From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Aug 18 06:13:24 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA21930 for ; Fri, 18 Aug 2000 06:13:24 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id GAA18078 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 18 Aug 2000 06:11:08 -0500 Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 06:11:08 -0500 Message-Id: <200008181111.GAA18078@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1786 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, August 18 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1786 In this digest: Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands. IN> Lucifer Granting Words Re: IN> Lucifer Granting Words Re: IN> Word-binding (Re: Limits to Lucifer) Re: IN> Saminga! Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> Saminga! Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] (longish) Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] (longish) Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> Saminga! Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir IN> Brief advert for PBEMs Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: Recommendation against micromanagement [was Re: IN> On Lilith and Bright Lilim] Re: IN> On Lilith and Bright Lilim Re: All about praise (was Re: IN> On Lilith and Bright Lilim) Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> S3 Art IN> Minor Choir Contest Re: IN> Billions and billions of souls... Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands Re: IN> The College of Saints, a Collective Superior Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 11:59:07 -0600 From: "ben" Subject: Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands. > By the by, I recommend that we exclude the minor Superiors from this. > Not because it wouldn't be interesting (I can see all kinds of > possibilities for Litheroy), but because the ability to create a minor > Choir or Band makes sense as one of the things that separates major > Superiors from the minor ones. Well, I personally think that Minor Superiors are rehashes of major Superiors; most of them are trumped-up Word-Bounds who might as well just serve a real Superior as a high-ranking servitor. Litheroy->Gabriel. Zadkiel->Novalis. Furfur->Haagenti or Belial. Fleurity->Haagenti or Kobal. Alaemon->erm. Maybe Kronos. Well, no, Alaemon has his own two feet. Mammon->erm. Haagenti, I guess, but he also has his own mojo. Magog->Saminga or Belial. Belial. Christopher->Yves. Khalid->Yves. This ain't to say I don't like 'em; lots of these folks are interesting. In any case, the minor Superiors aren't on my Rando-Superior-Ring, but I will add them if there is demand. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:16:23 -0400 From: "Misha" Subject: IN> Lucifer Granting Words I had a slightly different take on the whole idea of Word-granting. I'll confess that I haven't reread the pertinent sections of the GMG in some time, but I still like the "feel" this gives. When an angel is granted a Word, the Symphony is adjusted to make that angel the embodiment of that particular Word. This sort of collective "reality-editing" requires the efforts of lots of different beings, personified by the members of the Seraphim Council. Things work differently for the other side, though. Demons don't reflect the Symphony -- they each have their own *personal* Symphony. And Lucifer, being the ultimate Balseraph that he is, "helps" a demon rewrite his own personal Symphony so that he's got a part in it where he personifies one particular aspect. Note that this happens whether the demon in question wants it or not -- this is how Lucifer hands out the Word of Stale Bong Water, for instance. It might work a little something like this: "Congratulations on your efforts, Galkor. You have pleased Me greatly with your endeavours, and with the misery you have inflicted on the unwary. For this, I now create you 'Demon of Parking Tickets', hereafter known as 'He Who Will Get You Towed'. Hear the new sounds in your Symphony, and revel in your glory... and I'm sure that Kobal will have some suggestions for you soon." "Thank you, Glorious Morning Star... I do indeed hear those chords, and they are sweet to my ears. I hear and obey, and I will give the Jester Prince my full attention and respect." There are some implications to this interpretation, however. First, can *any* Balseraph do it, or only the First-Fallen? If it only required Princehood, then some Prince might have figured out how to do it. I *personally* prefer the "Lucifer-only" version, as I like the idea of Lucifer being on a different level than the rest of the Princes after the Fall and the events immediately after, but that's strictly my own POV. Second, allowing a demon's beliefs about his own personal Symphony to affect the *actual* Symphony, by funneling Word-Forces and Essence to him, might not fit cosmologically in your game. I prefer to say that acquiring a diabolical Word requires the sort of *total* self-confidence that can only be inspired by Lucifer telling you so (and making you believe it), but you may want to go another route. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 12:09:44 -0600 From: "ben" Subject: Re: IN> Lucifer Granting Words > There are some implications to this interpretation, however. First, can > *any* Balseraph do it, or only the First-Fallen? If it only required > Princehood, then some Prince might have figured out how to do it. I Just as there's a theory that *any* entity can be God if it becomes strong enough, there's a theory that any Balseraph can lie to the Symphony so convincingly as to create Words if his resonance is powerful enough. In the twenty-four thousand years that there have been Balseraphs, only one has ever been able to do it. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 11:11:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Word-binding (Re: Limits to Lucifer) Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 13:04:19 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Word-binding (Re: Limits to Lucifer) - - --On Thursday, August 17, 2000 9:02 AM -0700 Maurice Lane wrote: > Hmmm. This would suggest that _Yves_ could have the > same ability. There could be whole legions of hidden > Word-bound out there, fighting a little War all their > own, with nobody outside of Fate/Destiny knowing > anything about it... > And we would call it "In Nomine". Marc. Just Marc. Elohite Angel of Salvation True, but just think of the looks on your players' face when they realize that they're just as much ignorant, helpless pawns as the poor humans that they're protecting / corrupting. Or that their mighty, powerful Superior that can erase the PCs at will is just as meaningless, _and_ _knows_ _it_. Fnord. ;) Morgan (FAW) Kyriotate of Destiny Petitioner for the Word of I'm Sorry, But That Information is Not Available At Your Security Clearance, Citizen. ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 8/7/00 (this is a guess) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 13:15:11 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Saminga! From: "David Wood" > > (Okay, I suppose if you want to keep it Hellish, you can freeze some living > souls under the ice...) No, the images "Saminga on Ice!" inspired are too Damned funny to require such embellishment. ;;;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:39:33 -0400 From: "Galen G. Silversmith" Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir > Return-Path: earlw@mc.com > Domini Canes -- The Lord's Dogs Interesting idea, but from this (admittedly short) write up, there is little insite into the reason for this choir, or how they act as independant creatures. They are beings of the symphony, with free will and determination, fates and destinies. I think they could have a little more fleshing out. Esp how they act when their 'masters' change words. If the master realigns, how does the choir's attunement change? > Dominic offers to create a Dog for angels as a high mark of favor. He > has never inflicted an unwanted Dog on anyone. That would be unjust to > the Dog, if no one else, and would be generally bad politics and > strategy. Dominic is not Justice, but Judgement. While the just and injust is a part of Dominic's porfolio, it is not paramount. I can think of several Dogs being attunded (just in case) to the pre-Final-Trumpet Khalid, or Gabriel or Eli. Or any other major angel who Dominic feels needs some more guidance or a constant reminder of the judgement of god. > Dominic creates a Dog by taking an Ethereal Force from the master-to-be > (which he immediately replaces) He does? Maybe it its more Trade than Judgement, but there is a cost involved. It would be my arbitration that the cost and benefit is equivelent. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:52:27 -0400 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> Saminga! - --On Thursday, August 17, 2000 1:15 PM -0500 Prodigal wrote: > From: "David Wood" >> >> (Okay, I suppose if you want to keep it Hellish, you can freeze >> some > living >> souls under the ice...) > > No, the images "Saminga on Ice!" inspired are too Damned funny to > require such embellishment. ;;;) > On the other hand, it's nice to see Tanya Harding working again. Marc. Just Marc. Elohite Angel of Salvation ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:55:09 -0400 From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > > Domini Canes -- The Lord's Dogs > > The Domini Canes are Dominic's attempt to combine the powers of > the Malakim and the Cherubim. Like Malakim, they cannot fall. Like > Cherubim, the have an attuned. In fact, each Dog is made for, and > permanently attuned to, exactly one other celestial. Oh, I *like* this. They could be a lot of fun to roleplay; kind of Alfred to Batman. Too bad they can't Fall, because then they could play Jeeves to their master's Bertie Wooster. :) - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswcasa.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:59:04 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Galen G. Silversmith wrote: > Interesting idea, but from this (admittedly short) write up, > there is little insite into the reason for this choir, or how > they act as independant creatures. You're right. I neglected Dominic's motive for them. They are an additional safeguard against Falling, for those cases where Dominic deems a Fall would be more than usually disasterous and that a Dog would be a good way to help prevent it. > They are beings of the symphony, with free will and > determination, fates and destinies. Not a lot, really, no. They have the same hobble on free will that Malakim have, and they are heavily centered on their masters. They are less independent than most celestials. > Esp how they act when their 'masters' change words. If the > master realigns, how does the choir's attunement change? The Dog shares Word dissonance conditions with its master. It would be theoretically possible for a Dog and its master to be attuned to different Words, but it would probably be a very unhappy situation. > Dominic is not Justice, but Judgement. While the just and injust > is a part of Dominic's porfolio, it is not paramount. A matter of GM interpretation. There remains the issue of political strategy. > I can think of several Dogs being attunded (just in case) to the > pre-Final-Trumpet Khalid, or Gabriel or Eli. Or any other major > angel who Dominic feels needs some more guidance or a constant > reminder of the judgement of god. As I said, there's political strategy. Even waiving the ethical problems, doing this to an unwilling angel of another Word, especially a Superior, would raise a fuss Dominic doesn't want to face. And an Archangel would simply trash the Dog. Anyway, how is Dominic to get the Ethereal force from an unwilling Archangel? The most Dominic dare do is inflict unwanted Dogs on his own servitors. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 15:08:43 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Krishnaswami, Neel wrote: > Too bad they can't Fall, because then they could > play Jeeves to their master's Bertie Wooster. :) Aw, Bertie isn't Fallen. I was actually thinking of Bertie and Jeeves when I wrote of a Dog with a diminished master. Say, a master hanging on to one last Ethereal Force. Though really Bertie isn't that stupid, just pliable. A celestial Bertie is one Celestial Force away from remnanthood. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:53:01 -0500 (CDT) From: Benjamin Acosta Subject: Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] (longish) Well, as long as you're addressing tethers to Lucifer, what's your final word on the House of the Morning Star? If I remember it correctly it was the tether to Lucifer in New Orleans where a woman lived who was totally and unselfishly in love with him. Lucifer had no idea what to make of that and had prolonged her lifespan while he contemplated the matter. No one knew it existed except for Lucifer and the sensechal, whose job it was to keep it from being discovered. Ben, Elohite of Eli Angel of Neat Ideas ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 15:09:12 -0500 From: Kris Overstreet Subject: Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] (longish) At 02:53 PM 8/17/00 -0500, you wrote: >Well, as long as you're addressing tethers to Lucifer, what's your final >word on the House of the Morning Star? If I remember it correctly it was >the tether to Lucifer in New Orleans where a woman lived who was totally >and unselfishly in love with him. Lucifer had no idea what to make of >that and had prolonged her lifespan while he contemplated the matter. No >one knew it existed except for Lucifer and the sensechal, whose job it was >to keep it from being discovered. She died when he Redeemed; with her dead, the Tether died as well. Her spirit is currently under the thrall of Kronos, who keeps her isolated from the rest of Hell. He does nothing to her, asks nothing of her, -says- nothing to her. He, alone of all -surviving- Superiors in Hell, knows her secret, and he keeps her safe until Lucifer returns to Hell to rule again... Redneck Kris Overstreet, aka Redneck Gaijin publisher, White Lightning Prod. - www.wlpcomics.com I ***LOATHE*** Microsoft Outlook. Please get Eudora. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 16:46:50 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Krishnaswami, Neel wrote: > Too bad they can't Fall, because then they could > play Jeeves to their master's Bertie Wooster. :) And then I wrote: > Aw, Bertie isn't Fallen. Oh, wait, I get it. Bertie isn't Fallen, but Jeeves is. That makes a certain amount of sense. Only I have trouble picking a band for Jeeves (if we exclude Fallen Dog). He seems like such a perfect Elohite. Hm. Lilim, actually, now that I think about it.He knows what makes everybody tick. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:01:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Saminga! - --- David Wood wrote: > Actually, when I see "Saminga!", I always think immediately after it, > "On > Ice!" I can even hear the mellifluous tones of the announcer, the > spotlights > playing around the skating arena, the drum roll crescendoing, all > attention > drawn to the parting curtains where... I'll let your imaginations do > all the > work. Any attempt to put it into words would not do the image > justice. ROACLMWO o:> (Rolling on a cloud laughing my wings off) ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:13:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir I like the core idea, but I think they work better as Celestial spirits than as a minor Choir. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 14:17:51 -0700 (PDT) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Enanidah=20Kallai?= Subject: IN> Brief advert for PBEMs Started up two new PBEM on egroups - HeavenOnEarthRPG and HellOnEarthRPG - they are designed to run in tandem with events from each affecting both games, but having them on seperate lists should reduce the confusion and also maybe help keep the OOC info secret. You can join in both if you want though - players are good ;) The names aren't terribly imaginative I know - but I like to keep names reasonably short but can still be distinguished from each other. If you want more info feel free to email me privately (enanidah@yahoo.com). Sorry to those who aren't interested for taking up their time. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: 17 Aug 2000 21:46:00 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir On Thu, 17 Aug 2000 "Galen G. Silversmith" wrote: >> Return-Path: earlw@mc.com >> Dominic offers to create a Dog for angels as a high mark of favor. He >> has never inflicted an unwanted Dog on anyone. That would be unjust to >> the Dog, if no one else, and would be generally bad politics and >> strategy. >Dominic is not Justice, but Judgement. While the just and injust is a part >of Dominic's porfolio, it is not paramount. I can think of several Dogs being >attunded (just in case) to the pre-Final-Trumpet Khalid, or Gabriel or >Eli. Or any other major angel who Dominic feels needs some more guidance >or a constant reminder of the judgement of god. [snip] this presumes that Dominic can "sic" these Dogs on fellow Superiors--especially at a distance (since Gabriel rarely leaves her volcano, and i don't see Dominic travelling there; he'd have to know where Eli was to send Domini Canes after the Archangel of Creation), or that he knew of the need for them on such Superiors before they became potential disaster Archangels. also, since the Dog requires an Ethereal Force from its master-to-be, i don't think Dogs *can* be inflicted on beings of such power unwillingly. you further go on to say that Dominic wouldn't repay the Ethereal Force removed for Domini Canes creation, but if their creation is most often a mark of favor, i would say Dominic does indeed repay the Ethereal Force in question. only for those Servitors who are in need of watching for poor service would Dominic strip a Force and sic a Dog upon. -=|horsefly|=- God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:16:26 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: Recommendation against micromanagement [was Re: IN> On Lilith and Bright Lilim] At 12:07 AM -0700 8/17/00, Sean McCarthy wrote: >Our spies report that on 06:17 AM 8/17/00 +0000, Jo Hart said: >>Chill. I do think it's fair to ask people to give it a week or so for >>things to calm down on that particular topic before posting given the >>recent Lilith-spams. I'd rather do that than have it flare up again. > > > >Though you will note the topic was banned because of the volume of posts >generated, not the content. I admit it is very, very unlikely that so >massive a volume would be entirely 'good' meterial, but I not certain >banning any givne topic that generates a flurry of interest (without >knowing what the content is) is the right response. Actually, it was banned because I saw a title from one person talking about two others ranting on the subject *AND* because it was three whole stinking screens on the smae topic. When _that_ happens... There is clearly a flame war brewing, if not in full swing. Not to mention that the posts I did skim indicated that it had degenerated into a "I'm right!" "No, I'm right!" idiocy. If it's an interesting topic to all, then after a week, people will go back to it. If it's a flash in the pan flamewar spark, then _sensible_ people will not. Is a week going to kill anyone? I mean, if anyone has only a week to live, by all means, post whatever you want, but you'd better be dead after that week is up. At 7:05 PM -0400 8/16/00, Bull wrote: [...] >basically I slipped in something similar to what Archangel Beth did (is >doing? is thinking about doing? Is daydreaming about doing but probably won't because I don't fancy playing around in the guts of the config file, PERL scripting, and all the other stuff that can apparently work its voodoo on majordomo. Though I may tap into programmer wisdom at some point and start auto-bouncing _back to the sender_ anything with HTML in it, or MIME, or any other forbidden attachments or formats like HTML. Or HTML. (How many times in one paragraph is HTML forbidden?! Guess the number and win-- not getting smacked.) > Simply put, any board, list, or forum where >there is a moderator is NOT subject to the myth of free speech. You're >allowed only what the moderator allows. And in truth, this isn't as "moderated" a list as it could be. I _could_ set the list so that each and every message had to be hand-approved by the list admin before anyone else ever _saw_ it. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:05:41 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> On Lilith and Bright Lilim At 8:19 PM -0500 8/16/00, David Edelstein wrote: >Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >> (* Which means she might not have seen me laying down the smack in the >> first place. I've heard about her wedding. I've surely lost SAN from >> the mere descriptions. ) > > >Excuse me. Are you saying that if someone has an interesting Lilith >writeup, or new Lilith attunements, or a Lilith adventure seed, or >anything else Lilith-related, they may not post it until such time as >you give permission to do so? In short, yes. That permission shows up on Monday morning, which will be a week from when I said, "no more L-girl stuff for a week." Is a week going to just _kill_ anyone who wants to post on the topic? (And I, myself, am holding off on the "Urim" for that same week, and it's only LiliM related.) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:20:53 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: All about praise (was Re: IN> On Lilith and Bright Lilim) At 6:11 AM +0000 8/17/00, Jo Hart wrote: >Still, >>if anyone has something to say _besides_ praise (which generally ought >>to be in private email anyway > >Actually, I think it's sweet if people want to send (short) comments of >praise to the list about _anything_ they see here. It's always nice for >writers to get feedback, and it encourages people to do more ;) True -- though teeeeeeeechnically it's low-content. Though it does get the ball rolling, I suspect, prompting others to render unto the tortured writer the life's blood of regard and delight which keeps them typing away at the keyboard with oozing stumps of fingers for the delight of others... Which is often enough a feature. Not to mention that, alas, it has rarely been a problem that clogs the list. I mean, the day that I have to say, "Now, now, I know we all love that notion, but really, we need to stop posting to the list because the last three digests were nothing but the "IN>Praise" header..." Man, don't I _wish_... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 19:17:58 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir At 2:39 PM -0400 8/17/00, Galen G. Silversmith wrote: >> Return-Path: earlw@mc.com >> Domini Canes -- The Lord's Dogs (Very enjoyable notion, BTW. Should a suggested point value be given to have one as a Servant? Or are they more like a "Distinction"? Do they function roughly as familiars? (Can you give your Discord to one? (No, really, I could see how something like that _could_ be contrived to be necessary! Very contrived, but...) Do they have to roll against Will to avoid doing something you want them to do, or are they more like minions?) [...] >> Dominic offers to create a Dog for angels as a high mark of favor. He >> has never inflicted an unwanted Dog on anyone. That would be unjust to >> the Dog, if no one else, and would be generally bad politics and >> strategy. [...] > I can think of several Dogs being >attunded (just in case) to the pre-Final-Trumpet Khalid, or Gabriel or >Eli. Ah, but if it requires an Ethereal Force from the Dog's attuned "master," it might be a bit hard to persuade these Superiors to part with the required bit of soulstuff that keeps the Dog so perfectly attuned with its master's state... > Or any other major angel who Dominic feels needs some more guidance >or a constant reminder of the judgement of god. If they don't belong to him, he can't just rip a Force from them. Well, _maybe_ he could, but their Archangel would pitch a fit, I suspect. (At least, so it would be in any game of _mine_, personally.) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:19:06 -0500 From: Andrew Hackard Subject: Re: IN> S3 Art At 09:11 AM 17/08/00 -0700, Maurice Lane wrote: >While I'm thinking about it, does anybody know where I >can get a print of the full page portrait of Yves that >introduces his writeup in S3?* Your best bet is to e-mail Phil Reed at phil@sjgames.com and ask who did that art, and see if you can't pry contact information out of him. (Explaining why you're interested might help.) - -- "People are stupider than anybody." | hackard@io.com -- Tom Lehrer | AIM: Talthybias | ICQ: 19083015 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 19:35:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: IN> Minor Choir Contest Greetings from the Dark Side... Here is my entry in the contest. Let the games begin! Palatinates "The Caprices" The forces of chaos can never be tamed -- not even by a Superior who claims those forces as part of his Word -- but they can be shaped. The angels who are Janus' personal vision of the Wind are formed of capriciousness and raw chance. When Janus really wants big change to occur, he sends in the Palatinates. Resonance Palatinates can influence randomness. They don't create luck, but they can move it around. With a successful Resonance roll, a Palatine can give himself a bonus to all rolls that he makes. The bonus is equal to the CD of the Resonance roll (added to the CD's of successful rolls, subtracted from failed ones) and lasts for a number of minutes equal to the sum of the other two dice. The visible effect is that the angel benefits from a series of fortuitous coincidences. A side effect of this amplified unpredictability makes a Caprice whose Resonance is active immune to the effects of Baal's Baron of Victory Attunement. The downside of the Palatine Resonance is that using it steals luck from the angel's future. Once the bonus wears off, the angel has a penalty to all rolls which is equal to the bonus and lasts for the same amount of time (the CD of the Resonance roll is subtracted from the CD of successful rolls and added to failed ones). Even if the angel attempts nothing that would require a roll during that time, random bits of unpleasantness still happen to him (he gets pulled over for a taillight that just got broken, his soup has the fly in it, etc.). Dissonance Palatinates may not initiate change on the Corporeal plane for their own purposes, nor can they interfere with change that is a natural part of the Symphony. They may only combat stagnation or the interference of Celestials and Ethereals. Humans with unusual abilities (i.e. Sorcerers, Undead, Children of the Grigori) and those who have chosen sides in the War count as Celestials and Ethereals for this purpose. A Palatine who yields to the temptation to impose his own brand of luck on the Symphony is in big trouble; in trying to become a master of fortune, he becomes its slave. Dissonant Palatinates get addicted to manipulating luck and eventually become Sukallin. Manner and Appearance Look up "cool" in the dictionary and you'll find a Caprice's picture. They choose Vessels that are lean and graceful with wiry strength rather than muscular bulk. Their fashion sense tends toward clothing that is both sporty and stylish. Palatinates smile often -- it works as both a greeting and a threat. The celestial form of a Palatine is an ever-shifting mass with no set shape. They change consistency from thick liquid to vapor every few seconds and display a stunning variety of colors (mostly pastels). A Palatine's celestial form has a pale white aura. Choir Attunement Janus wants his Palatinates to be ready to move at a moment's notice, so he grants them the ability to assume celestial form without a Will roll (they must still spend Essence). ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:45:56 EDT From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Billions and billions of souls... In a message dated 8/17/00 11:10:12 AM Central Daylight Time, j_hart@hotmail.com writes: << Ever wondered what would happen if there were only a fixed number of potential human souls that could _ever_ exist. What if the Well of Souls began to run dry? >> I read a short story where that happened. Elderly people were dying for no apparant reason. No one noticed until someone pointed out that a definite cut-off age was appearing. Like no-one past the age of 70 was alive. And the cut-off age was dropping rapidly. They finally figured out that people were dying in order to be reincarnated. They tried instituting birth controls, but it didn't work, because China was cheating to try and get the population of the world to themselves. So we nuked them. :) Totally off-topic I know, but a cool idea for a seriously non-canon storyline. Reverend Brian A. Rogers ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 21:30:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands > Subject: Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands. > > - --- ben wrote: > > go ahead and get the creative juices > > churning and > > give our favorite Archangel of the Wind his very > own minor choir. > OK, here's mine. I bring you Janus' Merry Pranksters, opposed by Valefor's Randomizers, and both may be found at http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/servitors.html Incidentally, (and unrelatedly) I've also added Princely opinions about my Heretic AA Vapula. You can find that at: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/heretics.html Fair warning: the obvious objection that will pop into your head isn't actually germaine. :) Moe (Ben, I'll email the Choir and band over to you. Just not this second). ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 8/7/00 (this is a guess) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 02:17:58 EDT From: Zeresh43@gateway.net Subject: Re: IN> The College of Saints, a Collective Superior - Patron Saints (quasi-Word-bound Saints), posted 5/24/2000, by Jo >Hart. How does this work? >CHANCE TO SUMMON: 4 >SUMMONING MODIFIERS: >+1: A calendar of saints >+1: A medal for the Saint you are summoning >+2: A hagiography (saintly biography) for the Saint you are summoning >+1: A place of worship suitable for the Saint you are summoning >+2: A place of worship dedicated to the Saint you are summoning >+1: A non-place-of-worship dedicated to the Saint (e.g. "St. Joseph >Hospital") >+3: (!) A relic of the Saint you are summoning. ("Hey, that's my toe >bone!") It seems like this is a bit too hard, since there are a lot of Saints (well, compared to the fact that there's only one of each Superior). In my opinion, this should be a tad bit easier to do. Otherwise, it's very, very nifty. Clear Skies Zach "I know who you are! You're the Dee Eee Vee Eee um...Eye El." - --Delerium of the Endless "Don't drink the sludge at the bottom of your coffee cup. Don't drink the cup either. Just the coffee." - --Destruction of the Endless ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 23:10:37 +1200 (NZST) From: Keith Bolland Subject: Re: IN> Contest: Minor Choirs and Bands Here's my contribution. Interestingly, I note both so far have had resonances related to chance. Maybe I'm underinformed on Janus. *shrug* Anyway: HALAIIM[1] The Changers I studied the door in front of us with a scowl. Somewhere behind that foot and a half of metal lurked a Soldier of God in serious trouble, and his captors: a group of demons, mostly Djinn, who'd been poking around in all the wrong places and fallen on the Soldier and his escort, one of my brother Malakim. When my brother popped up in Heaven sans Vessel - damned Calabim - the boss immediately sent us hightailing down there to track down the Soldier and get him out of there before the demons had time to put some of their ideas into practice. The guy beside me rubbed a speck of dirt out of his eye and put his hand to the door. Now, if it had been my call, I wouldn't have brought this freak along - Janus is a nice guy, and all, but his Servitors are all so blastedly... Ofanite, even the ones that aren't! However, the boss said he had "special capabilities", and you don't argue with the Archangel of War. Well, not more than once, anyway. "Can you open it or not?" I snapped. "Does the wind howl through the crags atop Everest?" he answered, without looking at me. Oh, great. I HATE poets. "'Yes' would have done." "Ssh." He blinked twice, concentrated for a second, then stepped back and regarded the door. "I thought you said you could open it," I snapped, waving my brother with the heavy demo gear forward. "Not exactly 'open'," he murmured, and lo and behold if the door didn't turn, before my very eyes, into a... pile of Bibles? I swallowed. "Stylish." "Evangelism has come calling," he said with a weird little demented giggle. I TOLD you all servitors of Janus are annoyingly Ofanite. "You've got thirty minutes for the extraction before that door reappears. I'll wait here." "You got it," I said, hefting my gun and waving the troops forward. Some days I'm glad to be a member of a nice, simple Choir, in service to a nice, simple Word. Changers... yeesh! From time to time, as the whirling mass of Forces that constitutes Janus, Archangel of the Wind, courses across the celestial sky, an unfortunate reliever passing nearby will be sucked into the maelstrom. While most such are eventually expelled from the Storm without any damage other than a few bruises, occasionally something of a more important magnitude occurs. In rare cases, the celestial will emerge from the whirlwind of Janus' Forces with one of them attached, no longer a reliever but a fledged Angel. Such are the Halaiim. All Halaiim serve Janus. Because one of their Forces was, for a time, part of the Archangel of the Wind, they are ferociously loyal to that Word. It is not that they will not serve others... it is that they cannot - their minds cannot encompass the possibility, any more than Janus might suddenly take service under Jean. On a similar principle, the Halaiim share a connection with Janus through their Wind Force. In addition to making Janus easier to summon (see below), it allows Janus to know the location - and status - of any Halaiim, simply by directing a fragment of his attention to the task. This is both good and bad... Janus may show up to save your celestial ass if you get into a fight you can't handle, but it also means he will watch your dissonance like a hawk (see below, again). The Halaiim are not a populous choir - nobody except Janus knows whether they are even deliberately created, or arise as a result of pure chance, and Janus is not talking. In all, there are probably no more than a couple of hundred Halaiim in heaven. RESONANCE The resonance of the Halaiim is for change; they are the drivers of Symphonic dynamism, the prototypical shaker-uppers. With concentration, they can tweak the Symphony into new patterns about an object. This resonance cannot accomplish substantial change, nor can it change living into nonliving (or vice versa)... but Halaiim make GREAT beauty parlour staff, if they can be persuaded to stop fiddling with the results in search of "perfection". DISSONANCE It is dissonant for Halaiim to act as forces of detrimental change. If they knowingly change something which harms a mortal, they will be stung with a note of dissonance, and Janus' extreme displeasure. If they are unknowingly dissonant, the note does not sound... but if they later become aware of their detrimental actions, it will sound, and will only go away once the Halaiite rectifies the situation. Additionally, it is dissonant for a Halaiite to pass a day WITHOUT acting as a force for change. Once per day, they must change something to the betterment of the mortals around them, or sound a note of dissonance. However, if they can genuinely find nothing to change that will not be harmful, they are let off the hook. [Note to GMs: Make sure your Halaiite is aware of the difference between not finding and not looking, because their dissonance certainly is.] Janus is very, very short with dissonant Halaiim. If a Halaiite accumulates more than one note of dissonance, they can expect, within the month, to have to explain why to the Big Guy himself, and he's not exactly known for his patience. If a Halaiite manages to actually go Outcast, by whatever stroke of bad luck, Janus will -not- pursue him personally. Instead, he will simply refer to Dominic the exact location of the unfortunate Tripped, and provide whichever triad is assigned to deal with the case real-time updates on the position of the fleeing Outcast. Oddly, there are no Fallen Halaiim. MANNER AND APPEARANCE On the Corporeal Plane, Halaiite Vessels can look like ANYTHING. Variety is good, consistency is boring. Many Halaiim have two or three vessels, and switch between them on a daily or weekly basis. This doesn't contribute well to their holding down Roles, however - neither does their fluctuating manner, deadly serious one minute and giggling insanely the next. However, there is one key fact that can alert an experienced observer to a Halaiite: every sunrise, something about them changes. Maybe the vessel had brown eyes and now they're blue, or maybe that earring in the right earlobe just turned into a stud in the left, or maybe their nails grew an inch... little, minor things, side-effects of the aura of flux that surrounds Halaiim. [Note to GMs: As a general rule, these changes should not be of a magnitude enough to inconvenience the Halaiite; let the player make them up, if they want to. One proviso: these changes NEVER provide a directly beneficial effect; long nails are not claws, etc.] These changes do not accumulate: if a Halaiite's vessel has brown eyes and wears a ring on their ring-finger, should the ring vanish at sunrise as part of the flux, it will be back at the next sunrise when the Halaiite's eyes turn green. Though a Halaiite sees nothing wrong with these changes, if necessary, they can be suppressed. The Halaiite simply spends of a point of Essence - which does NOT cause a symphonic disturbance (neither, for that matter, do the changes themselves) - and the Halaiite's vessel will return to its "default" state until the next sunrise. In celestial form, Halaiim resemble divine windstroms, wreathed in an aura of oscillating, fluctuating multicoloured sparks. GAME MECHANICS With a successful resonance roll, Halaiim can envelop an object the size of a thick book that they are within three feet of, or proportionately closer for larger objects, within their everpresent aura of flux. The check digit of their roll determines to what degree they may affect the contents of their field: HALAIIM CHECK DIGIT RESULTS 1 - A single, very minor change, like turning a brown rug beige. 2 - Two such minor changes, or a more significant change, like turning the rug green. 3 - Up to the Halaiite's Forces in minor changes, or two significant changes. 4 - Four significant changes, or a major change, like changing the rug from an oblong shape to an oval. 5 - Six significant changes, or two major changes. 6 - A substantial change, like turning the rug into a pile of balls of yarn, three major changes, or up to the Halaiite's Forces in significant changes. The default duration on uses of this resonance is ten minutes for each of the angel's Celestial forces, or until it is consciously cancelled. However, a Halaiite's changes can be made permanent. This requires a second resonance roll, which must achieve a HIGHER check digit than the initial roll. If the roll is successful but the check digit is insufficient, there is no effect. However, if the roll is failed, a Symphonic disturbance equal to the Halaiite's Celestial Forces sounds. Halaiim can use this attunement on living things, but it's not very nice, and only entities with lower forces than the Halaiite's may be so targeted. Note that anything involving the mutilation of the body of the target will (a) require the Halaiite to be touching them, and (b) count as a substantial change, requiring a check digit of 6, and being unable to be made permanent. [Note: Don't overly sweat the laws of physics when it comes to the use of this resonance. Within reason, imbalances in mass, etc, will balance out across the Symphony. Note also that only a Halaiite which has somehow obtained supernatural speed enhancements will be fast enough to use their resonance on a bullet.] Many Halaiim know one or more Songs of Form, but it is not a requirement. Additionally, a Halaiite that somehow manages to be in service to a Superior other than Janus can invoke Janus without the usual -10 penalty. CHOIR ATTUNEMENT Halaiim (Restricted) Janus grants all his Changers the ability to exert their resonance upon something less tangible than its usual targets: the weather. Specifically, the wind. With a successful resonance roll, a Halaiite of the Wind can summon breezes proportionate to the check digit - a mere whisper on a 1, while a 6 drives forth a gale. The duration is unchanged, but weather-working cannot be made permanent. Note that this can be used as a way to invoke Janus' 80mph winds Rite, if the angel has adequate Forces. [1] STRICTLY a working title, because I Don't Know Any Hebrew(tm). If anybody has any suggestions for a better name - no, nothing in the collection of names linked from the SJG page grabbed me - feel free to let me know. //-- <*> Keith Bolland --------------------------------------- // "Life isn't fair. But the root password helps." -- The BOFH ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1786 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.