From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Nov 19 10:36:59 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07533 for ; Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:36:58 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id FAA11776 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Wed, 17 Nov 1999 05:38:04 -0600 Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 05:38:04 -0600 Message-Id: <199911171138.FAA11776@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1422 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Wednesday, November 17 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1422 In this digest: Re: IN> Sow the Wind... RE: IN> Impudite Resonance? Re: IN> Michael and his job IN> One Tough Taker IN> Beelzebub is Dead RE: IN> Sow the Wind... IN> 4 Words! We accept credit cards!! (84630) Re: IN> Sow the Wind... Re: Celestial Personality (was Re: IN> Impudite Resonance?) Re: IN> Beelzebub is Dead Re: IN> Bright Bands Re: IN> Demonic Resonances, and Geasa. Re: IN> Bright Bands IN> Confirmation needed for enrollment Re: IN> One Tough Taker Re: IN> Impudite Resonance? IN> Impudites Re: Adventures (was IN> How and Why Laurence Became the General of the Host) Re: Celestial Personality (was Re: IN> Impudite Resonance?) Re: IN> Bright Bands Re: IN> Impudite Resonance? RE: IN> Sow the Wind... IN> Re: Adventures Re: IN> Bright Shedim Re: IN> Impudite Resonance? Re: IN> Bright Shedim Re: Adventures (was IN> How and Why Laurence Became the General of the Host) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:38:33 -0500 From: Ben Aldred Subject: Re: IN> Sow the Wind... >Allied: Belial (Belial is allied with Janus) >Associated: No One (Saminga is associated with Janus) >Neutral: Everyone Else >Hostile: Kobal, Nybbas, Valefor >Enemy: Andrealphus > nice, I would like to know why he is hostile towards Valefor. While they were rivals they got along alright at least better than say belial and gabby or kronos and yves. A logic behind this would be cool. Otherwise quite cool. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:52:20 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: RE: IN> Impudite Resonance? > >BY sticking so rigidly to these stereotypes you are (IMO) blinding yourself > >to one of the major themes of In Nomine: Free Will. If all celestials > >conform to the personality imposed upon them by a Resonance, then the > >argument that they have Free Will is given a severe blow. That could be a good reason *to* pattern stereotypes -- it reinforces the difference between humans and Celestials. But especially when a Superior creates a Celestial instead of letting him fledge with time, I'd say it's perfectly reasonable to expect he'd construct his Servitor stereotypically. Well, except for Eli. It's where the Celestial goes *after* creation that makes the difference. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:54:29 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Michael and his job At 9:21 PM -0500 11/18/99, Samovar3@aol.com wrote: >I was not aware of this. However, this raises the question of why he quit. >It no longer becomes a thing of just being harassed by Dominic. Instead, >Michael chose to abandon the duty given to him by God. By my reading of >Michael, this seems completely against what was written of him. Indeed, it >has shades of Lilith and Eden. There is some weight to this, though I think the original thesis that Michael's ability to pursue the War at that time had been damaged by the trial is a strong one. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:55:43 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> One Tough Taker Someone asked if a bruiser Impudite was possible. Here's my attempt at one. Marco, Impudite of Malphas 4 Corporeal Strength 10 Agility 6 2 Ethereal Intel 4 Precision 4 3 Celestial Perception 3 Will 9 Role (Gym Manager/Trainer) - 2 Status - 2 Vessel-5 Charisma - 1 Area Knowledge (home city) - 2 Fighting - 6 Lying - 2 Dodge - 3 Songs Corporeal Form - 2 Corporeal Healing - 2 Numinous Corpus (claws) - 3 Corporeal Tongues - 1 Discord - Paranoid (2) Marco appears as a burly human male in his mid-'30s. He's bald, has multiple piercings, wears a lot of jewelry, and usually dresses informally (sweatpants, a tank top, and the like). He has a Role as the owner and manager of a small walk-up gymnasium in an urban, ethnic, working-class neighborhood (the GM can pick the ethnicity; I'm going to say Hispanic, but "Marco" could just as easily be Guido, Jimmy, Chong, Rah-El, or Zbig). Marco is a young demon, fresh out of Hell, and this Role is his first assignment on Earth. His primary job is to foment dislike, intolerance and violence in this particular urban neighborhood. Though not really that important a task in the great scheme of things, it's a good first assignment for testing and training a new demon. Marco's secondary jobs include recruiting Hellsworn, running a flophouse for transient demons who are passing through the city, keeping an eye on the Tether of a nearby Superior, and wreaking random evil. He has been in this job for a year or two, and in the normal course of events would expect to be reassigned after another couple of years. Marco has already become a neighborhood fixture, and is almost universally liked and respected. Many of the neighborhood men work out at his gym regularly. Marco uses his Role to get close to them ("Okay, I'm going to spot you on the bench press now"), strike up conversations, and use his resonance. Although his Will isn't high enough to make resonating too certain (against a typical human he needs to roll under a 6 to succeed), the constant flow of people in and out of the gym means that he can just try again every few minutes. Furthermore, the gym's patrons include a number of big, strong fellows who are heavy in Corporeal forces but weak in Ethereal and Celestial, and so are particularly vulnerable to being resonated. Over time, Marco has built up a "stable" of a dozen or so regular customer-victims; by repeated successful resonance rolls, he has reduced their resistance to the point where he only needs an unmodified Will roll to charm or drain them (see "More Sophisticated Uses of Resonance", IPG pages 62-3). There will usually be at least one of these humans within easy reach. Furthermore, Marco is known and trusted in the neighborhood to the point where he can just walk down the street meeting people and talking to them, resonating as he goes. In other words, if confronted on his home ground, Marco will have an abundant supply of Essence and of allies. Marco has used his charm to make plenty of good, trusted friends among the neighborhood men. In accordance with his master's Word, he spreads a simple message to anyone who will listen: beat the crap out of anyone who is different from us. Marco has been responsible for several ugly incidents where patrons of his gym have attacked innocent people of a different race, religion, or sexual orientation. Marco occasionally participates in these activities, but more often he just eggs his neighbors on ("Miguel, if we let one of these people walk the streets, soon they'll think they own the place..."). Police have noticed the recent rise in violence, but Marco has been discreet and no one has made any connection to him. Of course, it's not all about neighborhood "protection"; Marco isn't working for David, after all. He also gives plenty of personal advice to his charmed friends, of the sort that you'd expect from a Servitor of the Prince of Factions: "I think you should sue the bastard," "You oughta look that guy up and pop him one," and "Slap her around some, Joe -- it's what they all really want, deep down." Marco has ruined several lives, spread a great deal of quiet misery, and may possibly have damned a soul or two to Hell; so far, he's looking like a very promising up-and-coming young Taker. Marco is keeping an eye out for potential Soldiers. He hasn't spotted any really good candidates yet, but he's always looking. He's also watching over a Tether, a few blocks away in a nearby neighborhood, that belongs to a Superior hostile to Malphas... GM's discretion whether it's David, Novalis, or an enemy Prince like Saminga. Malphas would like to strike at the Tether and get someone else blamed for it; in preparation for this, he has Marco keeping careful track of comings and goings there. Marco has an apartment above the gym which is also a flophouse for transient demons and Hellsworn. Someone will be staying there about a quarter of the time. At the GM's discretion, this could be anyone from a Soldier of Hell on the run from the law, to a Calabite of Malphas passing through town; the GM may roll 1d6+4 to determine the visitor's strength in Forces. There's nothing special about Marco's Paranoid Discord (it's a fairly common condition for servitors of Malphas). It doesn't usually interfere with his job. However, it probably would come into play in any interaction between Marco and other Celestials. Marco likes his job, respects and fears his Prince, and is in no way a candidate for Redemption at this time. He's confident in his strength and wants to impress his bosses, so he might tackle a group of intruders single-handed. If they're obviously too strong, though, he'll certainly call Downstairs for backup; he's confident, not crazy. With his low Perception, Marco rarely gets to use his Servitor attunement (make a Perception roll to find out how to break the subject's trust in something). But that's okay; he can usually work the same information out of his victims, given time and a little effort. And he's saving his character points for an additional Celestial Force: get that Perception up to something useful, add another point or two to Will as well, and he'll really be able to mess with the mortals. Meanwhile he's enjoying life on Earth. PCs meeting Marco for the first time will probably _not_ make him for an Impudite... his stocky, bald, buff Vessel and his air of blunt competence seem more like a stereotypical Cherub or Djinn. Close examination, though, will show the classic Impudite obsession with appearance; his piercings are pure gold, his bald scalp is oiled and polished, even his sweat pants are immaculately clean. Rugged good looks and a hearty manner give him a point of Charisma, which should be emphasized in role-playing him. Marco is thoroughly plugged into the neighborhood, and so will quickly know if anything unusual happens or if any strangers start snooping around. Even if he makes his Will roll, his Paranoid discord will cause him to be instantly suspicious. If he fails the roll, of course, he'll still be suspicious... he'll just have some wild conspiracy theory about who the strangers are and what they want. In a fight, Marco will sing Corporeal Form (burning a couple of points of Essence to bring his armor up to 4), then try to get in close and use his strength. If no human observers are around, he'll use the Numinous Corpus; otherwise he'll just wade in barehanded. Marco's no Calabite, but he's a pretty tough opponent. His Dodge roll (9) means he's going to be fairly hard to hit, and his armor will blunt the attacks that do get through, so it may take quite a while to whittle away those 90 Body Hits. Marco knows that he can soak up a lot of damage, so he won't hesitate to charge an armed party. He also counts on being able to recharge Essence easily, so he'll burn it freely for a few combat rounds, upping his Dodge and attack rolls. Parties without strong combat skills may be in for some serious pimp-slapping. If he encounters tough opposition, or is reduced to less than 30 Body Hits, Marco will cut and run... but if he's allowed to escape, he'll quickly grab some more Essence from the neighborhood, use the Song of Healing to recover, gather some of his charmed friends from the gym, and come back looking for a rematch. A Celestial party that tackles Marco in his 'hood could be in for a tough fight, as he can easily assemble a party of a dozen five-force humans armed with knives, clubs, and handguns. If cornered, Marco will try to charm the strongest-looking member of a party (no, it almost certainly won't work against an angel, but a cornered demon doesn't have much to lose). If captured, he'll be no braver than any other Impudite, but his paranoia might add some interesting twists to an interrogation. Marco is a balanced starting character. He would be a formidable challenge for a group of human PCs, and even a small group of angels might have some trouble with him, especially if they try to tackle him in his home neighborhood. * * * * * So... would this qualify as a "bruiser Impudite"? I've never played in any campaign but my own, nor interacted with other IN players except via this mailing list. So I'm not sure how this compares to what other folks are doing. Interesting character, balanced character, messed-up character? Anyone? Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:15:15 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Beelzebub is Dead Uriel killed Beelzebub in 455 A.D. This is canon, per the GMG. - -David (don't you wish all questions were settled that easily?) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:37:18 -0600 From: "Trent" Subject: RE: IN> Sow the Wind... "nice, I would like to know why he is hostile towards Valefor. While they were rivals they got along alright at least better than say belial and gabby or kronos and yves. A logic behind this would be cool. Otherwise quite cool." I think my original idea was a lingering resentment from the old days when they were at opposite sides. IIRC the only reason I didn't make 'm Enemies was that they _do_ get along better now. 8) I'll mention it in v2.0 though thanks for the input. Trent Ofanite of Doubt ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 20:55:41 -0400 (EDT) From: "merch90210@hotmail.com" Subject: IN> 4 Words! We accept credit cards!! (84630) ACCEPT CREDIT CARDS OVER THE INTERNET Good Credit / Bad Credit / No Credit / No Problem!! *Multilevel Marketing *Mail Order/ Phone Sales *Home Based Business *INTERNET BASED BUSINESS *New Business* Small Business Everyone Is Welcome! Regardless of your credit rating, WE GUARANTEE YOUR APPROVAL!! *** NO SETUP FEES *** >>>>> CALL 1(888) 242-8260 <<<<< This message is sent in compliance of the new email bill section 301. Per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 1618, further transmissions to you by the sender of this email may be stopped at no cost to you. TO REMOVE CLICK ON mailto:merch90210@mailcity.com?subject=remove ******************************************************************************* 59314 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 01:18:51 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Sow the Wind... >Janus >Demon Prince of the Whirl Wind > >"The world is ashes. Ashes in the wind." Heh. I like it! And it's one of the smoother Ofanite-to-Calabite transitions, ennit. >Dissonance >It is dissonant for an Angel of the Whirlwind to change something for the >better. Everything they do must contribute to the ultimate destruction of >order. "Chaotic change for the worse" is probably a good translation of this Word. As opposed to, mmm, say Corruption, which is more gradual and orderly change for the worse. Right. [snip some good attunements] >Reap the Whirlwind >This attunement allows the user to summon an uncontrollable whirlwind with a >force equivalent to the essence spent to power the attunement. No essence >spent will produce a dust devil, while if a demon could muster 50 essence he >could summon a full blown tornado. The whirlwind lasts a d6 minutes. Mmmm, this seems a little vague. What would (say) a 3-Essence whirlwind do? >Fan the Flames >This attunement allows the demon to accelerate the inherent entropic >collapse of an item a number of years equal to 2*(celestial forces + word >forces). "Word forces"? >The first of the prime elemental angels to fall Janus received a warm >welcome (especially on Belial's part) into the hellish fold. He quickly >established a working relation ship with Belial and Saminga is fond of him. >Most of the Impudite princes annoy him as the Shal-Mari block try's to halt >the end of all. Yeah, Armageddon would have to be _real_ high on his agenda. >Allied: Belial (Belial is allied with Janus) >Associated: No One (Saminga is associated with Janus) >Neutral: Everyone Else I'd think Baal would like him. Or is he just too chaotic? Doug M. . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:04:05 PST From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: Celestial Personality (was Re: IN> Impudite Resonance?) >From: Tim Groth >Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >So tell me this. What type of demon do you build if you just want one which > >will be intelligent, competent, and capable of following orders? > >So the real answer is you build >any demon. > That was my point :) And if you want a demon to be charming, build one with lots of charisma, seduction, and fast talk (add in tactics if you want it to be cunning too). jo ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:19:22 PST From: "Micheal Knight" Subject: Re: IN> Beelzebub is Dead >Uriel killed Beelzebub in 455 A.D. This is canon, per the GMG. >-David (don't you wish all questions were settled that easily?) Yes. Absolutely. Thoroughly. I think I may qualify for service to Malphas after dropping those last few questions on the list. Micheal, Demon of irritating rules questions. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 23:34:12 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> Bright Bands Ehrbar wrote: > Bright Shedim (The Nonexistent) > Shedim either become Kyriotates, die during Redemption, or > quickly yo-yo, because of their Dissonance conditions. If a "bright > Shedim" manifests, they are immediately Force-stripped into a reliever > (or oblivion) by the redeeming Archangel. While a Bright Shedim might > be useful, the corruption they would spread in the name of *Heaven* is > unacceptable. Why can't you just reverse it? Each day, a Bright Shedite must - -improve- his Host's bahvior, doing something better, brighter, and nicer each day. Drug dealers become charity workers, philanderers stop cheating...that sort of thing. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 23:36:17 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> Demonic Resonances, and Geasa. Liam wrote: > i don't know, it smacks of min-maxing to me. a bruiser character is a > personality, an impudite is (kind-of) a race. why should it be a choice > between impudite and bruiser? surely they're different things entirely. you > should be able to have a bruiser impudite, or a comedian impudite, or a > ninja impudite, or whatever. it seems strange to me that all impudites > should have very strong will. Then don't expect to be able to use your Resonance. If you want anImpudite bruiser, he won't be able to steal Essence. It comes down to the fact that, in In Nomine, your 'race' isn't as -simple- as most RPGs. Your 'race' is both outlook and -purpose-. If your personality lends itself to combat, odds are you - -wouldn't- have fledged as an Impudite. When created, you correspond to certain Symphonic themes, and that's that to a large degree. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 23:44:30 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> Bright Bands Earl Wajenberg wrote: > Likewise, a Shedite can't successfully *make* a human go bad. > They have to seduce them into doing it, otherwise the rotten deed > was just a sort of psychotic episode, very unfortunate, but not > really moral corruption. Now there's an atypical character concept. A Shedite 'Terror Trooper' or something. Get the Will up -fairly- high, pump up Corp Forces and take some Vessel levels (I -think- they correspond to extra HP, least that's how I've seen it run) and you have the -ultimate- sneak-attack assassin. Bodyjump someone, slave them down, and attack your target, then leave when things are done. Hard for anyone to track and terrifying enough to engender -major- paranoia in anyone who knows 'something's not right, here.' - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 20:22:05 -0600 From: confirm@mail.maildebate.com Subject: IN> Confirmation needed for enrollment All our mailings are sent complying to the proposed United States Federal requirements for commercial email: Section 301 Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 618. Please see the bottom of this message for further information and removal instructions. MailDebate.Com, the company that pays rewards for joining their mailing lists, is contacting you to confirm your enrollment in our database. In our view, since receiving email solicitations on the Internet is inevitable, you might as well have a chance on winning some cash. In addition, by joining our opt-in mailing list club you will receive the following benefits: - - Free entries into our monthly giveaways of up to $5000.00 cash (Reply for details) - - First chance at promotional, sale, and special offers from leading companies - - Lowest prices to the software professional marketers use. - - Submit your site to the top ten search engines for FREE. - - FREE E-Books on Internet Marketing available for download. - - Access to free email address services. - - DISCOUNT on member mailings. - - PLUS MORE..... In order to participate, simply reply to this message to confirm membership, we will send you additional info regarding our company and our contest. If you are not interested, simply delete this message and you not be included in ANY future mailings sent out by this company. Thank you for your time. ** Please note, we recognize the sensitivity regarding the use of SPAM on the Internet. Please accept our apologies for this one time intrusion and understand that the eventual goal of our organization is to send advertisements only to people who are willing to accept them. Please be assured that if you do not reply to this message you will never again receive a mailing from our company. Required Sender Information: MailDebate.com Slidell, LA 70461 webmaster@mail.maildebate.com remove@mail.maildebate.com Per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 618, further transmission to you by the sender may be stopped at NO COST to you by forwarding this email to Remove@mail.maildebate.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 00:51:11 PST From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> One Tough Taker >From: Douglas Muir >Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > >Someone asked if a bruiser Impudite was possible. Here's my attempt at >one. Oh, I know it's possible. But actually the same stats would be more effective for any other band, because they'd have a good chance at using their resonance (where this guy still has less than 50% chance of being able to charm anyone) AND have buff physicals. Anyway, you'll all be pleased to know that I'll leave it here. But I do think that if I design a character and give it 10 Will, I want it to be GOOD at using its resonance and be able to use it reliable. I don't want it to be average. What's the point in specialising if you only get to be averagely good at it. So I want the charm ability to be on the same par as any other demonic attunement (it's slightly less useful than the others, but a bit more flexible. It still won't force people to do anything other than like you for awhile, which won't stop them attacking you if you do something stupid. It's no more powerful than Presence 1 in Vampire). A standard 3/3/3 Impudite should have a (reasonable) chance at charming anyone it meets, same as a 3/3/3 Balseraph has a chance of convincing anyone to persuade its lies -- subject to the demon making a Will roll, and the target failing one. And it should have a reasonable chance without having to minmax to get Will above 8. If the Essence thing bothers you, then make it more difficult. Give the Impudite a penalty of target's total forces when sucking Essence, or give the target a bonus to the resistance roll of Ethereal+Celestial Forces. I think what was intended was that most Impudites tend to be (supernaturally) charming, but only the most strong willed can reliably steal Essence. That's not what the current rules do. jo [Taking my regular Essence hit from Malphas :) ] ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:40:20 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Impudite Resonance? Leath Sheales wrote: > Honestly, how many players do you have that like to play > stereotypical characters? You may have a lot, but the groups I > have seen always want their characters to be something a little > different. Amen. Makes one wonder why game designers bother to develop character classes / archetypes / templates at all. Except that it gives players something to play AGAINST. In fact, it is my general role-playing experience that players barely get into a game setting before they want to push its envelope. They want to play emotional Vulcans or compassionate devils or oozing slime from another dimension who is, nonetheless, a suave and cool guy, etc. A friend of mine once observed that, for Edgar Rice Burroughs (author of Tarzan and the John Carter of Mars series), nowhere was ever far enough away. It wasn't enough to be in the jungle, you had to have a lost city in the jungle. It wasn't enough to be on Mars, you had to be in a forgotten valley on Mars. I do see some exploration of the themes given, but it's extraordinary how quickly people want to stand the setting on its head. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:38:28 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> Impudites >Liam wrote: > >> i don't know, it smacks of min-maxing to me. a bruiser character is a >> personality, an impudite is (kind-of) a race. why should it be a choice >> between impudite and bruiser? surely they're different things entirely. you >> should be able to have a bruiser impudite, or a comedian impudite, or a >> ninja impudite, or whatever. it seems strange to me that all impudites >> should have very strong will. > > Then don't expect to be able to use your Resonance. If you want anImpudite >bruiser, he won't be able to steal Essence. Um (raises hand), what about that longish character description I just posted? I think Marco is a bruiser. 90 Body hits and the ability to kick the stuffing out of your average 9-Force angel. And while he'd have trouble stealing Essence from a random stranger, his 9 Will means he'd have a decent chance at it (about 40%, on average). And -- point, here -- he's an Impudite, so he *doesn't* have to go after random strangers. He's dug into that neighborhood like a tick. He's got a stable of "friends" with lowered resistance (straight Will roll to resonate), and he can also "work the neighborhood" for Essence. He could drain himself in a fight, duck into the neighborhood, and come back in less than an hour completely recharged and with a dozen burly friends backing him up. One has to keep in mind that the Impudite resonance can be used again and again; even if it has a less-than-even chance of working on *one* human, it'll get plenty of hits out of a group of them. I think Imps are slightly more challenging than other Bands, but they're completely playable IMO. You can get fun PCs and some surprisingly tough and challenging NPCs out of them. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:46:27 -0500 From: neel@cswv.com Subject: Re: Adventures (was IN> How and Why Laurence Became the General of the Host) Walter Milliken wrote: > >At 20:32 -0500 11/18/99, Steel Angel wrote: >> >>Unfortunately, many Celestials are in no way constrained by -human- law. >>Nothing stops a lot of them from dealing out their own justice as long as it >>isn't Dissonant. Now Judgies may want to do this for their Rite, but I'm sure >>an equal number of them just punish an offender as they deserve. And then >>there are the Gabrielites... > >And this is when the GM should start whacking the PCs with the corporeal >consequences from their actions. Killing random humans is both noisy >and attracts far too much attention from human authorities. It's certainly >an option, but it's not particularly safe for any celestial with a Role to >do this, or one who's likely to hang around town for any time. Beating them >up is even worse -- it leaves someone to complain to the cops. [...] > >Anyway, if your players simply take the brute force approach to everything, >tossing a mystery at them is usually going to be something of a waste. I think this misses the original point: Michael smashing one of Yves's tethers in an easily-traced way is a problem because of the repercussions in the *angelic* society. The players aren't constrained by human law because it's simply not relevant. Sure, Joe G-man might be dubious when Bob the angel says he just knows that Michael did it, but what about when Bob tells another angel? It's not like there's going to be much doubt when he announces the results of his resonance scan in the angelic tongue, is there? It's doubly problematic when a supposedly-brilliant archangel embarks a just plain dumb plan. (Fall of the Malakim was the worst -- David's true word was revealed to be "dumb as a bag of rocks" rather than stone.) - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswv.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:59:48 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: Celestial Personality (was Re: IN> Impudite Resonance?) Jo Hart wrote: > So tell me this. What type of demon do you build if you just want > one which will be intelligent, competent, and capable of following > orders? If that's ALL you want, you sift through your population of damned human souls. You've got roughly 1/13th of all the damned there are, so there've got to be plenty like that in there. Why bother to build anything? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:03:46 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Bright Bands Steel Angel wrote: > Now there's an atypical character concept. A Shedite 'Terror Trooper' > or something. [...] > Bodyjump someone, slave them down, and attack your target, then leave > when things are done. Hard for anyone to track and terrifying enough > to engender -major- paranoia in anyone who knows 'something's not > right, here.' Maybe not a typical IN character concept, but very, very like what actual demonic possession is often thought to be like, though maybe a little more directed than the "real thing" usually seems to be. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:10:03 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Impudite Resonance? >In fact, it is my general role-playing experience that players >barely get into a game setting before they want to push its >envelope. They want to play emotional Vulcans or compassionate >devils or oozing slime from another dimension who is, nonetheless, >a suave and cool guy, etc. Point! This matches my experience, too. It ain't _always_ true, but there's at least one in every gaming group ("Well, yeah he's an assassin, but he's not _really_ evil...") >A friend of mine once observed that, for Edgar Rice Burroughs >(author of Tarzan and the John Carter of Mars series), nowhere was >ever far enough away. It wasn't enough to be in the jungle, you >had to have a lost city in the jungle. It wasn't enough to be >on Mars, you had to be in a forgotten valley on Mars. Heh. Very true. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:13:35 -0600 From: "Trent" Subject: RE: IN> Sow the Wind... >>Janus >>Demon Prince of the Whirl Wind >> >>"The world is ashes. Ashes in the wind." >Heh. I like it! >And it's one of the smoother Ofanite-to-Calabite transitions, ennit. Thank you. >>Dissonance >>It is dissonant for an Angel of the Whirlwind to change something for the >>better. Everything they do must contribute to the ultimate destruction of >>order. >"Chaotic change for the worse" is probably a good translation of this Word. >As opposed to, mmm, say Corruption, which is more gradual and orderly >change for the worse. Right. Good point I'll consider clarifying in v2.0. >>Reap the Whirlwind >>This attunement allows the user to summon an uncontrollable whirlwind with a >>force equivalent to the essence spent to power the attunement. No essence >>spent will produce a dust devil, while if a demon could muster 50 essence he >>could summon a full blown tornado. The whirlwind lasts a d6 minutes. >Mmmm, this seems a little vague. What would (say) a 3-Essence whirlwind do? Yeah, I planed to leave it up to the GM and what was appropriate to the story. >>Fan the Flames >>This attunement allows the demon to accelerate the inherent entropic >>collapse of an item a number of years equal to 2*(celestial forces + word >>forces). >"Word forces"? Yep. Go buy the GMG. >>The first of the prime elemental angels to fall Janus received a warm >>welcome (especially on Belial's part) into the hellish fold. He quickly >>established a working relation ship with Belial and Saminga is fond of him. >>Most of the Impudite princes annoy him as the Shal-Mari block try's to halt >>the end of all. >Yeah, Armageddon would have to be _real_ high on his agenda. Not necessarily. He doesn't care if Armageddon come; he just wants to eliminate order. It's a very fine line but the main point is that Armageddon would _probably_ follow in his wake if Janus was let loose. >>Allied: Belial (Belial is allied with Janus) >>Associated: No One (Saminga is associated with Janus) >>Neutral: Everyone Else >I'd think Baal would like him. Or is he just too chaotic? Maybe. Trying to figure out how each superior would react was giving me headaches, so the relations table is very much a rough draft. Trent Ofanite of Doubt ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:15:04 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> Re: Adventures >It's doubly problematic when a supposedly-brilliant archangel embarks >a just plain dumb plan. (Fall of the Malakim was the worst -- David's >true word was revealed to be "dumb as a bag of rocks" rather than stone.) I'll add my voice to not liking the Michael adventure in the LR... even in a low contrast "French style" campaign, that one has serious problems. But "Fall of the Malakim", though seriously troubled, works MUCH better when played in tandem with the excellent "Final Trumpet". A lot of what people don't like in FotM is lead-in and backstory for FT. Frex, when you GM it, you'll find that it will tend to leave players confused, upset, and apprehensive... troublesome in a stand-alone adventure, but perfectly appropriate when the next step is confronting the Apocalypse. I agree that David doesn't come out of it very well. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:19:47 -0500 From: neel@cswv.com Subject: Re: IN> Bright Shedim Ehrbar wrote: > >Well, that's how I originally was going to write up the Bright Shedim. >The problem is that then they aren't really Shedim anymore. But >Shedim are required to make their hosts commit "an act of selfishness >that indisputably harms someone," (IN p.51) or they take dissonance. Hey, no one ever said serving God was *easy*. Bright Shedim (The Martyrs) "For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 Every so often there are Shedim who repent of their evil ways, but have not been transformed into Kyriotates. Perhaps their celestial structure is too fragile to survive the transformation, perhaps the Shedite just doesn't want to run the risk of destruction before doing something to set the scales aright. In any event, these bright Shedim choose to serve God without becoming angels. In the service of Heaven, they retain the ability to possess mortals, but gain the additional dissonance condition that they may not take any action they take that corrupts their host. This is in addition to their original dissonance condition, so any Bright Shedite will accumulate at least one note of dissonance a day. Few last more than a few weeks to a couple of months before Discord destroys them. But during that brief time they can try to open their host's eyes to the truth of their moral condition, so that they too can begin to seek the light. The bulk of bright Shedim serve Gabriel and David, who of the archangels best understand the need of God that drives them to self-sacrifice. I posted a an NPC from my campaign, who might serve as a model, to the list last year: http://www.sjgames.com/ftp/sjgames/in-nomine/digests/1998/2/1-634.txt Search for "Slipgash." - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswv.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:26:11 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Impudite Resonance? Douglas Muir wrote: > Point! This matches my experience, too. It ain't _always_ true, but > there's at least one in every gaming group ("Well, yeah he's an > assassin, but he's not _really_ evil...") I've heard that one before. In my current game, I play the token mundane. Everyone else in the party is an alien, and elf, a robot, part dragon, genetically engineered, an animated statue, or a cat. (And, no, the cat isn't mundane. It's a CAT. Also, it's one of the genetically engineered, and is a test pilot.) I feel confident that, if we started an IN game, at least one would be a Renegade and at least one would be an Ethereal -- possibly a pagan god -- wanting to cozy up to the angels. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 10:32:52 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Bright Shedim Neel wrote: > Bright Shedim (The Martyrs) > This is in addition to > their original dissonance condition, so any Bright Shedite will > accumulate at least one note of dissonance a day. Few last more than a > few weeks to a couple of months before Discord destroys them. Bingo. One would like to think that Gabriel (or Soldekai) and David detail cherubs to track these guys and haul them in at the last minute for an emergency-room try at Redemption. ("Everybody stand clear!" Zot!) Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 11:36:08 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: Adventures (was IN> How and Why Laurence Became the General of the Host) At 5:32 PM -0800 11/18/99, Steel Angel wrote: >Eeyore wrote: [How even if you know the answer, you may still need to prove it via non-supernatural means.] (Or appropriately frame someone...) > Unfortunately, many Celestials are in no way constrained by -human- law. However, many, with Roles, _are_. If they go out playing vigelante, the cops will be after _them_. Naturally, if you're running that kind of "mystery," you need to have people who care if their Role gets trashed. But there are many reasons why celestials might want to play nice. Nobody wants to accidentally develop the Role of Wanted Killer, either... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1422 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.