From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Wed Mar 19 03:35:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by deliverator.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA20003; Wed, 19 Mar 1997 03:35:21 -0600 (CST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA21385 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Wed, 19 Mar 1997 03:38:17 -0600 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 03:38:17 -0600 Message-Id: <199703190938.DAA21385@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #78 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Wednesday, March 19 1997 Volume 01 : Number 078 In this digest: IN> On restoring remnants IN> Archangel of Music (Part 1) Re: IN> Erikel, The Angel of Music Re: IN> On restoring remnants IN> A Demonic goal achieved? IN> Archangel of Music (Part 2) Re: IN> On restoring remnants Re: IN> Angel of Music Re: IN> Angel of Music IN> Musical Words IN> Seneschals and Tethers Re: IN> A Demonic goal achieved? IN> In Search Of... IN> Fundamentalists Re: IN> Fundamentalists Re: IN> Restoring a Remnant? Re: IN> In Search Of... Re: IN> Erikel, The Angel of Music Re: IN> Angel of Music Re: IN> Musical Words IN> Musical Words IN> New demon (lesser) IN> IN + The Primal Order: RPing Superiors? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 14:18:58 -0800 (PST) From: Raven <94fa193@dvc.edu> Subject: IN> On restoring remnants Somebody made some comment about how risky it is to save a soul... (I accidentally deleted the message, and can't recall who.) That statement made me realize something about this whole 'restoring remnants' deal. With all their celestial forces gone, their /soul/ is gone! Quite literally, there's no angel left. Adding celestial Forces to a remnant wouldn't be restoring a brutally wounded angel, even considering how different he'd be; it's creating a /new/ angel with a pre-mde vessel and possible role. For anyone on here familiar with WW's Changeling: The Dreaming: it seems to me that a remnant is like a Fae who's been Undone. The body's there; they have all the memories of their /mortal/ life; but the really important part, the Fae soul, has been utterly destroyed. Even if there was a way to give them a Fae existence again, it wouldn't be the same Fae, and I don't mean in the abstract sense of "he's not the same guy he was before". LITERALLY not the same being. So, this would make the idea of restoring a remnant utterly pointless. The angel who wore that body and lived in that role is long gone, and they'll never get him back no matter HOW many new forces they give him. He's a casualty of war, and the remnant is just a pathetic monument to his past glory. (Ye gods, that was dismal. I gonna need to log off now, and find some way to cheer myself up before I shoot myself...) |\ /| | | |~~~ |\ | "It's a hundred and six miles to Chicago, we've |_\ /_| | | |__ | \| got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, |\ | | \ | | | | it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses." | \ | | \| |___ | | "Hit it." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 11:01:09 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: IN> Archangel of Music (Part 1) Okay, Here's my idea of the Archangel. Note that I only finished her yesterday, so she's probably as unbalanced as hell. Have a read and let me know what you think. - ----------------------------------------------------------------- MELODY - ARCHANGEL OF MUSIC. Melody is relatively young as far as Archangels go. She began her career as an ordinary Mercurian in the service of Blandine. Several hundred years of faithful service passed until she realisedthat humans were becoming more and more obsessed with the concepts of music. Ever since the first humans became aware of banging objects together to make noise, their non-celestial existence has attempted to recreate the Symphony in their own flawed, limited and overall human way. Humans were using music to tell stories , to amuse themselves, to evoke emotions. Their dreams were beginning to become filled with music. Those who lacked the skill or dedication to create their own aquired it in their dreamscapes. Melody petitioned for the Word and after a hard-fought contest with several servitors of Eli (who claimed that music should remain a part of Creation) she was granted the title Angel of Music. Tirelessly she worked for the next millenium, bringing the music of man closer to the music of God. As humans mastered the ability to recreate complex sounds on magnificent instruments, she guided them to performances more closely corresponding to the Symphony. As time progressed, music became an international language. People who could not speak another's language or comprehend their customs could appreciate a common piece of music. In recognition of this advancement of humanity's understanding of each other and to try and keep pace with the importance humans placed in music, God granted Melody the title of Archangel of Music. The 60s and 70s were a boom-time for Melody, as peace movements and flower-power proclaimed the joys of love annd peace through song. Then a minor disaster struck. Thrash, a minor demon of Malphas, had been promoted to Demon of Music and in an extremely lucky break (for Thrash) managed to inspire the punk movement, and capture humans' desire to overthrow their rulers and revert to 'free' chaos. In doing so he not only furthered his Word but that of his master. Through further manipulation, Thrash was able to pervert almost every form of music to deliver Infernal messages. Melody responded to the threat but was a little slower and experienced a lull in power. For his efforts Thrash was promoted to demon Prince. A steady but uneasy truce has existed between the two for the last decade or so, as each tried to consolidate their celestial power, but recently melody has succeeded in filling new music with love and hope, and once again seems to be gaining the upper hand in the music war. DISSONANCE. It is Dissonant for any of Melody's followers to stop any music being played, directly or indirectly. Note that pausing or interrupting music in order to, for example, join in, is not considered to be stopping the music. CHOIR ATTUNEMENTS. SERAPHIM-(the Singers) Gain the ability to tell limited lies through song. They can not directly lie, but are able to use poetic, musical language to express concepts they sing about. For example, a Seraphim singing about love may use lines like "My lover has the brightest eyes I have ever seen," even if this is not strictly true. CHERUBIM-(the Assistants) A Cherub attuned to a musician or a band makes no disturbance to the Symphony with any action or power used to aid the band (eg. acting as bodyguard, singing Songs over members etc.). It is completely the GMs discretion whether something aids the band or not. OFANIM-(the Roadies) Musicians and bands with an Ofanim aiding them rarely have problems with weather, setting up, union strikes, traffic etc. By making a successful Will roll, the Angel's check digit becomes a positive modifier for any roll for the band to successfully hold a concert. ELOHIM-(the Managers) These Angels are natural managers. They are easily able to tell musicians which gigs to play at, what investments to make and which songs sound better.. With a successful Perception roll, thhe Angel will know which choice is the 'best' one (GMs decision). MALEKIM-(the Bodyguards) If visibly protecting a musician or band (just being seen by the crowd), all individuals seeking to bring harm to the band must succeed in a Will roll or automatically 'chicken out' of the action and stop trying to cause harm. KYRIOTATES-(the Conductors) With a Perception roll, the Kyiriotate may move their chosen band (or musician) to greatness. The Angel may possess the band members without fully displacing their minds. All such possessed members may add the check digit of the Angel's roll to the check digit of any performance they do while possessed. ("It was as if the music had taken over my soul!") MERCURIANS-(the Groupies) When a musician or band meets one of these Angels, they feel as if their music is making a difference to the world. They may add 1 to the check digit of any musical attempt (writing, performing etc. They are 'inspired'). - ----------------------------------------------------------------- To be continued.... Just a thought... Leathal Weapon. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 14:38:20 -0800 From: John Subject: Re: IN> Erikel, The Angel of Music Well, the way I see it, Music is Music, whether it's Bach and Handel or Snoop Doggy Dogg... true - different forms and methods and messages - but basically, it's meant to strike an emotional/spiritual chord in the human soul and therefore should be under the domain or Erikel (I like Ruth, but Erikel just sounds a little more (well, sorry to say -- but) musical. Now I am torn about how a Demon of Music would be worked into this... The way I see it, it could be either: a) A Demon who used his influence to destroy musicians and/or their music (Beethoven's deafness (there's a backfired plan)... the plane crash of Buddy Holly, et al., the constant drug overdoses of famous musicians (Jimi, Janis) and so on... -or- b) A Demon who used his influence to counter the "good music"... Townsend smashing his guitar, Snoop Doggy Dogg, Gangsta Rap, and so on. I would be more inclined to choose the former simply because the latter implies too much of a "personal viewpoint of the author" onto the game... my $.02 John ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 17:48:51 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> On restoring remnants At 2:18 PM -0800 3/18/97, Raven wrote: >Somebody made some comment about how risky it is to save a soul... (I >accidentally deleted the message, and can't recall who.) > >That statement made me realize something about this whole 'restoring >remnants' deal. With all their celestial forces gone, their /soul/ is >gone! Quite literally, there's no angel left. Adding celestial Forces to >a remnant wouldn't be restoring a brutally wounded angel, even >considering how different he'd be; it's creating a /new/ angel with a >pre-mde vessel and possible role. I'm not sure that's entirely true -- they still have their Intelligence and Precision, right? (Just no Perception or Will.) So they might have some *memories* that were locked away from their "mere intelligence," memories of things that only a full celestial soul could comprehend. You'd get a different personality, somewhat, but I'd think they'd have some continuity (albeit patchy) of memory. Which means that if the person who knows The Plan gets toasted, you might *want* to take the risk to get him (or his "memetic descendent") back. [...] >So, this would make the idea of restoring a remnant utterly pointless. >The angel who wore that body and lived in that role is long gone, and >they'll never get him back no matter HOW many new forces they give him. >He's a casualty of war, and the remnant is just a pathetic monument to >his past glory. Not back entirely... I'd liken it to a GURPS-style brainwipe, myself: if they managed to stuff the requisite Celestial Forces back into the tattered remnant, there'd be some memories and possibly some continuation of "personality". The result probably *would* be horribly scarred, emotionally and psychologcally, and wind up in Trauma for a while... But there might be some, well, remnants of the former individual. If there's not *something* left, then why don't angels kill remnants (or at least the "vagabond" ones) when they find them? It would be more merciful that way... (Demons wouldn't care about mercy.) But apparently they don't, which suggests that angels consider there's still "something" left of the person, which should be left to live as best it can, and find what comfort it can. Even if it does seem like "walking dead" in the worst possible way. Maybe angels debate this sort of thing amongst themselves... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 16:51:56 -0600 (CST) From: Thany Subject: IN> A Demonic goal achieved? From _In Nomine_, pg. 182: "Most recently, [Vapula] has been recruited by Nybbas to help create a combination computer/television that will draw Essence from those nearby, or accept Essence "broadcast" from some central location, to power the dark invocations of the cathode ray tube. With such an (sic) device, - tentatively dubbed the NC, or "Nybbas Computer" - the Diabolicals' control of humanity might be complete." Then, I see an ad for Matrox Rainbow Runner, proclaiming: "Play PC games on your TV for a true arcade experience. ... Watch or record TV/video on your PC ..." A footnote after this says: "Watching TV on the PC requires Matrox Rainbow Runner TV (sold seperately)." I figure, at the least, there could be an Adventure Seed here. Hm? - -- "Yeah, the book says 'no', but I never read the book!" - Panthero, _Thundercats_ Disclaimer: I babble. A lot. If you don't understand something I said, don't worry, I probably don't, either. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 11:31:46 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: IN> Archangel of Music (Part 2) SERVITOR ATTUNEMENTS. Perfect Pitch- with a Perception roll, the follower of Melody may automatically tell if a note is out of tune and by how much. This power also makes them more sensitive to the music of the Symphony, and they may add their Celestial Forces to any test to detect disturbances. Divine Inspiration- the Angel may take any piece of music and intill in it a message of love, peace and happiness. Regardless of the actual words (which listeners will only vaguely remember) they will feel at peace and content, and will be less inclined to further the cause of selfishness and evil. This power requires a Will roll and 1 Essence for every thousand listeners hearing the music. The exact effects are left to the GM. Servants of Thrash hate Angels with this power and both can often be 'felt' at concerts trying to sway the feelings of the music. For music with a particularly evil or selfish message, a negative modifier may bbe applied to the Will target. DISTINCTIONS. Vassal of the Score - With a Perception roll these Angels may sense musicians and locate them to aid their musical dreams of greatness. Friend of the Music - By succeeding in a Will roll, these Angels can play any instrument they touch, and can even teach this instrument to others (although they must re-make the roll every time they put down the instrument). Master of the Symphony- With a Perception roll, these Angels can sense Celestials moving through the Symphony. Servants of Thrash are their particular targets, and their Celestial Forces to the target number. RELATIONS. Melody gets on well with most of the other Archangels. Some of them treat her with amusement due to her 'young' age as an Archangel. She is not hostile to anyone who appreciates music. She is allied to her former mistress, and with the Archangel of Flowers, as the two worked together to further the hippy movement. Since music is all pervading, she is associated with many of the other Archangels. Allied- Blandine, Novalis. Associated- David (the beat of the earth), Gabriel (music is alive like fire), Marc (there is a lot of money to be made in music), Michael (the harsh sounds of war music inspires soldiers). Neutral- All others (including Charon). Hostile- None. BASIC RIGHTS. *Listen to an entire recording (any form), or attend an entire concert/ live performance. *Jam with someone else for an hour. *Spend an hour browsing the music section of a store. CHANCE OF INVOCATION. 5- Melody has yet to get annoyed with her followers. She loves meeting with them, because they are music lovers like her. Modifiers: +1 Music being played (recorded). +2 Playing own music (any form). +3 A concert with less than 1000 people. +4 A concert with 1000 - 10,000 people. +5 A concert with 10,000 - 100,000 people. +6 A concert with over 100,000 people. MELODY'S CATHEDRAL - THE MUSIC BOWL. This huge open-air music bowl has perfect accoustics and lovely weather. Thousands of human souls and Angels sit, sing dance or whatever to the music that constantly plays. Usually the music being heard is an 'echo' of that coming from the best musicians of Earth, but occassionally deceased musicians who have chosen to remain on this level of Heaven take the stage and play, their beautiful music uncorrupted by mortal limitations. Even rarer, but still possible, some of Melody's more musically gifted Angels will play, greatly pleasing the human souls and their mistress in the process. All around the Bowl are lovely well tended trees, flowers and other plants. All around and in these lie the hearts of Melody's followers, untouched yet admired by her fans. - --------------------------------------------------------------------- So there you have it. That's what I've got for Melody so far, Thrash will be coming soon. Any thoughts or comments? Leath. PS Here are some ideas I have for followers of Melody. They still need to be fleshed out, but their names and Words are listed below. James, Follower of Melody, Angel of Digital Recodings. Elvis, Follower of Melody, Angel of Rock and Roll. Julie, Follwer of Melody, Angel of Live Performances. Just a thought... Leathal Weapon. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 18:16:23 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> On restoring remnants > > So, this would make the idea of restoring a remnant utterly pointless. > The angel who wore that body and lived in that role is long gone, and > they'll never get him back no matter HOW many new forces they give him. > He's a casualty of war, and the remnant is just a pathetic monument to > his past glory. That's the tack that Moriah takes and he's the head honcho for In Nomine right now... - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 18:32:17 -0500 From: "Joseph R. Watt" Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music Patrick O'Duffy wrote: > I dislike that idea becuase it's too subjective. Who's to say where > you draw the line on 'nice' music and 'bad' music, when the effects are > mainly in the listener. Okay... They don't actually have to favor different songs. They favor different aspects. However, for bad music, read studies on the correlation between certain types of music and drinking. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 19:51:34 -0600 (CST) From: fish Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music On Tue, 18 Mar 1997, Joseph R. Watt wrote: > > I dislike that idea becuase it's too subjective. Who's to say where > > you draw the line on 'nice' music and 'bad' music, when the effects are > > mainly in the listener. > > Okay... They don't actually have to favor different songs. They favor > different aspects. However, for bad music, read studies on the > correlation between certain types of music and drinking. Citing unspecified 'studies' isn't really a great argument -- do you have any examples for us? Publications, journals, books? "Goooo to chuuuuurch! Saaaay your praaayers! Tithe! Tithe!" -- fish. | Fish Flowers ><> | | (Malakite of Power Gaming.) (I don't exist.) (Fnord.) | | awflower@midway.uchicago.edu eidolon@io.com | | http://student-www.uchicago.edu/users/awflower/index.html | ------------------------------ Date: 18 Mar 97 22:28:44 EST From: Moriah - Steve Jackson Games <73407.515@CompuServe.COM> Subject: IN> Musical Words Being Word-bound to Speed Metal Music, Rock 'n Roll Music, and Music are all three different Words. We all know who is bound to 'Music' -- it is Barry Manilow. He *is* Music and he writes the Songs. Peace, Mandy ------------------------------ Date: 18 Mar 97 22:28:49 EST From: Moriah - Steve Jackson Games <73407.515@CompuServe.COM> Subject: IN> Seneschals and Tethers >Peter Frederick: >I gotta problem. In a small city, about 5 million people, I want a fair >balance of Tethers. That comes down to 2 Heavenly, 2 Diabolic and 1 a >mystery. You'll see that Austin has close to 20 in Night Music (for now). >But how partisan are Tether Seneschals. If the Tether Seneschals >are servitors of Laurence and Dominic, both of who are hostile to Eli, how >cold a place is it going to be for Servitors of Eli. The Seneschal is an angel whose Word *is* that Tether. The Tether is a reflection of the Word of the Superior who owns it. So, in one way, Seneschal is almost another Distinction (like Servitor, Friend, Vassal, and Master) of that Archangel. The Seneschal is also an angel who is free to think what they want. Obviously, they're not going to be outrightly disobedient, unless they're close to being Outcast; but they're not blind automatons of their Archangel, either. So, let's say that the J. Edgar Hoover FBI building in Washington, D.C. is a Tether of Dominic and a Servitor of Eli comes running in, chased by a horde of Soldiers of Hell. The Seneschal could have had a history in helping Dominic research Eli's 'heresies' and be a real hard-ass and kick the Servitor out to be killed by the Soldiers. Or, the Seneschal could have had no dealings with the case against Eli, but he knows his Master's dislike, so, he helps the Servitor of Eli, kills the Soldiers, and brings the Servitor to Dominic for 'questioning.' Or, the Seneschal could have an underground contact with a Soldier of Eli who's been providing info on local drug rings. And so, when this Servitor comes around, he gives him aid and 'forgets' to put that in his weekly reports to Dominic. Unless he were a Malakite... >Obviously not as bad >as for Diabolical agents whose local tethers are run by servitors of Demon >Princes who are hostile to their Master, but how little comfort are they >going to get from these obvious sources of succor. It's not easy being evil. >Or are the Seneschals operating under a more open policy to work for their >side rather than a particular faction. I guess another slant is to make it >dependant on the personality of the particular Seneschal. Exactly!! While there are stereotypes, there are also individuals. >The other thing that I am hazy about is the power level of the Seneschals. >Are they much bigger than PC starting level? Are their >powers/abilities/Forces tied to their Tether? As was mentioned, their Word is the Tether. This will obviously give them some special Attunements and Rites that come with being Word-bound to any Word. The exact specifics we have yet to work out. For now, treat Seneschals as NPCs and the GM's plot points. Peace, Moriah ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 22:02:15 -0500 (EST) From: Raoul Duke Subject: Re: IN> A Demonic goal achieved? This has nothing much to do with Thany's message, but I am reminded that my History of Journalism textbook says that the guy who invented TV (Philo T. Farnsworth, I think) was regarded by his family as being blessed, and thought of his invention as the product of divine inspiration (He came up with the idea for the hardware while plowing the fields, I believe). The book is far from hand so I'm probably mangling the facts (as befits Nybbas), but the influence of God stuff I remember clearly. An interesting synchronicity or art imitating life? Next, on In Search of... Joe ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 22:09:15 -0600 (CST) From: Thany Subject: IN> In Search Of... On Tue, 18 Mar 1997, Raoul Duke wrote: > This has nothing much to do with Thany's message, Many a true word... hence, the subject line has been made more appropriate in case a discussion should follow. Continuing: > but I am reminded that my History of Journalism textbook says that the guy > who invented TV (Philo T. Farnsworth, I think) was regarded by his family > as being blessed, and thought of his invention as the product of divine > inspiration (He came up with the idea for the hardware while plowing the > fields, I believe). Well, that's all the better, for extra insurance. It's a given that Nybbas would have to give the idea to some hapless human. But, if he believed that the idea came from God, then who would people blame for whatever problems it might cause? (I notice, however, that it hasn't really worked exactly as planned...) > The book is far from hand so I'm probably mangling the facts (as befits > Nybbas), but the influence of God stuff I remember clearly. An > interesting synchronicity or art imitating life? I've found that assuming anything with SJG to be a coincidence is a mistake... ;) > Next, on In Search of... Um. No, this isn't the one with Arthur C. Clarke...which one is? - -- "Yeah, the book says 'no', but I never read the book!" - Panthero, _Thundercats_ Disclaimer: I babble. A lot. If you don't understand something I said, don't worry, I probably don't, either. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 22:14:14 -0600 (CST) From: Thany Subject: IN> Fundamentalists Whose side are THEY really on, anyway? Personally, I don't think either side is willing to claim responsibility for them, but both report them as a great success. - -- "Yeah, the book says 'no', but I never read the book!" - Panthero, _Thundercats_ Disclaimer: I babble. A lot. If you don't understand something I said, don't worry, I probably don't, either. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 22:33:02 -0600 (CST) From: Corey Subject: Re: IN> Fundamentalists I concur, I was just dialing through the radio, when I caught something about cyberporn, so of course I stopped to listen. I had found a christian station who was torn between their hate of pornography and their fear of the "liberal government". While I accept the right of every man to his/her point of view, I feel that occassionally some of them are a bit overextended. But to relate this to the game, I feel that they can be used by both sides, I'm sure Laurence has many Soldiers, and well probably Andre too, sorry that was low, true but low. (The truth hurts, sure not like jumping on a bicycle with the seat missing, but it hurts) I heard the tongues of angels And the tongues of men Wasn't any differences to me Bob Dylan "Dignity" On Tue, 18 Mar 1997, Thany wrote: > > Whose side are THEY really on, anyway? > Personally, I don't think either side is willing to claim responsibility > for them, but both report them as a great success. > > -- > "Yeah, the book says 'no', but I never read the book!" - Panthero, > _Thundercats_ > > Disclaimer: I babble. A lot. If you don't understand something I said, don't > worry, I probably don't, either. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 23:51:28 -0500 (EST) From: "Michael C. Nutt" Subject: Re: IN> Restoring a Remnant? Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >It might be *very* hard to do, and leave the Archangel vunerable -- >not only do they have to restore Forces, but they have to do it >*ON EARTH*! They can't just grab the person and yank them up the >nearest Tether to work on them in Heaven until they've restored >at least one Celestial Force. It might indeed be hard to do... but they *owe* it to the ones who have suffered so much in their service, it seems to me. >And it's gotta be *noisy* as all getout -- a pyrotechnic show in >the Symphony that echoes across a midwest state or two, say, >since the Archangel is likely using the full power of the Symphony >to reweave the tattered parts of the Remnant's soul. Well, that's why I mentioned the bit about the "person" being *gone*... they might justify not doing it by saying that, "The one who served me is dead... the shell remains, but it's not *him*." >Which doesn't mean that it might not be tried, but it would probably >be a *risky* move. If a Demon Prince were using a remnant as bait, >he could run in while the Archangel was busy, and start dismembering >the Archangel... Have to be an awfully *brave* Demon Prince to try it, especially since an Archangel is likely to set up stout defenses before trying anything that difficult. And Demon Princes aren't exactly known for being willing to take anything approaching even odds... they seem to much prefer a good old-fashioned gang-stomp on their own turf, IMO. >Charity is all well and good, but if an *Archangel* gets turned into >a Remnant -- that's no good to anybody. Well, like I said above, I think he'll look to his defenses first. I don't imagine there are too many Remnants floating around, either, and since they're so difficult to trace, they probably get handled on a case-by-case basis. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 00:10:49 -0500 (EST) From: Raoul Duke Subject: Re: IN> In Search Of... On Tue, 18 Mar 1997, Thany wrote: > On Tue, 18 Mar 1997, Raoul Duke wrote: > > This has nothing much to do with Thany's message, > > Many a true word... hence, the subject line has been made more > appropriate in case a discussion should follow. Which it has. Now that someone's stroked my ego by replying (okay, so I'm easy to please), I'll get out that textbook and post exactly what it said tomorrow. > Continuing: > > > but I am reminded that my History of Journalism textbook says that the guy > > who invented TV (Philo T. Farnsworth, I think) was regarded by his family > > as being blessed, and thought of his invention as the product of divine > > inspiration (He came up with the idea for the hardware while plowing the > > fields, I believe). > > Well, that's all the better, for extra insurance. It's a given that > Nybbas would have to give the idea to some hapless human. But, if he > believed that the idea came from God, then who would people blame for > whatever problems it might cause? > (I notice, however, that it hasn't really worked exactly as planned...) I'm not sure if your parenthetical comment refers to Nybbas's "divine" ruse or to inventing TV as a whole. Let's face it; TV has its good points but is definitely a feather in Nybbas's cap. Nybbas is probably my fave Prince, being a prospective journalist... I can understand why Lucifer would grant Nybbas a Princedom, but why over the Media in general? Didn't anyone have a hand in perverting print and radio? If there were Demons of Radio or Newspapers (or the Movies), wouldn't they be a bit cheesed off by Lucifer's handing this upstart the whole package? Might be an adventure seed there, uppity subordinates of Nybbas that are older than he is, scheming to swipe his authority out from under him. > > > The book is far from hand so I'm probably mangling the facts (as befits > > Nybbas), but the influence of God stuff I remember clearly. An > > interesting fnord synchronicity or art imitating life? > > I've found that assuming anything with SJG to be a coincidence is a > mistake... ;) > > Next, on In Fnord Search of... > > Um. No, this isn't the one with Arthur C. Clarke...which one is? That's ACC's Unexplained World, I think. INS (hey, interesting acronym) was hosted by Leonard Nimoy and is much much cheesier, making it a more appropriate invocation for Nybbas, considering he actually *enjoys* manifesting as a game-show host... Joe ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 00:13:48 -0500 (EST) From: Raoul Duke Subject: Re: IN> Erikel, The Angel of Music On Tue, 18 Mar 1997 IQJason@aol.com wrote: > a 'plague' across music? And, although we've seen Angels encourage murder, do > you really think one would promote suicide? Yes. Night Music's supposed to include a very stressed-out Angel of Teenage Suicide. I suppose he could try to *prevent* it, but that's not very complex. Can't wait to see that one.... Say, does Derek still read the list? Joe ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 00:17:15 -0500 From: "Stephen B. Mann" Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music > I dislike that idea becuase it's too subjective. Who's to say where > you draw the line on 'nice' music and 'bad' music, when the effects "Good music" is the music you listen to for the purpose of education, soothing of savage beasts, innocent entertainment, etc. "Bad music" is music used for propaganda, mind control, to enrage savage beasts (riots spawned from a thrash metal song about killing your parents, etc), ad nauseum. All this is, of course, IMO. - -- Stephen B. Mann sm6439@cnsvax.albany.edu Webmaster Center on English Learning & Achievement http://www.albany.edu/cela ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 00:25:32 -0500 From: "Stephen B. Mann" Subject: Re: IN> Musical Words > We all know who is bound to 'Music' -- it is Barry Manilow. He *is* Music > and he writes the Songs. Booo, hissssss! - -- Stephen B. Mann sm6439@cnsvax.albany.edu Webmaster Center on English Learning & Achievement http://www.albany.edu/cela ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 01:24:50 +0000 From: "Bodhi" Subject: IN> Musical Words Moriah wrote... > We all know who is bound to 'Music' -- it is Barry Manilow. He *is* Music > and he writes the Songs. Well, now it is finally settled. Moriah is definitely a Diabolical. Nobody even remotely understanding the Idealistic concepts of Truth, Beauty and Goodness could say something like this ;-) Beware, my friends. Beware!!! Walk in Beauty, Rob Wolff / Bodhi rob@v-wave.com Nicholas Copernicus, Master Astronomer Stood up and Shouted, addressing the throng, "Abandon poor Ptolomy, Stand up and follow me, Heliocentrically, Ptolomy's Wrong!!" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 97 10:33 CET From: Marco Lambert Subject: IN> New demon (lesser) Hi everybody, I want to introduce you to Ribesal, Demon of satire. I hope you will find this fellow ehh well amusing ? Sory for the bad english. Everybody woh wnts to put this charkter in some archive would do me a great pleasure. He/She should be free to correcct my misspellings. DISCLAIMER: I want not to say that satire and caricature is bad or demonic. If there is none you are living in a very oppressed society. But I want just show you how this could become a fine tool for the more subtle demons. Bye and thanks to everybody on the list for submitting their ideas. Tschuess, Marco. RIBESAL, Demon of satire. „Do you remember the last time you heard the bad joke about the young men who want to become a catholic priest, just like his father ? Now your are sitting in mass and the guy in black talks to you about the sin of flesh. What does he know of the pleasure of flesh, perhaps even too much. Why is he trying to make his guilt and complexes your own ? Well, you can only laugh at him. Forget about his rubbish you will do it your way, he has no more moral authority over you.“ „There was a little picture in the newspaper showing the gouvernor proclaiming that he raised a million from the state funds to build shelters for the homeless. But in his back you see the building contractor and that is his brother. Later when the elections are held, somebody vows to better the lives of the poor and you remember the only persons who will be better of is he and his familie. So you decide not to vote for him and his plans.“ Ribesal is a known servitor to Kobal, who gained the word satire resently.His work is mainly to denounce all authorities and respected people. Therefore he uses songs, poetry, caricature and performances all to reduce the respect people have for their leaders and societies. A special friend of Riebesal are the churches, which he constantly harrass. As much the people lough at the church, as much they loose the confidence to the church beeing a institution of moral authority. Ribesal: Impudite of Kobal Forces : 12 ; 4 each corp, ether, celest. STR: 6 ; AGI: 10 ; INT: 8 ; PRE: 8 ; WIL : 10 ; PER: 6 He has a Vessel/4 with the Role of Journalist (Status/4), known for his satirical articles and caricatures. He appears mostly as the smart, young, successful freelance journalist, who is invited to many if not all VIP parties. Skills: Comp Oper /3 , Lying /5 , Savoire Faire/3 , Writing (Newspaperarticle or small mockerey)/4 , Artist/5 , Fast Talk/3 ... Songs: Motion(cor)/2 , Possesion/3 , Tongues(all3)/3 , Shields(cor)/1 (eth)/2 , (cel)/1 Discord: Merciful/1 He is Knight of Derision and Captain of Repartee. Attunements: Prank , Impud. of D. Humor , Habbalah of D. Humor In resent years he worked together with servitors of Nybbas and has even got some reward for inventing some satirical and cynical talkshows. So he now is also Knight of influence, and has the sublimial attunement. He also created the following new attunement: Sticky joke: With this you can give someone or some institution a bad reputation (Examples see the beginning). First draw a picture, perform a parody or write a text. If succsessfull then the check digit halved (round UP) is the nagtive social modifier the victim gets from the first 13 persons who see, hear... this satirical work and fail the will role. This effect lasts for check digit weeks. The affected people continue to spread this to other people. But for the second hand hearer, spectator... the social modifier is reduced to -1. So after some telling around the joke looses his effect. Live performances on TV do work also, but they do not attract more victims. ________________________________________________________________ Marco Lambert (Dipl.-Phys.) * Universitaet Kaiserslautern * Email:lambert@rhrk.uni-kl.de Fachbereich Elektrotechnik * Tel.:(+49) 631/205-3354 Lehrstuhl fuer Mikroelektronik * Fax.:(+49) 631/205-3616 Postfach 3049 * D-67653 Kaiserslautern * Geb.: 12 Raum:262 Germany * ________________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Mar 1997 01:34:27 -0800 (PST) From: Raven <94fa193@dvc.edu> Subject: IN> IN + The Primal Order: RPing Superiors? While my knowledge of the details is sketchy at best (how Socratic of me to confess my ignorance :), I have heard some stuff about a book called 'The Primal Order' (TPO). It's what's known as a capsystem, a pseudo-RPG system that's designed to be played over another system. Essentially, TPO is designed to bring gods into a fantasy game with some level of detail, even to the extent of roleplaying them as characters. I've been wanting to get a copy for some time, but something else (usually SJG or WW) usually catches by eye and wallet. Now, with IN out, and seeing how much the concept of divinity is integral to the game, maybe I should actually buy it for real next time I get money (which shouldn't be more than a few months after IN 2nd Ed. comes out :), especially when I realized that, theoretically at least, TPO could be used to play Archangels and Demon Princes. Not knowing the system, I can't say for sure how well it would work, if at all, but I like the idea. So, does anyone on this list know any more about TPO? If so, I'd love it if you would share your knowledge, either on the list if it's relevant (especially to this thread), or in private email if not. Also, any web pages you know about that have information on or for TPO I'd love to hear about. |\ /| | | |~~~ |\ | "It's a hundred and six miles to Chicago, we've |_\ /_| | | |__ | \| got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, |\ | | \ | | | | it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses." | \ | | \| |___ | | "Hit it." ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #78 ****************************** The material here is (C) 1996 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.