From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Thu Mar 22 18:03:19 2001 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA27712 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 18:03:18 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id SAA12829 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 18:08:59 -0600 Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 18:08:59 -0600 Message-Id: <200103230008.SAA12829@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #2121 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Thursday, March 22 2001 Volume 01 : Number 2121 In this digest: Re: IN> The angel of Hunting Re: IN> March 20, 2001 (PK) Re: IN> March 19, 2001 (ML) Re: IN> Pentecost Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) Re: IN> Superior Trauma Re: IN> In Nomine and Superheroes: a follow-up. IN> _The_ Gun Re: IN> Re: Moe's little ditty Fwd: Re: IN> March 20, 2001 (ML) Re: IN> Curiosity about the list Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) IN> Ditty IN> Fwd: Mare Imbrium IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons and Thread Crossover Re: IN> March 20, 2001 Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons and Thread Crossover IN> irritating things Archangels do... Re: IN> irritating things Archangels do... Re: IN> irritating things Archangels do... IN> Not the Song of Tire Irons Re: IN> Not the Song of Tire Irons IN> Ugly thought of the day... Re: IN> Superior Roles Re: IN> Not the Song of Tire Irons Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) Re: IN> Superiors soul-killing celestials in vessels Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) IN> The Bizzaro Ray ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:04:26 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> The angel of Hunting - --- Charles Phipps wrote: > Mzzzttttz > Kyriotate of Jordi > Master of the Creature Within > The Angel of Hunting I would've agreed that Hunting was a Word that Jordi was unlikely to support, but this convinced me. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:08:08 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> March 20, 2001 (PK) - --- "Rev. Pee Kitty" wrote: > > Humanity v2.0beta... Or Maybe Not Rev, you worry me. This is sick and twisted. In other words, nice work. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:12:13 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> March 19, 2001 (ML) - --- Maurice Lane wrote: > Minerva** > Ethereal Digital Spirit and Superheroine > **Before anyone asks, Minerva was a particularly > sympathetic character from Heinlein's Time Enough For > Love. She was a computer that wanted to be human - > and managed the trick, oddly enough. :) Ah... I thought she sounded familiar. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:19:44 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Pentecost - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > The disciples were able to address each person in their native > tongue. This is the first recorded instance of the "gift of > tongues," > and one of the few where it is truely and purely intelligible. > Most later instances of this "gift" (even later instances > mentioned > in the New Testament) are unintelligible babbling, though > sometimes > there is someone present who is given the reciprocal gift of > interpreting what has been said. Unintelligible babbling isn't how Christians believe it. Speaking in tongues is actually two different phenomena. The first, xenoglossia, is what happens in Acts 2. The other -- what modern Charismatics call "prayer language" -- is glossolalia, or speaking in a heavenly tongue (as per the original post on this thread). In IN terms, xenoglossia is a manifestation of the Corporeal Song of Tongues while glossolalia is a temporary gifting to a mortal of the ability to speak Angelic. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 14:20:52 -0500 From: "Rolland Therrien" Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) - -----Original Message----- From: Richard Douglas Drysdale To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Date: Thursday, March 22, 2001 1:52 PM Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) > >On Thu, 22 Mar 2001, Rolland Therrien wrote: > >> Here's the strategy in a nutshell: Mike sends an army of Angelic >> Volonteers to the guy's last known location, and rush him, forcing >> him to use the song over and over and over again until he runs out >> of Essence. >> > >Forgive me for being presumptious, but there seems to be a simple solution >for Micheal to deal with this guy without requiring massive numbers of >deaths of his Servitors which people have over looked. > >Doesn't Micheal have the largest number of Saints out of all the >Archangels? > >Think about it... Dang, why didn't I think of that? It's not like the song would do anything to them, would it? - -Exit the LoneWolf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:27:04 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Superior Trauma - --- Earl Wajenberg wrote: > what if they're multi-locating when one of > their manifestations gets the axe? Do they suffer partial > Trauma, > like having your leg fall asleep, then go all numb and prickly > for a while? Oh, that does sound amusing. I can just see Michael reviewing the troops when he suddenly gets an annoyed look on his face and starts stamping his left foot... ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:30:42 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine and Superheroes: a follow-up. - --- Charles Glasgow wrote: > Don't forget an uber-vengeful over-the-top Habbalite in a > darker, more > modern version of "Black Hawk's" old costume [snip] > (I'm sure that all the comics fans knows who and what I'm > talking about > here, but I'm willing to explain if anybody doesn't know. Moe > isn't the > only one who might risk using over-obscure references.) Naaah, no need to "bat" this around on the list. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:34:22 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: IN> _The_ Gun - --- Maurice Lane wrote: > No Way I'd > Let It Into One of My Campaigns, Even As A MacGuffin. You ain't kiddin'! ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:46:38 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Walton Subject: Re: IN> Re: Moe's little ditty Shame on y'all for not including the Ethereals in the fun! Okay, I'll get it started, but you have to do the rest. A Valkyrie's plight just doesn't seem right To those who are fond of Aesir. Attempts won't elate you -- more likely frustrate you -- To take off that iron brassiere. So though they're hot-blooded, 'bout which they are candid, A certain dexterity's always demanded, But if you can take off their armor one-handed They'll run to your extra-large bed. ===== Michael Walton, #9805-068 "When you have bought your own load of hooey, you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:09:21 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Fwd: Re: IN> March 20, 2001 (ML) >Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2001 23:44:33 -0600 >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Non-member submission from ["Eric Bertish" ] [Guess who was bouncing a while back? Right. Re-s u b s c r i bing rules are at www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/listrules.html . -- Beth] >From: "Eric Bertish" >Subject: Re: IN> March 20, 2001 (ML) >Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 00:37:08 -0500 > >From: "Charles Glasgow" > >> In which case, the first time this thing falls into the hands of any loyal >> servant of any Superior, they'll invoke their boss -- who will immediately >> grab this sucker and bury it either under the Granite Throne in the Lower >> Hells or toss as far up Jacob's Ladder as they can, depending on which >side. > >Unless, say, there happens to be a version of the Saint of Killers running >around in your game. ;) > > >-- Casca > >"...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of >His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: >with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their >feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the >doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." > -- Isaiah 6:2,4 > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:11:43 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Curiosity about the list At 3:15 AM +0000 3/22/01, Rhodri James wrote: >In article , > Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >We have met, though only briefly when you, Walter and Genevieve were >leaving the vast echoing gaming halls of Bucconeer (in search of food) and >I was entering (in search of something to do). Ah! Though I fear that I only barely recall this. I do, however, seem to recall some filk songs that passed in email.... O:> (The lack of blood sugar and sleep from the con was probably the source of my forgetfulness. On the other hand, I might well remember you if I saw a picture. O:> I've only just connected a face to a name amongst the Interregnum contributors...) - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. arcangel is nursing a trout with ARMS! ARMS that reach out and try to pound the keyboard! You say "And teeth. Ow." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:17:43 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) At 12:50 PM -0500 3/22/01, Krishnaswami, Neel wrote: >It turns the target into an ordinary human. What about that Swarm of Locusts That Is Turning The Sky Black And Goes By The Name Of Jordi? O:> (I don't think I'd want to face even 5 Forces' worth of ticked off Jordi-swarm. Especially if he were in killer bees.) - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. arcangel is nursing a trout with ARMS! ARMS that reach out and try to pound the keyboard! You say "And teeth. Ow." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:27:25 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) At 6:25 PM -0500 3/22/01, Charles Glasgow wrote: >The way I see it, even those angels who don't *agree* with her all still >*like* her, because she is one of the most likeable beings in the entire >Symphony. Doing nasty things to somebody that well-liked is the equivalent >of a signed and notarized suicide note. *eg* Whether or not one decides if they _like_ her, it's certainly the sort of thing that would get high-level Word-bound chasing after the possessor of the Song. Probably Kyriotates of the Sword with the Hunt attunement, Cherubim of Judgment ("Guess who, idiot?"), and others who can target the demon for smiting. Travel in pairs, one in deep cover, the other more obvious. After all, if there is something that affects Superiors, then it doesn't matter if it's happened to Novalis (who may or may not be liked) or Marc (who gets the prize for Most Hated when you break down the relationships!). It's a threat. And yes, as pointed out, it will do diddly to Saints. The next question is.... If Asmodeus is using his Humanity attunement, what happens? O:> [If one is going to have such a Song wandering around, one should probably say it _can't_ be used by Superiors, or some Superior is going to wring the Song out of a captive, and then things just get silly.] [But it's not happening at all IMC. O:> ] - --Beth, typing w/a uncoopertive baby (iolanthe) causing typos. arcangel is nursing a trout with ARMS! ARMS that reach out and try to pound the keyboard! You say "And teeth. Ow." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:18:20 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: IN> Ditty Excuse me for being a philistine, but these poems? What is the name of the style being used? And I know this has been asked, but when are we going to see a compilation, suitable for printing? I'd settle for just the major choirs and bands. Prefer it actually, and just staple on the extras as add-ons. :) Reverend Brian A. Rogers ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:51:14 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Fwd: Mare Imbrium >Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 13:56:01 -0600 >Subject: BOUNCE in_nomine-l@lists.io.com: Non-member submission from [Michael Walton ] >Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 11:49:21 -0800 (PST) >From: Michael Walton >Subject: Mare Imbrium > > What's going on with IN:MI? I have the humpbacks' creation >story (and ideas for the Fall of the whales), but I haven't seen >the humpback species primer yet. > >===== >Michael Walton, #9805-068 >"When you have bought your own load of hooey, >you know exactly what it is worth." -- Bruce Sterling > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. >http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 14:32:37 -0600 (CST) From: Benjamin Acosta Subject: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons and Thread Crossover On Thu, 22 Mar 2001, in_nomine-digest wrote: > From: "Krishnaswami, Neel" > Subject: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) > > Getting more serious, I really don't like using superiors as NPCs. > The power differential between a superior and a PC is just too > big -- it makes having complex relationships between them harder > to do. So anything that makes them scarcer and easier to take > down is a good thing in my book. Well, if you want something that PC level characters could potentially intimidate Superiors with, you could always give them something like the Ultimate Nullifier, which could totally anihilate any target if the user had a strong enough will to activate it. And could accept the fact that it would anihilate him as well. So you could threaten a Superior with it, but it really couldn't be too abused by a PC more than once. Hmmm, the Ultimate Nullifier as a relic of Mariel, Demon Princess of Oblivion. That might work. And to add to the cross thread converngence, Haagenti could have Galactus as a Superior Role. Uatu, of course, needs no change. Tall, ancient being who wields cosmic powers and is mostly content to observe humanity. Definitely a Grigori. He is, after all, a Watcher. Can you tell I've got comics on the brain? Ben, Elohite of Eli Angel of Neat Ideas ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 14:49:56 -0600 (CST) From: Benjamin Acosta Subject: Re: IN> March 20, 2001 On Thu, 22 Mar 2001, in_nomine-digest wrote: > From: Maurice Lane > > _The_ Gun > > Anyway, the modified Celestial Song of Life takes > effect. Humans will immediately be transformed into a > reliever, imp or gremlin (GM call which, based on > whether the person is nice or not) of the same number > of Forces. So what happens if a hypothetical 9 Force human is struck with it (A Saint, for example, could eventually grow to 9 and up)? Do they just become very big relievers or do they instantly fledge? I'd guess they fledge as Grigori. They are the closest to humanity, after all. Ben, Elohite of Eli Angel of Neat Ideas ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:09:34 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) From: "Elizabeth McCoy" > > The next question is.... If Asmodeus is using his Humanity attunement, > what happens? O:> Oooooh, you just gave me an idea for how to make this work... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:12:33 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons and Thread Crossover >From: Benjamin Acosta >Subject: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons and Thread Crossover >Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 14:32:37 -0600 (CST) [snip] >Hmmm, the Ultimate Nullifier as a relic of Mariel, Demon Princess of >Oblivion. That might work. !@#$%!@^%@!^%#@$!%!@#%!@# Why didn't *I* think of that? - -- Chuckg _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: 22 Mar 2001 21:12:43 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: IN> irritating things Archangels do... ...to each other! (it's a silly seed, but hey, why not?) we know Michael refers to Dominic and his Servitors as 'hyenas of Heaven.' Janus is capable of stealing just about anything from anyone, anywhere, if only to see the look on their faces when they realize it's gone and he has it. i can't think of anything else that's established canon, but something just occurred to me that Novalis might do to irk Michael after he's pushed her far enough for a week or month or however long it takes Novy to reach her breaking point... In fact, she commissioned Eli to craft a special stereo for her with the Celestial Song of Tongues embedded into it specifically for the purpose of blaring her favorite songs at the Firstborn when she just can't stand her frustration any more. Rumor has it she's been stuck on the song that got Edwin Starr famous for the last ten years, and Michael is going just as bonkers as Gabriel.... -=|horsefly|=- "God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." --Voltaire ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 16:32:07 -0500 From: "Rolland Therrien" Subject: Re: IN> irritating things Archangels do... - -----Original Message----- From: -=|horsefly|=- To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Cc: ebergese@haywire.csuhayward.edu ; walkie74@yahoo.com Date: Thursday, March 22, 2001 4:19 PM Subject: IN> irritating things Archangels do... >...to each other! (it's a silly seed, but hey, why not?) > >we know Michael refers to Dominic and his Servitors as 'hyenas of Heaven.' Janus is capable of stealing just about anything from anyone, anywhere, if only to see the look on their faces when they realize it's gone and he has it. I figure that these days, Dominic and his Servitors return the favor to Michael and his Servitors by creating more forms to fill whenever Songs are used on the Corporeal Plane. "Lots of Forms. To be filled in Triplicate. And try to get it right, or else we'll have to start it all over." And then there's how Blandine gets at Marc when he does something annoying like try to market the image of Ethereals: Find some of Marc's targeted executives, and give them the dream to aspire to religious enlightement, as a religious -Monk-. Marc, of course, doesn't do anything to annoy other Archangels... Intentionally. But he always manages to find something one Archangel wants, and tells them he'll give it to them. For a reasonnable Price. But that's not what annoys them: It's that smirk on his face when he just - -Knows- they have to agree to the bargain to get what they want that really gets to them. Nabiki Tendo's got nothing on Marc. *g* - -Exit the LoneWolf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:32:33 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> irritating things Archangels do... >In fact, she commissioned Eli to craft a special stereo for her with the >Celestial Song of Tongues embedded into it specifically for the purpose of >blaring her favorite songs at the Firstborn when she just can't stand her >frustration any more. Rumor has it she's been stuck on the song that got >Edwin Starr famous for the last ten years, and Michael is going just as >bonkers as Gabriel.... *giggle* Bad idea. *Never* get in a war of competing boom boxes with somebody who owns the entire John Phillip Sousa collection, can fill an entire parade ground with regimental bagpipers, *and* can bring you a special "1812 Overture" performance complete with *real* artillery sound effects... brought to you live and direct by real artillerymen. (Hey, even if they are firing blank charges, still, the *noise*... eeeesh!) - -- Chuckg _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 15:39:02 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: IN> Not the Song of Tire Irons (Beth's comment about the Humanity attunement is to blame for this, just in case anybody wondered...) Mortality Asmodeus uses this variant of his Humanity attunement this to punish demons that have committed offenses that require punishment less grievous than force-stripping or soul-death. For a duration chosen by the Prince of the Game at the time of sentencing, the demon is indistinguishable from a member of whatever species its current vessel resembles. The demon loses all access to its songs, attunements and resonance for the duration of the sentence, as well as the ability to consciously control its essence expenditure (few of those sentenced to this have managed to appreciate the fact that their actions do not cause disturbance once they realise that they have expended their entire store of essence on something as trivial as locating their housekeys, but I digress.) The only exception to this is that the demon may still be observed via its Heart (which becomes almost entirely unbreakable during the duration of the sentence.) Until the sentence has been lifted, the demon is forced to assume a temporary Role, typically level 3 or lower. Asmodeus typically assigns a cherub of The Game to keep watch over the demon being sentenced to this punishment, although some of the worst offenders are left to fend for themselves as best they can. If the sentenced demon is killed during the duration of this punishment, it faces the usual risk of Trauma. Once recovered from that, Asmodeus will almost invariably lecture the demon on not being so clumsy, then sentence it to an even longer term of Mortality. Rumors of the Prince of The Game having particularly annoying demons killed while Mortal in order to lengthen their sentences are exactly that, as are those concerning the Archangel of Justice posessing a similar punishment attunement. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:54:32 From: "Charles Glasgow" Subject: Re: IN> Not the Song of Tire Irons [snip] >Until the sentence has been lifted, the demon is forced to assume a >temporary Role, typically level 3 or lower. Asmodeus typically assigns a >cherub of The Game Nitpick -- Djinn. [snip] >Rumors of the Prince of The Game having particularly annoying demons killed >while Mortal in order to lengthen their sentences are exactly that, as are >those concerning the Archangel of Justice Nitpick -- Judgement. (Unless, of course, this is for some net.book whose details I am unaware of. If that is the case, please disregard.) >posessing a similar punishment attunement. Actually, if Dominic had this attunement, he'd use it on every single angel ever Outcast from Heaven that he knew existed. *It keeps them from being able to make too much trouble*. I can understand why the Game wouldn't want to do anybody else any favors re: using this to lock down Outcasts, but Heaven tends to be organized a bit differently. - -- Chuckg _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:59:37 GMT From: daiv@cruzio.com Subject: IN> Ugly thought of the day... Kyroiotate of Jordi, in service to fire, with both his native attunement, and Gabriels Malakite attunement (thats the one that give the user green fire around his hands, right?) "Hey, look, fireflies!" As an extra added bonus, The Kyriotate gets a char broiled ex demon vessel to eat, thus leaving his hosts better off than he found them. - -Daiv tech writer in service to Coffee. "This is not what I meant when i said I wanted to write science fiction!!" ------------------------------ Date: 22 Mar 2001 21:57:43 -0000 From: "-=|horsefly|=-" Subject: Re: IN> Superior Roles On Tue, 20 Mar 2001 07:39:55 -0500 Cameron McCurry wrote: >> Personally, I've always imagined the AA of Children as >> the one person you _don't_ betray - and God help you >> if you harm any kid in his presence > > You know, I considered that myself shortly after sending it out. I >had read your references to Christopher on your page and it made a lot >of sense. In fact, I play a Malakim of Christopher's in World Weavers >and you gave me some good ideas to work with on his personality. > Ah well. Chalk it up to human error on my part. Glad you liked it >otherwise. see, my view of Christopher is similar to Moe's (he'll never let you live after you maliciously harm a child), but i've always been fond of something out of Babylon-5 that Chris fits just fine: "First you will know pain, then you will know fear, then you will die." i can easily see Christopher as loving, tender, compassionate, and fiercely protective of his charges, but once angered, he's nothing sort of obsessive and sadistically psychotic in his persuit. it makes perfect sense to me that he'd torture a demon to vessel death the first time he found it, but after that would hunt it relentlessly (with the Song of Affinity rather than risking Dissonance from attuning to a target), eventually soul-killing the offender. -=|horsefly|=- "It was a different time: a time of blood and guns and killings.... It was a time when killers needed saints, for so much of God's good work was being done." --SAINT OF KILLERS #4, Garth Ennis ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 16:14:47 -0600 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Not the Song of Tire Irons From: "Charles Glasgow" > > Nitpick -- Djinn. > > Nitpick -- Judgement. > > (Unless, of course, this is for some net.book whose details I am unaware of. > If that is the case, please disregard.) No, I was working from memory while distracted and without any of my books available. Although it could have been some bleed-through from Moe's netbook working on me. > >posessing a similar punishment attunement. > > Actually, if Dominic had this attunement, he'd use it on every single angel > ever Outcast from Heaven that he knew existed. *It keeps them from being > able to make too much trouble*. It could open them to being punished in excess of their crimes, though, so it would be skirting dissonance for him to do that to all of them. And it's just a rumor, anyway. ;;;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 23:10:01 GMT From: daiv@cruzio.com Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) > >It turns the target into an ordinary human. > > What about that Swarm of Locusts That Is Turning The Sky Black And Goes > By The Name Of Jordi? O:> (I don't think I'd want to face even 5 Forces' > worth of ticked off Jordi-swarm. Especially if he were in killer bees.) Hmmm... Can a Calabite target a Swarm? Or does he have to pick the little buggers off one by one? - -Daiv tech writer in service to Coffee. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 18:24:29 -0500 From: "William J. Keith" Subject: Re: IN> Superiors soul-killing celestials in vessels >> Well, only Superiors know it. But it's rumored these Songs can be found by >> a determined searcher... and technically, they could be taught. > >No. It's RESTRICTED - Superiors Only. Only Superiors can use it. Even if >you could teach it to an angel or human, they couldn't use it, anymore >than a non-Seraph could use the Song of Truthswearing. If you want to >change it from "Restricted - Superiors" to "Secret", in your campaign, go >for it... but expect some MAJOR munchkining. It's listed under the Restricted Songs, because it effectively is, and because the Secret Songs are known only to a few Superiors, so it's not exactly Secret. But firstly, here's the text, direct quote: "...no Archangel or Prince would ever give his Servitors the power to create Servitors of their own. But from time to time, certain beings have demonstrated the power to control life and death, giving rise to speculation that the Songs of Life can be discovered by anyone who searches long enough." This has the dual implications that, first, if an Archangel wanted to, they could perfectly well give this Song to a Servitor, and second, that it can be found via research. Exactly what I said. Second, here's the text from the Celestial Song: "The performer must either use his own Forces, or have other Forces available with which to 'build' the new celestial - and only Superiors can juggle loose Forces like that." This strongly implies that a non-Superior *can* use this Song -- a human trying to make a 3-Force reliever might even survive the process. Thirdly, negative evidence -- all the other Songs in this section specifically have the text, "only _______ can learn/perform/etc. this Song." This one merely says that these Songs "are solely the province of Superiors." Lastly, check out my post on Dec. 7, 2000 entitled "Adventure," and Beth's reply on Dec. 9, in which I explore exactly this notion, and our esteemed Djinn Princess of Nit-Picking lauds the idea and says nothing about non-canon bits. (The only non-canon bit I see on review was the subtle question of how the relievers got their Vessels. But then, perhaps that was part of the initial creation process.) So yeah. It's not likely ever to see the light of day below the Superior level, and doubtless beings who demonstrate this ability (or even look like they're attempting to acquire it) are probably quickly "discouraged." But then, I in no way claimed that it was likely to happen. >-- >Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian, Q4B4L! William ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 18:46:47 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Re: The Song of Tire Irons (was Re: New Song ...) At 6:25 PM -0500 3/22/01, Charles Glasgow wrote: >>And even if he didn't, what do you think Michael would do to a guy who >>not only has that kind of power available to him, but tried it out >>on the closest thing he has to a girlfriend? > >Well, the "closest thing to a girlfriend" is non-canon. In canon, it's CDaU. Or even canted the other way. We can speculate that their mutual Hostility comes from repressing a mutual attraction, and enjoy it. (I know I do. ) But, in Canon they *are* Hostile to each other. We should remember that, more than we do. Of course, it's not as *fun...* >However, even in canon, Michael would get screamingly pissed -- >protection of the innocent is a significant driving force in his >makeup, and if it gets more innocent then Novalis then where the >heck did *that* happen? I can see this, and yet I can also see him getting *smug* as Hell. After all, this has vindicated his entire worldview *over* her worldview, and put a major thorn in his side (pun intended) into the Superior equivilant of Trauma. I expect he, Laurence and David will lay the smackdown on whoever did it, but be quite gratified "Novalis finally got the lesson she deserved." Of course, this is assuming the Song can even be sung to Novalis. She *does* have her Seraph attunement, and as a Superior, it's *much* more powerful.... >(Not to mention that Zadkiel would literally be frothing at the >mouth. She's even more intense on this topic than Michael, plus >Novalis is her best friend and one-time mentor.) Zadkiel will go as wholeheartedly spastic on whoever did this as any Superior level Cherub who's just had a beloved (attuned?) spacked with extreme prejudice, times two hundred for her Word. Zadkiel will be downright *mean.* >Anything that takes out an Archangelic Vessel this easily and >cheesily will get the Vengeance Squad O' Doom from Heaven -- >Michael, Laurence, Gabriel (picking on Novalis is just plain cruel, >cruel, cruel), and... Gabriel, yes. Michael and Laurence purely for tactical reasons. Gabriel it probably depends on the day. >... well, geez, like we *need* more? OK, fine, we'll get it -- toss >in Novalis' entire "Friendly" and "Associated" lists. Well, yeah. - -- Eric Alfred Burns - Habbalite of Belaboring the Point ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 18:02:17 -0600 (CST) From: Benjamin Acosta Subject: IN> The Bizzaro Ray Tsk tsk, Moe. We were all having mindless superhero fun and you had to whip out of gun. You do know you've started an arms race? I almost drew my Redemption Gun, but I decided to actually make something that could possibly be quantified with points. The Symphonic Connection Amplifier No one is sure where it came from. Jean denies making it. After all, it's not his style. A lot of people suspect Eli, but he's not around to confirm or deny it. Of course, it could be Vapula's, but why in the Hell would he make something like this? Then again, why in the Hell does he make anything? Dubbed by the Lightning Team which is testing it, The Symphonic Connection Amplifier looks like a ray gun from a 50's sci-fi movie. It's very simple to use. Just point the Inverter at a being and pull the trigger. With a loud Zap!, the target is hit with a ray of pure white light. He may then try to resist with a Will roll. If the target is a demon, the Will roll is penalized by the total levels of discord it has. If an angel, any levels of discord act as a bonus should it wish to resist. If they fail to resist, the being must endure the effects of the ray for its Celestial Forces in hours. Researchers theorize that the ray actually a transmission of a variant Celestial Song of Faith. Of coure, this is only conjecture. No one is sure what it actually does. Another popular theory that there's actually a Tear of God inside the mechanism, and the inverter merely projects a minute portion of its power. Unfortunately, since the inverter is unbreakable, they haven't been able to open it up and check. What the ray seems to do is open up or strengthen a connection between a being and the Symphony. Angels become totally partially subsumed by their divine nature, sort of like a weaker version of the Celestial Song of Faith. They must make a Will roll penalized by their Celestial Forces + the CD of a failed Resistance Roll to act in any way contrary to their Choir and Word. Ethereals, when they fail to resist, are drawn instantly back to their domain in the Marches, where they must stay for the duration of the effect. Unless, of course, they are summoned by a sorceror. When that occurs, the Ethereal suffers a penalty equal to the sorceror's Celestial Forces in any attempts to resist him in a Will War, or any sorcerous powers. Humans who are affected by the beam become Symphonically Aware for the duration. For those who already are Symphonically Aware, such as Soldiers, they instead gain the Ethereal and Celestial Connections for that time period, and sometimes the instinctive ability to use Songs they do not know as well. Sorcerors recieve a bonus equal to their Celestial Forces in any sorcerous skill and rituals. Undead, well they become fully living human beings for the duration. Some say if they died in such a state, their souls would again be caught up by the Wheel of Destiny and Fate, but no one knows if any have chanced it. It's what it does to demons which caused some Creationers to dub it the Bizzaro Ray. Those in Lighting described it more accurately as a Symphonic Polarity Inversion Effect. What the ray seems to do to demons is somehow create a temporary link to the Symphony. Simply stated, an affected demon is the subject of a pseudo-redemption which lasts for the duration of the effect. Symphonically, for all intents and purposes, for those few hours he's flipped to the Choir counterpart of his Band. He's has its Resonance and Dissonance conditions. He loses access to any Infernal Attunements, Rites and Distinction abilities, though they will return when the effect ends. On the plus side, for the duration of the effect he's no longer subject to the Dissonance Conditions of either his Band or his Word. Alas, as this is not a real redemption, he keeps any dissonance he's accumulated. The basic personality of the demon remains the same, though there have been reports of an affected demon's attitude being somewhat affected by the nature of his new state of being. What's really interesting is what happens if attempts to convert dissonance into discord. Unlike "real" angels, it can accumulate the Selfless Discord. In fact, any dissonance it attempts to convert in this state tends to become the Selfless Discord (any random roll which sends one to the Celestial Discord table instead automatically inflicts the Selfless Discord). Any Selfless Discord accumulated does not interfere with its gaining essence as long as it remains an "angel." Of course, once it's reverted back to its demonic state, this Discord will interfere with gaining essence just like any other Celestial Discord. For a potential Redemption Canidate, being zapped might be the shock which convinces them to seek the real thing. For those who are basically unrepentant, this usually sends them in a descending spiral into Discordant Madness. As you can probably guess, the Princes are not happy that this thing is around. They're grateful for the fact that there is only one. Unfortunately for them, Vapula's attempts to produce an Infernal Counterpart utilizing the Celestial Song of Self has so far met with failure. Of course, it doesn't help that they first tried to test it on was a Malakite, which only seemed to make it more powerful and adamant about slaying evil. At least that's what one reported in their last transmission. Oh, in case your wondering how hideously expensive it is, here's a breakdown. Relic/6 (Song of Faith Variant?)...........48pts Reliquary/6 (only usable with Relic).......12pts Activation Time: 1 Round...................+1pt Disturbance: Creates none (it merely amplifies the Symphony to the target).....+15pts Fragility: Totally Unbreakable............+10pts Use Enhancement: Anyone can use Relic......+6pts Use Enhancement: Anyone can use Reliquary..+3pts Visibility: Automatically detectable.......-3pts Total Cost: 92 points Pricey, isn't it? Not that any sane GM would let you buy it in the first place. Ben, Elohite of Eli Angel of Neat Ideas ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #2121 ******************************** The material here is (C) 2001 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.