in_nomine-digest Tuesday, February 25 2003 Volume 01 : Number 2974 In this digest: Re: IN> Gabrael, Insane Re: IN> Gabrael, Insane IN> [ADMIN] List moving? Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... Re: IN> Celeste Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... Re: IN> [! Series] Lights of Heaven Re: IN> [! Series] Lights of Heaven RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubim... Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... Re:Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... IN> Foxfire ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 13:19:13 -0500 From: Michael Nutt Subject: Re: IN> Gabrael, Insane > Was it the combination of word-friction from > Belial and the charges pressed on her from > Dominic that made her go nuts? >From Superiors 3, "An Analysis of Gabriel's Psychosis" sidebar, p. 45: "What she suffers from most is a lack of true identity, and the Discordant harboring of centuries of anger, rage, and barely withheld destruction. In the midst of her madness, she is also affected by the transcendent Divine perspective, frequently receiving inspiration directly from the Godhead." > If Dominic never brought her to trial would the word > friction alone have made you loose it? I think, based on the description in Superiors 3, that the trial was a precipitating event, but that Gabriel was deeply troubled long before. There's a combination of Word-friction with fits of Divine inspiration that makes Gabriel one of the most heavily-stressed beings in all Creation. Not only does Fire shine brightly from Gabriel, providing light and guidance, but it also consumes her with its intensity. - -- Michael ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 15:27:14 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Gabrael, Insane At 9:56 AM -0800 2/24/03, rob scwalen wrote: >Was it the combination of word-friction from Belial >and the charges pressed on her from Dominic that made >her go nuts? > If Dominic never brought her to trial would the word >friction alone have made you loose it? Much as I hate to be laconic about it... Try picking up Superiors 3, which has the expanded writeup on Gabriel. (Or _The Marches_, which has the initial 10-page expansion.) Those have paragraphs on Gabriel's instabilities, which might help you a lot. - -- - --Beth, arcangel@io.com / archangel@sjgames.com In Nomine Line Editor http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 15:29:08 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> [ADMIN] List moving? If something really wonky happens with the list, um, it's not my fault and I'll get things restored as soon as possible. (IO.com is moving some stuff around, and we may have to change email commands. Or not. It's a little up in the air to me right now. O:/ ) - -- - --Beth, List Admin http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/listrules.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 15:47:44 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... At 7:39 PM -0800 2/20/03, Kim Kondratieff wrote: [...] >I had a sudden thought, based on the _His Dark Materials_ series by Philip >Pullman--like daemons, who 'settle' into a form that reflects their humans' >personalities, would Cherubim fledge into celforms reflective of theirs? I would think so... You're probably going to find the less-predatory Cherubim in service to Flowers and Creation, say, while most of Jordi's will be Cherub Cats... >[...] the really, really imaginative Cherubim end up as representatives >of species that haven't yet evolved? :D Possible! Or Fire-Cherubim -- prophecy, dontcha know... - -- - --Beth, arcangel@io.com / archangel@sjgames.com In Nomine Line Editor http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:02:19 -0500 From: "Finder, Randolph J Mr NGB-ARNG" Subject: RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... > >[...] the really, really imaginative Cherubim end up as > representatives > >of species that haven't yet evolved? :D > > Possible! Or Fire-Cherubim -- prophecy, dontcha know... How about the following... Eli's cherubim (and no one else's) can be representatives of species (or sub-species/breeds) that only exist *because* of the actions of human beings. So any cherub which has the shape of a doberman, a miniature poodle, a persian cat or a Clydesdale must be Eli's. The concern has been with the "mules". While the Mule and Hinny Cherubs were rare in heaven, the fact is that the most recent of eli's cherubim have shown up with (among others) "Liger", "Tion" and "Beefalo" crosses for their celestial forms. There has been great concern that these cherubim are more likely to become Djinn because they have the same sort of "monster" celestial form. Jordi and his angels flatly refuse to work with these Cherubs at all, Jean hasn't made up his mind and both Vapula and Asmodeus are very interested... Randy Finder ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:15:44 -0500 (EST) From: Ryan M Roth Subject: Re: IN> Celeste Great stuff -- very much like healtly, invigorating food for the thought/creative processes. Liked the superior opinions a lot too. Ryan R. On Sat, 22 Feb 2003, Eric Bertish wrote: > Okay, I have the relations and superior opinions finished. My pal EDG has > archived the entirety of it at > http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/new/Gallery/Archangels/celeste.aet > her.html . As soon as I finish the history/personality/organization sections > I will either post directly to the list, or post a link, as size dictates. > > Enjoy! > > -- Casca > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 16:31:45 -0600 From: Asher Densmore-Lynn Subject: Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... Finder, Randolph J Mr NGB-ARNG wrote: > While the Mule and Hinny Cherubs were rare in heaven, the fact is that the > most recent of eli's cherubim have > shown up with (among others) "Liger", "Tion" and "Beefalo" crosses for their > celestial forms. There has been > great concern that these cherubim are more likely to become Djinn because > they have the same sort of "monster" > celestial form. Jordi and his angels flatly refuse to work with these > Cherubs at all, Jean hasn't made up his mind > and both Vapula and Asmodeus are very interested... And just to push the Transhuman Space edge, are dolphins gonna be legal Cherub forms if and when they finally go sentient? If someone creates humans with an IQ of roughly 15 (real, not GURPS) for organ harvesting purposes -- or worse -- are THEY gonna be legal Cherub forms? ... for THAT matter. What did Cherubs manifest as before there were animals? Stone was a Cherub, right? I'm mostly positive *he* would have to predate animals. It'd be -tempting- to say that the only legal Cherub forms come from the animals saved on the Ark. Certainly save a lot of arguments at the table. "See! See! It's right here!" "There weren't cameras in Noah's time, and even if there were that's just an inkblot. You can't be a Vermicious Knid." "Aww..." - -- Asher Densmore-Lynn ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:39:24 -0500 From: "Joey's mail" Subject: Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... > > ... for THAT matter. What did Cherubs manifest as before there were > animals? Stone was a Cherub, right? I'm mostly positive *he* would have > to predate animals. > Heaven is a realm of concept; the only reason Angels see it in the terms they do is because of their more "earthly" nature. The Angels who never leave heaven and were never meant to leave heaven (which the PCs are not, I would assume) probably see heaven quite differently. Seeing as Heaven is a realm of concept, I'm pretty sure there were gradual changes made to Cherubim Celestial forms, so no one really noticed--they just happened to soon appear in more earthly forms that resonated with their natures. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 00:26:46 -0500 From: "Eric Bertish" Subject: Re: IN> [! Series] Lights of Heaven I like your characterization of David. What's not clear is why he's in Gabriel's tether. I assume this is some kind of penance being performed for his Destruction of California during your "?" cycle. What I'm not sold on is your Kronos. I can't see why one of the bitterest beings in creation would find reason to redeem. I think I would be more willing to believe it if there were more backstory, or greater extenuating circumstances. - -- Casca As a point of amusment, when I read "?" it makes the Tim Allen "aroo?" sound. "!", on the other hand, gets a sentai karate-chop "whoosh!". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 06:32:40 -0500 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> [! Series] Lights of Heaven At 12:26 AM 2/25/2003 -0500, Eric Bertish wrote: >I like your characterization of David. What's not clear is why he's in >Gabriel's tether. I assume this is some kind of penance being performed for >his Destruction of California during your "?" cycle. Yes. (I couldn't remember, and didn't have the book on hand to check, whether the entire volcano is a Tether to Gabriel, or whether it's just the caldera and magma chutes.) >What I'm not sold on is your Kronos. I can't see why one of the bitterest >beings in creation would find reason to redeem. I think I would be more >willing to believe it if there were more backstory, or greater extenuating >circumstances. This is a result of my including him as a throw-away in the ending sequence and then having to figure out how to retro-fit him. ;) I'll probably turn out another ! story just to figure that out myself. >As a point of amusment, when I read "?" it makes the Tim Allen "aroo?" >sound. "!", on the other hand, gets a sentai karate-chop "whoosh!". Hee. :) I tend to read them as "What?" and "Huh.". - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:42:16 -0500 From: "Finder, Randolph J Mr NGB-ARNG" Subject: RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... > And just to push the Transhuman Space edge, are dolphins > gonna be legal > Cherub forms if and when they finally go sentient? If someone creates > humans with an IQ of roughly 15 (real, not GURPS) for organ > harvesting > purposes -- or worse -- are THEY gonna be legal Cherub forms? I presume it says somewhere that human beings of all of the animals aren't legal Cherub forms? There is an adventure seed http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/seeds/jordi_big_move.html with the idea of Jordi trying to get Chimps and Dolphins being declared equal to human beings... Randy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:55:27 -0500 (EST) From: Stephen Dunscombe Subject: RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... > There is an adventure seed > http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/seeds/jordi_big_move.html > with the idea of Jordi trying to get Chimps and > Dolphins being declared > equal to human beings... > > Randy Would he WANT them declared equal to human beings? Jordi doesn't LIKE humans.... ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 09:06:40 -0500 From: "Josh Moger" Subject: Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... > >Would he WANT them declared equal to human beings? >Jordi doesn't LIKE humans.... > There's a distinction between being declared equal to a human and as a human. Besides, being equal to humans means that they are 'people' and thus have rights. And Jordi's a Kyriotate- he's all for interspecies communication. Heck, usually he personifies interspecies communication. Except those darn dolphins won't speak anything other than Spanish. Oh, c'mon. I'm not the only one that saw that "Farside." Josh ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 09:08:41 -0500 From: EDG Subject: RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubim... At 08:55 AM 2/25/2003 -0500, Stephen Dunscombe wrote: >Would he WANT them declared equal to human beings? >Jordi doesn't LIKE humans.... (Topic changed because it was starting to grate.) Jordi doesn't dislike humans in particular; what he dislikes are a) humans being elevated above the rest of the animals, and b) human civilization displacing the rest of the animals. Now, over the last twenty thousand years (give or take a few), that may have ellided into "dislike of humans", but resolving those two issues would go a *long* way toward reconciling Jordi with the rest of Heaven. It is to be noted in the context of the adventure seed previously linked, by the way, that *all* animals go to Heaven when they die (and it is the GM's choice here whether to make this a riff on a Don Bluth film). - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 09:13:34 -0500 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... At 09:06 AM 2/25/2003 -0500, Josh Moger wrote: >Except those darn dolphins won't speak anything other than Spanish. At least they've gotten "Louie, Louie" unstuck from their collective head. On the other hand, it seems to have been replaced by Michael Jackson's "Thriller". Whether or not this is a good thing is up to the GM. - -EDG Yes, this is probably only funny to me. No, there's not a reference here. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 09:17:15 -0500 From: "Finder, Randolph J Mr NGB-ARNG" Subject: RE: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... > On the other hand, it seems to have been replaced by Michael > Jackson's > "Thriller". Whether or not this is a good thing is up to the GM. Mostly becuase Michael got the idea for Moonwalking from watching them at Seaworld. :) Fill in your own joke about the boys who went to Seaworld with him. :) Randy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 14:19:50 GMT From: Christopher Pipinou Subject: Re:Re: IN> Forms of *OLD* cherubs... EDG writes: >On the other hand, it seems to have been replaced by Michael > Jackson's "Thriller". Whether or not this is a good thing is up to > the GM. I have bizarre visions of a pod of dolphins trying (as well as one can with fins and a tail as opposed to arms and legs) to replicate the group-dance scene from Thriller, while a particularily deep voiced dolphin squawks out Vincent Price's part... You fiend. I'll be shuddering and giggling all day. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:52:51 -0500 From: EDG Subject: IN> Foxfire This was inspired, however offhandedly, by Chandra, whom all but one of you will likely not know. http://www.livejournal.com/talkread.bml?journal=etherjammer&itemid=6798 - -EDG ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2974 ********************************