From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Jul 21 14:18:13 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA31002 for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:18:12 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id OAA10636 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:16:47 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:16:47 -0500 Message-Id: <200007211916.OAA10636@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1727 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, July 21 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1727 In this digest: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Re: [slightly off-topic] Latin question Re: RPGA (Was Re: IN> Dead Superiors ) Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) IN> Laurence and Blandine Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) IN> Here Comes The Bride, and She Is Pi**ed (was: Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1726) Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Laurence and Blandine Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Re: IN> Dead Superiors Re: IN> Questions about Servitors of Stone ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:03:50 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) At 10:35 AM -0400 7/21/00, Emily Dresner wrote: > > Moreover, while I know that "Bright/Dark Dream" is one of your pet >> peeves, I've heard from an awful lot more people who were initially >> sucked into IN by the tone of Derek Pearcy's fiction and his vignettes. >> It promised a witty, occasionally profound game, a lot like Good Omens. > >One comment to support this: > >I have knowledge, with extremely good evidence, that the general >impression outside of this list and, in fact, outside of Steve Jackson >Games of In Nomine is that it is a black satire game. There is no >connection with "brightness knobs" or "contrast" or "everyone can play it >their way". The original core book's tone was clear. That actually doesn't support David's thesis. It works the other way. If general impressions are that this is a satiric game, but sales have been sluggish (including of the core book, if I gather correctly), then the tone isn't bringing people particularly quickly, or else has already brought most of the people it might. Either way, I'm not debating that the tone of the book isn't satiric. Nor am I debating that the tone was good. In fact, let's make this easy on everyone and assume I'm not debating anything, here. The Main Book is a Holy Thing, descended from on high, and we are not worthy to touch its paperboard cover lest we bring shame onto ourselves. Or it's not. Depending on who's reading this. I'm sick of the argument. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:04:36 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors Jennifer Campbell wrote: > And how could we forget the epic looooove stories? Which could be called "Passion Plays," to fit in with the Mystery Plays and the Morality Plays. Besides love, they could include things like "Coping When Gabriel Wigs Out Bad," "Through the Collective Unconscious with Gun and Camera (or Archetypes I Have Known)" for an Ethereal campaign, and "What to Do When the Tsayadim Come." Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:12:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) > That actually doesn't support David's thesis. It works the other way. > If general impressions are that this is a satiric game, but sales > have been sluggish (including of the core book, if I gather > correctly), then the tone isn't bringing people particularly quickly, > or else has already brought most of the people it might. I'm not arguing. I'm stating a pretty obvious fact. I'm too sick with the flu to argue right now. - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:10:49 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors - --On Friday, July 21, 2000 7:53 AM -0700 Jennifer Campbell wrote: > And how could we forget the epic looooove stories? > Stories of love lasting centuries, love that survives > the gulf between Heaven and Hell. . . > > I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the way. > I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de > Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. > > Or something. > > Tee hee. Stop me now. I'm writing. > Novalis would want in on it. Ditto Yves, for no reason anyone can explain. Marc. Just Marc. Elohite Angel of Salvation ("Wouldn't it just bring everything to a screaming halt if Uriel showed up to officiate...?") ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:10:02 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors Jennifer Campbell wrote: > I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the way. > I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de > Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. Well, there's always Cyrano de Bergerac, assuming he went to Heaven... Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:16:32 -0400 From: "Galen G. Silversmith" Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors > Return-Path: earlw@mc.com > Delivery-Date: Fri Jul 21 11:14:33 2000 > Received: from dmz.intouchsys.com (dmz.intouchsys.com [63.64.186.194]) > by stay.intouchsys.com (/) with ESMTP id e6LFEWK04096 > for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:14:32 -0400 (EDT) > Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) > by dmz.intouchsys.com (/) with ESMTP id e6LFEVf27088 > for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:14:31 -0400 (EDT) > Received: (from majordom@localhost) > by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id KAA26356 > for in_nomine-l-outgoing; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:11:40 -0500 > Received: from mc.com ([192.233.16.119]) > by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA26351 > for ; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:11:37 -0500 > Received: from 172.16.32.7 by mc.com (8.8.8+Sun/SMI-SVR4) > id LAA21605; Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:11:10 -0400 (EDT) > Message-ID: <397875DB.7520@mc.com> > Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:10:02 -0500 > From: Earl Wajenberg > X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Macintosh; I; 68K) > MIME-Version: 1.0 > To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors > References: <20000721145324.15535.qmail@web117.yahoomail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Sender: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > Precedence: bulk > Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com > Content-Length: 261 > > Jennifer Campbell wrote: > > I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the way. > > I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de > > Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. > Well, there's always Cyrano de Bergerac, assuming he went > to Heaven... Unless Roxanne was really Blandine, I don;t see this working nearly so well as it did in the corporeal. Cyrano was a master, but his insperation is not as focused on this as it could. Unlessyou want to add a twist or two. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:06:43 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors At 7:53 AM -0700 7/21/00, Jennifer Campbell wrote: >And how could we forget the epic looooove stories? >Stories of love lasting centuries, love that survives >the gulf between Heaven and Hell. . . > >I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the way. >I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de >Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. > >Or something. Kobal. Laurence has needed Kobal in his life for centuries now. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:21:35 EDT From: MarkDEddy@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Re: [slightly off-topic] Latin question In a message dated 7/21/00 7:57:15 AM, thowell@classics.umass.edu writes: >The 'morituri' part is what you want, '(the people who) are about to die'. >This does have a slightly different shade of meaning than 'those destined >to die' but it's close enough for government work. > >Anyway, I teach high school Latin (and used to teach it in college), >so I (hopefully :) ) know what I'm talking about. > >Hope this helps! > >- TJ I only know Latin from liturgical sources, but if 'morituri' is 'the people who are about to die', shouldn't 'morituribus' be 'we who are about to die'? (Peccatori versus peccatoribus is the parallell I'm thinking of.) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 08:22:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: RPGA (Was Re: IN> Dead Superiors ) There were no games of IN at Dragoncon. I saw a guy thumbing through the Liber Castellorum and was gonna holler at him since I had my main book, APG, and GMG in my backpack and just enough time to think up a good story and recruit players, but I was playing Changeling at the time and he didn't notice. *le sigh* Jenni - --- Thomas J Howell wrote: > Actually, I was wondering what kind of con presence > IN has? I know > I've run games in the past at the local convention > here in Amherst, MA > and made some converts. Most folks seem much more > interested in > buying a game they've already played once - perhaps > IN could use > a significant con presence if it doesn't already > have one? > > - TJ > > I'll be at GenCon this year, and I noticed only 2 IN > games in the > pre-reg book. One of them was spelled incorrectly > (In Homine or some > such silliness) and both were less than two hours > long. That just can't > be good... > ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 08:24:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors Hee hee. 'Cause romance (according to the Angel of Matchmaking, to be forwarded right after the Demon of Cookies) begins somewhere between Destiny and Nature. Oooh. *more frantic scribbling* Jenni - --- Marc Bowden wrote: > Novalis would want in on it. Ditto Yves, for no > reason anyone can > explain. ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 08:26:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors I have a feeling this is going to turn out like a skewed, screwed up episode of Saved By The Bell. . . *HIDE* Jenni - --- Richard Gant wrote: > > On Fri, 21 Jul 2000, Jennifer Campbell wrote: > > > I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the > way. > > I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de > > Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. > > > > Or something. > > I just had this image of Michael trying to help > Laurence out with this. > ("It's just another battlefield. How different can > it be?") His advice > would be... quirky. ("Impress her with your courage > and bravery. Do > great deeds in her name. Slay a dragon for her - > no, wait. That probably > *wouldn't* go over well." "Human women like gifts. > Give her flowers. > Give her Novalis, if you think it would help.") > > Richard Gant > Stopping before he goes *too* far > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Richard Gant's Gaming Ghetto: > http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dunes/4656/ > The Returners Final Fantasy Role-Playing Game Site: > http://returners.simplenet.com/ > or > http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Matrix/5758/ > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:21:22 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Whistling in the Dark wrote: > That actually doesn't support David's thesis. It works the other way. > If general impressions are that this is a satiric game, but sales > have been sluggish (including of the core book, if I gather > correctly), then the tone isn't bringing people particularly quickly, > or else has already brought most of the people it might. My thesis is that the original rulebook intrigued a lot of people -- In Nomine initially looked like it had a chance at being the Next Big Thing in RPGs. Subsequent supplements dropped the ball and IN lost its momentum. I don't think the lack of the same biting satire is all that the supplements lacked, but it's part of what lost people -- they read a main rulebook that suggested "Good Omens," and then subsequent supplements offered nothing to support such a premise. Now I happen to LIKE IN as a straight game of morality plays and supernatural conflicts, and I disagree with Emily that offering multiple presentations (e.g. "brightness" and "contrast") is a bad thing. But I just don't think IN will work trying to compete with the World of Darkness on its own turf. > Either way, I'm not debating that the tone of the book isn't satiric. > Nor am I debating that the tone was good. In fact, let's make this > easy on everyone and assume I'm not debating anything, here. The Main > Book is a Holy Thing, descended from on high, and we are not worthy > to touch its paperboard cover lest we bring shame onto ourselves. Not my argument at all. I'm certainly not canonizing Pearcy; along with his wonderfully satiric text, he also wrote a horribly organized mish-mash of rules, and he has ego problems as well. And I think everyone knows what I think of his Khalid writeup. The IN main book could really use some improvements. But draining the dark humor quality from it isn't one of those improvements. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 08:34:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors Oh. My. Lord. THAT'S PERFECT!! IAIEEEE!!!! *giggleJenni* - --- Whistling in the Dark wrote: > At 7:53 AM -0700 7/21/00, Jennifer Campbell wrote: > >And how could we forget the epic looooove stories? > >Stories of love lasting centuries, love that > survives > >the gulf between Heaven and Hell. . . > > > >I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the > way. > >I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de > >Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. > > > >Or something. > > Kobal. Laurence has needed Kobal in his life for > centuries now. > -- > Eric Alfred Burns - > > Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:36:36 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors - --On Friday, July 21, 2000 8:26 AM -0700 Jennifer Campbell wrote: > I have a feeling this is going to turn out like a > skewed, screwed up episode of Saved By The Bell. . . > To be distinguished from any other episode...how? Marc. Just Marc. Elohite Angel of Salvation (With Dustin Diamond as the Metatron. *pause* NOOOOOOOOO!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:51:25 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors At 11:36 AM -0400 7/21/00, Marc Bowden wrote: >--On Friday, July 21, 2000 8:26 AM -0700 Jennifer Campbell > wrote: > >>I have a feeling this is going to turn out like a >>skewed, screwed up episode of Saved By The Bell. . . >> > > To be distinguished from any other episode...how? Skreetch's head mounted on a pike in the depths of Sheol. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 09:06:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors More sex and violence? - --- Marc Bowden wrote: > To be distinguished from any other episode...how? ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:09:42 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors - --On Friday, July 21, 2000 11:51 AM -0400 Whistling in the Dark wrote: > At 11:36 AM -0400 7/21/00, Marc Bowden wrote: >> --On Friday, July 21, 2000 8:26 AM -0700 Jennifer Campbell >> wrote: >> >>> I have a feeling this is going to turn out like a >>> skewed, screwed up episode of Saved By The Bell. . . >>> >> >> To be distinguished from any other episode...how? > > Skreetch's head mounted on a pike in the depths of Sheol. > Ooooh. So it's a "very special episode". Marc. Just Marc. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:16:07 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors From: "Jennifer Campbell" > I have a feeling this is going to turn out like a > skewed, screwed up episode of Saved By The Bell. . . Oh god, now I have a mental image of Dustin Diamond playing Furfur that even wire brushes can't clean out of my brain... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 09:21:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors *explosive burst of Mountain Dew out of nostrils* WetNoseJenni - --- Prodigal wrote: > Oh god, now I have a mental image of Dustin Diamond > playing Furfur that even > wire brushes can't clean out of my brain... > ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:29:27 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) >the vignettes and background material in GURPS In Nomine >have about as much flavor as an unsalted rice cake. I did not find this to be the case. Given the rather stringent restrictions they were operating under -- trying to cram a _lot_ of material into a standard 128 page GURPS book, while making the appropriate system conversions as well -- I thought the folks who drafted GURPS IN did a crackerjack job. As to vignettes... there simply wasn't room for anything lengthy, let alone a piece like "A Bright/Dark Dream". But the little pieces at the beginning of each Choir/Band description were excellent, much better than the ones in the IN main book. I thought these added a great deal of fun and flavor. And at _least_ the *GIN_* writers did not _try_ to _spice up_ large _blocks_ of otherwise _bland_ text by the _excessive use_ of _italics_ for _emphasis_. I counted _seventeen_ of those on a _single page_ in the GMG. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:10:50 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Douglas Muir wrote: > I did not find this to be the case. > As to vignettes... there simply wasn't room for anything lengthy, let alone > a piece like "A Bright/Dark Dream". But the little pieces at the beginning > of each Choir/Band description were excellent, much better than the ones in > the IN main book. I thought these added a great deal of fun and flavor. You're entitled to your opinion. The Choir/Band vignettes in GIN struck me as endless repetitions of "Look, this is how the Seraph resonance works! Isn't that cool?" "Look, this is how the Impudite resonance works! Isn't that cool?" Whereas those in the original book were alternately amusing, intriguing, and downright chilling. Incidentally, the rest of GIN was fine. It's well-organized, the GURPS rules seem well done and balanced (as balanced as they can be, anyway), and it's a very competent product, in the same way that GM makes very competent cars. I just found it utterly lacking in flavor. I'm a GURPS fan myself, and GURPS books are usually of high quality, focusing on substance rather than style. GIN is no different. Using the rpg.net review scale, I'd give it a 4 for substance, 2 for style. Unfortunately, I think style is what makes (or breaks) In Nomine. Not that substance isn't important, but substance without style is no better than style without substance. > And at _least_ the *GIN_* writers did not _try_ to _spice up_ large > _blocks_ of otherwise _bland_ text by the _excessive use_ of _italics_ for > _emphasis_. I counted _seventeen_ of those on a _single page_ in the GMG. Don't be so pathetic. Since you failed in your attempts to goad me over the CPG, do you think it will work with the GMG? Douglas, I don't care what you think, since it's clear this is some kind of personal grudge for you. Here, I'll help you out: I also wrote large sections of the APG, IPG (identified in the TOCs), the vignettes at the beginning of The Marches and Heaven and Hell, a section in the Liber Servitorum (along with Cupid and Hani Basyah), and a section in the Liber Castellorum, Laurence in S1, Khalid in S3, and Baal in Final Trumpet. And I edited the Liber Reliquarum and Liber Canticorum. I'm sure someone could even save time for you by writing a macro which will randomly select something I wrote and insert it into one of your "That sucked" rants. (Don't forget to add S4, which I also edited. It's not out yet, but I don't think that's relevant to your opinion. ;)) - -David ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 13:20:27 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Laurence and Blandine Hehehe I personally have always loved the idea of Sword and Courtly love and surprisingly I think a netbook could be made on "Dreams of Chivalry, Dreams of Love" with discussing their gradual progression in romance and the eventual emergence of duel servitors....plus Beleth's nasty opposition. (I would kill personally to read a fanfiction which described Michael and Laurence dueling over the Lady of Dreams honor) Indeed I'm currently running an adventure about this as part of my "Last Temptation of Yves" campaign. Basically though the end of the plot is a bit sketchy but the majority of it goes like this..... "A Midsummer Night's Dream...take II" (advice would be appreciated) Laurence is distracted (not even bothering to read the copy of Nicolo Machivelli's "the Prince" that Michael sent him) and frankly it's with love with Blandine that even his servitors have realized over their lovelorn young prince. I'm not sure how much he's already tried courting her (badly written poetry comparing her to a sword anonymously has a least gotton Blandine the idea that it's one of his word)...I'm not sure even in this light hearted adventure he might try to serenade her out side her tower (and stink at it). Embarrased for their friend my players hopefully without too much proding will agree to help the poor Commander of God's armies try to win her affection. I think Blandine will be amused and flattered (alittle) but more annoyed than anything else at first because she loves Beleth truly and kinduv looks down at Laurence as a young man. Heart to hearts and wackiness hopefully will ensue (the idea of Michael trying to give Laurence a pep talk I will definately ensure). However at some point I'm fairly sure I think I should insert a plot (one's a Malakim of War) and I'm not sure about my current idea: Which is that Kobal catches wind of this and murders Blandine's sensechal before impersonating him...(possibly using a magic mask) intending some mischief which may include a Sleeping Beuty scenario as a favor to Beleth. Anyone else have any ideas for courtship adventures? - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:39:51 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) From: "David Edelstein" > > You're entitled to your opinion. The Choir/Band vignettes in GIN struck > me as endless repetitions of "Look, this is how the Seraph resonance > works! Isn't that cool?" "Look, this is how the Impudite resonance > works! Isn't that cool?" Whereas those in the original book were > alternately amusing, intriguing, and downright chilling. I liked the way they showed both the mechanics of the resonances and the mindset of the beings who have them. And the Lilim vignette struck *me* as pretty chilling... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:46:10 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) Prodigal wrote: > And the Lilim vignette struck *me* as pretty chilling... Rape, especially alluded to in such a ham-handed manner, usually comes off as sensationalistic rather than chilling. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:04:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: IN> Here Comes The Bride, and She Is Pi**ed (was: Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1726) Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 01:49:16 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1725 At 10:16 PM -0700 7/20/00, Maurice Lane wrote: >>Just fair warning, though: if you do, there will be >>a writeup of the AA of Fear* (and her crashing of the >>wedding, a la the Graduate), posted onto my web page >>within nanoseconds of my perusal... >YES! >(Nothing says "I object to this union" like forty->five Calabim tearing the front half of the church >open.)- -- Heh. Why let the happy couple off easy? Picture the scene. Blandine and Laurence, all radiant and happy, standing at the altar. True, Yves for some reason declined to conduct the service, so they got Israfel instead. Khalid's best man, Novalis is matron of honor, all of the big shots of the Host are there. Lots and lots of Malakim. Heck, even the Tsadayim might have popped in. Needless to say, this shindig's at the Halls of Worship: Catholic ceremony, naturally, so everybody wearing a sword has got theirs unbuckled and on the seat next to them*. Beleth shows up, of course, at the most inopportune time. Possibly after the "if any one here" bit, but before the vows (although inserting her after Laurence's, but before Blandine's, would make MUCHO hassles latter. Dramatic silhouette, screaming of "BLANDINE!!!", diving through the stained glass window (without breaking it), the whole nine yards. Of course, every Malakim reaches for his or her sword, curses, paws through the stuff in the pews, grabs any sword handy and flies on an intercept course. With all of Larry's swordies right behind them. The AA's are all jockeying for position, trying to line up a shot that won't incinerate a blackwing in the process, but the furball is already too intense. There's a problem, though. A Malakim of Trade screams and winds up for a suicide stroke, but halfway through his face blanches and he drives his sword into the floor. That Seraph of the Sword over there grunts as if she had been punched in the stomach and then deliberately barrels into the two Cherubim of Fire lining up some cleansing flame. Every single Dominican capable of Heavenly Judgement is looking shocked and drained. There's quite a scrum going on the sidelines, as Malakite and Mercurian resonance pings are followed by their pingers' inexplicable attempts to restrain their fellows. Even the AA's are starting to mill about, as their most favored Malakite Servitors frantically rush to them to whisper urgent words. Beleth pushes through the mob of putative attackers as if they were made of mist. She collapses at Blandine's feet, weeping. Michael has already started running to the altar, with Dominic right behind them. Both look pale. Now, Laurence is naturally incandescent with rage, but on the other hand, he's actually never gotten to slay a Demon Princess before. Going into a killing stance as his sword begins to smoke with all of the Word-attention put into it, his blade comes down... ... and, in the back of his mind, the resonance light comes on. ::: Scan complete. ::: ::: Most honorable act committed during last week: ::: ::: Redeeming.** ::: The sword stops a half inch from Beleth's exposed neck. Laurence is frozen with pure temptation, but he happens to be a practicing Roman Catholic, and the Church happens to have definite _issues_ about killing your fiancee's incovenient former lovers. Besides, as Michael (about the only one of the big brass who suspected that this might happen) will undoubtedly tell him, just as soon as he finishes running over there, there's now political considerations at work here. Laurence actually _throws_ _away_ the sword*** and says a nasty word. Needless to say, it echoes through the silent Halls like a gunshot. Meanwhile, Blandine's sitting on the floor and crooning meaningless sounds as she strokes Beleth's hair. However, in about thirty seconds, Blandine's going to remember where she is, what she had planned for her day today, and that she isn't exactly able to turn off what she feels for the angel standing above her. At that point, she'll look up, and lock gazes with Laurence. Close curtain. :) Morgan (FAW) Kyriotate of Destiny Petitioner for the Word of See, I TOLD You That Soap Operas Could Be A Significant Word *Us Catholics stand up and sit down a lot during services. I can tell you (from attending Mass at the Pennsic War in full medieval garb) that wearing a sword at such a time can be awkward. Yes, I have actually realtity tested IN, in a sense. :) **Or maybe a specific something else, but it all depends on whether this vignette is a standalone or part of a shared world. :) ***Which is now a killer (pardon the pun) artifact, but I digress. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 13:20:33 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) From: "David Edelstein" > Prodigal wrote: > > And the Lilim vignette struck *me* as pretty chilling... > > Rape, especially alluded to in such a ham-handed manner, usually > comes off as sensationalistic rather than chilling. It wasn't the rape itself, David, but rather the Lilim's attitude toward it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:32:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Laurence and Blandine >I'm > not sure even in this > light hearted adventure he might try to serenade her > out side her tower (and > stink at it). Guantanamera -is- a ballad written in the throes of a Cuban revolution. . . ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:47:25 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) At 12:39 PM -0500 7/21/00, Prodigal wrote: >And the Lilim vignette struck *me* as pretty chilling... My personal favorite was the Shedite one... (As for why there _are_ new vignettes, it's because SJ wanted 'em. Now that they're done, I no longer have the "oh gods more work" expression that I had at the start of writing them... The old format of the descriptions for the Choirs/Bands didn't work well with the new mechanics, so being able to lead off of a slightly different "spin" on each turned out to be useful.) The Superiors and Heaven/Hell descriptions, though, I couldn't see any way to rewrite that wasn't just a "say the same thing in your own words" kind of deal. I think there's one paragraph of that (see if you can find it!) in the Superiors, and the rest is clarification. >It wasn't the rape itself [...] but rather the Lilim's attitude toward it. Oh, good, someone _did_ get it, then... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:34:50 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) >Don't be so pathetic. Gracious, that seemed to have touched a nerve. >Since you failed in your attempts to goad me over >the CPG, do you think it will work with the GMG? Um... no. I said I didn't care for the CPG, partly because much of it was a blow-up of stuff that I already had, partly for other reasons. If you choose to interpret this as a personal attack... shrug. >Douglas, I don't care >what you think, since it's clear this is some kind of personal grudge >for you. I have very little interest in you, David, and no "personal grudge". You impact my life in two very limited ways: as David the author of IN supplements, and as David the list-contributor. David the author is a competent enough fellow; I like some of his stuff quite a bit, consider some of it workmanlike if uninspired, and am left cool by some of the rest. David the author does have certain quirks, of which the italics-for-emphasis thing is (to me) the most obvious... possibly because I used to have the same problem, until a good editor broke me of the habit. David the list-contributor seems to be something of a jerk. That's a pity, but... shrug. The Net is full of jerks. It seems to be a law of nature that there's at least one on every list and Usenet NG. But your mildly obnoxious behavior on this list doesn't affect my judgment of your skills as an IN writer; the manners, or lack thereof, of a creator have nothing to do with the quality of the creation. [snip David's bibliography] >something I wrote and insert it into one of your "That sucked" rants. Get with the program, David. I've reviewed several of these favorably, and one of them in glowing terms. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 13:39:44 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Adventures in In Nomine (was Re: Dead Superiors) From: "Elizabeth McCoy" > At 12:39 PM -0500 7/21/00, Prodigal wrote: > > >And the Lilim vignette struck *me* as pretty chilling... > > My personal favorite was > the Shedite one... I liked that one a lot, as well, but the Malakim one was my favorite (and no, I wasn't being biased AT ALL there. *g*) > >It wasn't the rape itself [...] but rather the Lilim's attitude toward it. > > Oh, good, someone _did_ get it, then... The end of that one still makes my flesh crawl. Good work. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:48:26 -0400 From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" Subject: Re: IN> Dead Superiors Richard Gant wrote: > On Fri, 21 Jul 2000, Jennifer Campbell wrote: > > > I'm all for the Blandine/Laurence romance, by the way. > > I just got an idea. There needs to be a Cyrano de > > Bergerac to get these two shy kids together. > > I just had this image of Michael trying to help Laurence out with > this. ("It's just another battlefield. How different can it be?") > His advice would be... quirky. ("Impress her with your courage and > bravery. Do great deeds in her name. Slay a dragon for her - no, > wait. That probably *wouldn't* go over well." "Human women like > gifts. Give her flowers. Give her Novalis, if you think it would > help.") Actually, this is the sort of scenario that requires cross-Superior cooperation. The PCs are an elite team of servitors of Novalis and Michael, with the task of hooking up Blandine and Laurence. After all, a romance would do Laurence good in the 'other angels are people too' department, and Blandine needs to get over Beleth -- once your ex has started torturing billions of innocent people it's probably time write off that relationship. For maximum humor value, Novalis talked to Laurence and Michael talked to Blandine, and each managed to poison the well quite thoroughly and accidentally. Now the PCs have to undo the damage their bosses did first, before they can get on with it. Then come the clever plans: o "Okay, Aluriel, I am not going to deliver Laurence the invitation to a party at the Glade." o "Okay, Aluriel, you were right about the party, but I am not going to be the one who gets Laurence drunk." o "Okay, Aluriel, so I got drunk too as part of juicing up Laurence. But sleeping with him was an accident, honest!" o "No, Aluriel, I don't think trapping Laurence and Blandine in an elevator together will work -- they can teleport out. o "Aluriel, God no, I am not going to go to Jean and special-order a teleport-proof elevator!" o "Aluriel, Marc *couldn't stop laughing* when I asked for a bigger loan -- how am I going to get more money out him?" - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@alum.mit.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 15:22:00 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Questions about Servitors of Stone At 4:44 PM +0000 7/19/00, Janet Anderson wrote: >I may be designing a Servitor of Stone shortly (alliteration's artful aid!) >and I would like the following matters clarified by a reliable rules person: > >1. Does attacking the attuned of a Cherub of Stone count as attacking the >Cherub? I'd say so, generally. With just enough leavening of doubt to make the Cherub want to be pretty sure that he's between his attuned and the first punch. >2. If a Malakite of Stone is ordered to work with a particular demon, and >the demon does not attack him, then the Malakite is off the hook as far as >his Oaths and his Servitor obligations are concerned (it's not his choice, >and he doesn't attack). But what happens if the demon attacks someone else, >or performs a visibly evil action? Would he then take dissonance if he >didn't take action against the demon, since the demon had actually done >something evil, even if the action wasn't against the Malakite directly? If he's ordered to _work_ with the demon, probably not, unless he has some other oath that causes him to Protect The Innocent or somesuch, which doesn't have the loophole. However, he'll almost certainly _want_ to do so -- perhaps by restraining the demon, reversing the damage, or looming over the demon and murmuring something about "Honest, Boss, he just... slipped. And fell down this manhole. Several times." I.e., it's a slippery slope, and a well-played Malakite will feel _AWFUL_ about letting something like that happen. Awful, and ANGRY. They'll be plotting how to toast the demon at the earliest possible opportunity. They'll be stealthily grabbing a bit of the demon's vessel's hair or fingernail clippings or something with the demon's blood on it, for use with a Song of Affinity after the truce is over. They'll be explaining to the demon how much they're not going to like a gang of Stonies (or other Malakim, or whatever) doing the cha-cha-cha on the demon's crushed and still-breathing body, and yes, you Hellspawn scum, we _will_ find you... A poorly played Malakite will go, "Huh. Whatever. I'm safe." Whereupon the GM will whong him with dissonance. At least if the GM is me. O:> >(Come to think of it, do demonic, or other, actions against innocent >bystanders, noncombatants, attuneds, etc. count as attacks for the purpose >of Stone dissonance conditions?) If violent or otherwise perceivable as an "attack," very likely. The dissonance conditions read, "don't start fights" -- not necessarily, "don't start a fight unless you yourself are hit." Many Stonies probably try to hew to the more definitive course -- not striking back until they themselves have been bashed -- but in a general melee... If there are innocent bystanders, etc., around, a Stonie will probably tell any potential combatants, "Touch anyone here, and you're starting something, boyo..." - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1727 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.