From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Jul 10 08:10:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA00578 for ; Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:10:23 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) id IAA24453 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:06:20 -0500 Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:06:20 -0500 Message-Id: <199807101306.IAA24453@lists.io.com> X-Authentication-Warning: lists.io.com: majordom set sender to owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com using -f From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #849 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, July 10 1998 Volume 01 : Number 849 In this digest: Re: IN> Word-Bound Servitors of David IN> Princes and Renegades IN> Re: IN- Word-Bound Servitors of David Re: IN> Heartless Free Lilim Re: IN> Word-Bound Servitors of David Re: IN> Elohim of Marc Re: IN> Word-Bound Servitors of David IN> The In Nomine Collection ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 13:15:00 -0400 From: Nana Yaw Ofori Subject: Re: IN> Word-Bound Servitors of David At 9:22 PM -0400 7/5/98, MarkDEddy@aol.com wrote: >I don't think David has any Word-bound Kyrios, but that's just me... > Mark(Cherub of Stone on my good days) Well, since he's so concerned about bringing people together, wouldn't the Woeds of various government types fall under Stone? Angel of Communism (Had this guy pegged as an Elohite, but now I'm not so sure.) Angel of Democracy (Kyriotate.) Angel of Monarchy Angel of Socialism Angel of Republics ===== ><{{"> =================================================== <"}}>< ====== Nana-Yaw "The Fish" Ofori, Freelance Soldier of Heck, presenty serving Senaieas, Shedite Baron of Lust, the Demon of Voyeurism nofori@pop3.utoledo.edu | Homepage: http://members.tripod.com/~maltesh maltesh@usa.net | In Nomine: http://members.tripod.com/~maltesh/T317 ===== ><{{"> ============ "Life's a Fish, then you Fry." ======= <"}}>< ====== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 13:07:45 PDT From: "Daniel Maberry" Subject: IN> Princes and Renegades >From: David Edelstein >>>>OK, then what I was arguing from about Beleth and Blandine wouldn't >apply. But it makes it *much* harder for Beleth's Servitors to go >Renegade if that's true.<<< > > >No harder than for any other demon -- break your Heart, and run. Not quite... Serving any demon prince has its own individual set of risks, particularly for those going renegade, and what those are can depend on the prince's Band, his Word, or just his personality traits unrelated to either. For example, running out on Beleth has its unique risks because she's a Djinn, which means that she will stalk you to the ends of the earth and all other planes. Having the Word of Nightmares, she can use the Marches against you like no other, possibly haunting the dreams of mortals she knows you associate with, or sending her underlings to do so, to find you or to manipulate them against you. As for her personality, the IPG describes her as having stripped her emotions down to just one: hate. Which means that when she DOES find you, you're not just toast; you're a cat toy. And now, for introductions: Name's Dan Maberry, and I just joined the list, although I used to be on here when the game first came out and was going by Raven (in case anyone else from back then is still on or has returned). Thought for the nanosecond: Electrons may be small, but they can really gang up on you. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Jul 1998 13:16:22 PDT From: "Daniel Maberry" Subject: IN> Re: IN- Word-Bound Servitors of David >From: Nana Yaw Ofori >Well, since he's so concerned about bringing people together, wouldn't the >Woeds of various government types fall under Stone? Risky... Not all government systems are intended to bring people together; actually, most aren't. They're designed by people in power (perhaps having just gained, as in a coup) as a way to maintain that power. I not sure how fond David would be of the Word of Monarchy, and Fascism is right out. He might like Words like Democracy and Socialism better, but whatever angel gets a government type as a Word should be careful to PREVENT its corruption, rather than being dragged down with it. Now THERE'S a thought: The Mercurian angel of Communism. Took the Word during Marx's life when he saw his philosophy's potential, but when Communist Russia turned corrupt, he not only Fell, but was re-granted the Word by Lucifer. Yikes. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Jul 1998 23:08:00 -0400 From: Frank Lazar Subject: Re: IN> Heartless Free Lilim >At 3:14 PM -0400 7/6/98, Walter Milliken wrote: > > Well, isn't stealing your Heart from the Princess of Nightmares >rather suicidal anyway? According to the IPG, she's attuned to them all, >and she'll notice the moment you steal yours. Shouldn't be too hard for her >to obtain a permanent attunement if she wants one, and all she has to do is >let her Renegade Hunters know "He's nipped off with his heart to >Abbadon/Olympus/The Dreamlands. Go get 'im." > Then I would guess the thing for a would-be Renegade of Nightmares to keep in mind is to forget about snatching their heart and settle for smashing it instead. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- | _ | | We are dreamers, shapers, singers and makers. /_\ | | We study the mysteries of laser and circuit, // \\ | | Crystal and scanner, holographic demons, \\ //___\\ | | And invocations of equations. \\ // \\ | | \\__// \\ | | These are the tools we employ. And we know... many things. \\ | | \\ | | | Frank Lazar http://www.interactive.net/~fmlazar | \\ | - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 10:32:29 +0100 From: Jo Hart Subject: Re: IN> Word-Bound Servitors of David >Peter Wrote >Anybody else have any ideas? > (You had to ask :) ). Angel of Trade Unions Angel of the Labour Movement Angel of Communism (Achtung, comrade! Those ideals aren't dead. They're just pining for the fjords...) Angel of Co-operatives Angel of Vengeance (Most likely to say: Revenge will be as swift as it is unexpected! Least likely to say: It is wrong to meet violence with violence. Turn the other cheek.) Angel of Cod Liver Oil (It tastes foul but it is very good for you. Allegedly.) Angel of Community Leaders Angel of Religious Leaders (under which, Angel of Priests, Angel of Rabbis etc etc) (These angels are sent to teach people how to lead communities) Angel of Student Societies Angel of Political Parties Angel of Pressure Groups Angel of Gay Pride Angel of School-teachers (poor thing) Angel of policemen who walk the beat Angel of Omerta (David says: No comment) Angel of the Rotarians Angel of Greenham Common Angel of the Womens Institute (and various other tight-knit humanitarian societies) Apparently there is no angel which has the word of the mafia but... Angel of Organised Crime (David says: Its a make-work scheme.) Angel of Argot Angel of 'All for One and One for All' Angel of Self-help groups Angel of group therapy Angel of community service Angel of the prison service Angel of Team Spirit (or 'Esprit de Corps' for the francophone) Angel of Team Sports (under which) Angel of Rugby, a seraph which is reputed to be more fearsome than the angel of the inquisition (Most likely to say: Pick yourself up and get back into that scrum! What do you mean, you have two broken ribs?? Least Likely to say: Chill. Its only a game. ) Angel of Field Hockey Angel of boxing Angel of tai chi Angel of self-defence (David claims that all team sports fall under his jurisdiction except for Aussie rules football which currently is sewn up by Belial... but he's working on it) Angel of builders Angel of Steeplejacks Angel of housewives Angel of team-building exercises (under which) Angel of 'team-building exercises' which actually turn out to be going down to the pub (Rumours that the reason Mercurians get all the fun jobs in Stone is due to a conspiracy are apparently unfounded) Angel of Conspiracies (Surprise, surprise. Its a Mercurian. Hmm.) Angel of Gargoyles Angel of Flying Buttresses Angel of Stained Glass Windows Angel of Double-Glazing I guess thats enough for now. jo :) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 11:09:01 +0100 From: Jo Hart Subject: Re: IN> Elohim of Marc At 23:43 02/07/98 -0500, you wrote: > >However, for the moment I'll restrict myself to asking for some >clarification of Marc's Elohim attunement. >"Fair market value" is >a much more ambiguous, contextual concept than the one sentence >description gives. Fair market value to whom? Where? Is this meant to >give its value to its current owner? I assume that applies when the angel is trying to put a value on a commodity which is relatively freely available on the open market, and it would give an estimate of the value in whichever mortal community the angel chooses (so that is actually quite useful if the angel wants to decide to buy coal in newcastle and sell it in somewhere coal is expensive -- it would make them demon traders (so to speak) ). It also might mean they have a natural knack at currency conversion, which is probably more useful in practice than it sounds :) > Does it tell the angel >the point at which the supply and demand curves intersect? If so, is it >only for the location he's currently in, or does he have an idea of what >the equilibrium point is somewhere else? Does he know the whole of the >supply and demand curves, or merely the equilibrium point? I'd say just the current equilibrium point (although many of them will be trained in economics as well so could probably produce scarily good projections), but in any mortal location he is familiar with. >In the case of an item that's unique, is the "fair market value" what it >would receive at auction (economists LOVE auctions)? Hmm. I'd go for the route that insurers take and figure it as 'what the item would cost to replace if you could take the nearest available thing to it.' That resonance doesn't really work well with unique items IMO, because it is so incredibly good with commodities; the notion of a fair market value for a unique item doesn't really apply in the same way. > The classic example is a rent controlled >apartment in New York City? Would the angel get the price it's worth >while being rented at the controlled price? I'd say he gets the cost under current market conditions in the locale only. He can compare it with similar properties in other locations under other conditions to try and project a value but that isn't what his resonance tells him. >Can the angel determine the price of something intangible? Take, for >instance, my In Nomine rulebook. The fair market value for the book >itself is $24.95. (This example assumes, of course, that SJG isn't >ripping us off.) But what is the intellectual property of the game >system itself worth? Or can he assess the value of a human life? Or goodwill? I'd say no, but if it is something like intellectual property or goodwill that commonly does occur on balance sheets, the Angel will probably know the current accounting conventions (which don't have much to do with actual value IIRC). It might be that Marc does have attunements for this kind of thing but I'd make the Elohim learn some economics and statistics and try to figure it out like anyone else. jo ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 11:15:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Elizabeth Bartley Subject: Re: IN> Word-Bound Servitors of David On Thu, 9 Jul 1998, Jo Hart wrote: > Angel of Cod Liver Oil > (It tastes foul but it is very good for you. Allegedly.) It's got a lot of vitamins in it (A and E especially, I think) which used to be very good for you in the winter when fresh fruits and vegetables were unavailable. Also supposedly helps constipation. Personally, I think its main use was in discouraging children from faking being slightly sick by making being sick unpleasant. Elizabeth Bartley e-bartley@pobox.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:45:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: IN> The In Nomine Collection Hi - You probably can't miss it. I changed the main page on the In Nomine Collection. What I am asking is that people do the following: 1. Open the page http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/index.html in your favorite web browser. 2. If the page DOES NOT FUNCTION, send me mail IMMEDIATELY at zenith@pyramid.sjgames.com, with the following information: a. Your Machine/Operating System b. The browser you are using. c. The version of the browser. d. A short description of the problem. 3. If you have any suggestions or comments, send them on to me, and I'll read them and make adjustments. If there are things you would like to see in the future, also send them on to me. If you have any flames, send them on to dev.null@black.hole.com. :) And thanks to everyone who HAS given me feedback. I apologize for not answering the mail individually, but they were all read and processed. THANKS! - - Em ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #849 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.