From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Thu Aug 12 14:58:30 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (root@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA28750 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 14:58:30 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id OAA26972 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 14:41:00 -0500 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 14:41:00 -0500 Message-Id: <199908121941.OAA26972@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1305 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Thursday, August 12 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1305 In this digest: IN> Geases vs. Remnants IN> Angel of Cookies Re: IN> I.N. Questions Re: IN> [RULES] Ofanim of Gabriel Re: IN> I.N. Questions Re: IN> Roles Re: IN> Rules questions . . . Re: IN> Cherub Attunements vs. Remnants RE: IN> Cherub Attunements vs. Remnants IN> EC Re: IN> Angel of Cookies Re: IN> I.N. Questions Re: IN> Angel of Cookies IN> Geases... IN> CPG Errata? Re: IN> CPG Errata? IN> Re: IN- Angel of Cookies IN> .General & Targeted..Internet-Leads - reach more for less IN> In Nominie Alpha Centauri Re: IN> Angel of Cookies ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:39:25 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Geases vs. Remnants At 2:02 PM +0000 8/11/99, Leath Sheales wrote: >Sean wrote; > >> IMHO, since Remnants are immune to all perception-based resonances, you >> could not track them down. Whether the attunement would break in the >> process I'm not positive about, but I am fairly sure you couldn't track >> them down that way. > >On a related note, are Remnants immune to Geases? Since Geases seem >to 'hook' into the soul, and the Remnant no longer has one. They're immune to new Geas-hooks being placed upon them, because the Perception-based part of a Lilim's resonance won't work! Existing Geas-hooks and agreed-upon Geases are a bit trickier. I could see either way on the hooks, since they _are_ hooks into the soul -- but Remnants aren't immune to Will-based resonances, like that of demons. (Though I believe they're still immune to Shedim.) I'd probably rule that existing hooks could be invoked, and the Remnant could agree to a Geas, but otherwise, immune. At least, I'd do so at the moment, but hey, it's only noon... (Yeah, I'm in a weird mood again.) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:28:06 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: IN> Angel of Cookies Janet Anderson wrote: > > P.S. to the would-be Angel of Cookies: Have you considered how much danger > you will be in from the Servitors of Haagenti? So would the Cookie Monster be a servitor of Haagenti or the Angel of Cookies? A fallen elohim with a really weird vessel? ;) - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:34:28 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> I.N. Questions Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >3:What happens if a Kyriotate's host's consciousness is destroyed in > >the marches during a divine takeover. > > The host becomes a vegatable or dies and the Kyrio goes dissonant, > most likely. The host goes vegetable/dies AFTER the Kyrio vacates the body. Dissonance still happens as soon as the Kyrio leaves (since is unlikely in the extreme that the angel can leave the person in 'better condition' after they have died!). - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:43:59 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> [RULES] Ofanim of Gabriel Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > > At 9:52 AM -0400 8/4/99, SwrdCherub@aol.com wrote: > >Okay, the Ofanim of Gabriel attunement states that Ofanim are immune to heat, > >does this include fire? > > Most definitely. > > >because if so, a starting off ofanim can just say > >"Eh, I wanna summon Gabe" and light themselves on fire gaining a +5 or +6 > >(can't remember which) and suffer NO ILL EFFECTS > > Why, yes. > > Of course, people tend to notice. Ofanim of Gabriel ROCK! Blowtorches? No problem. Scalding steam? Piece of cake. Molten lava? Ha! We laugh at molten lava! This goes for electricity and radiation as well. High-tension lines, lightning, the inside of nuclear reactors are all ineffective against them. Of course, an actual nuclear blast could break apart a vessel through concussive forces/shrapnel/lack of air/etc. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:36:13 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> I.N. Questions Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > If you have a vessel in a Body Bag, you _can't_ use it except by 1 of > two methods: > > #1: the vessel you're in is killed. You wake up in the vessel in the BB. > #2: you go celestial, move into the BB, and take command of the vessel > there. (The reverse of how you put it in.) > > You can't change into it, otherwise. (A tradeoff.) Yup. For people who overuse body bags, don't forget that the 'empty' vessel is vulnerable to control by Kyrio/Shedim. Bwa-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:31:03 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> Roles Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >Can a celestial have more than 1 role at once? I see nothing in the rules >that would prevent you from doing so (unless I skipped a chapter). > > Yes, though the more Roles you have, the lower-level they will be. Having > more than one Role per vessel is tricky, though possible. See the Liber > Servitorum for more detail. What she said. Also since each Role is a different human identity, you might get into corporeal conflicts. ("That's Joe Smith. No it isn't, that's Greg Kozinski!") > > >Also, If you want the Fighting skill, do you have to purchase it for both >Corporeal and Celestial??? > > Nope. What she said. > > >And Finally, Do you have to specify exactly what kind of weapon you can use >when you buy a weapon skill (such as Large Weapon and Sword)? > > Yup. Ditto. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:52:57 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> Rules questions . . . Chris Bergstresser wrote: > First, the rules say that killing a human causes a disturbance in the > Symphony, and damaging objects causes a disturbance, but not damaging a > human (p. 55). This doesn't seem quite right, and also tends to contradict > the description of the Malakim (p. 99) where hitting a Balseraph is > interesting because it *doesn't* affect the symphony. Which is "officially" > correct? (Actually, no matter what the official position, I'm probably > going to play it so that *any* damage causes a disturbance, because it just > feels right to me) Any damage causes disturbance. I believe the text description is wrong, but the example is correct. > Second, the description of Numinous Corpus (Feet) says at level 1 you get > Power +2, and at level 4 you get Power +4. What's the advantage of having > levels 2 or 3, or greater than 4? Can angels buy it at level 1 -- and then > as the description states they'll have hooves when they invoke the song? > Can angels get "demonic" traits, and vice-versa? a)increased chance to sing the song, plus you can cast it faster/with less fuss/etc. b)anybody can get any traits. Fun, yes? - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:57:05 -0400 From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC Subject: Re: IN> Cherub Attunements vs. Remnants Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > > At 8:24 AM -0700 8/10/99, Sean McCarthy wrote: > >Our spies report that on 12:57 AM 8/10/99 -0700, Matt Farmer said: > >> If a Cherub is attuned to a celestial who then becomes a remnant, does > >>he maintain his attunement? > > I'd say no. O:> I'd say the attunement would break, painfully, just as > if the attunee had been killed. I'm of mixed thoughts on this one. The attunement seems to have many corporeal elements but, in the long run, I'd agree with Beth (or make it a GM call... remnants aren't SUPPOSED to happen. They are unnatural and unplanned for.) - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ | John Karakash - Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs | | (919)388-2665(COOL) MIB2300 | | | | The power to tax involves the power to destroy. | | -Chief Justice Marshall | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:25:13 -0700 From: Brian Culver Subject: RE: IN> Cherub Attunements vs. Remnants > -----Original Message----- > From: John Karakash - Lucent ASCC [mailto:johnk@ascc.lucent.com] > Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 11:57 AM > To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > Subject: Re: IN> Cherub Attunements vs. Remnants > I'm of mixed thoughts on this one. The attunement seems to > have many corporeal elements but, in the long run, I'd agree with Beth > (or make it a GM call... remnants aren't SUPPOSED to happen. They are > unnatural and unplanned for.) Hmmm. What if they are planned for? That could be a fun idea. Suppose for a moment that Remnants are meant to be a sort of failsafe, in case either side loses the war. Kronos/Yves has plans to re-use them to rebuild the ranks/sabotage the other side after the big one goes down? Sure both sides deny that they can track remnants at all, but why not hide the ace up your sleeve? In a pre-apocalypse setting, several superiors would be quite interested in such a discovery, Asmodeus and Dominic in particular. Post-armageddon, the possibilities are endless. Remnants suddenly find themselves with extra forces, with abilities they do not know what to do with, drawn toward 'words'. PCs can be sent to hunt down these rogues, or aid them. Just a thought. 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Questions At 2:34 PM -0400 8/11/99, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: >Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >> >3:What happens if a Kyriotate's host's consciousness is destroyed in >> >the marches during a divine takeover. >> >> The host becomes a vegatable or dies and the Kyrio goes dissonant, >> most likely. > > The host goes vegetable/dies AFTER the Kyrio vacates the >body. Dissonance still happens as soon as the Kyrio leaves (since >is unlikely in the extreme that the angel can leave the person in >'better condition' after they have died!). Right, right, what he said. O;> - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 20:36:44 -0400 From: "Jason Terlecki" Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Cookies >So would the Cookie Monster be a servitor of Haagenti or the Angel of >Cookies? A fallen elohim with a really weird vessel? ;) If he is willing to serve me, I will grant him the "milk and cookies" attunement I am working on. No but seriously I have yet MORE questions: Is there a song to heal diseases or can you use the songs of healing for this? I know that celestials are not affected by diseases, but some of their mortal companions/friends/lovers might get something nasty... Also, is it possible for a remnant to acquire celestial forces in game at a later point? What happens then? I know that a mortal cannot become a celestial, but in their case, would it be possible in that specific situation? I have read in the Infernal Player guide that demons who are granted a word are also given a rite AND an *attunement* specific to their word. Is it the same for Angelic Side because I have seen no mention of attunements given. Also Are there guidelines for a word bound who wishes to create EXTRA rites or develop a new attunement? Finally those attunements, are they considered CHOIR attunements which he can give to *choirs* underneath him/her OR more like servitor attunements. Lastly, I have noticed that some celestials have choirs attunements from different superiors. These are only gifts which cannot be purchased in anyway, right? Jason would be angel of cookies (1 free cookie to anyone who smiles for me!) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:10:45 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> Geases... We've worked out some house rules on Lilim Geases. Not sure if these are completely consistent w/Canon, but they're internally consistent (they should be... they're derived from commercial contract law!). 1. A Lil can't Geas someone just by fulfilling their Need... she must inform the person that this is a deal, and that something will be expected in return. Example: Mike Mortal needs money, fast. Lily Lilim leaves $50,000 in an unmarked envelope in his mailbox. Result: no Geas. Example: Same, but Lil sticks a note in the envelope: "It's all yours if you need it, but you'll owe me one -- L." Mike is Geased. IMC, this does _not_ apply to Celestials; all angels and demons know about the Lilim, and it's assumed that they know the possible dangers of accepting "favors". 2. Lilim can't lie about Geasing to their target. They can, however, be vague. Example: Lil hands Mike $50,000 and says, "Take it, it's yours. No strings attached." No Geas can result. Example: Same, except Lil says, "You'll owe me"... nothing more. Geas. Example: Lil says, "You'll owe me". Mike says, "Ummm... what will I owe you? The money back?" Lil replies, "No, you can keep the money. You'll just owe me a favor some time." Mike takes the money. Geas. Lil is NOT required to say what will happen if Mike tries to welch. If he asks her, she can't *lie*, but, again, she can be vague: "Oh, I think you'll want to pay me back when the time comes." 3. Lilim must fulfill a Need to get a Geas... meaning they must do something that a reasonable person would call "fulfilling". So, they do not have to tell the target every string attached to the help that they give, but they do have to give the minimum necessary information to fulfill the Geas. Example: Lil knows that Psyko the Habbalite has a Need to kill a particularly annoying Seraph; Psyko is looking for a weapon that will let him do this quickly and efficiently. Lil offers Psyko the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch in return for a Geas-4. If the HHG requires a special invocation to operate, then Lil must provide that too; otherwise it's just a useless piece of rock, and no Geas is formed. If the HHG has special and unusual conditions of use -- i.e., it destroys everything celestial within a hundred-yard radius -- then Lil has to tell Psyko. She doesn't have to be perfectly specific ("You want to fling that thing from a good distance away, you know")... she just has to give him a reasonable idea what he has to do to fulfill his Need. Lil is _not_ required to tell everything she knows about the HHG, only things that will affect fulfilling the Need. So, if she knows that using the HHG will create a 500-point disturbance in the Symphony, and that there's a special "kill team" of Malakim detailed to investigate every such explosion... hey, Psyko only wanted something to kill the Seraph; he didn't specify "and escape safely afterwards". Caveat emptor... 4. Geases can be freely traded by Lilim unless the target specifically requests that they not be. Lilim like this, because it can let them get "free" Geas levels... ethereal Commissions, as it were: Example: Psyko the Habbalite hates Squicky the Impudite. Psyko asks Lil to get him a Geas on Squicky. Lil goes to Squicky and offers him, ummm, favors, in return for a Geas-2. Squicky agrees. Lil goes back to Psyko and hands over the Geas; Psyko pays her with a Geas-4 (he _really_ wants to get Squicky). Of course, Psyko doesn't know that Lil has also done a deal with Grunge the Calabite, who is willing to swap a Geas-6 for a change to get some serious leverate on Psyko! Lil is going to end up getting an excellent deal out of that initial favor to Squicky... Note that Lilim can trade Geases, but no one else can. Thus Psyko couldn't give his Geas on Squicky to another Habbalite, or anyhow not without a Lilim serving as an intermediary (for a price, of course). 5. Lilim can narrow the focus of a Geas by Geasing themselves. However, this hikes up the price of the Geas. Example: Lil can provide some valuable information to Squicky. She asks for a Geas-3 in return. "Okay," says Squicky, "provided that you can't ask me to do anything that would upset my Prince." Lil will agree to this condition, and Geas herself to keep it... but it'll hike the cost of Squicky's Geas one level,to a Geas-4. If Lil trades the conditional Geas away, the new Geas-holder is NOT automatically bound by the condition... and Lil will still get whacked with Dissonance if the condition is violated... so Lil should make sure that she passes these conditions along. "Here, Psyko. Just remember, you can't make him do anything that would upset his Prince... and I'm going to need a Geas-1 on you to confirm that, otherwise there's no deal." 6. Lilim cannot _deliberately_ arrange matters so that their victims cannot fulfill Geases. Example: Lil wants to get rid of Grunge the Calabite. She has a Geas-2 on him, so she asks him to knock down a door. It's a seemingly ordinary door, no big deal... except that she happens to know that the door is guarded by an 18-Force Djinn. Lil has to tell Grunge about the Djinn, or the Geas won't work (i.e., won't cause Dissonance). If she *doesn't* tell him, the Geas is discharged as soon as Grunge makes any reasonable effort to knock the door down (i.e., if he goes there, meets the Djinn, and runs away). If Lilim use low-level Geases to send their victims into deathtraps (like asking them to do a minor favor that turns out to be an ambush), it causes them Dissonance. In fact, just _trying_ to do this causes it, whether the victim is harmed or not. Note that Lilith does not approve of this sort of behavior... she likes sharp dealing, but this is cheating. Geases at level 5 and 6, though, are inherently hazardous, so the above does not apply. 7. An unexpectedly difficult Geas still works if circumstances _beyond the control of the Lilim_ make it difficult to fulfill. Example: Lil has a Geas-1 on Mike Mortal. She asks Mike to deliver an envelope to Squicky. As far as Mike and Lil know, Squicky is living across town; it should take an hour for Mike to ride the subway and make the drop, no problem. However, just as Mike enters the subway station, a massive earthquake hits the city. The station collapses, and Mike is trapped in the rubble for a day. Mike takes damage from not fulfilling his Geas. However, if Lil knew somehow that the earthquake was coming, Mike would not take damage; "delivering an envelope through an earthquake" is a Geas-2 or even -3. Example: Lil is sick of Squicky the Impudite. She does a minor favor for him in return for a Geas-1. She happens to know that Squicky is about to be arrested on a murder charge. He'll walk, of course -- if all else fails, he'll be able to charm at least one member of the jury -- but he'll be stuck in jail for at least a week. On Monday, Lil tells Squicky that she'll want him to run an errand for her the next day -- pick up some cigarettes -- and that this will discharge his Geas. Squicky agrees. Monday night, Squicky is arrested. Tuesday morning, Lil phones Squicky in his cell. "Say, Squicky. Remember that favor you owe me? Well, it's time, like we agreed. I want you to cross the street and get some cigarettes at the corner store... right now." Lil laughs heartlessly as Squicky bounces back and forth between the walls of his cell, screaming with the pain of Dissonance... Note that this wouldn't work if Lil had arranged for Squicky to be arrested. It also wouldn't work if she came to jail on Tuesday and told him to get the cigarettes; this would be "escape from jail and get me cigarettes", which is at least a Geas-4. But if Squicky has already agreed on Monday to deliver the cigs on Tuesday, well... 8. This rule cuts both ways. If a Geas turns out to be unexpectedly _easy_, because of some circumstance beyond Lil's control... well, then, it just is; the Geas gets discharged anyway. Example: Lil wants to get past that door (the one that's guarded by the 18-Force Djinn). She calls in her Geas-6 on Grunge the Calabite and tells him all about it. Grunge begins assembling an assault team to take out the Djinn and get through the door... when, unexpectedly, the Djinn goes Renegade and flees, leaving the door unguarded. Smirking, Grunge opens it with a single kick. His Geas is discharged, even though it cost him almost no effort. 9. A Geas is discharged if (in the GM's judgment) it is completely and totally impossible to fulfill... i.e. if the corner store has burned down. In the case above, Squicky *could* conceivably get out of jail somehow, so it's not quite impossible... just a lot more difficult than it should be. Thoughts, comments? Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 02:27:51 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: IN> CPG Errata? CPG, page 89, second column, first paragraph. "More importantly, an undead's soul is permanently tied to his configuration of Forces, which is tied to his corporeal form; he can never gain additional Forces on his own (though he CAN lose them)...." Next page, first column, second paragraph. "Undead are still limited by their potential Forces, but can acquire them like other humans, if they still have extra potential after becoming undead." Unless I'm totally missing something, one of these statements has to be wrong, right? PK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 02:00:55 -0500 From: "Ben Chism" Subject: Re: IN> CPG Errata? > Unless I'm totally missing something, one of these statements has to be > wrong, right? > >PK Hmm...I don't see a total contradiction...humans generally don't acquire Forces on their own, therefore an undead could only acquire another Force if (a) they have the potential and (b) someone else(a DP or Word-bound demon or others) grafted the forces on. I can see the problem the wording can cause, but that's just my interpretation. Ben Chism P.S. Just got back from seeing the Sixth Sense...and I may have to sleep with the lights on!!! Really cool movie, and some interesting things about Ghosts. I may have to write up the kid as a Soldier or something........ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 07:14:31 CDT From: "Wade Hursman" Subject: IN> Re: IN- Angel of Cookies >Is there a song to heal diseases or can you use the songs of healing for >this? I know that celestials are not affected by diseases, but some of >their mortal companions/friends/lovers might get something nasty... I'm not sure about diseases, but in Fall of the Malakim, the Corporeal Song of Healing is used to regrow a vessel's legs. I don't see why it wouldn't work on diseases if it can regenerate limbs. > >Lastly, I have noticed that some celestials have choirs attunements from >different superiors. These are only gifts which cannot be purchased in >anyway, right? > Right! At character creation, you can purchase choir attunemnts from your Superior, as long as they are not resonance dependant. After that, it's all up to your GM. >Jason >would be angel of cookies (1 free cookie to anyone who smiles for me!) > (Flashes Jason a blindingly bright smile) Good luck angel! Wade _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 12:21:18 +0100 From: poi47@correo.tamnet.com.mx (govoium) Subject: IN> .General & Targeted..Internet-Leads - reach more for less Have you ever gotten catalogs in the mail? Why would they do this? Because it's PROFITABLE! A certain percentage of people buy from them. They do it because it works each and everytime they send. "Sales, it's a numbers game" This is a great method BUT the cost can add up. When you mail 1000 or more, you have to consider postage, brochures, envelopes, and etc... Did you know that there is a method of that cost less, WITHOUT postage, envelopes and brochures but have the same effect? 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For details send a FAX to: 786-549-5787 Include your name, phone#, e-mail +++6++++6++++6+++6++++6+++ oCo_ns To=jo_ns ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 09:26:57 -0400 From: Adam Thomas Gieseler Subject: IN> In Nominie Alpha Centauri I'm delurking after a long hibernation, because this Alpha Centauri thing is too interesting. I also had had thoughts about this kind of crossover, and it's interesting to me how different our ideas are. For one thing, I think Jean would be decidedly wary about the University of Planet. They pursue an agenda of "unfettered research," i.e. more technology now and damn the consequences. Vapula would certainly love them. Jean would probably be unsure about them, but not oppose them unless he was sure they had Vapulan support. Prokhor Zakharov may very well be a Soldier of Vapula. He was supposedly one of the greatest scientists on Earth, and well known for his research-without-morals philosophy. Dierdre Skye, a renowned biologist and environmentalist, might be a soldier of Novalis. And it's noted that Yang has almost superhuman powers of will, so if any of them is a Soldier, he probably is. Of what is less certain--Game? But the only faction leader who clearly isn't supernormal is Pravin Lal. One Superior you haven't mentioned is Mammon. If the book title "The Ethics of Greed" isn't enogh to connect Morgan with him, I don't know what is. Marc is a secondary possibility, but I don't see Lilith. The Morganites rely on monopolistic dominance, not subtle double-dealing. Lilith would probably prefer the Spartans. Two of the factions you've identified with particular Superiors seem wqrong to me. Novalis would certainly support the Gaians--for one thing, they're pacifist, for another thing, they draw much of their ideology from the 60's movements she sponsored. Michael, or even Laurence or Dominic, seems like a better choice for the Peacekeepers. The latter two might also support the Believers, but they may be too militaristic even for Laurence. Jordi would probably despise all factions, although the Gaians less--but they all use captured mind worms. I don't have too much of a problem assuming the factions have been celestially influenced from the beginning for three reasons. An undertaking as ambitious as the Unity Project could hardly have succeeded without the help of Jean and probably Yves--it says on the website that there was only thought to be a one in a thousand chance of the colonization effort succeeding. Some of the factions' ideologies seem very close to those of certain celestials. And most importantly, it's fun making these speculations. About Earth, I hadn't even thought of the Armageddon angle. It's assumed that Earth has been destroyed in a nuclear war. Although your ideas are very interesting, assume for a minute that that's true. Both Heaven and Hell would be unharmed, and left with nowhere to turn but Alpha Centauri. Something to think about. Adam Gieseler ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 15:24:23 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Cookies At 8:36 PM -0400 8/11/99, Jason Terlecki wrote: > >No but seriously I have yet MORE questions: All these questions! Ah-hah! A customer to sell the rest of the Liber books to! >Is there a song to heal diseases or can you use the songs of healing for >this? Song of Healing (Liber Canticorum, pp. 36-37). >Also, is it possible for a remnant to acquire celestial forces in game at a >later point? KARAKASH! FAQ! (If this is already in the FAQ...?) Yes, if the GM wills. Otherwise, no. (In general, Remnants do _not_ get new Forces. The GM only lets them do so if the GM has something special in mind.) > What happens then? I know that a mortal cannot become a >celestial, but in their case, would it be possible in that specific >situation? Remnants are not mortal. If one were "revived".... I'm sure that's in the FAQ... (The FAQ is linked off of www.sjgames.com/in-nomine somewhere.) >I have read in the Infernal Player guide that demons who are granted a word >are also given a rite AND an *attunement* specific to their word. Is it the >same for Angelic Side because I have seen no mention of attunements given. Yup. It's a function of having a Word, generally. Though some Words are so little that the attunement gets skipped in writeups. >Also Are there guidelines for a word bound who wishes to create EXTRA rites >or develop a new attunement? Why, yes, in the forthcoming GMG (which I just finished editing and I'm not going to type more stuff in because my fingers hurt...). > Finally those attunements, are they considered >CHOIR attunements which he can give to *choirs* underneath him/her OR more >like servitor attunements. Servitor Attunements, not Choir Attunements. (Only Archangels have Choir Attunements.) >Lastly, I have noticed that some celestials have choirs attunements from >different superiors. These are only gifts which cannot be purchased in >anyway, right? If the GM _lets_ you have that backstory, then you can buy them. Heck, if the GM lets you get away with stuff... 99.9% of the time, though, yup, they're gifts. However, note that you can only get an attunement for _your_ Choir from a Superior other than yours. (Anyplace where that's contradicted in the books, it's been ERRATA.) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1305 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.