From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Sep 27 09:43:42 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA25392 for ; Mon, 27 Sep 1999 09:43:42 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id JAA31796 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 27 Sep 1999 09:39:57 -0500 Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 09:39:57 -0500 Message-Id: <199909271439.JAA31796@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1341 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, September 27 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1341 In this digest: IN> Malakim Re: IN> White-wolf Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> Malakim Re: IN> Malakim IN> Angel of Beauty Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> White-wolf's WoD Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> Malakim IN> New House System for Combat (Long) Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> White Wolf Re: IN> White Wolf IN> Gabriel's Madness Re: IN> Gabriel's Madness Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Re: IN> Gabriel's Madness ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 10:47:30 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Malakim >>>I have believe that Malakim are signifigantly underpowered when compared to their descriptions in the book.<<< The Malakim don't resonate for combat. They resonate for HONOR. They have a reputation for being nasty warriors that you don't want to mess with for the same reason the Ghurkas do -- not because Ghurkas are physically superior to other humans, but because their attitude and training scares the s*** out of their enemies. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 10:00:45 -0500 From: "Amo Nympham" Subject: Re: IN> White-wolf personally, I wouldn't do it, but with a little tweaking and some conversions, I'm sure you could. I think it's odd when people ask questions like this; the important thing to remember is when you run In Nomine, *it's your game*. no one is going to bust down your door and make you play a certain way. when I run In Nomine I tend to distort it somewhat, especially with the Superiors. ps., please do no send HTML mail to the list. - -Dennis H. Groome V "Amo Nympham" ICQ: 11340261 "I think I woke up screaming, 'cause I had a dream that you still loved me" -Stabbing Westward, ACF -----Original Message----- From: Tony Byrd To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Date: Saturday, September 25, 1999 5:31 PM Subject: IN> White-wolf Can In Nomine be used along with White-wolfs world of darkness system? Tony Byrd ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 12:01:54 -0500 (CDT) From: paranial@creighton.edu Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you On Sun, 26 Sep 1999, Tim Groth wrote: > Hmmmm, an Archangel of Beauty may well exist, but one of the first? It > would seem more likely that Beauty would be a word underneith another (Love > or Light for instance). Which could add an interesting twist to it. > > I like the write up though, though sorcerors are getting a bum rap again > (not all sorcerors are bound for hell, the Word of sorcery for hell is > interpretted very narrowly like most demonic Words, but I'm not going to > rant). > > Anyway interesting idea (there needed to be an archangel that could bridge > militant and peaceful well and realisticly). > Thank you very much. I'm glad you like it. Now I am going show other's realtions with Diana: Alllied by: Novalis, Blandine, Jordi, Eli Asscociated by: Yves, Gaberiel, Michael Hostile by: Domonic I only have the main book so I can't include any from the Rev. Cycle. If antone wants to give it a shot feel free. Bradley Paranial ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 13:36:30 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Malakim At 12:01 PM -0700 9/26/99, Azrael wrote: >This is only about combat, but combat isn't the whole game....try >telling that to my players...bastards. Tell that to my group. We start a new game and I get an Ofanite of Flowers, one of Creation, and a couple of Mercurians of Flowers and Lightning... somehow, I don't think I'm running an epic battle against Baal and Beliel here.... - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 13:44:03 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Malakim At 10:47 AM -0400 9/26/99, David Edelstein wrote: > >>>I have believe that Malakim are signifigantly underpowered when compared >to their descriptions in the book.<<< > >The Malakim don't resonate for combat. They resonate for HONOR. They have a >reputation for being nasty warriors that you don't want to mess with for >the same reason the Ghurkas do -- not because Ghurkas are physically >superior to other humans, but because their attitude and training scares >the s*** out of their enemies. Exactly. You get a Calabite of Fire, refined into a lean, mean combat machine. He bullies and strengthens and assaults everyone around him. He runs into a small, thin man with intense eyes. He leers, walking towards the small man.... Who slowly draws a sword with one hand and a sawed off shotgun with the other. "With God as my Witness and Michael as my Master, your reign of terror is over, spawn of evil. I can see the pain in the eyes of the man you threw from the tower. I can see the fear in the children as they watched their father die. I can even see you curled around your pillow in the night, burning with shame and crying for your lost Heavenly Glory. They strengthen me, scum -- they burn within me and they cry to smite and strike you, wiping your hateful body from existance. Come! *DEATH OR GLORY -- IT MATTERS NOT TO ME!!!!*" Which is about when the Calabite vents himself and runs like a schoolgirl, sobbing, but by then it's *far* too late.... - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 14:21:38 -0400 From: Chad and Erin Wilson Subject: IN> Angel of Beauty At 12:01 PM 9/26/99 -0500, you wrote: >On Sun, 26 Sep 1999, Tim Groth wrote: > >> Hmmmm, an Archangel of Beauty may well exist, but one of the first? It >> would seem more likely that Beauty would be a word underneith another (Love >> or Light for instance). Which could add an interesting twist to it. The most beautiful angel was Lucifer (aka, Daystar) the most favored of angels. it is possible that with his fall, there was made no replacement of his position. - -w ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 12:39:47 -0600 From: "Ben Glickler" Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Regarding the new Archangel concept -- interesting, yes, but it seems to me that the world of Beauty would probably fall under Novalis or Eli as a word-bound non-archangel, or as one of Uriel's previous non-violent servants. But, assuming we both agree for the need of such an archangel... The dissonant requirements need adjustment. They could be used to argue that servants of Beauty cannot kill humans. Only the infernal is truely ugly... ...what CAN servants of Beauty destroy? Do servants of beauty agree with the idea of a dark beauty -- that kind of fatal attraction that makes the abyss seem beautiful? Are the infernal truely ugly? Could you kill an Impudite or a Lilim, whose celestial forms are beautiful by mortal standards? When does beauty inside become more important than beauty outside? Used as a metaphor, how can an angel of Beauty even bear a corrupt system that is "beautiful" on the outside but "ugly" on the inside? Walking past a courthouse must make them wilt. Why does Beauty's dissonance requirements make them even more difficult to cope with when demons are in town than Malakim are? How is the Archangel of Beauty powerful at all? Based on the increase of infernal might over the centuries, the 20th century is a boiling point of demonic power. Things are pretty damned ( :) ) ugly. Nybbas and Andre abuse mortal beauty to buld their pornographic empire. Hell uses beauty to deceive. Surely it'd be harder to summon her with her strength spread so thinly. On the other hand, how come her divine alliance is so massive and mighty? War is ugly, and few of the Archangels are pacifists. I can see her allied to Eli and Novalis, and perhaps associated with Yves, but the likes of David, Michael, and others may very well thing her to be, at best, a distraction. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 15:03:33 -0500 (CDT) From: paranial@creighton.edu Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you On Sun, 26 Sep 1999, Ben Glickler wrote: > Regarding the new Archangel concept -- interesting, yes, but it seems > to me that the world of Beauty would probably fall under Novalis or > Eli as a word-bound non-archangel, or as one of Uriel's previous > non-violent servants. To each his Own I suppose > But, assuming we both agree for the need of such an archangel... > > The dissonant requirements need adjustment. They could be used to > argue that servants of Beauty cannot kill humans. Only the infernal is > truely ugly... ...what CAN servants of Beauty destroy? Do servants > of beauty agree with the idea of a dark beauty -- that kind of fatal > attraction that makes the abyss seem beautiful? Are the infernal > truely ugly? Could you kill an Impudite or a Lilim, whose celestial > forms are beautiful by mortal standards? I'd say that Soldiers of Hell, Undead, Sterotypical Sorcers, and mortals on par with Hitler, and Jeffery Dhamer are fair game. > When does beauty inside become more important than beauty outside? > Used as a metaphor, how can an angel of Beauty even bear a corrupt > system that is "beautiful" on the outside but "ugly" on the inside? Walking > past a courthouse must make them wilt. Your right there. > Why does Beauty's dissonance requirements make them even > more difficult to cope with when demons are in town than Malakim are? She really hates Demons. And like you said their ugly. > How is the Archangel of Beauty powerful at all? Based on the increase > of infernal might over the centuries, the 20th century is a boiling point > of demonic power. Things are pretty damned ( :) ) ugly. Nybbas and > Andre abuse mortal beauty to buld their pornographic empire. Hell uses > beauty to deceive. Surely it'd be harder to summon her with her > strength spread so thinly. It's your game do what want. (Pulls out nearest White Wolf book. Turns to page with "Golden Rule" sidebar. Watches as servitors of NitPicking flee in terror.) > On the other hand, how come her divine alliance is so massive and > mighty? War is ugly, and few of the Archangels are pacifists. I can see > her allied to Eli and Novalis, and perhaps associated with Yves, but > the likes of David, Michael, and others may very well thing her to be, > at best, a distraction. > She will not rest until. Every last hidoues demon has been destroyed and the Symphony has attained the Perfect Beauty she rembers. This fits Big Mike's Thinking nicely. Though Diana thinks he is a bit crude. He thinks that she is to concerned about finesse. Bradley Paranial, Mercurian Vassal of War ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 13:49:46 PDT From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> White-wolf's WoD >From: "Amo Nympham" > > >personally, I wouldn't do it, but with a little tweaking and some >conversions, I'm sure you could. I think it's odd when people ask >questions >like this; the important thing to remember is when you run In Nomine, >*it's >your game*. no one is going to bust down your door and make you play a >certain way. when I run In Nomine I tend to distort it somewhat, >especially >with the Superiors. > > >-Dennis H. Groome V "Amo Nympham" >ICQ: 11340261 >"I think I woke up screaming, >'cause I had a dream that you still loved me" > -Stabbing Westward, ACF > -----Original Message----- > From: Tony Byrd > > > Can In Nomine be used along with White-wolfs world of darkness system? > > > Tony Byrd Interestiingly enough, in an effort to re-vamp my In Nomine combat system, I was examining the combat rules of WW, and in the process of considering the possibility of an In Nomine "soak" roll, and I realized that for rolls in the IN system, degree of success has little or nothing to do with skill/song level. Granted, most of us have know that for a while . . . Only the *frequency* of success has to do with skill/song/resonance level . . . (am I wrong?) I know that for low-level humans (thus low-level characteristics) steps have been taken in the CPG, but . . . this is to correct a flaw in the system rather than to correct the system. It means that its still nearly impossible for low-level ethereals to get much of anything done (once the dice are actually involved), and ethereals are often spoken of as being low-level compared to Celestials. Those of you who have converted In Nomine stuff to be used in White Wolf's WoD, please e-mail me!! - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com "A closed mouth gathers no feet." - Hughs, John ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 15:11:35 -0600 From: "Ben Glickler" Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you > It's your game do what want. (Pulls out nearest White Wolf book. Turns to > page with "Golden Rule" sidebar. Watches as servitors of NitPicking flee > in terror.) If this is your answer, why in the world did you ask for comments and questions? Why not just ask for praise for your excellent Archangel submission? ;) > She will not rest until. Every last hidoues demon has been destroyed and > the Symphony has attained the Perfect Beauty she rembers. This fits Big > Mike's Thinking nicely. Though Diana thinks he is a bit crude. He thinks > that she is to concerned about finesse. That's rather extreme, don't you think? A little extreme for a stable, rational Archangel who isn't close to falling? The description strikes me as dangerously close to Khalid's outlook. And remarkably warlike for someone with the word of Beauty. Perhaps alter the dissonance restrictions of your Archangel idea. Don't make them so heavy-handed. Instead, forbid them from taking any action that intentionally makes something uglier. Require them to encourage humanity to see the varied forms of beauty. Make it dissonant for them to show bias for Hell's concept of beauty. Furthermore, why would she want to wipe out all the demons if she wishes to restore things to the beauty she remembers? Would that not also entail redeeming Andrealphus, her beautiful lover? Seems like servants of Beauty (why did you name her Diana?) would spend a lot of time working with Destiny, helping Yves help fallen angels redeem. > Bradley Paranial, Mercurian Vassal of War Ben ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 17:54:14 -0500 (CDT) From: paranial@creighton.edu Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you On Sun, 26 Sep 1999, Ben Glickler wrote: > > It's your game do what want. (Pulls out nearest White Wolf book. Turns to > > page with "Golden Rule" sidebar. Watches as servitors of NitPicking flee > > in terror.) > > If this is your answer, why in the world did you ask for comments and > questions? Why not just ask for praise for your excellent Archangel > submission? ;) > > > She will not rest until. Every last hidoues demon has been destroyed and > > the Symphony has attained the Perfect Beauty she rembers. This fits Big > > Mike's Thinking nicely. Though Diana thinks he is a bit crude. He thinks > > that she is to concerned about finesse. > > That's rather extreme, don't you think? A little extreme for a stable, > rational Archangel who isn't close to falling? The description strikes me > as dangerously close to Khalid's outlook. And remarkably warlike for > someone with the word of Beauty. > > Perhaps alter the dissonance restrictions of your Archangel idea. Don't > make them so heavy-handed. Instead, forbid them from taking any action > that intentionally makes something uglier. Require them to encourage > humanity to see the varied forms of beauty. Make it dissonant for them to > show bias for Hell's concept of beauty. You know, I never thought of that. > Furthermore, why would she want to wipe out all the demons if she > wishes to restore things to the beauty she remembers? Would that > not also entail redeeming Andrealphus, her beautiful lover? Seems like > servants of Beauty (why did you name her Diana?) would spend a > lot of time working with Destiny, helping Yves help fallen angels redeem. Good point actually. She would help a truely repentant demon. But she's a bit more....pragmatic than say Novalis. Scratch what I said above, don't have FT so I don't know about Khalid. I inteded her as somewhere between Laurence and Novalis. Blame Uriel. Bradley Paranial, Mercurian Vassal of War ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 17:54:57 -0500 (CDT) From: paranial@creighton.edu Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you As for why I named her Diana. Cause I helt like it. Bradley ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Sep 99 11:06:25 PDT From: "Azrael" Subject: Re: IN> Malakim >The Malakim don't resonate for combat. They resonate for HONOR. I know that they resonante for HONOR not for Combat. But in the Book its all blah blah blah COMBAT MONSTER.....well that's the impression that I get. > the Malakim don't worry about corporeal death Good Point I forgot about that... > Also the malakim of War attunement is very useful (you can't ambush them, its that simple). Perhaps the point I was attempting to make was not expressed with enough eloquence. I did not mean to say that MoW attunement was entirely useless. Although it makes them more difficult to surprise it doesn't necessarily make the impossible to ambush. Knowing that something will happen is different to knowing what will happen. The point that I ment to make was that I had pictured the MoW to have an attunemnt more like a Seraph. Something that provides them combat bonuses in their quest to eliminate dishonor. I also thought that Michael's distinctions would have been more combat orientated like The Master of the Granite Hand something with mechanics like that would much better suit the Word of War. But I do admit that the no fear gear does have its place in War. However the distinction that renders the user immune to fearis quite defunct, as a Servitor of War already will not run away, this isn't an entirely concious descision because their nature is affected by their superior. They gain disonance from acting against their nature. They must first choose and then force themselves to flee. Perhaps that was not so eloquent....ah well I'm tired I'm going back to bed. Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 11:02:08 +1000 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: IN> New House System for Combat (Long) G'day. I've tried a few times to patch the IN combat rules, usually by lowering Body Hits or slightly altering weapon damage. I've decided to now do a fairly comprehensive rewrite, which (I think) should do the trick. The aim of these rules is to make combat faster, and somewhat more dangerous, but still fairly cinematic. The main problem is not that Hits are too high, but that attacks don't do _enough_damage_ - a distinction that looks somewhat minor, but is actually fairly major. Attacks vary too little in the amount of damage they do - a pistol does only slightly more than a punch, is only as dangerous as a club. So the main thrust of these rules is altering weapon damage (and a few other parts of the rules to complement). I've used examples throughout to show how the changes work (all page references are for the main rulebook). Not everything here is concrete - I've suggested areas where individual GMs may want to alter the ways things are done, and some optional ideas. No system works perfectly for everyone. I'd like to thank David Edelstein for his input and help with this system. David came up with the Body Hit system I use, and the discussion I had with him during the playtest of the GMG helped me solidify the ideas I use herein. I also encourage people to give feedback, criticisms and ideas, so this can be polished further. I'm still not happy with the armor system, for instance, and new ideas would appreciated. BODY HITS This system uses the normalized Body Hits method from the GMG. All characters have Body Hits equal to Total Forces + Corporeal Forces + Strength + (5 x Vessel/Toughness level). Characters fall unconscious at 0 Body Hits, and die after taking a further (Corporeal Forces + Strength + Vessel/Toughness) Hits. EXAMPLE: Nicole (p.194) has 9 Forces, 3 Corporeal Forces, Str/6 and Vessel/3. By the old rules, she has 36 Hits, and dies at -18 Hits. By these rules, she has 9+3+6+[5x3] = 33 Hits, and dies at 3+6+3 = -12 Hits. EXAMPLE: Ishmael (p.193) has 9 Forces, 2 Corporeal Forces, Str/5 and Vessel/1; old Hits 15/-5; new Hits 21/-9. EXAMPLE: Lynoure (p.196) has 13 Forces, 4 Corporeal Forces, Str/6 and Vessel/5; old Hits 54/-30; new Hits 48/-15. In general, PCs will gain or lose a few Hits. Normal humans will gain quite a few, and powerful Celestials will lose a lot. The overall effect should be making combat that bit more dangerous, and make it easier to fight very tough opponents. I also recommend using the same system for Mind and Soul Hits (with appropriate changes to Forces and characteristics). SKILLS, AUTO-SUCCESSES AND DEFAULTS All combat skills work like normal skills, without the Forces bonus used previously. This keeps things consistent, and reduces the number of TNs over 12. EXAMPLE: Matthew (p.37) has 3 Corporeal Forces, Strength/7 and Fighting/3. By the old rules, he would have a Fighting TN of 3+7+3 = 13; by these rules, his TN is 10. Auto-successes for TNs over 12 are reduced. _Halve_ the number of auto-successes awarded to characters with high TNs (round _up_). These characters still have an advantage over those with lower TNs, but it's no longer as overwhelming. For such characters to gain a benefit from using Risks, they must reduce their TN to 11 or less. EXAMPLE: Hamet (from "Feast of Blades") has Strength/12 and Fighting/3. Normally he would receive +3 to his Fighting CD; now he receives +2. Similarly, he has Agility/12 and Dodge/4; rather than +4 to his Dodge CD, he receives +2. If he were to make a risky Dodge, he would have to reduce his TN from 16 to 11, and would gain +1 to the CD (in additional to the +2 he already has). Finally, the default levels of combat skills are changed. Fighting and Dodge have a default of -0, while _all_ weapon skills have a default level of -1. This gives untrained characters a better chance of being effective in combat (especially normal humans). EXAMPLE: The average person has Strength/4, Agility/4 and Precision/4. Under the usual rules, they would have a Fighting or Dodge TN of 3, Large Weapon TN of 1, and Small Weapon and Ranged Weapon TN of 2. Now, they have Fighting and Dodge at TN 4, and all weapons at TN 3. _Optional_: GMs might wish to simplify the various weapon skills (Large, Small and Ranged) so that they do not require specializing. That is, rather than buying Large Weapon (Sword) and using other weapons at default, the Large Weapon skill gives equal ability with all appropriate weapons. I find this simpler in general, but your kilometrage may vary. DODGING Dodging works less like armor in this version, and allows characters to Dodge powerful attacks (while making low-powered attacks like punches a little more useful). If a character successfully uses their Dodge skill, subtract their CD from the CD of the attacker's roll. If the result is zero or less, the attacker misses completely; otherwise, the attacker's CD is reduced by the defender's CD. This will reduce damage as defined in the next section. EXAMPLE: Carin (p.37) shoots Marcus (p.196). Carin rolls a CD of 4, using a .44 (Power +3) for 7 damage (under the old rules). If Marcus rolled even a CD of 6, he would still take 1 Hit of damage. Under the new rules, if Marcus rolled a CD of 4 or better, he would completely avoid the bullet; if he rolled a CD of 2, Carin would only have an effective CD of 2. For attacks that can be dodged but have no CD (such as Gabriel's Smite Attunement), subtract the CD of the Dodge roll from the overall damage done as before. GMs may rule that a successful Dodge with a high CD is enough to completely avoid the attack. _Optional_: This makes Dodging a lot more effective - possibly too effective for some GMs. Here are some options for keeping Dodging under control. - - Some attacks might be harder to Dodge than others - gunfire or lasers, for example. The GM might impose a penalty to the defender's skill, using the modifiers on p.38. Dodging bullets might be Tough (-1 to TN), while dodging the laser of a Song of Celestial Light might be Very Tough (-2 to TN). - - Using the example of the Storyteller system, GMs may rule that dodging ranged attacks requires the defender to dive behind cover or go prone. Characters cannot simply stay still - they must move and hide to avoid such attacks. - - Instead of allowing one free Dodge per round as usual (p.68), Dodging may count as the character's physical action for a round. While they can perform a supernatural action as normal, they must decide whether to attack or dodge. If this rule is used, spending the action dodging should allow the character to Dodge all attacks directed at them as per a Full Dodge, but they should not receive the +2 bonus. WEAPON POWER This is the biggest change in these rules. Simply put, instead of _adding_ an attack's Power to the CD to determine the damage inflicted, you now _multiply_ the CD by the Power to determine the damage. EXAMPLE: Adam (p.195) has Fangs/6, with Power +3. Under the old rules, if he rolls a CD of 4 when attacking a target, he inflicts 4+3=7 Hits. Under the new rules, he inflicts 4x3=12 Hits. The Power of the attacks defined in the IN rulebook have been altered to fit this new system as follows: Fighting and Melee Attack Power Punch* x1 Kick* x2 Brass Knuckles x2 Club, Dagger or Hatchet x3 Short Sword x4 Long Sword or Battle Axe x5 * Fighting/5+ or Strength/9+ each add an extra .5 to the attack’s Power. Ranged Weapons Attack Power Derringer x2 Revolver x3 .44 Revolver x4 Sawn-Off Shotgun x6 Uzi x4 (x6) Pump Rifle x5 Carbine x4 M-16 x5 (x7) Accuracy, range etc is unaltered. Celestial attacks have a Power of x1. GMs may wish to include the same bonuses to Power as Punch and Kick above (substituting Will for Strength). These Power ratings were generally obtained by adding +5 to the existing Power, then halving the result and rounding up (with some fudging). Other weapons can be converted in the same way. _Optional_: These Power values use whole numbers. GMs might want to vary the Power by small fractional amounts to differentiate between weapons. For instance, daggers, clubs and hatchets all have Power x3 in the above tables, but a dagger has +1 Accuracy. GMs might want to boost the Power of clubs and hatchets to x3.5 to compensate. ARMOR & PROTECTION Rather than simply subtract from the damage done, armor Protection now works as a _divisor_ upon the damage done. Use the current Protection value, but divide the damage by (1+ Protection value), rounding _down_. EXAMPLE: Adam's Fangs have Power x3. On a CD on 4 they inflict 12 damage. If the target is wearing Kevlar (Protection 2), they would only take 12/(1+3) =3 damage. If the target had Protection of 12 or more, they would take no damage. If a character has multiple layers of Armor (such as a Kevlar vest and the Song of Form), add the values together, then add +1 and divide by the total. EXAMPLE: Adam bites a target wearing a leather jacket (Protection 1) who is also protected by the Song of Form for Protection 4. He only inflicts 12/(1+1+4) =2 damage. SONGS, ATTUNEMENTS & SUCHLIKE Most other rules are unchanged, with a few exceptions. These only cover areas from the basic rulebook - filling in the gaps for the sourcebooks should be easy. Artifacts Fiery Sword: to bring this into the same damage range, it now has a Power equal to 2+level in corporeal combat, or equal to its level in celestial combat. EXAMPLE: A Sword/1 would have Power x3 corporeally - more like a Fiery Dagger - and x1 celestially. A Sword/5 would have Power x7 (very high) corporeally and x5 celestially. Holy/Unholy Pistol: Much like the Fiery Sword, this has a Power equal to 2+level. Since they aren’t as powerful as they once were in comparison to other weapons, they only cost 3 points per level, not 6. Alternatively, GMs may wish to multiply the base damage of the pistol (usually x2) by (level of the pistol +1). If using this version, GMs may wish to charge the full 6 points per level for the artifact. EXAMPLE: A Holy Pistol/4 would have a Power x6 (or 2 x (4+1) = Power x10, using the other rule). Songs Celestial Light: The laser has a Power equal to the amount of Essence spent (x1-x3). Numinous Corpus Most of these do not actually need changing, since they have a combination of Accuracy and Power than keeps them useful even at low levels - just change the Power directly to a multiplier (Power +3 becomes Power x3). There are a few exceptions: - Feet: As hooves, these increase kick Power by 1; as spurs, they increase kick Power by 2. - Tongue: increase Power to x2. Resonances Calabim: Their Resonance acts as an attack with a Power equal to their Corporeal Forces (Celestial Forces for celestial attacks). Attunements and Distinctions Kyriotate of David: Rather than Power x2, the vessel’s Punch has Power x3. Master of the Granite Hand (David): Add the character's Corporeal Forces to the Power of their unarmed attacks. EXAMPLE: If a character has Strength/6 and Fighting/6, they have a punch Power of x1.5. If they had 3 Corporeal Forces and this Distinction, they would punch with Power x4.5. Malakim of Eli: The weapon has a Power of 1+CD. Smite (Gabriel): As before, this does [Essence spent x Celestial Forces] damage. If the GM wants to increase this for the new Hit system, they might want to _double_ the damage done. EXAMPLE: If a character with 3 Celestial Forces Smites someone using 3 Essence, they would do 9 Hits damage. If the GM wanted Smite to be more powerful, it would do 18 Hits. Generator (Jean): This does [Corporeal Forces x Essence spent] damage. Mercurian of Laurence: The bonus can only be added to the Dodge TN, not the CD (otherwise it's too powerful). Blade Blessing (Laurence): This simply gives the blade a Power of x6, regardless of its size. Calabim of Belial: The Calabim does double the normal damage with their Resonance. Devour (Haagenti): As an attack, this has a Power of x5. EXAMPLE COMBAT As a demonstration of how it all works, this is a sample biff between Carin and Matthew, the two sample characters from the main rulebook (p.37). I rolled dice for each side, rather than relying on averages. All dice rolls are shown as result/CD. No interventions were rolled (thankfully). Under these rules, Carin has 28 Hits (dying at -11), and Michael has 31 Hits (dying at -13). Just for this example, I'll assume that each character gets a free Dodge each round, with no modifiers (see 'Dodging', above). ROUND 1 Supernatural powers: Carin uses Proficiency, while Matthew sings his NC: Tongue Song. Carin rolls 8/1 (failure). Matthew rolls 7/6 (success, 6' range) Movement: as the two are reasonably far apart, Matthew will move towards Carin, so as to use Tongue next round. Carin stays put. Attacks: Carin shoots at Matthew as he attempts to get into range. Since Matthew moved, he can't make a Full Dodge. Carin rolls 7/4 - a successful hit, with a CD of 4. Dodging: Matthew's Dodge TN is 9. He rolls a 9/3 - success, reducing Carin's CD to 4-3=1. Resolution: Carin's .44 has Power x4. With a CD of 1, Matthew takes 4 Body Hits. ROUND 2 Supernatural: Carin again tries Proficiency, while Matthew does nothing. Carin rolls 6/5 - a success, increasing her .44's Power by 5 (to x9). Movement: Matthew is now within 6 feet of Carin, so no movement is needed. Attacks: Carin shoots at Matthew, while Matthew attacks Carin with his Tongue. Carin rolls 9/4 - success, with a CD of 4. Matthew rolls 10/1 - a success, with a CD of 1. Dodging: Carin rolls 10/1 as well, a success, reducing Matthew's CD to 0 - no damage. Matthew rolls 2/2 - success, reducing Carin's CD to 4-2 = 2. Resolution: Carin completely avoids Matthew's Tongue. The pistol does 2x9 = 18 damage to Matthew, reducing him to 9 Body Hits and stunning him (he can take no action next turn, including dodging). ROUND 3 Supernatural: Carin uses Proficiency, rolling 4/5 - success, with +5 to Power (x9 again). Movement: none. Attacks: Carin shoots the stunned Matthew, rolling 7/6 - success. Dodging: Uh-uh. Matthew's doomed now. Resolution: Matthew takes 6x9 = 54 Hits! More than enough to kill him outright. Game over. Using the normal combat system, and the exact same dice rolls, things work rather differently. Without going into as much detail: Round One: Matthew takes 4+3-3 = 4 Hits from the pistol, same as before. Round Two: Because Matthew's TN is 14 this time, his CD is increased by +2 to 3. Thus, Carin ends up taking 3 Hits. Matthew ends up taking only 10 Hits from the gunshot - not enough to stun him (since he has 42 Hits in this system). Round three: Assuming Matthew concentrates on Fighting (and extending the same series of dice rolls), he successfully attacks Carin with a CD of 3 (+1+2=6 Hits). Carin partially Dodges and takes only 1 Hit (7/4), while Matthew rolls 7/2 for Dodging and takes 12 Hits - stunning him, but still leaving him with (42-4-10-12 =) 16 Hits. Carin is reduced to 26 Hits. It's likely that at least two more rounds would be needed to finish the fight (and only to a knockout, not a fatality). So the new system should make combats faster and more deadly, which is basically what I'm aiming for. Well, there it is. Any comments? - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia Journalism is not a profession or a trade. It is a cheap catch-all for fuckoffs & misfits - a false doorway to the backside of life, a filthy piss-ridden little hole nailed off by the building inspector, but just deep enough for a wino to curl up from the sidewalk and masturbate like a chimp in a zoo-cage. HUNTER S. THOMPSON, "Fear & Loathing in Las Vegas" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 19:44:25 -0700 From: Sean McCarthy Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you Our spies report that on 05:54 PM 9/26/99 -0500, paranial@creighton.edu said: >As for why I named her Diana. Cause I helt like it. > >Bradley I can understand why. (I believe I know who you mean.) sean ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 20:32:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Shauna Forrister Subject: Re: IN> White Wolf > Can In Nomine be used along with White-wolfs world of darkness system? > > > Tony Byrd I am currently working on integrating the World of Darkness into a campaign. If any one is interested, I'll be making a page dedicated to it, when I get the rules done. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 21:45:07 -0600 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> White Wolf Hmmm, I would think that using GURPS as middle ground would be the best route. Though I've always thought a werewolf crossover would be interesting, having them worship the Symphony as Gaia, and getting very irritated at all disturbances believing it to be the Wyrm's work. Timothy, "Angel" of Rambling If you have a hankering for waffles or chicken i know the place for you: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 12:54:38 +0100 From: Julian Breen Subject: IN> Gabriel's Madness A player of mine has recently suggested that Gabriel's insanity might have something to do with the fact that the Archangel of the Waters is deceased. An imbalance in the traditional four elements causing such instability in water's opposite. I thought that this was a very nice idea and wondered if anybody else had done anything similar? (IMC, Gabriel has recently sounded four of the Seven Trumpets, and become outcast (adopting a male persona now). Some of the angels who do not _want_ Armageddon (as well as a servitor of his) are desperately looking at ways in which to reconcile him with Heaven.) - -- Julian ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 08:00:54 -0500 From: "Trent" Subject: Re: IN> Gabriel's Madness - ----- Original Message ----- From: Julian Breen To: Sent: Monday, September 27, 1999 6:54 AM Subject: IN> Gabriel's Madness > A player of mine has recently suggested that Gabriel's insanity might > have something to do with the fact that the Archangel of the Waters is > deceased. An imbalance in the traditional four elements causing such > instability in water's opposite. > > > I thought that this was a very nice idea and wondered if anybody else > had done anything similar? > I've done very much the same thing, except I'm not promising Onaaes is gone for good... (not that my players have any idea about it) Trent ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 09:55:30 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> New Superior Just for you A couple of suggestions: If you want a more Biblical-sounding name, "Jophiel" means "Beauty of God" and is the name of one of the Seven Archangels in Pseudo-Dionysius, a popular source of medieval angelology. Add the idea of the "golden mean," of balance, as part of the Word of Beauty. This gives her Word more scope, since many virtues are the point of balance between opposing vices. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 08:40:08 -0600 From: "Ben Glickler" Subject: Re: IN> Gabriel's Madness > > A player of mine has recently suggested that Gabriel's insanity might > > have something to do with the fact that the Archangel of the Waters is > > deceased. An imbalance in the traditional four elements causing such > > instability in water's opposite. Gabriel's insanity is a function of her Word (fire is unstable), her persecution at the hands of Dominic, and, perhaps most importantly, her SHARED Word with Belial. The extended Gabriel write-up in one of the Revelation Cycle books explains this nicely. > > I thought that this was a very nice idea and wondered if anybody else > > had done anything similar? Not necessarily, this, but I had pondered the ramifications of Gabriel tripping or falling. I suspect without Yves' guidance and Cherubim, Gabriel would at least be an Outcast, happily growling in the desert with Khalid. How would Heaven cope? But I've already tripped a major Archangel IMC, it'd probably get old if I did it twice.. Ben ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1341 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.