From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Tue Feb 20 21:07:31 2001 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA24064 for ; Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:07:30 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id VAA29774 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:11:09 -0600 Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:11:09 -0600 Message-Id: <200102210311.VAA29774@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #2070 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Tuesday, February 20 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2070 In this digest: Re: IN> February 16, 2001 (ML) Re: IN> A Week in the Life, Part Two Re: IN> A Week in the Life, Part Two IN> Steve Jessop's page Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals Re: IN> Gabriel, v1.1 IN>About the Queen of Hell Netbook Re: IN> The Heavenly School of Human Languages Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals IN> The Choir Words: Contrarilus Re: IN>About the Queen of Hell Netbook IN> Kingu, Demon Prince of Might and the song of strength IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) IN> Just when you've convinced yourself it's only a Game Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals Re: IN> February 16, 2001 (ML) Re: IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) IN> a question about music Re: IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 03:11:29 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> February 16, 2001 (ML) Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 20:53:39 -0500 From: "Rolland Therrien" Subject: Re: IN> February 16, 2001 (ML) >Hey, nobody ever said all of Hell's forces are all >smart strategists. >There's bound to be a bunch of idiots who think >they've spotted "Heavenly Stupidity", from Calabim >too dumb to look past the "Open Season" thought to >Balseraphs who don't consider Humans smart enough to >tie their shoe-laces together. >Baal and most other Princes and their staffs would >see through that Angelic scheme in a pico-second, of >course. But they'd probably not bother to correct >any Demon stupid enough to actually fall for it. >Down in Hell, they tend to believe in Social >Darwinism. >- -Exit the LoneWolf Bingo. So do I, at least when it comes to demonic PCs who forget the Edelstein Rule*. I don't expect everything I provide here to work in every campaign out there: for example, I'd never try to sneak this past somebody with a military background. Their mental alarms would start screaming at them, just like Chuckg's did, and rightly so. However, every group has a exploitable blind spot. I don't recommend regularly whacking them in it, unless theirs is starting to really p*ss you off, but the occasional flicking of it is a time-honored tradition (and I happened to believe in the _Paranoia_ Rule** with a religious zeal). Here endeth the lesson. :) Moe *"Humans _matter_". **"The GM is playing and gets to have fun, too." ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 11/25/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 07:16:46 -0500 From: Marc Bowden Subject: Re: IN> A Week in the Life, Part Two - --On Tuesday, February 20, 2001 1:09 AM -0600 Prodigal wrote: > Eric, you frighten me... > You're not alone. Marc. Just Marc. Elohite Angel of Salvation ("And for my next impression, Jesse Owens..." *ZIP!*) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 06:02:27 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> A Week in the Life, Part Two Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 02:06:17 +0000 From: Eric Hallstrom Subject: IN> A Week in the Life, Part Two >Well, Moe wants me to make it Weird, so .... >It's _his_ fault. :p My God, what have I done? :) Moe PS Neat follow-through. :) ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 11/25/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:53:28 +0000 From: Sam Kington Subject: IN> Steve Jessop's page Hi, Does anyone know what happened to Steve Jessop's page, previously at Oxford University? It had a really good Kobal on it, and it's gone missing. Sam - -- Home page: http://www.illuminated.co.uk/ INWO Homebrew: http://www.illuminated.co.uk/inwo/ I spilled spot remover on my dog. He's gone now. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 09:59:07 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals Manny Nepomuceno wrote: > My original understanding was that all animals go to Heaven, > regardless. If I recall the main book correctly, it says that animals that attain spiritual awareness go to Jordi's Savannah, and that there are no animals in Hell; the closest to animals in Hell are (formerly?) human souls that have been Force-stripped, in Abaddon, which causes them to "devolve" into animal forms, until they crumble down to 1-Force grubs, burrowing into the floor of Hell to escape final dissolution. Animal souls that don't go to Heaven or Hell might reincarnate. I don't think canon says. I also don't think canon says if souls can go back and forth between animal and human by reincar-nating. > Of course, this *does* have some implications...if a Shedite > possesses an animal and corrupts the animal absolutely (I'm > having a lot of trouble describing what this actually means, > mind you), does the animal somehow go to Hell when it dies? Shedites can't possess animals, in canon. > For that matter, what do servitors of Gluttony use for beef in > Shal-Mari? Hmmmm. (The souls of dead Hellsworn cows? Mooooooo.) Either Force-stripped humans or "Essence constructs" that look like beef. "Essence constructs" are, I presume, what anything is on the celestial plane, that isn't a spirit -- clothes, walls, chairs, dirt, etc. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:13:29 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals Michael Walton wrote: > > Cats: I love my master > > I'm sure that cat lovers would like to think so. But, with > the exception of lions, cats in the wild are not social animals. > Domestic cats are basically in a state of arrested development > wherein they continually experience kittenish dependence on the > one who feeds them. Under those conditions, it's in one's best > interests to be affectionate. That presupposes that an offspring's love for its mother is purely selfish and calculated. I doubt that the very young (humans, let alone cats) have the mental equipment to formualte the idea "I'd better act as if I liked these guys, since they feed me." Observational evidence of small children does not indicate they realize AT ALL how important it is that they stay on Mommy and Daddy's good side. At least, the realization is far from consistent... I'd say that, for the most part, animals and small children live at a level below the one where distinctions like selfish and unselfish can exist. But they (children, anyway, and lots of animals) are perfectly capable of wishing another well, of empathy, of concern for others' welfare -- as in the case of cats, as well as dogs, who seek to cheer up unhappy owners. Also, is all spiritual awareness a matter of social behavior? Humans report profound emotions and intuitions when all alone, e.g. inspired by natural beauty. For all we know, animals might feel this and have no way to report it to anyone. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:44:47 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Gabriel, v1.1 From: "Manny Nepomuceno" > > wrong group...this should be in Tattered methinks... D'oh! Got to remember to keep those address book entries straight... And I'll have to repost it over there, then. > Oh, and okay, this was another Tattered plug. We're doing great stuff there > IMO. :) At the risk of sounding conceited, I think my misfire demonstrated that rather nicely. ;;;) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 08:52:53 -0800 From: edenesque@juno.com Subject: IN>About the Queen of Hell Netbook Hey all! A couple of months ago, Eric Burns (I think), had a great netbook going called "Lilith-Queen of Hell". Whatever happened to that? Does anyone know? ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:35:34 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: Re: IN> The Heavenly School of Human Languages Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 17:40 +0000 (GMT Standard Time) From: jgd@cix.co.uk (John Dallman) Subject: IN> The Heavenly School of Human Languages Cool. A couple of things, though: 1) I'd personally assign "Human Languages" a higher value than 12. It's pretty important. 2) Enochian/6. This is actually a question: precisely what _is_ Enochian? I thought it was some sort of weird esoterica of John Dee's, and not an actual language per se. Any kind of useful, comprehensive website on the subject would be helpful. All in all, nice location concept. :) Moe ===== In Nomine stuff: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 11/25/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:32:37 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals At 9:59 AM -0500 2/20/01, Earl Wajenberg wrote: >Animal souls that don't go to Heaven or Hell might reincarnate. >I don't think canon says. I also don't think canon says if >souls can go back and forth between animal and human by reincar-nating. Exactly. And it's unlikely to say. (Though someday, the Jordi writeup might have a lot of _rumor_ in it.) >> For that matter, what do servitors of Gluttony use for beef in >> Shal-Mari? Hmmmm. (The souls of dead Hellsworn cows? Mooooooo.) > >Either Force-stripped humans or "Essence constructs" that look >like beef. "Essence constructs" are, I presume, what anything is >on the celestial plane, that isn't a spirit -- clothes, walls, >chairs, dirt, etc. Though "Essence construct" is my own term for it, which has not yet made it into canon. We'll see if there'll ever be a place to winkle it in, or a reason. Maybe a VapuTech machine that reverses the process and goes rogue, starting out to eat its way through Hell like a mechanical Haagenti, and it has to be stopped... Of course, it's spitting out Essence like nobody's business, or else storing it in its Essence-battery, and is undoubtedly highly explosive... But just think how much Essence you'd have at your disposal if you could capture the thing intact! - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. "I'm nursing a TROUT! With legs!" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:27:05 -0500 From: "Charles Phipps" Subject: IN> The Choir Words: Contrarilus Interesting guy. The more I think about it, the more I'm beggining to see these guys as a sort of Heavengly hit squad for God. Much like the Malakim. You mentioned he has the ability to counteract the Shedim by giving good thoughts just as they bad. Well the Seraph of Seraphim has the ability to make Balseraph lies real...and that messes them up bad. What if these guys are connected to the demonic host and are charged with god for... Fixing them. fun huh? - -Charlemagne ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:19:30 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN>About the Queen of Hell Netbook At 8:52 AM -0800 2/20/01, edenesque@juno.com wrote: >Hey all! > > A couple of months ago, Eric Burns (I think), had a great netbook going >called "Lilith-Queen of Hell". Whatever happened to that? Does anyone >know? Oh, I know. I *know.* She screams in my ear each day and each night.... Seriously -- I've been sidetracked into Moe Lane's "Tattered Symphony" net.book. As soon as I finish my obligations to that, I'll finish the remaining initial Superiors and get on with the post-Luciferian fun. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 05:36:05 -0200 From: Bigatto Subject: IN> Kingu, Demon Prince of Might and the song of strength Kingu: The calabite Prince of Might is a former servitor of Belial, he was a very serious and loyal servitor. Then he became kinda obsessed for being Belial's mightiest demon and killing the weak. He ascended in his ranks quite fast and by promising that with the word of might he would crush all who opposed the great Belial through the might of fire itself, Belial petitioned for the word of might to his minion. Kingu really did a great work, and killed ALL the servitors (Belial's or another's) that plotted against his master including another word-bound that intended to become a Prince (in non-canon campaigns this could be Furfur), the demon of violence (or carnage, shreding, retalliation, dismantlement and so on, if you like..). So, after proving himself the mightiest (and the most loyal) of all demons (at least in Belial's ranks) by completely slaying the SECOND mightiest demon, he talked a lot with Baal. Baal realised the good that Kingu's word could do to him and his soldiers and began to try to convince Belial to "make" a new warlike prince, one that would act as a subordinate of great power and would "magnify" his actual troops' powers...! He managed to clear the way for the loyal demon (he almost got himself incinerated, but in the perfectly right moment, with his flawless loyal work, a great deal of care and, of course, a whole bunch of mighty LUCK; he actually was successful). After that, with Belial's support, the proceding tasks were, relatively, a little easier for him and thus the Demon Prince of Might rose to the infernal royalty... Dissonance: Kingu's demons MUST be mighty and those who aren't would better be dead. It's dissonant to them to show any weaknessess, lack of self-confidence and even to PRETEND being weaker than they are. Also, the mighty don't surrender, if mightier forces put them down, their duty is to find them and do a rematch (they may flee a fight or battle if it's still in the first round, weren't attacked or "made" attacks to their foes yet, tough they don't like it, but it's dissonant to them to flee a CHALLENGE, specially if their power (might) is put in doubt. If they are beaten up, they still get a note of dissonance but as soon as they "get even" with their opponents, this note vanishes...). To let an opposed force escape also provokes dissonance (until they are disposed of...). The same applies to a demon of might who shows mercy to a defeated foe that doesn't HAVE to live (making a disturbance of 20 or more notes in the simphony counts as "having to" let him/she/it live, around 15 notes in "silent" missions). Band Attunements: Balseraphs: Balseraphs of might's whispers are deadly. By making a will roll, any target (only one at a time) in [will + celestial forces] yards must make a perception roll (plus the demon's celestial forces for beings capable of controling essence) and will hear the whisper and react accordingly to it. This is primarily used in order to distract the victim from a mortal danger. The check digit of a successful roll applies as a penalty to the perception to try to notice the danger (or whatever is the target being distracted from) AND to any actions to try to avoid or react to the threat. The demon may spend any amount of essence in order to give any being capable of perceiving the simphony a bonus to his perception roll (to hear the whisper only). This essence expenditure disturbs the simphony normally. This power doesn't disturb the simphony since it is no different than the celestial yelling at someone in order to make him meet a possibly fatal disaster... Djinns: Add the check digit of a successful use of their resonance to any rolls made in the attuned place or to any rolls made to interact with the attuned being or object. Calabim: The calabites of might are Kingu's prefered servitors. They have a mighty resonance, they double their corporeal forces when adding them to the check digit of their resonance and it's range is measured in YARDS and not feet! Habbalah: Habbalah of might may use their resonance to make their victims think they are mightier than they really are, ranging from over-confidence to "I can fly if I jump from the tenth floor!" (this is metaphorically, thanks to the unconscious mind, no one will kill himself directly, only his self-confidence and sens of power are altered), according to the check digit of course. They may also use it to make their targets think they are LESS mighty then they really are... Lilim: Lilim of might are the ultimate personal trainers and business assessors. They may DOUBLE the level of geas they can impose on a victim if the favor they do, involves in making their victim mightier. -"Hey big boy, are you still remembered of who gave you those beautiful muscles!?" or -" You'd never be the president if it weren't for me, remember?". Shedim: Might is a word for power, not subtlety. Shedite of might may inflict [celestial forces] hit points to anyone they possess when leaving their hosts. They may choose to not inflict this damage, but they add a total of [celestial forces] notes of disturbance to the simphony when changing hosts. In compensation, they may possess it for [celestial forces] more days without having to make any will rolls when doing so... Humans seeing the shedite in his mighty celestial form also take ethereal hits equal to the shedite celestial forces. Impudites: Impudites of might don't need to charm anyone weaker (less forces and will points) than him or anyone who thinks, that is mightier than he really is. Impudites of might take no dissonance for killing humans as a result of obeying the dissonance conditions of the prince of might. Servitor attunements: Might:By using this attunement, the demon may lift [essence spent + corporeal forces (ethereal if in the marches and so on..)] tons of weight for check digit minutes. This attunement may also increase the power of melee attacks by the same amount for check digit combat rounds (but at least one point of essence must be spent). Cry of the Mighty: For 5 essence and a battle cry, the demon gains a protection in the chosen realm equal to the realm's forces for 1d combat rounds. Basic Rites: - - Lift very heavy weights for 3 hours - - Crush a mightier foe (3 essence if celestially) - - Destroy the self-confidence of a human, making him belief (or perceive) that he's defenseless Distinctions: Knight of might: The holder of this distinction knows how many forces a being has. Up to 25 percent more forces than holder of the distinction. He also knows how many of them are corporeal ethereal and celestial. Captain of power: These captains are totally immune to mundane kinetical attacks (an angel with a sword, doesn't inflict mundane kinetic attacks as well as a bazuca or grenade even concussion ones). The captains of power are very impressive, they get a +4 reaction bonus from anyone that sees him fightning, using some power or when trying to be more impressive (this bonus may be used in intimidation rolls). Baron of force: The barons of force may make force attacks. These attacks deal [total forces/3 + check digit] points of damage and it's range is the check digit yards. A will roll must be made to activate this power (calabim with this distiction may add it to their own resonance if their target is in this power's range). These barons are, also, immune to ALL kinds of kinetical attacks. Relations: Though Belial supported Kingu in achieving his princedom and likes what he does, Belial's paranoia makes him somewhat suspicious of his former minion. Still, Belial has good relations with him. Baal likes the warriors of might and also the idea that, if Kingu is like Belial he could exerce some control on him too. Beleth is mighty in her "home territory" and Kingu perceives and likes it. Andrealphus and Valefor don't like his destructive nature and Asmodeus hates Kingu's lack of care about disturbances in the simphony, dissonance and discord among his servitors and his idea that rules don't apply to the ones who are mighty. Furfur, doesn't like Belial and he doesn't like his pal either. Kingu himself promised Belial that he would show Furfur what he thinks about his loud word....through his infernal skull... Allied: Belial Associated: Baal, Beleth (Baal, Belial and Saminga are associated to Kingu) Hostile: Andrealphus, Asmodeus, Valefor (Andrealphus, Asmodeus and Valefor are hostile to Kingu) Enemy: Furfur Chance of invocation: 2 Modifiers: +1 20 pounds of academy weights +2 A large weapon +3 A car smashed with your own hands +4 A car lifted above your head +5 A truck destroyed by yorself +6 A large and loaded truck lifted above your head +7 The corpse of a powerful being (15+ forces) killed by you alone - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ The song of strength: Corporeal: This song simply enhances strength. The singer's strength raises one point for each skill level. It has a duration of check digit in minutes. Ethereal: The target of this song's mind are overcomed by the powerful mind of the singer. The victim of this power are stunned for check digit combat rounds if they fail to resist with an Intelligence roll (celestials may add their ethereal forces). Celestial: The possessors of this song have the power to command weaker willed beings. If the victim loses in a contest of wills (celestial add their celestial forces), he'll have to obey any orders given to him by the winner. If a command directly violates some kind of moral code or the like ( like dissonance conditions) the victim may attempt another contest for each such an order and each time it is ordered. The song lasts for check digit minutes. Bonus: Might. Essence requirement: 1 Degree of disturbance: The check digit. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:33:49 -0500 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) The recent writeup of the Kyriotate Choir Angel as "Control" has been making me ponder the whole Choir. It's been mentioned that "Control" is kind of a bad view of what Kyriotates do, "Multiplicity" perhaps being more accurate. Of course, there's very little other than control that Kyriotates do, in canon, since they have no Vessels and require hosts. Kind of an odd Choir to first come up with the idea of Vessels, don't you think? Frankly, possessing someone just seems vaguely demonic anyway if you're not used to the Kyriotate resonance; not to mention pushing a mind out of its body, for any period of time. So here's a rewrite of the Kyriotate concept from the bottom up that I thought I'd toss at y'all. Kyriotates(the Swarms, the Many) Description Kyriotates are the angels of multiplicity, capable of producing numerous forms from a single being. The facet of God this Choir represents is His omnipresence. The Kyriotate ideal is a synergistic whole made up of innumerable parts with unique identities. They enjoy things like crowds, complex machines, and custom craftsmanship. Resonance A successful application of the Kyriotate resonance allows it to split off or recombine a number of its Forces. In the celestial realm or the Marches, this allows them to produce multiple celestial forms or ethereal icons; each requires a minimum of three Forces, so most Kyriotates can produce three such forms. On Earth, the primary use of the Resonance is to form or release a new Vessel in the shape of some animal or human. Any non-celestial form lasts for a number of days equal to the check digit on a successful Resonance roll; after this time, the Kyriotate must either attempt to change the form on which the time limit has expired, pass a Will roll, or be drawn back to its Heart. A failed resonance roll will not suffice, so prudent angels make changes well beforehand. However, a cosmetic change to a Vessel or a form change to an icon will suffice. Kyriotates are in their celestial form when they first descend to the Corporeal plane, like all other angels. The first angel to discover the physical use of the Kyriotate resonance was Jordi, then granted the rank of Archangel and the Word of Animals. Since then, any Kyriotate can form their own Vessel, while Archangels can make Vessels for their Servitors' use. The number of Forces split off determines the maximum size or complexity of the Vessel; while the Kyriotate's basic characteristics govern the Vessel's characteristics, the number of Forces involved in creating the Vessel must be equal to or greater than the number of Forces generally required to create such a being with average statistics for its species. After a splitting, no Vessel may be left with less than the required number of Forces, although a single successful application of Resonance will allow the Forces in a single Vessel to become any number of new ones. Each new Vessel has its own viewpoint, both physical and, in the case of animal or human Vessels, to a certain extent mental; the process which creates an animal Vessel imprints upon it the genetic history and instincts of that species. Kyriotates take pride in knowing what the Symphony looks like from many perspectives at once, and even something of how numerous species think and feel. In addition, a Kyriotate may change a Vessel its Forces are currently riding in; this is the same roll as it would take to create a new Vessel. Only gross changes are possible(fine control requires the Song of Form) with any certainty; the check digit indicates how difficult a change may be made. Gross changes like gender are easy; changing something as subtle as eye color(with nothing else) is extremely hard. When initially creating a Vessel, the Kyriotate may duplicate any Vessel it has used within the last (Celestial Power) years. Equipping a Vessel is simple enough; the angel may carry the usual amount of items in potentiality, and even bring forth a Vessel clothed if the appropriate clothing is available. Note that being in multiple Vessels is not without risk; while each Vessel has the base number of Body Hits of the angel, *any* Vessel being killed will send the angel to Trauma. In addition, the angel presents multiple fronts of attack, and Mind and Soul Hits are calculated singly for the angel's single mind and soul. In addition, the usual effects of a decreased time rate apply when a Kyriotate is in multiple realms. For injuries, note that each Vessel heals at base rate, so multiple physical injuries may be made up at once; Mind and Soul Hits heal at the standard rate. When two Vessels combine, use the healthiest Vessel's Hits. Dissonance The angels of multiplicity should never get too narrow a view. If the Kyriotate's Forces all join in a single entity, whether it be Vessel, icon, or celestial form, the angel must make a Will roll every hour or fraction thereof spent in such a form or suffer one note of Dissonance. Note that in Trauma, the angel's forces are chaotically split and recombining without resonance control, so Dissonance does not occur; as the angel heals, order and identity are reimposed. Choir Attunements (Unmentioned Archangels retain the usual Attunements.) Blandine's Kyriotates' ethereal icons each have the angel's base number of Mind Hits and regenerate them separately. If recombining, use the healthiest icon's Hits. David's Many may purchase the usual stone vessels. Dominic's Swarms may take the form of specific humans, down to fingerprint and DNA matches, if they have a sample available(blood, hair, etc.) Janus' Kyrios take no dissonance for using their gaseous form. Jean's Kyrios may create artificial forms, if they pass an appropriate roll -- usually Engineering, Electronics, or Artistry. Khalid's Many gain their 1 Will and may still make a resonance roll to inspire faith, although it is not necessarily by entering them. Laurence's Swarms are still bound to a specific dead human and gain their identity and Role. Marc's Kyriotates may stay in a form for (Celestial Power) days, or better on a succesful resonance roll with a better check digit. Michael's Swarms' Vessels have Fast Regeneration. They're terrifying in a protracted fight, and make great torture subjects. Novalis' Many may take plant forms. Yves' Kyriotates, creating a Vessel, obtain a set of memories and skills for that Vessel, the check digit indicating the detail of the life history and how close it is(in respects like cultural origins and profession) to what the angel desired. Kyriotates and their Colas Confronted with a soda machine, a Kyriotate would walk around it, climb atop it, peer under it, and possibly create a form to crawl inside it, interested in what it looked like from all angles and how all the parts it was made of fit together. Falling A Kyriotate Falls from Choir Dissonance because he spent too much time being a single entity. The Fallen Kyriotates, the Shedim, exemplify this self-centered attitude, attempting to force other beings to become like them, as well. They possess humans, use their minds, try to make the humans accept the Shedim worldview. The facet of the Symphony that Shedim reject is the notion of many unique identities. The Shedite ideal is the imprinting of one's identity on everything to the overriding of all other identities. They enjoy things like monopolies, out-shouting someone, and mass production. Discord Walkabout(Celestial): One of the Kyriotate's forms believes itself to be a separate entity from the Kyriotate; while the angel maintains viewpoint and most control, whenever the chosen Vessel or its Role is endangered, it may react in self-preservation from the view of the Role rather than the angel. Roll vs. Will with a penalty equal to the level of the discord to see if the angel can impose its will on its errant Forces. (If a Kyriotate with this Discord ever joins all its forces in a single Host, it must make a Will roll in addition to the Dissonance roll or gain amnesia for the next hour, acting in line with its Role if it has one. The state is uncomfortably close to being a Remnant.) Impressionability(Ethereal): The angel becomes so in tune with the myriad identities in the Symphony that it begins losing its own; any Vessels it has begin taking on the behavior characteristics of those around it(icons take on the personalities of nearby dreamers). Make a Will roll, at a penalty equal to the level of the Discord, when the angel wants to perform an action differently from the way the nearest persons in view are performing similar actions, if any. Any Corporeal Discord will manifest in any Vessel the Kyriotate creates; they just can't seem to picture a body without vestigial wings, for example. William ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 19:31:35 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: IN> Just when you've convinced yourself it's only a Game This will start sounding like a typical failed dot com story. It's not. It is the most compelling real world "example" of a Balseraph I've ever seen, right down to his victims swearing he has a special place in God's eyes. http://www.thestandard.com/article/display/0,1151,16368,00.html Enjoy! - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:21:59 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Spiritually aware Animals - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > I doubt that the very young > (humans, let alone cats) have the mental equipment to > formualte > the idea "I'd better act as if I liked these guys, since they > feed me." [SNIP] > I'd say that, for the most part, animals and small children > live > at a level below the one where distinctions like selfish and > unselfish can exist. I think it's more like a level below which distinctions like altruistic and malicious exist. Babies (both human and animal)are selfish not because they wish their parents ill but because they aren't capable of anything else -- a natural consequence of not being able to care for oneself. Parents, feel free to back me up on this one. 0;> ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "You have walked through the halls of power and have somehow managed to remain untouched. I can only assume that you have not been paying attention." -- Londo Molari __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:17:47 -0500 From: Mike Bruner Subject: Re: IN> February 16, 2001 (ML) >>Hey, nobody ever said all of Hell's forces are all >>smart strategists. >>There's bound to be a bunch of idiots who think >>they've spotted "Heavenly Stupidity", from Calabim >>too dumb to look past the "Open Season" thought to >>Balseraphs who don't consider Humans smart enough to >>tie their shoe-laces together. >>Baal and most other Princes and their staffs would >>see through that Angelic scheme in a pico-second, of >>course. But they'd probably not bother to correct >>any Demon stupid enough to actually fall for it. >>Down in Hell, they tend to believe in Social >>Darwinism. > >Bingo. So do I, at least when it comes to demonic PCs >who forget the Edelstein Rule*. > >I don't expect everything I provide here to work in >every campaign out there: for example, I'd never try >to sneak this past somebody with a military >background. Their mental alarms would start screaming >at them, just like Chuckg's did, and rightly so. > >However, every group has a exploitable blind spot. I >don't recommend regularly whacking them in it, unless >theirs is starting to really p*ss you off, but the >occasional flicking of it is a time-honored tradition >(and I happened to believe in the _Paranoia_ Rule** >with a religious zeal). And of course the REAL bright and creative demon might consider what one can do with an obvious ambush if you turn it around on the angels... (never underestimate your players, either; I'm as stuck for creativity in game as many but it's amazing what happens when that one bit of inspiration hits ya that the demon... err, DM, didn't think of :)). - -- Mike Bruner-- bruner@delaware.infi.net "But soft, what light through yonder window breaks? It is the East, and Juliet is AHHH THE SUN!!!" *FOOM* --Vampire theatre ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:25:07 -0500 From: "Rolland Therrien" Subject: Re: IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) - -----Original Message----- From: William J. Keith To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Date: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 6:37 PM Subject: IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) >The recent writeup of the Kyriotate Choir Angel as "Control" has been >making me ponder the whole Choir. It's been mentioned that "Control" is >kind of a bad view of what Kyriotates do, "Multiplicity" perhaps being more >accurate. Of course, there's very little other than control that >Kyriotates do, in canon, since they have no Vessels and require hosts. > >Kind of an odd Choir to first come up with the idea of Vessels, don't you >think? > >Frankly, possessing someone just seems vaguely demonic anyway if you're not >used to the Kyriotate resonance; not to mention pushing a mind out of its >body, for any period of time. [snips most of this] I honestly like your suggestions. But there's a way to keep Kyrios as Posessers without making them potentially demonic, while doing away with the "Host is unaware of whatever is happening" problem. Basically, whenever a Kyrio sends a part of itself into an animal or human, it can use a resonnance check to nudge the subject into taking any action that would cause it to help others (Such as the Angels or any innocent bystander). A Kyrio with a team of Angels stuck in a fire-fight with a bunch of Soldiers of Hell might use it's resonnance to nudge a pair of cops driving a few streets away into checking out the warehouse where the firefight is happening, then use the distraction to possess one or more of the soldiers and nudge them to surrender for everyone's own good. That, or just say most Kyrios have the Song of Possession, and that they can possess anyone as long as they have at least one of each type of Forces inside the subject. What do you think of this idea? - -Exit the LoneWolf ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 21:50:15 -0500 From: "Kirt Dankmyer, aka Loki" Subject: IN> a question about music IS there a nifty musical term for "a set of symphonies"? You know, kind of like geese come in flocks. Something to put in X in the syllogism flock:geese::X:symphonies... I'd settle for a more specialized or generalized term, something that means something like "a group of musical works by the same author" or "a set of symphonies written in the same key". Yes, this will be In Nomine related eventually. :-) -Loki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 16:05:55 +1300 From: "Alex Liddell" Subject: Re: IN> Kyriotates(gaping hole ripped in canon within) > >The recent writeup of the Kyriotate Choir Angel as "Control" has been > >making me ponder the whole Choir. It's been mentioned that "Control" is > >kind of a bad view of what Kyriotates do, "Multiplicity" perhaps being >more > >accurate. Of course, there's very little other than control that > >Kyriotates do, in canon, since they have no Vessels and require hosts. > > > >Kind of an odd Choir to first come up with the idea of Vessels, don't you > >think? > > > >Frankly, possessing someone just seems vaguely demonic anyway if you're >not > >used to the Kyriotate resonance; not to mention pushing a mind out of its > >body, for any period of time. > >[snips most of this] > >I honestly like your suggestions. But there's a way to keep Kyrios as >Posessers without making them potentially demonic, while doing away with >the >"Host is unaware of whatever is happening" problem. > >Basically, whenever a Kyrio sends a part of itself into an animal or human, >it can use a resonnance check to nudge the subject into taking any action >that would cause it to help others (Such as the Angels or any innocent >bystander). A Kyrio with a team of Angels stuck in a fire-fight with a >bunch of Soldiers of Hell might use it's resonnance to nudge a pair of cops >driving a few streets away into checking out the warehouse where the >firefight is happening, then use the distraction to possess one or more of >the soldiers and nudge them to surrender for everyone's own good. This is good. In theory if you were using Contrarilus in the campaign you can have him grant a Kyriotate his Synergy Attunement which does pretty much the same thing. This means what you aren't ripping toooo much of a gaping hole in canon, if you have moral problems with that! :) Alex _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2070 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2001 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.