From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Oct 20 11:56:45 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA01089 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:56:43 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id LAA27294 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:54:32 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:54:32 -0500 Message-Id: <200010201654.LAA27294@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1860 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, October 20 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1860 In this digest: Re: Re:IN> Crusade replies. Re: IN> Well, apparently the Devil IS a Yankees fan... IN> People, I know this one's Just Asking For It, but retain your dignity, OK? Re: Re:IN> Crusade replies. IN> Splatbooks: An Abstract Exercise Re: IN> Splatbooks: An Abstract Exercise Re: IN> New Hellish society Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Re: IN> Stat+SKill Systems Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword IN> Summonable feature Re: IN> Stat+SKill Systems Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Re: IN> People, I know this one's Just Asking For It, but retain your dignity, OK? IN> Another of those wacky websites Re: IN> Just who did come up with it? Re: IN> People, I know this one's Just Asking For It, but retain your dignity, OK? Re: IN> Mercurians and the Way of Harmony. Re: IN> Another of those wacky websites Fwd: Re: IN> Dominic's Confessions IN> Fwd: djinn IN> Fwd: Ethereal Vessels, and Mortal Songs re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Re: IN> Fwd: Ethereal Vessels, and Mortal Songs Re: IN> Setting question Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Re: No more Re: IN> Stat+SKill Systems & an Adminny comment. Re: IN> Splatbooks: An Abstract Exercise Re: IN> Summonable feature IN> Song of Restriction ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 22:55:48 -0500 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: Re:IN> Crusade replies. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Azrael/Demigouge" To: Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2000 11:44 PM Subject: Re: Re:IN> Crusade replies. > [...] I > > can't imagine that Belial was precisley close to the Demon Prince of the > > Oceans, but he still wiped out Oannes for the crime. > > While I agree that it would start an outright conflict between Heaven and > Hell, I don't believe that Belial struck at Oannes because he killed Vephar, > but rather becuase he *could*, Belial is a Calabite after all. Destroying > his opposition (boh ine Word, and general opposition) would be a high thing > on his list of priorities regardless of what Oannes did. > > The fact that this would start a conflict, as well as weakening Hell's > position (but Heaven would also be weakened considerably) Eh? The worst-case scenario of the New Crusade that I've seen so far has them losing several thousand younger Servitors, and that's it. Plus *recovering* one partially-lost Archangel. When this is stacked up vs. Hell being one Demon Prince, and one of the nextmost-strongest of their War faction besides, what I see is Heaven losing a little and Hell losing a great big whacking chunk. So while Hell would be weakened by a major amount, as currently planned the New Crusade would weaken Heaven only by a minor or moderate amount.. Did I miss something? - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 00:14:29 -0400 From: David Wood Subject: Re: IN> Well, apparently the Devil IS a Yankees fan... Quoth Maurice Lane on 10/18/00 12:34 AM: > ... and, really, this is an untapped mine of IN wackyness ... I mean, > "interest". Somebody out there should play with this bit of sports lore in > general. > Are you sure you want to go THERE with THIS crowd? >:) > I, myself, figure that the Angel of Baseball is a Elohite of Stone. No demon > has dared request the demonic version: the Yanks have to lose _occasionally_, > but just try explaining that to the Lightbringer... :) No, actually it's the much more bitter and sardonic sequel to "Angels in the Outfield," titled "Demons in the Dugout." There! Now that I've mentioned the title, everyone should *reflexively* contribute enough beats to put a script together! > Moegiel Kyriotate of Destiny in Service to Judgement ("Out? Out? That ball > nowhere near his zone of strike. Umpire unJust. "SMASH UMPIRE! SMASH UMPIRE!") So, how is throwing a beer bottle at the Ump helping him toward his Destiny...? - --David http://home.bluecrab.org/~dwood "I must warn you, sir, that outside I have police dog Josephine, who is not only armed, and trained to sniff out certain substances, but is also a junkie." -Monty Python, episode 5 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 21:14:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: IN> People, I know this one's Just Asking For It, but retain your dignity, OK? You know, you can get some really _weird_ ones working for the more ancient types. Thought I'd share ... but save the scatalogical jokes for private email? I _mean_ it! ;) Moe Quentin Kyriotate Friend of the Gardeners (literally, really) Angel of Manure Corporeal Forces: 5 Strength: 10 Agility: 10 Ethereal Forces: 4 Intelligence: 9 Precision: 7 Celestial Forces: 5 Will: 12 Perception: 8 Word-Forces: 14 Skills: Chemistry/2, Dodge/3, Fighting/2, Knowledge/4 (Ecology), Medicine/3, Throwing/1 Songs: Affinity (Corporeal/1), Charm (Corporeal/3), Empathy (Celestial/2), Fire (Corporeal/1, Celestial/2), Forbidding (Ethereal/4), Fruition (Corporeal/1), Harmony (Ethereal/3), Healing (All/2), Ice (Ethereal/2), Light (Celestial/1), Shields (All/3), Succor (Corporeal/1, Ethereal/1) Attunements: Kyriotate of Flowers, Seraphim of Flowers, Nothing But Flowers, Smell the Roses...*, Friend of the Gardeners, Angel of Manure *Smell the Roses... (non-canonical, alas) Anyone within ten feet of someone with this Attunement receives a +3 to any roll to calm down, snap out of the Angry or Berserk Discords, or generally relax. By spending 4 Essence, the angel may require a person to do the same, whether they want to or not, for ten minutes. Demons get a Will Roll at -4 to resist. Angel of Manure 1): Quentin, being a Kyriotate, may craft a temporary vessel out of manure. Quentin needs 30lb of manure handy for each Force that it chooses to tie up: hits and Strength are based on Quentin's own statistics, but are limited by how many Forces it has invested in the vessel (thus, if it only invests 2 Forces in the vessel, it does damage and has hits equal to an average entity with 2 Corporeal Forces). Quentin usually invests 5 Forces. The vessel, being made out of (usually) soft and homogenous material, is highly resistant to physical attacks: all corporeal damage done is divided in half. Quentin does not suffer from dissonance if the vessel is 'destroyed', and may possess it for as long as his colleagues will tolerate it. Quentin has been known to provide this as a Servitor Attunement. 2): Quentin can heal most bacteriological-based diseases, or purify up to 50 lb. of organic fertilizer with a touch (and 2 Essence). Special Rites: : Compost. : Be the compost for four hours (+2 Essence). Sure, go ahead and laugh. Do you have any idea how bad the world's crop yields would be if it weren't for soil enrichment? Quentin has had an adventurous life. It started out as a Shedite of Death, patiently killing off humanity one rotting corpse at a time, back when a demon could casually wander the earth and spread various infectious diseases hither and yon. Alas, Saminga doesn't particularly reward the thoughtful, and Quentin was thoughtful. Shedim of Death are fairly odd, anyway: they don't have to corrupt their deceased vessels (not that you could, anyway), so they're not under quite the same pressures as their Band-mates. Most act nasty anyway, but the occasional one can end up fairly tolerable. Quentin was such a one. It noticed that it didn't have to actually do anything to promote Death: if it stuck around in one place long enough, people just dropped like the flies that followed it everywhere. Being fairly curious, Quentin set out to discover why... and independently discovered about germs long before humanity ever did. Germs were fascinating: they did all sorts of interesting things, and the little buggers were everywhere. Eventually it worked out that manure was a bacterium's paradise, and that's when it really started to get in trouble. Manure was fascinating stuff, not only for the kinds of bacteria it hosted, but also for what it did. A simple by-product of corporeal digestive products had been turned by a busy Nature into a tool for redistributing absolutely vital nutrients back into the ecosystem. And bacteria were so important for doing this: in fact, the process of decay was what kept the whole system going. One of Death's most potent symbols - decay - was really a subtle agent for Life. Really, when Quentin had gotten this revelation through its head, what choice was there but to Redeem? Life had already beaten Saminga, and the idiot didn't have a clue. If Quentin didn't want to violate Death's dissonance conditions, it would have to stay off the corporeal plane... and they didn't have manure in Hell. Not the good stuff, at any rate. Novalis listened to all of this with not a little bemusement, of course, but Quentin was serious about Redeeming. It survived the process, and the new Kyriotate immediately started working to improve crop yields. It liked manure even more now, seeing as it could root for bacteria without fear of dissonance. Eventually, Quentin got to the point where a Word was in order, and naturally asked for Manure. It was surprisingly easy to get; even Michael supported the petition, once he stopped laughing. Quentin, these days, does a lot of work in rural regions (naturally). Its major task is to try to keep the natural cycle of decay and growth running smoothly. Quentin is quietly proud of the fact that areas under its direct supervision are clean, disease free, and produce bumper crops. It doesn't like combat at all, and has grown quite adept in alternative methods of conflict resolution. The Angel of Manure is fairly well liked by other Servitors of Flowers, although they find its habit of animating dunghills fairly bizarre ... not to mention quite smelly. Note that Quentin also possesses other things, as well: it's helpful in getting a really good handle on ecological processes. But it always goes back to the manure. The manure is the key. The Manure is the Life. ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 15:28:04 +1000 From: "Azrael/Demigouge" Subject: Re: Re:IN> Crusade replies. > So while Hell would be weakened by a major amount, as currently planned the > New Crusade would weaken Heaven only by a minor or moderate amount.. Did I > miss something? > > -- > Chuckg No, it was probably me, I was thinking under the "lots of little things make one big thing mindset". Belial and his crew would take some killing, lots of angels would be destroyed, I was thinking enough to amount to one Demon Prince. Of course I then failed to account for the regaining of Gabriel... It was me...I screwed up... Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 15:31:47 +1000 From: "Azrael/Demigouge" Subject: IN> Splatbooks: An Abstract Exercise What if SJG really did put out a line of splatbooks....reasons not to but them Seraphim SB; it'd be too "high" and "mighty", as if the author had a stick up their ass. Cherubim SB; having to make sure the book was alright every minute of everyday, would be undesirable. Elohim SB: Would beempty, it isn't our place to disturb the symphony (?) Malakim SB: There is only so many ways you can say, swear oaths and kill demons. (?) Ofanim SB: Because using a PC Printer in draft made, and then photocopying the book as a method of production, before bundling it together with a staple, but not bothering to sort the pages is the fastest way to distribute the book, although it leaves a desire for quality. Kyriotates SB: There's no point unless you possess multiple copies. Mercurians SB: It's nothing but advice about clothes, hair and socializing. Grigori SB: After a while, you'd feel the urge to throw it out. Balseraphs SB: It'd just be wrong, or all about Mercurians of Flowers. Djinn Spaltbook : Who gives a sh*t about the Djinn? Habbalah SB: (?) Calabim SB: You couldn't read more than a couple of pages before needing to "Take a break".<...groan> Lilim SB: (?) Shedim SB: After you read this, you'd wish you hadn't, or could at least was the dirt from *under* your skin... Impudite SB: This would just plain suck... and reading it would be really draining Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 15:54:41 +1000 From: "Azrael/Demigouge" Subject: Re: IN> Splatbooks: An Abstract Exercise > What if SJG really did put out a line of splatbooks....reasons not to but > them Sorry, make that buy them, not but them... Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 22:11:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> New Hellish society Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 23:07:53 -0400From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> New Hellish society >The Hollow Ones > >Thus the order makes it a special point to hunt down >and destroy servitors of Novalis and make lives >difficult for them above others. _Not_ bright of them at all, as Asmodeus will explain to them in great detail when he tracks them down next week. "We've got an Archangel on the Other Side who's always ready to at listen to a plausable sob story, and you want to _eliminate_ her?" Of course, Michael will probably take the time to thank them as he cleaves them in twain. "Thanks, guys. I've been trying to get her pissed off for the last twenty thousand years. I _thought_ that the mass evisceration of her servants would do the trick nicely, but I didn't think any of you dumbasses would be stupid enough to actually _try_ it..." Neither of the above should be seen as a criticism of your idea, naturally. Quite enjoyable, it was. :) YMMV. Morgan (FAW) Kyriotate of Destiny Petitioner for the Word of When Novalis Frowns, Worry. When Novalis Purses Her Lips, Retreat. When Novalis Sighs and Says, "Oh, Dear." RUN. ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 22:21:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 21:54:46 -0500 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword >Every couple of months, this durn Muse just reaches >out and grabs me by the frontal lobes and *forces* me >to write things that my normally uncreative self >can't hope to compose... >.. anyway, at least I managed to finish this one in >one episode rather than leave an unfinished story >dangling. >I hope you like it. Yes. Very much so. Nice use of non-Western chivalric imagery. Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 00:26:49 -0500 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maurice Lane" To: Sent: Friday, October 20, 2000 12:21 AM Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword > Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 21:54:46 -0500 > From: "Charles Glasgow" [snip] > >I hope you like it. > > Yes. Very much so. Nice use of non-Western chivalric > imagery. Thank you. I wish I could actually take credit for it, but I was stealing bits from all over -- the katana duel in David Weber's _Flag In Exile_, the katana duel from Marvel Comics' KITTY PRYDE & WOLVERINE limited series (issue #6) of all places, a Kurosawa movie or two, and even David Brin's _Uplift War_ for Laurence's last line. (Lest anyone think that I am any great expert on Japanese culture, I'll come clean in advance -- I ain't.) So while I really thank you for your praise, I do want to point out that I wasn't exactly being the Archangel of Creation when I wrote this... - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 06:07:40 GMT From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Stat+SKill Systems >From: David Edelstein >> >"Krishnaswami, Neel" wrote: > > > > > Realistically, their "performance envelopes" should be quite > > different. Dramatically, the old salt and the bright young middy > > serve different purposes. > > > > Fix? I have no idea. > > >The alternative is to assume that two people with equal >amounts of experience will be equal, even if one is far smarter than the >other, which makes no more sense. Actually, you could set prerequisites on skill levels based on attributes. Frex, if you can't buy any int-based skill up above 3 unless your int is at least 8, can't buy them above 4 unless your int is at least 9, can't buy them above 5 unless your int is at least 10. That would hit mortals especially hard, but a mortal CAN have int 10, and perhaps that's what you need to learn stuff like Maths/6. jo _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 22:19:12 -0700 From: Charles E Smith Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword *applause* Excellent story! Bravo!!! :D Please send more as you come up with it. :) ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 02:49:33 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword >Thank you. I wish I could actually take credit for it, but I was stealing >bits from all over -- the katana duel in David Weber's _Flag In Exile_, the >katana duel from Marvel Comics' KITTY PRYDE & WOLVERINE limited series >(issue #6) of all places, a Kurosawa movie or two, and even David Brin's >_Uplift War_ for Laurence's last line. (Lest anyone think that I am any >great expert on Japanese culture, I'll come clean in advance -- I ain't.) I shouldn't worry about it, Charles. I quite enjoyed this. I had a quibble or two (I don't see Baal retreating with shoulders slumped; he'd somehow convince himself that he'd *really* won, and strut off with a sneer), but a solid piece nonetheless. Please do more. >So while I really thank you for your praise, I do want to point out that I >wasn't exactly being the Archangel of Creation when I wrote this... Eli knows perfectly well that most "new" stuff is just old stuff arranged in new ways. He's cool with that. Doug M -- delurking ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 09:19:28 +0100 From: "Laurent" Subject: IN> Summonable feature Hi everybody! Just a quick question: how much does the Summonable at Will feature cost? 5 or 7 points? I don't have my books at work, and need to know asap... Thanks, Laurent. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 08:05:27 -0400 From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" Subject: Re: IN> Stat+SKill Systems Perry Lloyd wrote: > >> However, In Nomine's system is just too coarse. You are either >> ALWAYS or NEVER succeeding depending on which end of the curve you >> are on. > > And my players with low-levels songs are testement to that fact. Most > refuse to purchase a Song at a low level because "it's just not worth > it" I never had a problem with this, myself. People with Songs at low levels usually used extra time to get bonuses to their rolls, and used the "risk" rules. So a 3 Forces character with a level 1 Song has a base roll of 4. Pretty bad, but if he takes an extra hour to perform his Song and accepts a -1 to the check digit, his skill level becomes: 3 (Forces) + 1 (skill) + 4 (time) + 1 (risk) = 9 This is an 83% chance of success. If he spent 1 extra Essence, it goes up to 92%, and with two it's 97%. For many songs, like Celestial Projection, this even makes in-game: showing a human the beatific (or miserific) vision is something that *ought* to be easier if you make a ceremony out of it. The only Song that got bought to high levels were ones that had nonlinear increases with skill level (like Healing or Celestial Motion). - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswcasa.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 07:26:27 -0500 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douglas Muir" To: Sent: Friday, October 20, 2000 1:49 AM Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword > I shouldn't worry about it, Charles. I quite enjoyed this. I had a > quibble or two (I don't see Baal retreating with shoulders slumped; he'd > somehow convince himself that he'd *really* won, and strut off with a > sneer), Oh, Baal's convincing himself that he really won will happen... in about 10 seconds, *after* he's safely out of range of the immediate threat. But Laurence can be *very* daunting while you're staring him straight in the eye... (Of course, Baal is going to gnaw his own liver out in sheer frustration after he finds out that Michael had witnessed the whole thing, and therefore knows what really happened! So much for impressing your opposite number with your war stories, eh Baal? *g*) > but a solid piece nonetheless. Please do more. Thank you. - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 09:05:38 EDT From: MarkDEddy@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> People, I know this one's Just Asking For It, but retain your dignity, OK? In a message dated 10/20/00 4:14:51 AM, moelane_1999@yahoo.com writes: >Quentin >Kyriotate Friend of the Gardeners (literally, really) >Angel of Manure I liked him, quite. But wouldn't he be a close ally (or servitor) of the Angel of Compost/Composting? And you didn't include *her*. Mark (Elohite of Flowers, at a guess...) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2000 00:16:57 +1000 From: "Azrael/Demigouge" Subject: IN> Another of those wacky websites http://www.alaska.net/~clund/e_djublonskopf/Flatearthsociety.htm While not directly related to celestial affairs, it could be modified and incorporated with our favourite militia the NRTF (Nephilim Resistance Taskforce)... I found this site while searching for Grigori, and in the section "why a flat earth" a man named Grigori Efimovich, who I belive they dislike is mentioned. Unlike other sites of this silliness there are some *obvious* hints that this isn't serious. Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 07:46:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Just who did come up with it? Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 16:40:54 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Just who did come up with it? >>I need to find a copy of it (my girlfriend is trying >>to get her head around the idea of Djinn as anything >>but apathetic sluggards, a situation that I'm afraid >>I've unwittingly encouraged. Hey, it works for me), >>and I remember the bit as being pretty good at >>getting into Azzie's head. Thanks. It's http://www.sjgames.com/ftp/sjgames/in-nomine/digests/2000/6/1-1693.txt under the "most likely to Redeem" thread. In response to your own post, actually. Why do you think I remembered it in the first place? ;) Thanks. Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:48:19 -0400 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> People, I know this one's Just Asking For It, but retain your dignity, OK? ... >Special Rites: >: Be the compost for four hours (+2 Essence). Heheehee... I don't know enough about Eastern philosophies to say whether this is more Tao-like or Zen, but it's something along those lines. %^) I really enjoyed this one, and I'm pretty squeamish about the, err... "dirtier" side of life. Also liked his Redemption story, it's a very reasonable way a Shedite might figure out that Death's not so hot after all. William ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:57:34 -0400 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> Mercurians and the Way of Harmony. In addition, if one really wishes to play a Mercurian that's not entirely required to go soft on the humans, one might consider playing a Mercurian of Judgment. If the person has committed a crime (and assault is most definitely a crime), then the Mercurian can punish them justly for it, which would include any *reasonable* force required to arrest or capture them. They still wouldn't be able to kill, unless he knew the human had committed murder, in which case "eye for an eye" would apply(and, although this is a fine point, I would probably require that the angel know that the human was unlikely to be sufficiently punished by Earthly law). Playing an angel of Judgment comes with its own strict job requirements, of course, but it's something to be able to use force in a just manner. Half of Dominic's Choir Attunements allow the angels to get around their Choir Dissonance Conditions. Something ain't right about that boy... William ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:14:16 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Another of those wacky websites Azrael/Demigouge wrote: "Unlike other sites of this silliness there are some *obvious* hints that this isn't serious." Such as the fine print in which they disclaim all responsibility for, among other things, "the recent yeti sightings outside the Vatican, or for the unfortunate enslavement of the Nabisco Inc. factory employees by a rogue hamster insurrectionist group." Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:26:36 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Fwd: Re: IN> Dominic's Confessions >From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Admin request of type /^\s*who\s+\S+\s*$/i at line 5 (I.e., the word "w h o" appeared at the beginning of a line, within the first 6 lines or 10 or whatever the magic line number is. --Beth) >From: "Kish" >Subject: Re: IN> Dominic's Confessions >Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 18:05:46 -0700 > >From: Laurent > > ><us these beautiful pieces of art. > >Thank you. > > >Laurent.>> > >Heartily seconded. I expected them to be more...humorous. Less to >them. But some of these (most of these, I think) are really >beautiful. > > >-- > Kish >ICQ#: 28085879 >AIM: Kish K M >Kish_K@mindspring.replacewithcom > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:27:50 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Fwd: djinn >From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 21:04:36 -0500 >To: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Non-member submission from [chris carr ] (Might be a good idea to Cc responses to this fellow...) >Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 19:04:07 -0700 (PDT) >From: chris carr >Subject: djinn > >i am very new to in nomine, and was just wondering >something about the djinn. the book says that they may >use their power on something that they are attuned to, >then roll on the chart. so does that mean that the >first use of the power gives a general location idea, >and the second use on the same target gets the >response on the chart, or what? >> > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. >http://im.yahoo.com/ > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:28:56 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Fwd: Ethereal Vessels, and Mortal Songs >From: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 22:51:44 -0500 >To: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Non-member submission from [StoyboI@aol.com] >From: StoyboI@aol.com >Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 23:50:59 EDT >Subject: Ethereal Vessels, and Mortal Songs >I have noticed some rules discrepancies when it comes to songs and mortals. >I am hoping they can be cleared up. > >1) Mortals can only learn corporeal songs. This is stated in many of the >books, yet, there are numerous sections where mortals are hinted at having, >celestial projection (Revelations III: Heaven and Hell) or even ethereal >songs (Revelations II: the Marches). Also, I have seen that mortals cannot >learn songs without celestial aid of some kind, however, sorcerers seem to be >able to bypass this (of course, I can concede that the sorcery attunement >could be considered celestial intervention). > >2) How does a starting ethereal spirit (PC) get a body. In Revelations II: >the Marches, it is said to require essence. No problem, but what about a new >character with a body already. Should the vessel be bought as a resource >normally? Perhaps as a way of indicating all that time spent hording essence >instead of gaining songs or skills or gaining artifacts. > >I have considered some possible answers for these, but I would appreciate >hearing the party line. My own answers are: > >1) Corporeal songs cost 1 point per level, Ethereal costs 2 (after all, >humans do enter dreams every night, so why should it be impossible to play >with them. just difficult), and Celestial cost 3. Yes, this is something I >was inspired by from reading the sorcery skills. > >2) Have the ethereal buy its first body (for the sake of playability) as a >resource and just say that it was spending time hording the essence, but only >ONE vessel. > >Thank you for your time. I will undoubtedly have more as time marches on. > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 17:26:10 BST From: "nick sands" Subject: re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword wow, this is so beautiful. it makes michael the angel that i always immagined him to be and laurence to to a 'grown-up' now that he has no more inner fears, knowing that he wwould have and always will sacrifice himself in true duty/honour to god, and not just get himself killed for being a fool with little idea of what he is saying. do you have any stuff to be published? if not, WHY NOT!!! Nick Sands ICQ- 60645575 (its working again) home page (with a few modifications)- www.angelfire.com/goth/psyber _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 11:39:11 -0500 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Fwd: Ethereal Vessels, and Mortal Songs At 11:28 AM 10/20/00, you wrote: By the way: you might want to visit www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/lists.html for information about the In Nomine Mailing Lists. >I have noticed some rules discrepancies when it comes to songs and mortals. >I am hoping they can be cleared up. > >1) Mortals can only learn corporeal songs. This is stated in many of the >books, yet, there are numerous sections where mortals are hinted at having, >celestial projection (Revelations III: Heaven and Hell) or even ethereal >songs (Revelations II: the Marches). Also, I have seen that mortals cannot >learn songs without celestial aid of some kind, however, sorcerers seem to be >able to bypass this (of course, I can concede that the sorcery attunement >could be considered celestial intervention). If I remember correctly, Saints, Undead (with the possible exception of zombi) and Sorcerers can use Songs other than the Corporeal. Sorcery, as far as it goes, is a different power than Songs are, and I think you might be getting the two confused; details are, again IIRC, in the Corporeal Player's Guide. (I don't have anything but the main rulebook with me, so I can't check your references.) As far as I know, /no/ mortal can learn Songs without celestial intervention. (Update: From the FAQ. I think Celestial and Ethereal Attunements are in the CPG: Can a Superior give a Song to a human? Yes, but that's not very efficient. Usually, the Superior would grant an Ethereal Attunement (this is what dream soldiers get) or a Celestial Attunement to grant the ability to use the appropriate songs.) > >2) How does a starting ethereal spirit (PC) get a body. In Revelations II: >the Marches, it is said to require essence. No problem, but what about a new >character with a body already. Should the vessel be bought as a resource >normally? Perhaps as a way of indicating all that time spent hording essence >instead of gaining songs or skills or gaining artifacts. Starting Ethereals buy vessels at normal cost, yet again IIRC. David Edelstein or (Sean McCarthy?) should be able to answer this in more detail, but as I recall, Ethereals may create vessels for the same cost as a Celestial in Limbo. >1) Corporeal songs cost 1 point per level, Ethereal costs 2 (after all, >humans do enter dreams every night, so why should it be impossible to play >with them. just difficult), and Celestial cost 3. Yes, this is something I >was inspired by from reading the sorcery skills. Does this rule apply only to mortals, or to everybody? >2) Have the ethereal buy its first body (for the sake of playability) as a >resource and just say that it was spending time hording the essence, but only >ONE vessel. That's the gist of it, yes. - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:22:19 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Setting question At 1:25 PM -0400 10/19/00, Andrew Stoner wrote: >Has anyone out there done anything with a cyberpunk-style IN setting? I >can't imagine that I'm the first to think of this, but I can't seem to >find anything on the web. Also, are there archives out there? I'd >assume there are, but I can't seem to find an address for them. http://www.sjgames.com/ftp/sjgames/in-nomine/digests/ http://www.sjgames.com/ftp/sjgames/in-nomine/articles is the INC. http://homepages.tcp.co.uk/~maya/nomine/fiat.html has some "fluff" bits, such as http://orleans.pave-france.org/~maya/meta/META17.html which is Cyberpunkish in a very weird way... - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. "She's either babbling, or summoning Elder Gods. I'm not sure which." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 12:47:18 EDT From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword In a message dated 10/20/00 12:12:30 AM Central Daylight Time, moelane_1999@yahoo.com writes: << From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: IN> FICTION -- The War and the Sword >Every couple of months, this durn Muse just reaches >out and grabs me by the frontal lobes and *forces* me >to write things that my normally uncreative self >can't hope to compose... >> Um, I don't think I got it. Could you email it to me, if you still have it? Reverend Brian A. Rogers BillionSix@aol.com ICQ# 22544590 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 13:07:31 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: No more Re: IN> Stat+SKill Systems & an Adminny comment. At 2:55 PM -0400 10/19/00, William J. Keith wrote: >Erm. If I translated this right, you're asking for comments on the Outcast >Archangel of Song? I don't think there are any; the first I've heard of it >is a throwaway line in the write-up of the Grigori. So we know it's a >Grigori, and Outcast. ;^) That's about right. Oh. And last I recall, from long-ago discussions, prefered female vessels. Which is hearsay (if not heresy), not canon. >[...] Why, then, would Song be an Archangelic Word? > >My answer: [snip] - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. "She's either babbling, or summoning Elder Gods. I'm not sure which." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 13:07:37 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Splatbooks: An Abstract Exercise At 3:31 PM +1000 10/20/00, Azrael/Demigouge wrote: >Lilim SB: (?) You'd get it before you paid, but the interest would be hell... - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. "She's either babbling, or summoning Elder Gods. I'm not sure which." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 13:07:41 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Summonable feature At 9:19 AM +0100 10/20/00, Laurent wrote: >Hi everybody! > >Just a quick question: how much does the Summonable at Will feature cost? 5 >or 7 points? >I don't have my books at work, and need to know asap... 5 if it costs Essence, 7 w/out Essence cost. IIRC. - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. "She's either babbling, or summoning Elder Gods. I'm not sure which." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2000 10:04:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: IN> Song of Restriction This one came to me during lunch. It's in real rough form, but what the heck. Moe Song of Restriction This Song was originally discovered by Asmodeus, and he certainly planned to keep it a secret, but it eventually was duplicated by another Prince. From there it spread throughout Hell like a wildfire ... and Heaven snapped it up almost as rapidly. The Song reinforces celestial natures. Actually, "intolerantly restricts" would be a better descriptor. When The Song of Restriction is successfully performed, anyone within a ten yard radius (including the Singer!) suffers from debilitating mental agony every time he, she or it does _anything_ that could be remotely interpeted as violating, however trivially, either their Word or Choir/Band dissonance restrictions. This mental agony results in a penalty for _all_ Skill, Song, Resonance or Characteristic rolls, with a penalty equal to the check digit of the original Song roll. Interventions are not affected. Actually doing something dissonant will result in two points of dissonance, not one. For the purposes of this Song, mortals are completely immune, unless they have a donated Angelic / Infernal Force: in this case, they suffer from the mental attack if they do something that would have violated the dissonance restrictions of the Band or Choir that donated the Force. Ethereals are also not affected. This Song is often threatened, rarely seen: the only celestials that are flexible enough to use it routinely are some Malakim of Creation. Soldiers love it, but the nature of this Song makes it hard for them to use it. Some ethereal spirits are doing their best to get their hands on it, but that might not be too bright, in the long term. This is a Celestial Song: rumours of Corporeal and Ethereal versions are rampant, but unproven. Essence: 4, 2 to maintain. Duration: 15 minutes Degree of Disturbance: none ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 9/5/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger - Talk while you surf! It's FREE. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1860 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.