From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sat May 6 19:11:35 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA15893 for ; Sat, 6 May 2000 19:11:35 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id TAA25837 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sat, 6 May 2000 19:09:10 -0500 Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 19:09:10 -0500 Message-Id: <200005070009.TAA25837@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1613 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Saturday, May 6 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1613 In this digest: IN> GMG break Re: IN> Re: Fixing humans Re: IN> Jophiel, Archangel of Temperance Re: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. Re: IN> Re: Fixing humans Re: IN> Player mistakes IN> Angel comics Re: IN> Firstborn (was Angel of Pain) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 17:51:11 EDT From: Daedalus3D@aol.com Subject: IN> GMG break Hey guys, I got so sick of hearing Eric, Emily and David say "Y'know Daedalus, the suggestion you just made is already in the GMG," that I went out and bought it. Hey, they were right. So until I come up with something original to say (and have some time to reflect on the GMG), I'll sit humbly in the corner :) By the way, if any of you don't have the Game Master's Guide, buy it now. Right this minute if humanly possible. No rules, no flavor text, 100% ideas for gaming. Now that's how I like my supplements. Later Daedalus ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 19:22:01 -0500 (EST) From: Neel Krishnaswami Subject: Re: IN> Re: Fixing humans Matt Trent wrote: > neelk@cswcasa.com wrote: > > > This way, a starting PC won't overwhelm mundane humans at ordinary > > activities, but will have a wide selection of cool supernatural > > powers at their command to distinguish them from humans. > > But they're Angels for crying out loud! Geezz I don't know about > you guys but I'm aware that face to face with a being of divine (or > for that matter infernal) nature I have no chance at all to beat > them up and I don't think the average human should. Seriously, this is the result of my experience with my last campaign. The players were not happy with the way the system worked: they had too few opportunities to use miraculous powers, but it didn't matter because no human was even vaguely tough enough/strong-willed/observant enough to threaten a celestial. Basically, they wanted celestials to be able to outdo humans, but they wanted them to do it with miracles rather than carrying on like Batman. Beefing up humans' Forces, but giving celestials a lot of extra points on magical abilities seems like a reasonable way of achieving that goal. Another possibility is to make celestials basically human-level, but give them all Words and use the Estate mechanics from _Nobilis_ for all their miraculous abilities. That would be more work, but I think it could work even better. - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@alum.mit.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 00:01:30 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Jophiel, Archangel of Temperance I like her. >At her hearings before the Seraphim Council for her Word, some asked if >an Elohite wouldn't be more suitableto the Word of Temperance. She >answered that every Elohite *represents* Temperance in some way or >other; the Word doesn't need more representation; it needs someone to >*defend* it. Neat. >Champions of her Word on Earth have included the philosopher Epicurus; >the essayist Joseph Addison, who did much to introduce modesty as an >ingredient of good manners; Pres. James Madison, who designed the >balance of powers in the U.S. consitution; Jane Austen, in whose novels >kindness and good sense are the conquering virtues; Bill Wilson, founder >of Alcoholics Anonymous; and columnists Abigail van Buren ("Dear Abby") >and Judith Martin ("Miss Manners"). All very good. I'm trying to think who else... what actors have tended to embody temperance? Or politicians? (Hmm, actually neither of those groups tend to be too temperate.) >The Higher Common Sense: >Roll against your Will. Similar to the Divine Logic attunement used by >servitors of Destiny, it lets the servitor talk someone out of an >intemperate course of action; they will remain convinced for a number of >hours equal to the Check Digit, after which free will kicks back in, but >one can hope they decide to stay convinced. I *like* this one. >Rehab: >Roll against your Will and touch a willing subject. Relieves the >subject of their most pressing addictive, compulsive, or obsessive >behavior for a number of days equal to the Check Digit. Willing subjects only, though... okay. >SUMMONING MODIFIERS: > >+1: A copy of the "Big Book" of Alcoholics Anonmyous >+1: A book by Jane Austen >+1: A faux-alcoholic beverage, like near-beer or a Bloodless Mary >+1: A bottle of Prozac or similar product >+2: A recovering addict clean for at least a year No modifiers higher than 2... nice touch. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 17:59:03 -0700 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: Re: IN> House combat system - comments wanted. Shane and family wrote: > Suggestions, comments and criticisms (like pointing out some humongous > flaw I've probably missed) are extremely welcome. Haven't had a chance to do any real numbercrunching, but here are a few comments: - - I take it you're allowing humans to have Vessels, as per the original rules and not the CPG amendments? Are you also allowing them to buy their Vessels higher than their Corporeal Forces? (The example with the Special Forces certainly implies this.) I'd advise against that; it unbalances thing and creates humans that are really tough. If mortals must have levels, allow them to buy Toughness; each point of Toughness gives another Serious Wound or somesuch. - - In this system, Strength has no effect on your wounds, only Corporeal Forces. Call me old-fashioned, but I do think someone with Str/7, Agl/1 should be a tad tougher than someone with Str/1, Agl/7, even if they both have 2 Corporeal Forces. It's also unbalancing; at the moment, Str and Agl are about equally useful, but under this syetm Agl is _much_ better to put points into, as it bumps up Dodge without dropping hits. - - I can understand point-blank shots doing more damage, but why are they at - -2 to hit? So far, so interesting. You've started along an intriguing track here, and I'd be curious to see how you finish it up. Please post to the list when you've completed these rules; I for one would like to see the results. - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia I so badly want to kill everyone in this room. Even the children. _Especially_ the children. - Spider Jerusalem, TRANSMETROPOLITAN #17 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 11:46:31 -0400 From: "Galen G. Silversmith" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Fixing humans > Return-Path: neelk@alum.mit.edu > Seriously, this is the result of my experience with my last campaign. > The players were not happy with the way the system worked: they had > too few opportunities to use miraculous powers, but it didn't matter > because no human was even vaguely tough enough/strong-willed/observant > enough to threaten a celestial. Miracles are Miracles. They *should* be rarefied and usually unnecessary. On the other hand, I'm running a mortal's game, and have this problem from the other side. Even using the human advantages from the CPG, the players still have problems. (the part is currently 2 5-force humans, 1 6-force mundane and one 6-force sorcerer.) Getting them to get successful perception rolls, or skill use under duress is hard, and I have to fudge with the numbers constantly for the story to flow at all. The characters only have so many points in skills (20-24, plus some from discord/disads), and it makes it difficult for the story, esp since they generally have robust characters and lots of points went into background skills, rather than picking the most practical. > Basically, they wanted celestials to be able to outdo humans, but they > wanted them to do it with miracles rather than carrying on like > Batman. Beefing up humans' Forces, but giving celestials a lot of > extra points on magical abilities seems like a reasonable way of > achieving that goal. What I'm thinking of changing for my campaign is some mishmash of: giving mortals a level or two of toughness automatically (and moving the max up accordingly), changing the skill point:forces ration from 4:1 to 5:1 or 6:1 in addition to the 'bonus' basic skill set. Moving base mortal to 6 forces, and mortal++ to 7. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 May 2000 02:45:24 +1000 From: Brent McCartney Subject: Re: IN> Player mistakes Don't make it a high power campaign, that's what hack'n'slash 'TM' is all about. Make them start off as 9 force angels or 7 force demons and make the earn it. That's one way to convert them. Another way is to make it more cinematic instead of involving a whole bunch of dice rolling. Tell the story and get them involved in the story and gloss over the dice rolling. that also works. Don't exclude dice rolling cause it is important, just don't make it as important as munchkins think it is. Brent At 10:23 AM 4/30/00 +0800, you wrote: >Dear Lista Lista >On Subject of creating a high power campaign - I just started a new one , >but my >players have just shifted from the Hack and Slash RPG's [whose names I >withold :D]. >What should a player emphasise in their characters - and how would a GM >such as >yourselfs go about encouraging that? > >High Calibre is a far road for me - I need a map :D >John Kuan > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 12:39:31 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Angel comics I am a Sinfest fan. The current run is amusing. Start at: http://sinfest.net/d/20000501.html - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 00:36:07 +0100 From: "Christopher Lee" Subject: Re: IN> Firstborn (was Angel of Pain) >you're not the christopher lee who wrote that radio series on british >history are you? > Nope sorry, I am not the same person, nor am I the actor. I have spent my whole life being asked what I am doing out in the daylight, do I only bite virgins, etc, etc, ad infinitum. I am a historian, however, just not famous enough to write my own series! Christopher Lee ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1613 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.