From owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Mon Nov 10 14:03:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA05469 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 14:03:56 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id NAA30014 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 13:03:56 -0600 Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 13:03:56 -0600 Message-Id: <199711101903.NAA30014@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #464 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@LISTS.IO.COM Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@LISTS.IO.COM Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, November 10 1997 Volume 01 : Number 464 In this digest: Re: IN> Jimmy, Soldier of God IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. IN> Stat Maxima for NPCs Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. Re: IN> Gypsy Demons Re: IN> Ok, Valefor it is... IN> [FLUFF] Next week... GMING!!! Eeep!!! IN> Slayer Project update IN> Thunderstones (relic) IN> Anachronistic Words Re: IN> Kyrio Telegraph Re: IN> Anachronistic Words Re: IN> [FLUFF] Next week... GMING!!! Eeep!!! Re: IN> Anachronistic Words Re: IN> Gypsy Demons Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. IN> Evangelism (for gamers) Re: IN> Anachronistic Words Re: IN> Anachronistic Words Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. Re: IN> Slayer Project update IN> Pagan Soldiers Re: IN> Kyrio Telegraph ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 09 Nov 1997 16:02:25 -0200 From: "Cristiano Guião de Freitas" Subject: Re: IN> Jimmy, Soldier of God PLEASEPLEASEPLEASEPLEASEPLEASE I WANT MORE JIMMY I WANT MORE JIMMY!!!!!!! - -- "Ancient spirits of evil, transform this decayed form to Mumm-ra! the ever-living!" ---Mumm-ra, the ever-living ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Nov 1998 19:40:53 +0200 From: Ijon Tichy Subject: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. Good evening. Is it only my imagination, or are most of you playing with all the petty rules of +1 and -1 presented in In Nomine and accessories? I'm no novice roleplayer, I have been playing for over ten years now, and, you know, it's time to lay off the AD&D "+1 vs. small things, +5 vs. large things, +3 vs. not-quite-so-large things" kind of rules. I was introduced to In Nomine in an Israeli roleplaying tournament (called IGOR) that was held recently. The GM who happened to have been running the In Nomine table also happens to be one of the great Diceless Roleplaying prophets in Israel. Characters were created, not a single number was mentioned. A short adventure was played, involving angels and demons, and not a single die was rolled. It was the magic of the word, sans mechanics. Now, it was a tournament and the In Nomine table was meant to introduce people to the game, not play by the rules. It accomplished that. In fact, less than a week later, I purchased the book in New York City, as it is unavailable at all here in Israel. (Yo, you people of SJG! If you're interested in the market, e-mail me, I'll put you in contact with the right people!) I began reading the book, and loved the concept. Then I hit the game mechanics section, and darkness enshrouded me. Woe! AD&D come back to haunt me! Gagh! What's all this nonsense with tables for picking your nose? I thought this is the nineties and RPGs have gone a step further. We're not in it for the dice! We're not in it for stat-wars. We're in it for role-playing. Roles. Drama. Passionate monologues cast in the name of your character! Who cares about +1 modifiers? I'm starting my campaign these days. I created characters with my players. We _did_ use numbers and levels. We _are_ going to roll dice. Sometimes. But nowhere NEAR as many times as the rules indicate! Do they seriously expect me as GM to roll numerous times for every celestial in a few miles' radius everytime someone pushes some essence?? Get real! Does anyone seriously expect me to let a die roll determine whether Asmodeus will see his impetuous demons the minute they want to? No, my friends. Oh, well, alright, maybe I will, but they'd better have a Really Good Excuse... My point: In Nomine, in my humble opinion, calls for too many die rolls, involves too many modifier tables to be looked up, and is generally somewhat overladen with mechanics that, again - to me (and my players) - hamper gameplay rather than help. I do not preach complete diceless In Nomine, nor a stat-less In Nomine. I do preach to ignoring a healthy bit of the rules and numbers, and employing a Dramatic System instead of a Mechanical System. Let the GM determine action results that would best advance the storyline. Don't let characters live or die by die rolls. Let 'em die because of their mistakes! Conclusion: Do as thou wilt (did I hear anyone say "Eli" ?), but don't say I didn't tell ya. - -- Ijon Tichy Sailing the 'net in the only e-mail: ijon@forum2.org Space Barrel known to man. Homepage: http://www.forum2.org/ijon MOO: VotSB, telnet://forum2.org:7777 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 13:54:07 -0500 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Stat Maxima for NPCs >>>That's right, and those other Forces are in a gray area of canon. House rules that maxed out at 12 stats, but maybe allowed other Forces to add to things like Songs, would probably not be *too* awful.<<< Actually, house rules, by definition, can be anything the GM wants. - -David (I still allow stats above 12 in my own campaign) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:29:24 -0600 (CST) From: Dorothy Bixler Subject: Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. On Mon, 9 Nov 1998, Ijon Tichy wrote: > Good evening. Hello. > > Is it only my imagination, or are most of you playing with all the petty > rules of +1 and -1 presented in In Nomine and accessories? Sometimes. (snip!) > > My point: In Nomine, in my humble opinion, calls for too many die rolls, > involves too many modifier tables to be looked up, and is generally > somewhat overladen with mechanics that, again - to me (and my players) - > hamper gameplay rather than help. I do not preach complete diceless In > Nomine, nor a stat-less In Nomine. I do preach to ignoring a healthy bit > of the rules and numbers, and employing a Dramatic System instead of a > Mechanical System. Let the GM determine action results that would best > advance the storyline. Don't let characters live or die by die rolls. Let > 'em die because of their mistakes! > Usually, I perfer to have my players role dice often. If I don't like the result I fudge it, but the more you role the more often you'll hit intervention. Intervention can be a blast. For example- my oh-so-perky Impudite of Tech who hit demonic intervention while tring to chech and see if a guy was checking her out in a bar ("Hey wait a minute, he has horns. Hello tall, dark, and Calabim-ish!") *Dorothy Michelle Bixler * mudmh10@ecom.ecn.bgu.edu* "Gidget, have you been laying with the Horned One again?" -MST3K's Mike from "The Thing the Couldn't Die" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:02:47 -0600 (CST) From: Shadowcat Subject: Re: IN> Gypsy Demons On Fri, 7 Nov 1997, Andre Ribeiro wrote: > Folks, I need some input here... No, it's more an opinion... > If you'd involve the gypsies with demons - which Demon Prince would > suit them better?? If you insist upons a demon I would say Lilith for the Rom as they see them selves, but Valafor as they are seen by the gaujos*. My Grandfather was poshrat@, and uaed to tell me stories when I was a wee baern#. As for angels I can see them serving Novalis,Eli, or maybe Janus do to travel. So if you are going to do this atleast grant them 2 "Camps" one for each side. Shadowcat * = Non-gypsies (Rom) @ = 1/2 blood (Rom) # = Baby (Scottish(sp?)) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ The Great Spirit doesn't smile on those who dampen others and take the stars out of happy eyes ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:12:08 -0600 (CST) From: Shadowcat Subject: Re: IN> Ok, Valefor it is... On Sat, 8 Nov 1997, Andre Ribeiro wrote: > Yeah, it was pretty obvious, but I had to be sure... > Valefor *is* the demon Prince of the gypsies... > Thank you for the input... I still think Lilith is better. Oh ah Shadowcat All cats may look upon a king. No comment on the Queen ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 02:26:09 -0500 From: "Thomas Davidson" Subject: IN> [FLUFF] Next week... GMING!!! Eeep!!! Next week, I start GMing IN for the first time... And, boy, am *I* nervous about this prospect. This is the biggest group (about eight) of players I've *ever* GMed. And plus the fact that I will probably have *two* separate groups to GM.... ... Also, this is the first time I'll be GMing *anything* in... oh, about *five* years! Eeek! What am I going to do?!! :) Thomas Davidson tdavidso@suffolk.lib.ny.us MUSIC: Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones, Rush, Jimi Hendrix GAMES: Champions (old and new), In Nomine, Nephilim TV: The X-Files, The Simpsons, Superman, The Tick, The Animaniacs OTHER: Religion, Philosophy, mysticism, the runes, the Tarot, writing ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 04:57:24 -0500 From: "bruce dykes" Subject: IN> Slayer Project update After this evening's (Monday 10 Nov) episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, there will be a major update (and some fiction) to the character of Rupert Giles, plus a new Diabolical. Due to the somewhat tepid response to the Slayer Project on the list, I won't post it generally so , please email me if you're interested in the updates... Bruce, Impudite Captain of Cross-Licensing bdykes@intac.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:12:57 -0000 From: "Hart, Joanna" Subject: IN> Thunderstones (relic) Name: ThunderStones Appearance: These stones can appear in various sizes but the most common is a small piece of knapped flint, sized to fit comfortably in a human hand. In fact archaeologists regularly dig these up and classify them as neolithic knives or axeheads (you didn't really believe Vapula's line about evolution? :) ), and put them in museums. There are larger versions, most notoriously ancient monoliths such as Stonehenge or Avebury but these aren't very portable. Owner/ Maker: David Point Cost: The small stones can be costed as per holy bullets. Background: These stones are the oldest relics of the first war in heaven, they were created by David to arm Michael and the Heavenly Host when the Lightbringer and his followers were cast out. Some of them fell to earth and can be found there to this day (usually in old archeological digs). Most of the earthly ones have been used up long ago and have no more power than a certain odd curiousity value, although demons tend to superstitiously avoid them. Powers: Originally the small stones were endowed with Song of Thunder/1, and their use required that they be thrown down at the feet of the enemy whilst the wielder called out the demons name or invoked the divine presence. (They can also be thought of as a pre-firearms combination of holy pistols & holy bullets). Oddly enough, the ones which are left on earth seem to have an unerring ability to fall into the hands of potential soldiers of God and its not unusual for a mortal to be tuned into the symphony from having heard the stones singing to them. It was for this reason that Yves had advised David after the Fall that they should be not be gathered in. His actual words were along the lines of 'Let them lie in the earth and we will see what fruit these cold seeds will bear'. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:37:43 -0000 From: "Hart, Joanna" Subject: IN> Anachronistic Words I was vaguely pondering over an apocalyptic setting and I realised that I felt quite sorry for Baal if he survived the final conflict. Can't be much scope in being Demon Prince of 'The War' once The War is over. This is something that is going to apply to other word-bounds as well though, so what do people think happens to a word bound celestial whose word just gets outdated, either by technology or by events? eg.. Demon of the Imperial Measurement System (now how many ounces are there in a pound again?) , Angel of Pit Ponies. Is it possible to give out temporary words, in the knowledge that they will one day be outdated but in the meantime they can still be useful? Or can you apply to have your word updated (to version 1.1)? jo - --- "I'm really very tolerant, just some stupid things drive me up the wall." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:21:40 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Kyrio Telegraph The Kyrio telegraph is a cute idea. As for the problem of talking with a pigeon -- how about using a crow instead? Crows, ravens, magpies, and most other members of the Corvidae can talk. Starlings, too, I think. And of course the parrot family, though carrying a parakeet around with your party might be conspicuous. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:43:53 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Anachronistic Words I would suppose that you can get your word changed -- there's been some speculation on the list that it happens automatically if you Fall or Redeem, or that you automatically lose any Word when you Fall or Redeem. But the thing to remember is that it is less like changing job titles than like getting an organ transplant. I'm going to introduce a nasty word: Allegory. This is a story where the characters represent other things, usually abstract qualities. Allegory is OUT right now -- people think. Call something and allegory and you are damning it. But really ... Almost any political cartoon is an allegory, albeit a very short one. The success of Neil Gaiman's "Sandman" series, with the hero BEING Dream, the brother of Death, Destruction, Destiny, Delirium, Desire, and Despair, shows that there is still a market for allgory. The Worded characters in In Nomine are likewise allegorical. They personify their words, or at least the dark or bright sides of their words. To have the object of your Word go extinct should be like starving or suffocating. To take a Word, knowing it to be temporary -- "I am the Angel of World War Two" -- would be a very gutsy thing to do, or a very harsh thing to have forced on you. Last year, I think, there was an article in "Pyramid" about similar things. It was entitled "Angels in the Architecture" and talked about ephemeral angels of ephemeral words. I remember in particular the example given of the Angel of Autumn, who is re-born and dies every year, presumably in a repeating pattern with three other seasonal angels. That would be the most drastic form of temporary Wording. Less drastic forms can be imagined, but I'd still think that coming to the end of your Word could throw you into Trauma or something similar. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:47:25 -0500 From: Charybdis GreyDragon Subject: Re: IN> [FLUFF] Next week... GMING!!! Eeep!!! >Next week, I start GMing IN for the first time... Congrats... >And, boy, am *I* nervous about this prospect. This is the biggest group >(about eight) of players I've *ever* GMed. And plus the fact that I will >probably have *two* separate groups to GM.... ... 8 is tough... But just remember you (and they) are all in it for fun... >Also, this is the first time I'll be GMing *anything* in... oh, about >*five* years! Eeek! What am I going to do?!! > > :) Relax... Take a deep breath. Repeat to yourself over and over, "It's only a game. It's only a game..." Then remember that you are the chosen GM for a reason-- most likely because 1) you are the best one for the job, and your players trust you or 2) because your players are too cowardly to try it for themselves... :) So, just chill a bit and let yourself have fun... The mechanics and all will follow... Peace, Charybdis GreyDragon charybdis@krilion.cnchost.com http://www.krilion.cnchost.com ** "The mind is a funny place. I do not even trust my own." ** ** -- Roger Zelazny ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:50:21 -0500 From: Charybdis GreyDragon Subject: Re: IN> Anachronistic Words >I was vaguely pondering over an apocalyptic setting and I realised that >I felt quite sorry for Baal if he survived the final conflict. Can't be >much scope in being Demon Prince of 'The War' once The War is over. > >This is something that is going to apply to other word-bounds as well >though, so what do people think happens to a word bound celestial whose >word just gets outdated, either by technology or by events? eg.. Demon >of the Imperial Measurement System (now how many ounces are there in a >pound again?) , Angel of Pit Ponies. > >Is it possible to give out temporary words, in the knowledge that they >will one day be outdated but in the meantime they can still be useful? >Or can you apply to have your word updated (to version 1.1)? I would say that this is one reason that Word-bound Celestials work very hard to promote their Word... If they actively promote it, it won't become obsolete... Though it may take some doing and some semantic shift. Peace, Charybdis GreyDragon charybdis@krilion.cnchost.com http://www.krilion.cnchost.com ** "The mind is a funny place. I do not even trust my own." ** ** -- Roger Zelazny ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:39:42 -0500 From: Charybdis GreyDragon Subject: Re: IN> Gypsy Demons >> Folks, I need some input here... No, it's more an opinion... >> If you'd involve the gypsies with demons - which Demon Prince would >> suit them better?? >Without a doubt, I'd have to go with Valefor. The Roma have traditionally >been regarded as thieves and wanderers, and the Prince of Theft is >certainly interested in both stealing and in the nomadic lifestyle. Yeah, if I were looking for a Demon Prince to hold sway over the Romani people, it would have to be Valefor... >Valefor's heavenly counterpart, Janus, is also an ideal patron for >gypsies, for the same reasons. True. In fact, I have a Seraph of Janus PC who has spent most of her Corporeal service working with and guiding the Romani people... Her Seraph of the Wind resonance is *great* for stereotypical Gypsy bujo. > This could lead to "good" and "evil" tribes of gypsies who don't necessarily > get along with each other. Then again, considering that Janus and Valefor are > likely to be the same individual, the Roma are probably having few internal > problems at all. Guess that depends on which way you (or your GM) rules on that one... > They tend to be a very close-knit group, anyhow, much more likely to support other Roma >than they are to trust outsiders. That much is true... Actually, if you wanted to play up the stereotypical "fortune tellers" aspect, you could go with Kronos on the Dark side and Yves on the Light... Peace, Charybdis GreyDragon charybdis@krilion.cnchost.com http://www.krilion.cnchost.com ** "The mind is a funny place. I do not even trust my own." ** ** -- Roger Zelazny ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:57:26 -0500 From: Charybdis GreyDragon Subject: Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. >My point: In Nomine, in my humble opinion, calls for too many die rolls, >involves too many modifier tables to be looked up, and is generally >somewhat overladen with mechanics that, again - to me (and my players) - >hamper gameplay rather than help. I do not preach complete diceless In >Nomine, nor a stat-less In Nomine. I do preach to ignoring a healthy bit >of the rules and numbers, and employing a Dramatic System instead of a >Mechanical System. Let the GM determine action results that would best >advance the storyline. Don't let characters live or die by die rolls. Let >'em die because of their mistakes! Works for me. I just figure that the Canon included all those die rolls for those who feel more comfortable with boundaries. For we random-abstracts, there is always the cardinal rule of *all* RPGs-- "No matter what the book says, the GM is the final arbiter." Just do what you are comfortable with-- but be sure to let your players know in advance. (Otherwise your Rule-Lawyers go into conniptions the first time they quote chapter and verse of the Canon to you and you say, "And your point?") I personally tend to use dice when I am unsure of how the situation will/should turn out. When I figure an action should be automatic or impossible, I don't both to roll dice. (Except for the sound they make at times... Nothing wakes up your players faster than watching you grin evilly and reach for the dice... ) And I tend to use the dice MUCH less in PBEM games than I do in live games... But then it really doesn't matter much, since the players never know whether I am rolling the dice or not in any given situation... >Conclusion: Do as thou wilt (did I hear anyone say "Eli" ?), but don't say >I didn't tell ya. Eli is my hero... Peace, Charybdis GreyDragon charybdis@krilion.cnchost.com http://www.krilion.cnchost.com ** "The mind is a funny place. I do not even trust my own." ** ** -- Roger Zelazny ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:23:32 -0500 (EST) From: Jamie Wilmoth Subject: IN> Evangelism (for gamers) Yea, oh brethern and sistern! *cough* Pardon. A friend of mine is currently waffling on spending his entertainment dollars on a copy of IN. What encouragement/discouragement/caveats does the list have? I love the game, but I can't seem to express the game's good points to him succintly- at least, not thirty dollars worth. Any creative, pithy quotes from the list? - -James ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:45:50 -0500 From: "Kirt A. Dankmyer -- aka Loki" Subject: Re: IN> Anachronistic Words >word just gets outdated, either by technology or by events? eg.. Demon >of the Imperial Measurement System (now how many ounces are there in a >pound again?) , Angel of Pit Ponies. Remember, the Demon of the Imperial Measurement System is alive and well here in America... ;) -Loki - -- Kirt A. Dankmyer --- Academic Computing Specialist http://www.wfu.edu/~dankmyka/ -- (910) 759-4202 -- PGP public key available. For the Snark _was_ a Boojum, you see. --Lewis Carroll ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:21:23 -0600 From: Bob the Dancing Monkey Subject: Re: IN> Anachronistic Words At 09:43 AM 11/10/97 -0500, you wrote: >I would suppose that you can get your word changed -- there's been >some speculation on the list that it happens automatically if you >Fall or Redeem, or that you automatically lose any Word when you >Fall or Redeem. But the thing to remember is that it is less like >changing job titles than like getting an organ transplant. Thoughts: Tech-based: I think that it is a very uncommon thing for Celestials to be granted a different word. It might be a little more common for Lightning and Technology-based Words, which are tricky due to their planned obsolence, but even that would porbably be somewhat uncommon. If one thinks about it, the very concept of the Word is, as Earl put it, to allegorize an idea. With competing technologies, there will be a need for a Celestial to allegorize the effort towards that goal. There will simply be a winner and a loser. Also, specialization's a bitch. The Demon whose Word is Fossil Fuels is in trouble right now, though the Angel of Energy has never sat prettier. On the other hand, why would Jean and Vapula waste the efforts of their best and brightest when what their Words come to stand for become last year's Scientific American article? Angelic: In the case of the Angelic Choirs, one could imagine an Augmentation or a Generalization if - and only if - the Angel in question can at once become an avatar for that Generalization while keeping the spirit of her original Word alive (a tricky thing indeed!) Demonic: In the case of the bands, consider how a Word is given. Are _you_ going to go to Satan and say, "Gee, I'm sorry. The Word you gave me isn't good enough; can you give me a better one?" After all, even Furfur was denied his request, though I think the alternative worked much better for him (after all, I think the way in which he invoked Lucifer is about as Hardcore as it is possible to get...) - -Drew ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:36:14 -0500 (EST) From: IQJason@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. Ijon Tichy writes: "What's all this nonsense with tables for picking your nose? I thought this is the nineties and RPGs have gone a step further. We're not in it for the dice! We're not in it for stat-wars. We're in it for role-playing. Roles. Drama. Passionate monologues cast in the name of your character! Who cares about +1 modifiers?" CAVEAT: I'm mostly on your side in this one. I'm a big fan of system-low, drama-high games. However...there are three parts to the phrase "role playing game." And each one appeals to different parts of the gaming psyche. (Much of this is derived from talk on rec.games.frp.advocacy, filtered through my own brain. It may, then, seem familiar to some.) Some people like the "role" part, and spend most of their time on developing their characters into fleshed out, developed beings that seem to have lives of their own. They'll often desire drama and vibrant encounters over realism. Some people like the "playing," and want a coherent, consistent (not necessarily realistic) world to play in. Some call them simulationists -- they want a world that follows its own laws, and simulates a 'real life' for its participants. And some people like the "game" aspect -- they like the challenge of building characters and randomization. Placing a well-crafted character into a world with puzzles and challenges in hopes of improving ones standing...dare I say winning? Most people gain pleasure, in some levels, from all three. But, even on their own, I wouldn't call any of them the "wrong way" to play. "My point: In Nomine, in my humble opinion, calls for too many die rolls, involves too many modifier tables to be looked up, and is generally somewhat overladen with mechanics that, again - to me (and my players) - hamper gameplay rather than help." Eh...whaddaya want from the minds that made GURPS? ;) "I do preach to ignoring a healthy bit of the rules and numbers, and employing a Dramatic System instead of a Mechanical System. Let the GM determine action results that would best advance the storyline. Don't let characters live or die by die rolls. Let 'em die because of their mistakes!" I'm on the same boat as you...but realize that there's a large amount of players who would consider decisions like that "unfair" -- they feel the GM has enough power already and want some decisions out of her control, in the hands of randomizers that are, at the very least, unbiased. "I purchased the book in New York City..." Funny. So did I. :) yours, Jason Schneiderman, Demon of Game Review, Balseraph of the Media. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:18:52 -0500 (EST) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> The honorable Rulius Advocatus, Esq. > Good evening. It's still morning here. :) > My point: In Nomine, in my humble opinion, calls for too many die rolls, > involves too many modifier tables to be looked up, and is generally > somewhat overladen with mechanics that, again - to me (and my players) - > hamper gameplay rather than help. I do not preach complete diceless In > Nomine, nor a stat-less In Nomine. I do preach to ignoring a healthy bit > of the rules and numbers, and employing a Dramatic System instead of a > Mechanical System. Let the GM determine action results that would best > advance the storyline. Don't let characters live or die by die rolls. Let > 'em die because of their mistakes! Indeed. You're not going to get an argument from me. I'm coming off of Amber Diceless Roleplaying, which I love to death. I've played it for years, and GM'ed a bit of it. Mechanics? Do you mean there are mechanics? What are these little square things? I have many a house rule which eliminates dice rolls. But the main problem is that the GM (me), often forgets about the dice. I've played just too much diceless to remember. I have this bad habit of just being arbitarily cruel and nasty. To hell with dice! Mine never seem to have any spots on them anyways, just a handful of blank black cubes that my players laced in my die bin. I let the roll to call down their superiors, some songs, when the plot requires them to occasionally fail at things, and combat (which needs a patch so badly I could scream). Other then that, heck with it. > > Conclusion: Do as thou wilt (did I hear anyone say "Eli" ?), but don't say > I didn't tell ya. > -- > Ijon Tichy Sailing the 'net in the only > e-mail: ijon@forum2.org Space Barrel known to man. > Homepage: http://www.forum2.org/ijon MOO: VotSB, > telnet://forum2.org:7777 > Emily K. Dresner, M.S.Eng. Applications Programmer III and Balseraph of the Game Desktop Applications Team - Medical Center Information Technology Current Quote: It's all just a bunch of tree hugging hippy crap. - Cartman from South Park ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 11:23:25 -600 From: "John L Veazey" Subject: Re: IN> Slayer Project update Stupid Question: What is the Slayer Project? I vaguely remember a mention of it. Vz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 11:23:25 -600 From: "John L Veazey" Subject: IN> Pagan Soldiers I know this has already been asked and answered, but can Etherial Solders learn Corporeal Songs? I know Soldiers of God & Hell are restricted to learning Corporeal Songs. So, are Etherial Soldiers restricted to Etherial Songs? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 11:05:56 -0600 From: tom timberlake Subject: Re: IN> Kyrio Telegraph Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > The Kyrio telegraph is a cute idea. As for the problem of talking > with a pigeon -- how about using a crow instead? Crows, ravens, > magpies, and most other members of the Corvidae can talk. Starlings, > too, I think. And of course the parrot family, though carrying > a parakeet around with your party might be conspicuous. > The Etherial Song of Tongues, otherwise known as Instant ESP, will also solve your communication problems, though the duration is a bit short, especially if you are planning on carrying on a strategy planning session, with all contributing to the laying of plans. It works okay, though, for a quick status report or similar short message. It also is noted in the book as having a 0 degree of disturbance, but check the errata, since it does require Essence expenditure [1 Essence]. tom timberlake, Mandarin's butterfly to James the Stone Malakim ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #464 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.