > >I like the idea of Beleth as a crystalline spider. with her web of nightmares into which she lures her victims ... but why crystalline? - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com pl312993@oak.cats.ohiou.edu http://www.geocities.com/perrylloyd/ "And that's the hardest thing for a human being to do - be wrong. Do you know that people would rather die than be wrong?" - --from A Matter For Men by David Gerrold _________________________________________________________________ Rejoignez le plus grand service de messagerie au monde avec MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:18:31 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Dominic, without the Hood (RE: Ethnic backgrounds) From: "Perry Lloyd" > > > >I like the idea of Beleth as a crystalline spider. > > with her web of nightmares into which she lures her victims ... but why > crystalline? In part due to the miniseries version of _It_, and also in part because I liked the imagery. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 23:41:32 -0500 From: "Gregg Forge" Subject: Re: IN> Don't ask. Please don't ask. >Please. :) > >-EDG > >The Magic Mushroom > >The Fire Flower > >The Autumn Leaf > >The Tanuki Suit > >The Frog Suit > >The Hammer Suit > >The Power Wing > >The Sunlit Cape > >Starman > You go, EDG. Oh, you so-very-go. Now, with my Limbo Stick Rev 2, we can create the most butt-kicking pair of Italian-vessal'd Malakim of Creation the world has EVER seen! Kamika-Z ...da da Dah da da DAAT...BOMP...doot doot doot... _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 07:06:47 -0400 From: Cameron McCurry Subject: IN> The T-Shirt The appearance of this item in the Marches has only been noted for about the last ten years. It is limited to mortal Dreamscapes and has yet to appear anywhere else. It appears as a simple T-shirt but on the front is very realistic artwork. The depiction is typically of some momentous occasion within a person's life although some minor incidents may be recorded here. Oddly enough, the shirts do not seem to serve any other function aside from recording events. They appear spontaneously and become a part of the landscape. The shirts have not appeared outside Dreamscapes, they do not move on their own and appear to have no intelligence. So when someone says "Been there, done that, got the T-shirt", you have a new appreciation for what it means... (This was another by product of last week's game. Don't know why it demanded to be written, but my muse gets cranky if I don't obey her) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 05:47:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Lilith's Body I _like_ this idea. Consider it stolen. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 05:55:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> A random question from a summertime lurker - --- Maurice Lane wrote: > *Yes, I know, the vision of Laurence as a California > surfer is kind of painful. Then again, so is In > Nomine as seen through the lens of a 1950's beach > movie musical. Nybbas' Drive-in presents -- Beach Blanket Balseraph! Brought to you by makers of Ceno-bites, the snack that tears your hunger apart! ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 06:01:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Credit where credit is due (or not) - --- EDG wrote: > The Credit [sigh] Once again, somebody gives me inspiration for something Man Was Not Meant to Know... Round Tuit This Artifact appears as a metal or ceramic disc about the size of a silver dollar. The word, "Tuit" is engraved on each side. Upon gaining possession of the Tuit and every hour thereafter the holder must make a Will roll to avoid doing something that he has been putting off. Only after discharging this obligation is the victim able to rid himself of the Tuit. Round Tuits can exist on any plane except one -- whatever unfinished business you have, you can't get a Round Tuit while you're in Limbo. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 09:34:38 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Jumping Malakim... >> How hard it is for /her/ to fulfill it doesn't matter. What matters is >> how hard it would be for the Malakite to fulfill it. >> And unless I'm mistaken, looking at her stats, that should make it a >> Need/0. "Fight or don't--it won't matter either way!" >Need/1, actually -- as trivial an effort as fetching a pack of gum. Unless the Malakite is the "athletic" sort and would prefer a good fight/chase. If she can't deliver she's out of luck. (This is what comes of reading Moe's "IN> New Group" post.) "Ha ha. I think I'll run off an join a media circus." -Pete Pete, Demon of Misinformation http://www15.brinkster.com/ugwump/IN/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 09:34:38 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> New Group >He raised one fist; >the sound of her neck breaking accompanied her into >unconsciousness. A bit wasteful. [snip] >The optimal course is to actually find an >existing serial killer, work out a way to kill him >celestially and take over his existing life. You're having trouble taking over a role? Why not take over Alyx's? Apparently she's made more than a few "sacrifices." The very people you hunt would become the next generation role. It does add a whole new dimension to the phrase "serial killer." "One man's angst is another man's pathos." -Pete Pete, Demon of Misinformation http://www15.brinkster.com/ugwump/IN/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 09:34:39 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Ethnic backgrounds of the little guys >>Perhaps not, but he does have a servant named Eminem. > No. Nononononono. That's a SOLDIER. As opposed to >the last one, who was quickly traded to Mammon, for having >a silly name and really, really bad hair. Sorry, my bad on the terminology. Still, it was nice to know someone else thinks [he now wants to be called] V-Ice serves Hell. Though I'd say he worked for Kobal. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>Thinking about it, only Mercurians and Elioites (and their Diabolical >>counterparts) would care strongly what their Vessel looked like. >Elohim? Elohim don't care about their vessels... Well, they might, but >they don't allow it to affect their judgment. They'll speak up if they >need a vessel of a particular type to be more _effective_... My bad again. I should have specified caring about effectiveness for the Elohim and caring about "chumminess" for the Mercurians. "Hey! You're mean!" -Squeakers, Reliever of Flowers "Yeah. But I'm cute, so I get away with it." -MacNorma (Free Lilim) Pete, Demon of Misinformation http://www15.brinkster.com/ugwump/IN/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 09:34:38 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? >> I've generally thought of Blandine as a snow-leopard, and Beleth as >> some mutation of a panther. >I like the idea of Beleth as a crystalline spider. I prefer Beleth as the Closet Monster / Windego. You know it's behind you. YOU KNOW IT'S THERE! But it knows when you are going to turn and look. No matter how fast you are you'll never see it. Yours in Fear and Loathing, BC Petery http://www15.brinkster.com/ugwump/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 09:46:49 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? It would make thematic sense if Blandine and Beleth had symmetrical and opposed forms. For instance, if Blandine is a four-winged white swan, Beleth is a bat-winged, slightly decayed-looking black swan. If Blandine is a snow leopard, Beleth is a black panther with two skull-like heads. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 10:23:35 -0400 From: "Roger Williby" Subject: Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? I like the spider idea, but I was thiking more of that cool spider in that movie Krull. That thing was pretty unattractive. Also, why should the appearance of an angelic superior have any bearing on how their demonic counterpart chooses to represent themself? I would think they woul try to distance themselves from the whole thing entirely. _________________________________________________________________ Join the world s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:14:38 -0400 From: "Bergeron, Robert F., DS1(SW)" Subject: RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... - -----Original Message----- From: Charles Glasgow [mailto:cglasgow@hotmail.com] "I shall not suffer an Evil to live, if it is my choice." This Oath covers Vessel-killing as well as soul-killing. If KK can get a successful look in a Malakite's eyes, that's at least a Need/1 (and probably no more than a Need/2, given that it's not much of an effort for her to fulfill the Need given how cheaply Kobal is subsidizing her Vessel replacement. Maybe a Need/3 if you consider Trauma 'significant risk'.) >I'd think a Malakite would Need to destroy her Celestialy. That's a Need/6, but KK would Choose not to fulfill that one. :) >Especially if that Malakite owed her for a Vessel killing. - -- Chuckg I don't see how a Lilim could be allowed to aquire a geas in this fashion at all. Almost every angel would have some desire/wish to either kill or try to redeem any demon, so if you go this route, every Lilim can get a level one geas on nearly every angel they meet, as long as they look them in the eyes and let angel take a shot. Just seems too easy, and we'd have a lot more tripped up angels. DS1 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:10:57 +0000 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? >From: Earl Wajenberg >Subject: Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? >Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 09:46:49 -0500 >It would make thematic sense if Blandine and Beleth had >symmetrical and opposed forms. For instance, if Blandine >is a four-winged white swan, Beleth is a bat-winged, slightly >decayed-looking black swan. If Blandine is a snow leopard, >Beleth is a black panther with two skull-like heads. Much like how Michael and Baal would also have opposed forms, representing Baal's rivalry and envy as he tries to be "more Michael than Michael". Of course, given that one's a Seraph and the other's a Balseraph, symmetrical and opposed forms wouldn't be hard to arrange. - -- Chuckg _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 16:13:24 +0000 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... >From: "Bergeron, Robert F., DS1(SW)" >Subject: RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... >Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:14:38 -0400 >I don't see how a Lilim could be allowed to aquire a geas in this fashion >at all. Almost every angel would have some desire/wish to either kill or >try to redeem any demon, so if you go this route, every Lilim can get a >level one geas on nearly every angel they meet, as long as they look them >in the eyes and let angel take a shot. And as long as they're willing to use up a Vessel (and spend a go-around in Trauma) for each and every Geas/1 they rack up. Unless you have the direct favor of a Prince who's willing to give infinite Vessel replacement and Trauma-recovery aid for free -- as KK does, and as no other Lilim (especially a PC Lilim!) in the entire universe is even remotely likely to ever get -- the cost/benefit ratio is totally unworkable. As Beth said -- KK is a total munchkin. She's just an *NPC* munchkin, and that's how she's remained viable this long. - -- Chuckg _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 12:30:49 -0400 From: "Bergeron, Robert F., DS1(SW)" Subject: IN> Lilim Geasa Started as Jumping Malakim, but it's gone beyond that - -----Original Message----- From: Charles Glasgow [mailto:cglasgow@hotmail.com] And as long as they're willing to use up a Vessel (and spend a go-around in Trauma) for each and every Geas/1 they rack up. Unless you have the direct favor of a Prince who's willing to give infinite Vessel replacement and Trauma-recovery aid for free -- as KK does, and as no other Lilim (especially a PC Lilim!) in the entire universe is even remotely likely to ever get -- the cost/benefit ratio is totally unworkable. As Beth said -- KK is a total munchkin. She's just an *NPC* munchkin, and that's how she's remained viable this long. - -- Chuckg Okay, point taken. But does a Lilim's aquired geas level depend on how hard it is for her to fulfill it, or how hard it is for the geasbound to do it themselves? KK has an unlimited supply of bodies, so her allowing one to be vanquished doesn't in any fashion help the Malakim's Need to destroy evil. What if a Lilim has a million dollars, and she detects a man who needs a thousand dollars, what level does the geas end up? My own thought was that it depended on how badly the person NEEDed something. Using my example, if the person Needed a grand to go to Vegas with his friends and hang out, it would only be a level two at best, but if the person Needed a thousand dollars to pay for his child's schooling, it would be more, and if the Need for money was to keep a loan shark from breaking something, or to pay for life saving surgery, then the Geas level would be 6. So "pass the salt" or "pick up the gum" favors would almost never generate an actual geas hook. I thought that's why they were referred to in such a fashion. DS1 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 10:34:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Beleth's celesstial form? - --- Charles Glasgow wrote: > Much like how Michael and Baal would also have opposed > forms, representing > Baal's rivalry and envy as he tries to be "more Michael > than Michael". > > Of course, given that one's a Seraph and the other's a > Balseraph, > symmetrical and opposed forms wouldn't be hard to > arrange. Same applies to Blandine and Beleth (though to a lesser degree); one's a Cherub, the other's a Djinn. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 19:23:43 +0100 From: "Harfield@eidosnet.co.uk" Subject: Re: IN> Ethnic backgrounds of the little guys Novalans would go the opposite route -- a petite White or Asian woman is non-threatening. Petite Asian women are non-threatening?! Have you ever seen any kung fu films?!?!?! Dave ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 15:30:32 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Lilith's Body At 8:32 PM -0400 6/19/02, William J. Keith wrote: >> "Hmmmmmmm, let's see. I've got this GREAT Korean body that would fit >>PERFECTLY in this chi pao...though it'd not be as snug on the top, or as >>impressive, as it would be on my greek bod...then again, that vessel's also >>got WAY too much hip for that dress...ooooh! That bit of faux-Amerind suede >>lingerie would net me a slew of Geases, with a wink...I think I'll take >>it..." >>> >>> >Kamika-Z > >I've had a tantalizing little notion in the back of my head for a while, >and it's that Lilith *can't* have Vessels. She only has the one human body [...] > in the end, only one real body, lounging in Hell >or walking on Earth. Just an idea for people to play with. I've actually toyed with that idea as well, from time to time. However, she couldn't take the _corporeal_ body to Hell, probably. So that means that either she _can't_ appear in Hell (which is somewhat contradicted by canon, but you could claim it's a Song of Projection), or she is able to "go celestial" to some extent. Even so, she can sort of have vessels -- she can multi-task, so she can use a Song of Possession on a vessel she's created (unless you're going to deny her that, of course, in which case she'd have to trade for them) and stored in a Body-Bag. When the Possession begins to fade Celestial Motion it back into its storage chamber. Which leads into another notion I've been having, for perhaps handling Superior manifestations if you don't feel like exposing the PCs to it... Have the Superior get to the Servitor's Heart and use Kyrio resonance or Song of Possession. Poof, Superior is now in the Servitor's vessel! This means that the PC Servitor can "come to" afterwards, with the signs of mayhem (or eerie lack of mayhem) all around and a pithy Superior comment in its head... O:> That, and it might amuse the GM to have the little wimpy 7-Force Andrealphite that the PCs are torturing for information suddenly smile and look upon them with the eyes of a Prince(ss)... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 15:42:31 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... At 4:13 PM +0000 6/20/02, Charles Glasgow wrote: >>From: "Bergeron, Robert F., DS1(SW)" >>Subject: RE: IN> Jumping Malakim... >>Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:14:38 -0400 > >>I don't see how a Lilim could be allowed to aquire a geas in this fashion >>at all. Almost every angel would have some desire/wish to either kill or >>try to redeem any demon, so if you go this route, every Lilim can get a >>level one geas on nearly every angel they meet, as long as they look them >>in the eyes and let angel take a shot. [...] >As Beth said -- KK is a total munchkin. She's just an *NPC* munchkin, and >that's how she's remained viable this long. The other trick is that K.K. has to _look_ for the correct Need. Since she has 1/2/6, she can often do that -- the penalty to Perception rarely gives her less than a 50-50 chance of nailing a Need on the first go-round. (If she fails, that's what her Dodge and Celestial Motion are for, till enough time has gone by that she can try again.) PC Lilim, unless they've gone the path of munchkinism that K.K. was desgined for, are unlikely to have Perception 12 quickly. _SANE_ Lilim, which K.K. is _not_, are unlikely to want to die multiple times for a crummy Geas/1-3 or so! And even if they do, they'll want a high Will (K.K.'s is 12) and low Corporeal Forces so they don't stay in Trauma long. It's a totally one-sided character, and really its only purpose is to make Malakim miserable from time to time. That said, I NPC'ed her in Maya's Fiat game, and it was rather interesting. See, she'd gotten tied up and drugged... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor RPG links; Random name list, Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 13:13:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Ethnic backgrounds of the little guys - --- "Harfield@eidosnet.co.uk" wrote: > Petite Asian women are non-threatening?! Have you ever > seen any kung fu films?!?!?! Yeah... enough to see Angela Mao-yin work the coquette angle right up to the moment when she starts kicking butt. I said that they appear non-threatening, I never said they couldn't be dangerous. Especially when they have the Malakite of Creation Attunement. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 17:29:00 -0400 From: "S.D." Subject: Re: IN> Lilith's Body >I've actually toyed with that idea as well, from time to time. However, >she couldn't take the _corporeal_ body to Hell, probably. > >So that means that either she _can't_ appear in Hell (which is somewhat >contradicted by canon, but you could claim it's a Song of Projection), >or she is able to "go celestial" to some extent. I had an idea awhile back about the Garden of Eden being partially of the Celestial plane, and therefore Adam/Lilith/Eve perpetually half in Heaven, half on Earth. Which was allowable, because they were designed to be able to go to all *three* planes without having to die first. Until Adam and Eve ate the apple. The *real* reason they weren't supposed to eat that particular fruit (as opposed to, say, "going near this poisonous snake" or something else overtly dangerous) wasn't just because it went against God's will, or because it gave them Knowledge that God didn't want them to have. (Hmm... shades of Raphael and Jean here...) It was because apples from the Tree interacted strangely with their Corporeal bodies, altering the genes that let them transition between the planes (and pass that on to their children.) So half of why Adam and Eve got kicked out was because they literally *couldn't* stay in Eden. And no other human has that ability, since not even a human descendant would have the genes. Except Lilith. She never ate the apple because she left willingly. She can go to Heaven...or *could*, if she wasn't a Princess. But between her innate ability and that rank, she *can* go to Hell without dying. Which raises the question, could a *human* child of Lilith do the same? And would (or does) Lilith have any human children? Mmm, plot seeds... ~S.D. Ryukage ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "The Man [Christ] loved being human. Probably why He was so good at it." Rufus, the 13th Apostle, 'Dogma' (More proof for the Eli-as-Jesus theory. ^^) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 14:49:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Lilith's Body - --- "S.D." wrote: > I had an idea awhile back about the Garden of Eden being > partially of the Celestial plane, and therefore > Adam/Lilith/Eve perpetually half in Heaven, half on > Earth. Which was allowable, because they were designed to > be able to go to all *three* planes without having to die > first. Interesting... > half of why Adam and Eve got kicked > out was because they literally *couldn't* stay in Eden. > And no other human has that ability, since not even a > human descendant would have the genes. > > Except Lilith. > > She never ate the apple because she left willingly. She > can go to Heaven...or *could*, if she wasn't a Princess. > But between her innate ability and that rank, she *can* > go to Hell without dying. > > Which raises the question, could a *human* child of > Lilith do the same? Assuming that the father was one of Adam's descendents (and Human males who aren't are in really short supply), I see three possibilities: 1) Adam's genes are dominant, so the offspring must die to ascend to the Celestial; 2) Lilith's genes are dominant, so the offspring has her ability to traverse planes freely; 3) Neither set of genes is dominant, which leaves two options: 3a) Some offspring from the pairing will take after Lilith, others will take after Adam. Final results depend on how many of them there are; 3b) Any offspring from that pairing will have a limited version of Lilith's plane-shifting ability -- say, they can go to Hell but not Heaven without dying (or vice versa). Another variant could perhaps reach the Ethereal without falling asleep but would have no special talent for entering the Celestial plane. Whatever option the GM goes with, I would definitely allow members of Lilith's Brood to go to Limbo. ===== Michael Walton, #US2002023848 "Be aware that most people are operating on a highly condensed version of the 10 Commandments... the part about murder." -- Mark Bricklin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2681 ********************************