in_nomine-digest Wednesday, September 4 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2763 In this digest: Re: IN> The Rings IN> Skill Difficulty IN> New Skill: Jumping Re: IN> The Rings Re: IN>Something to chew on Re: IN> It's been a while since I've done one of these... Re: IN> It's been a while since I've done one of these... Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Fwd: Re: IN>Something to chew on from Gregg Forge Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping Fwd: Re: IN>Something to chew on from Robb Kidd Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping Re: IN> Skill Difficulty IN> Ecumenical Attunement: Apotheosis IN>Kobal has Something chewing on me Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Re: IN>Kobal has Something chewing on me Re: IN>Something to chew on Re: IN>Something to chew on Re: IN>Something to chew on Re: IN>Something to chew on ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 13:18:08 +0000 From: "Sirea Theyal" Subject: Re: IN> The Rings *laughs* Aw, what about the Pegasus Boots? I love those. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 09:50:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher Anthony" Subject: IN> Skill Difficulty This has been bugging me for a while. Unfortunately, I haven't playtested this at all. Suggestions are welcome; I'm aware that CP costs here are high, but it does solve the problem of a character starting out with no combat skills at all and becoming a Kung Fu Grandmaster after two average sessions. - -EDG Skill Difficulty (Throughout, "skill" should be read as "skill or Song". Skill Difficulties apply to Songs as well.) This is a new statistic for skills (going along with Associated Characteristic and Default). A Skill Difficulty (SD) increases the amount of effort and study required to learn new levels in a skill (including buying it from default); mechanically, this involves increasing the character point cost of each new level of the skill. (Yes, there's math involved.) The Skill Difficulty rating of a skill is the cost, in character points, required to buy the skill from its default level to level 1. To improve a skill, the character must spend character points equal to the SD of the skill multiplied by the level to which he wants to increase it. Additionally, character points must be paid for one level before the next can be purchased. To wit: Bob the Newly-Fledged Mercurian, has no levels in Knowledge (Physics). Knowledge (Physics) defaults to Knowledge at -4, and has a Skill Difficulty of 2. Bob wants to know it at level 3. He needs to pay 2 CP for level 1, 4 CP for level 2, and 6 CP for level 3 - a total of 12 character points. Another example: Fred the Experienced Malakite still hasn't learned the Corporeal Song of Seals past level 2 (which he bought at character creation). The Corporeal Song of Seals has a Skill Difficulty of 3; Fred's going to have to pay 9 CP to master another level of the Song of Seals, and if he were to buy it to level 6 he'd have to pay 45 further character points! Note that Skill Difficulties can be fractional, although CP costs are always rounded up to the nearest integer. (All existing skills, for example, have SD 1/6.) In addition, an SD should rarely be higher than 2 or 3. Skill Difficulties *do not apply* during character creation. (A suggested alternate, for those of you who dislike all these two-digit CP costs, is to make each level of a skill cost its SD in character points. Buying to level 6 in a skill with SD 2, from the default level, would thereby cost 12 CP. It's still a little low for my tastes (four sessions to Kung Fu Grandmaster), though.) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 10:06:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher Anthony" Subject: IN> New Skill: Jumping This may be duplicated somewhere; I don't have books and therefore can't check. x_x - -EDG Jumping (Strength) Default: -1 SD: 1/2 This is the skill of jumping, both broad and high. In combat, a highly-mobile character may use the higher of Jumping or Dodge to get out of the way of attacks. (This is up to the GM's discretion.) The distance jumped is a function of the check digit: Standing high jump: (1 ft. * CD) + Jumping levels Running high jump: Basic move (feet per second) + CD + Jumping levels Standing broad jump: Agility + CD + Jumping levels Running broad jump: (Basic move (feet per second) + Jumping levels) * CD ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 10:13:32 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher Anthony" Subject: Re: IN> The Rings Sirea Theyal said: > *laughs* Aw, what about the Pegasus Boots? I love those. And both of those previous posts lead to: Pegasus Boots (Talisman/6) Pegasus Boots are a pair of tanned leather boots, rising about to the calf, with a folded top and with feathered wings at the ankles. They add 6 to the wearer's current Jumping level; although they cannot raise the skill above 6, any excess is automatically added to the check digit (on successes *and* failures). Pegasus Boots do not recognize an owner, except as much as their current wearer owns them. They cannot be attuned (as per normal artifacts), although an enterprising artificer can turn them into corporeal artifacts. Talisman/6 (Jumping): 12 CP Excess skill adds to CD: +2 Cannot be attuned: Total * 75% Total Cost: 11 CP ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 16:05:23 +0000 From: "Sirea Theyal" Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on (And here's how I see my Demon Princes!) Baal: His human form looks a lot like Michael's, just with black hair, pale skin, and a much more angry look. His celestial form is a gigantic snake with bladed wings, large red eyes, and blood red scales. Andrealphus: Her human form is whatever you must lust after, taken up a notch. She usually has red hair. Her celestial form is either the most sexual man or woman you have ever imagined, with long black hair and very exotic features. Kronos: His form is always that of a average sized man with long blond hair perfectly parted down the center. He wears elegant brown and black robes with white and red markings, and has on a large black circlet. He always has his special book in hand with a red quill-pen, and a large black-bladed saber-like sword when he's... angry. His eyes are cold and black, and his skin is a perfect shade of blue-white. Kobal: His human form is whatever he feels like at the time, and his celestial form is a desolate looking man wearing black clothing, with no apparent wings. His eyes are a pale green, and he has a halo of black light. Haagenti: His human form is a huge and fat man with red hair (think something like Fat Bastard from Austin Powers) and his celestial form is like in Canon- giant angry evil death demon. Malphas: His human from is whatever you want it to be (usually looks like your best friend, or a relative) and his celestial form is that of a truly massive cloud of boiling yellow smog and black light, with a million faces within it. Beleth: Her human form is an utterly ugly and terrifying human with no eyes, bone-white skin, wispy hair, the works. Her celestial form is... well, no one is sure. Whatever it is, whenever you look at it, you see your worst fear... Asmodeus: Human form is just a very strict and cold man with short black hair and icy blue skin. His celestial from is a gigantic black chinese dragon with a wispy beard and piercing eyes that know your every sin... Valefor: He doesn't take a human form, he instead manifests as a swooshing wind cloud that can speak. His celestial form is a truly gigantic and ever moving demon with green and blue coloration. Vapula: His human form is whatever fits his fancy, but usually it's a hurried looking mad scientist with really freaky eyes... his celestial form is that of a mad scientist again, but with scars and cuts and burns... Saminga: In undead form, he's a 16 foot tall zombie with a crown of bone an flesh, and hollow eyes. His celestial form is a screaming pool of black darkness, with bodies and undead crawling out of it. Lilith: She always appears as a woman with a wild bush of luminous white hair, with soft glowing white skin. She looks like a Lilim, sans the horns and green skin really. Belial: His human form is a tall grinning man with black hair and red eyes, wearing black clothing in good taste. His celestial form is that of a truly huge Balrog-like Calabite with a river of flame behind him. Mammon: Human form is that of a fat and greasy looking banker. His celestial form is a large snake with golden scales, gems for eyes, and wings made from precious minerals. Nybbas: His human form is Canon, with the hair and bad suits and glasses. His celestial form is the same really, just with a halo of static and two LCD screen wings. Magog: His human form is a large and evil looking man with bloody hands and sharp teeth. His celestial form is that of a dripping column of reddish-black fluid with a million snarling mouths, and people screaming in eternal pain and they are ripped apart inside of him. Alaemon: His human form is whatever he prefers, and they always wear black. His celestial form is... well, hard to tell. Everyone who sees it walks away forgetting it. Fluerity: Human form is again whatever works for the time, but usually looks like a slightly smiling drug dealer. His celestial form is a typical Habbalite, but he has needles and knives and such jutting from his skin. And he has a big bag of goodies for you... Furfur: His human form is your typical raver, angry and hardcore looking. Oddly, he doesn't wear leather, he always wears flannel, a white t-shirt, and a pair of jeans. His celestial form is the same as his human one, just with big horns and two nasty wings with razor sharp edges. Beelzebub: When he was human, he always had a rotting vessel that oozed black and yellow liquid. His celestial form was that of a huge and rotting... -thing-. He had seventeen wings, and wherever he went things died and rotted, or turned bad somehow. Gebbeleth: Shhh! It's a secret! Makatiel: His human form was always a perfectly healthy young man or woman, with the best and most healthy features. His celestial form was scary- he was perfectly normal. No scars, no piercings, no tattoo's, nothing. He could have been an Elohite for all they knew. But he did cough an awful lot, and sneeze... Genubath: In mortal form he took a vessel of a large and ugly man who would do some pretty horrible things to you. In celestial form he was simply an ever moving stream of black and yellow goop that stole whatever you happen to have when it passed. Legion: It's celestial form was so mixed up that most people cannot remember it without screaming in fear. The humans he possessed though, had blackened skin and yellow glowing eyes, and they all spoke in perfect syncrocity... Mariel: She didn't have a human form that people remember. Some people recall that her celestial form was a large cloud of boiling gay light with two gossamer wings that stretched out into infinity... it's hard to recall. Meserach: His human form was a truly fat and ugly... -thing- of a human that didn't do much to move. His celestial form was a massive and ugly purple frog with two drooping wings. Vephar: In human form, he looked like a really ugly and salty sailor. In celestial form, he was a gigantic leviathan type creature as big as a city. Lucifer: When he appears, he always appears as a tall thin man, about 6'1", with long and beautiful ebony black hair, with pale white skin and feminine features. He wears a long sleeved black silk shirt, and simple black pants with shoes. He always shines with an aura of glorious Light... _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 12:42:57 -0400 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: Re: IN> It's been a while since I've done one of these... Thanks for sharing that! I love stories with the archangels and that one was very nice, several times of an almost literal laugh at loud during my break at work as I read it and it certainly provided a welcome break of the day. My best to you! Jeff =) _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 10:36:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> It's been a while since I've done one of these... Hah! The Commander of the Host and the Most Just agreed with me on a movie review! Vindication! =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"Don't repent. Stop sinnin'." -- old cowboy saying

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 10:39:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Skill Difficulty I'll reserve judgement until I see the playtest results. 0:> =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"Don't repent. Stop sinnin'." -- old cowboy saying

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 10:56:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping - --- Christopher Anthony wrote: > Jumping (Strength) Default: -1 SD: 1/2 I'm pretty sure it's not duplicated (I have no books with me either, but it doesn't sound familiar). However... > Standing high jump: (1 ft. * CD) + Jumping levels As a former track & field star, I see this as being way off. If I read this formula correctly it would allow a Human to perform a standing vertical leap of up to 36 feet - -- that works in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon but not for a realistic campaign. Most people can't jump higher than 2-3 feet, while world-class athletes generally can't do more than about 5. This assumes that you measure between the ground and the lowest point on the body, of course. > Running high jump: Basic move (feet per second) + CD + > Jumping levels Again, the effects are rarely so impressive. High jump distances rarely go much beyond 8 feet even at the Olympics. > Standing broad jump: Agility + CD + Jumping levels Still nope. An 8-foot broad jump is better than the vast majority of people can do. Even most trained athletes can't get much past 10. With this formula, a Human with 3 Corporeal Forces, Agility/6 and Jumping/6 could broad jump 13-18 feet. > Running broad jump: (Basic move (feet per second) + > Jumping levels) * CD Technically there's no such thing as a running broad jump; it's called a long jump. 0:> For this, distances are trickier to figure. For one thing, the relationship between speed and distance isn't that clear-cut (I could outrun people who could outjump me, for example). Second, most jumping relies on a combination of strength and agility -- this is especially true for the long jump. Third, the jumper's mass figures very prominently; small wiry guys like me could achieve results at moderate speeds that heavier guys could only produce by running flat out. What you have is a good set of simplifications (because the real world math is complex enough to give me a headache) that would work just fine if the numbers were tweaked a bit. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"Don't repent. Stop sinnin'." -- old cowboy saying

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 14:58:07 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher Anthony" Subject: Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping Michael Walton said: >> Standing high jump: (1 ft. * CD) + Jumping levels > > As a former track & field star, I see this as being way > off. If I read this formula correctly it would allow a > Human to perform a standing vertical leap of up to 36 feet > -- that works in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon but not for > a realistic campaign. Most people can't jump higher than > 2-3 feet, while world-class athletes generally can't do > more than about 5. This assumes that you measure between > the ground and the lowest point on the body, of course. Like I said in what turns out to be a draft that never got sent, these are figures off the top of my head, and not guaranteed to be accurate in any sense of the word. ;) 1/2 CD, rounded up? (Average person would jump between 1 and 3 feet; someone with high Strength and high Jumping - let's say 3 Corporeal Forces, 8 ST 6 AG, and 6 ranks in Jumping - would jump 3-5. >> Running high jump: Basic move (feet per second) + CD + >> Jumping levels > > Again, the effects are rarely so impressive. High jump > distances rarely go much beyond 8 feet even at the > Olympics. Hm. 1/2 Basic move (down) + 1/2 CD (up)? Normal person gets between 3 and 5 feet, while the athlete from above gets 6-8 feet. (Basic move is 7.2 feet per second; half of that is 3.6, rounded down to 3, plus 3-5 for the modified check digit.) I want to make this 1/2 Basic move (nearest, half goes down) + 1/2 CD (up), but that's a little more math than I think people are willing to do. ;) > >> Standing broad jump: Agility + CD + Jumping levels > > Still nope. An 8-foot broad jump is better than the vast > majority of people can do. Even most trained athletes > can't get much past 10. With this formula, a Human with 3 > Corporeal Forces, Agility/6 and Jumping/6 could broad jump > 13-18 feet. You know, this *is* supposed to be a cinematic game. I'm tempted to make this the same as a running high jump, except that I don't want to involve basic move. On the other hand, I can't think of a good alternative. >> Running broad jump: (Basic move (feet per second) + >> Jumping levels) * CD > > Technically there's no such thing as a running broad > jump; it's called a long jump. 0:> Pah. Details. ;) 1/2 Basic move + Jumping + CD gives J. Random Person (no ranks in Jumping) 3-8 feet on a long jump, while the athlete gets 12-17 feet. (It's too condensed a curve for my tastes - athletes should be able to jump huge distances (20+ feet, IIRC), and I have no idea how far the average human can long-jump. Oh well. It'll have to do. > What you have is a good set of simplifications (because the > real world math is complex enough to give me a headache) > that would work just fine if the numbers were tweaked a bit. Thanks for catching my math. :) - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 16:08:06 -0400 (EDT) From: "Christopher Anthony" Subject: Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Christopher Anthony said: > (A suggested alternate, for those of you who dislike all these > two-digit CP costs, is to make each level of a skill cost its SD in > character points....) Another alternate, which makes bookkeeping simpler, is to use the (absolute value of the) skill's Default as its Skill Difficulty. A skill that defaulted to Precision -2 would therefore have an SD of 2, and would cost either twice the new level or 2 CP to go up a level, depending on which model the GM likes. - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 15:58:08 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Fwd: Re: IN>Something to chew on from Gregg Forge >From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2002 17:51:55 -0500 >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Admin request of type /\bsubscribe\b/i at line 8 > >From: "Gregg Forge" >Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on >Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2002 17:47:30 -0500 > >>For instance, a Calabite of Fire may look like the Balrog (and in fact I >>immediately thought of that when I saw the demon in the movie) while a >>Calabite of Gluttony may manifest several large mouths and sharp teeth. >> >>A Seraph of Trade may have gold plated scales and six blood-ruby eyes, >>while a Seraph of the Sword would have bladed wings. > > Ah, you subscribe to the Monster Rancher school of Celestial >Differentiation! Not that this is a bad thing; I find it tends >to help preserve the distinctive qualities that makes it so that >not ALL Seraphim are identical, etc. Then again, this may more >be an aspect of me envisioning a Tiger-Monol crossbreed as a Djinn >of the War...and a Pixie-Gali as a Mercurian of Purity, but I >digress. > >Kamika-Z ...and Jordi steps into his Zilla vessal... > [unnecessary .sig quotations trimmed --Admin] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 16:41:21 -0400 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping >This may be duplicated somewhere; I don't have books and therefore >can't check. x_x > >-EDG Well, it's covered in GURPS, so maybe we can reverse-engineer a formula from there... >Jumping (Strength) Default: -1 SD: 1/2 Though the GURPS Jumping skill is based on DX(approximately, Agility), the "Default" form of Jumping is based on ST (Strength). I'm happy with either. The mechanic in GURPS is that one may substitute Jumping skill for ST, which seems close enough to what's going on here. >This is the skill of jumping, both broad and high. In combat, a >highly-mobile character may use the higher of Jumping or Dodge to get >out of the way of attacks. (This is up to the GM's discretion.) The >distance jumped is a function of the check digit: An "Acrobatic" Dodge is covered by, not surprisingly, Acrobatics -- which is a skill in In Nomine, so hey! (Succeed on an Acrobatics roll, get +1 to Dodge for one attack that turn. It was some fancy maneuver -- fail it, and you get a -2.) Jumping, on the other hand, has a base distance at which the character automatically succeeds for high and broad jumps, modified by running starts; you can then try for more distance. >Standing high jump: (1 ft. * CD) + Jumping levels >Running high jump: Basic move (feet per second) + CD + Jumping levels GURPS rule, converted to In Nomine stats: 6 inches * (skill, or Strength by default) - 4 inches. Add 2 feet for a running start. >Standing broad jump: Agility + CD + Jumping levels >Running broad jump: (Basic move (feet per second) + Jumping levels) * CD GURPS rule, converted to In Nomine stats: (Jumping skill or Strength) * 2 feet - 1 foot. Add 1 foot for every yard of running start, up to double base distance. Need to jump higher, farther? It takes extra effort (I think in basic In Nomine this is called the risk mechanic?). Converting out, it looks like, for every 2 inches higher you want to jump, take a -1 penalty to Jumping, and roll for it. For every 8 inches broad jump (every foot, with a running start), take a -1 penalty to Jumping, and roll for it. I'm looking at Michael Walton's statistics and trying to calculate the results here, but I don't know how the skills would be calculated in basic In Nomine -- this is just a stat-to-stat conversion of the GURPS Jumping rules. William ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 15:58:16 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Fwd: Re: IN>Something to chew on from Robb Kidd >From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 17:25:40 -0500 >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Non-member submission from [Robb Kidd ] > >Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on >From: Robb Kidd >Date: 03 Sep 2002 18:19:23 -0400 > >On Tue, 2002-09-03 at 17:13, Eric Bertish wrote: >> [talk of IN:Lodoss War] >> >> So I guess that means Laurence is Parn and Khalid is Etoh, but Deedlit >> doesn't fit *any* of the female AA's... > > She's a blend of Blandine (ethereal/elfin), Gabriel (whumping on Parn) >and Novalis (er ... flowery elfin things). > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 16:54:33 -0400 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> Skill Difficulty >This has been bugging me for a while. > >Unfortunately, I haven't playtested this at all. We have. We call it GURPS. ;^) > Suggestions are >welcome; I'm aware that CP costs here are high, but it does solve the >problem of a character starting out with no combat skills at all and >becoming a Kung Fu Grandmaster after two average sessions. > >-EDG > > >Skill Difficulty >The Skill Difficulty rating of a skill is the cost, in character >points, required to buy the skill from its default level to level 1. >To improve a skill, the character must spend character points equal to >the SD of the skill multiplied by the level to which he wants to >increase it. Additionally, character points must be paid for one >level before the next can be purchased. Hmm. To buy something up to a level of 6 would thus cost 21 times the skill dificulty. A middling-tough, SD 2 skill would, at your 3pts/game calculation, take 14 games, or about 3 and a half months. Of course, this might be perfectly good in a campaign, depending on how much action were in a single game, how much time it spanned, etc. (A suggested alternate, for those of you who dislike all these >two-digit CP costs, is to make each level of a skill cost its SD in >character points. Buying to level 6 in a skill with SD 2, from the >default level, would thereby cost 12 CP. It's still a little low for >my tastes (four sessions to Kung Fu Grandmaster), though.) This is more like the GURPS version. Mind you, while GURPS does have the variable-difficulty statistic, one that might be more applicable to IN would be simpler: study time. A GM could simply say, "yes, I see you have the character points to buy this, but over the last four games we've spent four days in Tokyo. The teachers are good, but not that good. If you want to trade the points pulling favors in from your Superior's organization to spend some time studying there, I'd be happy to do that." Poof, the character gets his own personal sensei, suddenly impressed with his student's potential; three months of intensive study later, the character can kick a man in the face while spouting snappy banter and pondering the Harmony of the Way. ^_^_v William ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 21:05:05 +0000 From: "Sirea Theyal" Subject: Re: IN> Skill Difficulty Hmm... I really like this idea so far, but I dunno... I always held the idea that celestials just didn't suffer from skill diffuculty, because if their divine/infernal nature and abilities. Humans would do good with this though, and maybe Songs should have diffuculty. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 14:37:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> New Skill: Jumping - --- Christopher Anthony wrote: > 1/2 CD, rounded up? (Average person would jump between 1 > and 3 feet; > someone with high Strength and high Jumping - let's say 3 > Corporeal > Forces, 8 ST 6 AG, and 6 ranks in Jumping - would jump > 3-5. Sounds good to me. > Hm. 1/2 Basic move (down) + 1/2 CD (up)? Normal person > gets between > 3 and 5 feet, while the athlete from above gets 6-8 feet. > (Basic move > is 7.2 feet per second; half of that is 3.6, rounded down > to 3, plus 3-5 for the modified check digit.) Also good. > I want to make this 1/2 Basic move (nearest, half goes > down) + 1/2 CD > (up), but that's a little more math than I think people > are willing to do. ;) Agreed. Shoot, I did the critique and it's more math than I want to do! > You know, this *is* supposed to be a cinematic game. And by cinematic rules, a 13-foot broad jump (well into long jump range, btw) is reasonable. Of course, a long jump by those rules would be really impressive. > I'm tempted to make this the same as a running high jump, > except that > I don't want to involve basic move. On the other hand, I > can't think of a good alternative. Me neither. Math is not my forte. > 1/2 Basic move + Jumping + CD gives J. Random Person (no > ranks in > Jumping) 3-8 feet on a long jump, while the athlete gets > 12-17 feet. > (It's too condensed a curve for my tastes - athletes > should be able to > jump huge distances (20+ feet, IIRC), and I have no idea > how far the average human can long-jump. Olympians can long jump up to about 28 feet, IIRC. I'm about in the middle of above average with a personal best of 15'6". The average person is probably somewhere in the 10-12' range. > Thanks for catching my math. :) My pleasure -- it's rare that I get to talk sports on an RPG list. 8> =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"Don't repent. Stop sinnin'." -- old cowboy saying

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 14:42:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Skill Difficulty - --- Christopher Anthony wrote: > Another alternate, which makes bookkeeping simpler, is to > use the > (absolute value of the) skill's Default as its Skill > Difficulty. A > skill that defaulted to Precision -2 would therefore have > an SD of 2, > and would cost either twice the new level or 2 CP to go > up a level Ah, me likes this version better. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"Don't repent. Stop sinnin'." -- old cowboy saying

__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 18:07:49 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN> Ecumenical Attunement: Apotheosis >This is a JOKE, people. > >-EDG A joke worthy of Dark Humor. I can just see Lilim of every stripe struggling to gather enough Geases, scrambling to get all the celestials together, only to find out it doesn't work. They've been hosed. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 18:08:14 -0400 From: BC Petery Subject: IN>Kobal has Something chewing on me > David: Again, much like in Canon for his celestial form. His human form is > the same. Yeah, sans clothing... "Put some clothes on, boy! You're makin' the horses jealous!" > Janus: > His celestial form is a truly gigantic and ever > moving tornado of green and blue wind. It used to be a brown tornado, until Kobol inspired Chuck Jones. "Oh Tazzie boy!" -Bugs Bunny > Jean: Human form, male or female (hard to tell the difference) has slicked > back white hair[...] Until he runs out of hair gel. The he looks like a dandelion gone to seed. > Laurence: He's so cute! > Celestial form is the same, but his feathers look > like daggers... and in fact, are! But he's the AA of the SWORD. He would never have such a small tool. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 23:38 +0100 (BST) From: jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) Subject: Re: IN> Skill Difficulty In article <2067.162.129.50.92.1031147427.squirrel@webmail.earlham.edu>, anthoch@earlham.edu (Christopher Anthony) wrote: > Unfortunately, I haven't playtested this at all. Suggestions are > welcome; I'm aware that CP costs here are high, but it does solve the > problem of a character starting out with no combat skills at all and > becoming a Kung Fu Grandmaster after two average sessions. Well, this makes it cheaper to buy up stats than skills, which doesn't seem right. Easier ways to deal with this: * Don't give out experience every session: give it out at break points in the campaign. * Don't let them buy up their skills by more than one level at a time. - --- John Dallman jgd@cix.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 23:38:40 +0000 From: "Sirea Theyal" Subject: Re: IN>Kobal has Something chewing on me > > Laurence: He's so cute! > > > Celestial form is the same, but his feathers look > > like daggers... and in fact, are! > >But he's the AA of the SWORD. He would never have such a small tool. Just for this alone, your a cruel cruel CRUEL man >_< _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 19:56:53 -0400 From: "Josh Moger" Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on > >Laurence: He's so cute! ^_^ looks like he does in Superiors 1, with the long >hair, armor and whatnot. Celestial form is the same, but his feathers look >like daggers... and in fact, are! > Every mental image. Every story. Every writeup. Every time the Commander of the Host is mentioned- I see a blond. Don't know why. Can't explain. Doesn't make sense- But Laurence is forever blond in my mind's eye. Josh ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 20:02:05 -0400 From: "Josh Moger" Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on > >Azrael: His human form is either a tall and grim looking bald man wearing a >black robe, or a small and happy looking gothic girl. > ::blink:: Neil Gaiman groupie I assume? For some reason, I see the illustration they gave to Dominic as a good way of showing an Archangel of Death, at least in Celestial. Course, with absolutely no information about him... or her... including no choir... well, I can't get a good concrete image. Though I do like the idea that s/he could be manifesting as the good deaths (see Moe's page for the the Pratchett/Gaiman Ethereals). Would make sense if s/he's a Grigori. ::cough:: Josh ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 20:47:21 -0400 From: "Josh Moger" Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on >Fluerity: Human form is again whatever works for the time, but usually looks >like a slightly smiling drug dealer. His celestial form is a typical >Habbalite, but he has needles and knives and such jutting from his skin. And >he has a big bag of goodies for you... > You know, the Fleurity and Furfur illustrations in the books both collided head on with what I had imagined them to look like. Instead of the very suave looking Fleurity, I imagined a short fat man. Actually, start with the chinese Buddha, but make him white instead of asian. Then add long clumps of dreds. Give him a grease stained shirt and make sure that he's locked into a lotus position sitting next to a giant hooka. Add a smoky atmosphere and that's my mental image. As for Furfur... >Furfur: His human form is your typical raver, angry and hardcore looking. >Oddly, he doesn't wear leather, he always wears flannel, a white t-shirt, >and a pair of jeans. His celestial form is the same as his human one, just >with big horns and two nasty wings with razor sharp edges. > YES! This is my mental image of Furfur as well. Cut off flannel shirts, white t-shirt beneath it. Jeans with worn through holes. And for some reason, I always pictured him with really short hair. Usually blond. And very chiseled facial features- a very hard and unyielding look. I was a bit surprised by the picture in Night Music because I really did just seal him into this image. >Beelzebub: When he was human, he always had a rotting vessel that oozed >black and yellow liquid. His celestial form was that of a huge and >rotting... -thing-. He had seventeen wings, and wherever he went things died >and rotted, or turned bad somehow. I imagine a hulking man wrapped in a rotting gray cloak. Pieces of flesh keep dropping. He appears bulky and carries a mace wherever he goes. His leprous white arms have spots of decay branching through them. And that's just the corporeal image of have of this guy. >Makatiel: His human form was always a perfectly healthy young man or woman, >with the best and most healthy features. His celestial form was scary- he >was perfectly normal. No scars, no piercings, no tattoo's, nothing. He could >have been an Elohite for all they knew. But he did cough an awful lot, and >sneeze... Okay. This is good. This was very good. On the alternative- do you remember a Magic (wow, I'm a nerd) card called Plague or Pestilence? On it there was a bald child zombie with white eyes. It was wrapped in a yellowish garment and it's flesh was rotting. I could see that as Makatiel's celestial form- a child playing with things it can't comprehend. >Mariel: She didn't have a human form that people remember. Some people >recall that her celestial form was a large cloud of boiling gay light with >two gossamer wings that stretched out into infinity... it's hard to recall. > I think she would have been that other shadow in the room. The one that where there wasn't actually anything to cast a shadow. Her voice was actually an ordered negation of sound. And lets not forget the fact that everyone in a room (At least in the Corporeal) would have started manifesting clouded breath the moment she entered. In Celestial... How about invisible? Complete negation of the Symphony. Mariel can't be seen, but she can be felt and 'heard'. > >Lucifer: When he appears, he always appears as a tall thin man, about 6'1", >with long and beautiful ebony black hair, with pale white skin and feminine >features. He wears a long sleeved black silk shirt, and simple black pants >with shoes. He always shines with an aura of glorious Light... > That would actually really work. But... while I could see this as a Corporeal image and possibly a Celestial image amongst other demons, I think that Demon Princes and Archangels would probably see Lucifer in another way- The ultimate Balseraph: Coiled around his Heart, huge segments separated by ridges upon which thousands of underdeveloped and pale white eyes, blind from years of self-imposed darkness, stare out in a vain attempt to see. At the top of the enormous wyrm are three pale pink lines which come together in the middle. As Lucifer speaks blasphemies and delusions, the lines open and close to reveal row after row of force-shredding teeth. This is indeed the Conqueror Wyrm- but it is a thing which has battened onto it's own false sense of divinity and has starved for lack of Truth. Josh ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 01:30:35 +0000 From: "Sirea Theyal" Subject: Re: IN>Something to chew on >You know, the Fleurity and Furfur illustrations in the books both collided >head on with what I had imagined them to look like. Instead of the very >suave looking Fleurity, I imagined a short fat man. Actually, start with >the chinese Buddha, but make him white instead of asian. Then add long >clumps of dreds. Give him a grease stained shirt and make sure that he's >locked into a lotus position sitting next to a giant hooka. >Add a smoky atmosphere and that's my mental image. As for Furfur... Hey, that's a pretty good image for Fluerity actually. I just don't use him much, so I didn't ever really giuve him a lot of thought. > > >YES! This is my mental image of Furfur as well. Cut off flannel shirts, >white t-shirt beneath it. Jeans with worn through holes. And for some >reason, I always pictured him with really short hair. Usually blond. And >very chiseled facial features- a very hard and unyielding look. I was a bit >surprised by the picture in Night Music because I really did just seal him >into this image. I see him with slightly short auburn hair meself. And yes, the jeans are acid washed and have some holes in them. I dunno -why- but flannel just says "Hardcore" to me. > >I imagine a hulking man wrapped in a rotting gray cloak. Pieces of flesh >keep dropping. He appears bulky and carries a mace wherever he goes. His >leprous white arms have spots of decay branching through them. And that's >just the corporeal image of have of this guy. You wanna know how I really think he should look, despite being a Djinn? Ever play Castlevania, Symphony of the Night? Look at -that- Beelzebub. HUGE rotted man impaled upon a thousand hooks, Corruption seething from his battered corpse... >Okay. This is good. This was very good. >On the alternative- do you remember a Magic (wow, I'm a nerd) card called >Plague or Pestilence? On it there was a bald child zombie with white eyes. >It was wrapped in a yellowish garment and it's flesh was rotting. I could >see that as Makatiel's celestial form- a child playing with things it can't >comprehend. I do recall that card. Do you know the Terror card with the blackened guy, screaming with the huge eyes? That's sorta what my Skulkers look like. >I think she would have been that other shadow in the room. The one that >where there wasn't actually anything to cast a shadow. Her voice was >actually an ordered negation of sound. And lets not forget the fact that >everyone in a room (At least in the Corporeal) would have started >manifesting clouded breath the moment she entered. >In Celestial... >How about invisible? Complete negation of the Symphony. Mariel can't be >seen, but she can be felt and 'heard'. Hmm... personally, I for some reason associate Oblivion with Grayness, thus the Gray cloud of oblivion. What goes in does not come out... > >That would actually really work. But... while I could see this as a >Corporeal image and possibly a Celestial image amongst other demons, I >think >that Demon Princes and Archangels would probably see Lucifer in another >way- > >The ultimate Balseraph: Coiled around his Heart, huge segments separated >by >ridges upon which thousands of underdeveloped and pale white eyes, blind >from years of self-imposed darkness, stare out in a vain attempt to see. >At >the top of the enormous wyrm are three pale pink lines which come together >in the middle. As Lucifer speaks blasphemies and delusions, the lines open >and close to reveal row after row of force-shredding teeth. This is indeed >the Conqueror Wyrm- but it is a thing which has battened onto it's own >false sense of divinity and has starved for lack of Truth. No one ever sees my Lucifer in celestial form ^_^ _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2763 ********************************