From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Thu May 4 12:23:55 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA21940 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 12:23:54 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id MAA27166 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Thu, 4 May 2000 12:21:41 -0500 Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 12:21:41 -0500 Message-Id: <200005041721.MAA27166@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1611 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Thursday, May 4 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1611 In this digest: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 Re: IN> Jophiel, Archangel of Temperance Re: IN> Christian Mods IN> Core Book reprint question Re: IN> Core Book reprint question Re: IN> Core Book reprint question Re: IN> Pushing Books (Re: Players and Supplements) Re: IN> Re: Best Choir for Angel of Comedy Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 Re: IN> What happened? RE: IN> Core Book reprint question Re: IN> What happened? Re: IN> What happened? Re: IN> Core Book reprint question Re: IN> What happened? IN> Choir/Band Splatbooks! (WAS: What happened?) Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes Re:IN> Core Book reprint question Re: IN> Re: Best Choir for Angel of Comedy Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 Re: IN> Jophiel, Archangel of Temperance Re: IN> Re: Best Choir for Angel of Comedy Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes IN> House combat system - comments wanted. Re: IN> Core Book reprint question RE: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. RE: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. Re: IN> Core Book reprint question IN> Fwd: Returned mail: too many hops 20 (17 max): from via localhost, to Re: IN> What happened? Re: IN> What happened? Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes Re: IN> Pushing Books (Re: Players and Supplements) Re: IN> What happened? IN> Imagination wanted. Re: IN> Core Book reprint question IN> Re: Fixing humans ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:44:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 > Just gathering Essence from my Not Suffering Fools Rite.... And when he gets enough essence, he's going to EXPLODE! - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 13:54:31 -0700 From: "Sean McCarthy" Subject: Re: IN> Jophiel, Archangel of Temperance Interesting overall, and I will analyze in depth later. My only qualm is with an Archangel creating an Ethereal. I am not saying they could not, but I have my suspicious that an action such as this would be badly looked upon... Sean ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:01:06 -0400 From: neelk@cswcasa.com Subject: Re: IN> Christian Mods Doctor TOC wrote: > Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > > > I didn't say no politics; I even spoke in favor of heated > > arguements in Heaven. And Doctor TOC didn't exactly say no > > politics either -- he complained of the flavor of the politics. > > Thanks for getting what I meant, Earl. Looking at what I wrote, I can > see that it could be interpreted as a blanket "politics is bad", but > that's not what I intended. I was indeed referring to the flavour of the > politics. It seems that having factions of angels who might actively > work against others, or might regard others as evil, goes against the > very nature of what Heaven should be. I've got no problem with that sort > of behaviour amongst demons, but among angels it seems wrong. IME, politics is at most agonizing and interesting when you actually care what the other guy thinks. Some of the best sessions in my IN game were when the angels all got together to decide what to do. Frequently, they couldn't come up with a unified course of action, because their moral judgements were different. Watching them try to navigate the several kinds of ethical minefields was big fun for this GM. An example: there was a demon who one of the PCs thought was redeemable, but he was sure that she would be turned firmly against Heaven if the angels came on like heavies. But there were other angels who thought her loyal human lieutenant was redeemable, if only he could be brought out of her influence for a while. The angels were honest about what they thought was more important with each other, but this made the decisions harder -- you don't want to screw up the work of your close friends, either. - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswcasa.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:52:38 -0500 From: Andrew Hackard Subject: IN> Core Book reprint question My boss and I are discussing the format of the reprint. Some of the distributors are agitating for a hardcover-only reprint, probably priced around $35. (I asked, and the design wouldn't match either of the hardcovers already printed; what it *would* be like, I haven't heard yet -- and it may not yet be decided, for that matter.) The question for y'all is, would you or your players be interested in a hardcover reprint of the rules at that price? (Obviously, you're a bad sample, since almost all of you *have* the rules, but if you could ask around and get back with me, that would be great.) Answers I don't have at the moment: How large the reprint will be, and how much the corresponding softcover would be. (Those two questions are, in fact, hugely related.) Thank you very much for your help! Please e-mail me privately at andrew@sjgames.com with your thoughts and concerns. And please don't get all excited on the list; this is NOT anything close to decided and we aren't out to screw the gamers. - -- Andrew Hackard /\ "My money and my Promotional Writer /()\ [CENSORED] go to Steve Jackson Games / \ Illuminati University" andrew@sjgames.com /______\ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:33:17 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Core Book reprint question From: "Andrew Hackard" > > The question for y'all is, would you or your players be interested in a > hardcover reprint of the rules at that price? Valefor appears to have made off with my copy of the main rules, so as long as I'm going to be replacing it, I want a hardcover. *g* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 18:44:56 -0400 From: "Galen G. Silversmith" Subject: Re: IN> Core Book reprint question > Return-Path: andrew@sjgames.com > The question for y'all is, would you or your players be interested in a > hardcover reprint of the rules at that price? (Obviously, you're a bad > sample, since almost all of you *have* the rules, but if you could ask > around and get back with me, that would be great.) I might; my players who are mostly on tighter budgets than me but are interested in getting the core rules, would not. If its going to be hardcover only, its a loss. Mixed or softcover only would be fine here. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 19:03:30 -0400 From: "TNT" Subject: Re: IN> Pushing Books (Re: Players and Supplements) - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elizabeth McCoy" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2000 12:28 PM Subject: Re: IN> Pushing Books (Re: Players and Supplements) > art. Frankly, _that's_ the thing that most endangers "Bright Dream/ > Dark Dream" -- it's 17 pages long, and depending on how it goes, I > may be able to think of so many other things to do with some of those > pages. Natch, that would require a new pair of opening stories. So > there'd be _something_ there... Oh geeze. As a fairly new convert to the game, who's already infected/evangelised one group and an on-line friend and is about to do so with a new group (once I find one) when I move for my new job...I have to say..the Bright/Dark Dream Vignette was what got me hooked. I started reading those 17 pages and couldn't put it down. I hate to say it, but they really set the tone for me. And for the people I've infected/evangelised as well. My group was reluctant to try the game, til I made 'em all sit down and read those two stories. That vignette just seemed to encapsulate what was possible with the game... Not sure that I had a point or anything, but..I just kinda hate to hear that the Bright/Dark Dream might not make the cut. > --Beth, catching up as she can, typing with a baby (iolanthe) in her lap > and no computer desk -- the keyboard shares the lap, and the trackball sits > on a pile of GURPS books. I want the computer desk back! Moving is a hassle. > (PS: may be typing with 1 hand, or even toe! Please forgive capitalization.) A.Hamilton ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:32:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Martin Subject: Re: IN> Re: Best Choir for Angel of Comedy On Wed, 3 May 2000, Prodigal wrote: > I was going to suggest either a Malakite or Elohite, because having someone > whose nature demands that they keep a straight face at all times embodying > the word of Comedy has a twisted appeal to me. *g* Elohite would be *perfect* for Angel of Humor. Kobal would either find it Funny or would freak out. After all, an Elohite of Humor would be able to say, with precision: "To whom is this funny? To whom is it not funny? At whose expense?" Malakim of Humor are probably more interested in the "whose expense" part, and deal harshly with vicious practical jokers. Nothing twisted about it. The Elohite *understands* Humor and thus knows how to defend it (like the excellent Cherub Angel of Temperance), the Malakite defends it a little more directly. OK, slightly twisted. - -- I remain, Michael Martin "It is commonly the case with technologies that you can get the best insight about how they work by watching them fail." -- Neal Stephenson, "In the Beginning... Was the Command Line" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 01:25:39 +0100 From: Omentide Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 >-David (Elohite or Habbalite, depending on my mood) What's the difference, they both work for Heaven. Objectivity is mostly relative Ashley Ashley and Hilary omentide.omentide@virgin.net http://freespace.virgin.net/omentide.omentide ------------------------------ Date: 4 May 2000 01:10:17 -0000 From: "Chris Rose" Subject: Re: IN> What happened? On Tue, 02 May 2000 18:24:57 -0500 David Edelstein wrote: >Gregory Gietzen wrote: >Hmm. Probably falls into the "cruel but not entirely undeserved" >category. Probably also falls into the "White Wolf is still bitter about >GURPS Vampire being better than WoD Vampire" category. > >-David And I'm not even gonna mention GURPS Bloodtypes or GURPS Undead ... I don't even play GURPS, and those books thoroughly rocked and are incredibly useful for anybody running a game which has even the slightest hint of darkness. Even better, and much harder to get - Grimms Cybertales, by Ianus games, for Cyberpunk 2.0.2.0. (They also did a pretty good vampire sourcebook for c-punk, but I can't remember the title right now.) Grimms is my bible ... decent rules for fear, stress, sleep deprivation, and some thoroughly scary boogymen .. ^C Chris - -------- Chris Rose ofanite@gospeedgo.com Angel of Phone Technical Support Ofanite of Lightning ________________________________________________________________ Get Free Email, Anime News, and The Best Prices at http://AnimeNation.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:27:26 -0700 From: "Robert Veneman-Hughes" Subject: RE: IN> Core Book reprint question I would love to buy myself a hardcover, providing that I have any money at the time. The rest of the world may not - I would suggest a mixed run. - -Robert ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 19:57:31 -0600 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> What happened? Well we got to hunt down the demon of wrist injuries and beat him to death, while we're at it the demo of mis-diagnosis needs a taste of divine ass kicking. I was diagnosed with carpal tunnel, but it seems to be either a sprained wrist or much less likely very early stage carpal tunnel. Now I need essence for a corporeal song of healing, so I'm going to be rambling a bit. Ok about how IN should be supported I don't think city books are good. I think the Superior books and player's guides are the key. I also think a line on individual religions, their beliefs, implications for the IN universe of their beliefs, ethereals/celestials assosiated with them and major figures (past/present) of the religion. Also how about players guides for choir/bands. Like the Seraphim/Balseraph player's guide. The psychology, expanded resonance, maybe the metaphyics that differentiates them from other choir/bands, details on their falling/redeeming, etc. Maybe also a SPG (Sorceror Player's Guide). Maybe alternate settings books would also be good, like historical ones. Or a full cyberpunk setting (i've only skimmed the stuff so far, but it looks interesting), or an IN high fantasy. Personally I think that a Big Book of the Symphony, with flavor text in the form of excerpts from Jean's Symphony Operation Manual and Vapula's Experimental Log Book would be neat. Things like what is essence/forces/resonance and other metaphyics could fill it. Incidently I've started writing something like this for my own campeigns. Alright I'm done, my wrist hurts, and I have a hall meeting. Timothy, Angel of Rambling Ofanite of Creation ArchRival of Mathus My international broadcasting agency: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 21:13:35 -0500 From: Jonathan B Lotzer Subject: Re: IN> What happened? *drools* Ahem, reading this I caught myself dreaming of what these could mean. Oh, I would /love/ to see all of these put into production. I would definately put these on my must have list. Jonathan B Lotzer PS: *grumbles* I /really/ need to figure out how to change my fonts on Netscape. My linewraps are all off. Sorry for difficulties this may cause. Tim Groth wrote: > Ok about how IN should be supported I don't think city books are good. > I think the Superior books and player's guides are the key. I also think a > line on individual religions, their beliefs, implications for the IN > universe of their beliefs, ethereals/celestials assosiated with them and > major figures (past/present) of the religion. Also how about players > guides for choir/bands. Like the Seraphim/Balseraph player's guide. The > psychology, expanded resonance, maybe the metaphyics that differentiates > them from other choir/bands, details on their falling/redeeming, etc. > Maybe also a SPG (Sorceror Player's Guide). > > Maybe alternate settings books would also be good, like historical ones. > Or a full cyberpunk setting (i've only skimmed the stuff so far, but it > looks interesting), or an IN high fantasy. > > Personally I think that a Big Book of the Symphony, with flavor text in the > form of excerpts from Jean's Symphony Operation Manual and Vapula's > Experimental Log Book would be neat. Things like what is > essence/forces/resonance and other metaphyics could fill it. Incidently > I've started writing something like this for my own campeigns. > > Alright I'm done, my wrist hurts, and I have a hall meeting. > > Timothy, Angel of Rambling > Ofanite of Creation > ArchRival of Mathus > > My international broadcasting agency: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:08:10 -0500 From: "Michael Neal" Subject: Re: IN> Core Book reprint question - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Hackard" To: "In Nomine List" Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2000 4:52 PM Subject: IN> Core Book reprint question > My boss and I are discussing the format of the reprint. Some of the > distributors are agitating for a hardcover-only reprint, probably priced > around $35. (I asked, and the design wouldn't match either of the > hardcovers already printed; what it *would* be like, I haven't heard yet -- > and it may not yet be decided, for that matter.) > > The question for y'all is, would you or your players be interested in a > hardcover reprint of the rules at that price? (Obviously, you're a bad > sample, since almost all of you *have* the rules, but if you could ask > around and get back with me, that would be great.) No. Absolutely not. If you release a softcover reprint, I'll probably pick it up, because I desperately want a better organized copy of the rules. I'll take my old copy and either give it to a friend or drop it into a used games bin somewhere in hopes that someone else will be interested and pick it up. I am *very* unlikely to buy a hardcover. J. Michael Neal ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:38:08 -0500 From: "David Rodemaker" Subject: Re: IN> What happened? > Even better, and much harder to get - Grimms Cybertales, by Ianus games, for Cyberpunk 2.0.2.0. (They also did a pretty good vampire sourcebook for c-punk, but I can't remember the title right now.) Grimms is my bible ... decent rules for fear, stress, sleep deprivation, and some thoroughly scary boogymen .. Night's Edge The Other David ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:17:42 -0500 From: "Tafka J." Subject: IN> Choir/Band Splatbooks! (WAS: What happened?) At 7:57 PM -0600 05/03/00, Tim Groth wrote: > Also how about players guides for choir/bands. Like the Seraphim/Balseraph > player's guide. The psychology, expanded resonance, maybe the metaphyics > that differentiates them from other choir/bands, details on their > falling/redeeming, etc. A few, rare, people have seen my take on this already. I call them the Splatbooks. They were meant as HUMOR. I've got an Ofanim Player's Guide, Kyriotates Player's Guide and a Calabim Player's guide. Mostly it's just a pretty cover, along with the little text blurb one gets when looking at the other TRUE published books. When I can get my In Nomine website, Solitaire moved (currently it resides on an account that I can no longer _access_, due to a little matter of not paying the phone company; who incidently provided me with the internet service, and not having a job to pay for said account at the time *phew*), I'll upload what I have. I think I was last working on the Shedim Player's guide cover. I'll say this much, I'm _very_ pleased with the first two covers I drew. The Ofanite in Celestial Form rocks! I also used a non-traditional version of the Calabite, so it would look more akin to a warped version of the Ofanite form (instead of mr. batwings & horns). I'll _privately_ email people a copy or three if they really _can't_ wait. . . But keep in mind, I'll have to send you an attachment of it. . . (Also, all inquiries can be sent to me _privately_.) I'll also see about getting permission to put them up in the INC, since they are best served being as examples of HUMOR. Be seeing you, - - Tafka J. = tafkaj@thrifty.net # Balseraph of Fate, Marquis of Delusions of Grandeur ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 01:36:31 -0500 From: Santiago Subject: Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes Well, last fall we had the Calabite of Death called Medeath (really). His most commonly used phrase was "I NEED a bigger weapon!" His first vessel got wasted when he stormed the house owned by the insanely powerful sorceror with the staff of Moses and gang of assault-rifle-wielding bodyguards who was our antagonist (and turned out to be the son of Loki, in a campaign where Ethereals are almost as powerful as Superiors). His complaining resulted in his getting his alternate raven vessel taken away by a local servitor of Vapula, and replaced with a scrubbot. Whenever he got too obnoxious, we just turned him off, which had the (un)fortunate effect of wiping his memory since the transfer. At one point he threatened to rip Kobal's head off, which meant that Kobal campaigned very hard and succeeded at getting him the Word of Buck Futter, as well as giving him a rather humorously cursed sword. Later, while the servitors of Dark Humor were hanging with Loki, he was thrown into the grand melee we were watching, and though of nothing better to do than try and shoot Loki. This did not go well for him either... He eventually left, and we haven't seen him since about January. Few of us regret this. >* How do you lose all six clones in PARANOIA during character creation, >I ask you? You think he'd keep his mouth shut after #4, but noooooo... Ooh, that's good. In our last game, we lost them all before we got to the R & D lab to be outfitted, but it was mainly because we started killing each other to steal each other's security clearances. Took a whole 22 minutes for all five players to lose all six clones... - -- Santiago ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 01:55:08 -0500 From: Jonathan B Lotzer Subject: Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes *thwack* *thwack* *thwack* Oh this is interesting. Either my sarcasm-meter is a) broken from the level of sarcasm inherent in this posting or b) detecting nothing. Either way, be very very afraid. Santiago wrote: > Well, last fall we had the Calabite of Death called Medeath > (really). His most commonly used phrase was "I NEED a bigger > weapon!" His first vessel got wasted when he stormed the house owned > by the insanely powerful sorceror with the staff of Moses and gang of > assault-rifle-wielding bodyguards who was our antagonist (and turned > out to be the son of Loki, in a campaign where Ethereals are almost > as powerful as Superiors). His complaining resulted in his getting > his alternate raven vessel taken away by a local servitor of Vapula, > and replaced with a scrubbot. Whenever he got too obnoxious, we just > turned him off, which had the (un)fortunate effect of wiping his > memory since the transfer. At one point he threatened to rip > Kobal's head off, which meant that Kobal campaigned very hard and > succeeded at getting him the Word of Buck Futter, as well as giving > him a rather humorously cursed sword. Later, while the servitors of > Dark Humor were hanging with Loki, he was thrown into the grand melee > we were watching, and though of nothing better to do than try and > shoot Loki. This did not go well for him either... He eventually > left, and we haven't seen him since about January. Few of us regret > this. > > >* How do you lose all six clones in PARANOIA during character creation, > >I ask you? You think he'd keep his mouth shut after #4, but noooooo... > > Ooh, that's good. In our last game, we lost them all before > we got to the R & D lab to be outfitted, but it was mainly because we > started killing each other to steal each other's security clearances. > Took a whole 22 minutes for all five players to lose all six clones... > > -- Santiago ------------------------------ Date: 4 May 2000 08:01:03 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re:IN> Core Book reprint question i wouldn't mind buying a hardcover reprint, but not for $35. for $30, certainly. that's at least competitive with the other games i buy. -=|horsefly|=- If I ever wanted to say 'gwrthwynebiad', I'd probably kill myself by choking on my own tongue. =) - --John Karakash ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:38:27 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Re: Best Choir for Angel of Comedy - --On Wed, May 3, 2000 3:32 PM -0500 Prodigal wrote: > From: "Marc Bowden" >> > Prodigal >> > Demon of Calling In to Tech Support Without the Product Nearby >> >> YOU'RE the guy! C'mere, I want to have a Word with you... >> >> Marc. Just Marc. >> Angel of Keeping the IT Guys from Choking the Living Daylights out >> of People who Call In to Tech Support Without the Product Nearby > > After working in tech support for the last few years, mine seemed > to be the natural choice as far as demonic Words went. Especially > when I started becoming reasonably proficient in troubleshooting > without having to have the person I am helping at the keyboard. > I've *always* found it easier to do support or PM without them there... 110 of them, 1 of me. Yikes! ==================================================================== Marc Bowden MERIT Network - University of Michigan System Administration Desktop Computing Environment Support Office: (734) 647-8643 A Loud Buzzing Noise: (734) 647-3745 "Special Orders don't upset us." ==================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:39:38 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 - --On Wed, May 3, 2000 4:44 PM -0400 Emily Dresner wrote: > >> Just gathering Essence from my Not Suffering Fools Rite.... > > And when he gets enough essence, he's going to EXPLODE! > > - Em > I'm pretty sure the number of sheer idiots in general circulation will prevent this. Marc. Just Marc. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:41:15 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Jophiel, Archangel of Temperance - --On Wed, May 3, 2000 1:54 PM -0700 Sean McCarthy wrote: > Interesting overall, and I will analyze in depth later. My only > qualm is with an Archangel creating an Ethereal. I am not saying > they could not, but I have my suspicious that an action such as > this would be badly looked upon... > > Sean > As an agent (a la "community policing")? Marc. Just Marc. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:45:25 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Re: Best Choir for Angel of Comedy - --On Wed, May 3, 2000 4:32 PM -0700 Michael Martin wrote: > Elohite would be *perfect* for Angel of Humor. Kobal would either > find it Funny or would freak out. After all, an Elohite of Humor > would be able to say, with precision: "To whom is this funny? To > whom is it not funny? At whose expense?" Or, with equal panache, "the right people will get the joke." Marc. Just Marc. No humor here. Nope. Move along. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:46:57 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1606 - --On Thu, May 4, 2000 1:25 AM +0100 Omentide wrote: > > Objectivity is mostly relative > The reverse is also true. Marc. Just Marc. Planting mental telephone poles in your road of life since.... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:54:19 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes - --On Thu, May 4, 2000 1:36 AM -0500 Santiago wrote: >> * How do you lose all six clones in PARANOIA during character >> creation, I ask you? You think he'd keep his mouth shut after #4, >> but noooooo... > > Ooh, that's good. In our last game, we lost them all before > we got to the R & D lab to be outfitted, but it was mainly because > we started killing each other to steal each other's security > clearances. Took a whole 22 minutes for all five players to lose > all six clones... That's about par for the course actually. ...and now I have this sick In Nomine/Reboot Alpha crossover in my brain. Somehow, I blame Prodigal for this. Marc. Just Marc. Ow. Quit it. Ow. Quit it. Ow. Quit it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:40:21 +1000 From: "Shane and family" Subject: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. I'm developing an alternative combat system for IN that whilst still using the d666, Corporeal Forces and Vessel levels, doesn't result in powerful Celestials being walking tanks (although a human still wouldn't want to meet a buff celestial in a dark alley). It should (I hope) be especially useful for GMs wanting to run a mixed game and/or want their celestial PCs to respect human firepower a lot more. http://www.bigfoot.com/~sabriel/gaming/nomine/in-combatsystem.html Suggestions, comments and criticisms (like pointing out some humongous flaw I've probably missed) are extremely welcome. Shane. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 08:43:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Core Book reprint question > The question for y'all is, would you or your players be interested in a > hardcover reprint of the rules at that price? No. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emily K. Dresner -- http://www.pave-france.org/zenith Read No Donut -- Gaming, Politics, Conspiracy, Computers, and other fun stuff at http://www.nodonut.com/. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 06:05:20 -0700 From: "Robert Veneman-Hughes" Subject: RE: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. > Suggestions, comments and criticisms (like pointing out some > humongous > flaw I've probably missed) are extremely welcome. > > Shane. > Yeah, sure - I don't understand how you determine *what* level of damage is done. - -Robert "What did you use?" "Your standard-issue big gun. The equipment section made it, and now it's in my private collection." - -From 'Ghost in the Shell' ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 23:38:14 +1000 From: "Shane and family" Subject: RE: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. On 4 May 2000, at 6:05, Robert Veneman-Hughes wrote: > > Yeah, sure - I don't understand how you determine *what* level of damage is > done. > > -Robert Oops. Okay, this should be fixed now. Specific question for folks: should Essence spent by the attacker and defender to improve their CD instead improve or reduce the potential category of the wound? Eg: Joe shoots at Bob, and Bob has a Dodge/10. He can spend 4 Essence to get a Dodge/12 with a +2 to his CD under the old system. Under my system, do people think that +2 should still improve his CD by 2, or should it reduce any potential Wound by two categories? Shane. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 10:00:28 -0500 From: "Ben Chism" Subject: Re: IN> Core Book reprint question > The question for y'all is, would you or your players be interested in a > hardcover reprint of the rules at that price? Hmmmm...$35? not at that price....Especially since I still have my Hardback copy now if they were around $25 or so, sure...but I'd rather see a softcover reprint to bring more players in... just my $.02 Ben Chism ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 11:27:58 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Fwd: Returned mail: too many hops 20 (17 max): from via localhost, to >Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:54:02 +1000 >From: Mail Delivery Subsystem >Subject: Returned mail: too many hops 20 (17 max): from via localhost, to >To: >To: postmaster@firewall.dingoblue.com.au >MIME-Version: 1.0 "angelofdarkness, you're getting u-n-s-u-b-b-e-d until you can make this thing not bounce right back into my mailbox. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 10:29:40 -0500 From: Andrew Hackard Subject: Re: IN> What happened? >I also think a >line on individual religions, their beliefs, implications for the IN >universe of their beliefs, ethereals/celestials assosiated with them and >major figures (past/present) of the religion. I would love to see this; I doubt it will ever happen. >Maybe alternate settings books would also be good, like historical ones. >Or a full cyberpunk setting (i've only skimmed the stuff so far, but it >looks interesting), or an IN high fantasy. I'd love to see these, too, but I think the most realistic thing to hope for is a single book ("Remixes"?) giving a number of different time periods and flavors for the core IN material. - -- Andrew Hackard /\ "My money and my Promotional Writer /()\ [CENSORED] go to Steve Jackson Games / \ Illuminati University" andrew@sjgames.com /______\ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 11:46:33 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> What happened? Tim Groth wrote: > I also think a line on individual religions, their beliefs, > implications for the IN universe of their beliefs, ethereals/ > celestials assosiated with them and major figures (past/present) > of the religion. There is a *section* on exactly this in the GM's Guide. I know it's a little condensed, but I'm not sure the subject could be expanded into a whole line of books. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 11:15:29 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes From: "Marc Bowden" > > ...and now I have this sick In Nomine/Reboot Alpha crossover in my > brain. Somehow, I blame Prodigal for this. The subliminals are working! ;;;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 12:38:51 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Anti-Munchkin - formerly : Player mistakes - --On Thu, May 4, 2000 11:15 AM -0500 Prodigal wrote: > From: "Marc Bowden" >> >> ...and now I have this sick In Nomine/Reboot Alpha crossover in >> my brain. Somehow, I blame Prodigal for this. > > The subliminals are working! ;;;) > These aren't the balseraphs we're looking for. You can go about your buissiness. Move along... Marc. Just Marc. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 12:45:51 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Pushing Books (Re: Players and Supplements) At 19:03 -0400 5/3/00, TNT wrote: >Oh geeze. As a fairly new convert to the game, who's already >infected/evangelised one group and an on-line friend and is about to do so >with a new group (once I find one) when I move for my new job...I have to >say..the Bright/Dark Dream Vignette was what got me hooked. I started >reading those 17 pages and couldn't put it down. I hate to say it, but they >really set the tone for me. And for the people I've infected/evangelised as >well. My group was reluctant to try the game, til I made 'em all sit down >and read those two stories. That vignette just seemed to encapsulate what >was possible with the game... Well, maybe what should be done is to print those in a promotional giveaway booklet, then, sort of like how GURPS Lite is sometimes distributed. (Yes, that's also available as a PDF, but Bright/Dark Dream are already available on the In Nomine web site, even if only in HTML.) >Not sure that I had a point or anything, but..I just kinda hate to hear that >the Bright/Dark Dream might not make the cut. They *are* cool, but they're also a bunch of pages you read once or twice, and then aren't terribly useful after that. They're also a little far out from canon, even as the original version of the game went, and they've crept a little further as the game a shifted a bit to meet what the main audience seems to want. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:04:01 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> What happened? At 21:57 -0400 5/3/00, Tim Groth wrote: > I also think a >line on individual religions, their beliefs, implications for the IN >universe of their beliefs, ethereals/celestials assosiated with them and >major figures (past/present) of the religion. Religious splatbooks? Maybe, but the GMG does a pretty decent job on the basics, and I'm not sure nailing down canon on religions is a good idea. That's an area a lot of GMs like to play with. > Also how about players >guides for choir/bands. Like the Seraphim/Balseraph player's guide. The >psychology, expanded resonance, maybe the metaphyics that differentiates >them from other choir/bands, details on their falling/redeeming, etc. >Maybe also a SPG (Sorceror Player's Guide). These are definitely splatbook territory, and the Powers That Be want to avoid doing that, even if it is a successful strategy for WW. Personally, I think the level of detail in the APG and IPG are adequate for most of the above. I wouldn't object to more "color" about the Choirs and Bands, but some of that is being handled in the Superiors books; I think the rest would be better handled in setting books (i.e., better material on Heaven and Hell, and what people do there). The metaphysics strikes me as mostly the moral equivalent to rubber science -- you're trying to concretize the miraculous. Not that I object to some metaphysical discussion, but I'd want it to be stuff the GM could use to extrapolate from when trying to figure out whether something should work or not. For the most part, the resonances seem straightforward enough. Other than that, metaphysics would be mostly "purple prose"; some of that's good for flavor, but I wouldn't want a steady diet of it. >Maybe alternate settings books would also be good, like historical ones. "IN Historical" has been near the top of the wish list for quite a while. >Or a full cyberpunk setting (i've only skimmed the stuff so far, but it >looks interesting), or an IN high fantasy. Crossover settings have some inherent dangers, since they're more likely to emphasize the "super" in "supernatural". ("What're the differences between an angel with a LAW, a demon with a LAW, and a human with a LAW?") >Personally I think that a Big Book of the Symphony, with flavor text in the >form of excerpts from Jean's Symphony Operation Manual and Vapula's >Experimental Log Book would be neat. Things like what is >essence/forces/resonance and other metaphyics could fill it. Incidently >I've started writing something like this for my own campeigns. This could be useful, though I think it would be hard to get it right enough that a lot of people would like it. It's the kind of thing that's easier to do for your own campaign. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 11:11:40 -0600 From: "ben" Subject: IN> Imagination wanted. I don't suppose I could encourage one of you more creative folks to write me a Demon of Some Assembly Required? I've managed to slightly injure myself on a shelf last night, but this fits nicely into a campaign killer I've thought up involving Uriel's return, a lucid Gabriel, an abortive apocalypse and the demon (possibly a Kobalite) suddenly pulling off the right trick to become the Demon of Flaws. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:12:32 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> Core Book reprint question At 23:08 -0400 5/3/00, Michael Neal wrote: >No. Absolutely not. If you release a softcover reprint, I'll probably pick >it up, because I desperately want a better organized copy of the rules. This is a reprint, not a second edition. No re-org, as far as I know. The only improvements I'm aware of will be the inclusion of errata, including a few changes introduced in the Superiors books and GURPS IN. But for the most part, I don't think you'd notice much difference. So don't pick it up thinking it will be a vast improvement over the first printing's organization; I'm pretty sure you'll be disappointed. As far as I know, the IN 2nd ed. is not on the table at this time. It will probably have to wait until the reprint run is mostly gone, at the very least. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:20:58 -0400 From: neelk@cswcasa.com Subject: IN> Re: Fixing humans Sean McCarthy wrote: > > The names of the skills elude me, but essentially you might have > child brawling, which is really great for beating up other children > in gang fights. You may even have the highest possible skill and be > a terror to your enemies. But that skill is counted at (IIRC) half > value if you face an adult who has the Real(tm) skill in that area. > > Perhaps, if the goal is to allow humans to have a chance in the > system while still showing Celestials to be So Much More, we could > devise some multiplier to skills or stats or both (Say +1/3 or +1/2 > total...or maybe just double value for skills) and allow humans to > use that when celestials aren't involved. This gives humans a > chance of successful die rolls while still keeping the scale.. What I plan to do in my future IN games is to upgrade humans a lot, and upgrade celestials a little. The average human will go from 5 to 7 forces. Soldiers will have 8 Forces and tough soldiers will have 9. Getting the 8th Force won't be considered a Big Deal, either. Celestials will remain at 9 forces, but in addition to the 36 resource points they start with, they get an extra 24. The extra 24 can only be spent on supernatural abilities -- Songs. attunements, extra vessels, artifacts, and so on. This way, a starting PC won't overwhelm mundane humans at ordinary activities, but will have a wide selection of cool supernatural powers at their command to distinguish them from humans. - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswcasa.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1611 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.