From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Fri Mar 2 16:22:09 2001 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA03567 for ; Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:22:08 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id QAA27343 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:22:07 -0600 Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:22:07 -0600 Message-Id: <200103022222.QAA27343@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #2092 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Friday, March 2 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2092 In this digest: Re: IN> How much do they know? IN> Heaven, Hell and the ENGLISH Civil War IN> Re: Muslim Jesus Re: IN> World War I (was Heaven, Hell, and the Civil War) Re: IN> World War I (was Heaven, Hell, and the Civil War) Re: IN> How much do they know? IN> Fwd: (Semi-Choir/Band) The Dobraim IN> [ADMIN] U n s u b s c r i b i n g Re: IN> Clarification of my opinions, Part 1 (Heaven) Re: IN> Clarification of my opinions, Part 2 (Hell) Re: IN> Clarification of my opinions, Part 2 (Hell) Re: IN> Fwd: (Semi-Choir/Band) The Dobraim IN> Chibi-Chibi!!!!!!! IN> Chibi-chibi Re: IN> Re: Muslim Jesus IN> Re: Chibi! Re: IN> Re: Chibi! Re: IN> Re: Chibi! IN> Chiba Dommie IN> Jesus Re: IN> Re: Chibi! Re: IN> World War I IN> Here's a seed for you ... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 12:44:36 -0500 From: "Rolland Therrien" Subject: Re: IN> How much do they know? - -----Original Message----- From: Earl Wajenberg To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Date: Friday, March 02, 2001 10:53 AM Subject: Re: IN> How much do they know? >3) The spiritual leaders are likelier to have some limited >amount of information. This would be people like the Pope, the >Patriarch of Constantinople, the Dalai Lama, and figures less >well-known outside their religious communities, but who are >important within them and happen to, say, have been involved >with "exorcisms" or to have "studied occultism." I gotta agree with this. If no one else does, then the religious leaders of the world would be aware of the War. Which isn't to say that any of them would have direct contact with the Celestials themselves. Let's face it, having a Religious Leader being an actual Soldier of God would be like broadcasting the location of your beachhead to the enemy before D-day. So we're left with the Angels and Demons acting in more subtle ways, only showing themselves to the religious leaders when it's important to further their cause. Laurence, for exemple, dispite being the protector of Catholocism, doesn't directly involve himself in the Pope's affairs, except to keep the Demons from interfering with him. Add to that the fact Humans don't have any way of telling the Angels from the Demons when both are in vessels, and it's quite likely the Demons are passing themselves off as Angels to add to the confusion. Heck, the way the Spanish Inquisition turned out, the guys in Hell obviously had a hand in it, convincing guys like Torquemada he was serving God by slaughtering thousands of Jews. So, I'm in the "They think they know, but they don't have all the facts" camp in regards to Leaders knowing about the War. - -Exit the LoneWolf ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 09:59:10 -0800 (PST) From: Maurice Lane Subject: IN> Heaven, Hell and the ENGLISH Civil War Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 15:21:22 From: "Jo Hart" Subject: Re: IN> Heaven, Hell, and the Civil War >>From: "Janet Anderson" >> >>So what about celestial involvement in the Civil War? >Oh, I think Heaven per se tends to be old-fashioned, >but I'm sure Janus was betting on the Roundheads. > > >jo That'd be my take, too, although I suspect that Marc might also have been on the Roundheads' side. Hmmm. Eli might not have been in for the War, but he'd probably have signed up for the Restoration: I can't see either him or Blandine liking the closing of the theaters under Puritan rule. Larry? Larry loves romantic idealists, so he probably would have found Cromwell too cold - besides, let's not even get started on the Ireland issue. Mike probably had to keep him from incinerating Oliver several times during that little escapade, more's the pity.* As for Hell... Andre would have also been a Roundhead, I think: less overt Lust, but more than compensated by the covert. Lilith would have perked up at the idea of beheading a king: Valefor likewise at the idea of stealing a kingdom. That's all I can think off, except that Sammy'd would have found the whole thing fairly pleasant. Anyone from the British Isles who'd like to do a fuller examination of this topic, please don't let _me_ stop you. It'd be fun to read. :) Moe *Sorry. My ancestry's Boston Irish Catholic. My grandfather spit on the ground every time he heard Cromwell's name, so I may not be unbiased. :) ===== Liber Licentiae Moeticae: http://www.stormloader.com/users/moelane/innomine.html Last updated 02/19/00 (this is usually way out of date) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 13:18:32 -0500 From: Jonathan Walton Subject: IN> Re: Muslim Jesus > PS Nope, no AA Jesus coming from me in the future - > unless I decide to do one where he's going, "Err... > didn't Allah - the Compassionate, the Merciful - > Inspire Muhammad after I left? He said that He was > going to..." > > Actually, that would be kind of interesting, if only > because Laurence would go _so_ incredibly pale... It'd be funnier if he also mentioned the angel Moroni and some golden tablets. Then the organized church would have to figure out how to incorperate Mormons and Muslims into their theology. Speaking of which, the Chinese translation of John 1 (NOTE: not 1 John, John 1) has Jesus being the incarnation of the Dao: "The Dao" as in The Way, ala Daoism and Laozi. It starts out, "In the beginning was the Dao and the Dao was with God. The Dao _is_ God." and continues to Jesus being "the Way made flesh." It'd be interesting if you decided that this was canon IN theology and Jesus told Heaven that the Chinese have been worshiping him (as the Dao) ever since the time of the legendary Sage Emperors (c. 3000 BCE), which would put them up with the Jews as the oldest followers of the Divine. I always wanted to have kung fu angels ... :) Later. Jonathan ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 13:33:44 -0500 From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" Subject: Re: IN> World War I (was Heaven, Hell, and the Civil War) Sam Kington wrote: > > Ben Glickler wrote: >> >> It's also interesting in that Archangels and Demon Princes seldom >> try to blatantly force big wars, but who would've thought that the >> greatest conflict in human history (at the time) would be sparked >> by the death of one relatively unexceptional nobleman? Sounds like >> a celestial plot to me. > > Sorry for being late on this, but this sounds to me like the greatest > example of why Celestials do *not* run everything. Consider this > possible example: > * Bunch of newly-spawned Calabites get assigned to Archduke Ferdinard > * His chauffeur goes a different route than expected, and they Fail > * They're sitting in a bar lamenting their failure, when they see him > * They get a second chance, and they kill him > * World War II happens > * What the hell? I think the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand stinks of the sort of thing that would get any one of Asmodeus, Kobal or Malphas a tether. Consider: the head of the Black Hand -- the terrorist group that killed him -- was *also* the head of the secret police assigned to capture them. That has the sort of bitter irony and implausibility that only one of those three Princes could truly appreciate. :) It would be a shame to turn it into direct action, IMO. - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswcasa.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 12:56:27 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> World War I (was Heaven, Hell, and the Civil War) From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" > > > > * Bunch of newly-spawned Calabites get assigned to Archduke Ferdinard > > * His chauffeur goes a different route than expected, and they Fail > > * They're sitting in a bar lamenting their failure, when they see him > > * They get a second chance, and they kill him > > * World War II happens > > * What the hell? > > I think the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand stinks of the sort of > thing that would get any one of Asmodeus, Kobal or Malphas a tether. > Consider: the head of the Black Hand -- the terrorist group that killed > him -- was *also* the head of the secret police assigned to capture > them. I would have Kobal and Malphas struggling for control of the tether, personally. The interlocking series of treaties that caused all the various nations to declare war upon one another gives Factions a claim on it, yes. But how Dark Humor comes in is through some really twisted irony. After a number of failed attempts on the Archduke's life, one of the members of the Black Hand who had lost his nerve and never gotten a shot at Ferdinand went to a cafe. Meanwhile, the Archduke's driver had gotten lost in the confusion and taken a wrong turn while trying to return to the castle, and by the most bizarre of chances stopped directly in front of the assassin's table. The triumph of sheer dumb luck and circumstance which cost so many people their lives has got to be one of the few things that raised a laugh from Kobal this century... ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2001 03:05:38 +0800 From: Manny Nepomuceno Subject: Re: IN> How much do they know? Which explains why the Pope has his blood red Vatican assault uniform and his "Meek and Mild" Walther PPK handgun. If you missed the reference, you can check out that site that got posted on this list a few days ago...:) > I gotta agree with this. If no one else does, then the religious leaders of > the world would be aware of the War. - -- :) Manny Neps The Demon of Java, Habbalite of Technology "No, no, no, no. It's really quite simple. 'Public static void main( String[] args).' You can remember that, can't you?" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 14:33:39 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Fwd: (Semi-Choir/Band) The Dobraim >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Non-member submission from [EDG ] > >Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 03:28:23 -0500 >From: EDG >Subject: (Semi-Choir/Band) The Dobraim Thanks, Beth. :P Thoughts? - -EDG The Dobraim Those Who Hover The Dobraim are not a Choir or a Band per se; instead they are a collection of celestials who share a certain common nature. Some are still angels and others are still demons, but all are Outcast or Renegade, and all have encountered a quirk in the Symphony. It seems that if you break your angelic Heart -just right-, the Symphony doesn't reject you all the way. While your resonance does turn in on itself, you continue to share the connection with the world that your angelic resonance grants. Likewise, if your demon Heart shatters just so, the Symphony accepts you partway, but leaves half of you out in the cold, so to speak. The Dobraim are those celestials to whom this has happened. While they no longer have full access to their original resonance, this is made up for in some respect by the fact that they do have partial access to their other-side counterparts' resonance. An Ofanite, for example, could still move at ultraspeed, but would also have the Calabite tendency to shatter whatever she touched. Dissonance Dobraim have the dissonance condition for both celestial types which they embody. However, they treat dissonance as if it were 1 less for the purposes of making dissonance rolls. Manner and Appearance Dobraim come in many shapes and sizes - at least thirteen, but even then the appearance varies according to the celestial in question. Most Dobraim appear to be a strange blend of the two types; Ofanim and Calabim are the sole exception to this. Calabite-Dobraim retain their Calabite appearance, but become engulfed in celestial flame, rippling down their bodies, when they use the Ofanite resonance. Ofanite-Dobraim, on the other hand, are subdued, their fire coalesced into an almost human shape. Ofanite-Dobraim and Calabite-Dobraim are almost indistinguishable when they are using their Ofanite resonances. Game Mechanics Dobraim retain their old resonance, but gain the powers of the opposite side as well. However, the target number for their original resonance is reduced by their Celestial Forces; likewise, they roll against their Celestial Forces to activate the foreign resonance. Points may be moved from one to the other by spending three character points; when one or the other target number drops to 0, the celestial ceases to be a Dobrai and becomes a celestial of the type for which he has the full resonance. (A demon-Dobrai must have the aid of an Archangel to take the final step.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 14:41:58 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> [ADMIN] U n s u b s c r i b i n g I've just gotten (and dealt with) a couple of messages that suggest that, well... You know that little message you got when you s u b s c r i bed? The one that said, "KEEP ME"? Well, apparently people aren't. Makes me glad that I have administrivia set to bounce to me, despite the nuisance of having to spell out u-n-s words. (Administrivia bounces things like u n s b s r i b, for instance.) Anyway, if you've gone and thrown that rather important little bit of mail away, you can still avoid having to have me remove you from the list by hand. (Which is a good thing, since it takes longer for me to do it by hand, and if you're bailing because you can't keep up with the list, you don't want to have umptyzillion new messages on before I happen to log on and handle my email, right?) All you have to do is read the list rules/List FAQ. What, you threw that away, too? Never fear! HTML is here! Well, not _HERE_ on the list; that's a bad thing, that is. But it's around. Just go to the URL listed in my admin .sig. The one that says, "/listrules.html" at the end. Scroll down a little, past the orange links. Or hit the first link there: "How does the list work?" That has all the data you need to know to get yourself off the list. (Or onto it, with a little reverse engineering, such as removing the "u n" from u n s u b - s c r i b e.) - --Beth, List Admin http://www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/listrules.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 14:16:14 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Clarification of my opinions, Part 1 (Heaven) At 6:32 PM -0500 3/1/01, Shadow wrote: >Fair Warning: I'm a Southerner. And quite proud of it. It shows. Which is not an insult. >The North was more like: The Dream of Making Everyone Else Do As We Say. And >the South was more like: Defending My Home From Barbarous Invaders. Mm -- easily as simplistic an opinion as saying "The Civil War was about Slavery, because those Racist Southerners wanted to own and flog humanity and we (the history books generally say we) needed to emancipate the slaves." Which goes back to the Simpsons episode where Apu was becoming a U.S. Citizen. The final question he was asked was "why was the Civil War fought?" He responded "well, there were many philosophical, political and economic drivers for what came down to the ultimate test between Federalism and Jeffersonian Democracy--" only to be interrupted by the tired testgiver, who said "just say Slavery, okay?" >The North did not enter into the War of Northern Aggression because >of some high holy quest to rid the world of slavery. Were there >yankees that fought for that reason? I'm sure there were. But did >Lincoln start the whole mess for it? No. Actually, Slavery *was* the flashpoint for the Civil War, even if it wasn't the whole (or even the primary) story. It came down to the Abolitionist movement growing enough strength to begin to force Federal legislation on the matter. The States-rights advocates denied that the Federal government had such a power, and when that power was assumed anyhow (right or wrong I won't debate) the Southern States moved onto the road towards succession. However, had the Union *not* held Slavery up as a cause celebre when entering the War to keep the Union together, there wouldn't have been sufficient support for the War to take place. Politically, the Abolitionists needed to be brought into the fold for the Union to have a unified and strong front. Lincoln was primarily concerned with preserving the Union, without a doubt, but the *North* was largely anti-Slavery. That can't be denied. In In Nominesque terms, there are some lovely elements of the Game to the whole affair, followed of course by War and The War. As for Destiny and Fate... I rather think Yves was strongly in support of the Abolitionist movement and more than willing to manuevuer it into the public soul of the North's involvement. I'm also quite sure Kronos supported the institution of Slavery. Marc I would expect would have been against the South because withdrawal from a union rather than accept compromise and the give and take of politics is antithetical to the principles of Trade. Marc *wants* countries to have to compromise and work together. Succession is against that entire principle. >The issue was about whether the individual States had th right to tell the >Federal Gov't to blow it out it's nose. The North wanted to use the Fed to >open up the south to the exploitation of factories by eliminating slavery. Well, no. Oh, I'm sure that the Industrial Barons were thinking on those lines, because it would make for profits. But the Intelligensia who drove the Abolitionist movement were unconcerned with industrial profits. Ralph Waldo Emerson and the Transendentalists were certainly far more sympathetic to an Agrarian model of society than an Industrial one, but they still were the spearhead of Abolitionism. >The South resisted, attempted to peaceably succeed, and the North reacted. >Slavery entered into it in that it was the issue around which the war over >who had the power (State or Federal gov't) was fought. Again, not so. Abolitionism had been a hot button issue for decades by the time the Civil War rolled around. Now, while I agree that the South's attempt to secede stemmed not out of a desire to keep their slaves per se, but to resist the Federal Government's *telling* them what to do with their slaves. There is no doubt that Federalism/States-Rights was the rallying point and central issue of the South's entry, and certainly was Lincoln's concern. But Abolitionism and the institution of Slavery were part of a deep seated conflict between the two sides long before there was any shooting being done. In fact, there were several grassroots movements and mild rebellions on both sides to free slaves/eliminate abolitionist interference for decades before. To try and cut the issue of Slavery *out* of the Civil War is both revisionism and rather unwieldy deconstructionism. I personally think Stone was the primary motivator and supporter behind the Union -- "keep the whole together no matter what" is a particularly Davidian sentiment. >Was the Confederacy >blameless? No. The institution of slavery was unethical. But the South was >not evil. Nor were most people who fought for the South fighting over >slavery. They were fighting for the right to determine their own destiny at >a local level. Painting the North as valiant heroes, especialy considering >the murderous savages like Sherman is an injustice. There I agree. This was a battle between opposing viewpoints, not good and evil, even if an expressly evil institution like the owning of human beings was a core part of it. However, I do think that, in the principles of Selflessness versus Selfishness (called by the demons Totalitarianism versus Self Interest), the bias of Heaven would be towards the Union, and the bias of Hell would be towards the South. It's just if we do that, we have to make the War (the big'un, not the Civil War) lower Contrast than several do. >I can quite easily see David as supporting the South. The South was very >much a rural/agrarian culture where family and close knit social bonds were >of high importance. But I can see him sitting it out as well. I can't see David supporting the South at all. It goes against the core belief of Stone. While I can see several Archangels having Southern Sympathies or even support for the South (Michael, Laurence, Gabriel, Blandine, Jean and even Yves would all be sympathetic to certain Southern ideals -- or at least certain Southerners), David would be a Northerner all the way. > > Dominic: North. This was easy; it says in the core rules and in >Superiors >> 1 that Dominic supports just laws and opposes unjust ones. > >Was slavery unjust? No question. But the attempts of the North to use >violence to enforce their viewpoint is bullying, not justice. Mm. Disagree with you. Dominic is *Old* Testement. If Slavery is unjust, it is perfectly acceptable to exact painful retribution in the name of balancing those scales. > Further, once >the 'Reconstruction' Era began, many of the punishments imposed on the >citizens of the South were certainly not just. Again, here I completely agree. The Carpetbaggers would have been anathema to Dominic, and the burdens of Reconstruction were unquestionably too harsh. > > Gabriel: North. Another no-brainer; "punishes the cruel." > >Neutral. While some, even many, slave owners were cruel, the argument can >be made they were no worse than many of the factory owners of the North. This, sadly, is an apples and oranges argument. "While some, even many apple pies are tasty, so is well cooked veal, and therefore Gabriel would have been neutral in the dessert contest." Slavery is a cruel institution. A well kept slave -- and certainly there were slaveowners who were compassionate -- is still a human being who is being made subhuman. Property. This is cruelty, and would be anathema to Gabriel's eyes. Yes, there would be things about the South she admired and things about the North she despised, but Gabriel would be a *vicious* abolitionist. >Additionaly, the common soldier was no more cruel then you or I. He was >fighting to defend his home from barbarous invaders. Hardly cruel. >Further, the POW camps on -both- sides were so horrendous as to make those >of North Viet Nam look like summer camp. Oh, and... Andersonville being regarded by far the worst of breed. 12,000+ dead, as I recall... >Hello, Sherman? You know, burned a swath of farming land clear down to >Atlanta, raping and pillaging as he went in an orgy of death and destruction >that surely had Saminga and Baal cackling with glee. If you want one of >history's greatest war criminals, look no futher then the North and it's >General Sherman. There was plenty of cruelty to go around. Gabriel was >certainly busy smiting both sides. Here, again, we have no disagreement. > > Janus: Neutral. Okay, I like the Underground Railroad idea, but Janus's > > Word will flourish during *any* war, no matter who's fighting or who wins. > >I think Janus would support the North. Much of the fight was about change. >The north wanted it. The South did not. A good point, and I don't disagree with it. However, I could also accept that Janus supported the breakup of the nice, big, solid, staid Union. Either I think works. > >I'm sorry, but claiming that the Northern victory in a war of aggression is >a victory for Destiny is...well, I don't think either way this would have >been a victory for Destiny. It is this same interventionist mindset and >then inflicting of punishments after the victory that led to the wonders of >WWII, Korea, Viet Nam and the current bullying America is known far and wide >for. This is true... however, there *is* still that Slavery thing. Hm. I could accept that a lot of people achieve both Destiny *and* Fate in this puppy. (I should get around to writing up the C.S.S. Hunley for In Nomine. I've got it down as one of those human innovations that Jean sabotages because "humanity isn't ready for it," condemning the crew to death and significant resources -- that could have turned the Naval war, should the Hunley had been a success -- to death for the sake of his timeline....) - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 14:21:13 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Clarification of my opinions, Part 2 (Hell) At 6:42 PM -0500 3/1/01, Shadow wrote: > > Kronos: As with Yves, and for the same reason, I believe Kronos supported >> the South -- a Southern victory would move the South toward its Fate and >> push the remaining United States further from its Destiny. > >How so? Suppose the South gave up slavery of it's own free will within >twenty years? Done of it's own accord as it was becoming increasingly less >feasible economicaly, is it not possible that in the long run relations >between races might be less strained? Here, I agree. The *Southern* Abolitionist movement was alive and well, and between the economic realities encroaching and the winds of the world's overall change, it's likely the South would have introduced various forms of Abolition and Emancipation over time, and probably sooner rather than later. As it is, there is considerable contention that still rankles in the South, because they lost a War that spelled the end of their way of life and was used as an excuse to crush (or try to crush) their pride. The debates about the Confederate Flag today underscore the entire of this. To the African American community, the flag is a painful reminder of ownership. To (I think) many Southerners, it is a reminder of the positive aspects of Southern life, and the lost cause. (I had a business trip to Richmond that was amazingly illuminating, both in terms of one city's feelings on the Civil War, and in terms of race relations.) > - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 14:26:00 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Clarification of my opinions, Part 2 (Hell) At 7:26 PM -0500 3/1/01, Shadow wrote: > >ObIN: One world gov't's and Superiors? Which Superiors would support a one >world gov't or even International Bodies like the UN? Anyone? Angels: David. Make it a Catholic government and you get Laurence and Dominic too. The U.N. would be supported by Marc, a single world government less so. Demons: Asmodeus. Kronos (one nation's Fate is simpler than dozens). Others, but I'm in the middle of other stuff and can't think too long on it. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 14:45:36 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Fwd: (Semi-Choir/Band) The Dobraim Interesting idea. Where does the name come from? It brings up the possibility of sub-choirs and sub-bands. E.g. suppose all cherubium that look like winged lions have some particular wrinkle about their natures? Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 15:51:16 -0500 From: "Daniel Gallagher" Subject: IN> Chibi-Chibi!!!!!!! This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_08DD_01C0A330.9D687440 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well, since I've movved away this seems to be all of the Chibi = (super-deformed) Archangels/ princes that you'll get outta my buddy.=20 http://home.earthlink.net/~jjg52/chibihagginti.jpg http://home.earthlink.net/~jjg52/chibinovalis.jpg PS - Beth, I'm really sorry but he couldn't do Baal. I watched him = struggle over it for hours. Daniel Archangel of Slackers "The world is... hey, pass the Doritos." - ------=_NextPart_000_08DD_01C0A330.9D687440 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, since I've movved away this seems = to be all=20 of the Chibi (super-deformed) Archangels/ princes that you'll get outta = my=20 buddy.
 
http://home.e= arthlink.net/~jjg52/chibihagginti.jpg
http://home.ea= rthlink.net/~jjg52/chibinovalis.jpg
 
PS - Beth, I'm really sorry but he = couldn't do=20 Baal. I watched him struggle over it for hours.
 
Daniel
Archangel of Slackers
"The world is... hey, pass the=20 Doritos."
- ------=_NextPart_000_08DD_01C0A330.9D687440-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 15:58:37 -0500 From: "Daniel Gallagher" Subject: IN> Chibi-chibi Well, since I've moved away it looks like this is all the Chibi (super deformed) Archangels/ Princes that you'll get out of my buddy http://home.earthlink.net/~jjg52/chibihagginti.jpg http://home.earthlink.net/~jjg52/chibinovalis.jpg PS- Beth, I'm sorry but he couldn't do Baal. I watched him struggle with it for hours ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 16:11:54 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Re: Muslim Jesus Jonathan Walton wrote: > Speaking of which, the Chinese translation of John 1 (NOTE: not 1 > John, John 1) has Jesus being the incarnation of the Dao I'm glad to hear this Once, while leafing through a dictionary of philosophy and theology (So I have strange books. We already knew this, right?), I noticed the same idea cropping up under several names in many languages. In Greek, it's Logos/"Word", or Sophia/"Wisdom," in Chinese it's Dao/"Way", in Hinduism, it's R'ta, in Egyptian myth, it's Ma'at/"Truth." There were others. It's the ordering principle that makes the universe hold together and make sense. John took the term from Greek philosophy, possibly via Philo of Alexandria, a Jewish philosopher contemporary with Jesus. In fact, given that the Holy Family fled to Egypt for a few years, Philo may have passed the Incarnate Word in the streets of Alexandria's Jewish quarter, as a toddler hanging on to Mary's finger... arl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 16:21:12 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: IN> Re: Chibi! >>Well, since I've movved away this seems to be all of the Chibi (super-deformed) Archangels/ princes that you'll get outta my buddy.<< Well, darn! I like them! I have those two now, plus the Dominic with the hammer one. I was hoping to complete the set! :) Reverend Brian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 15:38:43 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Chibi! From: > > I have those two now, plus the Dominic with the hammer one. What's the address for that one again? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:56:03 -0500 From: "Daniel Gallagher" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Chibi! http://home.earthlink.net/~jjg52/dominic.jpg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 17:06:17 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: IN> Chiba Dommie No idea where the Dominic one came from. Sorry. Forgot. Reverend Brian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:08:44 -0600 From: Santiago Subject: IN> Jesus Okay, here's my take on the whole religion thing in In Nomine world. Some people might find this vaguely irreverent or offensive, but not too much. - ---- In a bar somewhere, a scruffy-looking yet somehow attractive and charming man rambles on: "No, the whole bringing monotheism to the masses was Yves' idea, man. He thought that if we told people some version of the truth, they'd all accept it and use it to guide their lives towards positive principles...sounds reasonable, doesn't it?" He pauses to take a drink from mug of beer. "You could say that Zoroaster was sort of the beta test--tell people about the War, keep it simple, you know, just seven per side, point out that the Destiny and Fate of the universe are in their hands, assume most will make the right choice. It worked out okay, but they got a little picky with details. That 'no converts' thing they got going now is a symptom of that--too rigid, too unwilling to adapt. Anyway, like I said, it was a beta..." Another gulp serves to keep his throat lubricated. "Anyway, Yves thinks things over for a few centuries, then comes up with a finished product, and decides to let it loose. Writes the most important bits on stone tablets, then hands them over to Moses. Things go south within the hour, what with that golden calf worshipper massacre you've probably heard about. Moses comes back for another copy of the rules, which they've already ignored, and Yves gives the man some stern words. He must have let his name slip at some point, though when you pronounce it in ancient Hebrew it comes out more like 'Yahveh'...anyway, things work for a while, then problems appear. The usual, you know--corruption, sectarianism, fighting..." The man shakes his head, flopping his loose black hair about. "So, old Yves decides he needs to revise things, issue a patch, if you want it in modern jargon. This time, instead of taking it on his own, he shops around a bit for ideas. We synergize pretty well, and next thing you know I'm volunteering to deliver the message for him. We figure that this time, instead of an engraved message from on high, it'll work better if we have a more personal touch, get a human to deliver it--even if it's a human that's part divine, to make the impression stick. So, one shepherd girl and a Song of Fruition later, and I'm busy manifesting a vessel for the next thirty or so years." He pauses to absorb more of the fermented goodness. "On, the whole, it goes pretty well. People listen to me, they get the message...few things did go wrong, though. Running into that soldier of Greed in the temple got a little unpleasant. And that time I was giving the sermon when all the people showed up--I wanted to order about 6000 anchovy pizzas, then remembered that not only had they not been invented yet, these people had never seen a tomato before, so I decided to leave out the sauce, then remembered that cheese and fish probably wasn't too kosher, so I left that off, and just poofed up a bunch of flatbread and fish. Oy, and the trinity...I was explaining to the my disciples exactly who I was, and who Yves was, and how Gabriel has the gift of prophecy, and next thing you know they're claiming I'm Yves' son and Gabriel is some holy spirit hiding behind every curtain." He stares meditatively into his beer, not partaking of any just at the moment. "And, the whole thing just ended really badly... No, I don't want to talk about it, not the crucifixion, not the resurrection, and especially not that Holy Grail mess. There's a reason I decided to leave behind some memories." He breathes in deeply, then exhales, and relaxes somewhat. "You can see why I was put off of religion for a few centuries there. But, after enough time had gone by, Yves broached the topic again. This time, he got me, Gabriel, and Khalid together as a sort of focus group, and bounced more ideas off us. The end result looked pretty good, so we decided to go ahead with it. This time, though, we'd use a real human, not one of us, and I had done the hard work last time, so Gabby got the job of doing the actual delivery work. Now, between you and me, I think she was already starting to lose it even back then, and she screwed up royally. Got whole chunks of the thing wrong, and I have no idea where she got that pillow routine." One more mouthful drains the glass, which is set back down on the table. "I just sorta gave up on the whole project, but Khalid started obsessing over it, trying to fix things up. Does it seem like a coincidence that all of us that have worked on the religion thing wind up kinda looney? Makes you wonder, eh?" "Anyway, back in the sixties Yves shows up again, saying he's got another plan, but I didn't even bother listening to him. It was the straw that broke the camel's back. I just ditched the unpleasant memories he'd managed to drag up, packed my bags, and split. I still think this religion idea has merit to it, but next time it's gonna be done right. I'm researching, getting a real feel for what it means to be human, and I'm starting to think that there's no one good solution. In any case, look at the messes that hasty action has caused in the past, eh." "Well, my beer's gone, my story's over, and I gotta run--catch ya later man, and stay cool!" - -- Santiago ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:56:03 -0500 From: "Daniel Gallagher" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Chibi! http://home.earthlink.net/~jjg52/dominic.jpg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:12:34 -0600 From: Santiago Subject: Re: IN> World War I >>I think the assassination of Archduke Ferdinand stinks of the sort >>of thing that would get any one of Asmodeus, Kobal or Malphas a >>tether. Consider: the head of the Black Hand -- the terrorist group >>that killed him -- was *also* the head of the secret police >>assigned to capture them. > >I would have Kobal and Malphas struggling for control of the tether, >personally. The interlocking series of treaties that caused all the various >nations to declare war upon one another gives Factions a claim on it, yes. >But how Dark Humor comes in is through some really twisted irony. > >After a number of failed attempts on the Archduke's life, one of the members >of the Black Hand who had lost his nerve and never gotten a shot at >Ferdinand went to a cafe. Meanwhile, the Archduke's driver had gotten lost >in the confusion and taken a wrong turn while trying to return to the >castle, and by the most bizarre of chances stopped directly in front of the >assassin's table. The triumph of sheer dumb luck and circumstance which cost >so many people their lives has got to be one of the few things that raised a >laugh from Kobal this century... Well, for more ironic aspects, also consider the Ferdinand used to have himself sewn into his clothing when he put it on, so as to prevent it from shifting around and getting wrinkly. This hindered the ability of rescuers to get it off him, possibly preventing them from saving his life. - -- Santiago ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 22:16:43 From: "Janet Anderson" Subject: IN> Here's a seed for you ... My husband received the message below in his e-mail. There's ample material here for In Nomine for a person whose imagination is warped enough (hi, Moe!). And if no one else does, I may do it myself. Janet Anderson >>Hi Brethren, >> >>You now have the opportunity to purchase HOLY ANOINTING OIL, >>just like the oil used in the Bible. You can now get the same oil GOD >>speaks to the children of Israel about in Exodus 30:22-33. >> >>"This shall be an holy anointing oil unto me throughtout your generations" >>(Exodus 30:31) >> >>THIS OIL IS TO BE A BLESSING THROUGHTOUT THE GENERATIONS >>FOR ALL THE CHILDREN OF GOD. >> >>It will sanctify and make holy (Exodus 30:29). ALL CHRISTIANS can >>have this great blessing GOD gave us in his word. >> >>The oil is made according to the specifications in GOD'S word, of Myrrh, >> Calamus, Cinnamon, Cassia, and Olive Oil (Exodus 30:21-33). >> >>Please make sure you include the words HOLY ANOINTING OIL. >> >>WE WILL GET BACK TO YOU AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. >> > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2092 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2001 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.