From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Jan 5 20:27:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA15333 for ; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 20:26:59 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id UAA08355 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 5 Jan 1998 20:19:02 -0600 Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 20:19:02 -0600 Message-Id: <199801060219.UAA08355@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #549 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, January 5 1998 Volume 01 : Number 549 In this digest: Re: IN> Fwd: What 'he' finally did... Re: IN> Headaches Re: IN> Angelic Player's Guide Nitpicks RE: IN> Who are you, anyway? Re: IN> Headaches Re: IN> Seattle for Celestials (was Re: Headaches) Re: IN> Forces as Game-World Objects Re: IN> Losing your wings? Re: IN> Headaches Re: IN> Fwd: What 'he' finally did... Re: Anime off-topic (Re: IN> IN Anime movie trailer : 2) Re: IN> Remnants Re: IN> Forces as Game-World Objects Re: IN> Seraphim and Roles IN> IN historical Re: IN> Headaches Re: Anime off-topic (Re: IN> IN Anime movie trailer : 2) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 15:11:42 -0800 (PST) From: Querent Subject: Re: IN> Fwd: What 'he' finally did... Evolution possibly? Clearly Extinction is a subset of Death. (The cesation of life of an entire species, compared to the cesation of life, period.) If the act of extinction is the death of an entire species, it's antithesis would be the creation of an entire species. Barring divine intervention, this usually takes the form of evolution. "Look at this Steve, just like the North American Mollusk Sharkworm, but do you see the cavitation in the surrounding soil caused by the respiratory process? By golly I think we've just found a whole new species!" Or, possibly Conservation. Saving the species vs. destroying the species. Heck, the Angel of Endangered Species and the Angel of Species Evolution are probably BOTH picking on the poor Demon of Extinction. - ---Dataweaver wrote: > > what would the opposite of Extinction be? > == --Querent USELESS FACT: Why are the command centers on submarines sometimes cloaked in red light? No, Red Alert is not the right answer. Stop watching Star Trek. In daylight hours, the command center is lit normally, but at night, the only lights are red to dilate the pupils. That way, if the periscope is needed, the crew's eyes are already adjusted to the lack of sunlight. _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:38:06 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Headaches At 10:57 PM -0500 1/3/98, Brandon Quina wrote: >> Why am I not surprised? The Game will probably bet on nearly >> anything, and Destiny has an inside track... Who *did* win? > >::Grins:: Ive currently got a Mercurian of Judgement who enjoys >going around and 'punishing' the guilty who escape through the >cracks of the US Justice system. Oh, dear. I think my "I'm Only Renegade If They Catch Me" Lilim would *like* him. (This *is* the Lilim who, when Gabriel burned down a demonically-run strip joint, said, "I like her style." She got a Gabriel-Rite later, too.) >The other players-- expecially our Renegade 'Wanna-be-Angel' Lilim >are scared to death of this guy. :) The Lilim is mostly scared of >him cause A: He serves Judgement, and she is a Lilim. B: He tends >to get alot of Disturbance going when he gets in his 'avenge' mode. I think mine is immune to Judgment now, for the most part. We have some Creationers based in the area, and a handy Destiny Tether -- they come down and do sweeps of everyone they know about. Nosy busybodies. Of course, for several months, the triads really did freak mine... >> Oh, geeze, and here I am with the Renegade who won't raise her Forces >> because she already makes *plenty* of noise shifting vessels, thank >> you very much... (She did raise her characteristics a bit, though -- >> Will 7, Perception 8, and we start on the physical ones next.) > >::Grins:: Disturbance is cool. Our lil Servitor of Judgement >ranks up quite abit of it while punishing the guilty. Tsk! >Question: If someone creates alot of disturbance, then uses >the Celestial Song of Motion to 'teleport' away, does he pretty much >avoid being tracked down?? It's a GM call. The segment on disturbance in the book says that echoes can lead people to the place, the person, or both in succession, at the GM's option. Another way to work it is to say that the CelSong of Motion causes disturbance at *both ends* (leaving and arriving). And, to make it really evil, let it cause the Song's disturbance *PLUS* the disturbance he was fleeing from! (The Symphony was being warpled anyway...) Those are all GM options, depending on what he wants his celestials getting away with. >> Oh, they're loads of fun. Take one >> into Feast of Blades. Take a Kyrio of Lightning who searches the >> house wall by wall. Heck, there was enough noise, they decided to >> get the Ofanite inside while the party was going on... > >Hehehe :) > >Mercurian of Judgement, Elohim of Creation, Kyriotate of Michael >Renegade Lilim (formely of the Game), a Remnant, and Malakim of Swords. Oooooooog! Cool. Tell me about this sometime, hm? >One quick question: How would a renegade demon go about getting >a superior? Expecially if nobody in the game (currently, atleast) >serves that superior.. Hm. Basically, you decide that the character is ready to ask; since nobody in the campaign is currently serving that Superior... Probably have to find an associated or allied or at least friendly Superior (or Tether thereof) and have a message sent. *NOVALIS*? In a bunch of war-faction except for the Creationer??? EEEP! Hm. Might actually have the best luck with the Judgment, depending on your view of them. Whether they *like* Novalis or not, they're pretty fair. From their point of view. There's a lot of stuff about Redemption in the IPG, when that comes out... And what Asmodeus does to redeemed traitors he catches. >Another quick question: If a character does get a word (this >hasnt come up yet, but it might) can he get servitors? Do they get >access to his rites?? Can he give them attunements?? A Wordbound may attract servitors (if not Servitors). He can give them access to his particular Rite(s). Attunements? I think the current canon is a little dubious about it. If he *has* Servitor attunements, then maybe; not Band/Choir attunements, though, I think... Lemme get back to you on that. Subject: Re: IN> Angelic Player's Guide Nitpicks At 11:22 PM -0500 1/3/98, Brandon Quina wrote: >> The other trick is that a Seraph does *not* need to answer the >> question that was asked. If you ask, "How old are you?" and the >> Seraph says "Fish", then there's no dissonance. > >Isnt that just abit silly. I mean. The other examples you have >given seem fine, but what does 'Fish' have to do with how old the >Seraph is.. Nothing! But a Seraph doesn't *have* to answer questions. Non-sequators are just fine (so long as they aren't an *answer* -- you can't answer "what is 7 x 6" when the question was "how old are you"...) >Maybe "This body is 23 years old." Or "Its impolite to ask a lady her >age." Or "Old enough to know better, young enough to do it anyway." >Or "Old enough to be your grandfather! " :) Those are all fine, yup! Or, "Oh, let's see what my driver's license says... Says here I'm 42.") >> So if you ask, "What's your job?", the Seraph may say, "The folks at >> the bar pay me to come in and sing." And, if they have a Role with >> a job, they *can* say, "I was hired to do [x]," or even just "I do >> [x]" (ommitting the "When I'm not busy smiting evil" part). > >"What do you do, hon?" "Im a Seraphm in the Service to Creation who >is currently on the trail of a Shedim of the Game. I also sing and >dance at the bar across the street. Yourself?" Yes, well, that's probably more than some people need to know... >Question Everybody.. If you were a non-mundane thing in >the In Nomine universe, what would you be?? Yes, well... Everbody *knows* what I am. [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:25:04 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: RE: IN> Who are you, anyway? On Mon, 5 Jan 1998, Steven Feldon (Exchange) wrote: > > lore@tmgbbs.com writes: > Why does everyone serve the Big Words? :/ Not everyone. I am a happy Servitor of Archives.... Jockying for the Word of COntinuity Tracking, too. - -- Casca, Seraph of Archives (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:50:21 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Headaches At 11:58 PM +0000 1/3/98, Nathaniel Eliot wrote: >> >cool. other people have games like mine. i was worried it was >> >something in the water >> >> No, it's something in the ink on the In Nomine pages. > >Well, if you don't chew on the pages... It's a skin-contact agent. What do you think those borders at the top and bottom are for, anyway? (What, is this thing going to the list? Um...) >> (Or, in the other game, Free Renegade Lilim not yet in service to >> Lightning, Kyrio of War, strange human private investigator, and >> Ofanite of Litheroy. The Lilim is *still* the only sensible one.) > >Sez her player. What's so insensible about Saphreal? Saphreal the spy (how many people does she follow around? Some people bug others; Saph hides rats and cats and chipmunks in their area!), and then there was the "I got an evil Vapulan drug!!" bit... O;D Squabbling with one's Malakite mentor might have been a bit... bouncy as well. [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:25:49 EST From: MarkDEddy Subject: Re: IN> Seattle for Celestials (was Re: Headaches) In a message dated 1/5/98 2:25:40 PM, djohnson@atlas.socsci.umn.edu writes: >At 03:33 PM 1/5/98 -0500, you wrote: >>The tethers I have made up for the Seattle area are all actual >>buildings/locations. >>For obscure reasons, most of them are on or near the University of >Washington> > >>campus. >> >>Side o' Light: >> > >Excellent, Mark. Except that you forgot a few important Angelic tethers. > >Children: Gasworks Park on Lake Union - a power/gas plant turned into a >pastel playground for children. And the greatest place to fly kites in >the >world. > >Trade: Pike Place Market - food, crafts, magic tricks, magazines...you >can >find almost everything there. > >Fire: Mt St. Helens - Gabriel's big blow-off of steam in 1980... > >-Drew Thanks. I'll be using these. Mark. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 17:53:30 -0600 (CST) From: Dataweaver Subject: Re: IN> Forces as Game-World Objects On Mon, 5 Jan 1998, Querent wrote: > Certainly the difference could be told (provided some method other > than simple perception were used.) But never would a quantifiable > amount be used. I can look at the person next to me, and say "Gee, > he's much stronger than I am" but I'd be hard pressed to say "Looks > like he's got 3 more points of Strength than I have." > > Provided the observer had a means to discern the amount of > forces/essence, the difference would be relational, not quantitative. Playing devil's advocate here... If this is true, why does the IN rulebook state that a "free Lilim" owes Lilith nine Favors - _one for every Force he/she has_? - ---- Jonathan Lang ---- x ------- alias: Dataweaver --------- Webpage: http://www.io.com/~traveler /@\ The Dogma of Otherness insists GURPSnet's Benevolent Tyrant for Life ~~~ that all voices deserve a hearing, FAQ: http://www.io.com/~ftp/GURPSnet/www | that all points of view have Archive: http://www.io.com/~ftp/GURPSnet | something of value to offer. submit new files to gurpsnet-files@io.com | --David Brin, "Otherness" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:26:20 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Losing your wings? At 2:33 PM -0500 1/5/98, Jack of Spades wrote: >[...] I have a 9-force >Malakite who got into celestial combat with a Calabite - and lost a force. > Do I now have an 8-force Malakite, or a Reliever who used to be a >Malakite? Any ideas on this one? I would say that you have an 8-Force Malakite. His Forces were already attuned to the theme of the Malakim, it pervades his entire nature, whether he was created Malakite or whether he fledged Malakite from being a reliever. Of course, your GM may always choose differently, especially if a Superior were the one doing the Force-stripping. But since I *really* hate the idea of someone Force-stripping a Malakite and then having it re-fledge as something else... O:P Can of *worms*! [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:17:57 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Headaches At 10:31 AM -0500 1/5/98, MarkDEddy wrote: >In a message dated 1/3/98 7:06:58 PM, emccoy@nh.ultranet.com writes: > >>>This reminds me... >>>In my game, our seraph of Laurence got into a duel with a Calabite of Baal. >>>In a parking garage. Directly beneath Yves' tether in Seattle. Less than >>a >>>quarter mile from Asmodeus' Tether. The two Seneschals showed up to the >>>fight, and ended up placing side bets. >> >>Why am I not surprised? The Game will probably bet on nearly >>anything, and Destiny has an inside track... Who *did* win? > >The Seraph. Because he had a third vessel. It was very close. And very >noisy. Well, at least the Seneschals had something to watch... >What I didn't mention was that the Seneschal of Yves' assistant is a >Elohite of Archives. Ooooo! >And was holding the bets. (Any puns about bookies you >just thought of are my fault...) :} Owch! Throw the book at this person...! > Mark(Maybe I should do a guide to Seattle and environs for In Nomine...) (Settings part of the INC, right here. After I recover from the 400 messages, including some with short fuses...) [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:13:39 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Fwd: What 'he' finally did... At 10:06 AM -0500 1/5/98, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >I think that, in large part, the unpopularity of cats is just >a random fluctuation of "fashion." Other details that might >contribute to their unpopularity include: > > - They are nocturnal and stealthy, always a bit unnerving. > - They are predators. (Never mind that this is their utility. > Rationality has no place here. Think of "good" mice and "bad" > cats on cartoons.) Humans root for the underdog. (Me, I watch nature programs about lions taking down grass-eaters and don't flinch at the bloody jaws...) > - They don't play the dominance/submission game, like horses and > dogs do. Personally, I think this is the main reason they are > disliked by most of the people who dislike them. Cats play dominance/submission games all the time. They're dominant, the human is their cat-slave... (And then there's Choplicker, who is a dog in a cat vessel...) One just needs to know how to read the cat bodylanguage. It's more subtle than a dog's, when it comes to human-cat relationships. emccoy@nh.ultranet.com, Uppity Wynch http://brie.bmsc.washington.edu/people/merritt/books/Eye_of_Argon.html "rumoured to contain hoards of plunder, and many young wenches" Mike [falsetto]: "We're tired of these degrading patriachical slurs! From now on we demand to be called 'wynchys.'" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 20:27:57 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: Anime off-topic (Re: IN> IN Anime movie trailer : 2) At 11:17 PM -0600 1/3/98, rogue@ez-net.com wrote: >IN Cast List >OK, moving on. I know this is gonna sound ignorant, but I'm just a poor >backwater demon with no experience in this particular area... > >... so can anyone recommend some good anime for me? Preferably IN-relevant, >but anything good would be appreciated. My town is only 5000 people (about >4,985 of which are non gamers, and 4,985 of which have never even *heard* of >anime), so I've never had much chance to see it. The limits of my >experience include Vampire Hunter D, one episode of Tenchi, half of Akira >and a bit of Battle Angel (at Gencon two years ago.) Oh My Goddess. Maybe more Tenchi if you cross your eyes (it starts making more sense around the 5th or so episode, and it's a fun ride). There might be Wicked City, which has Shedim porn in it *and* Djinn-porn (I kid you not), but I don't know because I only ever saw the non-subbed, non-dubbed version, and started somewhere in the middle, so I haven't got a clue what it's *really* about -- but it looks like a lot of demons running around playing with humans. Definitely not an entirely nice film. For simple coolstuff... Ranma 1/2, definitely. Kimagure Orange Road (psi powers, love triangle...) El-Hazard: alternate world stuff, very neat. Shayla-Shayla is a Malakite of Fire! Neon Genesis Evangelion! Illuminated! Things called "Angels"! A starting theme song that is really cool! Rei! (Rei *rules*. I love that character.) Slayers (for a lot of Silly *D&D kinds of things, though Nathaniel was less thrilled than we) Bubblegum Crisis is okay; go Silia go! (So, is she an Elohite?) Bubblegum Crash... could be better. A.D. Police Files is very artsy in some ways; if you liked Ghost in the Shell, this might appeal, too. Same world as BGC, above. Cutey Honey (Lots of fan service! Kekko Kamen (Lots of fan service!) La Blue Girl ("Japornamation"/"Pornime") would be better if it didn't have that stupid Nin-nin thing. Yeesh. Demons and "sex-craft" ninja and all sorts of silliness. Devil Hunter Yohko! (A Soldier with a Relic...) Battle Angel, for some obscure reason, I really like. Gory. Warriors of the Wind is an evil, awful dub-job -- but the music and plot and characters and art just sucked me in. Ushio and Tora: a story of a boy and his demon. Tora is a Djinn and and I *adore* him. They Were 11: the manga is better in some ways, but the food-fight in the anime is cool. This is a very character-based thing. Princess Minerva: an astounding amount of plot for something with so much fan service... Something about a magical carpet that I can't remember the name of right now, but which gave us the idea that magical power is in inverse proportion to intelligence... Magical Twilight is more pornime, and was cute. Dirty Pair: some are better than others. Do not expect plot in all cases. (Some have it, some don't.) Expect massive amounts of destruction and some fan-service. PatLabor: Reading both the manga and watching the anime is best. Dominion: Tank Police -- worth it to understand Dominican Tank Police! Phantom Corp. (I think that's the title...) I want her lipstick lightsaber! Sort of a Japanese Ghostbusters. For things to avoid: Plastic Little is high on fan service, high on explosions, negligable on plot. Worth the $1 to rent it. Dragon Half is very silly, but it changes animation styles from: standard to stylized to "super deformed/silly" in a very constant way that we found *utterly* annoying. Dragon Pink: more pornime, and is okay, but I prefer more attitude in the victim. Gude Crest: For some reason, didn't grab us. >All suggestions are appreciated- but ArchBeth, I warn you... start >inflicting Geasa on me and I *will* play dirty for revenge. ;) Why would I inflict Geasa upon you? At 1:05 AM +0000 1/4/98, Patrick Chester wrote: >> At 2:34 AM +0000 1/3/98, Patrick Chester wrote: >> >> At 7:28 PM -0600 12/21/97, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >> >>>> Dubs, ick.... >>>> (And then there's the "Warriors of the Wind" mutilated; >>>> and yet it's what sent me really ga-ga on this stuff!) >>> >>>That was one of the things that started my interest in anime too. >>>And the original 'Naussica' was SO much better. :) >> >>*HAVE YOU GOT A COPY*????? > >No, sorry. I like the Nausicaa Manga. >>>Flight 005 Conspiracy was one of the ones that got a bit grim. Or at >>>least I wasn't laughing at the mayhem they caused at the end. >> >>Which one was that? The one with the psi-kid? Yeah, that >>one annoyed me, for some reason. > >No, that was something else. This one had a warpshuttle explode in >deep space, but no insurance claims were filed by any passenger's >relatives. Ah. Hrm. Weird. I don't know if I've seen that one. >>>Ick, this just gave me the thought of being able to copy an IN soul >>>into some computer memory. *BRR* >> >>I like it. Celestial braintaping and ghostcomping... > > Sounds Vapulan. I *like* it... >>>>>I know others have disagreed, but I -still- think Bell-chan is a Bright >>>>>Lilim. >>>> >>>> I could see that, actually... She's so *giving*. >>> >>>Hmm... Skuld as a servitor of Jean with a Need of Ice Cream? ;-) >> >>Yes. Utterly. And Skuld is a Malakite. > >Except her oath is to never suffer a Bug to live. ;-) Bugs are Evil!!!! >>>> [On vacation 22nd-28th December 1997: 400 messages when I get back!] >>> >>>Whee! O_o;; >> >> > >Here, have another. MUAAHAHAHAHAHHAH! ;-) AIE! [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:05:33 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Remnants At 11:14 PM -0500 1/4/98, Perry M. Lloyd wrote: >Remnants are not affected by celestial perceptions. I assume this >means that an Angel's ability to peer into a person's soul does not >function on Remnants (e.g. Angelic Resonances of Perception have no >affect, such as the Cherub's and the Mercurian). > >But what about the Demonic Resonances? I assume the Lilim's would not >function. That's right. >What about the others'? I think they would -- they are not related to *perceiving*, after all. (Except Djinn, though you could make a case that instead of self-tuning to a perceived theme of the Symphony that corresponds with the attuned person, they *force* a link...) However, I could see a GM saying "No celestial abilities work on them" as a personal "not far off" sort of thing. This (the canon one) would mean remnants can be possessed by Kyrios and Shedim (a Shedite might be able to figure out what it was in, too, and would hopefully be squicked! [Yow, squicking Shedim...]). >Also, with no Will characteristic, does this mean that it would be an >automatic success for the Demonic Resonance, or an automatic failure, >since there's no Soul/Will to twist. There's still a chance to spend Essence to affect the roll, and for Divine/Infernal interventions. >I'm guessing that the Djinn resonance doesn't work on Remnants, nor >does the Lilims', since there's no Soul in there to sense. More GM-call stuff, I think. And more things for me to tuck away! O:> [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:32:01 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Forces as Game-World Objects At 3:13 PM -0500 1/5/98, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >There are so few forces in a standard entry-level celestial that >one more or less makes a big difference. Do "forces" exist in >the game world as well as in the game mechanics? Would one celestial >say to another, "That Malakite's got to have at least five corporeal >forces"? I've been assuming that Forces are at least a vague concept -- "the forces that make up our being" and possibly, "he is strong in physical forces, but his celestial forces are weak". But I've been twitching, personally, over whether or not they *number* the wretched things. >How abou Essence points? These are clearly descended from "spell >points" and their cognates, but I never felt that magic users in >these RPGs spoke to one another about how many "spell points" a given >feat cost. But Essence has the same coarse granularity as forces. >It would be reasonable to notice it. Essence as a concept -- "I had to burn Essence to make that motorcycle jump!" -- yes. Points of Essence? Urm. Personally, I've been trying to avoid sentence contstructions that require specific numbers -- "Full of Essence," "Empty," "mostly full," "mostly empty," "only a little Essence left," "I'll give you half my Essence"... If anybody has better ideas... emccoy@nh.ultranet.com, Uppity Wynch http://brie.bmsc.washington.edu/people/merritt/books/Eye_of_Argon.html "rumoured to contain hoards of plunder, and many young wenches" Mike [falsetto]: "We're tired of these degrading patriachical slurs! From now on we demand to be called 'wynchys.'" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 20:04:47 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim and Roles At 11:07 PM -0500 1/3/98, Brandon Quina wrote: >Okay.. Ive been paying attention to this topic, and ive got afew >questions.. > >1) If a mortal asked a Seraph what his name was, and the Seraph >said "Men call me Zane." he wouldnt be lying, right?? If he said >"My name is Zane" when his name was Zebadaih, then he would be lying-- >even if he had a role where he was called Zane? Yes. His name is not Zane, any more than Sly Stallone's name is Rambo. >What about "You can call me Zane." or "I go by Zane." Or even "Its >not my real name, but I didnt like my given name. Im Zane, now." All those could work (though if he'd better be telling the truth about not liking his given name), yes. (And then there's my mother's father, "Jack." My grandmother says she found out his real name (Clarence Perry, aka "C.P.") at the altar!) >2) If a demon asked a Seraph 'Are you an angel?' he would have >to tell them that he was, or suffer dissonance.. Right?? Or find >some way around the question. Or just not talk. That's how I'd play it, yes. They couldn't say *no*. They *could* mislead somehow, though -- "Do you mean literaly or figuratively?" "Some people have called me that." "Oh, what do you think?" "Why do you ask?" They don't have to answer the question, after all. At 10:25 PM -0500 1/4/98, David Edelstein wrote: >Possible Seraphic responses: [...] >"Actually, I'm a Republican*, but you can call me an angel if you want." He can't say "Actually," I think, without skirting. But he could say, "Well." >* (This only works if the angel has joined the Republican party as part of >his Role, but you can think of other variations, I'm sure.) At 10:10 AM -0500 1/5/98, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >Can a seraph consider the possibility of having more than one "name"? >Lots of humans have several. This depends on the GM. Officially, angels have names in the celestial tongue, and their names are a very large part of them, a "True Name," basically. In a lesser way, it is almost like a Word to them, since it is often a *concept* ("Adoration of the Crown of God," say.) If they're lucky enough to get a name that can be translated into human, then they can probably get away with using that translation -- Michael ("Who is Like God") doesn't have to give the plain-english translation, if he doesn't want to. If a GM wants to use Roles *and* yet make Seraphim careful... Maybe roll it, as for disturbance. If they make the Role-roll (had to do that...), they don't get dissonance. If they *fail* it...ow. At 2:45 PM -0500 1/5/98, David Edelstein wrote: >>>>As i see it, a seraph could have said this, since the balseraph didn't >like, if the balseraph had said," yes it safe to poke your finger in >here," that would have been a lie, and the Balseraph along with a few >classmates would have beleived it to be safe. >Seraphs are not telling a lie if their wording is litterally not a lie.<<< > >Not quite true. You can create a tortured literal interpretation of nearly >any wording to make it mean something very different from the surface >meaning. [...] they cannot say things >that are only literally true if you apply a bent, Balseraph-like twist to >the meaning. Depending on the strictness of the GM, the Seraph's player might have to roll against Fast-Talk to see if a twisty intrepretation will or will not cause dissonance... (Like the Seraphim of Janus.) At 4:42 PM -0500 1/5/98, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >Obviously, the temperamental differences of the various choirs are >meant to supply structure for building characters. But how much >structure? How tight a strait-jacket does canon mandate? Too tight >and no one will play canon, though they may use it. This is something that the APG actualy devotes a fair amount of time to. There are certain constants that make up the vast majority of the Choir -- call it a bellcurve, with those on one end being almost *parodies* of their Choir, and those on the other end being astoundingly different, such as a Seraph who's as social as a Mercurian and understands very well that sometimes combinations of words *don't mean what they sound like*. ("See, there's this tonal element to the words, so there's this thing called *sarcasm* -- it alters the meaning of the words to be the exact opposite. Sort of like Chinese." or "When someone says, 'How are you?' they may not *mean* to ask for details; they're just asking if you're breathing. So you say 'okay,' and that tells them that you don't need an ambulance called.") To some extent, the Seraphim thing (among others) is a GM call. **Personally, as a GM,** I'd be fine if they have a name that embodies their concept -- taking Uriel as an example (hey, he used to be a Seraph once, right?), he can say: "My name is Light of God" and I'd let that equal, "My name is 'Light of God'" or "My name is Uriel" or "My name is (something that means the same in some other language)." He might even be able to reply to a "What's your name?" question with "Uri" or some fragment of his real name, and could certainly have the conversation of: "Hey, Uri, where are you?" "Over here!" (In general, anytime a Seraph is addressed by a nickname or whatever, they can respond to it as if their real name had been used -- it is, after all, something meant to address the Seraph.) To take my Urilebana ("Light of the Moon," I was trying for...), she could tell a Seraph her name was: "Urilebana," "Moonfire," "Moonlight," "Light of the Moon," or "Fire of the Moon." (Depending on how one translates Uri...), and all of those would probably read as true (with the celestial concept coming through on a 6). She can't say, "My name is Ellen" without running into trouble... >Must all Malakim be totally humorless? What if I want to play a >merrily gallant warrior angel, patterned after Cyrano de Bergerac or >Reepicheep or the Three Musketeers? Malakite would be the obvious >choir. Can't I fit in a sense of humor? Sure! They *tend* to be grim, but not all of them restrict their humor to situation comedy involving demons and power tools... But *honor* probably won't be "funny" to any but a really weird one. >A counter-example: > >Elohites are stereotyped as "emotionless." [...] She is portrayed >as firm of purpose and clear of head. She emotes freely, but that >never stops her from doing what's needed or recognizing the truth. Another thing dealt with in the APG, stated outright. Some express emotions and have favorite colors; some try to suppress everything. But all good Elohim will be ruthless at accomplishing a goal, to the extent they feel is objectively justified... [Still dealing with non-urgent email from the 400 messages from vacation] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 20:13:02 +0000 From: Jo Hart Subject: IN> IN historical At 11:11 05/01/98 -0500, you wrote: > >I'm very fond of the 19th century, though I wouldn't want to live there. > >Earl > Nice ;) I was thinking about a historical based game for the next set of sessions I'm planning. Was thinking English Civil war. Oliver Cromwell, John Milton, the Witchfinder General, Samuel Pepys, Cardinal Richelieu, Cavaliers & Roundheads, the man in the iron mask & a supporting cast of angels and demons ... but actually I can see the attraction of mid/late-Victorian era. I'd be tempted to include a few fictional characters (like Sherlock Holmes & Captain Nemo) but I can think of a few scenario ideas off the top of my head. Vapula tries to feed/ steal the idea for the radium bomb from Marie & Pierre Curie. PCs get mixed up in an 'Around the World in 80 Days' bet. A deranged angel pretends to be 'the martians' and sends threatening bombs to explode outside lots of capital cities, to try to force world leaders to declare world peace against 'the martian threat'. Which is OK until another set of 'martians' turn up. (Any plot out of one of the Flashman novels) Send the PCs off to China to take part in the Opium Wars. Or to Islandhwana (sp) to be part of the Zulu massacre. Jack the Ripper is an infernal aligned sorceror stealing bodily parts from his victims for unholy rituals. Or is he trying to stop an summoning of a prince of hell...? jo ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 21:08:22 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Headaches On Mon, 5 Jan 1998, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > A Wordbound may attract servitors (if not Servitors). He can > give them access to his particular Rite(s). Attunements? I think > the current canon is a little dubious about it. If he *has* > Servitor attunements, then maybe; not Band/Choir attunements, > though, I think... Lemme get back to you on that. IN Anime movie trailer : 2) >At 11:17 PM -0600 1/3/98, rogue@ez-net.com wrote: >>IN Cast List >>OK, moving on. I know this is gonna sound ignorant, but I'm just a poor >>backwater demon with no experience in this particular area... >> >>... so can anyone recommend some good anime for me? Preferably IN-relevant, > >Oh My Goddess. Maybe more Tenchi if you cross your eyes (it starts >making more sense around the 5th or so episode, and it's a fun >ride). Tenchi OVA, that is. Tenchi TV is fun, but not so much so as the OVA, and when the New Tenchi TV series comes over, it'll stink. }:-{P >There might be Wicked City, which has Shedim porn in it *and* >Djinn-porn (I kid you not), but I don't know because I only >ever saw the non-subbed, non-dubbed version, and started >somewhere in the middle, so I haven't got a clue what it's >*really* about -- but it looks like a lot of demons running >around playing with humans. Definitely not an entirely nice >film. Wicked City Shinjuku, if you're looking for the dub or sub in stores. It will probably be hard to find. >For simple coolstuff... > >Ranma 1/2, definitely. Only if you're into fluffy slapstick comedy (which I am). >Kimagure Orange Road (psi powers, love triangle...) I actually hate KOR. The lead character is possibly the most spineless character in all anime, his family is 100% irresponsible, and the pacing and storytelling of the series bore me to tears. >El-Hazard: alternate world stuff, very neat. Shayla-Shayla is a Malakite > of Fire! Again, the OVA series is better than the TV series. And what would you call Ifurita anyway? A Grigori Archangel? >Neon Genesis Evangelion! Illuminated! Things called "Angels"! A > starting theme song that is really cool! > Rei! (Rei *rules*. I love that character.) If you don't like 'artsy' stuff or Kabbalistic references, -avoid-. Also, if you didn't like the original 'Gall Force,' run away from 'Evangelion.' >Slayers (for a lot of Silly *D&D kinds of things, though Nathaniel > was less thrilled than we) Very fun, although (being a heterosexual male) I much prefer Naga to Gourry as Lina's traveling companion. }:-{D >Bubblegum Crisis is okay; go Silia go! (So, is she an Elohite?) Not a chance. Sylia, if anything, is a Habbalite. She's fighting for revenge. >Bubblegum Crash... could be better. Bubblegum Crash... could be Bubblegum Crisis. But it wasn't. >A.D. Police Files is very artsy in some ways; if you liked Ghost in the > Shell, this might appeal, too. Same world as BGC, above. Artsy and shallow. Avoid. >Cutey Honey (Lots of fan service! >Kekko Kamen (Lots of fan service!) Both by Go Nagai, who also created 'Devilman,' which IMHO should be a 'must-see' for IN players. Nagai is noted for being no-holds-barred on sex, violence, and slapstick. >La Blue Girl ("Japornamation"/"Pornime") would be better if it didn't > have that stupid Nin-nin thing. Yeesh. Demons and > "sex-craft" ninja and all sorts of silliness. La Blue Girl is on my 'avoid' list. It's stupid. It's poorly animated. Most importantly, it's what everyone and their uncle thinks of besides Speed Racer when you say 'Japanese cartoons.' >Devil Hunter Yohko! (A Soldier with a Relic...) More like, 110 Soldiers with Relics. }:-{D >Battle Angel, for some obscure reason, I really like. Gory. Battle Angel, or GUNNM, or Alita, comics & anime and what-not, all cool. >Warriors of the Wind is an evil, awful dub-job -- but the music and > plot and characters and art just sucked me in. Look for 'Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind,' either as a fansub or the original manga by Hayao Miyazaki. It's worth the search. >Ushio and Tora: a story of a boy and his demon. Tora is a Djinn and > and I *adore* him. And Ushio is obviously either a Soldier with a Relic, or more likely a descendant of Grigori. >They Were 11: the manga is better in some ways, but the food-fight > in the anime is cool. This is a very character-based > thing. Have yet to see this one, actually. >Princess Minerva: an astounding amount of plot for something with > so much fan service... You found a PLOT? >Something about a magical carpet that I can't remember the name > of right now, but which gave us the idea that magical power is > in inverse proportion to intelligence... "The Girl from Phantasia," another time-waster. >Magical Twilight is more pornime, and was cute. Cute and sweet. >Dirty Pair: some are better than others. Do not expect plot in > all cases. (Some have it, some don't.) Expect massive > amounts of destruction and some fan-service. And expect anime fans to go to arms over whether or not 'DP Flash' was any good. >PatLabor: Reading both the manga and watching the anime is best. Avoid the movies. Talking heads for 1:45, action for :15. TV series is fun. >Dominion: Tank Police -- worth it to understand Dominican Tank Police! Worth it whether or not you play In Nomine. >Phantom Corp. (I think that's the title...) I want her lipstick lightsaber! > Sort of a Japanese Ghostbusters. You-sen-gai-sya, I think. "Phantom Quest Corporation." Hilarious. >For things to avoid: >Plastic Little is high on fan service, high on explosions, negligable > on plot. Worth the $1 to rent it. No it's not. >Dragon Half is very silly, but it changes animation styles from: > standard to stylized to "super deformed/silly" in a > very constant way that we found *utterly* annoying. And which I loved. People who love the first fifteen minutes of 'Sailor Moon' and hate the stock footage will love Dragon Half. >Dragon Pink: more pornime, and is okay, but I prefer more attitude in > the victim. Another basic time-waster, unless you like rape. >Gude Crest: For some reason, didn't grab us. Never heard of this one before. You totally left out 'Urusei Yatsura,' which to my mind is a crying shame. Of course, there's the question of which kind of IN demon Lum is... }:-{D I'd recommend other anime as well, but unfortunately it would have absolutely zero application to IN. }:-{D Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | "It's Christmas in Heaven, http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | there's great shows on TV; c/o White Lightning Productions | the Sound of Music twice an hour http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | and Jaws I, II and III." Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- A Nybbas Christmas http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #549 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.