in_nomine-digest Sunday, August 4 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2733 In this digest: Re: IN> Give 'em Hell... Re: IN> Give 'em Hell... IN> New Discord- Reliphobia Re: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia IN> *coughsnigger* IN> Evil Mike part 3 IN> Quick Question IN> Dischord - Spicy IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... Re: IN> *coughsnigger* Re: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... Re: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia Re: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... Re: IN> Evil Mike part 3 Re: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia Re: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... RE: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... Re: IN> Evil Mike part 3 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2002 17:46:27 -0500 From: "Gregg Forge" Subject: Re: IN> Give 'em Hell... > > Hey, you threw the gauntlet first; now you gotta keep from > > shooting the food. >Throw the gauntlet? Moi? Surely, you jest. :D (It's against my >dissonance >conditions!) You issued the challenge. Now, you're gonna have to endure the results! Oh, and lest I forget...food run time... Kamika-Z ...Purple Ofanite Needs Food Badly! > >... > > >... > >... Shooting the food? Heeheeheeheehee! _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2002 17:47:47 -0500 From: "Gregg Forge" Subject: Re: IN> Give 'em Hell... > > http://web2.airmail.net/tanuki/InNomine/InHellPerdition6WIP.jpg > > > > Uh huh. And somebody called for something other than > > Balprop? }::;> > >Compared to the iCelestial ones, this isn't? ;:;) Damned right. Kamika-Z, preparing to deploy the Blue Habbalah Group... _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Aug 2002 20:22:11 -0700 (PDT) From: W S Subject: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia Because the idea of an Angel (Especially the Sword or Judgement) getting this amuses me :) Reliphobia (Ethereal Discord) A celestial who is suffering from Reliphobia is terrified of the trappings of organized religion. Although they may not personally believe in a given human faith, the signs of that faith can be enough to drive them away or reduce them to blubbering tears of fear. When confronted with a triggering condition (based on the level of the Discord), the celestial in question must make a Will check, with the CD being higher than the level of the discord, or do whatever it takes to flee from the presence of the religious object. Note that as this is an ethereal discord, it's purely in the Celestial's head- if confronted with a totally alien religion, they won't be afraid- until the significance of everything is explained to them. 1: Large, immoble objects- churches, mosques, etc. 2: Holy men or priests, dressed in full, formal robes/wear. 3: Holy books. 4: Small, portable items- a cross, sacremental bread and wine, etc. 5: A sung hymn. 6: A spoken prayer. ... "You have to believe me! I'm an angel serving the Most Just, and I'm here to bring that demon to justice!" "Then how come you run off whenever he waves a cross at you?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 00:21:03 -0400 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia At 08:22 PM 8/3/02 -0700, you wrote: >Reliphobia (Ethereal Discord) Pretty neat. :) Just as a side note, the term meaning "fear of religion" is theophobia (where "fear of religious ceremony" is teleophobia, which is also "fear of definite plans"). :) Kaimeliophobia (Ethereal Discord) Typically, this word denotes a fear of objects of power or significance; as a Discord, it manifests not so much as an aversion as a jinx: artifacts, talismans, relics, and reliquaries simply do not work around the afflicted celestial. This Discord is seen mostly in servitors of Creation and Technology, though it appears in angels who serve Lightning and demons who serve Greed and Gluttony. If the suffering celestial even so much as touches an artifact of any sort (corporeal, ethereal, or celestial), the artifact immediately loses levels equal to the level of the Discord, affecting all of its powers equally. (Someone with Kaimeliophobia/2 who came into contact with a relic/talisman that granted Celestial Shields/4 and Move Silently/2 would reduce the effectiveness of Celestial Shields to 2, and eliminate Move Silently entirely.) Once the celestial has left contact with the artifact, the effect dissipates at a rate of one level per hour that goes by, for *all* of the artifact's powers. (In other words, the relic in the previous example would grant Celestial Shields/3 and Move Silently/1 after an hour, be back to full effectiveness after 2 hours.) The exception to this is reliquaries; although their Essence capacity returns, any Essence they might have lost as their capacity diminished is lost to the Symphony. Wise characters will note that this Discord does have some positive aspects: namely, artifacts such as Will Shackles and Force Catchers are barely usable against a character with high levels of this Discord, and any relic weapons that rely on physical contact to affect their victim (such as Holy Bullets) are diminished *before* their damage is dealt! However, weapons such as a gun that fires Celestial Light at a target are unaffected unless the afflicted celestial makes physical contact with the weapon itself. Unlucky sufferers of this Discord, if they are allowed to become more Discordant, often find themselves suffering from Kaimeliophilia (Celestial Discord) This Discord inflicts a desire for artifacts of any sort (corporeal, ethereal, or celestial); whenever one comes into view, the celestial must make a Will roll, at a penalty equal to this Discord's level, to avoid trying to gain possession of it. Add 1 to the roll that the afflicted celestial makes to regain Essence if he is, at that point, in personal possession of at least one artifact of any kind. Finally, there's Oneirokaimeliosis (Ethereal Discord) This Discord tends to occur in servitors of Dreams and Nightmares more than anyone else. The afflicted celestial alters the powers of any talisman or relic that he touches, to the extent of changing the Songs and skills that the artifact grants. These changes are not under the celestial's control, and do not change the artifact's levels - only its abilities. The changes last for a number of minutes equal to the Discord's level; if the celestial is still in contact with the artifact at that time, or has resumed contact with it, the artifact will shift again for another full duration. Again, the wise celestial will note that this can be used to the celestial's advantage - the same sorts of artifacts that are affected by Kaimeliophobia are changed by Oneirokaimeliosis, and so Will Shackles can be turned into manacles with Celestial Seals, and so on. However, remember that this is not under the conscious control of the celestial, and is an unpredictable power at best. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 09:07:19 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> *coughsnigger* > ...Anyone got any requests? :D > > - --Kim, Angel of Random Enthusiasm The look on Prince Andre's face when his partner says, "You are the _second_ kinkiest man I've ever been with." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 09:07:19 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Evil Mike part 3 > Djinn: > Djinn in Michael's service are generally back-up > Demons. They are automatically attuned to a specific > Demon of War and gain 1 Essence whenever they aid that > Demon in any battle. Shield Demons? :> > Michael re-assigns them another > Demon to attune to should the one they used to help > dies. A failure... Not the kind of backup _I'd_ be looking for. > Strike With Great Vengeance: > For 1 Essence per damage taken, they can add that same > amount of damage to their next attack. This may be > done until the Demon no longer has Essence or the > target has been hit. For example, an Angel hits the > holder of this attunement for 2 damage, for 2 Essence > the Demon can add an extra 2 damage to the damage to > his next attacks until it hits. Glah! Munchkin Alert! Reword or else: "Go on, hit me again. Now more Essence. Now hit. Essence. Again. Again. Yeah, that'll do it. Now I'll do the Song of Healing. One more Essence. Thanks. You're pretty cool for an Impudite. Now that I'm all charged up, lets go find that Malakite that's been bothering you." > Unholy Frenzy: > Holders of this attunement can take twice the damage > they normally do whenever in battle. However, they > lose 1 Essence per point of damage taken in excess. What? They have x2 Hit Points and then loose Essence if their HPs fall to less than what they would have without this Attunement? > Captain of War Mongers: [...] > They gain 1 Essence > for every 5 participants in a battle they caused that > they did not involve directly. Rephrase please. And perhaps include the phrase, "Any Essence beyond what the demon could normally hold bleeds off into the Symphony." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 09:07:18 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Quick Question > Occasionally dump him into a host which has a secret > vice, like abusing animals, drugs, paedophilia, abuse, etc. -- something > no good angel should overlook, but a Kyrio has to worry about damaging > the host. That's always a nice fork. Fink him out to a Mercurian of Fire? A Cherubim of Flowers? A Malakite of War? (After the Kyrio leaves of course.) The M o' W (or a pack of Fire) might want to form a working relationship, "You set 'em up, I'll knock 'em down." Random Thought: Would a Kyrio of Yves be able to access a demon's memory while possessing his vessel? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 09:07:19 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Dischord - Spicy > Mmmmm. Spiced Angel. Andre is gonna sponsor a tasting contest. He might also make it an ornamental Numinous Corpus. I can just imagine Haagenti inflicting this on an arena full of Gremlins, and then eating them like popcorn. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 19:00 +0100 (BST) From: jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) Subject: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... Something interesting that happened in Rhodri's campaign a few weeks ago, and which I've been thinking about since. A few weeks ago, we cleaned out a nest of Lusties, sending them all back home in Trauma. They came back, with reinforcements, which really didn't please our Cherub, who is attuned to one of their targets. This time we got nasty. We captured most of them, except for the Habalite with a really fragile vessel, and after the local Michaelite interrogation squad had asked them a few questions, we discussed how best to dispose of them. Now, we would not have had this option is we hadn't had a big and generally known heavenly tether around (The Tower of London, 12-force Tether of the Sword), but we did. So we took it. We took those demons down to the tether, and one at a time, killed their vessels in the tether locus, thus forcing them into celestial form. And 12D6 celestial damage per round will keep them stunned, and makes bashing them celestially essentially unnecessary, although it's very satisfying. So we soul-killed them. They didn't report back - they could have reported success of their initial moves, but then they just vanished and they won't be coming back. Now, none of the angels who was responsible for this has any real moral problem with the idea (servitors of War, the Sword, Lightning, Divine Fire, Destiny and Creation-ist-Wind). What this *player* is wondering is what it says about our campaign tone, by other people's standards. - --- John Dallman jgd@cix.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 19:00 +0100 (BST) From: jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) Subject: Re: IN> *coughsnigger* In article , bpetery@yahoo.com (BC Petery) wrote: > The look on Prince Andre's face when his partner says, "You are the > _second_ kinkiest man I've ever been with." He's going to have to kill Eli for that, you realise... - --- John Dallman jgd@cix.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 18:23:04 +0000 From: "Janet Anderson" Subject: Re: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... >We took those demons down to the tether, and one at a time, killed their >vessels in the tether locus, thus forcing them into celestial form. And >12D6 celestial damage per round will keep them stunned, and makes bashing >them celestially essentially unnecessary, although it's very satisfying. >So we soul-killed them. If you kill a celestial's vessels, don't they end up in Trauma next to their heart (except for Malakim)? They might *choose* to take celestial form, but they wouldn't be *forced* to. Other than that, since when does soul-killing by angels make a campaign dark? Janet Anderson _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 13:23:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia Seems to me that this Discord is more appropriate for demons. It works even better for Undead. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two things that stand in the way of happy marriages

-- men and women." -- Rev. David Moore

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 13:29:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... - --- John Dallman wrote: > Now, none of the angels who was responsible for this has > any real moral > problem with the idea (servitors of War, the Sword, > Lightning, Divine > Fire, Destiny and Creation-ist-Wind). What this *player* > is wondering is > what it says about our campaign tone, by other people's > standards. Dark, low contrast. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two things that stand in the way of happy marriages

-- men and women." -- Rev. David Moore

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 13:46:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Evil Mike part 3 Well, the over-the-top Superiors contests didn't officially close, so this definitely qualifies. As for making the stuff actually playable... - --- Kanako Otaku wrote: > Balseraphim: > Whenever they use their resonance to start or prolong > any form of conflict, even just a shouting battle, > they gain 1 Essence. 2 if the battle involved > physical combat. They must be a participant in the > conflict however, to gain Essence. Seems OK. > Djinn: > Djinn in Michael's service are generally back-up > Demons. They are automatically attuned to a specific > Demon of War and gain 1 Essence whenever they aid that > Demon in any battle. Enh. Not much of an Attunement IMO. > Calabim: > Destroyers of War are Michael's second favorite > Servitors. Most of his Captains are Calabim. Calabim > who use their resonance to destroy an opponent's > weapon before a battle gain 1 Essence after the > battle. Beginning to see a trend here... > Habbalah: > The few Habbalah of War are always paired with Lilim, > as their Band Attunements work well in combination. > Habbalah gain 1 Essence whenever they use their > resonance to make a person feel the Need to fight > someone. 2 if the person is someone the target > doesn't know. This is pretty good, but the trend continues. > Lilim: > His step Daughters are Michael's most favored Demons. > First, they gain a Geas/2 on a person if that person > Needs to fight someone Why automatically a Geas/2? It should be based on how badly the subject Needs to fight someone. Which means a bonus to detect the Need to fight is more appropriate. > Shedim: > Shedim of War become dissonant whenever they leave the > host's body without engaging it in a battle. If they > do, they gain 1 Essence, but only if they actually see > that battle to it's conclusion. A bonus to make a Host engage in battle would be better, methinks. > Impudite: > Whenever they have hostile forms of physical contact, > such as punching, with a person, they can use their > resonance to take 1 Essence per contact. IOW, they can use fighting as a replacement for Charm. Nice. Now here's my problem; almost all of these Attunements are Rites with no apparent limits on how often they can be used. This is seriously munchkiny. Evil Mike's demons are basically given bottomless cups of Essence. > Strike With Great Vengeance: > For 1 Essence per damage taken, they can add that same > amount of damage to their next attack. This is worded a bit akwardly. How about, "...they can add that same amount of damage to their next successful attack" instead? Otherwise it seems OK to me. > Unholy Frenzy: > Holders of this attunement can take twice the damage > they normally do whenever in battle. However, they > lose 1 Essence per point of damage taken in excess. Hmmm... double Hits, but you lose Essence when you get down to your normal Hits (thus decreasing your ability to fight)? This seems like more of a curse than a blessing. > Knight of The First Strike: > Knights of War can instantly cause the corporeal death > of a person with a single attack Just say "no" to one shot kills. This is too munchkin to even be considered playable. > Captain of War Mongers: > Captains of War are masters at making people start > fighting for no sensible reason. They can sense any > underlying hatred or bitterness towards another person > or group, and with a touch, they can make a person use > that reason to start a conflict. They gain 1 Essence > for every 5 participants in a battle they caused that > they did not involve directly. As in, they touch somebody and that person flies off the handle? No resistance test or anything? That's balanced how? And the secondary effect just adds to the bottomless cup of Essence. > Baron of Conscription: > For 1 Essence per target, they can make a target fight > a battle for the Demon. The number of targets > however, is limited to the number of the Demon's > Forces on that plane and may only be used on those > within the Demon's line of sight. This cannot be > countered with a Will Roll. Also, if the Demon > participates in the battle with the targets, they no > longer have to pay the Essence cost. Those targeted > by this are subject to the Demon's control until the > Demons or Michael himself releases them, or until they > die. NO FREAKIN' WAY would I ever allow this as written in my game. Not without some kind of resistance test for sure, and I'd prefer that the user had to make an activation test or spend Essence to use it. > Basic Rites: > -kill an Angel ( 1 for Corporeal, 2 for Celestial, 3 > for Soul-Death ) Ummm... Celestial death IS soul death. Do you perhaps mean Ethereal combat for that second one? > -start a small scale, armed conflict such as a riot > -participate in a violent uprising > -use the weapon of an opponent against them > -kill an opponent who has surrendered to you. Except for the hiccup on the first one, the Rites are rather good. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two things that stand in the way of happy marriages

-- men and women." -- Rev. David Moore

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 14:51:14 -0700 (PDT) From: W S Subject: Re: IN> New Discord- Reliphobia - --- Michael Walton wrote: > Seems to me that this Discord is more appropriate > for > demons. It works even better for Undead. Certainly it's more appropriate- but the image of a vampire recoiling from a cross isn't half as amusing as the incongruity of a Seraphim of Judgement doing the same :) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 22:59 +0100 (BST) From: jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) Subject: Re: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... In article <20020804202926.66506.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>, thunderdog_sa@yahoo.com (Michael Walton) wrote: > John Dallman wrote: > > What this *player* is wondering is what it says about our campaign > > tone, by other people's standards. > Dark, low contrast. That's what I thought people would say. But what else can you do, when they won't take the hint and go away? - --- John Dallman jgd@cix.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 16:29:53 -0600 From: Julian Mensch Subject: RE: IN> Contrasty, yes, dark, maybe... In article <20020804202926.66506.qmail@web14608.mail.yahoo.com>, thunderdog_sa@yahoo.com (Michael Walton) wrote: > John Dallman wrote: > > What this *player* is wondering is what it says about our campaign > > tone, by other people's standards. > Dark, low contrast. That's what I thought people would say. But what else can you do, when they won't take the hint and go away? - -- I'm actually going to disagree here. If your character kills someone who is A) unrepentently evil, and B) cannot be effectively corralled short of real death (which does apply to Celestials) then that doesn't make a chronicle Dark -- just not so Bright as to completely obscure the realities of being in a war. Now, if the Lusties weren't actively out to hurt and degrade others, the situation would be different, but given that sending them to Trauma is only going to mean Andre gives them new vessels and sends them out to continue being sexual predators, what else could the angels do? Most demons are just not redemption material (in canon -- Moetica, for example, obviously differs). Would granting a fair duel make this situation seem more palatable? Invoking Dominic for a mock trial when the verdict is already clear? I can't see how either of these affect the balance of morality here. - -- Julian Mensch ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2002 16:07:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Kanako Otaku Subject: Re: IN> Evil Mike part 3 >Glah! Munchkin Alert! Reword or else: "Go on, hit me >again. Now more Essence. Now hit. Essence. Again. >Again. Yeah, that'll do it. Now I'll do the Song of >Healing. One more Essence. Thanks. You're pretty cool >for an Impudite. Now that I'm all charged up, lets go >find that Malakite that's been bothering you." The damage can only be returned to the one who did it in the first place. Which menas: "Stop hitting me you damn Impudite before I rip your head off...." >What? They have x2 Hit Points and then loose Essence >if their HPs fall to less than what they would have >without this Attunement? Pretty much, yeah. >Rephrase please. And perhaps include the phrase, "Any >Essence beyond what the demon could normally hold >bleeds off into the Symphony. Being done as we speak. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2733 ********************************