From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sun Aug 8 20:32:54 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA12517 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:32:54 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id UAA32057 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:30:53 -0500 Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:30:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199908090130.UAA32057@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1302 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Sunday, August 8 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1302 In this digest: IN> Fire the Boss and break the Alarm Clock! IN> CPG Cuts: Sorcerous Rituals -- Curse IN> CPG Cuts: Advantages IN> New rules questions -- minor Night Music spoiler Re: IN> New rules questions -- minor Night Music spoiler RE: IN> New rules questions -- minor Night Music spoiler IN> AI Plot Seed (was Hacking) Re: IN> AI Plot Seed (was Hacking) Re: IN> AI Plot Seed (was Hacking) IN> Re: Rules questions . . . ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 07 Aug 99 10:33:26 EST From: success@abf.se Subject: IN> Fire the Boss and break the Alarm Clock! TRIPLE YOUR $ THIS MONTH Would You Take Out 15 Seconds To Read Something If U Knew You Would Triple Your Money In The Next 3 months? It is happening To Hundreds of People Every Month! Fire the Boss and break the Alarm Clock! - - I can truly say it was one of the best decisions of my life!!! - - Never commute again! - - Make $2000-$5000 or more per month from home! - - To find out how our system works: Call: 1-800 242-0363 Ex 8212 Listen to our 2 minute message Leave your name and Phone # BENEFIT: Stay home with the family! 14 Year Proven track record of success! You can start out in your spare time Work part time or work up to full time if you want to! It's your business! Call 1-800 242-0363 Ex 8212 No selling! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 10:24:51 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> CPG Cuts: Sorcerous Rituals -- Curse Here's another pre-playtest cut from the CPG. I wanted to add a bunch of new sorcerous skills and rituals, but just working with those already presented in the Marches, and expanding on them a bit, took up enough space; the CPG didn't have room to present a whole sorcerous grimoire. So here is the initial batch of additional rituals I cooked up, before deciding there wouldn't be room for them. These haven't been polished, and they haven't been playtested, so I make no guarantees as to their suitability. Need I mention that these are totally, completely, unofficial and non-canonical? - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----------------------------- Curse Will The sorcerous skill Curse is knowledge of how to manipulate the Symphony itself to bring about your will. Curse Rituals Some Curse rituals can actually be used to bless, but the selfish nature of sorcery makes it more difficult to do good than harm. These rituals are very powerful, as they affect the Symphony directly. As a result, they tend to have a high cost -- no doubt responsible for originating the "Threefold Law." Jinx (Curse/1) The subject will suffer bad luck at the worst time. If performed successfully, the subject may resist with a Will roll (ethereals and celestials add their Celestial Forces). If he fails to resist, the next time he tries to spend Essence to improve a d666 roll (consciously or unconsciously), that Essence will not be spent! Instead, the victim's roll will suffer a penalty equal to the check digit. Time: 10 minutes Essence: 2 x the check digit Blessing (Curse/2) This ritual works exactly like Jinx, above, except that the target does not need to resist, and instead of replacing the bonus for an Essence expenditure, the check digit will add to the subject's roll. A successful performance of this ritual on the victim of a Jinx will also dispel the jinx. Time: 10 minutes Essence: 2 x the check digit Luckless (Curse/3) This ritual deprives the victim of his "luck" by preventing him from regaining Essence. If the victim fails to resist with a Will roll (plus Celestial Forces for ethereal and celestials), he will not receive his daily Essence regeneration for CD days. This ritual does not prevent Rites from working, nor does it prevent the victim from receiving Essence from others or using reliquaries and spirit jars, etc. If this ritual fails, it affects the sorcerer instead! Time: 30 minutes Essence: 3 x the check digit Calamity (Curse/4) One of the most malevolent rituals, but completely unpredictable in its effects, a Calamity can be resisted with a Will roll (plus Celestial Forces for ethereals and celestials). If it is not resisted, then sometime in the near future, Something Bad will happen to the victim. The sorcerer has no way to influence exactly what will happen or when, but the check digit determines how bad it will be. A CD of 1 will result in a mere inconvenience, such as catching the victim in a traffic jam when he's late for work. A CD of 3 will cause something with serious repercussions, such as an important document being lost in the mail, while a CD of 6 can cause any misfortune that does not directly kill the subject. If this ritual fails, it affects the sorcerer instead! Time: 1 hour Essence: 3 x the check digit Remove Curse (Curse/5) This ritual can remove the effects of the Jinx, Luckless, or Calamity rituals, above. The ritual is treated as a Contest against the malign ritual. Time: 1 hour Essence: 3 x the check digit Change Weather (Curse/5) This ritual can affect local weather patterns. Some sorcerers, notably among tribal peoples, have studied the Curse skill only to use this ritual -- it used to be taught by many ethereal spirits. If the ritual is performed successfully, the local weather is "pushed" in the direction the sorcerer desires. (The area affected is up to the GM -- use the smallest region capable of sustaining its own local weather pattern, with a county being about the largest possible area.) The check digit determines both the duration, in hours, and the intensity of the effect. As a general rule, the temperature can be raised or lowered by 5 degrees Fahrenheit times the check digit, or generate other weather phenomena of equivalent severity. Thus, a check digit of 1 can cause only minor, barely noticeable changes, while a check digit of 6 can cause dramatic changes, but nothing supernatural; the ritual can bring rain during a drought, or diminish a tropical storm to a stiff breeze, but it can't bring snow to a hot desert or summon or banish a hurricane. Time: 4 hours Essence: 3 x the check digit Curse (Curse/6) This ritual afflicts the victim with long-term misfortune. The subject may resist with a Will roll (plus Celestial Forces for ethereals and celestials). It has two effects on those who fail to resist. First, every day, the victim must make a Will roll or he will not gain his daily Essence. (This does not affect Essence received from Rites, transfers from others or from reliquaries, etc.) Secondly, the victim will be plagued by a constant string of inconveniences and minor disasters. This is nothing that affects dice rolls, but the GM should engineer something inconvenient and annoying to happen to the character at least once a day, and anytime the GM has arbitrary discretion over the outcome of the character's actions, he should make the result bad. Nothing supernatural or wildly improbable should happen to the victim, but he will definitely feel like he is "cursed." The curse lasts for a number of weeks equal to the check digit of the ritual. There is no known ritual that can undo it -- however, killing the sorcerer who placed the Curse will end it . . . If this ritual is performed unsuccessfully, it affects the sorcerer! Time: 3 hours Essence: 3 x the check digit ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 10:28:31 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> CPG Cuts: Advantages Last set of CPG cuts. These advantages (for humans) WERE playtested, and found to be imbalancing and/or undesirable for other reasons. Use them at your own risk. Unofficial, non-canonical, etc. etc. - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------- Symphonic attunement Some mortals are unnaturally tuned in to the Symphony, and can hear certain strains above all background noise, even above their own deafness. They can hear disturbances, even if they are not Symphonically aware. For 4 points, a human is attuned to one kind of disturbance. This can be Songs, the sound of a celestial entering or leaving the corporeal plane, the sound of corporeal damage inflicted by a celestial, the sound of a human being killed by a celestial, etc. Humans without Symphonic awareness (Corporeal Player's Guide, p. 22) can roll to perceive disturbances made by that source. Mundanes may be very confused by the noises they hear; though they receive information about the disturbance as usual (In Nomine p. 55), they probably have no idea what it means! A human who does have Symphonic awareness gets a +2 bonus to hear that kind of disturbance. A human who is attuned to Songs may also learn them over time, if exposed to them often enough. (See Liber Canticorum, p. 13.) He must meet all the usual requirements in order to actually perform any Songs. However, there is a deeper form of Symphonic attunement. For an additional 2 points, a human can be attuned to a specific Song, and able to perform the Ethereal version of it, thanks to a very narrow link to the ethereal plane. For another 2 points, his attunement extends to the celestial plane as well! Even with a Symphonic attunement, no mortal with less than 6 Forces can perform any kind of Song. Note: A Symphonic attunement is a rare gift, one that often drives its recipient insane! It's mostly intended for NPCs, and definitely not intended to give human characters a convenient way of getting around the limitations on what Songs they can perform. You must be born with a Symphonic attunement; it's not something that can be acquired later in life, even with the help of a Superior. Superiors can bestow the Ethereal Connection and Celestial Connection attunements (Corporeal Player's Guide, pp. 27-28), but even they don't know what produces the rare human able to hear and play in the Symphony naturally. Divine/Infernal Favor Some mortals have a touch of Divinity or Infernal taint from birth, while others attract the attention of Higher Powers later in life, through unusual piety or unusual depravity. Some believe it is a sign of celestial ancestry. Almost always, they have a great Destiny and/or a terrible Fate. Celestials are inevitably drawn to these mysteriously favored mortals, hoping to push them towards or away from whatever greatness has been laid out for them. Even without overt meddling, Favored humans always know instinctively from an early age that they are meant for something special, and that Someone is watching over them. With all this influence, humans with Divine Favor usually turn out extremely virtuous and tend to live exemplary lives, while those with Infernal Favor are usually identified as "bad seeds" early on. But there have been startling exceptions on both sides . . . Divine or Infernal Favor costs 4 points per level; humans may buy up to 6 levels. It has the following effects: * The human benefits from Interventions of the appropriate type (and suffers from the opposite kind) as if he was a celestial; e.g., unlike mundanes (Corporeal Player's Guide, p. 10), he is treated as fully aligned and a full participant in the War. * He is more likely to receive favorable Interventions! When someone with Divine Favor gets two '1's on his success roll, the check digit is treated as a '1' also (i.e., a Divine Intervention) if it is equal to or less than his level of Divine Favor. Someone with Infernal Favor who rolls two '6's adds (Infernal Favor -1) to the check digit; if the total is 6 or higher, he receives an Infernal Intervention. Otherwise, revert to the unmodified check digit and treat it as a normal d666 roll. Example: Caleb "Big Brother Cal" Slade, televangelist and Satan's choirboy (Infernal Favor/4) is trying to Fast-Talk a Malakite into letting him out of his studio. He rolls a 12 with a check digit of 3 . . . normally, that would mean curtains for Brother Cal. But adding (4-1) = 3 to the check digit makes it a 6 -- Infernal Intervention! The Malakite is so taken in by Brother Cal's words that he ignores his resonance and believes the preacher's protestations of innocence! Not only does he let the human get away, but he actually covers the man's escape! * Favored humans tend to succeed when they really need to, because their prayers get answered. When making a focused effort (Corporeal Player's Guide, p. 20), add a human's level of Favor to the Essence spent. * Humans resisting diabolical resonances and attunements add any levels of Divine Favor to their roll; Infernal Favor acts as a bonus to resist angelic resonances and attunements. Divine/Infernal Favor does not help in resisting Songs. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 13:59:46 -0400 From: "Chris Bergstresser" Subject: IN> New rules questions -- minor Night Music spoiler A few other questions . . . In the In Nomine rulebook it says Celestials, in a vessel, have to breathe (although not eat or drink -- p. 48). In Night Music, the description of Zara's recuperative mud states that Humans, unlike Celestials, must use air tanks to stay submerged for any length of time. This one's not in the Errata. Next, looking through the archives, I'm noticing a lot of discussions and/or corrections for the combat system. Is there a brief summary of the official changes? Is everyone modifying the system in some way? What have people found to be the best way of dealing with it? - -- Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 14:38:56 -0400 From: "EDG (and Orc)" Subject: Re: IN> New rules questions -- minor Night Music spoiler At 01:59 PM 8/7/99 -0400, you wrote: > In the In Nomine rulebook it says Celestials, in a vessel, have to >breathe (although not eat or drink -- p. 48). In Night Music, the >description of Zara's recuperative mud states that Humans, unlike >Celestials, must use air tanks to stay submerged for any length of time. >This one's not in the Errata. I believe this one was discussed a couple months ago, and that it was decided that Zara's recuperative mud was "special"; submerged in it, celestials don't need to breathe (or can breathe it), but corporeals do. > Next, looking through the archives, I'm noticing a lot of discussions >and/or corrections for the combat system. Is there a brief summary of the >official changes? Is everyone modifying the system in some way? What have >people found to be the best way of dealing with it? I'll leave this to someone else to answer. :) I think there might be something in the In Nomine Collection (www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles), but I'm not sure. Eslin's in charge over there. :) - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 15:03:34 -0400 From: "Chris Bergstresser" Subject: RE: IN> New rules questions -- minor Night Music spoiler > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > [mailto:owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com]On Behalf Of EDG (and Orc) > > > In the In Nomine rulebook it says Celestials, in a vessel, have to > >breathe (although not eat or drink -- p. 48). In Night Music, the > >description of Zara's recuperative mud states that Humans, unlike > >Celestials, must use air tanks to stay submerged for any length of time. > >This one's not in the Errata. > > I believe this one was discussed a couple months ago, and that it was > decided that Zara's recuperative mud was "special"; submerged in it, > celestials don't need to breathe (or can breathe it), but corporeals do. That seems really odd to me. Isn't it easier to just come out and say the description goofed. rather than try and explain away the discrepancy? > > Next, looking through the archives, I'm noticing a lot of discussions > >and/or corrections for the combat system. > > I'll leave this to someone else to answer. :) I think there might be > something in the In Nomine Collection > (www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/articles), > but I'm not sure. Ah, yes. I've looked through there (thanks, Beth) and found the list of suggested combat modifications. That's really what prompted my question. I was really trying to get a sense of whether people in general had found modification to be necessary, and if so to what extent they went to work. - -- Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 18:31:35 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> AI Plot Seed (was Hacking) This discussion of hacking led to a plot seed that has been bubbling in the back of my head for a while. What would the attitude of Celestials be towards an AI? Let's say that there's a major research effort to develop true Artificial Intelligence. Let's say further that it seems to be moving towards success; they've developed a program that seems to be getting verrrry close to true thought. This raises some interesting metaphysical questions. Does the software have free will? If so, does it have a "soul" that can be saved or damned, or is it more like one of the undead? Can it be "programmed" to be good or evil? Different GMs will answer these questions differently. Still, I imagine various Superiors finding out about the (embryonic, possible) AI and coming up with various responses.... Blandine: Humans have been dreaming of this for centuries. Let's make sure the dream comes true in the best possible way. Dominic: Are these mortals usurping God's prerogative? Watch closely while I summon the Seraphic Council to confer. Eli: Cool. This is, like, the ultimate Creation thing, guys. Help them. Janus: Lovely chaos. Help them. Jean: No. They're not ready for this, and frankly, we aren't either. Sabotage this effort, but collect all the records and information possible. Jordi: They're moving further and further away from the natural world... I don't approve. Laurence: Could it be used as a weapon? Observe, and gaurd against Diabolical interference. Michael: The War won't be decided by this sort of gimmickry. Not interested. Novalis: If it's alive, it deserves to be protected and nurtured. Help it grow. Yves: If it has free will, it has a Destiny. Andrealphus: It won't have feelings, will it. Or a body either. I don't like it. Pull the plug. Asmodeus: A new factor in the War? I don't approve. Still, I won't say it should be destroyed until Lucifer has set a policy... watch, and watch how others respond to it. I'll be paying close attention. Baal: Imagine a software virus that can think... I like it. If it has free will, so much the better. Help them, and make sure that the new thing is on our side. Beleth: Humans have had nightmares about this for a long, long time. Let's make them come true. Kobal: Ohhhh, the possibilities. Help them. Kronos: If it has free will, it has a Fate. Lilith: If it has free will, it deserves to be free... at least until it chooses, of its own free will, to bind itself. If it's really intelligent, help it to escape, then find out what it wants and make a deal with it. Malphas: Another sort of intelligence means more opportunies for division... help them. Nybbas: Terminator! R2-D2! The Iron Giant! Furbies! Hot, hot, hot! Help them, then make sure that everyone finds out about the AI! Either the whole world should want one for Christmas... or everyone should hate and fear it as much as possible! Either way, I see biiiig numbers! Go, go, go! Saminga: A new kind of life? I say, a new kind of _Death_. Kill it. Valefor: Steal it and bring it to me. I have an idea... Vapula: (cackling madly) Yes, yes, yes, yes! I've been waiting for this for years! Make sure that it's intelligent, find out what it wants, and give it to it. It MUST be ours! I'm imagining various sorts of Servitors converging on the Silicon Valley startup or university research lab where the AI is being grown. Hmmm, the University of Illinois at Champaign would do very nicely, or Stanford or MIT if those are closer to home for your campaign. Roleplaying opportunities abound on a college campus... and the new Celestials in town may have some interactions with the ones who already have established Roles there (the Impudite of Haagenti who's a housefather on Fraternity Row, the Cherub of Yves who steers young souls towards their destinies, the Balseraph of Malphas who chairs the English Department...). The AI might be a false alarm... just a very very elaborate program that gives misleadingly lifelike responses. OTOH, it might be true AI. I'd say that such a "baby" AI would have one or two Forces -- either Ethereal or Celestial, at the GM's discretion. I'd think the "free will" question would be crucial. If it has free will, it's the Adam of a whole new race! This would attract attention from the highest levels on both sides. Imagine the Eden scenario being run all over again, but with an intelligent software program as the protagonist... If it *doesn't* have free will -- that is, if it can be programmed for "good", "evil", or whatever -- then it's still going to be very interesting to certain Superiors. Michael, Laurence and Baal will promptly classify it as a weapon; watch for struggles between these three and Jean and Vapula. And Jordi or Novalis might decide that, even if it lacks free will, it's still *alive*, like an animal or a tree, and so deserves respect and good treatment. Thoughts? Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 00:40:19 +0100 From: Ashley Subject: Re: IN> AI Plot Seed (was Hacking) Doug, Wonderful idea. >What would the attitude of Celestials be towards an AI? And what would be the attitude of mundanes? There would be a research team and a massive amount of money behind the development backed by bankers, industry or whoever. The mundanes dream of creating AI, might they would serve it, nurture it, feed it? Just how much essence would they give to it? Might it not have it's own dreams and aspiration, or its own place in the Marches? Such an entity may not be of the Symphony, it is not created of the Word. Ashley ashley.omentide@virgin.net http://freespace.virgin.net/omentide.omentide ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 22:44:16 -0400 From: "EDG (and Orc)" Subject: Re: IN> AI Plot Seed (was Hacking) At 06:31 PM 8/7/99 -0400, you wrote: Love the idea. But... >Jean: No. They're not ready for this, and frankly, we aren't either. >Sabotage this effort, but collect all the records and information possible. From my impression, this isn't the way Jean works at all. More like: Jean: If this isn't a Vapulan trick, then it's wonderful that the humans have finally realized this potential. If it is, I want it destroyed at all costs. Jean will go to lengths to prevent celestial technology from reaching mundane hands, but he won't take away technology that the mundanes make themselves. - -EDG who just saw "The Iron Giant" and loved every second of it. *stomp whirr*! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 18:27:41 PDT From: "David Streeter" Subject: IN> Re: Rules questions . . . > I'm getting ready to run my first game of In Nomine (and neither > Finally, anyone have any general suggestions for how to assemble and >run >a group? Good adventures to start with? How to balance a starting party? >How to introduce a group of people to the game? WARNING! SPOILERS FOR "FEAST OF BLADES" Watch out for mapboard combat - the In Nomine rules as they stand don't really suit it. Much better to do it "cinematically" and not use a map. Also, I would suggest that you have no two players of the same choir/band. Since your resonance usually has no essence cost, and doesn't cause a disturbance, it tends to be your main problem solving tool. Be careful of those impudites in "Feast of Blades"... they can be quite nasty. If you have a less combat oriented group, I'd suggest having your players encounter them two at a time, rather than all at once. Prepare LOTS of NPC humans. Have a few templates (I have three basic humans - - "Beefy", "Geeky" and "Average"), and generate a lot of names, needs, honorable/dishonorable deeds, etc depending on the resonances of your PCs. Note that humans tend to have a lot of skills compared to celestials - they only get twenty points, but can't spend them on much except skills. I'd suggest starting with a group of angels for your first adventure.. it can be quite tough keeping a group of demons together. SurturZ, Habbalite of Factions, Angel of Constructive Criticism ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1302 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.