From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Mar 3 14:44:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by deliverator.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA27558; Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:42:11 -0600 (CST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA00978 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:44:33 -0600 Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:44:33 -0600 Message-Id: <199703031844.MAA00978@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #51 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, March 3 1997 Volume 01 : Number 051 In this digest: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... IN> Couple of IN questions Re: IN> Couple of IN questions IN> A peculiar adventure seed... Re: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... IN> A peculiar adventure seed... IN> release date Re: IN> Saints and Sorcerers IN> Auction Update IN> Shedim and Divine Tethers Re: IN> Some questions.. Re: IN> Some questions.. IN> Fluff - possibly mildly offensive joke (Heaven and Hell) Re: IN> Couple of IN questions IN> Need some help Re: IN> Some questions.. Re: IN> Dom and Azzie, sitting in a tree... Redemption/Extermination of Renegades? (Re: IN> Coolness) Re: IN> Couple of IN questions Re: IN> Some questions.. Re: IN> Shedim and Divine Tethers Re: IN> Auction Update and the Combat System Re: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... Re: IN> Some questions.. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 00:15:55 -0800 (PST) From: Raven <94fa193@dvc.edu> Subject: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... I was watching tonight's 'X-Files', and the whole devil-worship thing of course got me looking at the whole ep in 'In Nomine' terms. Anyway, I came up with an interesting interpretation, and possible adventure seed... A group of people in a semi-secluded New England town, members of the local school's faculty and coming from a long line of Infernal Soldiers, have drifted out of contact with theri demonic patrons, and allowed the practice of their dark religion to slip somewhat. The infernal Tether located in the nearby woods has fallen into disuse, although never really destroyed by the Host because of its low power and back-woods location. Rumors, however, persist about black magic among the locals. A pair of half-drunk teenage guys and their girlfriends go out to the woods one night, to the Tether, with a cheezy demonic invocation ripped from a library book. They hope to simply scare the girls into their arms (and beds, if lucky), but the incantation at the Tether attracts the attention of a Balseraph, possibly the one who had supported the town's cultists in the past. She comes down to the Tether, ritually killing one of the boys and scaring off the other kids. She quickly assesses the situation, and decides the wayward Soldiers need to be dealt with. Harshly. Assuming the Role of a substitute schoolteacher, she finds the class the remaining three kids have together (biology), gets the teacher out of the way by ruining his health, perhaps with a Song, and takes over the class, using her Band's Resonance to convince the faculty that she was hired. At this time, local police are investigating the boy's death. (The GM may choose to write out FBI involvement if he feels it's unneccesary.) As they investigate, the Balseraph again uses her Resonance to implant false memories in one of the two girls, the daughter of one of the Soldiers, memories of ritual abuse, incest, and the sacrifice of the three chilren she bore. The detectives begin to investigate the father. If the PC's do not interrupt her plans, the Balseraph will continue to press as the girl's mind, eventually driving her to suicide, perhaps using the scalpel she uses while making up the dissection project she missed because of her freak-out. This would put in in the classroom after school, where she would be alone, and in proximity to the Balseraph. After that, the girl's father may confess his watered-down occult practices to the investigating officers. If so, he will be dealt with first. Any well-run Balseraph could have a multitude of means of killing him at her disposal; the GM need not stick with the methods from the show. Possibilities include attacking with an animal vessel, using her Resonance or the Song of Possesion to force another to do it, calling in Habbalah or Calabim, etc. The rest of the Soldiers may be driven by fear to renew their practice, and placate the demon with a sacrifice. They may pick the investigating officers, or perhaps one of the other kids at the summoning. If they succeed in capturing them, the Balseraph may use the Song of Possession to cause one Soldier to kill the others in front of the cops, as seen in the episode, or drive each of them to suicide after killing them and leaving enough evidence to prove it was them, or simply destroying them herself whether they succeed or not. In any event, if the Balseraph's plans are unimpeded, the Soldiers will all be dead, as well as a few innocents. She may then attempt to establish a new group of Soldiers, and renew the strength of the Tether. The PC's may be angels trying to destroy the Tether and perhaps redeem the wayward Satanists. Or they may be demons who serve a hostile Prince, and want to sieze the Tether for themselves, or maybe they want the Soldiers alive for their own use. Or, to make life REALLY interesting, the PC's could be the Soldiers themselves! So, whaddya think? a worthwhile adventure seed? Or should I get a life? :) |\ /| | | |~~~ |\ | "It's a hundred and six miles to Chicago, we've |_\ /_| | | |__ | \| got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, |\ | | \ | | | | it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses." | \ | | \| |___ | | "Hit it." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 1997 19:15:43 +1000 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: IN> Couple of IN questions G'day. Just picked up IN NOMINE, think it's pretty cool, and am submitting some fiction sample to SJ soon. Three questions, though, that I can't find answers to in the rules. 1. Do celestials recognize each other? Okay, I know that disturbing the Symphony attracts attention. What I want to know is, would a angel recognize a demon if she met him in a coffee shop? What about another angel? An angel of her own Choir? Or could you be best friends with someone without knowing that they play ball for the Other Side? 2. Does physical damage cause pain/shock effects? This question is less major, since I think the combat system in IN is kinda dodgy, but as it stands, do people have pain effects (like task check modifiers etc) from damage? I know they get shocked if they loose 25% of their HP, and pass out at 0 HP, but do you get a -1 to target numbers if a Balserpah caves your ribs in with a tire iron? What about a mortal being hurt, as opposed to a celestial? 3. How sturdy are the hosts of Shedim and Kyriotates? I'm assuming that the host maintains the same number of Corporeal Forces as normal, but substitutes the Strength/Agility of the possessor. The host would have a Vessel level equal to its Corp Forces, with augmented HP due to the Strength of the celestial. Mind you, that's not spelled out in any place I could find. And if that's the case - what if a Corporeally weak Kyriotate possesses a _very_ physically strong mortal - - would the HP go down? Seems unlikely. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia The crumbled cities stand as known Of the sights you have been shown Of the hurt you call your own Love is suicide SMASHING PUMPKINS, "Bodies" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 1997 05:52:17 -0800 From: Paul Franklin Subject: Re: IN> Couple of IN questions In response to your first question. I believe that celestials would only recognize each other if they make a Perception roll. Paul F. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 05:34:32 +0000 From: "Bodhi" Subject: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... > I was watching tonight's 'X-Files', and the whole devil-worship thing of > course got me looking at the whole ep in 'In Nomine' terms. Anyway, I > came up with an interesting interpretation, and possible adventure seed... GOOD WORK! I loved this, except for one thing. My whole gaming group watches the x-files "religiously". (pun intended). I'm afraid that they'd recognize the story. I'll use this, because it's really quite good, but I'm going to have to change the plot a smidge (who knows... I might pull the ol' switcheroo, and make the father of the incest victim the REAL balseraph, so when they recognize the plot from the x-files, they WRONGLY persecute the female substitute biology teacher... hee hee hee...) Walk in Beauty, Rob Wolff / Bodhi rob@v-wave.com Did you hear the one about the Buddhist Monk who Walked up to the hot-dog vendor and said ... "Make me One with everything!" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 97 07:31:00 -0600 From: Deathdog Subject: Re: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... >Walk in Beauty, > >Rob Wolff / Bodhi >rob@v-wave.com > >Did you hear the one about the Buddhist Monk who >Walked up to the hot-dog vendor and said ... >"Make me One with everything!" This is an adventure seed right here... Buddhist Monks cracking bad jokes. Has all makings of a good In Nomine campaign. *********************************************************** Brad Everman aka Deathdog, Mac programmer & Grammy-Winning Rap Artist "Friday, February 21st: Downloading of pornography on the internet drops by over fifty percent as millions flock to see The Empire Strikes Back" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 07:06:23 +0000 From: "Bodhi" Subject: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... Deathdog wrote a playfully cutting remark about Bodhi's sig file... > This is an adventure seed right here... > Buddhist Monks cracking bad jokes. Has all makings of a good > In Nomine campaign. Deathdog, you absolute cad! I must respond! ;-) First of all, this is a GREAT JOKE! Second of all, Buddhist monks are notorious for their sense of humour! They tend to be some of the happiest guys on the planet. If you hated that one, did you hear about the two cannibals eating the dead clown, when one cannibal turns to the other cannibal and says... "Hey, does this taste funny to you?" Another GREAT JOKE! Um... perhaps Buddhist monks are notorious for their sense of humour for all the wrong reasons... Could it be that we have , well, ... a bad sense of ... Nah! No way! Forget-about-it! ;-P Walk in Beauty, Rob Wolff / Bodhi rob@v-wave.com Did you hear the one about the Buddhist Monk who Walked up to the hot-dog vendor and said ... "Make me One with everything!" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 10:01:14 -0500 (EST) From: AK Subject: IN> release date does anyone know the price and release date for the In Nomine hardcover? thank you kindly. anthony ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 97 11:10 EST From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Saints and Sorcerers [Moriah:] > 3. Death. For celestials, it's just a broken vessel. They might switch >vessels, inhabit another human, or suffer a little Trauma before coming >back. For humans, Death is a Real Big Thing. Heaven or Hell is in store for >them -- and it's supposed to be no more earth for them. Actually, it says in one place (under the stuff on corporeal death, I think, that humans can also get reincarnated or wind up in the Marches. Presumably this depends on the beliefs of the person in question. (Which leaves the open question of what is supposed to happen to us agnostics and atheists....) > But death for these *Saints* should still be a problem. They shouldn't be >allowed to continually incarnate willy-nilly, not worrying about death at >all. So, I propose that for each death, the Saint must make some sort of >roll to not give up the War and ascend to the upper heavens. This will teach >all human PCs never to take death lightly. Death is always a sacrifice for >humans -- it is the final and ultimate moral choice to make. Another possibility is that they don't actually give up the War, but are called to deal with it at another, higher level. The more successful (i.e. powerful) the person, the more likely the call. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: 03 Mar 97 12:02:17 EST From: Moriah - Steve Jackson Games <73407.515@CompuServe.COM> Subject: IN> Auction Update Yeah, I know it's a few days out of date, but interested parties have to see this webpage before bidding, anyway, and thus, will know the current bid. ______________________________________________________________ Lot 6 Be an Angel! Design an In Nomine angel; describe the character; name it with your own name (or something else); we'll fit it into an upcoming supplement. If you like, you can send us your photo for the artist to work from. We reserve the right to playtest the character and to edit anything really disgusting that you try to slip in :-) Current high bid is $200 from Frank Lazar (fmlazar@interactive.net), at 23:56 on Wednesday, February 26. Bid on this Item ______________________________________________________________ Lot 7 Be a Demon! Design an In Nomine demon; describe the character; name it with your own name (or something else); we'll fit it into an upcoming supplement. If you like, you can send us your photo for the artist to work from. We reserve the right to playtest the character and to edit anything really disgusting that you try to slip in :-) Current high bid is $175 from Michael Kosteva (tuba@io.com), at 11:55 on Thursday, February 27. Bid on this Item ______________________________________________________________ - -- end forward -- Peace, Moriah ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 11:56:28 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Shedim and Divine Tethers Okay, so you have your poor Shedite-possessed host. You drag him to a divine Tether (possibly fooling him into believing that he's infiltrating the place). Then you dose the host with sleepy-drug type things. (Or bop him on the head, if anesthetic isn't legit for "knocking the host out.") 30 minutes later, the Shedite has a problem... Demons aren't allowed to approach a divine tether *in celestial form*. But he can't stay in the unconscious host... What happens? Does he manifest and flee screaming (probably with a few celestial-form angels in snickering pursuit)? Does he take damage? Does he get to stay in the host? Does he have a chance to be bathed in the pure light of the divine symphony and get a notion about the value of being redeemed? Or is he simply not able to approach, even in a host-vessel? - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:07:23 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Some questions.. At 12:35 AM +0000 3/3/97, Molt wrote: >Okay, some more generic questions for 'those in the know', and anyone else :) > >- If a Soldier uses a song, does this cause the same sort of 'ripples' in >the Symphony as if a Celestial does the song? I would say yes. >- In the description of the Seraphim's description if seems possible for >a Seraphim to know what the truth of something is even if the person they're >asking has no idea whatsoever! Does this mean a Seraphim and another angel >hunting a demon can find him just by the Seraphim saying "Okay, where is he?" >and the other one replying he has no idea, but the Seraphim getting a check >digit of 6 for the lying check and so being able to say "The Truth is he's >staying at 23 Charington Rd, London, but you didn't know this!"? Hmmmmm.... Technically, that's accurate. But if people started doing that, I, as GM, would start rolling the dice myself, privately... And just wait for that 18 on the dice. >- What would people reckon a humans number of forces NORMALLY are? It says >they're 'five or less'.. does this mean only truly exceptional human would >have five forces, normal humans having less? I would assume that a human must have at least 3 forces -- one Corp, one Eth, and one Cel. They generate Essence and go to the celestial realm when they die, so they must have at least 1 Celestial Force; they dream in the Marches, so they likely have at least 1 Ethereal Force; and they obviously have a body, which gives them at least 1 Corporeal Force... >- Does a character instantly get rites, attunements etc. upon becoming >Word-bound? And are these paid for by CPs, or given to the character >instantly? I don't know how "instant" it would be, but probably fairly soon after it -- especially if it's a particularly strong Word. Since the GM decides if anyone gets a Word in the first place, then at least one rite would probably come as a "freebie" -- or, rather, an alternate reward for exceptional roleplaying. >- How do people think a Lilim would cope with two people calling in >contradictory Hrm? Contradictory what? Geases/Geasa? She'd be in big trouble. Since the Geasa are unlikely to be called in at *exactly* the same time, she might be able to talk the second person into holding off a while, since she's already bound to a contradictory task. Either that, or the nature of the Lilim's Geas means that you can't have more than one at once, if you don't want it? If neither person will release her from the conflicting Geasa, then she probably has to choose which one she's going to accomplish, and take the Dissonance hit. Either that, or she'll have to get *really* tricky and make two conflicting things stop conflicting... Here, one likely finds them writing down the exact words that invoked the Geasa, and trying to find loopholes. Knowledge: Semantics or Knowledge: Law might be helpful here. When Lilim negotiate deals, they probably put in escape clauses to help mitigate these things -- my Gray Lilim (she's sincerely working on becoming a Free Lilim, and is trying to avoid further entanglements with both sides) has pledged not to "interfere with the clientele" of a certain angel-run bar "without permission first," for six months. However, she has left the loophole that, if she gets a contradictory Geas, she can notify the second person that there's a conflict. And if someone tries to conflict, she's agreed to tell the angel who did her the Favor she Geased herself for (though naming no names). - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 97 12:06 EST From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Some questions.. >- If a Soldier uses a song, does this cause the same sort of 'ripples' in >the Symphony as if a Celestial does the song? I believe it's said somewhere that Essence expenditure always causes "noise", so a human using a Song will still cause noise. I'm less sure about the "default" Essence expenditure that humans do unconsciously to improve their luck, though. >- In the description of the Seraphim's description if seems possible for >a Seraphim to know what the truth of something is even if the person they're >asking has no idea whatsoever! Does this mean a Seraphim and another angel >hunting a demon can find him just by the Seraphim saying "Okay, where is he?" >and the other one replying he has no idea, but the Seraphim getting a check >digit of 6 for the lying check and so being able to say "The Truth is he's >staying at 23 Charington Rd, London, but you didn't know this!"? The Seraphim is "tuning into the Symphony" to extract the information, so it's possible. On the other hand, it's not clear how much "Truth" the Seraphim actually should get, especially when it has to do with things not in his immediate vicinity. Note also that frequent rolls to do this sort of thing invites problems from "backfires" and infernal intervention.... >- What would people reckon a humans number of forces NORMALLY are? It says >they're 'five or less'.. does this mean only truly exceptional human would >have five forces, normal humans having less? The average human's characteristics (from the text descriptions of the various characteristic levels) are about 2.5, if I remember right, which translates to an underlying Force value of about 1.25. So an average human should have about 4 Forces. >- Does a character instantly get rites, attunements etc. upon becoming >Word-bound? And are these paid for by CPs, or given to the character >instantly? Getting Word-bound is a long, complicated process. Presumably the various benefits are worked out over time, and then granted when the celestial is bound to the Word itself. I also assume that a Word-bound celestial can invent their own Rites (for their Word). >- How do people think a Lilim would cope with two people calling in >contradictory With great difficulty.... One possibility is to trade the second "call" to another Lilim, paying by taking one (or more) of hers. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:10:00 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: IN> Fluff - possibly mildly offensive joke (Heaven and Hell) Heaven is where the French are the cooks, the English are the police and the Germans are the engineers. Hell is where the English are the cooks, the Germans are the police and the French are the engineers. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 97 12:14 EST From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Couple of IN questions > 1. Do celestials recognize each other? It's fairly clear that the general answer is no. A Seraphim of Yves might be able to tell using physical contact, using his Choir attunement. Of course, celestials may have favorite appearances for their vessels, which means that if you know what they looked like, once, you *might* be able to recognize them, if they kept that vessel's appearance for later vessels. > 2. Does physical damage cause pain/shock effects? It doesn't appear so -- certainly the stories (A Bright/Dark Dream) seem to indicate that celestials, at least, aren't particularly bothered by damage to a vessel (which makes some sense, since vessels clearly aren't "true" bodies). IN's combat system is decidedly cinematic, so leaving out nasty little details like this is probably a Good Thing. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 1997 12:23:22 -0500 From: Hatcher Rhanyr Subject: IN> Need some help Hatcher bows honorably to the folks on this list. Hello All, yes I'm sure you've read this before but guess what?? Your gonna read it again. I'm new to this list after picking up a most anticipated copy of In Nomine at the local hobby shop. I really love the idea. My only problem is that as this is not "the same old style" of game, I'm having problems coming up with an idea for a game. I want to start the PC's out as mundanes who get caught up in everything that is occuring, but what exactly that's occuring I'm not certain of. I do want to use Nicole and Marcus (from the intro story) as kinda a backdrop. However this won't be the focus of the game. If anyone could help me out, I'd appreciate it. The best I've come up with so far reminds me of an Indiana Jones movie (i.e. quest for the Holy Grail or Ark of the Covenant, take your pick) Hatcher Rhanyr "The Intergalactic Sage" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 09:26:55 -0800 (PST) From: durrell@innocence.com (Bryant Durrell) Subject: Re: IN> Some questions.. Elizabeth McCoy writes: > At 12:35 AM +0000 3/3/97, Molt wrote: > >- In the description of the Seraphim's description if seems possible for > >a Seraphim to know what the truth of something is even if the person they're > >asking has no idea whatsoever! Does this mean a Seraphim and another angel > >hunting a demon can find him just by the Seraphim saying "Okay, where is he?" > >and the other one replying he has no idea, but the Seraphim getting a check > >digit of 6 for the lying check and so being able to say "The Truth is he's > >staying at 23 Charington Rd, London, but you didn't know this!"? > > Hmmmmm.... Technically, that's accurate. But if people started > doing that, I, as GM, would start rolling the dice myself, privately... > And just wait for that 18 on the dice. I'd probably deal with this by asserting that the other angel was telling the truth -- he doesn't know where the demon is. Remember, this is all in the context of the person you're asking. If you ask me how to make pancakes, and I give you one recipe, you don't get the One True Pancake Recipe as a Higher Truth out of it. - -- Bryant Durrell (sysadmin, cynic, coyote) | "well, it seems doable so we should durrell@innocence.com / durrell@bofh.net | do it. if we can't then we should http://www.innocence.com/~durrell | get no biscuits." -- tim@meer.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:26:33 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Dom and Azzie, sitting in a tree... At 8:00 PM -0600 2/28/97, James Kiley wrote: >It would be hundreds of times more amusing to me, suddenly, if Asmodeus >and Dominic had been lovers before the Fall. > >Or still were. Hm.... Nah, not my cuppafur. Though perhaps they were "brothers," created by the same Superior, serving together through thick and thin, best friends, double-dated, always together... In some ways, that's even more tragic than lovers-then or lovers-now. Or perhaps one created the other -- parent-child relationship... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:30:41 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Redemption/Extermination of Renegades? (Re: IN> Coolness) At 8:56 PM -0500 3/1/97, JOHN C DYE wrote: >On Thu, 27 Feb 97 23:06:36 -0600 (CST) kestre1@airmail.net (Andrew >Getting) writes: [...] >>Also, aren't Renegades prime targets for Redemption, like >>Outcasts are for Falling? > >You would trust someone even the Other side could not abide? It might depend on whether the demon were one who originally Fell, or whether s/he were created on the "wrong" side, and might actually incorporate (accidentially, one is sure) some chords from the "purer" Symphony. (Maybe Dominic just can't abide anyone who's a turncoat.) Of course, it would take a *long* time to trust a Redeemed Renegade again... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:22:54 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Couple of IN questions At 7:15 PM +1000 3/3/97, Patrick O'Duffy wrote: >G'day. > > Just picked up IN NOMINE, think it's pretty cool, and am submitting >some fiction sample to SJ soon. Three questions, though, that I can't >find answers to in the rules. > > 1. Do celestials recognize each other? > Okay, I know that disturbing the Symphony attracts attention. What I >want to know is, would a angel recognize a demon if she met him in a >coffee shop? What about another angel? An angel of her own Choir? Or >could you be best friends with someone without knowing that they play >ball for the Other Side? If you're not a Seraph of Yves, sure. (My gray Lilim has been muttering, "all the bars in the city, and I walk into one run by angels...") If you don't give yourself away (by spending Essence, or by being too obvious using the results of your resonance), I'd say you can masquerade as a human (or animal!) to your little celestial soul's content. You might have some clues, though -- Seraphim tend to be tall, thin, and a little austere. Ofanim are hyper. Calabim are sloppy and disassemble things. Shedim are always doing Bad Things. Lilim tend to do favors for people. You can also use a resonance to check -- if a Lilim hits a Need that goes "Help this person meet Fate/Destiny," she's got a clue that this is no human she just looked at, and may even know who the other celestial works for. If an Elohite gets a good roll and discovers that someone's in the area is looking for a "mark" to corrupt/Geas/save, then he knows there's a celestial around, and possibly what Choir/Band. Likewise, if a Seraph is sensing truth in someone, and rolls well, they might hear, "I'm Jane Doe," and know the Truth was: "Her name is Areshnet." The Seraph might ask further questions, such as, "Where are you from?" and get "Cleveland" and the resonance says, "Beleth's side of the Marches." (Seraphim are annoying when you're undercover...) > 2. Does physical damage cause pain/shock effects? [...] I haven't seen any rules for this, or for Fatigue, for that matter. Or whether extremes of heat/cold (short of boiling/freezing) bother celestial vessels, or whether they could wander around in a miniskirt and halter top during 40F weather. > 3. How sturdy are the hosts of Shedim and Kyriotates? [...] Hm. I think I'd give Corporeal forces of the Kyriotate/Shedite for all purposes *except* hit points -- and retain the original for this. Either that, or the stress of supporting the celestial entity makes the body more fragile for the duration. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 12:42:27 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Some questions.. On Mar 3, 12:35am, Molt wrote: > Subject: IN> Some questions.. > Okay, some more generic questions for 'those in the know', and anyone else :) BTW, I'm taking on the duties as the 'answer guy' for In Nomine. Some answers might be off-the-cuff and get overruled by The Boss (or his chief servant, Moriah), but in general you can probably trust me. Honest. > - If a Soldier uses a song, does this cause the same sort of 'ripples' in > the Symphony as if a Celestial does the song? Yes. Songs are an essential change in the way 'things should be'. That is why a high-level role can mask Celestial interference and why many angels/devils prefer to use skills most of the time. > - In the description of the Seraphim's description if seems possible for > a Seraphim to know what the truth of something is even if the person they're > asking has no idea whatsoever! Does this mean a Seraphim and another angel > hunting a demon can find him just by the Seraphim saying "Okay, where is he?" > and the other one replying he has no idea, but the Seraphim getting a check > digit of 6 for the lying check and so being able to say "The Truth is he's > staying at 23 Charington Rd, London, but you didn't know this!"? There are two takes on this: 1) That was a piece of badly-worded prose. Perceptive Seraphim have a darn good chance of detecting falsehood, just like the rules say. Roll the resonance as written. 2) That Seraphim get a vague feeling that someone might be lying, withholding information, skirting the facts, etc. But in order to find out exactly what the case is, you have to make the resonance check successfully. Since few people tell 'the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth' each time they speak, there is usually a taint of falsehood no matter what the situation. My take is that you really can play it either way, but that number 1) is the right answer. Seraphim are constantly bombarded by lies, half-truths, and deliberate omissions and this can cloud even their senses. > - What would people reckon a humans number of forces NORMALLY are? It says > they're 'five or less'.. does this mean only truly exceptional human would > have five forces, normal humans having less? Five is a reasonable number for any human that might make a difference in a story. Not exceptional, per se, but 'competent'. Any human with less than five (and definitely less than four!) is incompetent or lacking due to a variety of reasons. Youth and old age are two good examples of this. Most humans start rather small and puny, work their way up to five forces, stay there for most of their life and gradually sink down as they get older. Exceptional humans (over five forces) are on the level with soldiers. They are noticed and quite unusual. Though rare, some humans do have six forces without being directly connected to either the infernal or divine. Higher levels are presumably possible, but long before that *someone* would have tried to recruit such an extraordinary individual! > - Does a character instantly get rites, attunements etc. upon becoming > Word-bound? And are these paid for by CPs, or given to the character > instantly? Though this is not detailed in the book, my take was that you start out relatively weak and work your way up in power. This point of view is supported several times in the text. So, you start out relatively powerless and have to buy what you need. Unfortunately, those costs and procedures are not ready just yet. > - How do people think a Lilim would cope with two people calling in > contradictory favors? Heh. A very, very clever Lilim would try to work it out, somehow, that both are satisfied. More likely she will experience dissonance and possibly discord from the conflicting favors. Other avenues might include trying to re-negotiate the favor so they don't conflict or asking someone else to help resolve the situation (which might involve yet ANOTHER favor being issued). - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 13:00:56 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Shedim and Divine Tethers On Mar 3, 11:56am, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > Subject: IN> Shedim and Divine Tethers > Okay, so you have your poor Shedite-possessed host. You drag him to > a divine Tether (possibly fooling him into believing that he's infiltrating > the place). Then you dose the host with sleepy-drug type things. (Or > bop him on the head, if anesthetic isn't legit for "knocking the host > out.") > > 30 minutes later, the Shedite has a problem... Demons aren't allowed > to approach a divine tether *in celestial form*. But he can't stay in > the unconscious host... > > What happens? Does he manifest and flee screaming (probably with a > few celestial-form angels in snickering pursuit)? Does he take damage? > Does he get to stay in the host? Does he have a chance to be bathed > in the pure light of the divine symphony and get a notion about the > value of being redeemed? Or is he simply not able to approach, even > in a host-vessel? Here's my take on the situation: 1) demons in Vessels (even borrowed ones) can enter a Divine tether because they are shielded by the Vessel. Demons in Celestial form don't have that luxury so cannot enter. 2) Any demon that is tricked or trapped in a divine tether and has to assume their Celestial form is screwed... and hard. Each round the demon will take 1 dissonance (from being exposed to the divine in such a pure form) and will take a Celestial attack that automatically hits. On a roll of 666, the dark forces will shield the demon enough to protect their Soul for one round, but on a 111 the demon has the instantaneous choice between being utterly destroyed or being redeemed. Only demons that were 'wavering' have the second choice at all! - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Mar 1997 12:06:00 -0600 (CST) From: Bob the Dancing Monkey Subject: Re: IN> Auction Update and the Combat System I have to admit...I am impressed. I saw the Build Yer Own Angel/Demon bits in the auction and I didn't think that people would bid as high as they have for those particular lots. $375 combined between the two. Sheesh. On another note, I take it many of you have taken IN out for a test run. How have you been finding the combat system? I've gotten some mixed reports from our Angels in the Field here in Northfield, MN. - -Drew Johnson __________________________[O][O][O]____________________________________________ Drew Cosby Johnson [O][O][B] http://public.carleton.edu/~DJOHNSON/ djohnson@carleton.edu [O][C][O] Ld. Robert Bartholomew Mmm...Nukes... [M][O][O] Gabba-gabba-hey. __________Student Computing Intern____[O][O][O]___Carleton College_____________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 97 12:21:38 -0600 From: Deathdog Subject: Re: IN> A peculiar adventure seed... >First of all, this is a GREAT JOKE! Oh, really? :) >Second of all, Buddhist monks are notorious for their sense of >humour! They tend to be some of the happiest guys on the planet. Yeah, I know. I know *all* about Buddhists, hehehehe. >If you hated that one, did you hear about the two cannibals eating >the dead clown, when one cannibal turns to the other cannibal and >says... "Hey, does this taste funny to you?" > >Another GREAT JOKE! Bad bad bad BAD! I must say this is awful, even though I am laughing kinda hard. >Um... perhaps Buddhist monks are notorious for their sense of humour >for all the wrong reasons... Could it be that we have , well, >... a bad sense of ... Nah! No way! Forget-about-it! ;-P I dunno. Some of those Buddhist jokes are even worse than the hotdog one. At least they're better than the Sikh stories...:) *********************************************************** Brad Everman aka Deathdog, Mac programmer & Grammy-Winning Rap Artist "Friday, February 21st: Downloading of pornography on the internet drops by over fifty percent as millions flock to see The Empire Strikes Back" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Mar 1997 13:04:17 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Some questions.. On Mar 3, 12:06pm, Walter Milliken wrote: > Subject: Re: IN> Some questions.. > >- If a Soldier uses a song, does this cause the same sort of 'ripples' in > >the Symphony as if a Celestial does the song? > > I believe it's said somewhere that Essence expenditure always causes > "noise", so a human using a Song will still cause noise. > > I'm less sure about the "default" Essence expenditure that humans do > unconsciously to improve their luck, though. In general, it doesn't, because such use is very 'unfocused' and is enveloped by the background noise. It's the precise use of essence by someone trained in it that is 'noisy'. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #51 ****************************** The material here is (C) 1996 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.