From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sun Nov 16 11:19:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA08858 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:19:57 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id LAA02806 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:08:50 -0600 Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:08:50 -0600 Message-Id: <199711161708.LAA02806@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #473 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Sunday, November 16 1997 Volume 01 : Number 473 In this digest: Re: IN> New Prince. (Night Music SPOILERS) Re: IN> Prince of Wrath Re: IN> Anachronistic Words Re: IN> New Prince. (Night Music SPOILERS) Re: Card Games ( was Re: IN> Wording ) IN> New Archangel. Re: IN> New Archangel. Re: IN> New Archangel. IN> Superior's Hearts Re: IN> Superior's Hearts Re: IN> Superior's Hearts IN> Re: IN- [DV] Symphony's End Re: IN> New Prince (Fezek) Re: IN> Questions philosophical and practical... Re: IN> Superior's Hearts Re: IN> Superior's Hearts Re: IN> Superior's Hearts IN> New Archangel Re: IN> Superior's Hearts Re: IN> Superior's Hearts Re: IN> Superior's Hearts ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 11:40:08 -0500 From: "Thomas Davidson" Subject: Re: IN> New Prince. (Night Music SPOILERS) > From: Casca > To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > Subject: Re: IN> New Prince. (Night Music SPOILERS) > Date: Saturday, November 15, 1997 2:08 AM > > > An interesting idea, well-written and well thought-out. > > There's just one problem: it's already been done. Furfur, Demon Prince of > Hardcore, whose word encompasses such things as riots and things done in > the heat of the moment. > Perhaps you misunderstand the nature of Furfur's word, Casca. Hardcore is a word about *abuse*... such as 'hardcore porn' and other such terms. To quote NM p. 123, "What could Lucifer be thinking? Hardcore. Wait, this word is *expandable*. Hardcore could be so much more than the music[....] But whenever ordinary Lust become[s] abusive, that's Hardcore, too. Whenever humans take things to absurd lengths, whenever any average sin crosses the border into the truly Hellish, Furfur could be there...." So there. :) Thomas Davidson tdavidso@suffolk.lib.ny.us MUSIC: Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones, Rush, Jimi Hendrix GAMES: Champions (old and new), In Nomine, Nephilim TV: The X-Files, The Simpsons, Superman, The Tick, The Animaniacs OTHER: Religion, Philosophy, mysticism, the runes, the Tarot, writing ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 11:41:46 -0800 From: The Saint of Killers Subject: Re: IN> Prince of Wrath David Edelstein wrote: > This is somewhat inconsistent with the dissonance restrictions of all other > Superiors. Servitors are supposed to *encourage* their Words, live them > even, not suppress them! Even Servitors of Lust are allowed to Lust after > people....they just can't cross the line into Love. He encourages the spread of his word by making other people angry. His servitors are meant to plot out ways of pissing off those around them. I've been in arguments before where I just sat there calm and smiling and the person got more and more red in the face. > (a) They must provoke someone else to wrath once a day, or I really don't like this. Not just here, but I don't care for it for any of the princes and archangels. It seems like a bit of a cop-out. I don't think that it really makes all that much sense, cos they -should- be provoking people to wrath all the time. It'd be like Belial's dissonance being 'set a fire once a day' or Saminga's being 'kill a person once a day'. It's what they'd be doing anyway, but there should be more to it than that. > (b) It is dissonant for them to forgive a slight -- rather, they MUST hold > onto and nurture all enmities, abandoning feuds only if the other party > offers an unconditional apology/surrender (i.e. letting the demon "win"). > This doesn't mean they have to fly into a rage -- they can let their wrath > simmer, as they coldly plot vengeance. I like this. If I were to run an IN game and use all my stuff, I might actually use this. Mainly because Fezek himself would have to follow it, and knowing how Saminga feels about him would make him start his plotting already. A good political game. As for the dissonance I've already set up, I think it's like Belial's dissonance. You -want- other people to burn, just don't get burnt yourself. sok ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 11:36:14 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> Anachronistic Words >> >> You can only get a Word if you ask for it. No one is >> >>'drafted' for the position. So 'avoidance' is a simple matter >> >>of not asking! ;) >> >Wait, can't Lucifer asign different Words to Demons pentioning him for a >> >certain one? >> Yes, but you have to ask for a Word before you get one- even if that Word >> isn't the one you wanted. > Um...are you seriously suggesting that Lucifer actually CAN'T, if >he wants to, slap a Word on a Demon just because said Demon hasn't said, >"Please"? He could, and in at least one documented case he has, but he doesn't do it often. And the Seraphim Council doesn't do it at all. Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 13:01:47 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> New Prince. (Night Music SPOILERS) On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Thomas Davidson wrote: > > From: Casca > > Perhaps you misunderstand the nature of Furfur's word, Casca. Hardcore is > a word about *abuse*... such as 'hardcore porn' and other such terms. Abuse? Not at all. How is hardcore music abusive? (Besides to the eardrums, I mean.) I think it's more along the lines of 'anything taken to excess,' which I believe is supported by the quote you provide. And since Fezek wanted to be the Demon of Riots -- riots being anger or discontent taken to excess -- I think it qualifies as overlap. As Prince of Wrath and former servitor of Maphas (who brought us such lovely attunements as Imbrolgio), I -definiately- see overlap. > But whenever ordinary Lust become[s] abusive, that's Hardcore, too. > Whenever humans take things to absurd lengths, whenever any average sin > crosses the border into the truly Hellish, Furfur could be there...." > So there. :) Not quite. Let us consider the following (emphasis mine): Dissonance: It is dissonante for Servitors of Hardcore to back down from a _violent situation_ in order to solve a problem intellecually or through diplomacy. _They will always answer violence with violence_. Lilim: ...may use only a victim's Geas toward a _violent action, and may only perform violent favors_... Shedim: .. add their Celestial Forces toward any attempt to urge their hosts into _violent action._ Baron of Hardcore: ... gives the demon the ability to fill a human with _hate for the establishment, "The Man," and society in general_... As we can quite clearly see, anger and violence is a major subset of the Word of Hardcore. How is Wrath different enough from these to justify its own Word? - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 13:30:50 -0500 From: Benjamin Colley Subject: Re: Card Games ( was Re: IN> Wording ) >collectable ) and Lunch Money (has anyone else apart from me heard of or >played that I wonder). Lunch Money? Isn't that with kick boxing Catholic school girls? No really, I think that is what it is. - -Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 13:44:39 -0800 From: The Saint of Killers Subject: IN> New Archangel. I -really- hope that this isn't the second time people are getting this. If it is, I'll be mildly embarassed, but I'll get over it really quickly, cos I have no shame. I'd make all sorts of excuses about Netscape and how crappy it is, but... eh... that's actually true. Nevermind. I'm Saint, Demon Prince of the InterNet. The world is a giant web of connected computers and flowing information, and it's really really damn slow and works only half the time. DUMA, ARCHANGEL OF SILENCE "..." There are many angels of which it is said that they were one of the first created. Duma is one of these many. The Archangel of Silence has not always been silent. Before the Fall, his Word was Archangel of the Symphony. It was his job to trace chords back to the start, follow notes to their end, find resonance in the Symphony and watch for discord. He was not Uriel, and did not seek to purify the Symphony, he merely watched and cared. The past, future and presence were his duty, his only rules: do not interefere, never tell. Never tell. Then came the Fall. Three angels knew of the Fall before it happened. Michael and Uriel were surprised. Gabriel and David were unprepared. Even Lucifer's followers did not believe it would happen. Surely God's golden boy wouldn't throw it all away. Would the Morningstar abandon the Heavenly Host? Lucifer knew he would. So did Yves and Duma. Yves and Duma had known that Lucifer would betray God before Lucifer did. Duma had seen it and, despite the rules, had told Yves. Yves did not get upset, either at Lucifer's Fate or Duma's dissonance. Yves merely shrugged and gave that queer little smile of his. Perhaps he'd already known. Known that Lucifer would do such a thing, known that Duma would tell and could do nothing of it. Could tell no one else. The Fall affected Duma in a way that it touched no other angel. Only Gabriel could be said to have felt such a profound impact from the rebellion. Duma could no longer carry out his Word. The Symphony, with its potential destinies and darkly bidding fates, it no longer captured Duma's interest. Nor his love. Duma's last words were, "I sing no more." And he didn't. The Archangels had hopes that Duma would snap out of it. No one had ever turned against their Word before. Even Lucifer and his followers had merely taken darker versions of those they previously held. Love to Hate, Light to Dark. Never in Heaven had Love or Hate turned to Apathy or Disinterest. It could not happen. It did. Yves, of course, knew that it would not go away. It was he who suggested that Duma's Word be changed, instead of the Removal that Uriel and Dominic were insisting upon. It was God who granted Duma his new Word, that of Silence. Not merely the dark and vile version of the Symphony that Kronos' Word embodied, but an absolute antithesis of sound and predestination. Duma still does not speak, though he has come to participate more fully in the War. His Word, like that of Gabriel, is symbolic. Silence represents the throwing off of the shackles of the Symphony. Duma is the Archangel of spontinaity, free will and unpredictability. This gives his servitors a certain flare for dramatics, and makes it nearly impossible for Laurance to include him in strategies at all. Rumours fly. Duma speaks only to Yves. Duma speaks only to God. Duma is God. Duma is Satan. Duma is Dominic. Michael respects Duma for the same reason he holds Yves in contempt. Laurence despises Duma, referring to him as the 'Patron of Atheism'. Blandine cries for him and Janus laughs for him. No one speaks for him. DISSONANCE Angels of Silence have no specific dissonance, however causing noise in the Symphony acts as dissonance for them. As long as there is a sound in the Symphony that they have directly created, they have as much dissonance as the target number for people nearby to detect it. Yes, this means that it is possible for an angel to temporarily have more dissonance than normally possible. It only remains for as long as the echoes last, then disappears altogether. With a great enough disturbance in the symphony, angels may temporarily display the symptoms of various Discords. CHOIR ATTUNEMENTS Seraphim Duma's Seraphim cause no ripples in the Symphony for taking their Celestial form. Cherubim Cherubim of Silence cause no disturbance in the Symphony for using songs when it affects the one they are attuned to. Protecting their attunement, healing them or, for really daring (or stupid) cherubs, killing them. Ofanim Ofanim can destroy objects without causing an audible interference in the Symphony. Elohim Elohim can percieve new sounds in the Symphony at a distance of - -ten- times the norm. In a large city, it can get quite loud at times. Elohim of Duma have an uncanny ability to concentrate in the most distracting of envionments. Malakim Malakim may kill humans without causing notes in the Symphony. Note: This only prevents the actual murder from sounding out. If the Malakim uses a song or takes Celestial form to commit the act, then both of these will cause a disturbance. Kyriotates Kyriotates, when in a vessel, may use songs on their host(s) without causing undue activity in the Symphon. Mercurians Mercurians may spend essence without it causing ripples in the Symphony. SERVITOR ATTUNEMENTS Generally, Servitor Attunements aren't considered nearly as important to Angels of Silence as is learning the other Band Attunements. Percieve the Symphony Borrowing on Duma's old Word, the angel may spend time concentrating on the Symphony. By doing so he may find clues about the future, and insights into the past. This is not fortunetelling or Last Week TV. It is often uncertain and more often confusing. A roll must be made, the target number being -half- the angel's perception. For each hour spent meditating, the target goes up by one. Follow the Money By following one note in the Symphony, an Angel of Silence may discover who controls any one target. This can be used to find out who a mortal's boss is, what Archangel an Angel follows, or what Prince a Demon kneels before. This requires a simple perception roll, with the check digit showing how detailed a heirarchy the angel will know. (1: Jimbo Demon works for Belial, Prince of Fire. 6: Jimbo Demon has no Word, and is directly controlled by Flamebo Demon, Demon of Plasma Leaks in Jeffrey's Tubes. Above Flamebo is Borgia, Demon of Terrible Starship Mishaps. Above Borgia is Belial, Demon Prince of Fire.) DISTINCTIONS Vassal of Obmutescence The angel may render any one target unable to speak for as many turns as his Etherial forces. Friend of Aphonia A Friend of Aphonia may spend an essence and grant a fellow angel any of his Choir Attunements for as many turns as his Celestial Forces. Master of Taciturnity The Master may use songs without causing a disturbance in the Symphony. RELATIONS Relations with the other angels are understandably strained. There are those who pity him, those who admire him and those who hate him. He acts against no one, but rarely allows himself to be acted against. Allied: Yves. Associated: Janus, Blandine, Eli, Gabriel, Michael. Hostile: Dominic, Laurence. BASIC RITES * Teach someone to think for themselves. * Spend six hours in silent contemplation. CHANCE OF INVOCATION: 0. INVOCATION MODIFIERS +1 A monk, having taken a vow of silence. +2 A quiet house. +3 Ten people making no noise. (Sleeping is acceptable.) +4 An example of subversive pop culture. +5 A monument to Free Will. (The Constitution, Liberty Bell.) +6 A silent city. NOTES ON DUMA Who is Duma? Laurence may be closer than he believes he is. Like Yves, Duma is a direct incarnation of God. However, neither he nor Yves realize it. Duma is God's self-doubt, a part of Him that isn't even sure that He exists. Originally created to be the Symphony in celestial flesh and blood, the Fall caused a great change in Duma. Despite his innate connection to God, a connectiong just as strong as Yves' own, he yearns for Free Will. This is a powerful paradox. Duma demands Free Will from his own Will. He wishes to work outside of the Symphony, when working outside of the Symphony is, itself, such a great restraint. His own servitors must work for Free Will, but would do anything Duma asked of them. Duma's silence is his meditation. He's not yet realized it, but he is slowly coming closer to untying the knot of his mind. When he does, not only will he have a complete understanding of how Silence has a place in the Symphony, but so will the others. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 18:15:03 -0200 From: "Cristiano Guião de Freitas" Subject: Re: IN> New Archangel. Cool idea! i *really* liked it! But your netname "Saint of Killers"... and Duma's history... I guess you are a Vertigo Fan, am i right? By the way, i always wanted to know, how many people on this list read THE comic book for In-Nomine: PREACHER? - --Cris (the Brazilian One) - -- "Ancient spirits of evil, transform this decayed form to Mumm-ra! the ever-living!" ---Mumm-ra, the ever-living ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 15:23:39 -0800 From: The Saint of Killers Subject: Re: IN> New Archangel. Cristiano Guião de Freitas wrote: > But your netname "Saint of Killers"... and Duma's history... > I guess you are a Vertigo Fan, am i right? I do read Preacher, and I did read Sandman, but Duma isn't based on Gaiman's Dumas. It is instead based on Duma, an angel with name recognition in Jewish folklore. He's the angel of the silence of death (or stillness of death), and his name is Aramaic for silence. He was the patron angel of Egypt, and one tradition holds that he is Satan. Then again, Belial is too. 'Course, where there's such a diverse and old bunch of folks like the pentateuchial religions, you're going to find all sorts of different ideas about the same people. I liked my idea of an un-angel more than just another demon. sok ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:07:39 EST From: "PERRY M. LLOYD" Subject: IN> Superior's Hearts I was doing some thinking about celestials' Hearts and was wondering, what's IN Canon on Superior's Hearts? Can Dominic grasp Eli's Heart and find out where he is? Do Superiors even _have_ Hearts? - -Perry Perry M. Lloyd "This place is famous for the creatures of prey that keep upon it." - -Antigonus ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 15:41:40 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts >I was doing some thinking about celestials' Hearts and was wondering, >what's IN Canon on Superior's Hearts? Can Dominic grasp Eli's Heart and >find out where he is? Do Superiors even _have_ Hearts? > My take on this is, 'Superiors do not have Hearts, and don't need them.' Why? (1) If Eli had a Heart, Dominic could very well use it to track him down. (2) If Demon Princes had Hearts, Asmodeus, or any other Prince or Princes, could use them to catch another Prince in a vulnerable position and destroy them. (3) If Superiors have Hearts, the issue of 'Is Janus Valefor, or Vice Versa' would be settled. (4) Who would -keep- the Hearts? What power would make those Hearts -for- the Superiors? Hearts, as I understand the situation, are anchors for those Celestials which can get lost between Heaven/Hell and Earth. Superiors, representing a quantum step up from PC-level Celestials, do not need this anchor, and therefore do not use them. Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 15:22:52 -0700 (MST) From: Kingsley Lintz Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts > >find out where he is? Do Superiors even _have_ Hearts? > My take on this is, 'Superiors do not have Hearts, and don't need them.' Um...ALL of those reasons assume everyone would keep their Hearts out in the open, where just anyone could walk up and use them for whatever. This is unlikely enough in Heaven. In Hell...um, no. I just don't see Malphas keeping his Heart in Asmodeus's sitting room. Consider that even in Heaven, the Hearts are kept in each Superior's Cathedrals, and usually watched over. Superiors' Hearts probably have their own rooms. (Though I also like MaBarry's idea that a Cathedral IS a Superior's Heart. There's some impression from the book {I don't have H&H, of course) that there are multiple Cathedrals per Superior, so it's presumably not canon, but...so? ) So, no. Dominic couldn't just use Eli's Heart, because Eli's Heart is in Eli's Cathedral, and Hearts are very personal things...the Inquisition can't even use the average Angel's Heart without at least SOME kind of permission from their Superior. It'd be scandalous. And of COURSE Demon Princes can't use each other's Hearts against each other. See my first paragraph. That's just silly. And unless Janus/Valefor keeps his right out in the open when no one else seems to have any reason to, that's still fine, too. (Besides, that mystery, logically, should be solved the first time anyone sees him in Celestial form. Personally, I think he has two Hearts.) And, of course, Superiors, as people like Haagenti, Furfur, and Lawrence prove, started out just like everyone else. It's not as though someone has to make a "Superior Heart" for them; they're just Superiors, who have Hearts too. I like the thought that they glow a little brighter, but...*shrug* 'Course, I like the idea that Hearts are a little bit more than a cheap game mechanic for what happens when your Vessel dies, and don't need much thought beyond that...but I'm weird. [Heck, lately, I've even been thinking the Symphony ought to be more than a cheap game mechanic for why people can't just go around spending Essence and singing Songs whenever they want to.] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 17:02:37 PST From: "Alex Diaz" Subject: IN> Re: IN- [DV] Symphony's End Most of the texts I have access to refer to God as the >source of all light and life. Once he has left the building, the music >should stop. >I raised this because I was reading the DV page, and suddenly flashed on >an image of the Angels and Demons battling away in a universe that was >running down, and falling apart around them. Life begins to cease (not >end, just..stop, much to Saminga's puzzlement). Objects begin to >crumble, laws of physics begin to function sporadically, and matter >itself begins to regress back into the void from which it came. >Eventually there are only two Celestials left, clawing at each other in >a vast sea of nothingness... >Gave me a shiver anyway. THIS IS ALL WHAT THAT KULT GAME'S ALL ABOUT. CHECK REALITY OUT. IT BITES WITH THE DEATH THROES OF THE DEMIURGE. JUST A FRIENDLY NEIGHBOUR, FROM THE LAND OF DISCORD ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 23:32:43 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> New Prince (Fezek) I like him! One question though...what's this "Domino Effect" attunement?? Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian (Married to Rev. Unibomber on 11/15/96 - be jealous ;) Meow! - -= Windows 95 =- A 32-bit patch for a 16-bit GUI shell running on top of an 8-bit operating system written for a 4-bit processor by a 2-bit company who cannot stand 1 bit of competition. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 23:40:57 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> Questions philosophical and practical... On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Patrick O'Duffy wrote: > G'day. > Some things I'm wondering about. > > 1. What Song can cure disease? Healing would make sense, but doesn't > make allowances for some diseases being harder to cure than others > (AIDS, cancer etc). Perhaps you could allow the normal Song of Healing to do so, by rolling at a penalty and requiring a certain check digit to work. Also see the Archangel Raphael at the INC (a non-canon AA of Healing who can grant that ability). > 2. How could you _appear_ to cure someone without doing so? In the > adventure I'm working on, demons create a false cure for cancer, and I > want to work out just how they're doing it. Song of Healing that only > temporarily heals? An illusuon using Balseraph resonance or other > methods? Any ideas are appreciated. You've got to check out Nergal, a non-canon Demon Prince of Sickness (again, at the INC). He can grant that exact ability. Otherwise make up a unique Song... > And a point for discussion: How do some Superiors negate the > Symphony? There are a number of Servitors (Calabim of Belial, servitors > of Jordi etc) who get to ignore disturbance in some situations. I don't > care about the mechanics, but this seems to contravene the basic rules > for disturbance, and I wonder how the Superiors get around it. I don't worry about it...in my game, Superiors break rules all the time. Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian (Married to Rev. Unibomber on 11/15/96 - be jealous ;) Meow! - -= Windows 95 =- A 32-bit patch for a 16-bit GUI shell running on top of an 8-bit operating system written for a 4-bit processor by a 2-bit company who cannot stand 1 bit of competition. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 23:50:36 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts On Sat, 15 Nov 1997, Redneck Gaijin wrote: > My take on this is, 'Superiors do not have Hearts, and don't need them.' > > (4) Who would -keep- the Hearts? What power would make those Hearts -for- > the Superiors? God, to both questions. Of course, since God doesn't talk much these days, this doesn't nullify the first three points. - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 23:56:19 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts On Sat, 15 Nov 1997, Kingsley Lintz wrote: > probably have their own rooms. (Though I also like MaBarry's idea that > a Cathedral IS a Superior's Heart. There's some impression from the book Wow. Tell her I'm so impressed by this it's being immediately integrated into my game. > {I don't have H&H, of course) that there are multiple Cathedrals per > Superior, so it's presumably not canon, but...so? ) I'm only partly through H&H, but I didn't get that impression from what I've seen....nor from the main book. I'm curious as to what gave you that impression. > [Heck, lately, I've even been thinking the Symphony ought to be more than > a cheap game mechanic for why people can't just go around spending Essence > and singing Songs whenever they want to.] What? Heretic! Off to Purgatory with you! ;) - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 23:47:40 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts >On Sat, 15 Nov 1997, Redneck Gaijin wrote: > >> My take on this is, 'Superiors do not have Hearts, and don't need them.' >> >> (4) Who would -keep- the Hearts? What power would make those Hearts -for- >> the Superiors? > >God, to both questions. Of course, since God doesn't talk much these >days, this doesn't nullify the first three points. > And where does this leave Demon Princes? Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Nov 97 01:34:21 -0600 (CST) From: kestre1@airmail.net (Andrew Getting) Subject: IN> New Archangel Myrddin, Archangel of Miracles (MUR-thin) The world is a glory, a never-ending spectacle. One of the most important aspects to the Symphony is that mankind must accept God through faith. Still, man is a somewhat selfish beast, as Myrddin himself will tell you, and needs to be prodded along occasionally. A crotchety old Mercurian, Myrddin's appearance belies his true age. Depending on who you talk to, Myrddin is either one of the youngest Archangels around (approximately a millenium old), or an even younger being from some future time, displaced by accident or magical whim. Indeed, there is much unknown to the Host about Myrddin. Most notably, the fact that Myrddin was once one of Belial's most-favored agents in Hell until he went Renegade after befriending a mortal king on a holy quest. Though imprisoned by his lover, a sorceress in service to Asmodeus, he was freed and redeemed through a joint effort between Yves and Gabriel. Using his knowledge of Hell, Myrddin quickly rose in Gabriel's hierarchy, ultimately gaining the Word of Miracles (more easily achieved in days when obvious miracles are rare). Following Dominic's censure of Gabriel, Myrddin was allowed to join the ranks of the Archangels in the hopes that Gabriel would interfere in the mortal realm less if it was officially someone else's domain. Gabriel and Myrddin still work together closely. Existence is precarious for the children of Miracles. They must carefully inspire a select few, so that those may inspire others. No few servitors of Miracles have gone too far, inspiring cults and causing havoc. Myrddin has, however, been giving greater leeway to his followers in recent times, however. Dissonance It is dissonant for a Servitor of Miracles to directly alter the course of a mortal's life. They may inspire a mortal to greatness, and advise said mortal along the way, but any choices made must be done by the mortal. It is also dissonant to create dark miracles, which inspire people toward selfishness. Unfortunately, this is hard to determine before hand. Choir Attunements Seraphim Seraphim of Miracles may assume Celestial Form in full view of mortals without disturbing the Symphony. Doing so forces all other Celestials in the area to likewise assume Celestial form, again without disturbance. Cherubim The attunements of a Cherub of Miracles may not be directly affected by Songs, unless those Songs' check digit are greater than the last attunement roll's check digit. Ofanim Ofanim of Miracles many not be barred entry or exit from any place. Magical wards, electronic locks, Chinese finger cuffs, et al. will fall apart at the touch of an Ofanite of Miracles. Note that using this attunement to free a mortal generates dissonance. Elohim Elohim of Miracles may use their attunement to make an educated guess as to whether any actions they perform will qualify as a dark miracle. While not 100% accurate, no Elohim of Miracles have ever Fallen. Malakim Malakim of Miracles are allowed to harm dishonorable humans freely, gaining no dissonance as long as the mortal is redeemed by the process. Malakim of Miracles are often loaned to Dominic. Kyriotates By their nature, Kyriotates are not allowed to serve Miracles. Mercurians Mercurians of Miracles are rare, as the nature of their resonance compells them to help humans but the Word of Miracles limits such help. A Mercurian of Miracles may, however, show mortals the consequences of their actions via a special attunement. On a successful resonance check, the Mercurian may show a mortal how different their life would be if one crucial action were changed. The higher the check digit, the more moving the experience. Servitor Attunements Transubstantiation For three essence, a Servitor of Miracles may change the makeup of any single substance on a successful Perception roll. Examples include a holy wafer into the body of Christ, lead into gold, or a hamburger into sacred manna. The greater and more valuable the change, the higher the difficulty. While the alteration is permanent, it does not affect living things, nor does it affect form or shape. Divine Grace For three essence, the Servitor seizes a mortal's attention for a moment, during which they and they alone are given a divine vision. The greater the check digit, the clearer and more moving it is. A roll of three sixes indicates that Lucifer has tapped into this particular vision. Distinctions Vassal of Consequence With a full day's meditation, the angel may know the cause of the most recent disturbance in the Symphony in the area. Diviner Once per session, the angel may reroll a failed roll, unless the failure's check digit was a 6. Bearer of the Word Whenever a holy or unholy intervention is rolled, the Bearer is subject to a Divine Grace vision, with either God or Lucifer speaking directly to the angel. Relations A young angel of suspect origin and an alliance with a lunatic, Myrddin's word is his only saving grace in Heaven; none question his importance without absolute evidence. His preference for subtelty and his selective process for determining which mortals to favor does not endear him to many. Allied: Gabriel, Khalid, Novalis, Yves Associated: Blandine, Laurence, Michael Hostile: Dominic (though he is quiet about it) Basic Rites: Take place in a holy rite, with reward variable upon the difficulty of fulfilling it. Thwarting an infernal plot without directly interfering (full essence) Chance of Invocation: 2 Invocation Modifiers +1 a bus that arrived on time +2 holy wafers or wine +3 direct evidence of an infernal plot +4 the sword Caliburn +5 the Holy Grail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 10:01:37 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts > >God, to both questions. Of course, since God doesn't talk much these > >days, this doesn't nullify the first three points. > > > And where does this leave Demon Princes? In Hell. ;) Seriously, DP hearts would be kept by Lucifer. That way they'd be reasonably sure that another Prince wouldn't get ahold of them, and Lucifer would have a way of insuring their loyalty. - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:11:42 EST From: "PERRY M. LLOYD" Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts So, IS there a canon answer to whether or not Superiors have hearts? I've found no answers in IN basic or in Feast of Blades, the only two IN publications to which I have access. - -Perry Perry M. Lloyd "This place is famous for the creatures of prey that keep upon it." - -Antigonus ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 09:59:00 -0700 (MST) From: Kingsley Lintz Subject: Re: IN> Superior's Hearts > > My take on this is, 'Superiors do not have Hearts, and don't need them.' > > (4) Who would -keep- the Hearts? What power would make those Hearts -for- > > the Superiors? > God, to both questions. Of course, since God doesn't talk much these > days, this doesn't nullify the first three points. Depends on where he keeps them. Archangel Hearts I tend to picture being in those upper reaches of Heaven. (And, yes, also within their Cathedral. Given the nature of space in Heaven, there's no particular contradiction there.) ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #473 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.