From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sun Sep 5 19:24:26 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA09121 for ; Sun, 5 Sep 1999 19:24:25 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id TAA16174 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sun, 5 Sep 1999 19:20:06 -0500 Date: Sun, 5 Sep 1999 19:20:06 -0500 Message-Id: <199909060020.TAA16174@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1321 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Sunday, September 5 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1321 In this digest: [Admin: Stay on Topic] Re: IN> A brief digression: Re: IN> Plot Seed: Welcome to Gibson City! IN> Re: IN- Corporeal Player's Guide IN> Re: IN- Plot Seed: Welcome to Gibson City! IN> Re: IN- Malakim [Longish] Re: IN> Malakim [Longish] Re: IN> A brief digression: Re: IN> A brief digression: IN> Justice is served... (was A brief digression) IN> Liber Canticorum Question ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 16:46:33 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: [Admin: Stay on Topic] Re: IN> A brief digression: Whistling in the Dark's post stuck with IN-related material, but this post hasn't. Unless some In Nomine is stuck in post-haste, this is an off-topic thread and should NOT be replied to. (Failure to comply _will_ get snitty email from me, and lack of groveling _can_ get people u n s u b s c r i b e d. Got that?) - --Beth, Djinn Princess of List Admin ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 15:33:19 -0600 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> Plot Seed: Welcome to Gibson City! Very, very interesting. Especially the demonic campeign about corrupting it. I have to say well done. Timothy, "Angel" of Rambling ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Sep 1999 17:58:58 CDT From: "Wade Hursman" Subject: IN> Re: IN- Corporeal Player's Guide Just decided to put my 3 cents in: CPG: I like it. Just got it, and I think it's a blast!! You Are Here: Well, I'm borrowing it from a friend cause I can't get it yet where I life. Wow! Good job! Bood of Servitors: Another hit, as far as I'm concerned...although, it would have been nice to see a sample servitor of every superior...expecially, in my opinion, of Zadkiel. Wade Habbalah of Technology, Demon of Telemarketers ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Sep 1999 18:03:50 CDT From: "Wade Hursman" Subject: IN> Re: IN- Plot Seed: Welcome to Gibson City! *giggles wildly* Oh boy are my PC's gonna love this one! I have a demonic campaign running, and one of them is a Lilim...Oh the things she can do! Wade Habbalah of Technology, Demon of Telemarketers ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Sep 1999 17:38:45 PDT From: "Micheal Knight" Subject: IN> Re: IN- Malakim [Longish] >Even ignoring the rest of this example - I really have trouble with the >notion of the Virtues breaking promises. Not technically dissonant - but it >is close and ought to make them feel a bit uncomfortable. Reread the main book. "If you see a Malakite tell a demon that he can live if he cooperates, you've just seen him lie to a poor bastard demon who's about to die." Paraphrased, mind, because I haven't got my book handy. I don't see Malakim as >having< to play straight on anything they don't take formal Oaths on. Most of them will, but don't stuff them all into that little niche. It will get you killed. Micheal ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 04 Sep 1999 18:31:54 -0700 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> Malakim [Longish] Whistling in the Dark wrote: > At 4:05 AM +0100 9/3/99, Warsinger wrote: > >On Fri, 3 Sep 1999, Steel Angel wrote: > > > > > The Rat says, "Okay, I told you, now lemme go. > > > The Seraph notes, "You didn't tell him where he could find any fish." > > > The rat screams, and the Malakite breaks its little diabolical neck. > > > After all, it was just a promise, not an Oath. > > > >Even ignoring the rest of this example - I really have trouble with the > >notion of the Virtues breaking promises. Not technically dissonant - but > >it is close and ought to make them feel a bit uncomfortable. To paraphrase the main rulesbook. If you hear a Malakite tell a demon he'll let it go, you've just seen a Malakite lie to some poor, bastard demon who's about to die. Guess honour might only -really- apply to the honourable, which is pretty common in a lot of cultures. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 04 Sep 1999 18:57:56 -0700 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> A brief digression: "John J. Maurer, esq." wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Steel Angel > To: > Sent: Friday, September 03, 1999 11:05 PM > Subject: Re: IN> Malakim [Longish] > > > What country do you live in? Not the US, that's for sure. Drunk > drivers who > > have killed -27- people get out after about 11 years and get to drive > again. > > a) Do you KNOW they get to drive again? My guess is that they do not. > Yes, I know. http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19990901/ts/crime_bus_1.html That's the starting point. Check cnn.com to see if they still have the story. CNN reported that he would still be allowed to drive. > b) After 11 years in jail, someone's life is effectively ruined. They will > never hold a job again. > Still a bit light for -27- deaths, wouldn't you say? Mostly children and teens. > c) Since the news has given the name of this particular drunk driver, I > suspect their life will be unending hell. (not that it shouldn't) > > > > Or canvas the news for the 'penalties' your average rapist or child > molster gets and > > how -many- times they get out to do it again. > > The problem with reading newspapers is that you only hear the stories that > are exceptional. For every news story about a rapist or child molester > getting out you don't hear over 1,000 stories of where the slimeball goes to > jail and they throw away the key. Most child molesters have to spend their > entire sentence in solitary confinement because the other inmates will KILL > them. (again, not that I would lose much sleep). The news gives you an > inflated sense of what happens in criminal trials. > I don't just go to the papers. The library has hundreds of books and articles. The fact that -anyone- convicted of rape or child molestation is getting out -multiple times- is indicitive of a system in need of some repair, wouldn't you agree? The fact that the papers have enough fodder to go after means that, more than likely, there are others. > > > Again, I don't think you really know how -broken- the judicial system > is. It's > > not a -few- crimansl that go free, according to some estimates, 90-95% of > any given > > criminal defense lawyer's clients are guilty, and maybe 60% of them are > convicted, > > then the appeals and plea bargaining begin... > > Where do you get your statistics? Over 90% of criminal indictments lead to > guilty pleas! Criminal appeals are rare as hen's teeth and rarely result in > a reversal. Plea Bargaining you can have a problem with depending on your > view of the punitive justice system. It is my opinion that the legislature > has vastly inflated sentences in the mistaken belief that it will decrease > crime. A plea bargain can be viewed as allowing a more equitable sentence. > Also, becuase the legislature has criminalized so many things (largely > drugs. During my work at the PD office at least 80% of my cases are drug > related) if we tried every case that was indicted we would need 9x the > lawyers and judges we have. > > I'll send you the articles and books as well, but we'll take it off list > to neaten it up. : ) - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots > . ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 23:16:24 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> A brief digression: At 6:57 PM -0700 9/4/99, Steel Angel wrote: >"John J. Maurer, esq." wrote: > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Steel Angel > > To: > > Sent: Friday, September 03, 1999 11:05 PM > > Subject: Re: IN> Malakim [Longish] > > > > > What country do you live in? Not the US, that's for sure. Drunk > > drivers who > > > have killed -27- people get out after about 11 years and get to drive > > again. > > > > a) Do you KNOW they get to drive again? My guess is that they do not. > > > > Yes, I know. http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19990901/ts/crime_bus_1.html >That's the starting point. Check cnn.com to see if they still have the story. >CNN reported that he would still be allowed to drive. There's a campaign seed here, a pretty good one. Angels in a party hear of a miscarriage of justice such as this, and move in to investigate (Gabrielites, perhaps, sent to punish the cruel.) They begin to go in, investigating, rooting out the corruption and helping to feed the fires of local and national outrage at this miscarriage of justice.... And find themselves opposing other Angels, who have been working to oppose a Nybbas-oriented campaign to inflame public opinion and damage public institutions by trying their campaigns in the court of public opinion, driving to force the institution of mob rule and a breakdown of the rule of law by people not understanding the full situation. Now they have to A) stop Nybbas's and B) defuse a potentially violent situation without causing the original convicted criminal to walk free in the process. A nice, tight conunderum for any IN campaign. (Why yes, I've gotten really annoyed at sensationalist headlines driving ill-concieved 'reforms,' why do you ask?) - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 00:57:10 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> Justice is served... (was A brief digression) >away from that debate and into something else that's related and may >make his point better than a screed would> Point of essence for you, good buddy. And can you tell us when the next good TMBG album will be out? >There's a campaign seed here, a pretty good one. Angels in a party >hear of a miscarriage of justice such as this, and move in to >investigate (Gabrielites, perhaps, sent to punish the cruel.) They >begin to go in, investigating, rooting out the corruption and helping >to feed the fires of local and national outrage at this miscarriage >of justice... Gabrielites, yeah. Possibly sicced on by a Word-bound superior (not a Superior, a high-ranking Servitor) who is new to Earth. The Seraph who holds the Word of Righteous Indignation, perhaps... you just *know* that Word is held by a Seraph... >And find themselves opposing other Angels, who have been working to >oppose a Nybbas-oriented campaign to inflame public opinion and >damage public institutions by trying their campaigns in the court of >public opinion, driving to force the institution of mob rule and a >breakdown of the rule of law by people not understanding the full >situation. Yeah! I like it! Nitpick: it'll be a joint effort between Nybbas and Asmodeus. Remember, running Hell's Gestapo isn't his sole job; he also loves perverting and damaging human systems of judgement and justice. The rival angels would be working for Dominic and/or David, I imagine. >Now they have to A) stop Nybbas's and B) defuse a potentially violent >situation without causing the original convicted criminal to walk >free in the process. A nice, tight conunderum for any IN campaign. Yes. Very nice. And, of course, they've still got the annoying Seraph leaning over their shoulder... >(Why yes, I've gotten really annoyed at sensationalist headlines >driving ill-concieved 'reforms,' why do you ask?) Shan't risk the wrath of AA Beth by responding except to say... mm hm. Whence the Johnny Bravo quote, btw? Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Sep 1999 19:11:33 -0500 From: "Amo Nympham" Subject: IN> Liber Canticorum Question Celestial Song of Machines: what does this actually do? maybe I'm just too tired to make the connection between the text and what it does in the game. Corporeal Song of Nightmare: seems like Habbalah should get a bonus to this one - - Dennis H. Groome V "Amo Nympham" nallix@bellsouth.net ICQ: 11430261 "I think I woke up screaming 'cause I had a dream that you still loved me" -"ACF", Stabbing Westward ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1321 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.