From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sat Oct 11 10:37:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA11467 for ; Sat, 11 Oct 1997 10:37:03 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA31739 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sat, 11 Oct 1997 10:22:07 -0500 Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 10:22:07 -0500 Message-Id: <199710111522.KAA31739@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #401 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Saturday, October 11 1997 Volume 01 : Number 401 In this digest: Re: IN> backwards IN> Remove IN> Remove Re: IN> [FICTION] Chess Game Re: IN> [FICTION] Chess Game Re: IN> [FLUFF] Superiors at the Movies Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Re: IN> [FLUFF] Superiors at the Movies IN> Hellhounds IN> Tethers of Janus and Valefor IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Re: IN> Hellhounds Re: IN> backwards Re: IN> backwards Re: IN> [FICTION] Chess Game Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Re: IN> Hellhounds Re: IN> On playing demons Re: IN> Janus, Valefor, and the Rest Re: IN> IN: THE MOTION PICTURE IN> Sacraments I Re: IN> Janus, Valefor, and the Rest Faerie Gods (ArchBeth, please read; was: Re: IN> Janus, Valefor, and) IN> Re: IN- Sacraments I Re: IN> Bast Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 18:52:15 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> backwards At 11:04 AM -0500 10/10/97, Dorothy Bixler wrote: >On Fri, 10 Oct 1997, Andre Ribeiro wrote: >> Hmmm... You know too much. Would you mind discussing it further in a >> *hot* mud bath? ):-) >> >> Andre, D.P. >> >Ahem. There will be no suduction of my attun...er..spouse without my >involvement. > >Or in the language of the Djinn : MINE!!!! Getting a little dissonant about him, are we? [ Sorry, sorry, been depriving her of her fictional existance... Getting uppity.] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 16:27:42 -0700 From: Pam Jackson Subject: IN> Remove Please remove the following from your mailing list: Mdaisey@americanredball.com Pamela Jackson American Red Ball International Moving families safely worldwide pjackson@americanredball.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 16:26:08 -0700 From: Pam Jackson Subject: IN> Remove Please remove the following from your mailing list: Mdaisey@americanredbal.com Thank you. Pamela Jackson American Red Ball International Moving families safely worldwide pjackson@americanredball.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 14:48:35 From: Jeff Miller Subject: Re: IN> [FICTION] Chess Game At 08:39 PM 10/8/97 +0000, you wrote: >> > >Me, my personal fantasy would be meeting Eli in a female >> > >vessel... :9 >> > >> > Oooooo..... >> >> Oh. Oh my. My my my my my. Hmmmmmmm. Yum. (Although Gabriel >> and a bit of fireproofing is high on the list!) > "Come on Baby, light my fire...." The date of choice for all us pyros! Jeff Miller Program Director/Webmaster for Agamemcon II Burbank Airport Hilton -- May 22-24, 1998 Contact Info: 24161-H Hollyoak (714)643-8352 Laguna Hills, CA 92656 www.primenet.com/~shadocat/agamemcon.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 14:12:30 From: Jeff Miller Subject: Re: IN> [FICTION] Chess Game Great piece. I just got around to reading it. >>Unfortunately, you used Eli. Eli <---> Andrealphus seems natural, and Eli >>is a little skimpy on his inhibitions as well. A little strip poker, >>maybe. > >Well, two problems here. > >First, I'd already had the Eli-Nybbas inspiration. > I really liked that one. Eli, playing his own game with his own rules. That's just the kind of thing I like to emphasize with Eli. I'm a bit suprised that Nybbas got it but, I guess, he's not a complete fool. BTW, I don't see Laurance letting himself get talked into that (or Malphas, for that matter). Jeff Miller Program Director/Webmaster for Agamemcon II Burbank Airport Hilton -- May 22-24, 1998 Contact Info: 24161-H Hollyoak (714)643-8352 Laguna Hills, CA 92656 www.primenet.com/~shadocat/agamemcon.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 15:20:37 From: Jeff Miller Subject: Re: IN> [FLUFF] Superiors at the Movies At 09:52 AM 10/9/97 -0400, you wrote: >On Oct 9, 3:11am, Thomas Davidson wrote: >> Subject: Re: IN> [FLUFF] Superiors at the Movies >> On Thu, 9 Oct 1997, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >> >> > What movie would any given Superior go to watch? >> > >> >[sniperooni!] >> > SAMINGA - Doesn't go. Doesn't care. Until they do a documentary about every >> > possible way to kill a man, he could care less about how the movies show >> > them- ugh!- living. >> > >> >> How about "Faces of Death" (or something like that--it could be "Masks of >> Death") which shows supposedly live footage of people getting killed? >> (Saminga: It's a comedy, isn't it?) > > Also the possibly-non-existant snuff films that you always >hear about. Numerous zombie movies also spring to mind. Nearly >any movie where everyone dies in the end would be right up his >alley. > It would be a whole different take on the suspense scenes. Jeff Miller Program Director/Webmaster for Agamemcon II Burbank Airport Hilton -- May 22-24, 1998 Contact Info: 24161-H Hollyoak (714)643-8352 Laguna Hills, CA 92656 www.primenet.com/~shadocat/agamemcon.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 97 17:04:51 PDT From: "Chris Jackson" Subject: Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] snip a whole lot here - These two are the two Superiors I've seen on the list who I'd most like to see added to canon. I've already added them to my campaign. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 21:10:17 -0400 From: John Dye Subject: Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Emily Dresner wrote: > I am officially working off a Geas to ArchAngel Beth. I promised this > stuff about a week ago, and because I was too burned out to program > anymore, I thought I would write instead. I KNEW she was a Lilim in disguise. The Malakim will be told! > Some of this is very buggy, some is outright wrong. I really encourange > comments. Thanks. > Introduction > > I bought the Marches sourcebook, and was both pleased and disappointed > with some of the findings. Pleased, because now there are rules for > sorcery, and I can incorporate them into my game. Displeased, because, > well, because all arcane knowledge and practices of the world was > relegated to the works of one servant of Kronos, and considering some of > the religions and beliefs around the world, that seemed more then a > little unfair. I tend to disagree with that. You look at most of the religions of the world as "magic", which it is not. Instead, it is man trying to influence Heaven. Even that theocentrist Laurence has room for those saffron robed monk/souls in his Halls of Worship, the various idols (though to be sure, the demonically inspired ones are missing) of the Hindus, et al. There is room for EVERYONE in Heaven...if you meet the standards. No, I don't know them either. > So I split sorcery into two categories: > > 1. The learning and meditation of arcane knowledge to better > understand the human condition and it's relation to God. This is called religion. The Kabbalists were trying to take a short cut. > 2. The learning of arcane knowledge to manipulate Creation and > to better further the private purposes of Man. I think you missed the picture here. The initial humans created the spirits of the Marches from their hopes and fears. Being products of Man, these spirits were reasonably easily influenced by man when the proper spiritual levers were used. With Revelations about the nature of God and Lucifer were spread, these same levers were attempted against Celestials. Because of their fractured nature, they worked against demons. Unfortunately, most spells worked like this 1) Summon demon 2) Demon posseses caster 2a) Demon eats caster, the end 3) Caster does a lot of unpopular stuff, like ratting to the tax man, or playing polka music 4) Community burns caster, his/her books, and any other unpopular people in the area just to make sure. They party, The End Kronos felt that more could be done if step 2 were changed into some deal making which really paid out in the long term. > I have a real hard time believing that the Lotus Sutra, > certainly a "magical" work, is from Hell and does any more then put > students to sleep while reading it. I guess I got off subject. "Mystical" works of a neutral nature exist; its just very often used by demons as a gateway here and now. The sorcerer is looking for power, and demons are powerful. And I'm pretty sure that the Buddha > wasn't a sociopath, although I could be wrong. No, according to the IN universe, he could be a saint, or avatar of God, or an angel, or whatever floats your boat. He doesn't have to be magical at all. I cut some interesting stuff, which I'll keep. I just have a different perspective. Besides, I've met the Archangel of secrets, and she wears a white leather miniskirt and runs a University. :> > > "What does it matter? It's all a bunch of tree hugging hippy crap." > Good quote ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 22:07:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Highway Star Subject: Re: IN> [FLUFF] Superiors at the Movies According to Donald G Bixler: > > Just where is Dragon*Con? (Virginia?) I've heard good things about it... Hotlanta, Georgia. I had a grand ole time there; it also tends to be VERY cool, and very well attended, it seems. It's also how I got into Heavy Gear; DP9 and Activision had a life size Heavy Gear there. > Oops da Ogre, lucky @&*%$(!... It was all by accident, believe me...:) SeanMike - -- The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots. - Thomas Jefferson, 1787 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 22:27:45 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Hellhounds >>>Here's the kicker: Have the Familiar get Discord: Bound/6. This gives the Familiar another 18 (!) points to spend on things like<<< >>>Okay, that's my thoughts... knock holes in it, so I don't run amok...<<< Cute, but if any player tried to pull this on me, I'd feed his CHARACTER to a pack of Hellhounds.... - -David ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 22:27:49 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Tethers of Janus and Valefor >>>From a conversation at an earlier date, it was suggested that Janus and Valefor might have moving Tethers. Likes a very special min-van, train or bus. This would allow the Tether to have Seneschals that aren't soggies or sohos. Soho? Soldiers of Hell? Did I just make that up? Anyway, yeah. Moving Tethers. I'd bet the Tether of the Wind (sounds ironic) would create quite a stir as it came into town. :)<<< In my In Nomine New York game, the Cyclone roller coaster at Coney Island is a Tether of the Wind. But I admit, it's just a background detail that hasn't become relevant in the game yet, so I haven't really given any thought to how the Seneschal avoids dissonance....but I'm inclined to say that being Word-bound to a roller coaster, riding it constantly is "movement" enough for him. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 22:27:47 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Not bad. Very close to my own conception of Raziel. But there is an amusing (and rather intriguing ) typo below: >>>ARCANE KNOWLEDGE For two essense points, this attunement allows the caster to lay their hands on a tomb, and learn everything that is held between the bindings.<<< "Hmmm.....yup, he's dead. Been dead a looong time too...." - -David ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 21:09:24 -0600 (MDT) From: Kingsley Lintz Subject: Re: IN> Hellhounds > On Oct 10, 8:06am, Realm Control wrote: > > Subject: IN> Hellhounds > > An idea that I've been kicking around is the concept of Hellhounds: > Familiars are NPCs and therefore are constructed (or at > least approved) by the GM. Any munchkinism is shot on sight. > Have a nice day! ;) All *I* have to say is the same thing I said the last time the idea of ultra-strong Servants with low Wills came up.... ..being an Amber GM, I'd -CERTAINLY- let them have it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 21:10:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Dorothy Bixler Subject: Re: IN> backwards On Fri, 10 Oct 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > At 11:04 AM -0500 10/10/97, Dorothy Bixler wrote: > >On Fri, 10 Oct 1997, Andre Ribeiro wrote: > > >> Hmmm... You know too much. Would you mind discussing it further in a > >> *hot* mud bath? ):-) > >> > >> Andre, D.P. > >> > >Ahem. There will be no suduction of my attun...er..spouse without my > >involvement. > > > >Or in the language of the Djinn : MINE!!!! > > Getting a little dissonant about him, are we? > Nah, I rolled a divine intervention on him somewhere along the line (no wait...I didn't say that. i don't care about anyone but myself!) > > [ of the Game, back into her subconscious> Sorry, sorry, been depriving > her of her fictional existance... Getting uppity.] Now, now, Dearie. Every now and again you have to let your inner demon loose (make a break for it, K.K.!) > > > --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor > GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ > > *Dorothy Michelle Bixler * mudmh10@ecom.ecn.bgu.edu* "Gidget, have you been laying with the Horned One again?" -MST3K's Mike from "The Thing the Couldn't Die" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 21:14:19 -0600 (MDT) From: Kingsley Lintz Subject: Re: IN> backwards Nathaniel Eliot said; > > > stuff like that). Basically, the people who play are Superiors > > > (and high ranking Ethereals?), giving orders to the lower ranks > > Hey, the idea sounds funny! Who is behind this (I've already > > lost track of who is writing what here...)?? > Me. If there's enough demand, I will definately look into it. Well, of course, being of such gentle disposition, I try not to be DEMANDING...but I'd be interested. {And, from the background, MaBarry suggests she might find the time as well.} ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 22:07:10 -0500 (CDT) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> [FICTION] Chess Game >Great piece. I just got around to reading it. Thanks. >BTW, I don't see Laurance letting himself get talked into that (or Malphas, >for that matter). Well, Laurence didn't want to play what Novalis wanted to play, Novalis didn't want to play what Laurence wanted to play, Malphas didn't want to play what anybody else wanted to play, nobody was crazy enough to play four-way M:tG with Malphas... so Kobal kinda stepped into the breach. }:-{D Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 20:37:59 -0400 From: "Steven Ehrbar" Subject: Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] Might I also suggest that the Ars Magica supplements the Maleficum (now out-of-print) and Pax Dei (still in print) have a number of interesting ideas for magic in In Nomine? Actually, both also have a lot of other things that /could/ be mined for use in an In Nomine campaign. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 20:02:59 -0700 (PDT) From: lugaid@seanet.com Subject: Re: IN> Hellhounds On 1997-10-10 in_nomine-l@lists.io.com said to lugaid@seanet.com >An idea that I've been kicking around is the concept of Hellhounds: >Okay, that's my thoughts... knock holes in it, so I don't run amok. honestly, i see nothing wrong with doing that... its low Will ensures that it is remarkably vulnerable to other Celestials (through Songs, Attunements, and so on), as well as most Soldiers... it'll kick the tar out of most mortals, but so what? get a pack of them, for that graveyard scene in _The Omen_... ;) i'd probably allow it, but i think that i could keep it under control... Slan agus Beannachtai, Lugaid MacRobert "I may act kind of random, but I am not a senseless beauty." - Leigh G Net-Tamer V 1.08X - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 20:02:28 -0700 (PDT) From: lugaid@seanet.com Subject: Re: IN> On playing demons On 1997-10-10 in_nomine-l@lists.io.com said to lugaid@seanet.com >lugaid@seanet.com wrote: >> reading this thread, i just had a burst of insight... >> Heaven is suburbia, and Hell is a slum/inner city... >This resembles the depiction of Hell in "The Great Divorce" by >C. S. Lewis, in which damned souls can take a tour bus to the >outskirts of Heaven. (One or two of them stay, and so get off >damned lightly, you could say.) Hell is an infinite slum >under perpetual drizzle in never-ending late evening. You can >wish up anything you like, but, the damned being who they are, >it's always tacky, and it doesn't really keep of the drizzle. >His Heaven, on the other hand, is a paradisal wilderness, leading >away to mountains where a light brighter than the sun waits. Hell, if Lewis thought of it first, then i guess i must be on something like the right track, no? ;) i still say that IN's Heaven is more like suburbia, or one of those walled-off communities that are starting to spring up... i should note that my vision of suburbia is close to the opening scene in _Blue Velvet_... happy and smiling on the surface, safe and nice - seething with repressed hatred underneath... if i were given a choice of places to go after death in IN, i'd take the Far Marches, thanks (though most parts of IN Hell wouldn't be so bad)... Slan agus Beannachtai, Lugaid MacRobert I'm here for moral support. Ignore the gun. Net-Tamer V 1.08X - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Oct 1997 20:03:06 -0700 (PDT) From: lugaid@seanet.com Subject: Re: IN> Janus, Valefor, and the Rest On 1997-10-10 in_nomine-l@lists.io.com said to lugaid@seanet.com >Perhaps. Odhinn isn't immune to flights of fancy or trickery, >either. sure, and he has played the disguise game more than once... >But, actually, you're right. of course i am... ;) >Odhinn is a little busy >preparing for the Ragnarok that he is sure will come. That Fenris >hasn't been destroyed by Uriel's Purge is disturbing news, indeed. it is, and it provides an interesting insight into the nature of rewriting the Symphony... >But I don't have much (check that: no) information on Lugus. I'm >not familiar with Celtic mythology at all, go to Barnes and Noble, and pick up _Ancient Irish Tales_ by Cross and Slover, if you are interested... Lugus goes by the name Lugh in Ireland... >except isn't Rhiannon >from the Celtic Mythos? sort of... she is the later Christianized Welsh version, retaining quite a few pagan elements... the original (probably) went by the name "Rigantona" - but that is more of a job title, like "Magna Mater"... Rigantona means something like "Great Queen"... Rhiannon (in the extant material) is heavily euhemerized... somehow i managed to fit my Celtic obsession into IN... if anyone is interested, i have some material from Alexei Kondratiev (a professor of linguistics who specializes in the Celts and Celtic religion) on the gods of the Celts... it's pretty long, so i won't post it to the list, but i'd be happy to send it in private email... it might help in fleshing out Faerie a little... or, if the list Archangel thinks it appropriate, i could go ahead and post it here? Slan agus Beannachtai, Lugaid MacRobert Smith & Wesson: The original point and click interface. Net-Tamer V 1.08X - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 11:51:46 +0900 From: Dave Conrad Subject: Re: IN> IN: THE MOTION PICTURE Stacy Stroud wrote: > > > Nybbas: Robert Downey Jr. (Wayne Gale, anyone?) > Nybbas has got to be James Woods. He's got the same face, and I can really see him in the role. I haven't seen Hrecules yet, patially because I don't like Disney, partially because I live where it hasn't hit the theaters, but when I saw Contact, he reminded me of Nybbas the whole time. - -- Dave C. iN*T*x "To break the rules is to break the spell" - C. Lasch ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 01:09:17 -0400 (EDT) From: CeIestiaI7@aol.com Subject: IN> Sacraments I Hey there! I'm currently working on a series of NPC celestials (angels), each of whom holds a particular Sacrament as their Word. I'm not familiar with any such series to date, so I thought I'd give it a try. For those not familiar with the Seven Holy Sacraments, they are: Baptism, Confirmation, Holy Eucharist, Penance, Anointing the Sick, Holy Orders, and Matrimony. I have a few ideas for each of them and will post each as I finish it. If you have any *must see* ideas, send them to my private email address. Otherwise, I'd rather just have public discussion on what I've already posted. So here's part one... - -------------------------------------cut here--------------%< Hymaneus ("Manny") Angel of Marriage Malakite of the Sword The middle aged Jamaican woman with four-inch, glitter-gold nails looked up through her purple framed glasses. Manny was still there. She sighed. "8C," she said. The cigarette in her mouth clung to her lip for dear life. "Thanks," Manny said, offering a polite smile to the motel attendant. He brushed up his suit and lugged the deceptively heavy attaché case up the stairs. He reached the room and set his case down. A "Do not disturb" sign was hanging off the knob. Manny slipped it off the handle and put it in his pocket. His hand came out with a stick of cinnamon chewing gum. The malakite stripped it of the silver foil and popped it in his mouth. He checked his watch and chewed for exactly one minute. Once the gum had reached the desired consistency, Manny stuck the red wad over the door's peephole. He rapped three times on the door. Once the sounds of hurried dressing had ended, a man in his forties peeked his face through the opened door. Manny produced a picture and showed it to the man. "You know him?" Manny asked. A look of puzzlement and disgust was his only reply. "Maybe your, um, friend will know," Manny craned his neck over the guy's head. "No. I don't think she will. Now go the hell away!" Manny pushed the door open, snapping the chain and shoving the man directly into the closet. "Thanks. I think I will come in," he said and strode directly over to the half-dressed woman by the bed. Again, he flashed the picture. The woman slid the left strap of her bra over her shoulder. She eyed the picture and glanced up at the malakite. "Oh Lord," she whispered. "that's Tom." "So you know him then" Manny spat. She nodded in reply. "And what were you doing on the 18th of June, 1973?" She sat on the edge of the bed, and thought. "My God. That was our wedding day. Do you work for Tom? Did he send you?" Manny met her eyes with a cold, hard gaze "You lacked commitment then, you lack it still. Your husband is free. 'Til Death do you part..." Corporeal Forces - 5 Strength 12 Agility 8 Ethereal Forces - 3 Intelligence 6 Precision 6 Celestial Forces - 6 Will 12 Perception 12 Vessels: Human/4 (Middle aged male); Human/4 (Young-adult female) Role: Marriage Counselor/3 Skills: Detect Lies/3, Driving/2, Fighting/3, Knowledge: Marriage Laws & Customs/6, Knowledge: Church Doctrine/6, Large Weapon/2, Ranged Weapon/1, Songs: Attraction (Ethereal/4, Celestial/2), Harmony (Ethereal/5), Tongues (Corporeal/3) Attunements: Malakite of the Sword, Scabbard, Purity of Purpose, Hunt, Divine Contract (Marc) Special Rites: Attend a 25th year anniversary party (+1 Essence; +2 for 50 years, +3 for 75 years); Kiss a bride (married before God) on her wedding day +1 (once a day) Hymaneus is a bitter angel. The twentieth century has seen his Word become more of a pastime than a lifelong commitment. Marriages are no longer about couples, their love for each other, and their love for God, but about personal satisfaction, convenience, financial stability, and regular sex. Other celestials have questioned the wisdom of assigning a malakite to the Word of Marriage. Former angels of that Word have been cherubs, mercurians, and kyriotates; malakim are not generally known for their sentiment. Laurence looked beyond the sentiment of matrimony when he selected a candidate for this Sacrament. He thought it tactically sound to place an honorable and faithful angel in charge of a Word that includes such ideals. Who better than one of his own brethren? Manny once served Marc, making sure that people bound by legal contracts honored them. He was dissatisfied with his work, and felt his talents leaned elsewhere. Soon he had impressed Laurence enough, that the Archangel petitioned Manny's Superior for release into his own service. Marc agreed. Hymaneus once enjoyed his work. He made sure that couples were committed to the idea of marriage and family before they went to profess their intentions before God. He counseled them and watched love, trust, and partnership bloom before his eyes. Lately, his calling has been to protect the institution of Marriage against adulterers and divorces. He is running out of patience. Several incidents have led him to harsh action. Action which may be construed as inappropriate considering the situation. Dominic's servitors are keeping a close eye on him, as is Laurence himself. Hymaneus has also been troubled as of late, regarding the number of same-sex "marriages" occurring. On the one hand, they fulfill his Word. Many lasting and loving partnerships have been such unions. His problem is that Laurence whole-heartedly disapproves. Marriages promote the growth of The Church through children and families. No children equals no growth. After all, Laurence has his own Word to think about. - -------------------------------------cut here--------------%< Scott Mercurian Friend of Flowers, Angel of Chilling Out ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 02:11:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Davidson Subject: Re: IN> Janus, Valefor, and the Rest On Fri, 10 Oct 1997 lugaid@seanet.com wrote: > On 1997-10-10 in_nomine-l@lists.io.com said to lugaid@seanet.com > >Perhaps. Odhinn isn't immune to flights of fancy or trickery, > >either. > > sure, and he has played the disguise game more than once... > Oh, absolutely. Something about Billingsdotter comes to mind... :) > >But, actually, you're right. > > of course i am... ;) > > >Odhinn is a little busy > >preparing for the Ragnarok that he is sure will come. That Fenris > >hasn't been destroyed by Uriel's Purge is disturbing news, indeed. > > it is, and it provides an interesting insight into the nature of > rewriting the Symphony... > Oooo... evil thoughts! evil thoughts! <"Mommy! he's doing it again!" "Tommy, stop scaring your sister!"> > >But I don't have much (check that: no) information on Lugus. I'm > >not familiar with Celtic mythology at all, > > go to Barnes and Noble, and pick up _Ancient Irish Tales_ by Cross and > Slover, if you are interested... Lugus goes by the name Lugh in > Ireland... > Lugh... Lugh... *that* name is familiar. I think it's in my copy of Deities and Demigods... :) > >except isn't Rhiannon > >from the Celtic Mythos? > > sort of... she is the later Christianized Welsh version, retaining quite > a few pagan elements... the original (probably) went by the name > "Rigantona" - but that is more of a job title, like "Magna Mater"... > Rigantona means something like "Great Queen"... Rhiannon (in the extant > material) is heavily euhemerized... > Ah. I should really check it out more... > somehow i managed to fit my Celtic obsession into IN... if anyone > is interested, i have some material from Alexei Kondratiev (a professor > of linguistics who specializes in the Celts and Celtic religion) on the > gods of the Celts... it's pretty long, so i won't post it to the list, > but i'd be happy to send it in private email... it might help in > fleshing out Faerie a little... > I'm just getting started with my IN campaign... I don't think I'll be needing anything for Faerie for quite a while... > or, if the list Archangel thinks it appropriate, i could go ahead and > post it here? > Maybe instead ArchBeth could put it in INC? (It's worth a shot, and it would be available to those who want it, without eating up gobs of bandwidth). > Slan agus Beannachtai, > This looks Celtic or Gaelic... what does that mean? Thomas Davidson tdavidso@suffolk.lib.ny.us MUSIC: Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones, Rush, Jimi Hendrix GAMES: Champions (old and new), In Nomine, Nephilim TV: The X-Files, the Simpsons, Superman, The Tick, the Animaniacs OTHER: Religion, Philosophy, mysticism, the runes, the Tarot, writing. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 04:37:45 -0700 (PDT) From: lugaid@seanet.com Subject: Faerie Gods (ArchBeth, please read; was: Re: IN> Janus, Valefor, and) On 1997-10-11 in_nomine-l@lists.io.com said to lugaid@seanet.com >On Fri, 10 Oct 1997 lugaid@seanet.com wrote: >> it is, and it provides an interesting insight into the nature of >> rewriting the Symphony... >Oooo... evil thoughts! evil thoughts! ><"Mommy! he's doing it again!" "Tommy, stop scaring your sister!"> hehehe... i *am* one of those accused of playing the game backwards... ;) oh, and just so people don't get the wrong idea about my interest in things Celtic, i'll point out that i consider myself pagan and "CR" (which can stand for either "Celtic Reconstructionist" or "Celtic Restorationist" - the difference is really only of importance to those of us in the "community", sort of like the difference between Baptist and Charismatic ;)... >> go to Barnes and Noble, and pick up _Ancient Irish Tales_ by >>Cross and Slover, if you are interested... Lugus goes by the name >>Lugh in Ireland... >Lugh... Lugh... *that* name is familiar. I think it's in my copy of >Deities and Demigods... :) damn! don't *do* that! (ok, not *all* of them are/were clueless...) >> or, if the list Archangel thinks it appropriate, i could go ahead >>and post it here? >Maybe instead ArchBeth could put it in INC? (It's worth a shot, >and it would be available to those who want it, without eating up >gobs of bandwidth). i'll edit it a little (to remove some of the stuff that is of no relevance to gaming), send it directly to those who ask me for it, and ask the Archangel of Archives if she would like to archive something that is not necessarily directly game-related, but might be useful for background... for reference, the file (as edited) comes to 28,569 bytes - not as long as i thought (there was a lot of pagan-specific stuff to take out)... so, Archangel Beth? >> Slan agus Beannachtai, >This looks Celtic or Gaelic... what does that mean? it is Irish, and means, literally, "Health and Blessings", or, more loosely, "Good-bye, and Good things to you"... Slan agus Beannachtai, Lugaid MacRobert I am the grave of every vain hope Net-Tamer V 1.08X - Test Drive ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 05:16:40 PDT From: "Andrew Frades" Subject: IN> Re: IN- Sacraments I >I'm currently working on a series of NPC celestials (angels), each of who= >m >holds a particular Sacrament as their Word. I'm not familiar with any su= >ch >series to date, so I thought I'd give it a try. For those not familiar w= >ith >the Seven Holy Sacraments, they are: Baptism, Confirmation, Holy Euchari= >st, >Penance, Anointing the Sick, Holy Orders, and Matrimony. I have a few id= >eas >for each of them and will post each as I finish it. If you have any *mus= >t >see* ideas, send them to my private email address. Otherwise, I'd rather >just have public discussion on what I've already posted. So here's part >one... > >-------------------------------------cut here--------------%< > >Hymaneus ("Manny") >Angel of Marriage >Malakite of the Sword Very nice. I like the idea a lot (can't wait for Penance). I have one idea you might like though. Manny is a reletively new angel to the job, the previous angels having failed. Perhaps make him just a few steps weaker than you have him. Make him inexperienced and unsure (kind of like Laurence) but directed. He has ideas of what to do but isn't always sure how to implement them. Sound kind of cool? I like the idea of him being very green and perhaps weaker, unsure if he can do a good job but willing to give it a go. BTW I really like the idea that he is confused about same sex marriage and is perhaps trying to convince Laurence that it isn't so bad. "Look boss, they love each other and are destined to stay together for the rest of their lives, see... Children... Well, they adopt..." - - Andy, Kyriotate of Jean ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 10:13:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Bast > I thought it was funky too. (It also suggested > that she and Sekamet/Sachmet/that lioness-headed warrior-ish > goddess were varients of the same entitiy.) > > I'll take your research, though -- there are a few other holes > in the reference book that I've found (though it's usually > correct as far as it goes, from what I can see...). > > Got any suggestions for good research books on the Egyptian Pantheon? > Lemme walk into the bedroom.... The books I have on me right now is: * "Ancient Egyptian Religion" by Henri Frankfurt * "Egyptian Religion" by Siegfried Morenz There is a book I loaned out, "When Egypt Ruled the East", which is a very good historical background book. Warning, the Morenz book is like reading marmalade, and it does require you have a background in Hieroglyphics first. - -Em ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 10:41:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] > > Calabim: > > > > The Calabim join and help the destructive cults, which put forth the > > concepts of selfishness and using their knowledge to manipulate the world > > around them. They regain essense if they participate in any group > > activity which causes the destruction of an entity, ie. computer > > "technopagan" groups which hack viruses, Temple of Set groups who commit > > sacrifices. > > > On that last one, officially the Temple of Set (if I remember their fact > right) does not condone sacrifice of animals or children (ditto for Church > of Satan). I'm still in the process of writting these two delightful orgs > up (along with thier respective founders) I'll send a copy to anyone who > would be interested in having the two largest (US) satanic churches in > their game. > Just doing my duty, ma'am. > Okay, you're right, and those were bad, incorrect examples. I had spoken to a CoS member earlier in the day before I started writing this, and I was given a briefing on what it was "all about". My God, a great inspiration for Habbalah if I've ever seen one. So I do stand corrected - but they are destructive to lives and psyche without ever getting around to using a goat. If you do crank out your descriptions, passing them around could be helpful if I end up expanding these guys. - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 11:04:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Raziel\Ghogiel [VERY LONG] > > I am officially working off a Geas to ArchAngel Beth. I promised this > > stuff about a week ago, and because I was too burned out to program > > anymore, I thought I would write instead. > > I KNEW she was a Lilim in disguise. The Malakim will be told! No, I was just working it off. I had gotten a favor, and now I paid it back. The oncoming flamewar I smell in the air is a tribute to by true Balseraph-hood. :) And please don't tell the Malakim. I'll have to call my Calabite buddies. > I tend to disagree with that. You look at most of the religions of the > world as "magic", which it is not. Instead, it is man trying to > influence Heaven. Even that theocentrist Laurence has room for those > saffron robed monk/souls in his Halls of Worship, the various idols > (though to be sure, the demonically inspired ones are missing) of the > Hindus, et al. There is room for EVERYONE in Heaven...if you meet the > standards. No, I don't know them either. But maybe they are printed in the Angelic Players Guide. :) *snicker* > > So I split sorcery into two categories: > > > > 1. The learning and meditation of arcane knowledge to better > > understand the human condition and it's relation to God. > > This is called religion. The Kabbalists were trying to take a short > cut. That comes right out of one of my normal religion stuff I was reading, actually. And there's meditation and debate on the Torah as well... When I wrote that, I was actually thinking about some of the Mystical Taoist stuff I was exposed to in college. Just because the human condition and the condition of God were pretty much one and the same didn't mean that there wasn't some sort of "magic" that comes out of it. (I jump up and down, scream "I-Ching", and giggle insanely.) > > > 2. The learning of arcane knowledge to manipulate Creation and > > to better further the private purposes of Man. > > I think you missed the picture here. The initial humans created the > spirits of the Marches from their hopes and fears. Being products of > Man, these spirits were reasonably easily influenced by man when the > proper spiritual levers were used. With Revelations about the nature of > God and Lucifer were spread, these same levers were attempted against > Celestials. Because of their fractured nature, they worked against > demons. Unfortunately, most spells worked like this > [snip] Correct. Which is WHY I slotted the Sorcery attunement and the whole nine yards about it under the demon prince, and let all the OTO stuff that goes with it to the normal Sorcerers. Is it fair to Damn a Wiccan? I know some very nice ones, I would hope not. Off topic, I spend alot of time staring at a computer. I sunk $85K into this privelage. Have you ever read the WIRED article on Technopagans? Well, do so, it's an interesting read. I am not one, but I appreciate the standpoint. There is a certain amount of mysticism, "sorcery", that goes into a really good hack, or a very nice piece of code. It's a very zen thing in a very Gateless Gate source of the word. There are arcane almost completely non-understandable languages involved, arcane bizarre knowledge... and sometimes it's Good and helps mankind, and sometime it makes the caster into a complete sociopath... Heh. I should add that he talks to Vapula. :) I see a certain amount of science as attempting to "understand God". Quantum Physics, CERTAINLY Mathematics, Astrophysics, Molecular Pathology... all arcane languages, all strange knowledge, and sometimes they fall under evil influence and become sociopaths. :) So I split Magic into two categories. Those who Summon Demons, make cults, destroy lives... and those that learn how to do heart transplants, and cure cancer. I don't think I missed the picture at all. > > I have a real hard time believing that the Lotus Sutra, > > certainly a "magical" work, is from Hell and does any more then put > > students to sleep while reading it. > > I guess I got off subject. "Mystical" works of a neutral nature exist; > its just very often used by demons as a gateway here and now. The > sorcerer is looking for power, and demons are powerful. Which, as I said, there is a demon prince involved here. > > I cut some interesting stuff, which I'll keep. I just have a different > perspective. Oh goody! Different perspectives are good. > > "What does it matter? It's all a bunch of tree hugging hippy crap." > > > > Good quote > And SO apropos. :) - - Em ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #401 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.