From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Mar 8 14:17:23 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10295 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 1999 14:17:23 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id NAA24850 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 8 Mar 1999 13:14:29 -0600 Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 13:14:29 -0600 Message-Id: <199903081914.NAA24850@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1137 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, March 8 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1137 In this digest: Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim Re: IN> Re: nature of evil Re: IN> Corporeal Death (was FoTM) IN> [plot hook] virtually addicted Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim IN> Calabim Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim IN> IN fluff/OT Re: IN> Re: Nature of evil Re: IN> Re: Corporeal Death (was FotM) Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink IN> [ADMIN] Fwd: failure notice Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink Re: IN> Re: Nature of evil Re: IN> [ADMIN] Fwd: failure notice Re: IN> Re: nature of evil Re: IN> Question: Songs of Shields Re: IN> FoTM: Asmodeus' Angel Spotters??? Re: IN> Celestial Capture Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink Re: IN> Question: Songs of Shields Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 07 Mar 1999 13:47:45 -0800 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim Hydrax 59 wrote: > P.S. has anyone else ever thought that every time any calabim uses his > resonance, Belial grows? Why? The Calabite resonance is for destruction, which doesn't necessarily take the form of fire. It can also age, disintegrate, or erode the target, to give three fairly common examples. - -EDG - -- EDG, Mercurian of Jean, Angel of Information Dissemination anthoch@earlham.edu 159.28.165.120 "I never trust anybody who can't lie." - Caitlin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Mar 1999 13:53:48 -0800 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Re: nature of evil Hydrax 59 wrote: > > Okay,how about this. In your view, could someone ever be fated if they > followed their own personal honour systems - acting out what they saw as > good. By this I mean acting towards what they consider right. So could a > dictator do terrible things if HE believed that it was nessecary for the > welfare of the country. Absolutely. Destiny and Fate, IMO, are determined by how selfless or selfish you are - NOT by how "good" or "evil". A person could honestly feel that it was in the best interest of his community for them to give him all of their money - but it's not selfless. Likewise, if a person gave up everything, died for an organization knowing that it would carry nothing for him and only benefit said organization, that - IMO, again - is selfless; self-sacrifice without hope of benefit. > Actually, this would make the Malakim a lot more powerful as it would > allow them to see a persons good/evilness relative to that persons own > standerds. Malakim _only_ see a person's honor/dishonor relative to that person's own standards. In Nomine, p. 101. - -EDG - -- EDG, Mercurian of Jean, Angel of Information Dissemination anthoch@earlham.edu 159.28.165.120 "I never trust anybody who can't lie." - Caitlin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Mar 1999 14:15:20 -0800 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Corporeal Death (was FoTM) Tick Tock wrote: > Perhaps I am misunderstanding your explanation. It seems you were saying that > a demon experiences a completely opposite effect from that of an angel. Rather > than being cut off from the Symphony as an angel would be, a demon is exposed to > it without the balm of it's own selfish symphony for protection. That doesn't > make sense me. IMHO it would seem that any celestial being would experience the > same effect though it's nature would dictate it's reaction to that effect. > Either both are cut off or both are not. If I've failed to comprehend > adaquately please let me know. I do value the manner in which you've worked the > Heart into the death/trauma/recovery cycle. I understand what Whistling meant; however, I'm coming up with yet another theory: When a celestial dies corporeally, she is separated from the Symphony that she knows - whether it be God's Symphony, for an angel, or her personal Symphony, for a demon - and in that moment in which she's separated, she's separated from _everything_, celestial, ethereal, or corporeal, and she experiences a moment, a split second, an eternity of Limbo. That instant is so utterly terrifying - being so completely _alone_ - that the soul somewhat goes into shock. And then she hears her Heart. Her Heart, that which loves her completely and will always be there, even when all else is gone. Her Heart, screaming and crying out in pain because she _is_ _not_ _there_, reaching out and tugging her back to reality. And at the same time her Symphony comes back, in full force; and everything causes the celestial in question to reach back to her Heart and cling to it, in complete shock, while her Heart soothes and calms her, and readies her to return to consciousness. C&C? - -EDG - -- EDG, Mercurian of Jean, Angel of Information Dissemination anthoch@earlham.edu 159.28.165.120 "I never trust anybody who can't lie." - Caitlin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Mar 1999 19:25:18 +0000 From: Simon Killingray Subject: IN> [plot hook] virtually addicted I am writing this as a plot hook that I hope to make more detailed later so any input you have will be gratefully recevied as it will just make it better. This is stutible for heaven sent or Hellspawn. I new virtual reality system is being beta tested, the standard of the graphics and interactivity are streets ahead of what we have now. This will be a new dawn (or dusk) in our technology! For the trial a complex will opened will be opened by a major hardware manufacter, which will remain nameless and from the volenteers I demographically representive sample of 50 people will be choose to try out this new gear totally free of charge. This of course to any interested celestial parties has all the hallmarks of the demon prince of technology! SET UP Vapula, is indeed behind this, but for the moment would like to keep that quiet this particular invention has great possiblities, but while he would not admit this to anyone it might just be a little on the unstable side. This is why it's being beta tested rather than released, as is to humanity. Vapula's cover story Many words have been used to describe Vapula, stupid is not one of them. Vapula is quite well aware that due to the nature the beta test this will be connected to him so he has concocted a cover story. Vapula has told the vast majority of his servants that the aim of this new VR equipment is to blur the line between fantasy and reality so after playing a VR shoot em up where it all seemed so real an unfortunate human wouldn't see too much difference between that and picking up a real gun.... He has also told his servants that one of the reason humans will find it so addictive is that a essence is given to them atomatically ever time they commit some bad act in VR. He has given orders to his servants not to share this information with anyone except servants of Baal which he has roped in for security on this job. After all when people let go of there agression war is the normal result. Vapula knows that Hell being what it is this information will get out and be deemed real because of the trouble taken finding it out. Vapula's intent The real purpose of the VR euipment is told one to the top-ranking demons on the project and definately not shared with Baal. The reason for the VR rig is that using it vapula things that he can suck essence and maybe even forces right out of the people using it and into the demons operating it. Such an ability if successful could prove a major turning point in the war (not to mention his word!) hence the abnormal level of care he is showing testing the experiment. The Problem The VR rig works! It will drain essence and forces from any being using the VR rig straight into any one demon operating it. The problem is that in absorbing the essence or forces the demons force pattern will be altered, in layman's terms it is now leaking. Any essence or force obtained in this way will slowly drain away and the drain won't stop there unless the demon takes action his forces will seperate leading him to dissolution. Note: that action in this case will normally mean stealing more forces to replace the ones that were lost. [ This is where I run into problems as well I need some system to model this: I want those demons who steal essence only to first lose essence then start taking celestial hits which can only be healed by stolen essence which will in turn cause more hits. The effects should appear within a couple of days of the first draining. For those drain forces the effect should be the same but faster appearing within a day and leading to dissolution faster. What I want to do with this effect is model sevre addition where by getting lots of stolen power the demon can almost but not quite stop the decline. ] The only way for a demon to be cured is if the central control is destoryed at which point the hole in his being will be plugged. Not an easy thing to do with the a legion of Baal's finest on guard duty. Once a demon has been "addicted" he gains the ability to drain essence or forces using the same mechanics as an impudite without needing to use VR. This lasts until cured. A more worrying matter for those not already addicted is that if an addicted demon drains them of a force they too become addicted. Setting the stage: This first test will be in a out of the way compound with a hi-tech security system and boasting a very nasty security company (Baal's demon's) In fact any one with access to police files willl see a whole group of hit men out of work mercinaries and former special forces people on the pay roll of the scurity team. There are also sevants from virtually every other prince in hell trying to work out wants what so important it's so well guarded. Malphas is having a field day. In many ways hell has shot itself in the foot as it's child's play for any angels sneaking around as theres so much noise for want the various demons are doing it's easy to cover any trace. Due to the amount of Baals demons a frontal attack is sucide. PCs will be better of sneaking around finding out what they can. Timeline At first all is going to go fine at the beta test about 2 days in a demons will trying drawing forces. A few days later there panic adict other demons who will in turn addict demons then choas. demons fighting demons addicted servants of baal fighting there brethin choas. At this point any interested PC demons or Angels might be able to convice enough of Baals people to blow the central control or at least use the chaos to blow the central control themselves. Theres a bit more to add but I thing this is big enough for one post. Tell me what you think. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Simon Killingray "Eeeeeewwwwww, that's the third Jedi we've lost this month. I tell you we've got to make it more obvious which end of the lightsaber is which!" - Jedi training camps: The Untold Story - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- See my site on the Web at: http://www.rdg.ac.uk/~smu96spk/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Mar 1999 20:42:42 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim On Sun, 7 Mar 1999 BillionSix@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 3/7/99 12:28:18 AM Central Standard Time, > hydrax@hotmail.com writes: > > > has anyone else ever thought that every time any calabim uses his > > resonance, Belial grows? > > That's probably why Belial's own Calabim are so bad-ass. Honestly, isn't > Calabim of Fire the demon character every munchkin on earth wants to play? No. Munchkin want their Calabite to have Baal's attunement as well. Think about THAT combo. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! ::: Thinking about a Tampa Bay Devival in the future - email me! ::: Or go to http://www.cris.com/~pkitty (hell, go there anyways!) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Mar 1999 21:08:10 -0800 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim Pee Kitty wrote: > No. Munchkin want their Calabite to have Baal's attunement as well. > Think about THAT combo. Gah. It took me a bit to figure out _why_ Baal's Calabite attunement was useful at all... but... gah. Actually, add Andre's Calabite attunement... *shudder* - -EDG - -- EDG, Mercurian of Jean, Angel of Information Dissemination anthoch@earlham.edu 159.28.165.120 "I never trust anybody who can't lie." - Caitlin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Mar 1999 21:55:20 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: IN> Calabim On Sun, 7 Mar 1999, EDG wrote: > Pee Kitty wrote: > > No. Munchkin want their Calabite to have Baal's attunement as well. > > Think about THAT combo. > > Gah. It took me a bit to figure out _why_ Baal's Calabite attunement > was useful at all... but... gah. I remember a long while back I posted an off-the-cuff interp of Spawn as a demon. I think he had 6/5/6 Forces with both of those attunements. Heh. Y'know, I love abusing rules to think up total munchkin characters almost as much as I hate using 'em (or letting others use 'em)...there's just something fun about MAKING them. > Actually, add Andre's Calabite attunement... *shudder* Naw, can't take a Force. Not as useful as it could be. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! ::: Thinking about a Tampa Bay Devival in the future - email me! ::: Or go to http://www.cris.com/~pkitty (hell, go there anyways!) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Mar 1999 22:51:58 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim In a message dated 3/7/99 7:46:44 PM Central Standard Time, Pkitty@concentric.net writes: > > That's probably why Belial's own Calabim are so bad-ass. Honestly, isn't > > Calabim of Fire the demon character every munchkin on earth wants to play? > > No. Munchkin want their Calabite to have Baal's attunement as well. > > Think about THAT combo. > ::moment of stunned silence:: Wow. Just wow. Brian A. Rogers ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Mar 1999 21:05:22 -0800 (PST) From: -=|horsefly|=- Subject: IN> IN fluff/OT On Sat, 6 Mar 1999, Whistling in the Dark wrote: > they had. Fleurity has a servitor working for him with the Word of Role > Playing Supplements, I'm just sure. [snip before and after quote] heh, to paraphrase Casca, "role-playing games: drugs would be cheaper!" i'm sure Fleurity has a servitor with the word of Anime, too ;) -=|horsefly|=- "Back off, preacher, I don't care if it's Sunday. I ain't no angel, but I never felt better!" --FREEDOM, Alice Cooper ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 13:27:36 +0000 From: Kevin Walsh Subject: Re: IN> Re: Nature of evil On Sat, Mar 06, 1999 at 01:32:13PM -0500, Whistling in the Dark wrote: > >Okay. Try this. > >A Seraph tells the truth. A Balseraph has people believe him. > >A Mercurian loves humanity. An Impudite gets people to adore him. > >An Ofanite moves swiftly. A Calabite _gets_obstacles_out_of_his_way_. > > > (I've written my own thoughts about Calabim with a perspective much influenced by Stephen Donaldson. It can be found on Jo Hart's webpage, at www.btinternet.com/~jhart/IN.html) But anyway, I remember reading Hitherby's take on the Cherub of the Wind and Djinn of Theft attunements, that someone attuned to by either of them would partially understand their true natures, causing love of the Cherub and fear of the Djinn. I think that this difference can be extended into some of the other Theft/Wind attunements. The Ofanite of the Wind attunement allows them to see the quickest and most effective way to get by the obstruction, whereas the Calabite attunement simply weakens it. The Mercurian attunement allows them to find the quickest way through a crowd, whereas the Impudite attunement causes people to want to get out of the nice Impudite's way. It has no particular rules application (though it means a perceptive Windy or Thief should be able to spot the difference more easily), but I think it's nice for style purposes. A cunning explanation of the difference between the Elohite/Habbalite and Kyriotate/Shedite attunements is beyond me, however. Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. - -- "With such tripe masses of human beings were tranquilised - until those rare occasions when they woke up, saw what was happening around them, misunderstood it, and did their best to impose the stupidest possible solution on the men who normally led them." A Dark and Hungry God Arises, by Stephen Donaldson. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 15:02:44 -0000 From: "Ramesh Satkurunath" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Corporeal Death (was FotM) EDG wrote: >and death by an Archangel of Death in bunny slippers, NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Not bunny slippers! Ramesh aka Demon of Fiddling, Balseraph of ???? "First you must learn Fiddling, then you must forget Fiddling. Must you remember to breath for breathing to occur? No. It is the same with Fiddling" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 16:12:56 -0000 From: "Ramesh Satkurunath" Subject: Re: IN> Calabim/ofanim Brian A. Rogers wrote on 07 March 1999 >In a message dated 3/7/99 12:28:18 AM Central Standard Time, >hydrax@hotmail.com writes: > >> has anyone else ever thought that every time any calabim uses his >> resonance, Belial grows? > >That's probably why Belial's own Calabim are so bad-ass. Honestly, isn't >Calabim of Fire the demon character every munchkin on earth wants to play? Not *every* munchin, only one of the characters munchkins in my group have come up with was a Calabim of Fire, I seem to remember a fondness of the Scabbard attunement... Ramesh aka Demon of Fiddling, Balseraph of ???? "First you must learn Fiddling, then you must forget Fiddling. Must you remember to breath for breathing to occur? No. It is the same with Fiddling" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 15:57:23 -0000 From: "Ramesh Satkurunath" Subject: Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink Martin Arnold wrote on 07 March 1999 >For my money, Lilim resonance is inherently selfish; how can it be used >for good? Is the Resonance of the Lilim anymore inherently selfish than Marc's Word of Trade? Ramesh aka Demon of Fiddling, Balseraph of ???? "First you must learn Fiddling, then you must forget Fiddling. Must you remember to breath for breathing to occur? No. It is the same with Fiddling" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 11:53:53 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> [ADMIN] Fwd: failure notice Okay, this person's tried to s*bscribe twice. >Date: 6 Mar 1999 07:12:49 -0000 >From: MAILER-DAEMON@cdc.net >To: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: failure notice > >Hi. This is the qmail-send program at cdc.net. >I'm afraid I wasn't able to deliver your message to the following addresses. >This is a permanent error; I've given up. Sorry it didn't work out. > >: >Sorry, no mailbox here by that name. (#5.1.1) So, until I get a *real* address that doesn't bounce (little ethereal gods but my email is full today!), "innomine@cdc.net" is going to be un-s*bscribed every time I catch it. - --Beth, Demon Princess of Nitpicking http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/INChar/Demons/Prince.Beth.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 17:02:05 +0000 From: Kevin Walsh Subject: Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink On Mon, Mar 08, 1999 at 03:57:23PM +0000, Ramesh Satkurunath wrote: > >For my money, Lilim resonance is inherently selfish; how can it be used > >for good? > > Is the Resonance of the Lilim anymore inherently selfish than Marc's Word > of Trade? > The difference between many geasa and agreed upon trades is a rather large one. One is a compulsion, and the other isn't. Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. - -- "With such tripe masses of human beings were tranquilised - until those rare occasions when they woke up, saw what was happening around them, misunderstood it, and did their best to impose the stupidest possible solution on the men who normally led them." A Dark and Hungry God Arises, by Stephen Donaldson. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 99 9:23:51 PST From: nick jost Subject: Re: IN> Re: Nature of evil > >a person > >with good intentions who does evil will also go to Hell. > > why if they truly believe it was right? And does this mean that every > leader who ever ordered an execution is damned? > Be careful. Your assuming that killing is the same is murdering. Almost every society draws a very distinct line between the two. From what we've seen H&H do the same thing. - -- Kakita ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 12:28:49 -0500 From: Matthew Rice Subject: Re: IN> [ADMIN] Fwd: failure notice Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > > Okay, this person's tried to s*bscribe twice. > So, until I get a *real* address that doesn't bounce (little ethereal > gods but my email is full today!), "innomine@cdc.net" is going to be > un-s*bscribed every time I catch it. > > --Beth, Demon Princess of Nitpicking > http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles/INChar/Demons/Prince.Beth.html Very odd...I'm at cdc.net as well. For that matter, I may know who it is trying to subscribe. I'll call and find out. Matthew Rice ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 99 9:46:37 PST From: nick jost Subject: Re: IN> Re: nature of evil > Okay,how about this. In your view, could someone ever be fated if they > followed their own personal honour systems - acting out what they saw as > good. By this I mean acting towards what they consider right. So could a > dictator do terrible things if HE believed that it was nessecary for the > welfare of the country. > > Actually, this would make the Malakim a lot more powerful as it would > allow them to see a persons good/evilness relative to that persons own > standerds. > What they FEEL doesn't matter. What they did, whether it was selfish or not is the only thing that matters. - -- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 13:05:24 -0500 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> Question: Songs of Shields EDG wrote: > > Thinking about recent events in our game, I became curious about the > canon workings of the Songs of Shields. > > To be more specific, what effects do the Songs have in the various > realms? Does Celestial Shields produce a barrier, a la Corporeal > Shields, in the Celestial realm? > > If so, can this be used to prevent a celestial from returning to her > Heart - or to trap one after the death of its corporeal body? Oooooh, fun question! The Shields ONLY have the abilities listed. None of them can prevent a celestial form from going through them (either a conscious or a 'dead' one going to a heart). Note that the corporeal song is useless on the ethereal or celestial planes and the ethereal song cannot function on the celestial planes, IIRC. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 13:20:20 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> FoTM: Asmodeus' Angel Spotters??? At 6:22 PM -0600 3/6/99, Elizabeth Bartley wrote: >Mira the Inquisition probably has no claim on, but she just screams out >for reassignment. Screams out worse than Max, actually. What is a Bright >Lilim doing in a demon-controlled city where the Game can find her at any >time? What the *hell* is an angel with a major Geas owed _directly to a >Demon Prince_ doing where it's most convenient for a Prince to call it in? Waiting for it to be called in, in a place where she can't really take anyone with her. Would you rather that she were in San Francisco? "Here, Mira. Take this box to the basement of that building over there. Push the button. Say hi to Blandine when you wake up from Trauma." Or Paris, perhaps. "You're an angel, and thank you so much for being here. I'll send you a picture of the mushroom cloud at Notre Dame when you wake up." (Of course, that does assume that Lilim psychology is simply *so* biased towards fulfilling Geases that their brains just turn off. Though a Bright has more to lose from dissonance than a dark one -- she can, after all, Fall again.) [But then, I *do* assume that Lilim are inclined to avoid dissonance and fulfill Geases; my PC slammed her Renegade sister up against a wall and screamed, "You *****, you put me in Geas-conflict with an Archangel!" Which wasn't the smartest thing to reveal, but she was in Geas-conflict...] - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 13:20:06 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Capture At 11:07 PM -0500 3/6/99, Whistling in the Dark wrote: >David Edelstein writes: >>>>>Besides, they don't have to catch every angel trying to slip in. They >>just >>have to catch a few. And tear apart their vessels and drag their celestial >>forms to Hell [...] >>How exactly would that be done? [...] >But EDG writes: >>[...] Does Celestial Shields produce a barrier, a la Corporeal >>Shields, in the Celestial realm? >>If so, can this be used to prevent a celestial from returning to her >>Heart - or to trap one after the death of its corporeal body? > >Yeah! Yeah! That's it! That's what I was thinking of when I was talking >about Celestial Capture by the Game in that earlier post! Honest! Why are >you looking at me like that.... There are also (currently) non-canon artifacts in the HUNT story that I and Maya did versions of, which is at the INC fiction page. (Little gold nooses, used for dragging unconscious Renegades back to Hell; beloved of Gamesters, and rarely loaned out...) (One assumes they cost some amount of Essence to use, and that the captured celestial gets a Will-relic's level roll to avoid being pulled celestial and then another one to avoid being dragged back to the Gamester's Heart as it descends. This is, of course, what Celestial Charm is for.) Another nasty trick is Ethereal Attraction, which has been used by an Impudite of Fate in Maya's Fiat Justitia game. Let's see -- one infatuated Ofanite followed the Impudite to the Archives (along with a Kyriotate, trying to bring the Ofanite to sense) and only barely got out in time... And then there was the Malakite who sat down for tea until (that same) Kyriotate possessed his vessel and got them away. IOW, "Why, yes, preach redemption to me! Just let me hold onto my Heart while we do this. Oh, and I'll have to give notice personally to my Prince." - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 13:29:02 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink At 3:49 AM -0800 3/6/99, Martin Arnold wrote: >On the subject of FotM and it's many errorsÖ > >Beth: "Bingo -- the Sense for Betrayal attunement (Heaven & Hell, p. 24) >detects dissonance in *anyone*, combined with... Shedim (can't possess >celestials), Habbalah (limited emotion-sense like Elohim), Lilim >(Need-readers), as well as some mundane background checks on suspicious >folks..." > >Can you explain this in the context of the question (the airport Q); I >don't understandÖ Indeed. The explanation is, simply, that anyone with a trace of dissonance can be picked up by a Gamester with Sense of Betrayal. Shedim can try to possess a random sampling of the passengers -- anyone they can't slip into is a celestial. (They can also possess the staff and check to see which cities people have come from -- and monitor closely the flights coming from angel-dominated areas.) Shedim are also nasty if you want to send a Soldier into the area, because they get to riffle through his memories. Habbalah can look for emotions like, "I am being sneaky and worried I might get caught." (IPG, sophisticated use of resonance.) Lilim can read needs bip-bip-bip as they make eye-contact. Needs to infiltrate, needs to not get caught, needs to slay evil... No, they're not going to get everyone. But they don't have to get everyone immediately. They just have to get *enough* people... >Actually while you're at it, could you explain Bright Lilim! :-) They, like Lilith, are rule-breakers. (Humans can't have Words. But do you want to tell *Lilith* that?) The Lilim resonance is to see needs, and then ensure that they get paid back for fulfilling them. Seeing needs is not inherantly "Evil" -- it's even close to what Elohim can do. Imposing Geases can be selfish, or it can be selfless -- such as a Lilim making a scumbag businessman give to charity (Lilim of Gabriel, anyone?) or forcing a demon to keep its word (Lilim of the Sword, perhaps?). Also check out the "agreed-upon-Geases" (in the Infernal Player's Guide, sophisticated use of resonance) and Trade's Divine Contract Servitor Attunement. Lilim have free will. They can choose to do good just as they can choose to be lazy and do evil. A Bright can choose to never invoke a hook, or even to vanish them immediately upon acquiring them. That's why some call them "Gifters." Of course, others call them "Troubles," because that's what they cause a lot of. Go check out Redemption in the IPG for more along those lines. The little greenies get their own sections. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 13:48:38 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Question: Songs of Shields At 1:05 PM -0500 3/8/99, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: >EDG wrote: >> If so, can this be used to prevent a celestial from returning to her >> Heart - or to trap one after the death of its corporeal body? > > Oooooh, fun question! > The Shields ONLY have the abilities listed. However, check out some of the Songs in the Liber Canticorum -- such as, IIRC, Forbidding. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Mar 1999 19:06:54 -0000 From: "Ramesh Satkurunath" Subject: Re: IN> Vurt, FotM, the Kitchen Sink Kevin Walsh wrote on 08 March 1999 >On Mon, Mar 08, 1999 at 03:57:23PM +0000, Ramesh Satkurunath wrote: >> >For my money, Lilim resonance is inherently selfish; how can it be used >> >for good? >> >> Is the Resonance of the Lilim anymore inherently selfish than Marc's Word >> of Trade? >> >The difference between many geasa and agreed upon trades is a rather large >one. One is a compulsion, and the other isn't. Ahh... I see, because you *have* to pay the Lilim back it's obviously evil. But if you were able to walk away from the bargain like a normal deal it'd be okay. Ramesh aka Demon of Fiddling, Balseraph of ???? "First you must learn Fiddling, then you must forget Fiddling. Must you remember to breath for breathing to occur? No. It is the same with Fiddling" ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1137 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.