From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Jul 28 10:11:49 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA13458 for ; Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:11:49 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id KAA07153 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:09:09 -0500 Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:09:09 -0500 Message-Id: <200007281509.KAA07153@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1739 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, July 28 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1739 In this digest: Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band IN> Minor Superiors IN> Updating the INC: July 27, 2000 RE: IN> Question... IN> Minor Superiors RE: IN> Question... Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract Re: IN> The Penitent Re: IN> Thirty seconds over the Vale... Re: IN> Thirty seconds over the Vale... Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract Re: IN> Minor Superiors IN> Legion seed Re: IN> Question... Re: IN> "Angel" of Schlock Horror Re: IN> Minor Superiors Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors Re: IN> Re: Dionysian Set-up Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors Re: IN> Minor Superiors Re: IN> Barney in In Nomine Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors Re: IN> Re: Dionysian Set-up IN> Harry Potter, Satanism, and In Nomine Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:01:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Whistling in the Dark wrote: > Litheroy I actively *like.* See, I don't see him as a Super-Seraph. > It's not Litheroy's truth that makes him interesting, in other words. > It's his almost staggering naivete. > Zadkiel, on the other hand, has to be the most boring writeup of a > Superior I've ever read. In my opinion, of course. It would take a > *lot* to make her interesting to me. I must say: AGREED and AGREED. I love Litheroy, though I try to use him sparingly in my games, and I've grudgingly decided to have Zadkiel exist IMC, but can't think of a single use for her... if I want angels assigned to protect someone important, I just use Cherubim from any of the militant (or sometimes other) Superiors. "Protection" doesn't seem like even a major word, much less Superior status. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian, Q4B4L! Meow! If I had a shiny gun, / I could have a world of fun Speeding bullets through the brains / Of the folk who give me pains; Or had I some poison gas, / I could make the moments pass Bumping off a number of / People whom I do not love. But I have no lethal weapon; / Thus does Fate our pleasure step on! So they still are quick and well / Who should be, by rights, in hell. -- Dorothy Parker, "Frustration" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:08:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, David Rodemaker wrote: > > If you're referring to "Weasley" Crusher from Star Trek, he's most likely > > be one of Jean's, and Jean's stereotype at that. (He's a tech geek who's > > useless outside the lab without detailed directions from a superior > > officer.) > > BEEEEEEP!! > > You lose. Anybody else get the reference? > > My vote is for Malakite, if only for the Trauma issue... Malakite, yes... honorable, but pragmatic, and an incredibly fighter. Maybe it's a cop-out, but I'd say Creation. He's versatile as all hell, and I don't just mean in fighting styles. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian, Q4B4L! Meow! Want to hold up a bank in Latin? "Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam." (I have a catapult. Give me all the money, or I will fling an enormous rock at your head." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 02:21:40 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Minor Superiors Charles Glasgow writes: >Actually, the Word of Hardcore is one of the most fun and subtle creations >I've seen in canon. You *think* it just applies to rock-and-roll and >headbanging and violent parties, but then you realize that "perverting >something to destructive excess" has a *lot* of play and overlap with other >concepts... Definately. Alchohalism, Drug Abuse, Soccer, Stock trading, Dieting, Eating, Fighting, and the like all ultimately owe their allegiance to Furfur. Truth be told Lucifer was making an ulterly brillant move making Fufur the Demon of Hardcore because it as a concerpt is quite possibly the single most defining concept of the modern era. Hardcore Game-play for instance, Hard Core Humor, Hard Core Lust-the potential for alliances are also extremely strong. >Assuming Armageddon doesn't come for 2000 years, it's entirely possible that >Furfure will end up as the Demon Prince of Destruction. >(Either that, or a pile of ash on the bottom of a lava lake in Sheol. >Infernal evolution in action, as usual.) Counterpoint there dude that I doubt Furfur needs a stronger word and in order to become Demon Prince of Destruction (exactly where the Demogorgon left off) he'd have to waste Saminga and Belial both at which point only Kronos would be stronger. Asmodeus and Baal aren't going to let that happen.... Even Gluttony. (Hardcore Eating and Hardcore Greed....no offense all of Gluttony's newfound power is at risk) - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 02:28:03 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Updating the INC: July 27, 2000 Good choices EDG and I must say I've been waiting for an update for sometime. Your choices look very good and I eagerly anticipate the weekly updates. > -- A characterization of a pre-Archangel Laurence, including his first and >only note of dissonance, by Charles Phipps. Wow thank you very much EDG. To think that something I did for my seraphim's character background has passed into legend. - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 02:50:17 -0400 From: Tim Groth Subject: RE: IN> Question... I can sort of understand the lying argument for why the Balseraph attunement is better, but from a game balance point of view a Master distinction shouldn't be worse. Also why should Kronos know more about the Symphony than Yves, I'm sure Yves can keep a vessel attached when adding the Kyriotate resonance. Timothy, Angel of Rambling Ofanite of Creation ArchRival of Mathus ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 02:55:47 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Minor Superiors >These are mostly responses born out of Canon/FotM, so understand that >you can change stuff to your heart's content. Of course, some of >it's also my opinion, and that's graven in STONE, man! I dunno I personally like Furfur as presented; I think he'd be an excellent superior to attract the more musically inclined demons (the Symphony Hardcore equals Hell) in a cosmic sense, the more modern totally out of tune with the "old fogies" demons (the demon of Stale Bong Water at last has a superior!), and those out and out insane demons who hate Belial. >Furfur's defined as a Hardcore rocker, which is itself an extremist >form of Punk, as opposed to a 80's Hair band metal rocker (for >example). A child of Sid Vicious rather than Ratt, or so it seems to >me. The sort of person who destroys the bar that the band is playing. >Not trashes it. Destroys it, leaving the faint smell of alcohol and >charred formica in its wake. That definately works with my perceptions of it, interestingly enough I rather see Fufur as Malcomlm McDowell in a Clockwork Orange. His entire way of life shaped by destructive psychopathia yet somehow still functioning in a coherent sense that wasn't breaking down. Though admittadly that may be more Impudite than Calabim. >In Canon, Belial is actively trying to destroy the Upstart Prince, >and Furfur makes no bones about wanting to tear Belial down and >displacing him in Hell. In Canon, so take that for what it's worth. I actually had heard something about that and chose to ignore it. Then again in retrospect it fits perfectly with who and what Belial is....he's the young snot who hates the idea that his word as the resident nutcase with a flamethrower-whose an anarchist taking no orders from Baal-threatened by someone equally psychotic and equally young...saves him all the planning. Why he destroyed Demogorgon before the guy got a princeship. >Very true, IMC. Which is (I think) a function that he's been a Prince >for about eight minutes, as Celestials tell time. If/when he gets an >advanced writeup, I hope we'll see some evolution of all his >(somewhat worthless, IMO) attunements to reflect having a couple of >years under his belt. As stated I see a serious generation gap about to begin occuring between Asmodeus, Baal, Kronos, Malphus, Mammon, and possibly even Kobal.... And the younger demons like Fufur, Haagenti, and Fleurity.... Indeed in my opinion Lucifer is orchestrating what may be considered a "Fall" between the two factions to the point that one side will be completely annhilated or exiled (perhaps to the Ethereal Marches or perhaps to some place else entirely) in order to strengthen disorder and anarchy and evil. >Not too far off. >And, pardon if the writer of the original's reading this, an >*actively* boring writeup. You try to read it, and your eyes slip off >the words and you start considering getting a life. That's basically my opinion of Zadkiel and I don't think it's a particularly bad one. If I could *FIND* the writeup it might be easier but I'll take your warning to heart. Like Fufur I see Zadkiel as lacking an overall vision for the universe. No rebind hell and expand the heavenly population until every human has a gaurdian angel or the like. Right now she still thinks like a Cherub and simply promotes orders like the Police, Gaurdian Angels, Papal Knighthood, and motherhood/responsible fatherhood. Aside from sending her followers to act like Touched like Angel I don't see her doing much (I disagree and think Zadkiel is a better choice David) >He'll be disgruntled, but Litheroy's really not the "undermining" >type. He's a lot more likely to talk about how he thinks a Seraph >with the Word of Forgetfulness is a bad idea. To *everyone.* All the >freakin' time. (Well, in a comedic game, anyhow.) It's definately a comic campaign and frankly it's already amusing because the Seraphim in question has been waiting for the word for 111 *MILLION* years (being an associate with Lucifer, the Grigori, and three trials for hersay...which truly WEREN'T his fault) and the fact that the servitors he'll be attracting are mostly Malakim to cover up Celestial disturbances while he wanted folks who want to soothe mortals who can't handle memories of pain and suffering and anger (though he's not against keeping humanity in the dark about some terrible truths truly :-)) Oh this will be hilarious. >In the writeup, he's extremely active on Earth, where he spends most >of his time in Archeology and the like. His cathedral is an Abbey, >according to Heaven and Hell. Works still. I bet Laurence was PO'ed when he blew the whistle on the whole Dinosaur/Creationalism thing eh? >Mm. Probably not, simply because he would go on to explain just who >Jesus was to his knowledge, and how he did or didn't fit Heaven. And >he and Dominic get along very well. (Hey, *someone* has to like >Dominic.) I take it the angel has a mouth on him? >Well, Christopher isn't a child. He's the Archangel *of* Children, >and may appear as one sometimes, but he isn't a child. True I actually see him as a very old Angel (and being a servitor of stone that makes you usually VERY old) but one who commonly wears a child's vessel and adopts the mannerism of a child in order to be more protective to children (he appears probably as a child just a few years older?). Still I don't think his thought processes are very adult or more precisley I don't think he sees human adult thought processes as very worthwhile.... Children can be very close to animals (Lord of the Flies)....it might be Christopher is contemptious of most of modern society and hoping to bring it down. You think he and Peter Pan are running something in the marches together? - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 03:06:14 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: RE: IN> Question... At 2:50 AM -0400 7/28/00, Tim Groth wrote: >I can sort of understand the lying argument for why the Balseraph >attunement is better, but from a game balance point of view a Master >distinction shouldn't be worse. Also why should Kronos know more about the >Symphony than Yves, I'm sure Yves can keep a vessel attached when adding >the Kyriotate resonance. I agree. I don't see a Master somehow becoming a Dual Angel. I see a Master being given an almost unique perspective on the Symphony -- an understanding of the flows and ebbs of Destiny and Fate so profound that he can see things from another viewpoint entirely -- in this case a Kyriotate's viewpoint. This knowledge is sufficent to broaden his overall views -- enough that they gain the Dissonance conditions of the new Resonance. But they don't change the fundemental, core nature of the Angel. Further, there are some Kyriotates who can have vessels with Attunements, meaning that there are ways to attach a vessel to a Kyriotate. The known methods (using stone or the corpse of a soldier) use preexisting materials, admittedly. Still, the old vessel of the Angel is preexisting too. And finally, there are *two* examples of multiple resonances to look at. One is the Balseraph attunement, showing how it works that way. The other, however, are Superiors. In a way, a Master of Divine Knowledge gets a tiny taste of the majesty of the Archangels -- he gains the ability to take on a second Resonance, even as the Archangels do. The Archangels have access to the Kyriotate Resonance, but can still have vessels. The Kyriotate Archangel, Jordi, has access to other Resonances, but doesn't seem (in the writeup, at least) to have Vessels, though I don't doubt he could. The implication is clear -- access to other Resonances and Dissonance conditions do *not* change the core nature of the Angel, and that includes the ability to have a vessel. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 04:44:25 -0700 (PDT) From: "O. S. Kerr" Subject: Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract Sigh. Wuvvv. Twuuue Wuvvv. I liked it a lot, Chuck. I don't think that either one is going to have any trouble with it. In Council, they are both going to vote and think the way they always have. Michael the Seraph *knows* that Novalis belives her way could work; he disagrees. Novalis is wise enough to realize that the personification of War is going to have a difference of opinion. I keep seeing Daniel J. Travanti and Veronica Hamel from Hill Street Blues in bed at the end of an episode. (For those of you not familiar with 80's US television, Hill Street was a drama based around a police precinct. These two were the local police chief and the District Attorney, respectively. They had a long-standing torrid relationship, off duty. Lots of sexual tension when they were facing off in the station house, none of which kept either one from doing what they thought was right. "Look, Ferrillo, I want you to rub my feet." "Objection, Councellor. It's your turn to rub mine.") JM.02 O. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 04:49:54 -0700 (PDT) From: "O. S. Kerr" Subject: Re: IN> The Penitent Douglas ~ A fascinating story, and a compelling character. I fear that my group would use the Penitent as a deus ex machina, and will probably not use him in his current format. As soon as I figure out something for him to *do,* I'll post the results... :) O. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 05:00:09 -0700 (PDT) From: "O. S. Kerr" Subject: Re: IN> Thirty seconds over the Vale... Moe~ Problem: This sounds more like something Baal and Belial would cook up. Any operation of this magnitude would have to go the Council before one blackwing powered up on the tarmac... What are David and Michael supposed to say when Blandine asks them, "Okay, before I agree to this, exactly how many of your people are we talking about?" Side note: Assume this goes according to plan. What if... Blandine Falls? Gets back together with Beleth? Supports the other side clandestinely? Calls up all the Ethereals that owe her favors? Kicks ass on Stonys and Warriors alike? O. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:12:21 -0500 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Thirty seconds over the Vale... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "O. S. Kerr" To: Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 7:00 AM Subject: Re: IN> Thirty seconds over the Vale... > Moe~ > > Problem: This sounds more like something Baal and Belial would > cook up. > > Any operation of this magnitude would have to go the Council > before one blackwing powered up on the tarmac... > > What are David and Michael supposed to say when Blandine asks > them, "Okay, before I agree to this, exactly how many of your > people are we talking about?" Michael -- "The agreement was, as many of our people as we found necessary and had at least some prior experience in the Ethereal realms, correct?" (This is truthful enough for a Seraph to get away with -- especially given that it's phrased in the form of a question.) David -- "Several thousand." (David has nothing stopping him from flat-out lying like a rug... and, well, I *suppose* you could consider "ninety" as "several"... *wink wink*) > Side note: Assume this goes according to plan. What if... > > Blandine Falls? Gets back together with Beleth? Supports the > other side clandestinely? Calls up all the Ethereals that owe > her favors? Kicks ass on Stonys and Warriors alike? Realizes that Beleth's new plan to target her Servitors directly has actually been beaten off? Gets an epiphany that War isn't something totally useless -- it actually does let the Peace faction be free to work *in* peace, when it's correctly applied? (Read -- it's a lot easier to get on with the work of saving and comforting human souls if you *don't* have some damned demon trying to bash your skull in -- or the human's skull in -- while you do it. And it's a lot easier to arrange for said demonic interference to not be there if you've got half-a-dozen Malakim of War/Stone standing over your shoulder going "Step across that line, demon-boy. Come on, step on it. I *dare* you to step on it... hey, where are you going?" - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:16:38 -0500 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract - ----- Original Message ----- From: "O. S. Kerr" To: Sent: Friday, July 28, 2000 6:44 AM Subject: Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract > Sigh. Wuvvv. Twuuue Wuvvv. > > I liked it a lot, Chuck. > > I don't think that either one is going to have any trouble with > it. In Council, they are both going to vote and think the way > they always have. Michael the Seraph *knows* that Novalis > belives her way could work; he disagrees. Novalis is wise > enough to realize that the personification of War is going to > have a difference of opinion. That will be the eventual end result, yes. (Along with an increase in overall operating efficency for the Host, as War and Flowers suddenly start *complementing* each other's efforts instead of working at cross-purposes...) But it's not gonna happen overnight. Those two are a case of simultaneously having a lot of overlap between their respective natures and being two of the most dissimilar personalities in Heaven. All that this incident did was set up the possibility of them falling in love, by knocking a lot of illusions each one had about the other one out of their eyes... there's still a lot of story left to be written. If I could only *think* of something.... (I have lots of vignettes in my mind, but no overall story linking them together.) Two scenes that demand to be let out of my head are the one where one of Novalis' senior servitors is surprised as all get-out to catch her reading Sun Tzu in her office ("It's someone else's favorite book, dear... I'm just trying to understand him a little better.") -- and then the severe jaw-dropping in the Seraphim Council when Novalis *quotes* from Sun Tzu. Admittedly, if Novy ever reads it, she'll probably have a severe eyebrow-raising moment when she sees the part that goes "To fight and conquer in all our battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting". ("*This* is what's considered 'supreme excellence in War'? Then how come they don't ever actually *try* it? Breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting is what I've spent the past 22,000 years trying to do!") "Michael, dear, I know you're interested in strategy and all... I found this book you might like to read..." "Sun Tzu? I own the first edition." *Novalis points at one particular passage* "Errrrr... are you trying to tell me something?" *She looks at him sideways* "Yes, but..." *Looks at him some more* *mumblemumblemutter* "OK, I'll see what I can do." - -- Chuckg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 08:52:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner-Thornber Subject: Re: IN> Minor Superiors > Definately. Alchohalism, Drug Abuse, Soccer, Stock trading, Dieting, > Eating, Fighting, and the like all ultimately owe their allegiance to > Furfur. Truth be told Lucifer was making an ulterly brillant move making > Fufur the Demon of Hardcore because it as a concerpt is quite possibly the > single most defining concept of the modern era. Hardcore Game-play for > instance, Hard Core Humor, Hard Core Lust-the potential for alliances are > also extremely strong. Alcoholism, Dieting and Eating goes to Gluttony, Drug Abuse goes to Fleurity, Fighting goes to Belial and Stock Trading goes to Mammom. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emily K. Dresner-Thornber -- http://www.nodonut.com/zenith The Parisian Asphalt Initiative - Paving France for a Better Tomorrow http://www.pave-france.org How can you say, "We are wise and the law of the LORD is with us," when, in fact, the false pens of the scribes has made it into a lie? - Jeremiah 8:8 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 09:30:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas J Howell Subject: IN> Legion seed I once had a Kyrio of Jordi in my group, very powerful, and I ran an adventure based off of this seed (I'll post my notes for the adventure if folks are interested) to frighten her... Sennecherib, Demon of Beasts Shedite Servitor of Corruption Corporeal Forces - 6 Strength 12 Agility 12 Ethereal Forces - 3 Intelligence 9 Precision 3 Celestial Forces - 4 Will 11 Perception 5 Attunements: Shedite of Corruption (same as Shedite of Factions) Songs: Numinous Corpus/6 (Claws), Form (Corporeal/5), Tracking (All/5), others as you see fit Skills: Fighting/6, Dodge/6, Tracking/6, others as you see fit Sennecherib was originally a powerful Servitor of Animals, until his propensity for excessive slaughter of both humans and animals (he was overly fond of possessing carnivores) caused him to Fall. He fell in with Legion, Prince of Corruption, and specialized in turning animals, even domestic predators, into vicious killers. For his service, Lucifer gave him the word of Beasts. Sennecherib always supported the extermination of man by the animals. He specializes in having domesticated animals turn against their owners (all animals want to be free from their oppressive masters). But he also represents the bad animal in the woods, the rabid animal, the one that steals children in the night. Though all the world knows that Legion was destroyed in AD 1008, what nobody knows was that Legion shared his secret with Sennecherib before he died. The dark Prince placed some of his own Forces within an amulet once owned by a Greek magician who corrupted Christians. That amulet gave Sennecherib the ability to possess multiple hosts while he wore the amulet. But at the same time he imprisoned Sennecherib in the amulet, a dark seed of corruption to be hidden in the earth until, one day, it should be unearthed again. That day has now come. What's worse is that Sennecherib has been plotting inside his amulet prison and he thinks he knows how he can rekindle the Kyriotate of Animals attunement that he once possessed... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 09:32:54 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Question... Leath Sheales wrote: > Therefore the Distinguished Angel doesn't 'trick' the Symphony into > believing that it has two resonances, it becomes so much a part of > the Symphony that it actually is both Choirs at once. [..] > Therefore, IMO, an angel who gains this Distinction and chooses the > Kyriotate Resonance becomes as a Kyriotate in all things, losing > the ability to hold a vessel But if it is also still a seraph (or whatnot), that entails the ability to hold vessels. I would think a Distinction would not diminish the angel's abilities. I could believe any of the following: - The angel can now use any combination of hosts and vessels, while simultaneously using its native resonnance. - The angel can either use *a* vessel *or* multiple hosts, while simultaneously using its native resonnance. - The angel can use a single vessel and its native resonnance, or throw a switch and temporarily lose its native resonnance and the ability to use vessels, while gaining the ability to use multiple hosts. In short, it's a sort of "were-kyrio." Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 09:39:52 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> "Angel" of Schlock Horror A very good Samingite. Except for the Habbalite concern with "justice," he's almost a miniature Saminga, and a good illustration of the Saminga mindset. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 08:45:34 -0500 (CDT) From: edg@pyramid.sjgames.com Subject: Re: IN> Minor Superiors On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Emily Dresner-Thornber wrote: > Alcoholism, Dieting and Eating goes to Gluttony, Drug Abuse goes to > Fleurity, Fighting goes to Belial and Stock Trading goes to Mammom. And Soccer, of course, goes to Asmodeus. (Is catching the ball in one's horns and running with it considered to be a valid play?) - -EDG ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:04:08 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors A big part of traditional angelology is the belief in guardian angels. While other Superiors guard this, that, or the other aspect of human life, Zadkiel is (or could be played as) the central focus for this entire aspect of angel lore. If I were GMing her, I'd put Zadkiel at the top of a huge, flattish hierarchy of guardian angels, mostly cherubim, desperately thin on the ground as they try to protect EVERYONE. Yes, maybe compared to a lot of other Words, angels of Protection are kind of colorless, but they'd form an important part of the celestial infrastructure. Other angels would often find it useful to look up the guardian angels of the humans involved in the current plot, to get background information. (This information can be as slight as the GM wants it to be due to Zadkiel's people being so thinly spread.) Playing a Protector would generally involve one of the Protector's charges getting involved in a celestial plot. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:07:44 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Dionysian Set-up Daedalus3D@aol.com wrote: > So their using the order of everybody's favorite monk, Dionysus. > They just dropped "angels" as a choir and stuck the grigori in > there because they liked 'em. Interesting . . . . Or, wait, so > maybe they're just calling "angels" "Aeons" to avoid confusion. > Hmmm, so there's TEN choirs? Maya mentioned angels without choirs, so maybe "Grigori" is used as the name of the choir Dionysios named "angel." Maya, do these choirs have different abilities, as in IN, or are they just different degrees of authority or power? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:30:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract Me, too. I've always thought that these two would be good in a Much Ado About Nothing sort of plot. . . After we've got Mr. Prissypants and Sleeping Beauty together, they could enlist all their servitors to share the happiness with two good friends. :-) Or would that be too MUCH love for one story? Jenni - --- "O. S. Kerr" wrote: > Sigh. Wuvvv. Twuuue Wuvvv. > > I liked it a lot, Chuck. ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:32:07 EDT From: MarkDEddy@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band In a message dated 7/27/00 6:26:32 PM, PhoenixRising@horusinc.com writes: >I know. But I just watched it again, and I'm *almost* as bad about Princess >Bride quotes as I am about Rocky Horror references... > > > >Ki > *snicker* So is there a 'Dr. Frank N. Furter' etherial spirit in your campaign? Mark ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:32:23 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors For a comedic look at guardian angels, see the comic strip "Rose Is Rose" at: http://www.unitedmedia.com/comics/roseisrose/ab.html Ther heroine's little boy has a close relationship with his guardian angel. You can generally find one or two angel strips in any given week. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 14:36:08 GMT From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Minor Superiors > >And Soccer, of course, goes to Asmodeus. > >(Is catching the ball in one's horns and running with it considered to be >a valid play?) > > Oh yes. Aussie Rules Football was originally adapted from Hades Rules, you know. The annual Baalite vs Belian Derby still picks up the biggest annual ratings in Hell. (Team with the last 'man' standing wins.) jo ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:39:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Barney in In Nomine This is priceless! I laughed. I cried. . . Well, maybe not cried. But it was kinda sad and creepy and weird, too. Good job! Jenni - --- Rolland Therrien > > Tell me what you think of this idea, guys. ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 14:38:57 GMT From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors >From: Earl Wajenberg >Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:04:08 -0500 > >A big part of traditional angelology is the belief in >guardian angels. While other Superiors guard this, that, >or the other aspect of human life, Zadkiel is (or could >be played as) the central focus for this entire aspect >of angel lore. > > That's very true, and I quite like it. I think I'd be tempted to use Zadkiel as a wordbound Cherub -- prolly of Yves -- with _millions_ of relievers reporting to her, each one sent out to keep a watchful angelic eye on some otherwise forgotten mortal soul ... (that lets them be traditional guardian angels that don't need vessels.) As a Superior she seems rather dull to me, but the guardian angel shtick is cute. jo ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 14:41:26 GMT From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Dionysian Set-up > >Maya mentioned angels without choirs, so maybe "Grigori" is >used as the name of the choir Dionysios named "angel." > >Maya, do these choirs have different abilities, as in IN, or >are they just different degrees of authority or power? > Different jobs/ degrees of authority. Some of them traditionally specialise in particular areas, power-wise, or use traditional forms (although my impression is that you can pretty much dictate exactly what your PC angel looks like, and be as 'normal' or as 'freaky-looking' as you like, as long as you stick to it.) jo (17 heads and 9 pairs of wings? It's a RP challenge!) ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:48:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Bruce Dykes Subject: IN> Harry Potter, Satanism, and In Nomine It's in the Onion: http://www.theonion.com/onion3625/harry_potter.html Okay, so they don't mention In Nomine, but it easily could... bkd __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:47:10 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> IN Romance -- Opposites Attract At 7:16 AM -0500 7/28/00, Charles Glasgow wrote: > >(Along with an increase in overall operating efficency for the Host, as War >and Flowers suddenly start *complementing* each other's efforts instead of >working at cross-purposes...) Cross-pollination? Now, the problem with *all* of this remains the same -- Novalis is the ultimate pacifist. If she ever, *ever* accepts that the "active response" to an issue is anything other than a horribly regrettable situation forced on you by the other side not seeing reason, it represents a failure of her entire ethos. Moe's Malakite Scenario is one possibility. Her Falling because of it is another. But I think her simply not putting herself into such a situation is the most likely. Similarly, Michael is the Archangel of *War.* Not defense. His entire core being demands that regardless of the hearts and minds of humanity, if all the demons are *dead* then Heaven *wins,* period. Damage control can naturally follow. If War and Flowers begin complimenting each other, I can believe that Efficiency among the Host will increase. I also think Heaven is doomed. The only way they can compliment each other's functions is to reconcile to those functions. If you take away both Peace and War, you're left with a Department of Defense that has no mandate. Put another way... Novalis is kind of the ultimate New Testement Angel -- she embodies the Christian principles of forgiveness, absolution, peace and brotherhood that are Jesus's hallmark. Michael is kind of the ultimate Old Testement Angel -- do things Right or God will come down and get absolutely Biblical on your Ass. Have the two of them reconcile those positions, and you don't get either the Old *or* New Testements. I just don't see it. Oh, I can see Novalis and Michael having the occasional torrid night -- Michael is an Alpha Male primal masculine image and Novalis is a primal feminine Earth Mother image -- but actually changing their operations to reflect each other's nature and compromise? Nuh-uh. Now, going back to some old INC "Movie Trailers," the *Dominic*/Novalis idea has a lot of comedic merit... >"Michael, dear, I know you're interested in strategy and all... I found this >book you might like to read..." > >"Sun Tzu? I own the first edition." > >*Novalis points at one particular passage* > >"Errrrr... are you trying to tell me something?" > >*She looks at him sideways* > >"Yes, but..." > >*Looks at him some more* > >*mumblemumblemutter* "OK, I'll see what I can do." Mm. I think it far more likely Michael would say "you're quoting out of context," and start going through and showing how the eternal philosophies and strategies reflect a need to respond with force when appropriate. Then they start arguing about what's appropriate and not, resulting in Michael throwing some pottery against the wall and going out to beat the hell out of Recruits for a while, while Novalis closes her eyes, and leaks a tear, and moves out to embrace and cherish her Relievers and put Michael from her mind for a while.... Oh yeah, *that's* romantic. "The only thing Opposites Attract... is Divorce." - --John Cleese. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:51:14 PDT From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors >From: Earl Wajenberg >Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com >Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors >Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:32:23 -0500 > >For a comedic look at guardian angels, see the comic strip >"Rose Is Rose" at: > > http://www.unitedmedia.com/comics/roseisrose/ab.html > >Ther heroine's little boy has a close relationship with his >guardian angel. You can generally find one or two angel strips >in any given week. And every so often, we get to see what his guardian angel *really* looks like when he's not manifesting in that I-look-just-like-a-little-boy form so as to avoid spooking his charge... ... and it looks like a twenty-foot tall Malakite with a HUGE honkin' sword, with an expression on its face like Laurence at a Balseraph convention. :-) - -- Chuckg ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 07:56:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jennifer Campbell Subject: Re: IN> Re: Wrong Band The question is, do you have to actually -wear- the fishnets to invoke him? Heee heee hee. . . *jumping to the left* Jenni - --- MarkDEddy@aol.com wrote: > *snicker* So is there a 'Dr. Frank N. Furter' > etherial spirit in your > campaign? ===== "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - -William Clayton ICQ UIN: 14514495 AIM: Pepper2540 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 11:07:23 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Playing Minor Superiors Charles Glasgow wrote: > And every so often, we get to see what his guardian angel *really* > looks like when he's not manifesting in that I-look-just-like-a- > little-boy form so as to avoid spooking his charge... > > ... and it looks like a twenty-foot tall Malakite with a HUGE > honkin' sword, with an expression on its face like Laurence at a > Balseraph convention. :-) Two instances of the angel's true form: We see the Malakite-form riding down out of heaven on a winged steed, dismount over Rose's house, morph into the lookalike form, and pass into the kid's bedroom. (His name is Pasquale, by the way.) As the kid wakes up, the angel brightly remarks, "Today, we'll talk about the importance of a positive self-image..." We see the Malakite-form standing, sword drawn, in a darkened hallway outside Pasquale's bedroom. Before him, all fluffed out in panic, is the housecat. Next panel, the cat has regained some composure, and the angel is back in little-boy form, saying, "*You* don't startle *me*, *I* won't startle *you*!" Earl ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1739 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.