From owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Wed Oct 29 02:37:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA07566 for ; Wed, 29 Oct 1997 02:37:09 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id CAA12034 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Wed, 29 Oct 1997 02:26:59 -0600 Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 02:26:59 -0600 Message-Id: <199710290826.CAA12034@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #445 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@LISTS.IO.COM Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Wednesday, October 29 1997 Volume 01 : Number 445 In this digest: Re: IN> Elohim etymology Re: IN> Celestial Genesis Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] Bright Victory? Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] Re: IN> Beth's post munge, take 2 Re: IN> [FLUFF} An IN Halloween Re: IN> [Dark Victory] Media Malakim Re: IN> Dissonance Maintenance Re: IN> Hebrew in IN and fluff. Re: IN> Beth's post munge, take 2 IN> Few questions, A Re: IN> [Dark Victory] Media Malakim IN> Falling IN> Tabloids strike again! IN> IMPORTANT message Re: IN> IMPORTANT message Re: IN> Few questions, A Re: IN> Any ideas? IN> Errata here? Re: IN> Any ideas? Re: IN> [DV] PLACES: The Holy City of Rio de Janeiro Re: IN> Errata here? Re: IN> [DV] PLACES: The Holy City of Rio de Janeiro IN> [DV] Cities After the Apocalypse IN> [FLUFF] Superior Book Endorsements ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:06:49 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> Elohim etymology > >Hello there. > >As one who speaks the "holy tongue" Hebrew, I can't help but wonder. > >"Elohim" is a Hebrew word meaning, literally, "gods". It is the name God >uses to emphasize his being genderless, single and plural, in the Old >Testament. > >What made the people at SJG decide that Elohim are kinds of angels? Couldn't it also mean, 'those who are of God?' Redneck (just guessing, but remember, it's only a game) Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:39:33 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> Celestial Genesis >On Tue, 28 Oct 1997, Emily Dresner wrote: > >And lets not forget vap.alt.sex.lilim.yes.please.mistress > I'm not touching that one with a forty foot turkey baster. }:-{D Redneck (yes, Beth knows, she knows how depraved we can be, my Precious) Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:04:32 From: Jeff Miller Subject: Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] Bright Victory? >>>> Eris goddess/AA of discord? >>> >>>Goddess of Discord, Chaos, and All Things Funky. The only reason she'd >>>be an Archangel would be to get into the Seraphim Council long enough to >>>do some fruit throwing. >>> >>The thought of a horde of Cherubs or Djinn Attuning to the apple.... >> >>Or, give it to a Lilim... ...what a quandry! > >"Okay, who *Needs* this the *MOST*??" > >(Bidding war, bidding war!) > Yeah, but would she be willing to give it up? Jeff Miller Program Director/Webmaster for Agamemcon II Burbank Airport Hilton -- May 22-24, 1998 Contact Info: 24161-H Hollyoak (714)643-8352 Laguna Hills, CA 92656 www.primenet.com/~shadocat/agamemcon.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:55:16 -0600 From: Jaeden Subject: Re: IN> [DARK VICTORY] Redneck Gaijin wrote: > > >PERRY M. LLOYD wrote: > >> > >> >With all the things happening in the In Nomine world, what about > >> >vengeance? With the change in alliances and Saminga going force hungry, > >> >I bet someone just might be a little mad. > >> > > >> >Is there a AA or word-bound in the In Nomine books, or do I have to > >> >create them? > >> > > >> >With Uriel it might be something like this : Impure*slash*, Impure*slash > >> >Impure impure impure *slash*slash*slash* *insane cackle* > >> > > >> >Jaeden > >> > >> I'd say so. > > > >Glad you agree, how about the Angel of Vengeance? I did a prelim > >writeup for an AA, but he will probably end up being a Malakim of Fire, > >word-bound to vengeance > > > Actually, I am going to plunk the Renegade Lilim Kallisti (not to be > mistaken for any Etherials by that name), Demon of Vengeance into 'Rebirth > of Liberty.' Maybe a redeemed Malakite instead, I just love that idea. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 20:11:27 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Beth's post munge, take 2 At 10:20 PM -0500 10/27/97, Casca wrote: >On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >> >So limbo is a Celestial Realm of sorts? Okay, that works... >> >> Limbo is a state, not a place. It may be a place, it may be what >> a celestial experiences while spread out all over creation, it >> may be the "rests"/gaps in the Symphony. Nobody knows. Vapula >> may well send a few dozen imps into Limbo periodically, trying to >> conduct experiments. > >A couple of week back -- long before H&H was out -- I speculated upon the >existence of Purgatory, a third Celestial realm. It was where human souls >went when they weren't good enough for heaven and not bad enough for hell. >Alas, no one responded to it.... > >I was so hoping to get feedback, too. Well, Limbo's been around a bit longer. However, I've known about it for a while, so I *couldn't* comment. Currently, there's no canon Purgatory, except maybe the Marches... Which isn't to say you can't use it, or that other people can't use it, or whatever... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 20:32:43 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> [FLUFF} An IN Halloween At 9:42 AM -0500 10/28/97, Emily Dresner wrote: >Yeah. I'm gonna remember that for gaming on Thursday. I can see my token >Happy Fun Bal using that. "Contrary to what the damn angel told you, I am >NOT a Balseraph. I'm a hubcap. And you want to go to bed with me. It'll >do well for your career." > >Cool cool cool. > >- Em, who is wondering why all her demonic NPCs are horny all the time. Well, my demonic PC is... *ahem* Well, what do you expect -- she's got two of them.... I hope someone takes pictures if the Happy Fun Bal gets his way. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 20:18:59 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> [Dark Victory] Media Malakim At 12:22 AM -0600 10/28/97, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >>On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >> >>> No, the Malakim need something constructive to do, something which promotes >>> the Word. I really liked the idea of Malakim being action heroes... except >>> how many 'Surname: Texas Ranger' shows could you have at one time? }:-{D >>> Something like that would work... maybe Malakim as stuntmen... hmmm... >> >>How about as investigative journalists? Reporters who uncover >>illegal/unethical/dishonorable practices and expose them for all the >>world to see....cameramen who go into war zones to film the atrocities >>there so that the world may know....angels who are willing to fight and >>die for the story "Because the people have a right to know, dammit!" >> >>Maybe I've just been playing too much Cyberpunk recently. >> >.......................................... > >0_o > >... Beth, what's the Malakite Attunement for Litheroy? "The foes of Litheroy's Malakim cannot hide. Once the Malakite has entered into honorable combat with a foe, he will know exactly where that foe is until" one of 'em croaks or swaps realms. The foe doesn't get to hide, either -- the Malakite can see through walls, practically. >We may just have a winner... }:-{D > >Redneck (why the Surt didn't I think of that? }:-{D ) You can't grab *all* the inspiration particles. I like it too. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 20:30:41 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Dissonance Maintenance At 6:00 AM -0500 10/28/97, dwood@skipjack.bluecrab.org wrote: >Quoth "Elizabeth McCoy " on 10/27/97 6:19 PM... > >>At 2:30 PM -0600 10/26/97, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >>>As such, the first time an Angel fails a Dissonance roll or draws a Demonic >>>Intervention, they Fall. >> >>As a general note, with the exception of Infernal Intervention, an angel >>*cannot* Fall accidentially. > >Here is the statement which has prompted this reply -- there is a note of >Falsehood to it which I feel must be whacked upon severely... >[Dissonance roll mechanics lovingly snipped] > >>First note: roll higher than 0. No problem. > >Odds of fallling = 1/216. Those pesky 666s. You've tried scrubbing, >you've tried soaking... > >Let's just say that in this case, a problem isn't anticipated. > >>Second note: roll higher than 1. No problem. > >Odds of falling = 1/216. 111, as you point out, means good stuff. 666 >means bad stuff. And BTW, the stuffs are detailed on p. 58. > >>Third note: roll higher than 2. But if you roll a 111, something *good* >> happens! > >Odds of falling = 8/216. 111 is good stuff. Any combination of 1s and 2s >on three dice (there's 7 of them) or 666 means losing ground. Re: selfbap -- roll 2 or higher. And 111 is always good. No falling. >>Now, if you get 3 notes of dissonance, you convert it to Discord > >*NOT* automatically. No, but if you're paranoid... Yes, you can try to correct it -- but you are still making a conscious choice to "live dangerously" while you attempt to do so. If you get more dissonance... It was by your own free will, not by accident, that you were in a position where it might happen. >Discord, however, can only be removed by a superior, and usually only >after a damned good explanation. (And a tongue-lashing.) But it means you weren't Falling... So what you do is fix it at the first two notes, and never *get* to 3. >Okay, that's the stuff for the Angelic side. > >What about demons? > >Demons who fail dissonance rolls merely pick up more Discord and >dissonance. And more, and more and more... >They are never required to seek Redemption, and in fact, >Diabolic society has no real problem with Celestial or Ethereal Discords. > >So at what point are demons forced to redeem? Or are they? They are not. A demon must choose of his own free will to repent, and find an Archangel willing to untangle his twisted Forces. Of course, after your head is messed with enough by Discord and dissonance, you might just be willing to try *anything*... But even that usually takes some brainwashing to get the demon thinking that selfless = good. Elohim are very good at it, the ruthless, manipulative little critters. >Can they just >keep soaking up dissonance until they finally pick up a few Celestial >discords and agents of Asmodeus say "C'mere, punk..."? (The latter case >is a bit too YMMVish for my tastes; I'd like some sort of guideline to go >by.) Basically. Though some alterations of that may be in the works... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 20:29:50 -0500 (EST) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Hebrew in IN and fluff. > >>Haven't you ever noticed? They're all... leafy! > >I thought that was only Novalis... > > Cabbages in Hebrew is "KROOVIM". This has been transliterated in the King > James bible to "Cherubim". The original use of the word, however, seems to > be to refer to angels, just like "Seraphim". No plausible explanatation > (possibly excepting the above) connects the angel types to cabbages, or > indeed to any other vegetable. But there it is. You clearly have never met my Players. I have two cherubs. I tend to shake my head alot and wonder. Cabbages, indeed! :) - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 13:38:28 +1100 From: christopher.stevenson@aihw.gov.au (Christopher Stevenson) Subject: Re: IN> Beth's post munge, take 2 >>I was so hoping to get feedback, too. > >Well, Limbo's been around a bit longer. However, I've known about >it for a while, so I *couldn't* comment. > >Currently, there's no canon Purgatory, except maybe the Marches... > >Which isn't to say you can't use it, or that other people can't >use it, or whatever... > Hmm, a shared dream realm for like-minded shades? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 22:17:46 -0500 (EST) From: "Dr. Todd W. Page, Esq." Subject: IN> Few questions, A Hey all, this is my first post to this list. *GASP* :) Wow. Im sure you're all honored and all that, but anyways: to the point. I was just wondering in general about saints and sorcerers. I hear 'bout them a lot, but alas, I cant find any IN books where I am, and I really want to use a sorcerer in my game (if they are what I think they are) so.. if anyone wants to, they can Email me privately (twpage@mailbox.syr.edu) just a short li'l deal about what the heck these dudes are.. please do. :) I'd be very grateful, and all that. On a different note, I'd like to pose a question. :) A lot of times on this list, and on the web and even in the books I think, people refer to the eternal struggle of Satan Vs. God. But to me it seems a lot more like Satan vs the archangels. In my game atleast, I see God as above both heaven _AND_ hell... Satan falling was just as much a part of his plan as anything else was. Does anyone else see things this way or am I just kinda insane? :) Anywho.. thanks for reading. - -Todd/He who poseses no cool IN-ish nickname yet. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 21:10:03 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> [Dark Victory] Media Malakim >At 12:22 AM -0600 10/28/97, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >>>On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Redneck Gaijin wrote: >>> >>>> No, the Malakim need something constructive to do, something which promotes >>>> the Word. I really liked the idea of Malakim being action heroes... except >>>> how many 'Surname: Texas Ranger' shows could you have at one time? }:-{D >>>> Something like that would work... maybe Malakim as stuntmen... hmmm... >>> >>>How about as investigative journalists? Reporters who uncover >>>illegal/unethical/dishonorable practices and expose them for all the >>>world to see....cameramen who go into war zones to film the atrocities >>>there so that the world may know....angels who are willing to fight and >>>die for the story "Because the people have a right to know, dammit!" >>... Beth, what's the Malakite Attunement for Litheroy? > >"The foes of Litheroy's Malakim cannot hide. Once the Malakite has >entered into honorable combat with a foe, he will know exactly where >that foe is until" one of 'em croaks or swaps realms. The foe doesn't >get to hide, either -- the Malakite can see through walls, practically. > Thank you, Beth... MALAKIM OF NYBBAS: Malakim of Communications are almost all former Malakites of Litheroy. They frequently partner with reporters- not the gossip columnist or restraunt critic (okay, sometimes the restraunt critic- urp!) but a true investigative muckraker reporter. Malakim of Nybbas are sworn to never, ever kill a human save in self-defense; however, when they use their Resonance to spot a -human- evildoer, they may use their Resonance again to attune themselves to the location of the target for a number of days equal to the check digit. It is very, very difficult to shake off the Truth when it's on your tail... Redneck (the other idea had its points, but this seemed better) Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 22:17:17 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Falling >>>Here's where we get into priorities. "Well, this Dissonance is temporary, it'll go away soon as I fix it, I'll hold off on the Discord growth." or "This Dissonance will go away, but i don't want to take any chances. I'll just have green blood for a while, until I can do a big favor for my Superior."<<< And that's exactly the point. Beth is assuming that every angel who gets 3 points of dissonance will automatically convert it to Discord. That's not necessarily true. There are some fairly easy ways to remove dissonance (easy compared to removing Discord, anyway), and the prospect of "hanging in there" until you can go purify yourself may appeal more than inflicting a visible badge of celestial shame that will take a long time and a REALLY big favor to your Superior to get rid of. I agree that as dissonance goes beyond 3, an angel who doesn't convert it is really courting a Fall, and so getting 4 or more points might seem foolhardy....but as long as you haven't Fallen *yet*, you can always tell yourself "I am NOT going to do *anything* else dissonant until I get this fixed!" And of course, an angel who's accumulated 3+ points of dissonance in the first place is obviously having trouble with his angelic nature... In other words-- yes, following strict game mechanics and assuming that all angels are rules-lawyering PCs, it would seem highly unlikely that any angel would ever Fall. Looking it at from an angel's point of view, though, it is easy to see how some might put themselves in a perilous position. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 22:39:01 -0500 (EST) From: Mark Kinney Subject: IN> Tabloids strike again! I'm looking at a copy of the Nov. 4 1997 Weekly World News. A big article on pg 24-27 is a great guide to Angel Watching, "An Exciting Guide to Spotting God's Winged Helpers." Complete with a listing of the ten basic types (not really similar to In Nomine ones at all :-) and where one can best find them. ObInNomine: Now... I can see a possible adventure hook here. Perhaps a Balseraph is using the odd belief one can occasionally find in this kind of thing in a weird twist of the "corrupt evangelist" stereotype. Or maybe there's a basis there for backwards play. :-) Discuss. :-) alberich@iglou.com | Mark Kinney | http://www.iglou.com/nations "This, I suppose, is the logical extension of having a pizza sent to someone that didn't order it?" -- Me, don't ask why. :-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 22:41:53 -0500 From: Frank Lazar Subject: IN> IMPORTANT message With a name like this, I had to forward this to the list. The sad part, however is that this might very well be true. The listadmin might want to check out domain-blocking procedures if this happens. >To: avatar-l@b4dawn.com >Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 18:19:00 -0500 >Subject: IMPORTANT message >X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2,5-7,10-12,15-16,21-22,28-29,32-33,42-43,48-51,65-74 >From: the1whowillbe@juno.com (Ted Mantuano) > >THIS'S A SERIOUS NOTE AND SHOULD BE TAKEN AS SUCH, SINCE IT INVOLVES ALL >MEMBERS OF GAMING MAILING LISTS: > >There's a group of people who have recently written to several gaming >mailing lists threatening to cause havoc and start trouble, in the hopes >of shutting down all gaming Mailing lists. > >This group, calling themselves the HEAVENLY HOST (and using names such >as Seraph, Archangel, Cherub, etc.) do this by editing the TO: segment in >the header of message and retyping in names of established Mailing List >members. > >They then send private e-mail to other members of the Mailing Lists in >the guise of being YOU, and write to other inflammatory remarks in the >hope of getting those recipients of the letters to start fighting with >you. > >This group has recently sent to the Anime Cards mailing List a very >informative and nasty letter, explaining that they find all gaming >Mailing List members to be freaks of nature, that discussion groups about >gaming are abnormal, and that the members of these Mailing Lists are >perverted weirdoes who need to get lives. > >Needless to say, we at the ACML took them with a grain of salt and >ignored them at first - that's, until they started sending out letters to >people using OUR e-mail address and posting as us. When this happened, >fights started breaking out, until finally someone caught on to what >happening, and informed the entire mailing List of how this trick was >being pulled. > >The Heavenly Host use a mail server, and are currently >being investigated, in the hopes of tracking them down and possibly even >shutting them down for good. > >THEREFORE, if you receive an irrationally antagonistic e-mail from >someone your Mailing List, THINK BEFORE ACTING! The best method in >dealing with this sort of thing is to create an entirely new e-mail and >ask the sender in question if they did, in fact, write that letter to >you. If they did, then be my guest and flame them back. If they did not, >you'll know that you've been victimized by the Heavenly Host. Also, if >this's the case, be aware that they may also be sending similar letters >to others using your identity, be sure to e-mail your entire mailing >List, explaining the situation - to keep all conflicts at minimum. > >It has been the pattern that once the Heavenly Host's gig is up on one >member's e-mail address, they move to someone else's. Please keep in mind >that cyberspace is a place without emotions, and therefore it's easy to >fake out or misinterpret things here. be sure to ask first before leaping >to trouble. > >More info... > >I forgot to mention that one of the biggest problem with the Heavenly >Host, in addition to the personal e-mail campaign, are that they target >specific members of the ML for e-mail bombs. typical e-mail bombs from > have been 100 messages at a time and up to 300 messages a >day, although Seraph is threatening a massive e-mail bombing campaign >against those who choose not to unsubscribe from the AC mailing list. >hopefully they may be shut down before this occurs. The have been >difficult to trace because they have managed to edit the received portion >of the header information in their messages so that the IP address of >their server is missing. So far all their message have been sent by way >of the mcs.kent.edu server. If their real domain is , then >we amy have already traced them and sent messages to the administrator of >their server. If not, then we may be in for even more problems in the >future. >========== > >Sincerely, > >Ted Mantuano > - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- | _ | | We are dreamers, shapers, singers and makers. /_\ | | We study the mysteries of laser and circuit, // \\ | | Crystal and scanner, holographic demons, \\ //___\\ | | And invocations of equations. \\ // \\ | | \\__// \\ | | These are the tools we employ. And we know... many things. \\ | | \\ | | | Frank Lazar http://www.interactive.net/~fmlazar | \\ | - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 22:36:33 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> IMPORTANT message > > > With a name like this, I had to forward this to the list. The sad part, >however is that this might very well be true. The listadmin might want to >check out domain-blocking procedures if this happens. > The 'beware the Heavenly Host' letter has circulated among the various anime fan mailing lists, with the -only words changed- being the specific 'sample list' and switching the words from 'anime mailing lists' to 'gaming mailing lists.' IF this was a legitimate warning, it should have been sent to the listmaster for io.com, and NOT to the list itself. My advice to everyone is to remain calm and let io.com handle any conflicts which might arise. Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 00:34:18 -0500 (EST) From: Casca Subject: Re: IN> Few questions, A On Tue, 28 Oct 1997, Dr. Todd W. Page, Esq. wrote: Oh, -wow-. We've got an Esquire on the list. Cooooool. ;) > all honored and all that, but anyways: to the point. I was just wondering > in general about saints and sorcerers. I hear 'bout them a lot, but alas, > I cant find any IN books where I am, and I really want to use a sorcerer > in my game (if they are what I think they are) so.. if anyone wants to, Saints are souls in Heaven that chose to come back to Fight the Good Fight. They have a Celestial form and may learn any Song, but don't disturb the Symphony through their actions (except when dealing with Essence or Songs, of course.) Think uber-Soldiers. Sorcerors are hedge diabolists who meddle with infernal powers. Pretty standard demon-summoning stuff: warding, sacrificing animals for essence, drawing circles, conjuring up that which they cannot put down. Think 'evolution in action.' > On a different note, I'd like to pose a question. :) A lot of times on > this list, and on the web and even in the books I think, people refer to > the eternal struggle of Satan Vs. God. But to me it seems a lot more like > Satan vs the archangels. In my game atleast, I see God as above both > heaven _AND_ hell... Satan falling was just as much a part of his plan as > anything else was. Does anyone else see things this way or am I just kinda > insane? :) Anywho.. thanks for reading. Yes. No. Both. Angels, in very real sense, ARE God. They are the manifestations of God's plan for Creation, and thus extensions of Divine Will. So Yves is God, as is Eli, as is Dominic...he is God, she is God, thou art God. (Someone stop me, I'm channeling Heinlein..) - -- Casca (bertishg@db.erau.edu) "...I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above Him were seraphs, each with six wings: with two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying...At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook, and the temple was filled with smoke." -- Isaiah 6:2,4 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 03:45:39 -0200 From: "Cristiano Guião de Freitas" Subject: Re: IN> Any ideas? >> >> >> Well, if your demon group are cops, why not make your angel group >> outlaws? You could play it as a kind of "Robin Hood" riff, with the >> angels doing hit and run raids on the Infernals operations and >> distributing the goods to the needy. All the time the media and the >> cops >> are portraying them as bloodthirsty bandit types, and they're always >> in >> danger of being turned over by some worthy citizen with no clue of >> the >> truth. > >> Cool, Chris i liked the idea but instead of doing "Robin Hood" >> things they may be like some Outlaws... loved by the Media, hated by >> the police and feared by the government... (hehe) Cool! thanks for >> the advice! > >> just a thought, >> >> TOC >> (Archangel of Sarcasm) >> >> >> I've been into angels since I read "The Devils of D-Day" by Graham >> Masterton (I was 10), and I love the game, though I've yet to find a >> >> group to play it with. > I will search for this book... >> If you're in the Boston area, and you'd like a >> player with a weird accent, get in touch! > > I wish you lived here man... i really liked your Stlyle TOC... Anyway, tankx again... The Brazilian Cris :-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 00:56:03 -0500 (EST) From: Pee Kitty Subject: IN> Errata here? In the description of Geas under sample discords, it says that characters cannot start off with Geas as a discord for points. One of the sample characters is listed as a legal starting character, who got 6 extra points by starting off with a Geas/2. Which is right? If the first, I can kinda see why (it's not permanent, after all, and doesn't hurt the character until used)...but why not just allow it, but require that they 'buy it off' when it's called in? Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian (Married to Rev. Unibomber on 11/15/96 - be jealous ;) Meow! - -= Windows 95 =- A 32-bit patch for a 16-bit GUI shell running on top of an 8-bit operating system written for a 4-bit processor by a 2-bit company who cannot stand 1 bit of competition. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 04:05:22 -0200 From: "Cristiano Guião de Freitas" Subject: Re: IN> Any ideas? > What about servitors of Christopher? Isn't it Brazil where hit squads > are > sent out to kill the children living on the street? Specific to Rio, > if I'm > not mistaken. > > Sadly that's not just in Rio... in Sao Paulo the hit squads work also > (and about 90% of the members are from the police) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 04:02:55 -0200 From: "Cristiano Guião de Freitas" Subject: Re: IN> [DV] PLACES: The Holy City of Rio de Janeiro > You *bet*!! Brasilia was built to be the nation's capital in the > middle of the > country, to take development to those areas...but it didn't worked as > they > planned... If someone cut off the government, Brasilia would become an > enormous > monument - nothing more... > Nice setting for a short adventure, post-apocalipthical Brazilia... > lot's of undead Politicians roaming through the streets... :-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 01:13:05 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> Errata here? > >In the description of Geas under sample discords, it says that characters >cannot start off with Geas as a discord for points. > >One of the sample characters is listed as a legal starting character, who >got 6 extra points by starting off with a Geas/2. > >Which is right? > Since you're referring to a Lilim, Sabrina, and the Geas is to Lilith herself, I will -guess- that Sabrina is exempt for these reasons. Lilim may start out with Geasa, but no other kind of Celestial may. All unofficial.... Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 01:14:54 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: Re: IN> [DV] PLACES: The Holy City of Rio de Janeiro >> You *bet*!! Brasilia was built to be the nation's capital in the >> middle of the >> country, to take development to those areas...but it didn't worked as >> they >> planned... If someone cut off the government, Brasilia would become an >> enormous >> monument - nothing more... >> Nice setting for a short adventure, post-apocalipthical Brazilia... >> lot's of undead Politicians roaming through the streets... :-) Oooh, one of Saminga's more powerful Servitors taking advantage of Brazil's civil war... }:-{D I -like- it. }:-{D Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 01:32:11 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: IN> [DV] Cities After the Apocalypse Well, I've pretty much given up on trying to give Beth a break and a chance to catch up after the weekend... }:-{D Only a handful of the smallest nations in the Corporeal world still function as nations. Some capitols, such as Lisbon or Montevideo or Sydney, still exist intact and claim to govern the rest of their countries (Portugal, Uruguay, Australia), but functionally they have no control outside their city limits or a bit farther (most of Portugal's military equipment is destroyed or held by bandits, Uruguay's countryside is infested with Jerseys and worse, and Australia's northern area has seceded from the rest of the nation). Those major cities which survived Armageddeon exist, for the most part, as isolated and practically independent city-states, each with its own militia or armed forces controlling what it can hold. Some (like, for example, New Orleans, Marseilles, Shanghai, and Veracruz) still claim loyalty to the pre-War governments; the majority, in a more practical fashion, just go independent, establish their own relations with those nations they can contact, and get on about the business of living. A lot of cities didn't survive, though. The United States alone had four (five if you count Mitrah's) nuclear devices strike, two Force 10 earthquakes, a plague of velociraptors (via Vapula's Project: Carnosaur- the Great Plains aren't safe anymore) and a major duel of Superiors- Malphas subdued Novalis in a battle which essentially destroyed Washington, D. C. As such, here follows a list of cities, divided into five groups- NUKED, CELESTIALED, DISASTERED, ABANDONED, and INHABITED. NUKED - Destroyed or rendered uninhabitable by nuclear device. Fourteen nuclear weapons reached their targets; thirteen cities were destroyed. Period. CELESTIALED - Destroyed or rendered uninhabitable by Celestials. DISASTERED - Destroyed or rendered uninhabitable by the natural disasters caused by Armageddeon. ABANDONED - Survived Armageddeon but could not sustain the lives of people living there. INHABITED - Still occupied by humans. This -includes- cities where fighting or riots are still continuing from the War. Except for Nuked, feel free to add cities to these lists if I haven't come up with them, based on the following loose guidelines; NORTH AMERICA - Western and Central America mostly Disastered; Central America except for Texas Deserted; eastern America mostly Inhabited SOUTH AMERICA - North coast nations mostly Inhabited, West coast mostly Disastered, remainder mostly Inhabited AFRICA - Mediterranean coast and South Africa Inhabited, the remainder mostly Disastered EUROPE - Eastern Europe mostly Celestialed, Western Europe mostly Nuked or Celestialed ASIA - Asia Minor and Arabia mostly Disastered, China mostly Inhabited, Japan mostly Nuked or Disastered, the remainder split between Disastered and Inhabited AUSTRALIA - Inhabited - --------------------------------- NUKED New York Los Angeles San Antonio Chicago Tokyo Beijing New Dehli Singapore Moscow London Berlin Rome Jerusalem CELESTIALED Budapest (all of Romania) Washington, D. C. Paris DISASTERED San Francisco-Oakland San Diego everything in between St. Louis Memphis (USA) Jakarta Honolulu Kyoto Athens Havana Quito Lima Naples Pisa The Hague Amsterdam ABANDONED Lubbock Amarillo Oklahoma City Omaha Denver Calgary Brazilia Bagdad Tehran (all of Germany's major cities) INHABITED (* = war still in progress) TEXAS Austin Corpus Christi Brownsville/Matamoros Houston/Galveston Beaumont/Port Arthur/Orange Dallas Fort Worth Shreveport NORTHEASTERN STATES OF AMERICA Erie Wilkes-Barre Buffalo Hartford Providence Springfield Worcester Boston Augusta (ME) Manchester Concord Albany Bangor REPUBLIC OF NORTHERN AUSTRALIA Alice Springs Perth * AUSTRALIA Sydney Canberra THE COLUMBIAN COMPACT Bogota * THE GREATER SCANDINAVIAN ALLIANCE + (+ Scandinavia is the only major chunk of Europe still in the Industrial Age. (The United Kingdom, without its capitol, has degenerated into over a dozen tiny principalities, including North Ireland, Scotland, Free Yorkshire, Wales, the People's Republic of Cornwall, and others, so it doesn't count.) Here the surviving Norse Gods took a stand, and through their influence the Frozen North of Europe was spared much of the carnage of other nations. In the month since, the whole region, including north Germany, the Netherlands, and East Prussia, has had a revival of Norse Paganism. Any Celestials traveling here have a small chance of attracting the Norse Gods' wrath in meddling with Their People.) Copenhagen Stockholm Oslo NON-ALIGNED CITIES Sao Paulo Rio de Janeiro Shanghai Manila Honolulu Montevideo La Paz * Capetown Cairo* Santa Fe El Paso (not claimed by Texas) Louisville Philadelphia * Pittsburg Cincinnati Toledo New Orleans Charleston, SC Mobile Madrid * Barcelona Seville Lisbon Marseilles Nice Veracruz Warsaw Kiev Bangkok * Seoul * If you have suggestions for cities to add, feel free to post 'em to the list. If you have a short explanation, so much the better. - ---Redneck Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 02:10:24 -0600 (CST) From: redneck@txdirect.net (Redneck Gaijin) Subject: IN> [FLUFF] Superior Book Endorsements You're a publisher. You've got a hot book which appeals to *EVERYBODY* that reads it. You hand it to your subordinate, who is secretly an Impudite of the Media, and they send copies to *EVERY* Superior on both sides with a standard 'celebrity endorsement' request letter. In the morning, you find the following in your "In" box, and your subordinate vanished, transferred to Kobal's service with a Distinction. It makes your dreams come to life. -- Blandine Suitable for kids of all ages. -- Christopher You'll be a better human being for reading this book. -- David Every word is true. -- Dominic A totally new concept in writing!!!!! -- Eli An Inspired work. -- Gabriel A book that really stirs things up. -- Janus The only way this book could have been better would be if I'd been consulted as technical advisor. -- Jean It's wild. -- Jordi A truly uplifting book. -- Laurence The next great bestseller! -- Marc I couldn't put it down... and when I catch the guy with the Krazy Glue tube, your ass is mine. -- Michael Puts you in touch with your inner harmony. -- Novalis A guidebook to your greatest potential, if you know where to look. -- Yves A great book to take to bed with you. -- Andrealphus A book with some fascinating, and occasionally disturbing, ideas. Worthy of closer investigation. -- Asmodeus I couldn't put it down... and when I catch you, Kobal, your ass is mine. Stupid Krazy Glue... -- Baal It'll haunt your dreams... -- Beleth It'll make you burn for more. -- Belial It's a trip, man. -- Fleurity This book will make you MAD. Really mad. If you aren't ready to kill something by the end, well, you didn't read it right. -- Furfur Delicious! -- Haagenti I laughed. I laughed. It became a part of me. (Especially when I got Krazy Glue on my fingers...this isn't funny) -- Kobal You should read it again. And again. And again. -- Kronos You need to read this book. Tell 'em I sent you. You'll just owe me one, okay? -- Lilith Tell your friends about it! -- Malphas It's the new paradigm in printed media entertainment! You can't live without this book! -- Nybbas It's cool. Huh huh, huh huh huh, huh huh huh. -- Saminga Worth a shoplifting rap- get your hands on it NOW! -- Valefor It filled my mind with new ideas. This book is sheer potential. A must for any intelligent man's bookshelf. -- Vapula - --- Redneck ("Hi. Your Reliever of Eli went to bed already. I'm her substitute, the Gremlin of Kobal...") Kris Overstreet, will write for food... | Do not taunt Happy Fun Belial. http://www.txdirect.net/users/redneck | * * * c/o White Lightning Productions | "I love the sweet smell of http://www.jurai.net/~redneck/wlp/ | humiliation in the morning!" Webmaster for Antarctic Press | --- Kobal reaffirms himself http://www.antarctic-press.com/ | ***QUESTION EVERYTHING*** ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #445 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.