in_nomine-digest Monday, November 11 2002 Volume 01 : Number 2855 In this digest: Re: IN> Questions about Kyriotates Re: IN> Questions about Kyriotates Re: IN> Superiors and AA Re: IN> Roles & Disturbance Re: IN> Superior Artifact: Beelzebub's Blade Re: IN> Questions about Kyriotates IN> A short Fic Re: IN> Superiors and AA/ Seneschals becoming Superiors Re: IN> New Songs for Saminga IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light RE: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light RE: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light RE: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light Re: IN> An interesting thought Re: IN> An interesting thought Re: IN> An interesting thought Re: IN> New Songs for Saminga Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light Re: IN> An interesting thought Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light IN> Not Really Laziness...is it?..Gabriel Request IN>Cathedral of Death Question Re: IN> Not Really Laziness...is it?..Gabriel Request IN> The Cathedral at the Gates of Heaven ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 17:44:26 -0500 From: Rolland Therrien Subject: Re: IN> Questions about Kyriotates Thank you for the responses to my questions (Would've responded nearlier myself, but I was waiting for my Digest to arrive) Thank you, William, for explaining to me how the Gurps Kyrio Resonnance was supposed to work. I missed the "Total amongst all hosts must not exceed the Angel's own Will" rule. Now the concept makes sense. Animals would have lower Will rolls then a human, and either would have a weaker roll then an Angel with IQ (and thus Will) 14. I guess Strong Will is a very useful Advantage for a Gurps Kyriotate. I'm probably going to keep the "Power Investiture Levels = Number of Manifestations" idea, though. That just works for me, logic-wise. Finally, The Fiat Justitia Logs sound interesting. Where can I find them? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 22:59:58 -0000 From: "Genevieve Cogman" Subject: Re: IN> Questions about Kyriotates - -----Original Message----- From: Rolland Therrien Finally, The Fiat Justitia Logs sound interesting. Where can I find them? http://homepages.tcp.co.uk/~maya/nomine/fiat.html , though I fear the campaign storyline was never finished. Genevieve ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 16:15:40 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Superiors and AA - --- "William J. Keith" wrote: > An Archangel of the Sun could well play an interesting > role in a campaign: That's why I suggested it. 0;> > I wonder if any other Tether could possibly support this > state change. The Ocean could easily do so -- Oannes certainly had at least one oceanic Tether. Word promotion to AA of the Deeps would be no great conceptual leap. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 16:27:09 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Roles & Disturbance - --- Christopher Anthony wrote: > Very interesting Discord, Michael, but you're more of an > X-Men fan than an Avengers fan, aren't you? But of course. > You can be a superhero plenty > well without being a mutant - just ask Daredevil, Thor, > or Captain America. Naturally -- but, with the possible exception of Thor, those examples are covered under the other two Discords in the write-up (Merciful for Cap, Nocturnal for Hornhead). > certainly most normals aren't going to know Spider-Man's > back story, > and I don't think he's ever been accused of being a > mutant.) He has, but it didn't stick. > Then again (Sirea, take note), maybe this Discord is what > happens when > you take the Superhero Role without an appropriate > Unusual Background. Heh heh... > For folks interested in this sort of thing (the > distinction between > superheroes and mutants as per the Marvel universe), I > recommend > _Marvels_, by Kurt Busiek and Alex Ross, as a quick, > full-color primer. Note that Mutant in the Discord sense covers more than mutants in the Marvel sense. The Metahumans (or "Bang Babies") of the Milestone universe also fall under this category. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 16:32:22 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Superior Artifact: Beelzebub's Blade Good grief! Superiors, Artifacts, whole universes... is there anything this girl can't do? Nice Artifact, this blade -- but I'm so glad it's a McGuffin. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 16:36:45 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Questions about Kyriotates - --- Rolland Therrien wrote: > How's this for an alternate, less confusing Kyriotate: > They can possess one > Host at a time, much like Shedim, and rather then > displace that host's mind, > they share it much like the Shedim do. But whereas the > Shedim are > Corruptors, Kyriotate are Consciences: they attempt to > make Hosts do Good > deeds, then convince them they did so themselves, so that > they learn to > become a good individual by habit. That's similar to the Choir Attunement that I wrote for Kyrios of Communication; they share consciousness with the Host and can offer suggestions. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 20:01:44 -0800 From: "Joey's mail" Subject: IN> A short Fic This is a brief fic about my character, Zendile, and Elohite of Fire. It's basically explains his outlook on his duty, and why he doesn't take pleasure in his work (as most Elohim of Fire don't). I think that Elohim of Fire, having the duty of punishing humans, would fall in great numbers if it wasn't for this restraint, since their duty is similar to that of the Haballah. In addtion, they would also tend to be more passionate than most Elohim, seeing as Gabriel's servants are known for their convictions. Anyway... The Flames Would Consume Me... "Oh God..." said the sinner. "Oh please, God, make it stop!" The sinner closed his eyes and curled into a fetal position, trying to ignore the illusionary flames encircling him. "Did your victims beg like that?" The angel said, his voice like a lake of ice. "As they scream, do you find joy as you tell them how worthless they are, as you beat them?" "Leave me alone..." the sinner cried. "Just leave me alone..." "Zendile, that's enough!" The Elohite's human companion pleaded. "He's..." "You think he's suffered enough," Zendile said, a statement, not a question. His voice was just as frigid as before. His bright green eyes didn't move from the sinner, who was now nothing more than a pathetic wretch, sobbing uncontrolably. "The ones he hurt, how much have they suffered? How much has his selfish pleasure hurt them?" The flames dissapeared, as they had never existed, and Zendile walked up to the wretch and lifted him by the collar from the ground. "Zendile!" the Soldier said. "Please..." the sinner said. "Please don't hurt me..." Zendile stared into the sinner's eyes. "Never go near any of those girls again," he said. "Or I'll come back." He threw the human to the ground, and walked away. The Soldier followed him, out the door of the man's apartment. "What a strangely cruel man," the angel said. "He needed to destroy another's psyche to feel valid." "How can you talk about that so...casually!? You practicaly tortured him!" The Soldier spat. "Remember, I am an Elohite," Zendile said. "I cannot act on my emotions." The human grabbed his arm, his face flaring with anger. "You could at least shown some remorse...some sympathy!" "Sympathy?" Zendile turned his face toward his companion. "Do you understand that the very emotions he leaks into the Symphony is part of my very being? That I punish those like him knowing this?" The angel closed his eyes, as if regret. "The only thing keeping the flames of his emotion from consuming me is knowing those he has harmed may yet heal." The Soldier lowered his head and looked at the pavement in shame. "Don't feel ashamed," Zendile said. "You have much yet to learn. Unfortunately, you will become used to these punishments. The cruel are everywhere, and it seems each one that is burned only has two more rise from their ashes. Tomorrow you should visit his victims in the hospital, then talk to that servant of Khalid's to see if that Balseraph has left behind any trace of his activities." The Soldier nodded. "Zendile, I..." "No need to feel sorry. Like I said, you have much yet to learn." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:58:57 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: Re: IN> Superiors and AA/ Seneschals becoming Superiors >>> Interesting thought: Can Seneschals who have the Tether >>> to which they >>> are attuned as a Word (i.e., the Demon of the Crowbar >>> that Kneecapped >>> Nancy Kerrigan) undergo the Superior State Change and >>> become the >>> Archangel of Tether X, Seneschal of Tether X? >> >> Probably not for minor Tethers, but truly major stuff >>might allow it. There is a canonical Tether to Divine Fire >>in the Sun -- if that Tether has a Seneschal, that angel >>could conceivably become the AA of the Sun. > > I wonder if any other Tether could possibly support this state change. The > only one that comes to mind is Io, and I can't really think of much an > Archangel of Io would do. How about the Tether at the plague pits in Hyde Park? (LCast. p125-126) If the Seneschal could arrange a new round of the Black Death, he might achieve it. Difficult in practice; at the least he'd need a new vector to spread the disease, but still make it obvious to everyone that the plague pits are the problem. On the upside, the absence of a DP of disease means there's a vacancy to fill, and the mass deaths would force mass burials of the victims, so he'd go from being Seneschal of the the Plague Pits(of Hyde park) to Demon Prince of Plague Pits(world wide). Cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:50:02 +1100 From: "james walker" Subject: Re: IN> New Songs for Saminga > - --- Rolland Therrien wrote: >> No there isn't. I have the book, and I didn't see >> anything like a Song of >> Undeath or the Undead in Canon. So I made one. > Michael Walton wrote: > Hmmm... I may have the wrong book, but there are Songs of > Undeath (the description says that some Undead wistfully > refer to them as the Songs of Life -- a reference to the > fact that at least one of them temporarily grants an Undead > the functions of the living). Maybe they're in the CPG. You're thinking of the Song of Unlife, page 91 of the CPG. It's actually a variant on the Celestial Song of Form; just one reason why the Songs of Form would be commonly known among undead. Cheers, James. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 20:05:36 -0700 From: sirea@softhome.net Subject: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light (Well, here he is, the Lightbringer himself :D Please be hard on him, he needs much refining! Thanks ^_^) Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light "The world is benighted by the Darkness of Hell. Let there be Light." Lucifer is a sad, sad being. Not so sad as to seem pathetic -- but sad enough that he looks perpetually downcast, even in his brightest of moods. Lucifer doesn't blame himself for the Fall, but he does blame himself for having let his own Light and Pride blind him so -- there is a reason why he is now called "The Most Humble". Lucifer was created when God said "Let There Be Light", and he stood along side his older brother Michael to help and witness creation, the universe, the Symphony. He watched as the dead grayness was filled with light and revived, as infinity stretched outwards as far as his six blazing eyes could see. He watched as Michael frowned the first time the word "humanity" was spoken. He watched as his brother, who he loved and respected so much, begin to grow cold and jealous. He watched as the Firstborn began to gather angels to his side, whispering of rebellion against God. Lucifer, his Pride blinding him to the Truth, joined with Michael, taking his brother's words as Truth -- maybe even above God's own. He wanted to believe Michael, not daring to believe he could be wrong. So he spoke to more angels, speaking of what Michael believed, and the Word of the Lightbringer enticed the naive angels, and drew them into Michael's ranks. But then... Lucifer began to doubt, as Michael grew more violent, acting with Hubris and wrath. The Lightbringer began to question his loyalty and love for his brother. Finally though, the time came. Michael marched up to Metatron and demanded that she bow down to him, for he saw that God was unfit to rule the Symphony. In that one moment of doubt and terror, the Lightbringer resonated himself with the full power of his Word and Seraphic being, and he saw the TRUTH. He saw what he would become, what Michael had already become, what could have been, what was, and what may be. He saw a million realities at once, a million possibilities, a million selfish Lords of Hell who had renounced God and sought destruction. So with a silent scream, Lucifer renounced his loyalty to his brother, and watched. He watched as Michael struck Metatron down, her scream echoing throughout eternity. He watched as his brother, who he loved and respected so much, led the Host to slaughter. He watched as the Firstborn was cast down into Hell with his own hands, his loyal angels following after. And Lucifer wept. He wept day and night with tears of holy luminescence, and told the remaining quarter of the Host what he had seen, what could have been, what he might have become. So the Host gathered together, and all the holy Seraphim of Heaven bent their heads low, and Lucifer threw himself before Jacobs Ladder and cried for God to have mercy on their Pride-blinded souls. And he wept, and was humble, and vowed he would save humanity from Michael's wrath, vowed he would banish the Darkness that nearly consumed all of Heaven, vowed that he would not fail God as so many other versions of him already had. Lucifer, greatest of all Seraph's, bearer of God's Holy Light, is a sad being... but there is little time for sadness, and he cannot afford to be weak. As he had been so many times before. *Dissonance* It is dissonant for a Servitor of Light to promote darkness or ignorance, be it literal or metaphorical. It is also dissonance to learn or use the Songs of Darkness or Shadows. *Choir Attunements* (Lucifites, Lightbearers, Torches, "Lightbulbs") Seraphim (Restricted): Truest of their Choir, the Most Humble of Light extend the Truth of the Symphony from themselves to everyone in their presence. Anyone speaking to the Seraph while he is in celestial form -must- tell the truth as best they know, they cannot and will not lie until the Seraph stops speaking to them, or they assume corporeal form. Cherubim (Restricted): With a successful Will roll and the cooperation of his attuned, a Cherub of Light can see through the eyes of his attuned, allowing the Cherub to observe things from the point of view of his attuned. Ofanim (Restricted): Tapping into the ultimate source of speed, Lucifer's Wheels can travel on rays of light. For 6 Essence and a successful resonance roll, the Ofanite can "catch" a ray of light and travel with it to wherever it hits a solid surface, at which point the Ofanite will reappear. At anytime on the journey, the Ofanite can drop off where he his and end the ride. Elohim: Light banishes all shadows, and allows for perfect objectivity. Elohim of Light can see perfectly in any amount of light, even total darkness, and barriers meant to obstruct sight do not affect them. Malakim (Restricted): The Virtues of Lucifer are blessed with the ability to let the Light of God that is inside of them to shine through, destroying all evil. Any demon, Soldier of Hell, undead, Infernal Saint or evil ethereal that fights the Malakite while he is in celestial form must subtract the Malakite's Celestial Forces from all rolls made while fighting, as God's Light burns away their personal symphony. Lilim: With a touch and a Perception roll, a Lilim of Light will know if their target has been blinded or has blinded themselves -- be it literal or metaphorical blindness. Kyriotates (Restricted): A Kyriotate of Light may possess sources of light, be it a torch, a lamp, fireflies, a campfire, glowing cave moss, etc. If the light is turned out or goes out naturally, the Kyriotate will be expelled in celestial form. Having the source of light malevolently is counted as the host "dying", and will incur dissonance. Mercurians (Restricted): When using their resonance, instead of gaining information on their target, a Mercurian of Light can feed the information back into the soul of his target, and if they fail a Will roll, it will open their mind up to the true infinity of the Symphony, making them realize for one bright second how deeply connected each living thing is to one another, leaving the target of the resonance humble. For the next Mercurian's Ethereal Forces in hours, the target of the resonance must roll versus their Will in order to consciously do something selfish. This attunement can be quite unnerving for demons. Grigori: Giants of Light, being creatures of perception, can use their interaction with the Word of Light to see through illusions of any kind, no visual trickery fools them. In addition, they can banish the effects of Songs meant to conceal things, with a Will roll minus the level the Song was sung at! Ethereals (Restricted): When on the corporeal plane, an ethereal who serves Lucifer may use the Corporeal and Ethereal Songs of Form for free, but only to alter their visage to look like their true ethereal icon image. *Servitor Attunements* Let There Be Light: Any Essence the angel spends on the Songs of Light is doubled in amount. And You Too Shall See: With a touch and the expendure of Essence equal to the target's Celestial Forces, the angel can grant them clear vision, removing the need for glasses, curing blindness, and removing all obstructions from their vision. Heaven Give Me Say: When speaking to someone, the angel can spend a minimum of 1 Essence to let them understand what he is talking about as he understands it, and can affect up to (Essence spent x Celestial Forces) at a time. Look Between The Shadows: For 1 Essence, the angel can flip his vision into any spectrum that exists, lasting for his Corporeal Forces in minutes. Let God Lead Me Home: If the angel can see the unobstructed sky with unaided eyes, for 1 Essence he will know his exact position on the corporeal, ethereal, or celestial plane. Suffer Not A Lie To Live: For 6 Essence, the angel can impose a painful restriction upon liars. Every time the target says something he considers a lie, he will take one Mind hit, and if he reaches zero Mind hits, he will collapse from mental exhaustion. This restriction lasts for the angel's Ethereal Forces in hours. Note that great care must be taken using this attunement, Lucifer does -not- enjoy seeing it being abused (unless the target is a Balseraph of course...) The Clouds Shall Part: For 3 Essence, the angel can renew the hopes of a number of people around him equal to his total Forces in number, inspiring them to struggle onward to their goals. *Distinctions* Vassal of Light: Their souls brimming with light, these angels add their Celestial Forces as automatic Charisma to all Roles. Friend of the Holy: For 2 Essence, a touch and a Perception roll, the angel can get a brief flash of insight into the soul of whoever he is touching, and will know that person's true nature. Note that, because of the intimacy of looking into a persons being, the target will get his own Perception roll to notice that he's been "found out"! (unaware humans will simply feel very "open" all of a sudden, and may or may not be unnerved by it) Master of Radiance: Lucifer's Masters, when in celestial form, shine with the Light of Heaven! This has the same effect on demons as if they were in Heaven, and any non-demonic being that is affiliated with Hell must roll their Will minus the angel's Celestial Forces, or flee the area. *Relations* Allied: Yves, Kobal, Lilith, Beelzebub Associated: Baal, Asmodeus, Saminga *Basic Rites* -All Servitors of Light gain 2 Essence at dawn instead of one -Burn 100 candles -Enlighten someone on a subject on which they were ignorant -Spend 2 hours praying to God and mankind -Watch the Aurora Aborealis for 2 hours (+2 Essence) -Help a demon to Redemption (+3 Essence) Chance of Invocation: 0 As leader of the House of Balance, Archnemesis to Michael, and Archangel of Light, Lucifer isn't often available to his Servitors. But he makes a hard effort to keep an open ear for his angels, and he knows that they would never abuse his power and position. Invocation Modifiers (+1 if at anytime after dawn, -1 if at anytime after dusk, +2 at noon, -2 at midnight) +1 A source of light +2 A book written to reveal a Truth +3 Someone renouncing their views of ignorance to accept the truth +4 The blood of someone who died fighting darkness +5 A demon who wishes to Redeem +6 A million points of light ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 19:30:36 -0800 From: Kish Subject: Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light sirea@softhome.net wrote: > Suffer Not A Lie To Live: For 6 Essence, the angel can impose a painful > restriction upon liars. Every time the target says something he considers a > lie, he will take one Mind hit, and if he reaches zero Mind hits, he will > collapse from mental exhaustion. This restriction lasts for the angel's > Ethereal Forces in hours. Note that great care must be taken using this > attunement, Lucifer does -not- enjoy seeing it being abused (unless the > target is a Balseraph of course...) Wouldn't this do absolutely nothing to Balseraphs? They never knowingly lie. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 23:10:18 -0500 From: "Josh Moger" Subject: Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light > >Grigori: Giants of Light, being creatures of perception, can use their >interaction with the Word of Light to see through illusions of any kind, no >visual trickery fools them. In addition, they can banish the effects of >Songs meant to conceal things, with a Will roll minus the level the Song was >sung at! I don't know why this didn't occur to me until this post, but if you've already got Malakim Falling and Lilim being native to Heaven- why not continue the switch? Skulkers- created by Hell after they were freed in order to quiet their disturbance on Earth and quickly infiltrate humanity's works? Course, after they were cast out of Hell because of their interbreeding with the lowly humans, some began to see the selfishness of their existence and then realized that they could serve a new cause in service to Heaven by locating the activities of their former masters in Hell. Eh? Josh "My God... it's full of... otaku." O.O ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 23:37:14 -0700 From: Julian Mensch Subject: RE: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light Interesting. Perhaps not exactly how I would have done him -- I love the idea of Pride as a virtue, and I've always seen Lucy as being cunning and guileful whether good or evil -- but it does have a very nice philosophical quality to it. The elemental metaphor of Light is very much up front, and it is one of the better handlings of an elemental Word that I've seen -- the attunements all seen to flow very natur- ally from the Word. Nice work, Sirea. - -- Julian Mensch ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 23:40:16 -0700 From: Julian Mensch Subject: RE: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light > > Suffer Not A Lie To Live: For 6 Essence, the angel can impose a painful > > restriction upon liars. Every time the target says something he considers a > > lie, he will take one Mind hit, and if he reaches zero Mind hits, he will > > collapse from mental exhaustion. This restriction lasts for the angel's > > Ethereal Forces in hours. Note that great care must be taken using this > > attunement, Lucifer does -not- enjoy seeing it being abused (unless the > > target is a Balseraph of course...) > > Wouldn't this do absolutely nothing to Balseraphs? They never knowingly > lie. They would take a Mind Hit along with a point of dissonance for lying -- which, like Seraphim, they can do in times of need IIRC. Granted, it's not a huge loss, but still... - -- Julian Mensch ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:25:43 +0100 (CET) From: Unni Solaas Subject: RE: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light On Sun, 10 Nov 2002, Julian Mensch wrote: > > > Suffer Not A Lie To Live: For 6 Essence, the angel can impose a painful > > > restriction upon liars. Every time the target says something he considers a > > > lie, he will take one Mind hit, and if he reaches zero Mind hits, he will > > Wouldn't this do absolutely nothing to Balseraphs? They never knowingly > > lie. > > They would take a Mind Hit along with a point of > dissonance for lying -- which, like Seraphim, they > can do in times of need IIRC. Granted, it's not a > huge loss, but still... What about changing "something he considers a lie,..." into "something that is a lie in the Symphony,..."? (Preferably written in a better sentence.) Yes I know, A GM's nightmare. :) But for 6 Essences? It shouldn't get used very often. One hopes. :P - -- language, n; an intangible artificial construct for obscuring one's meanings and intentions to others. -ppint. Unni Solaas ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 07:01:19 -0500 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> An interesting thought At 09:32 PM 11/9/2002 -0800, Kish wrote: >Since he arrived in Heaven, he must have acheieved his destiny. For >that to have happened, he must have been the best he was capable >of...right? There are several possible responses here. 1) Please note that I did not specify "how much better he could have been". (Consider a dark Tesla, designing weapons for Germany and Austria instead of power supplies for Westinghouse.) 2) If this is not canon, then I have seen it bandied about as such: Sufficient celestial interference, especially at formative stages, can alter a human's destiny and/or fate. If this is the case, then I personally would call an Archangel generating a situation of forcus interruptus by inserting a personal Force in the place of a human's putative natural fifth Force "sufficient celestial interference". 3) This is Destiny, whose halls are - at least in my mind - filled with angels who look at the best and brightest that humanity has to offer and say, "Well, what if he could have been better?". - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 05:37:47 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> An interesting thought While I like this version of Tesla, I prefer to leave him as a purely human phenomenon. Even Celestials should have to wonder sometimes. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 05:40:08 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> An interesting thought - --- Kish wrote: > Since he arrived in Heaven, he must have acheieved his > destiny. For > that to have happened, he must have been the best he was > capable of...right? Not necessarily. Achieving only means that he accomplished what he was Destined to accomplish. Had he been the best that he could be, he might have accomplished even more. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 05:43:14 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> New Songs for Saminga - --- james walker wrote: > You're thinking of the Song of Unlife, page 91 of the > CPG. Ah! Domo arigato. =====

Michael Walton, #US2002023848

"There are two kinds of selfishness: the kind that says, 'I must do what will make me happy,' and the kind that says, 'You must do what will make me happy.' The first is good, the second is bad." - -- Kenton E. Sinner

__________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 06:13:15 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light - --- sirea@softhome.net wrote: > (Well, here he is, the Lightbringer himself :D > Please be hard on him, he > needs much refining! Thanks ^_^) One general comment: I noticed that most of Lucifer's Servitor Attunements cost Essence to use. Given his need to keep the Symphony clean, maybe there should be an Attunement that'll reduce disturbance (or just cut the Essence costs for some)? Other than that, it looks pretty good. Got a website yet? Moe ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 09/18/02 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 06:29:17 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> An interesting thought > Nikola Tesla One quibble: for at least game purposes Tesla should have the equivalent of the GURPS Science! skill. Lord knows that the average party of PCs will greet his appearance with eyes shining with technogreed... :) Otherwise, pretty neat. Moe ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 09/18/02 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:32:31 +0100 (CET) From: Unni Solaas Subject: Re: IN> INverse Superior, The Big One -- Lucifer, Seraph Archangel of Light On Mon, 11 Nov 2002, Maurice Lane wrote: > Other than that, it looks pretty good. Got a website > yet? > Yes and no. There is a website in the making but it's not /quite/ unleashable yet. Sirea muttered something about within a couple of weeks.. :) As webmom for the INverse site I can also tell you that until I get the introduction/background thingie that the Brain-in-Chief (Sirea) has promised me for weeks now, there will be no unleashing even after the said two weeks! >:) The correct answer now, Sirea is: "Yes webmom! Here you are webmom!" Punctuated with a handing over of said document per email... ;P - -- language, n; an intangible artificial construct for obscuring one's meanings and intentions to others. -ppint. Unni Solaas ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 22:37:24 +0800 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: IN> Not Really Laziness...is it?..Gabriel Request Hi all, This is a request if any is feeling in the creative mood, to do a write up for Gabriel as the messenger AA instead of punish the cruel. The basic concept is the following: She is the Archangel of prophecy, and of the purifying fire. Considered THE avenging angel and the one likely to be the archangel of destruction. Her servitors have the less spectacular mission of being messengers for Heaven. Just thought if anyone has any inspiration, right now, I can't think of anything except how I want her in the campaign. Thanks in advance, or just for reading this. Jeff =) Part of my insanity manifest at JCT, where In Nomine meets science fiction in the far future http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jctrinityRPG - -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://mymail.operamail.com Powered by Outblaze ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 23:20:37 +0800 From: "Jeffery Watkins" Subject: IN>Cathedral of Death Question Hi, Just full of questions today. I was thinking about cathedrals and Death's. Could the gates of Heaven, where the souls end up be a cathedral for Death? Thanks in advance. Jeff =) Part of my insanity manifest at JCT, where In Nomine meets science fiction in the far future http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jctrinityRPG - -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://mymail.operamail.com Powered by Outblaze ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 16:22:19 +0100 From: shadur@systemec.nl (Rens Houben) Subject: Re: IN> Not Really Laziness...is it?..Gabriel Request In other news for Mon, Nov 11, 2002 at 10:37:24PM +0800, Jeffery Watkins has been seen typing: > Hi all, > This is a request if any is feeling in the creative mood, to do a writeup > for Gabriel as the messenger AA instead of punish the cruel. The basic > concept is the following: She is the Archangel of prophecy, and of the > purifying fire. Considered THE avenging angel and the one likely to be > the archangel of destruction. Her servitors have the less > spectacular mission of being messengers for Heaven. Actually, that raises another point.. She still *is* the Divine Prophet and bringer of Inspiration. Her extended writeup makes that fairly clear... But none of her Choir Attunements reflect upon that at all. Hmm, there's a thought: a second set of Attunements specifically for those of her Servitors who are tasked with bringing inspiration to the world rather than burning out the cruel (not that they're not expected to moonlight as the latter should the opportunity arise...) Now, as my GM is also reading this list and *is* aware of a few things I'm pondering, he'll probably suggest I have multiple agendae here... And he would be half-right, although it'd make sense on a level. ... lessee, Essence, got a copy of the Fermat Theorem proof here... okay, here goes. *invoke invoke invoke* Shadur, Cherub of Lightning IST Orc Angel of Underpaid Sysadmins With Too Much Time On Their Hands. - -- Rens Houben | opinions are mine Resident linux guru and sysadmin | if my employers have one Systemec Internet Services. |they'll tell you themselves PGP public key at http://suzaku.systemec.nl/shadur.key.asc ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 10:57:03 -0500 From: EDG Subject: IN> The Cathedral at the Gates of Heaven Inspired by Jeffrey. - -EDG She walked in silence, not only her own but of others around her. Her name was Harriet Margaret Epherst, and she could remember now that she went by "Peg", although for a frightening few seconds before she had passed through that great, shining, dark gate, she had not remembered anything at all. She remembered being told that there would be a light. There was no light: only dark, illuminated at regular intervals by torches set into impossibly distant walls. The ceiling was so far above her head as to be invisible, although she could see hundreds of thousands of torches blazing above her as well: they were so many, so incomprehensibly patterned, and so far from her that they appeared as stars, although she knew that they were not. Around her walked countless others, all silent, all contemplative. Some gazed up as she had; some gazed down at their feet; some gazed straight ahead or looked about as she was doing but still said nothing. She was not terrified, somehow. Despite the many thousands of people walking with her there was no sense of crowding; despite the improbable vastness of the room there was no sense of being alone. And then she was not alone, as a voice spoke to her: "Where is this?" she asked, and suddenly realized that she *could* see other people talking; they had been turned away before, or at just the wrong angle. said the voice, and she understood that "home" meant a thousand different things of which "the place you live" is only one meaning. "Why am I here?" she asked. said the voice. She looked down at herself and saw a girl in her late teens, in a sundress and sandals. The arthritis, osteoporosis, warts and liver spots and shaking hands and feeble, dry skin: all were gone in place of a body that seemed made of youthful exuberance. "What happened?" she asked quietly. The voice did not need to respond: her last memory flashed to her suddenly and without warning, a pair of brilliant lights blinked into existence to her side and before she could even react there was PAIN and then nothing. And she was standing in the unthinkably large hall, still walking. The voice sounded sad. it remarked. "Why is home so dismal?" she asked. The voice paused. It paused again. "But who?" she asked. "Who was the caretaker?" said the voice. She did. Above her still shone the ceiling, so far above as to look like the sky. The torches still burned, their light flickering across boundless distances to meet her eyes. Then, as though someone had placed glasses over her eyes, the torches came into focus: A Z R A E L was written across the sky in blazing letters a thousand feet tall. And she understood. "What," she asked, having wanted to since she first passed through the gate of dark marble and black pearl, "is the point of Heaven if it is so dismal a place?" said the voice, She looked forward, past the arch that she could now see at the far end of the hall, and realized that the hall itself was nothing more than the gate she had passed through, forged of dark marble and black pearl: a crossing between midnight on a country road and eternity in paradise. She looked forward, and there was light. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2855 ********************************