From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Aug 25 15:02:12 2000 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA03302 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2000 15:02:08 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id PAA07885 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 2000 15:00:49 -0500 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 15:00:49 -0500 Message-Id: <200008252000.PAA07885@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1792 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, August 25 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1792 In this digest: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare Re: IN> Contest II: [David]'s Minor Choirs. Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare IN> Minor Choir Contest II Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare Re: IN> Arthurian stuff question RE: IN> Re: Minor Choir contest II RE: IN> Re: Minor Choir contest II Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Re: IN> Fate before the Fall Re: IN> Janus/Valefor Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities Re: IN> Janus/Valefor Re: IN> Superiors 3 trouble with availability Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare Re: IN> Janus/Valefor ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 16:40:14 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare >Interesting. It raises a few thoughts. Danke. >Belial destroyed Demogorgan for growing too powerful. Belial hates Furfur >for growing too powerful. Why isn't Belial smacking Pyrius around, since >it's clear that Pyrius lost favor (and thus power) in the 50's? Or is he? Well Demogorgon was a Demon of Destruction in my opinion and thus had the potential to gain considerable power in his own right through methods that had nothing to do with Heat, Fire, or otherwise Pyrotechnics. The same with Fufur. Also the fact remains I don't believe either are personally very loyal.... Going out on a limb here I imagine Belial viewed the Nuclear Holocost word as enough under him that he was gaining from Pyrius's strength enough that he was no danger....however he certainly might (and theres a might) have interacted should he have been named Prince...I'm not sure. Your thoughts.... (It seems he would lose greatly some of his appeal as a smart Calabite if he was a servitor of Baal personally so I think I'll risk it) >Canonically, you can't have higher than a twelve in any stat. Furfur did in >Night Music, but that was a booboo. If you want him to be smart, lower him >to 12/12 and give him some sort of special attunement that gives him a bonus >to the check digit of intelligence rolls. > Olfalim Canonically I still think this is up in the air with Superiors having way higher stats and even word bound however what you said certainly makes sense. >... >Yeah. >... >(The Vomiters) >... OKAY I'M A BAD SPELLER..... :-) Cute though. Also makes sense given he's a Radiation Demon (among other things) >This is probably a suitable attunement for Belial to give. It burns. It's >uncompromising. Thank you. - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 16:40:28 -0400 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare >Calabite. I stand corrected. >He's a Calabite, and serves Belial. No can do on the Bal of Mal attunement >And you don't mention his word forces (not that everyone does for word >bounded, but that seems important for someone who was near-prince). Again corrected on the Calabite of Belial. Though in my game I allow Demons who do great services for other Princes to be allowed to recieve Band attunements instead of just Servitor, this is probably just my choice however and it's easily enough deleted if it's against In Nomine canon. As for the Word Forces of Pyrius.... I believe that Pyrius during the Cold War's height during the Fifties had a 18-20 Word Forces and was working to assmiliate Nuclear arms across the planet to make himself 21 and thus a Full Superior (this would have made Nuclear war fears a part of day to day life..post Apcolypse Earth would probably make him a 25 and a Major Prince). Currently I imagine Pyrius's Word hovers around 16 with Nuclear Holocost covering a few more words/fears/concepts than Nuclear Warheads (a Important Word)....during the whole India/Pakistan crisis I believe his word Forces surged to 18 briefly but he was unable to sustain concerns about it. (odd I researched this so much). >If I recall correctly, this is supposed to be the same as the number of >forces is the discord's realm. I forget is Wrath is Ethereal or Celestial >(probably etheric), but that needs to be a 5 or 6 for Pyrius. I stand corrected and he has a 6 Wrathful discord which roughly means he never forgets a slight against him and if you've ever crossed him, he will someday make you die in agony. Needless to say my only belief is that his ability to lie about good cheer and intelligence about whose useful has kept him from being smacked down by many enemy. >I'm missing the reasoning here. Indifference? unfair punishment? >Why did Pyrius fall? I wanted a certain air of mystery about a OFANIM (sorry there Ben-who'd think someone would take the time to nit pick through a post's spelling) who never visited humanity and was concerned with more abstract mathmatics/etc. However if I were as a mortal to guess I think it was the sudden feeling that humanity had turned his Word to mass murder of innocents. The two explosians acting as gigantic disturbances in the Symphony to him which more or less drove him off his rocker...ala Gabriel/Belial except alittle more pronounced and rapid.... I think his hatred for humanity is because they used something inherently incorruptible and beutiful as a weapon of war...so he's going to give it to them in spades (it's rather hypocritical but he's brassed off) >Eh. Yield is so dependant on usage (air vs ground blasts). And I assume >you mean of the nuclear mass contained within an object (bomb, missle, etc, >rather than the chunk of nuclear material); if you;ve got an >object at critical mass, its a little late to be estimating much of >anything. And the destructive power of a weapon containing less than the >critical mass of a material is simply through nuclear radiation and decay, >no destructive blast. GMs should remember that. >What about fussion weapons? Understood about that....however I wanted to be clear that this attunement provides an inherent understanding of nuclear physics, decay, unranium, and devices mixing with the surounding area. Basically a Calabite who puts his hands on a H-Bomb will say "This will blow up reaaaaaal good." As for Fusion weaponry, Pyrius views them as something that really needs to be nipped in the bud. While technically them being used as weapons would support his word, it's far too clean and reminds him too much of his time as a shining Ofanim of Gabrielle....with the awesome power of the Sun... To be inherently comfortable with. After all he's only been a demon for 40 years and he's not quite into his role yet. >Willpower? Unresisted after expending three essence? Uhm. Even divine >judgement is limited and only does 7/rnd. And that costs 7, although it is >ranged. Half will or Celestial in damage for check digit rounds, allowing >essence expenditures to increase the time, IMO. Well the fact remains this ability has no affect whatsoever on Celestails and cannot be used in Celestial form because such concerns do not affect spirits. This is an entirely corporal power that cannot soul kill a celestial....why I made the damage so high. If I were to allow it in celestial form I'd definately make it, the fact it only affects Vessels is because I don't believe Pyrius has quite yet mastered the Unholy Nuclear Warhead yet....and if he does Heaven will lay the smack down....or Belial. (Before Belial tosses it at Gaby's volcano or some such) >Should roll what? 1d6? 3d6/d666? 1d6. - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 18:17:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Contest II: [David]'s Minor Choirs. - --- ben wrote: > > If someone comes up with a "relievers of Stone" option > > that they name "Rockettes," I'm going to throw something... > > The Rockies? > > The Stoners? > > Pebbles? > > Bambam? (Only if you bambam first...) Whatever you call them, I'm sure that Relievers of Stone would be chips off the old block... ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 18:23:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities - --- Samovar3@aol.com wrote: > By the books, a Superior is supposed to have access to all the > resonances on its side. However, should a Superior really have the > ability to use the resonance of a minor choir or band that is wholly > under another Superior's control? > > I'm leaning against it myself, mostly on the principle that a > Superior that has virtually no contact with the choir and cannot > create it, should not be able to use that choir's resonance. Also on > this principle, I wouldn't let any Superior other than Lilith use the > lilim resonance. They can't create one, so why should they be able > to use it? I'd continue this by not allowing Yves' distinction > (don't remember the name of it right now, but it's the one that > allows an angel to use another choir's resonance) or Kronos' > balseraph attunement to grant the bright lilim resonance. After all, > if it could, there would be no Lilith monopoly on lilim in Hell. > Kronos could just make "bal-lilim" instead. I wholly agree on all points. I would even say that no Superior can grant an Attunement or Distinction that duplicates the Resonance of any Choir or Band that said Superior can't create. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:32:04 -0600 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities > I wholly agree on all points. I would even say that no Superior can >grant an Attunement or Distinction that duplicates the Resonance of any >Choir or Band that said Superior can't create. > This leads to the possibility of Kronos creating angels. Which isn't exactly against canon statements about him, afterall a demon with Forces donated directly from him can 'cloak' in heaven (exact rules I don't remember, my books are still comming out here to Colorado). Having a Prince capable of making angels can lead to some pretty tricky things. Like does he have choir attunements? And also does he create angels for infiltration into Heaven. Just some possibilities. Timothy, Angel of Rambling Ofanite of Creation ArchRival of Mathus ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 22:19:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare On Thu, 24 Aug 2000, Charles Phipps wrote: > Nuclear Holocost Holocaust. > > OKAY I'M A BAD SPELLER..... > > :-) No prob. > >Canonically, you can't have higher than a twelve in any stat. Furfur did > >in Night Music, but that was a booboo. > > Canonically I still think this is up in the air with Superiors having way > higher stats and even word bound however what you said certainly makes > sense. No, canonically it is not up in the air at all. It is a stated fact that NO non-Superior celestial can have an attribute higher than 12 (with the exception of those with Khalid's attunements). Period. Now, if you want to have it in YOUR game, that's cool. But the canon on it has been firmly established. BTW, I liked it. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian, Q4B4L! Meow! "There he goes - one of God's own prototypes. A high powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production... too weird to live, too rare to die." -- Hunter Thompson, "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 20:50:42 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare "Rev. Pee Kitty" wrote: > No, canonically it is not up in the air at all. It is a stated fact that > NO non-Superior celestial can have an attribute higher than 12 (with the > exception of those with Khalid's attunements). Period. > > Now, if you want to have it in YOUR game, that's cool. But the canon on it > has been firmly established. Well, there's nothing precluding some future Superior or Attunement or other effect allowing another exception similar to Khalid's. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:11:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: IN> Minor Choir Contest II Here they are: my entry David's Minor Choir. It's about time I got my rocks off... Turelim "The Rocks of God" Of all the minor Choirs, none are as stalwart as the Turelim. They partake of the Archangel David's strength and the steadfastness of his Word. David claims that he did not create the first Turelim, but that they strode fully-formed into Heaven the day that Masada became a Tether to Stone. Whatever their origin, the Rocks see themselves as Heaven's last line of defense if the demons ever get up the nerve to storm Heaven. Resonance Turelim Resonate with strength in the broadest sense of the word. They can tell at a glance what sort of opponent someone would be. The amount of information gained is based on the CD of a successful Resonance roll; consult the chart below (each result includes the information gained at lesser CD's). Turelim Check Digit Results 1: You know the subject's preferred mode of conflict (hand-to-hand combat, economic sanction, verbal sparring, etc.) and how good he is at it in relation to you (as in better, about equal, not as good); 2: You know the subject's overall power level (in terms of number of Forces, Attunements and Songs) relative to you; 3: You know the area in which the subject has the most Forces and which of those two Attributes is higher; 4: You know the area in which the subject has the least Forces and which Attribute is lower; 5: You know the subject's most potent defense; 6: You know one of the subject's specific vulnerabilities (a Discord/Disadvantage, supernatural prohibition, tactical blind spot, etc.). Dissonance As defenders, Turelim suffer doubly from David's prohibition against attacking first; they get two notes of Dissonance instead of one. It is also Dissonant for Rocks to use any weapon -- other than their bare hands -- that isn't mineral-based (i.e. stone or metal). They can kick someone without taking their shoes off, but hitting someone with a chair is asking for Dissonance. Too much of that and a Turelite becomes a Fravashi. Manner and Appearance Turelim are strong, but not silent. They are as loyal as Cherubim and stoic as Malakim (both of which they get along with quite well), but they can be as vocal as Kyriotates when it comes to their love for God. In the Gospels, Christ said that the rocks would cry out if men failed to praise God. The Turelim have claimed this Scripture as a reference to themselves. Turelim always have muscular Vessels and usually see themselves as masculine. However, there is a Society of Turelim called Caryatids who always wear Vessels in the form of slim athletic women. Rocks prefer no-nonsense clothing that is good for doing physical labor in -- a Turelite in a business suit is as uncomfortable as an Ofanite in a straightjacket. A Turelite's celestial form looks like an animated statue with no mouth or nostrils. Most are thick and blocky and look like granite or quartz. Caryatids are more graceful and appear to be made of marble. Turelim appreciate the loud reverberation of heavy horns -- shofars, conch shells and alpenhorns all reflect the Rocks' musical identity. Choir Attunement David wants his Turelim to be defenders, not killers. A Turelite adds his Celestial Forces to the CD of a successful roll when using Fighting or a weapon skill if he is trying to subdue his opponent. Any damage beyond what is needed to render the target unconscious dissipates harmlessly into the Symphony. Also, Turelim don't disturb the Symphony when subduing mortals. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:14:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities - --- Tim Groth wrote: > This leads to the possibility of Kronos creating angels. OK, I deserved that for the carelessly worded statement. Mea culpa. Actually, Kronos is the only place where that logic breaks down. The only explanation that springs to mind involves Kronos' status as an incarnate piece of the Symphony. Of course, this raises the question of whether or not Yves -- a similar being -- could give an angel a demonic Resonance (not that he would if he could). ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:16:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare > On Thu, 24 Aug 2000, Charles Phipps wrote: > > > Nuclear Holocost > > Holocaust. > > > > > OKAY I'M A BAD SPELLER..... Wow -- you never know who gets afflicted with that Discord! };> ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "If all the world's a stage, where does the audience sit?" __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 20:58:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> Arthurian stuff question Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 10:36:42 EDTFrom: MarkDEddy@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Arthurian stuff question >I haven't seen anything like that. The only Arthurian >In Nomine thing I can remember is Excaliber showing >up in L. Rel., and the annoying text surrounding >it. _That's_ what I was thinking of. Thanks. :) Morgan (FA ...Wait a second, that means that there is a distressing lack of Arthuriania in IN. Can't have that. :) Morgan (FAW, NOT FAY, thankyouverymuch) Kyriotate of Destiny Petitioner for the Word of No, I Left Out Excalibur Deliberately. Gotta Have A Quest, After All. King Arthur Ethereal Personification of Chivalry and Monstrous Headache to Laurence Corporeal Forces: 4 Strength: 8 Agility: 8 Ethereal Forces: 4 Intelligence: 9 Precision: 7 Celestial Forces: 5 Will: 10 Perception: 10 Vessel: older male human/3, +2 Charisma Skills: Detect Lies/2, Dodge/4, Emote/3, Fighting/4, Knowledge (Arthurian Myths/6, Administration/3), Languages (Latin/3, Gaelic/3), Large Weapon/5 (Longsword), Move Silently/2, Savoir-Faire/5, Small Weapon/3 (Dagger), Tactics/5 Songs: Dreams (Celestial/2), Healing (All/1), Light (Celestial/2), Projection (Ethereal/2), Shields (All/3) This is the Arthur of dreams, not the Arthur of history (whomever that might have been): resolute, chivalric, honorable, just ... and pious. This has made him a major headache. The Matter of Britain has inspired artists and writers for most of the last millenium, and as the legends crew, so did the spirit. He's not, strictly speaking, an ethereal god, as nobody provides him with Essence through worship (and Arthur would react badly to anyone who tried), but he is in no danger of fading away. Thomas Mallory and T. H. White have seen to that. He has become a representation of the Ideal Ruler in Western literature and mythology, and that belief is strong enough to ensure his existence without Arthur ever having to bother visiting the corporeal plane. But he still manifests on Earth constantly, in flagrant violation of the ban on ethereals. Why does he do this, when he doesn't have to? It's very simple. He's King Arthur. True, there are no more dragons or giants on Earth (and Arthur is not pleased that Uriel destroyed them all, centuries before he had the chance to slay at least _one_), but there are still many evils out there. Tyrants, sorcerers, injustice, and of course, demons. Demons of all sorts and sizes, tormenting and tempting good folk: why, one even tried to tempt Arthur himself with power, in exchange for an alliance with Satan. No doubt that the return of the emissary (well, parts of the emissary) was a sufficient reply. They've certainly tried their best to just kill him since then. And the angels aren't much better, it seems, although King Arthur suspects that most of his fellow ethereals are more than a little craven. He's dealt with more than one of these Malakim in his day: certainly, they may start off by screaming and waving flaming swords around, but usually they calm down fairly quickly. It's all a matter of making firm eye contact. Staying true to the example of Christ helps too, of course, but that's true in all situations. Still, some of these angels can be an annoyance to an entity doing his best to keep honor and chivalry alive in an imperfect world. It's getting to the point where Arthur is ready to have a talk with this Laurence, and find out exactly why a good Christian knight is constantly being interrupted while doing God's work... The Archangel of the Sword is in a real bind about this particular ethereal: it's bad enough that Arthur radiates honor like a torch, but there's almost no difference between his ideals and those expressed by the Sword. In fact, the legend of Arthur was used as a method to spread the Sword's ideals. Normally, divine religions don't create ethereal spirits, but apparently nobody told Arthur that. What makes it worse, of course, is that Arthur is a devout Christian: Laurence doesn't even want to _contemplate_ the dishonor that would arise from utterly destroying a co-religionist, simply because of existing policy. But, if ethereals can choose to unreservedly serve the Creator, is the ban on Earth really justified? That's a can of worms nobody wants to open. Most of the Host, except for Servitors of Stone and the occasional Triad, handle the problem by ignoring it. No Superior's actually gotten around to declaring Arthur evil, which gives the Malakim (and the more rigid organizations) a convenient out, and certain Archangels have even pushed to have Arthur declared a loa. David's Servitors, however, are expected to provide "discouragement": the Archangel of Stone doesn't like the precedent being set here. Luckily, Arthur knows that they can't start fights, so they aren't usually too much of a problem. Besides, once demons show up, such nonsense goes out the window. All in all, Arthur's not a bad entity to know. He's more tolerant than you would think, despite his distressing tendency to refer to all non-Catholics as "paynim". Fighting the forces of Hell gives one an excellent yardstick to judge good and evil, and he's pretty good-natured to begin with. Not to mention eminently trustworthy, honorable, chivalrous and fundamentally decent. Arthur doesn't fight all his battles on his own, of course (not even bringing up his Knights of the Round Table, which is a whole other issue). There are other ethereal spirits out there who aren't pretending to be pagan gods, and Arthur tends to work with the ones who are also dedicated to helping humanity. This sort of thing does get noticed. For example, it's rumored that he and Uncle Sam are the only ethereal spirits who have ever been invited for drinks at the Eighth Virtue... ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 8/7/00 (this is a guess) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 21:42:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Maurice Lane Subject: RE: IN> Re: Minor Choir contest II Well, it's Friday, so you can find my entry (the Cetherim, a Minor Choir of David's that he just can't seem to shake) at the Servitors page on the website below. Please note that I have refrained from the most obvious puns, but there is one there. :) Hope you all enjoy. Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Everything else (not that there is, right now): http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/main.html Last updated 8/7/00 (this is a guess) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2000 10:40:58 +1200 (NZST) From: Keith Bolland Subject: RE: IN> Re: Minor Choir contest II Not very inspired, this week (when it's IN vs. term paper, term paper wins) but here's my offering: MEBUNNAIM The Builders Bucharest, 1989. Pleasure. This city is such a cesspool of weak emotions for one such as myself to smile upon as I do God's work by winnowing out those unworthy of Heaven's light. Surprise. A group of people are moving down the street towards me. There is One at the head of them... One who points at me and bids them attack. Wrath. They will learn more appropriate behaviour. EMPTINESS. It takes... then the One cries out to them, and they rouse themselves and charge. Nervousness! Fear! Flight! They catch me. I am slain. Annoyance. Inconvenience. Vexation to all angels of Stone. RESONANCE The resonance of the Builders is for unity. By example, or with a stirring speech (usually of the "we must all hang together, or we shall all hang seperately" variety), they can cause groups of people to set aside animosity and grudges and make common cause - usually against an external (read: Infernal) enemy. However, the unity provoked by a Mebunnaite is limited: it can only be invoked for what Builders usually describe as a Purpose, a single goal that requires group effort to accomplish. DISSONANCE As constructive forces in the Symphony, it is dissonant for a Builder to destroy the work of human - or, Divine help them, angelic - hands. It is ALSO dissonant if a mob the Builder has used their resonance on, but which escapes their control, winds up wreaking destruction. Note that this does not include humans, but most Mebunnaim have moral qualms over killing a human who isn't already firmly on the path to their Fate. If the Mebunnaite can repair the destruction, their dissonance will go away. However, if a mob slips the Builder's control, this could be a tough proposition. MANNER AND APPEARANCE Corporeally, Mebunnaim usually appear as whatever necessary to blend into their chosen target group; however, their vessels will invariably have at least one level of Charisma and usually more. GAME MECHANICS To use their resonance, a Mebunnaite must be within sight and hearing (mechanical aids are fine) of a group of people that can similiarly see and hear - and are watching and listening to, more importantly! - the Mebunnaite. The Builder must speak to the people, outlining the need for unity, and, more importantly, the Purpose - the reason WHY they want the group to unify. This is important: if the Purpose is too vague, or too unattainable, the resonance will fall flat. Generally, a Purpose has to be something that could be obtained, or at least have progress made towards it, within a day. Purposes that will take longer than that can be designated, but the Mebunnaite will have to give the group a 'refresher' resonance invocation -every day- to keep them going. So much as one failure will see people drift away into the rhythm of their normal lives. A successful resonance roll can cause a number of people equal to the check digit times five who are both watching and listening to the Mebunnaite (if there are more people than that in the vicinity, the closest such, although the Mebunnaite can "exclude" a person who would normally be affected from the resonance's effects) will put aside their differences and work in harmony towards the named Purpose for a day. A FAILED resonance roll will lead to people equal to three times the check digit of the failed roll (from the fringes of the crowd, if it's a big one) drifting off back to their daily lives, ignoring the Mebunnaite, etc., along with all the usual consequences. This resonance does not work on celestials, and a cunning Mebunnaite can spot a demon by watching for the one whose attitudes haven't changed. SPECIFIC SUPERIORS Mebunnaim are so generally useful at rallying mortals that many Superiors seek after them. Generally, most serve one of five Superiors: Gabriel, Laurence, Michael, Yves, or David himself. Gabriel and David have by far the largest clusters of Mebunnaim: David has taught Gabriel how to make her own. Mebunnaite of Stone David's Builders are attuned to minerals in a refined form: steel, plastics, bricks, anything that has been worked from the raw by human or celestial hands. By concentrating, they can detect the weak spots in any refined item, which includes ways to destroy it (watch out for dissonance!) or render it useless. Mebunnaite of Fire (restricted) Mebunnaim serving Gabriel are tasked similarly to her Seraphim: they hunt those who are too arrogant or self-absorbed to realise that their actions cause pain to others. Builders of Fire have had a hand in many a revolution that has brought a tin-pot tyrant low. Optional: If you believe in Gabriel's attunements actually -doing- something, Builders of Fire can also use their resonance to control, in a limited sense, any wildfire. This control only extends as far as "Instead of where I am standing, go that way" and cannot be used to put a fire out. Diverting a brushfire around a town would take many resonance rolls. The other Superiors have no attunements for their Mebunnaim, but Gabriel makes hers available to Builders in the service of War and Creation. Mebunnaim of the Sword are out of luck. //-- <*> Keith Bolland --------------------------------------- // "Life isn't fair. But the root password helps." -- The BOFH ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 09:40:48 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Domini Canes -- A Minor Dominican Choir Thanks for the feedback on the Dogs. I apologize for not responding, but I was away on vacation. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 11:33:00 -0400 From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" Subject: Re: IN> Fate before the Fall Jeremy M. Smith wrote: > > I understand that souls that complete their fates without > completing their destinies go to Hell. My question is why? > What is it about Hell that makes it a fate magnet? Where did > souls that had achieved their fate go BEFORE The Fall, or did > fate not exist then? These questions are not all that important to > my campaign, but I'm curious and my PCs may ask at some point. Here's what I used in my own game. In orthodox Christian theology, Hell is defined as the absence of God -- the idea goes that everyone to a greater or lesser degree feels the presence of God in the universe. (This is the function usually ascribed to the Holy Spirit part of the Trinity, and is often held to be responsible for the moral impulse.) Anyway, when someone turns against God, he withdraws His presence from them. This is damnation, since by definition God contains/empowers/whatever all that good. So, the souls of the damned are souls that can no longer feel the presence of God. The fires of Hell are held to be a metaphor for the torment that a damned soul (or fallen angel) feels. This is cool enough, but kind of hard to make gameable. So next I turned to some stories in the Jewish midrash. One of the legends is that when God created the universe, He didn't quite complete the job -- He deliberately left parts of the universe undone. This was a test for any false god; they would be unable to finish the job and thus be revealed as frauds. Now, we finally circle back to IN. I took the Jewish myth and applied to my game world -- Hell (in IN) is the part of the celestial plane that God didn't finish constructing. It's a gap in the heavens and generally not a fun place. The Lucifer and the fallen angels (that should be a rock group name) fled there after their defeat at the hands of Michael and the Host because it's the one part of the universe where God had removed Himself from. This is the same thing that damned souls did -- after they died their souls fled to Hell. (The demons, of course, had a different story. They agreed with most of this except the part about Hell being deliberate. According to them it indicated a limit to divine power and hence a proof that it was possible to defeat God.) So Hell, as a blank spot in Creation, existed before the Fall. It's just that it was uninhabited back then. It wasn't until Lucifer invented the concept of rebellion against God -- of fate -- that fallen angels and souls began to go there. - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswcasa.com ------------------------------ Date: 25 Aug 2000 18:20:55 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re: IN> Janus/Valefor On Thu, 24 Aug 2000 16:13:19 -0400 Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >Sometime in September -- hopefully;remember the murphy's law of IN >material -- Superiors 4 should e out... This has Valefor in it. Might be >a little long to wait. O:< "long wait"? long wait?! i've been waiting for Superiors 3 since it was advertised--i beg and bother local gaming stores (and NOT SO LOCAL gaming stores) nigh weekly, and the answer is always, "there's no interest" or "it's just been sold out". ARRRGGH! sorry for the rant, all.... -=|horsefly|=- "It was a different time: a time of blood and guns and killings.... It was a time when killers needed saints, for so much of God's good work was being done." --SAINT OF KILLERS #4, Garth Ennis ------------------------------ Date: 25 Aug 2000 18:38:14 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re: IN> Minor choirs/bands and Superior abilities On Thu, 24 Aug 2000 19:14:46 -0700 (PDT) Michael Walton wrote: > >--- Tim Groth wrote: >> This leads to the possibility of Kronos creating angels. > > OK, I deserved that for the carelessly worded statement. Mea culpa. >Actually, Kronos is the only place where that logic breaks down. The >only explanation that springs to mind involves Kronos' status as an >incarnate piece of the Symphony. Of course, this raises the question >of whether or not Yves -- a similar being -- could give an angel a >demonic Resonance (not that he would if he could). forsooth, this leads into whether Yves could grant the Lilim resonance with his Master of Divine Destiny Distinction, and i just don't think that's possible. i don't think Yves can grant demonic resonances because nothing says that he can. granted, omission can later be written in, and perhaps eloquently explain a heretofore unknown ability of the ineffible Word of Destiny, but considering that demonic influences lead a being toward Fate--Yves' anethama--i then agree with you that he wouldn't grant such an ability even if he could. -=|horsefly|=- If I ever wanted to say 'gwrthwynebiad', I'd probably kill myself by choking on my own tongue. =) - --John Karakash ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 18:43:29 GMT From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Janus/Valefor > "long wait"? long wait?! i've been waiting for Superiors 3 since it was >advertised--i beg and bother local gaming stores (and NOT SO LOCAL gaming >stores) nigh weekly, and the answer is always, "there's no interest" or >"it's just been sold out". Uh .. had you thought of ordering a copy from them? All the shops I've known would do that for you. jo ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: 25 Aug 2000 19:40:03 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re: IN> Superiors 3 trouble with availability On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 18:43:29 GMT Jo Hart wrote: > >> "long wait"? long wait?! i've been waiting for Superiors 3 since it was >>advertised--i beg and bother local gaming stores (and NOT SO LOCAL gaming >>stores) nigh weekly, and the answer is always, "there's no interest" or >>"it's just been sold out". >Uh .. had you thought of ordering a copy from them? All the shops I've known >would do that for you. yes, i've tried repeatedly, thank-you. one shop's computers are down and they cannot order new books (their supply of new stuff continues to dwindle on their shelves). another shop refuses outright to do special orders at this time (and has since it was purchased by another store a year ago). a third store requires a downpayment of ten dollars which then goes toward paying for the book when it arrives, but since i'm so often short of cash, that's not an option. in all, it will be a wonder if i see more of that book than what's been printed on the web. -=|horsefly|=- Happiness is a laser designator and a friend in the artillery battalion. --Clayton A. Oliver ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 16:12:40 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Dr. Strangelove's worst nightmare At 10:19 PM -0400 8/24/00, Rev. Pee Kitty wrote: >On Thu, 24 Aug 2000, Charles Phipps wrote: > >> Canonically I still think this is up in the air with Superiors having way >> higher stats and even word bound however what you said certainly makes >> sense. > >No, canonically it is not up in the air at all. It is a stated fact that >NO non-Superior celestial can have an attribute higher than 12 (with the >exception of those with Khalid's attunements). Period. What Pee Kitty said. In spades. >Now, if you want to have it in YOUR game, that's cool. But the canon on it >has been firmly established. What Pee Kitty said again. In spades. There are characters published with higher stats. They are all errata'ed, OR SHOULD BE. If anyone finds such a character which is not errata'ed, please send that errata in to the errata coordinator. (The errata page allows entering the data on the web. www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/errata .) - --Beth, typing w/a baby (iolanthe) on her chest. Vapitalizatoin & spelling difficult, typing w/1 hand & supporting baby w/other. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2000 16:15:55 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Janus/Valefor At 6:20 PM +0000 8/25/00, -=|horsefly|=- wrote: >i've been waiting for Superiors 3 since it was advertised--i beg and >bother local gaming stores (and NOT SO LOCAL gaming stores) nigh weekly, [...] Won't they special-order it for you, and then stick it under the front desk with your name on it so you can come in and pay for it? If they won't, tell them that www.warehouse23.com does a nice business and delivers it to the doorstep. O:p - --Beth, typing w/a baby (iolanthe) on her chest. Vapitalizatoin & spelling difficult, typing w/1 hand & supporting baby w/other. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1792 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2000 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.