From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Tue Oct 28 18:39:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA09796 for ; Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:39:27 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id SAA07859 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:24:55 -0600 Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:24:55 -0600 Message-Id: <199710290024.SAA07859@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #444 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Tuesday, October 28 1997 Volume 01 : Number 444 In this digest: Re: IN> [LAST LAUGH] Toonic IN> Act 3 (humour -- long) Re: IN> Grey Victory Re: IN> Celestial Genesis Re: IN> Attn: Karakash - FAQ-type answer needed! Re: (Fwd) Re: IN> Story : Masquerade Re: IN> [LAST LAUGH] Toonic Re: IN> Grey Victory Re: IN> [LAST LAUGH] Toonic Re: IN> Celestial Genesis Re: IN> [DV] LITHEROY LIVES! Re: IN> [DV] Saminga, Demon Prince of Death, the Ultimate Evil Re: IN> [Dark Victory] Media Malakim Re: IN> Yves Library (side note) IN> Elohim etymology Re: IN> Hebrew in IN and fluff. IN> Lilim parentage. Re: IN> Beth's post munge, take 2 Re: IN> Celestial Genesis IN> Eris' Apple (was: [DARK VICTORY] Bright Victory?) IN> Problems Re: IN> IN: Dice questions. Re: IN> [DV] Falling Re: IN> Seraphim Check Digits Re: IN> [DV] PLACES: The Holy City of Rio de Janeiro Re: IN> Any ideas? Re: IN> [DV] Saminga, Demon Prince of Death, the Ultimate Evil ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 12:41:04 -0500 From: "Kirt A. Dankmyer -- aka Loki" Subject: Re: IN> [LAST LAUGH] Toonic >Come on, everybody's doin it. Everybody's into it. You wanna be cool >like everyone else, right? Then come ON! Okay, okay. ;) I'll warn y'all, though, I don't have Redneck's output potential. We're still working on things. Which Gaggles of Toons (like Chiors of Angels, or Bands of Demons) would you like to see first: * Loonseraphs. Natural fast-talkers. * Fuddim. Straight men, all. Tough to kill. * Daffanim. Bouncy destruction. * Smurfim. Objectively clueless. Each extremely good at one task. Tend to work in groups. * Goons. Big, dumb, and can Lift Heavy Things. * Kablowim. Stars, circling around people's heads. Switch hosts by hitting people. Sometimes can take over multiple hosts, sometimes can't. * Animim. Big-eyed Anime Toons. Resonance for embarrassing social situations. In the meantime, here's one of the ideas I came up with: TOONIC This is the varient of Angelic that all Toons speak. To an angel, it sounds like Angelic. To a demon, it sounds like Demonic. There is a certain sarcastic undertone to it that can be detected by non-Toons, if they know what to look for. You cannot lie while speaking Toonic -- unless what you're saying is patently absurd ("And that's when the hot-crossed buns leaped up and attacked my throat!" or "Dominic is a Toon."), or is the set-up for a joke (no matter how elaborate, e.g. "Dominic is a Toon."), in which case you *can* lie, and it seems to be the truth, even to a Seraph. Toonic has a written form which resembles Angelic Script in bright day-glo colors, called Roonic Toonic, or "Rooty Tooty". Good Toon poetry, when in written form, is often described as "Rooty Tooty Fresh an' Fruity", especially since many Toon poets are fruits to begin with (literally)... -Loki - -- Kirt A. Dankmyer --- Academic Computing Specialist http://www.wfu.edu/~dankmyka/ -- (910) 759-4202 -- PGP public key available. For the Snark _was_ a Boojum, you see. --Lewis Carroll ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 17:40:58 -0000 From: "Hart, Joanna" Subject: IN> Act 3 (humour -- long) On the Summoning of Demons (Act 3 of 3) ** The office, immediately after the last scene. Kobal is in his shirt sleeves drying off his hair with a towel, and the two Lilim are peering at a glossy copy of 'Young Hamster Lovers Quarterly'. The rain is driving hard against the French windows and the sky outside looks tempestuous. In the distance, there is an audible #BOOM# ** KOBAL: Now what? * A damned soul enters at a trot, wearing a smart morning suit. It turns away from the audience towards the demons and gesticulates back the way it came with white gloved hands, desperately trying to mime that something significant is happening * LIL1: Its a book? No.. a film! LIL2: *wide yawn* Its 'The Good, the Bad and The Ugly.' I swear its the only one he knows. Looks as though he's picking you out as ugly again, darling. KOBAL: *gives Lilim2 a pointed glance* LIL2: OK, OK, I'm sorry. Jeez, some people... KOBAL: *to the butler* Well speak up then. BUTLER: [mmmph euuugh mmmph] * beads of sweat on its brow -- frantic hand waving * ** as it turns into the light we see that it has been gagged with barbed wire. Every time it tries to speak it re-opens old and bleeding wounds. Its eyes are wide with pain. ** KOBAL: *very deliberately* I said speak up, I can't hear you. BUTLER: [MMMPH EUUUGH MMMPH!!!!] KOBAL: (aside) Now, shall I do that again for comic effect or not...? LIL1: I think hes trying to say that the front door just exploded, Boss. BUTLER: * points to its nose and then to Lilim1 triumphantly * KOBAL: *pained* Again? Oh very well, go and see who it is and show them in. ** The butler bows and dashes out. There is a sound of heavy footsteps and a few minutes later the butler returns, accompanied by a Calabite which is dressed as an imperial stormtrooper ** CALABITE: *stands at attention* I bear a message for His Highness Kobal, Prince of Dark Humour, Lord of Misrule, Duke of Derision and Master of this Realm. KOBAL: Speak. CALABITE: My liege the Prince of The Game requests and requires that you attend upon him at your soonest convenience, my Lord. ** the Lilim look at each other with some concern and then to their boss ** KOBAL: Mmm.. I see. Would Kronos be with him by any chance? CALABITE: I believe so, my Lord. I have been asked to wait upon your answer. KOBAL: *sighs* I never could get the hang of Tuesdays. *he nods to the Calabite* Alright, tell him I'm on my way. Truly there is nowhere I would rather be than basking in the bright rays of his presence. CALABITE: *bows and departs* KOBAL: Wish me luck, girls. *takes a long swig from the bottle of Pimms and replaces it on the table* Well /laugh/ dammit! It isn't going to kill you. *he runs a comb through his hair and pulls on a coat, tight-lipped* ** the Lilim attempt weak smiles but can't manage to raise a chuckle between them. They watch Kobal leave silently.. and the lights dim to the sound of pouring rain outside ** - ---------- ** Wide-angle view of Asmodeus's fortress in Hell. The building is a perfect copy of Senate House[1], the administrative HQ of the University of London (or vice versa). It looms up through the rain with great stone geometric precision. ** - ---------- ** An inner chamber. The walls and floor are stone and the ceiling is very high. A wide oak desk is angled across one corner, such that the occupant has a clear view of the door. There are 2 clusters of spotlights on the ceiling and one wall is lined with anonymous grey filing cabinets. A couple of chairs made of wrought-iron are placed so as to form an equilateral triangle with the desk. Kronos is seated on one of them with his hood pulled forwards, hiding his face. Asmodeus, bearing a striking resemblence to Al Pacino in Godfather III, leans back behind the desk, sitting in the only comfortable chair in the room. He is wearing mirror-shades. ** ASM: *musing idly* Every time this happens I wonder to myself, 'Will this be the last time?' It would be nice if it were the last time, don't you think? KRONOS: What is, is what must be. I rarely squander time on such wonderings. ASM: *smiles discomfortingly* No, I don't suppose you do. KRONOS: It is clear that this foolishness must stop, however. He is a loose cannon, and if he cannot be controlled then needs must we step in and.. ASM: *nods and cuts him off with a brief gesture* Yes, I'm well aware of that. Someone needs to jerk his chain and point out that there are a few rules of engagement that can't be bent. *he drums the table lightly with his fingertips* And also.. there is Kobal. You don't think perhaps you are letting... ahh... factors of personal involvement colour your thinking, hmm? KRONOS: *stares at Asmodeus coldly, and silence falls across the room* ASM: *loosens his collar; on the inside of his shirt we can see a lipstick mark. It is the exact same colour as the one Lilith was wearing in Act 2* Just something a little bird told me. KRONOS: *another long pause* ** Kobal enters, accompanied by another Calabite in Storm Trooper uniform. The Calabite takes up a guard position inside the door ** KOBAL: Gentlemen. *he nods politely to both of the DPs and tosses his coat across the back of the spare chair* ASM: So glad you could join us. *he indicates the chair* Sit. Words cannot express how it pains me to hear disappointing reports of you. KOBAL: I can imagine. *smirks at Kronos* So.. I hear you were walking the earth like Kane. Find enlightenment? KRONOS: Thus are we shown that there is no force in the world which can separate a fool from his folly. *stares at Kobal* Thou makest light of activities which have the potential to overturn our entire efforts. ASM: *lazily, to Kobal* You know, for someone who is reputed to be quite bright you say remarkably stupid things sometimes. KOBAL: What am I supposed to say? It wasn't anything to do with me. Comprendez? I wish it had been.. but it wasn't. ASM: *dryly* Not a very inventive excuse, I'm sure you'll be the first to agree. KOBAL: *shrugs in agreement* ASM: Alright. This won't be happening again. It really boils down to whether or not you can be trusted to leave the room, my friend. I'd so hate to have to decide that you couldn't. *he flips open a flat box of cigars on his desk and extracts one* Does anyone have a light? ** Kronos sits unmoving and Kobal shrugs, his smile has also dissipated. The Calabite flicks a lighter, producing a tall yellow flame, and steps forwards to light Asmodeus' cigar. As he does so, Kobal does a double take and gawps at him (he is that bit sharper than the others). The lights dim and spotlights pick out Kobal and the man in the storm trooper costume. Everyone else freezes in place. The storm trooper takes his helmet off. ** KOBAL: You. LUCIFER (for it is he): *flicks off the lighter* Who else? KOBAL: *sinking back into his seat* I.. see. Well, it was nice of you to come to my funeral, my Lord. I'm sure there won't be a dry eye in the house. LUCIFER: How very very overdramatic. Anyone else would have thought it might relieve the boredom. You could show a little more appreciation, you know. KOBAL: *weakly* Thank you. LUCIFER: *nods graciously* KOBAL: *sighs* It was you wasn't it? The third glass. You distracted Kronos on earth so that you could rendezvous secretly with Yves at my place, and now I'm about to take the rap for it. LUCIFER: *gently* Of course. And now all you have to do is decide whether you are going to tell them... ** Kobal and Lucifer hold a gaze for a long moment, then the lights come up and everyone else unfreezes. ** ASM: *cocks an eyebrow at the 'Calabite'* Why, dread lord Lucifer. How very thoughtful of you to drop in unannounced. *faint sarcasm* Cigars? Port? Shall we get on with business perhaps? LUCIFER: *murmurs* Please don't let me disturb you. Do carry on. KRONOS: *dips his head to Lucifer in a formal acknowledgement, but is otherwise silent* ASM: As you wish. *turns to Kobal* Do you have anything to say in your defence before I ignore it and pass sentence on you anyway? ** Kobal starts to say something, and then stops. Finally he begins to laugh, awkwardly at first, and then with more genuine humour, his shoulders shaking with the effort. The lighting softens and the laughter seems infectious. Lucifer grins and even Asmodeus allows an amused smile. Outside, we can hear the rain stop and a bright shaft of sunshine darts through a window. ** LUCIFER: *to Kobal, gently chiding* You should laugh more often. I like it when you laugh. *he turns to Asmodeus* I think perhaps we could let this one drop. ASM: *spreads his hands* I understand where you are coming from and I'd love to oblige but.. unfortunately we have the paperwork to worry about. *he waves towards a box file* Rules are rules, as I'm sure you'll agree. LUCIFER: Of course. Shall we look through the paperwork? KOBAL: *subsides into silent giggles and tries to get a grip* ** Asmodeus reaches across and flips the file open. Whatever was in there before is completely shredded, but there is a glimpse of a small brown furry form... ** LUCIFER: *tuts* Dave! You /bad/ gerbil. However did you get in there? KRONOS: *undertone* I wonder. ASM: *stands* Well I suppose that just about wraps it up. *he turns to Kobal and indicates the hapless rodent* And whilst you're about it, get that -thing- out of my office! ** Asmodeus walks out and as the door slams behind him the room fades to black ** THE END (?) - ---------- [1] Senate House is a front-runner for 'world's most intimidating building' (apparently there is a library in it somewhere but nobody ever goes in, and nobody ever comes out) -- as a visualisation aid I've dumped some photos of it on http://www.btinternet.com/~jhart/temp.htm :) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 13:01:19 -0500 (EST) From: Thomas Davidson Subject: Re: IN> Grey Victory On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, John L Veazey wrote: > I would love to see a story of the Pagan Gods winning, that just > seems cool. > Actually, I'm working on that, myself. It all starts with Janus/Valefor... and (to quote the rulebook) "mayhem ensues". :) > Vz > Thomas Davidson tdavidso@suffolk.lib.ny.us MUSIC: Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones, Rush, Jimi Hendrix GAMES: Champions (old and new), In Nomine, Nephilim TV: The X-Files, the Simpsons, Superman, The Tick, the Animaniacs OTHER: Religion, Philosophy, mysticism, the runes, the Tarot, writing. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 11:17:29 -0700 (MST) From: Kingsley Lintz Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Genesis > I'm telling you... Djinnporn scares me. Deeply. But hey, they're demons. > It's supposed to be nasty. Oooh...there's a Relic. "Playdjinn!" Any human who sees it is automatically on Beleth's side of the Marches every night for the next month... > > >Habbalah: > > > Copulation, "God's method". :) > > Does this mean they only use the missionary position? (Habbalah > No no no no... they definitely have whips and chains. I would never > deny a Habbalah a perfectly good pasttime. :) > My idea was just that they do it biologically... oh, never mind. Mind, given the way Habbalah feel about themselves, it may be worth noting that they probably do it in Corporeal Vessels, since they're so much more attractive that way...assuming that's an option. I suppose it might HAVE to be Celestial to work. (Incidentally, don't Elohim use turky basters?) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 13:11:08 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> Attn: Karakash - FAQ-type answer needed! On Tue, 28 Oct 1997, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: > On Oct 27, 4:13pm, Pee Kitty wrote: > > To what does "charm" refer to in the Lilim Band Attunements of Asmodeus > > and Kronos?? Asmodeus' Lilim get a bonus to "charm" a person. Kronos' > > Lilim get a resonance bonus on "charmed" people. Whazzup? > > Lilim of Asmodeus > "Asmodeus' Lilim show up most frequently as hookers, > strippers, substitute English teachers and other roles that > let them get kinky in plaid private-school uniforms." ;) > > I presume you meant _Baal_ and Kronos. Heh. Aw, gimmeabreak, mon...I was at work, all book-less and stuff. :) > Lemme check with Derek to see what the intent was. Thank you velly much. > > I find it hard to believe that this just refers to the Song of Charm. > > Kronos gives away so many cool, useful attunements that this one would be > > pathetic in comparison. An attunement that's only useful when you FIRST > > use a song and THEN resonate on someone? Nah... > > Hold on there. Lilim of Kronos can detect Discord in other > beings merely by looking into their eyes! That means that any > celestial with discord is immediately outed as a celestial (rather > than a human with a gimpy leg). Not a power to be discounted so > easily. From that point of view, anything else is just a bonus. ;) Not necessarily...I can't see any reason why a human can't have Anger or Greed, for example... Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian (Married to Rev. Unibomber on 11/15/96 - be jealous ;) Meow! - -= Windows 95 =- A 32-bit patch for a 16-bit GUI shell running on top of an 8-bit operating system written for a 4-bit processor by a 2-bit company who cannot stand 1 bit of competition. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:31:49 GMT From: maya@tcp.co.uk (GR Cogman) Subject: Re: (Fwd) Re: IN> Story : Masquerade >> Michael doesn't look that dumb, having tied Lucifer in a violin >> contest. > >Actually, I think that was Baal... > > >Nathaniel Eliot >temujin9@ix.netcom.com > Actually, it was meant to be Baal: black serpent mask to echo the golden serpent mask. Still, that's the problem when you have two Balseraphs on the enemy side who it might have been. Hm. I don't _think_ Lucifer showed. - --- Maya, Elohim of Eli in service to Blandine maya@tcp.co.uk - -- "There are those who say that wizards are subject to temptations and addictions beyond the understanding of ordinary men: the addiction to shape-changing, or to meditation under the influence of certain herbs and conditions of the stars; the obsession with knowledge, and the development of power. Yet this is not so. Temptation is temptation, obsession is obsession, and choice is choice." - Isar Chelladan, Precepts of Wizardry. -- "Dog Wizard", Barbara Hambly. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 12:41:29 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> [LAST LAUGH] Toonic >>Come on, everybody's doin it. Everybody's into it. You wanna be cool >>like everyone else, right? Then come ON! > >Okay, okay. ;) I'll warn y'all, though, I don't have Redneck's output >potential. We're still working on things. Which Gaggles of Toons (like >Chiors of Angels, or Bands of Demons) would you like to see first: > >* Goons. Big, dumb, and can Lift Heavy Things. But I thought Malakim were incapable of Laughing. }:-{D Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 14:01:07 -0500 (EST) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Grey Victory > > I would love to see a story of the Pagan Gods winning, that just > > seems cool. > > > > Actually, I'm working on that, myself. It all starts with > Janus/Valefor... and (to quote the rulebook) "mayhem ensues". :) I have determined that, in fact, that is how all In Nomine plots end up, regardless. No matter what you do, no matter how organized, you always end up with "And Mayhem Ensues." I heavily suspect the player characters, but I could be wrong. :) - - Em, gettin read to spin the doctor again. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 14:26:59 -0500 From: "Kirt A. Dankmyer -- aka Loki" Subject: Re: IN> [LAST LAUGH] Toonic >>* Goons. Big, dumb, and can Lift Heavy Things. > >But I thought Malakim were incapable of Laughing. }:-{D Tee hee. Yes, as far as anyone knows, no Malakim has ever gone Bass Ackwards and Sideways. The Goons are a uniquely Toonish creation, like the Lilim are uniquely Demonic. But now that Furfur is a Toon, maybe he'll be getting a Light-Hearted Malakim, now that the humorless word of Purity no longer protects them... -Loki - -- Kirt A. Dankmyer --- Academic Computing Specialist http://www.wfu.edu/~dankmyka/ -- (910) 759-4202 -- PGP public key available. For the Snark _was_ a Boojum, you see. --Lewis Carroll ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 15:08:19 -0500 (EST) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Genesis > > > I'm telling you... Djinnporn scares me. Deeply. But hey, they're demons. > > It's supposed to be nasty. > Oooh...there's a Relic. "Playdjinn!" Any human who sees it is > automatically on Beleth's side of the Marches every night for the next > month... That's probably a 21-and-over web site which is done by Nybbas's people. "Leave the tacky media to us!" And it does NOT have pictures of hang gliding. > > > >Habbalah: > > > > Copulation, "God's method". :) > > > Does this mean they only use the missionary position? (Habbalah > > No no no no... they definitely have whips and chains. I would never > > deny a Habbalah a perfectly good pasttime. :) > > My idea was just that they do it biologically... oh, never mind. > Mind, given the way Habbalah feel about themselves, it may be > worth noting that they probably do it in Corporeal Vessels, since they're > so much more attractive that way...assuming that's an option. I suppose > it might HAVE to be Celestial to work. Well, I would thinking that, maybe-possibly, Habbalah would insist on the same procedure as Angels. Go to the Prince, try to get the forces, and then do a little bit of weird bonding. Keep all the whips, chains, and Jello Gelatin. > > (Incidentally, don't Elohim use turky basters?) > Wha? *blink* My mind is now officially boggled. - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 16:09:34 -0500 From: Charybdis GreyDragon Subject: Re: IN> [DV] LITHEROY LIVES! [Charybdis] >>> Guess that's about the most literal example I've seen >>> yet of the old cliche', "The road to Hell is paved with good >>> intentions...." [Nathaniel] >>I was hoping that, in the DV universe at least, it would be paved >>with those Ophanim of Litheroy... [Archangel Beth] >(I think that character has become the character that we all >love to pick on...) And most of you haven't even met him... :) Poor Jeremiah... And he really is a nice guy, too... :) [Nathaniel] >>Of course, it would probably be paved with Malakim feathers, instead, >>for that oh, so creepy feeling... [Archangel Beth] >Malakite feathers. With the wings still attached. But not the rest >of the Malakim. OUCH! Peace, Charybdis GreyDragon charybdis@krilion.cnchost.com http://www.krilion.cnchost.com ** Let them eat each other!** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 23:03:38 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> [DV] Saminga, Demon Prince of Death, the Ultimate Evil At 6:38 PM -0600 10/27/97, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >were angels, Impudites and Ofanim in particular, squirming and crying out in Mercurians? - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 16:32:03 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> [Dark Victory] Media Malakim On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Kingsley Lintz wrote: [cool attunement snipped] Yeah, I like. What he said, RG. - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 15:16:34 -0600 (CST) From: Dorothy Bixler Subject: Re: IN> Yves Library (side note) On Sat, 25 Oct 1997, Dorothy Bixler wrote: (snip) > > flashed the lights to warn everyone it was time to leave? Yves' Library > > found you... > > Every time I go to the Library to wander. Hrm, actually considering the > stuff I end up finding, I think I actually end up in Kronos'. > > On a related note, I have a feeling that all of the refridgerators in > labs are really small portals to Tarturus. How else could you explain > some of the things you find in them? > Uh-Oh. Donald and I had fallen off the face of the 'net for several hours over the weekend. It looks like all of our posts may be finally catching up. So if anything gets double posted from us, just ignore it ;) *Dorothy Michelle Bixler * mudmh10@ecom.ecn.bgu.edu* "Gidget, have you been laying with the Horned One again?" -MST3K's Mike from "The Thing the Couldn't Die" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 23:47:22 +0200 From: Ijon Tichy Subject: IN> Elohim etymology Hello there. As one who speaks the "holy tongue" Hebrew, I can't help but wonder. "Elohim" is a Hebrew word meaning, literally, "gods". It is the name God uses to emphasize his being genderless, single and plural, in the Old Testament. What made the people at SJG decide that Elohim are kinds of angels? I'd be interested to learn of the etymological considerations involved. If you bring biblical quotes to support your reply, include pointers to the text. Esperanza - -- Ijon Tichy Sailing the 'net in the only e-mail: ijon@forum2.org Space Barrel known to man. Homepage: http://www.forum2.org/ijon MOO: VotSB, telnet://forum2.org:7777 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 23:54:28 +0200 From: Ijon Tichy Subject: Re: IN> Hebrew in IN and fluff. At 07:54 PM 10/27/97 -0400, emccoy wrote: >At 5:44 PM -0500 10/27/97, Emily Dresner wrote: >>> >>> >Most of the choirs are from hebrew, so we and my group can relate >>> >easily. [...] Cherubim are cabbages. >>> >>> Cabbages? >> >>Haven't you ever noticed? They're all... leafy! >I thought that was only Novalis... Cabbages in Hebrew is "KROOVIM". This has been transliterated in the King James bible to "Cherubim". The original use of the word, however, seems to be to refer to angels, just like "Seraphim". No plausible explanatation (possibly excepting the above) connects the angel types to cabbages, or indeed to any other vegetable. But there it is. - -- Ijon Tichy Sailing the 'net in the only e-mail: ijon@forum2.org Space Barrel known to man. Homepage: http://www.forum2.org/ijon MOO: VotSB, telnet://forum2.org:7777 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 08:56:23 GMT+10 From: "Leath Sheales" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: IN> Lilim parentage. Emily Dresner wrote: "- - Fathering The question then, is if Lilith is required to bear a child to full term, who is the father who provides the other end of the bargin, so to speak? Since Lilith is known for making bargins with the highest bidder, the father is the one who catches the fancy at the time. These include: * Demon Princes * ArchAngels * Ethereals * High Level Word-Bound Celestials "With Promise". To have a child with Lilith would mean a few things. It could mean that the Celestial in question has an 'early claim' via Geas onto the child in question. The second is that the child may exhibit a few of the traits of the parent. " I *like* this. Although not canon, it could really help explain the extraordinarily high level of conscience and frustration my Lilim seems to have (can anyone say "Daddy was an Archangel?") Leath. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 16:30:28 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Beth's post munge, take 2 On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Kingsley Lintz wrote: > someone said; > > Oh, sure, don't attribute me, RG. Crush my fragile ego. ;) > {Crush, crush, stomp} > Just obeying orders, Sir. Fascist. ;) > > Hey, it's a bureaucracy. There's -always- room in the budget for eternal > > waiting rooms filled with dreary muzak where everything has the texture, > > color, and taste of lint. ;) > > (Yep, that's how I described Purgatory to my players: a Celestial lint > > trap. They get just the right 'eyugh' expression on their faces.) > Ah, Casca, you do realize that, as the LintKing, that makes > Purgatory mine... If you want it, it's yours. Why you'd want a realm where time passes more slowly than a line at the DMV is quite beyond me... > (Wahoo! I own Purgatory! Wow! Gosh! What a..er..great...ah, piece > of..real estate. Yay. Hm...Say, would anyone like to invest in a > bridge I bought just last week?) > > Actually, though, if Purgatory gets ALL the souls that aren't good > enough for Heaven or bad enough for Hell, I'm reaping in a *LOT* of Forces > and Essence...wonder what I'm saving it for? Heh heh heh... As my post said, the Essence goes toward paying off Discord-debt of the inhabitants. It's not accessible by anyone there. - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 15:25:04 -0600 (CST) From: Dorothy Bixler Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Genesis On Tue, 28 Oct 1997, Emily Dresner wrote: > > > > > I'm telling you... Djinnporn scares me. Deeply. But hey, they're demons. > > > It's supposed to be nasty. > > Oooh...there's a Relic. "Playdjinn!" Any human who sees it is > > automatically on Beleth's side of the Marches every night for the next > > month... > > That's probably a 21-and-over web site which is done by Nybbas's people. > "Leave the tacky media to us!" > Or it's one of the newsgroups on Tauterus-Net. You know vap.alt.sex.djinn.mine.mine.mine and it's rival vap.alt.sex.shedim.drip.drip.drip. And lets not forget vap.alt.sex.lilim.yes.please.mistress *Dorothy Michelle Bixler * mudmh10@ecom.ecn.bgu.edu* "Gidget, have you been laying with the Horned One again?" -MST3K's Mike from "The Thing the Couldn't Die" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Oct 1997 12:14:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Dorothy Bixler Subject: IN> Eris' Apple (was: [DARK VICTORY] Bright Victory?) On Fri, 24 Oct 1997, Jeff Miller wrote: > At 07:10 PM 10/23/97 -0500, you wrote: > >> Eris goddess/AA of discord? > > > >Goddess of Discord, Chaos, and All Things Funky. The only reason she'd > >be an Archangel would be to get into the Seraphim Council long enough to > >do some fruit throwing. > > > The thought of a horde of Cherubs or Djinn Attuning to the apple.... > > Or, give it to a Lilim... ...what a quandry! > Or toss it between a Calabite and a Malakite. How many city blocks do you think they would take out in the fight for the Apple? (Though I still like the idea of beaning Dominic upside his head) *Dorothy Michelle Bixler * mudmh10@ecom.ecn.bgu.edu* "Gidget, have you been laying with the Horned One again?" -MST3K's Mike from "The Thing the Couldn't Die" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 00:12:17 +0000 From: "A. Nachmias" Subject: IN> Problems Hello, The last 173 message I took got corrupted and I had to reindex Pegasus (deleting all those), so it'll take me more time to answer messages. (Yes, cabbages!) Best Regards, A. Nachmias ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 00:08:12 +0000 From: "A. Nachmias" Subject: Re: IN> IN: Dice questions. Charybdis GreyDragon wrote: > [Charybdis] > >Even in long-shot situations and/or when facing a celestial, the > >celestial doesn't fail a song, only the affect of the song is so > >small that it goes unnoticed. No need for dice there as well. > Then it is not truly a long shot... You are saying it always succeed with > no result... And I think there may be some cases where it DOES have an > effect enough to be noticed. I agree. The GM should then decide the effect according to the level of the celestial's song. The absurd thing, in the rules, is that no matter if you know a song at level 1 or 6, the only thing this accounts for is whether you succeed or not and not on how much you succeed, AFAIR. > >> [A. Nachmias] > >> > Divine/Infernal intervention? You probably ask > >> >without stating it. Umm, I can picture a scene: The angel tries to > >> >open a door and gets a 111. Holy christ! God appears as a waiter, > >> >you can hear heaven's choirs sing loudly, as he open the door for > >> >you! Amazing? I think not. My point being: Divine/Infernal > >> >intervention should not be completely random and limited to certain > >> >significant scenes as the GM sees fit to prevent from ridiculous > >> >scenes where God/Lucifer helps/damages opening a miserable door, or > >> >other silly scenes. > [Charybdis] > >> Again, I think a bit of randomness is cool... Sure God and Lucifer have > >> grandiose plans, but we (and even the Celestials) don't know what those > >> plans are and what is significant to them. Now I agree that your above > >> situation is a bit ludicrous, but then, I wouldn't call for a die roll in > >> an automatic action... God and Lucifer have such grandiose plans that even the GM doesn't know about them?!?! ;-) Naah. Interventions should be limited to significant events as are die rolls. > [A. Nachmias] > >Randomness? God appearing at a random situation? This is silly. > Why? Okay, perhaps it's not random to God, but since we don't share > Divine Omniscience, it only seems random to us... That's a nice explantation but just doesn't fit. An intervention should be something, hell, it should be on such major incidents that the whole course of actions will change. > [A. Nachmias] > >"Oh, hello fellow angels, I kinda stumbled into you and since I'm > >here, I just as might help you open this door. *Phooo!* *Door > >opened* *Angels stands awed in front of the awesome power of God in > >opening doors!*" > As I said before, I wouldn't call for a die roll to open a door. I would > consider that an automatic action-- unless the door was locked or > booby-trapped or something.... And then came God and discharged the bomb? Hell, I could have done that. ;-) > >> [A. Nachmias] > >> > Dice are bad. Well, mostly bad. I admit some games > >> >can't be played without the help of randomness, dice. Still, dice, as > >> >I see it, takes some of the role-playing - When you waste time on > >> >throwing dice, calculating check-digits, damage points, > >> >characteristic points lost and so on, you actually waste time where > >> >you could have developed your character. On the other hand, some play > >> >more for the battles and less for the role-playing (not munchkins, > >> >those play only for the battles, and for the +19,000 two handed > >> >sword, of course. ;-)). > [Charybdis] > >> I think it really depends on the situation. True-- you don't want to > >> overuse the dice. Then you get stuck in a situation where mechanics push > >> out the story. But having a random element at times can add a lot to the > >> game-- both for the GM and for the Pcs. Sometimes, having a long-shot pay > >> off can be beneficial-- swinging things in ways neither the GM nor the > >> player imagined. Likewise, having a relatively easy task fail also moves > >> the plot in unplanned for ways. And it can be more fun for the GM if he > >> doesn't always know how *everything* will turn out. (Come to think of it, > >> maybe that was the idea behind God granting Free Will-- a chance to relieve > >> the monotony of omniscience). I wouldn't refuse a PC asking for a die roll in a place he's ready to take a chance. I won't initate die rolling myself. If a PC think I've been unfair and wants to try it through the rules, let it be, he has chances of failing as much as succeeding. > [A. Nachmias] > >And see what came of -that-! ;-) > Ah, but one has to ask, what would it have been like under the > alternative... One needn't ask because one wouldn't have been thinking of asking were the alternative come true... Best Regards, A. Nachmias ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 23:19:06 GMT From: w_mazur@primenet.com (Walt Mazur) Subject: Re: IN> [DV] Falling On Tue, 28 Oct 1997 10:29:39 -0500, johnk@ascc01.ascc.lucent.com (John Karakash - Lucent ASCC) wrote: >> Is this a action? Suppose you're a Kyriotate in a flock of birds and demons >> manage to stun all of you, then go around killing your hosts. Can you >> convert dissonance to Discord while stunned as you can use Essence to boost >> Will resistance while stunned? > > That's fair. Otherwise there would be a lot less Kyriotates >and a lot more Shedim! But there *are* more demons than angels... ;) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 23:18:52 GMT From: w_mazur@primenet.com (Walt Mazur) Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim Check Digits On Tue, 28 Oct 1997 10:04:23 -0500, johnk@ascc01.ascc.lucent.com (John Karakash - Lucent ASCC) wrote: >> demon took a Discord/4 worth 12 points, that would be enough to buy Ranged >> Weapon/6 and 6 unholy bullets. The GM can hardly object to a Calabite doing >> this since they're required to buy Discord. > > [And it's canon that they get CPs for them now, as well...] Yep. >> Since all these items are "off the shelf," I'd have a hard time justifying >> their prohibition by GM fiat. It seems to me they're part of the standard >> game world. All in all, if I were messing with the standard game world >> (more than I am already to get rid of that God-awful disturbance formula), >> I'd put into practice the FAQ statement that IN isn't a game where humans >> are helpless pawns and give them Will bonuses against Celestial influence. > > I'd just put an arbitrary limit of '6' for the Power calculation. >The CD can still get pretty high, but the multiplied CD would use a 6 >rather than the ungodly automatic success number. Do you mean just for (Un)Holy Pistols or for everything? If all CDs are limited to 6, then high level characters would have difficulty using points--there'd be no headroom for character advancement, and a starting Celestial would have far too easy a time with a Word-bound if the latter were limited to CD 6. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 09:49:16 -0200 From: Andre Ribeiro Subject: Re: IN> [DV] PLACES: The Holy City of Rio de Janeiro Redneck Gaijin wrote: > Brazilia, > which had little or nothing in the way of resources to support it, and which > was mostly destroyed by Brazil's civil war, is being abandoned by the people. You *bet*!! Brasilia was built to be the nation's capital in the middle of the country, to take development to those areas...but it didn't worked as they planned... If someone cut off the government, Brasilia would become an enormous monument - nothing more... Andre, D.P. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:50:08 -0500 (EST) From: CeIestiaI7@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Any ideas? What about servitors of Christopher? Isn't it Brazil where hit squads are sent out to kill the children living on the street? Specific to Rio, if I'm not mistaken. S.A. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:01:59 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> [DV] Saminga, Demon Prince of Death, the Ultimate Evil >At 6:38 PM -0600 10/27/97, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >>were angels, Impudites and Ofanim in particular, squirming and crying out in > >Mercurians? > D'OH!! Yes, Mercurians. Sorry. (Although Impudites will be going there in greater numbers as New Heaven begins putting its plans in motion... }:-{( ) Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #444 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.