From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Tue Mar 18 08:15:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by deliverator.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA29016; Tue, 18 Mar 1997 08:14:29 -0600 (CST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA25081 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Tue, 18 Mar 1997 08:17:53 -0600 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 08:17:53 -0600 Message-Id: <199703181417.IAA25081@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #76 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Tuesday, March 18 1997 Volume 01 : Number 076 In this digest: Re: IN> Whatshisname... Re: IN> Astaroth, HARDLY laughable!! Re: IN> Anime Re: IN> New Archangel. (Long) Part 2 Re: IN> Safe Houses IN> Astaroth and a thoguht on Demonic politics Re: IN> New Archangel. (Long) Part 1 Re: IN> Angel of Music Re: IN> Character Archive ? Re: IN> Totems and Angels Re: IN> Celestial names Re: IN> Re: Magic Re: IN> New Archangel. (Long) Part 1 Re: IN> Angel of Music Re: IN> Astaroth and a thoguht on Demonic politics Re: IN> Celestial names Re: IN> The Realm of Faery among other things Re: IN> Celestial names Re: IN> Angel of Music IN> Attention: Brian Gracey IN> Intro Re: IN> Secret Bible Re: IN> Restoring a Remnant? Re: IN> Angel of Music IN> Tether Seneschals Re: IN> Angel of Music Re: IN> Angel of Music Re: IN> Tether Seneschals ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 15:40:40 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Whatshisname... At 5:11 PM +0000 3/14/97, Bodhi wrote: [Angel of Music] >> Word-bound, a Servitor of Eli (Creation). In Service to whatshisname, >> the Archangel of Mathematics. > >(the following is to be read with an extremely light heart...) > >Hee Hee Hee. Alright, I tried to come up with a name that had many >levels of meaning. Foucault was an actual Physicist and >mathematician, and his Pendulum allows us to see that our Earth has a >place in the universal Mind of God. I knew it was F-something, but my spelling is... Elizabethean, at best... So I figured that whatshisname was close enough... Pronounce it Foucault, and you're home free, right? It was a very clever name, and I quite liked it, but, well, I've got this Absent-Minded Discord, y'know? - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 15:06:07 -0600 (CST) From: Brian Emord Subject: Re: IN> Astaroth, HARDLY laughable!! > Sounds like someone my ArchLilim of Knowledge (well, nominally, if > you take that option) would be at serious odds with. I *like* it. > Can I put him up on my web-pages, please, please? > > --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net > GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ > I would be duly honored to have my humble writing appear on your web page. , thank you very much for the consideration thereof. Brian Calabim of Belial Whose word is Rioting ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 13:14:08 -0800 (PST) From: Anders Swenson Subject: Re: IN> Anime On Mon, 17 Mar 1997, Kirt A. Dankmyer -- aka Loki wrote: > >I also had a thought one time fo doing an IN game based in Japanese > >folklore and theology; probably Shinto for the most part. Maybe call it > >'In Anime'. :) > > Speaking of which, has anyone noticed that In Nomine's epic feel makes it > perfect to be run Anime-style? Most Anime RPGs that are out there are bound > up with either mecha or comedy, but In Nomine has the potential to be > something different, while still maintaining that Anime feel. > Larger-tan-life characters, with their own faults and fiobles, but a good > conception of Good and Evil. > > I'm filled with images of cute, wide-eyed Mercurians (and Impudites and > Lilim), large, burly Malakites, and an Elohim with his/her hair sweepoing > over one eye... > -Loki (and if you want Mecha, one word: Jean) > At one point I was thinging of a Malachite of Jean baced on the Battle Angel stuff. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 09:54:20 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: Re: IN> New Archangel. (Long) Part 2 In reply to: > One thing: what Choir is Charon of? He seems like an Elohite, but it doesn't > say. > > Kestrel Oops! Yep, I forgot to say. I was torn on this issue. Charon best fits the Elohite manner, but in my mind, he occassionally gets caught up in his work and lets a little more emotion be seen than a good Elohite should. Hope that works. Just a thought... Leathal Weapon. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 07:42:24 +1000 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: Re: IN> Safe Houses Shadowcat wrote: > > On Sat, 15 Mar 1997, Patrick O'Duffy wrote: > > > Very cool idea. I started a bit dubious, but your arguments convinced > > me. I like the 'safe house' concept, because I like the idea of not > > having every angel/devil meeting end in a fight. > > The only problem for me is that you rarely have bars or coffeeshops in > > a museum! I mean, if you're going to talk with someone on the other > > side of the Big Fence, you want to do it over a Guiness or a espresso. > > You haven't been to Chicago have you? I can't think of one > Museum/Art Galery/Zoo/etc. in town that doesn't have one. Then there is > Millwaukee, where even the malls have pubs 8-) > > Yes, but I live in Australia, where no one ever goes to museums or art galleries, and no one bothers to put a pub somewhere interesting like that... - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia No prime donna, the perfume is on an old shirt That is stained with blood and whiskey And goodnight to the street sweepers The night watchman, flame keepers And goodnight Matilda too. TOM WAITS, "Tom Traubert's Blues" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 16:41:55 -0500 (EST) From: James Dibenedetto Subject: IN> Astaroth and a thoguht on Demonic politics > > Astaroth > > Demon of Ignorance > > Balseraph >> >Well I wasn't sure how this would be accepted, so I was a little hesitant >to post, but I have been thinking about it since the first of the >Archangel posts... Thank you for the compliments, and thanks for the >inspirational message that preceded this, I think it will inspire more >semi-lurkers like myself to venture out here to give ideas... > >I would just like to ask anyone if they have any other comments about >Astaroth and how he relates to the system??? >Again, Thanks in Advance... I *like* him! Actually, your description of Astaroth got me thinking a bit about Demonic politics. I immediately associated Astaroth with Saminga, as they both seem pretty straightfoward in their aims and actions. Unlike, say, Vapula, there's no mistaking that what Astaroth does is not for your benefit (same, obviously, with Saminga). There's not a lot of long-term scheming and plotting with these Princes (Haagenti probably falls into this category as well). I wonder if the big debate among the Demon Princes is between the simple, direct, blunt approach of Saminga and Haagenti and Astaroth, and the complex plans and plottings of Nybbas and Vapula and their allies. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 10:11:42 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: Re: IN> New Archangel. (Long) Part 1 IN reply to: > I like the description of Charon very much. Only I don't see > much purpose to his being the second Angel of Death and the > vanishment of Azrael. If it were up to me, I'd let him be > the first and only, named "Azrael," and only slightly younger than > Yves and Eli. Thanks. The reason I had him as the second Angel of Death (AoD) is because of the background as it appeared in my mind. This is the reasoning (feel free to change it if you don't like it). IMO, back when it all began, Azrael was THE AoD. He represented all death to all living things (including some Angels). But when the war came and Lucifer rebelled, Azrael realised that the time for death being pure was over. Now that places for both good and evil existed, Azrael knew that there would be 'good' deaths, such as natural causes and old age, and there would be 'evil' deaths, such as assassination and murder. Therefore, in an agreement between himself and God (known only to those two, and maybe Yves), he had his Celestial Forces divided into smaller beings. The good side became Charon, and was appointed the new Archangel of Death by God. The bad side fled to Hell, where it quickly ascended the infernal ladder to be Saminga, Demon Prince of Death. This is why Saminga doesn't wan't Lucifer's job, he was created for death and that's all he wants. Likewise, Charon doesn't want any more power in Heaven beyond that necessary to run his affairs, although arguably his Word makes him one of the most important Angels in the grand scheme. Now none of the others know this, and all would be worried if they realised the grand plan God allowed in the purposeful corruption of part of one of his more powerful Archangels, and Hell would be taken aback if they knew their demon Prince of Death was designed by God specifically for that role. Anyway, that's a (reasonable) brief reason why I made Charon the second AoD. Any thoughts? Just a thought... Leathal Weapon. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 10:19:55 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music A comment on: > [Patrick O'Duffy:] > > Anyway, I'd have the Angel of Music be a Mercurian. I think they'd > >dig the job the most. No idea who their superior would be. > I would allow there to be an Archangel of Music, who is obviously not one of the more powerful at the moment. Generally I like these things to be balanced, so there would need to be a Demon Prince of Music as well. The Archangel could have 'good' music (not just classical) where Heavenly ideals were expressed, and the Demon Prince would have the 'bad' music (not just Heavy Metal) where concepts of evil, such as suicide, murder etc were advanced. Their respective followers would make mean musicians and may even be some of the more popular bands and performers today. Otherwise they would be manipulating mortal musicians for their own ends. At the moment I would say that with life's general depression the Demon Prince is winning at the moment, with the Archangel taking a back seat, but the Archangel is building his forces for another feel-good assault on the music industry. Anyway, if I get time I may flesh out some of these ideas. Just a thought... Leathal Weapon. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 10:24:19 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: Re: IN> Character Archive ? > And I'm working on something like that of my own... Heck, I'll just > ask right now -- is it okay with people if I put up pages with > the various Superiors and other folk who have been posted to the > list? No complaints from me. Just a thought... Leathal Weapon. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 14:55:20 +0000 From: "Bodhi" Subject: Re: IN> Totems and Angels > >__Totemism and Shamanism__ > > I like the Concept and Choir selections, though it's perhaps > a slight pity that you didn't manage to fit the Choir-animals > with Choir. But Dog is much better as a Cherub, and Eagle > as a Seraph, so I won't kick. They're Concept-Bound anyway, > and follow slightly different rules. (Though *how* they managed > to get concept-bound when they're usually hanging around > with other critters...) You know, I tried my best to make the concepts work out with the official In Nomine listed animals, but I just couldn't hack it!! I mean, Dog, Coyote, and Wolf are all supposed to be malakites?!?!... Therefore, I went with my 'gut' and just decided to write it the way I thought it worked best. I could probably rationalize a way they all got to their current positions, but it would be spurious logic, at best. If anybody comes up with a better way of meshing my favourite, most powerful totems with a variety of concept-appropriate choirs, I'll gladly switch it with mine. I, too, found it a pity that the animal selection was inappropriate... but I couldn't make it work. Walk in Beauty, Rob Wolff / Bodhi rob@v-wave.com Nicholas Copernicus, Master Astronomer Stood up and Shouted, addressing the throng, "Abandon poor Ptolomy, Stand up and follow me, Heliocentrically, Ptolomy's Wrong!!" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 16:16:17 -0600 From: "adrienne l. travis" Subject: Re: IN> Celestial names right, but all *angels* should have, not just Hebrew names, but Hebrew names which end in either "-el", "-iah", or -"yah" (with a couple exceptions, like Sandalphon and the Metatron) . . . because these prefixes mean "of God," and, well, angels are supposed to be named like that. at least as far as i know. adrienne l. travis At 01:06 3/16/97 -0800, you wrote: >On Fri, 14 Mar 1997, Earl Wajenberg wrote: > >> By the way, am I the only one who would like to have seen just >> Hebrew names for angels, and no anachronistic modern names? At >> least for Archangels. I can see an angel on Earth taking a >> contemporary name as a nom de guerre. > >Keep in mind that a number of old Hebrew names became modern European >names. I don't know how much they've been altered over time, but Michael >and Gabriel are actual hebrew names. As I understand it, they got used by >Christians (many of which were Jews), and their usage spread with >Christianity. Which is why you get white-bread Protestants named Gabriel. > >For something I was writing a while back, involving angels in WW's WoD, I >was looking through my Oxford Study Bible (translated from the original >language by scholars, as I've mentioned before) trying to find an old >Hebrew name, and found Rebecca. Sounds so normal, doesn't it? David and >Daniel are also Hebrew names. We've had a president named Abraham, and >the Biblical Abraham's wife was names Sarah. For the most part, these old >names have simply stayed in use. > > >|\ /| | | |~~~ |\ | "It's a hundred and six miles to Chicago, we've >|_\ /_| | | |__ | \| got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, >|\ | | \ | | | | it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses." >| \ | | \| |___ | | "Hit it." > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 16:09:28 -0600 (CST) From: "Q (not from Star Trek)" Subject: Re: IN> Re: Magic On Mon, 17 Mar 1997, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: > On Mar 14, 2:33pm, Raven wrote: > > Subject: IN> Re: Magic > > I've been reading people's various comments about magic and human > > magicians, and I've decided that, with songs, we don't really /need/ a > > new system for magic. In my campaign, I allowed one of my players to make > > a sorceror character as an unaligned soldier (6 Forces, doesn't work for > > either side). I also had an idea for non-corporeal songs, allowing some > > characters to buy Ethereal songs at 2 pts. per level, and Celestial songs > > at 3 pts. per level. (He only bought 1 Eth. song, so it's no big deal.) > > The circumstances under which a human may be able to learn these songs is > > up to the GM, as I see it. > > > > As for rituals, just make generous use of the 'extra time' rule. > > > It has _tenatively_ been decided that spells are just > what humans call Songs. They are just ways to influence the Symphony > directly. This is not to say they will all be the SAME Songs, > just that they will _probably_ use the same mechanics. > Here's a thought. Traditionally, witches, wizards, warlocks and the like have always been considered (particularly in Puritan circles) to be in league with the devil or, at very least, with demonic powers (ex. Faust). Therefore, I think it would be reasonable to assume that most if not all human practitioners of magic are exactly that. As soldiers of Hell, magicians are granted to knowledge to perform certain songs in exchange that either they use them only for evil, or that they use them to further a certain demon's word. Unlike ordinary soldiers, however, magicians are granted attunements according to the demon prince they serve. The different types of wizards could range from necromancers (soldiers of Saminga) to mad scientists (soldiers of Vapula). I think it would fit in very well with the mummy/vampire/undead motif. Alternatively, a distinction could be made between sorcers or "white" magicians and wizards or "black" magicians, white magic being a gift of God and black magic being a tool of the devil. However, I would be more inclined to make the distinction between "magic" and "theurgy" the holy ability of priests and saints to perform miracles.Thus, _all_ magicians (even white magicians, who would more than likely be servants of Malphas than anything else) whether called witches, warlocks, sorcerors, conjurors, alchemists, skinwalkers or what have you are servants of evil while holy men, priests, saints, shamans, rabbis, medicine men, gurus, evangelists, etc, are servants of good. Now, this is not to say that _every_ self-proclaimed saint or holy man, or even one directly promoted by the church, is genuine, for many priests etc can be, and have been, demons in disguise (otherwise known as hypocrits). But on the whole, anyone who tampers with forces and powers that he doesn't understand, forces which he thinks he controls but are in actuality of far greater strength than he, regardless of his intents, is a servant of evil. Now, let me make it clear that it is not my opinion that rl magic is inherently evil in itself, or that any who practice or attempt to practice it are tools of the devil, I just think that the following outline would be a cool way to work magic into a campaign and which fits well with the world of In Nomine. I don't mean it as a critique of anyone's religion (i believe we do have a few Wicca here). - -Q - --------------------------------------- "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." -Albert Einstein Scott "Q" Meyer Scott.E.Meyer@wheaton.edu http://johnh.wheaton.edu/~smeyer ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 16:12:36 -0600 (CST) From: Brian Emord Subject: Re: IN> New Archangel. (Long) Part 1 I thought this was an excellant argument for having both of the AoD in the scenario. I think the explanation is well within the realm of all that is In Nomine-ish... I think I will adapt a similar stand point in my campaign... Keep the great ideas pouring in, and don't be surprised if you stop in on a Game and find A LOT that you recognize...hehehe I have been using the epithet of the word of Rioting, what do you think for a servitor of Belial, or would he claim more of an allegiance to Baal??? well I will think about it and get back to you... (is it clear which side of the War I favor???) Brian Emord Calabim of Belial Whose word is Rioting Who now Declares himself no longer of 'The Lurkers' - --* BEGIN GEEKCODE BLOCK *-- GCS/E d(+)>++ s+:+ a? C+++(++++)$ UBLAHS++$ P+++$ L++ E W++ N o K++ w O++ M-->--- V-- PS(++) PE(+)(-) Y+ PGP- t+@ 5+@ X R+(+++)* tv b++>+++ DI+++$ D G++ e(*)>++++ h+(*) r++>+++ y+ - --* END GEEKCODE BLOCK *-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 16:15:08 -0600 (CST) From: Brian Emord Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music > Anyway, if I get time I may flesh out some of these ideas. > I will take the demon if you take the angel...hehehe ;-) Brian Calabim of Belial Whose word is Rioting ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 16:27:54 -0600 (CST) From: Brian Emord Subject: Re: IN> Astaroth and a thoguht on Demonic politics > I *like* him! Actually, your description of Astaroth got me thinking > a bit about Demonic politics. I immediately associated Astaroth with > Saminga, as they both seem pretty straightfoward in their aims and > actions. Unlike, say, Vapula, there's no mistaking that what Astaroth > does is not for your benefit (same, obviously, with Saminga). There's > not a lot of long-term scheming and plotting with these Princes (Haagenti > probably falls into this category as well). > > I wonder if the big debate among the Demon Princes is between the simple, > direct, blunt approach of Saminga and Haagenti and Astaroth, and the > complex plans and plottings of Nybbas and Vapula and their allies. > The thing is I didn't think that he fully deserved princedom anymore (at one point yes, now not really) so while he may be contriving to ascend again, he is still just a powerful word-bound demon with a few servitors left over from a time long ago... But you are right, he does have that aire about him, and I guess he is made out for the short term quick push... Thanks for the comments and insight.... Brian Shedim of Nybbas Whose word is Psychotics ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 17:40:07 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Celestial names At 4:16 PM -0600 3/17/97, adrienne l. travis wrote: >right, but all *angels* should have, not just Hebrew names, but Hebrew >names which end in either "-el", "-iah", or -"yah" (with a couple >exceptions, like Sandalphon and the Metatron) . . . because these prefixes >mean "of God," and, well, angels are supposed to be named like that. at >least as far as i know. Though that would wind up with Demons having the same... I don't think *all* angels would have to have "el/iah/yah" in their names, though it would be common as... atoms. Some might have something that would translate as "born in Light," or "Strong Warrior" or something that was only indirectly "of the Lord". And there's no reason that they have to have *Hebrew* names, really -- old and religious names are best, especially for the eldest angels, but why just *Hebrew* ones? Islamic-oriented angels might reflect that in their names, for instance. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 14:52:23 -0800 From: "Joe Fulgham" Subject: Re: IN> The Realm of Faery among other things Kirt "Loki" Dankmyer said: > Well, there is a legend that the Fae are angels that chose neither side > during the original War in Heaven, and so were banished to Earth for their > indifference. This also explains the capricious nature of the Fae -- > sometimes good, sometimes evil. I've also heard that the Fae are the children of Lilith. In a Sandman story, among other places. - --------------------------------------------------------- Joe Fulgham |"Expecting the world to treat you puck@holycow.com | fairly because you are a good www.holycow.com | person is a little like expecting PGP Key available | the bull not to attack you because Puck Undernet #mtg | you are a vegetarian. -Dennis Wholey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 17:19:25 -0600 From: "adrienne l. travis" Subject: Re: IN> Celestial names a lot of demons would have taken new names after the Fall, probably. and you're right, Islamic angels don't have the same restrictions -- but i think there are Celestial naming rules there, too. i agree, the rules shouldn't be absolute . . . but i think that, in my games at least, *most* angels will have names that follow them. adrienne l. travis At 17:40 3/17/97 -0500, you wrote: >At 4:16 PM -0600 3/17/97, adrienne l. travis wrote: >>right, but all *angels* should have, not just Hebrew names, but Hebrew >>names which end in either "-el", "-iah", or -"yah" (with a couple >>exceptions, like Sandalphon and the Metatron) . . . because these prefixes >>mean "of God," and, well, angels are supposed to be named like that. at >>least as far as i know. > >Though that would wind up with Demons having the same... I don't >think *all* angels would have to have "el/iah/yah" in their names, >though it would be common as... atoms. Some might have something >that would translate as "born in Light," or "Strong Warrior" or >something that was only indirectly "of the Lord". > >And there's no reason that they have to have *Hebrew* names, really -- >old and religious names are best, especially for the eldest angels, >but why just *Hebrew* ones? Islamic-oriented angels might reflect that >in their names, for instance. > > > > >--emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net >GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 18:37:27 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music On Mar 18, 10:19am, Leathal Weapon wrote: > Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music > A comment on: > > > [Patrick O'Duffy:] > > > Anyway, I'd have the Angel of Music be a Mercurian. I think they'd > > >dig the job the most. No idea who their superior would be. > > > I would allow there to be an Archangel of Music, who is obviously not > one of the more powerful at the moment. Generally I like these things > to be balanced, so there would need to be a Demon Prince of Music as > well. Upcoming adventure has a Demon trying to become the Demon Prince of Rock and Roll. Look for it in _Night Music_ around April. ;) - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 14:53:18 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: IN> Attention: Brian Gracey Brian, If you're reading this, could you e-mail me personally please? My mailer is having problems delivering to the address that appears at the top of your posts. Thanks. Leath. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 18:53:15 -0800 From: John Gonzalez Subject: IN> Intro - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC3304.807B9600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey all... figured it was about time I came out of the wood work... = I've been lurking the past couple weeks, reading, hearing some very = thoughtful and insightful things and figured it was about time I chimed = in. I just started with IN, and I must say (as a lapsed Catholic) I really = enjoy the world in which it exists. Now, I'm not saying you have to be = a Lapsed Catholic to enjoy it, but I do, so there.... I started a web page, but am having a hard time thinking of what to put = on it that already isn't somewhere else... I'd like to put up a = character archive and ideas for stories, but beyond that? Any ideas would be helpful. It's pretty sparse right now. If ya wanna look, it's at: http:\\www.geocities.com\Area51\Corridor\8228 My email is either masque@bbic.com or nybbas@geocities.com Thanks... Look forward to joining in.... - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC3304.807B9600 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IhwCAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAyAEAAAEAAAAQAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAATwAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGluX25vbWluZS1sQGxp c3RzLmlvLmNvbQBTTVRQAGluX25vbWluZS1sQGxpc3RzLmlvLmNvbQAAHgACMAEAAAAFAAAAU01U UAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABkAAABpbl9ub21pbmUtbEBsaXN0cy5pby5jb20AAAAAAwAVDAEAAAADAP4P BgAAAB4AATABAAAAGwAAACdpbl9ub21pbmUtbEBsaXN0cy5pby5jb20nAAACAQswAQAAAB4AAABT TVRQOklOX05PTUlORS1MQExJU1RTLklPLkNPTQAAAAMAADkAAAAACwBAOgEAAAAeAPZfAQAAABkA AABpbl9ub21pbmUtbEBsaXN0cy5pby5jb20AAAAAAgH3XwEAAABPAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZnW4A 3QEPVAIAAAAAaW5fbm9taW5lLWxAbGlzdHMuaW8uY29tAFNNVFAAaW5fbm9taW5lLWxAbGlzdHMu aW8uY29tAAADAP1fAQAAAAMA/18AAAAAAgH2DwEAAAAEAAAAAAAAAtljAQSAAQAGAAAASW50cm8A DAIBBYADAA4AAADNBwMAEQASADUADwABAD8BASCAAwAOAAAAzQcDABEAEgAwAAcAAQAyAQEJgAEA IQAAAERCOTVDNEE0RjQ5RUQwMTFBNDRDMDBBMDI0N0IwNzY4AB8HAQOQBgDACgAAIQAAAAsAAgAB AAAACwAjAAAAAAADACYAAAAAAAsAKQAAAAAAAwAuAAAAAAADADYAAAAAAEAAOQDgN4iGRzO8AR4A cAABAAAABgAAAEludHJvAAAAAgFxAAEAAAAWAAAAAbwzR4W3pMSV3J70EdCkTACgJHsHaAAAHgAe DAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAB8MAQAAABAAAABtYXNxdWVAYmJpYy5jb20AAwAGEOsYcigDAAcQ hwIAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAEhFWUFMTEZJR1VSRURJVFdBU0FCT1VUVElNRUlDQU1FT1VUT0ZUSEVX T09EV09SS0lWRUJFRU5MVVJLSU5HVEhFUEFTVENPVVBMRVdFRUtTLFJFQURJTkcsSEVBUklOR1NP TUUAAAAAAgEJEAEAAAC9BwAAuQcAAFwQAABMWkZ1gnlyqwMACgByY3BnMTI1cjIMYGMxAzABBwtg bpEOEDAzMw8WZmUPkk8B9wKkA2MCAGNoCsBzhGV0AtFwcnEyAACSKgqhbm8SUCAwAdCFAdA2D6Aw NTA0FCHzAdAUEDR9B20CgwBQA9T7Ef8TC2IT4RRQE7IY9BTQrwcTAoACkQjmOwlvMBrf+mUOMDUc Ch0hHN8d6Rv0/x4SHH8gTyANH48dvxwPEGD8Mjgl2ibxJq8nuRv0J+K/Jk8qHyndKV8njytUOQ5Q Hy6kMAEoIzAAAoJzdHnqbAeQaAngdAAAE1AD8FBkY3RsCrFcMlhhmGRqdTFwBRBnaAVCOxYyDAFj CcAyYAMwc258ZXgXMAewBbAAwAJzc7EAUHNiMhRQMWBhE/D0XGsJ4HALkDI/MqMIYOsykAuAZTGg djlgAUAzm78MMDRkKAA3QASgC4BnJ/HpNOZiYRcQZAIgNaA1Rucx0DOQO5EgMTEzDlA2n/83rzi/ AFE5/ACgNG48fz2G/zEkD8A+jz+fQK8OUDnvQw/bRB89szMCghMQYzZgS6GTM5A9sHRpOZAgRAEQ qGF1bAVAUArAYQnA4GFwaCBGAiE2JCVA6GZpLQ+QOAFAOTBQM+tHDzKjYgsgcglQUlIWoNlSUnc0 JUEXAHAB0E1yfzO/Sp9Lpk/QTpAFEAIwLUNPMANhOiBUb1ewUyh1YmoFkHRXsERh6HRlOjYkNk// UQ9SH/9TL1Q5McA9ow4hS6E6tg5Qm1VvVn5SOYEXASBIPZH7BJA2JDdZb1p/W49cnTkPL12/D5Bp cAjQYgqwdDj/SfoPVEYQX79gxmoAYdALULx5L09AXLALEWJFczYk/ygAYz9kT2VfXK9UT2tfbG/v bXVX0ld0WKk5b78zPwMwHWmzOXOfdK96oERvY/51B4ACMAXQTwBM1nKkTbVjDGAJUGNmMnuoTVFI 7HlwBJBncWsaAXjSeDD3eHBxUQGAblgwAGAJ8E2g730AAgE14F5SZQDwfQAxgEuAYA5QdgiQd2sL gGT/a0CDwgTwB0AQYQFADgBxIvc9goUlAhBvBUIXIRLyWMAGbQtRWMAgQzpcXIBQUk9HUkFNTzAQ SUxFU4fQTUlDwYgAU09GVCCJQIhwbENFh9CJhkUAwAMQLn1LcHSA8BcQeHA1IWdyeHsBQIIhbjHQ GvCLJE40Y88DIBLzAIAFkGx2QaFG0P8OcDXgjbIBkAAgjkKEEX1B/wHBjbEW4A9wAABG0AzQAZD8 IC4aEo2oDlCOYk5weMD/jt+P75D/D8BG0AWBkp+Tr+2Uv2xrQEbQbJJflx+YJT4pkSwlQJX/mt+Y FGIg/igCkZv/jfNZUJmvnm+ff/+gj44gYxCh0o6voz+kT5Es/ygAod+nX6hvqX+OIHgApl//q++s /64ECvkDMHgveT96zRJ7YlB5IAdAbIUgrW7QZwhwCYAgTcAgbZA3BCABoGdBIE3QB4AgSc4ghLC4 wbhib2a4kDHQz7fwhlA1ILoQcmu3MLjguQAQcXWGYBOATfFiCeH+IApAuoA9wrnSCrAxcLkADwhg C1C58Qnga3MsIL8a8D2jvbA9gVcRPeBzA3C9u0JytuC50AhgtYFmTmD/tvCCMLfAAIG/xbnQO5G4 Ib/AQbdfuGrBMAeAwFIuCoX/CoW48LUivtCv4sIhA/C50F244E69sMAyuPBtxUNh/bbgKMKSu9BP AEtRh6BYsPO/kGdwYym44b3RtxC24PkJ8Gpvv2K58nFQwFLCcB/BMBbQwkI1cAQAdHMum7qwNcB3 vbC6120gE1BbxyM9wnkIYD1wYU3xdPZvu4HHsUzH/M4CyYRNwP29sGK4cbjwS3C9sL7gucL9GvCF xC/FhphwvWCtYAqw/Gdl0ES5IM2yPcKYcBbh/zUguKPBIrwTuaHKsFiwzgL+cLlyA6DCUbnQ1mEH QL3S/9ABNVC65sVhvvHKsIxhyXD+bBcQuqo1IGdwRqDWhr0Q/8exFtIA0FjABcAKwMORTfH/wDMB AMKRgpHFcQWwCJC9oV/QYruQzYDAQddiP8Q8Qf5u0AHdQ7oQTmA1IM5BMdDntBC/8cuhSXS65gQg F3D/FyAxgL7QCrETcbVks6HRltpJubB50yEAcG7HwYZQ3mu9sE3A4jhYsDoKhbWQrHRwh8GH0Hfn 0C7ToLd9AE3BB5AuBaCvkFwHENU9kDUAUFwIUHI1AQWw1YfQOF+QOMQ8TclhipL/2CHJcMYR3EEC kgiQylAS8hcPQD2xvMF7YkBZUEV0UkzGUEvG4IqhzhA6hQDAc7sAZUBiYg3g1+ii7GES8mRYsGHs ozqRAwuADiA3IADQyeoAefm6zhGMggCAqgBLqQsCAPKAChfygRDygW0AYQAAcwBxAHUAZQAIQABi 9AFpAGMA2i70YW/zIfKA4PGN9JCj8xT0UGwAdPTBOvMv//Q+GhACkspQFwBOcQjBC/L/fxXu7flS uVDsX+1v7nXgULvvUEtAQOgb79/w4zTxT8XyWBXygW4Aefgj93L9+BBn9+H00PRw9FD28PRQ7/fw 95D0nwI3OPZPA48En7/43/nvzMD+//vU5tVUl8H1vZCFxDxM5ZHdgm2TzhH/yaCzYD3Cs2DRjhoQ 8oASsAAAAAMAEBAAAAAAAwAREAQAAAADAIAQ/////0AABzDAlmXPRjO8AUAACDDAlmXPRjO8AQsA AYAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAAAAOFAAAAAAAAAwAFgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAUoUA ALcNAAAeAAaACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAABUhQAAAQAAAAQAAAA4LjAAAwAHgAggBgAAAAAA wAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAAYUAAAAAAAALABCACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAAOhQAAAAAAAAMAEYAI IAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAAABCFAAAAAAAAAwASgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAEYUAAAAA AAADABWACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAAYhQAAAAAAAB4AJYAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAA ADaFAAABAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAeACaACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAA3hQAAAQAAAAEAAAAAAAAA HgAngAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAOIUAAAEAAAABAAAAAAAAAB4APQABAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAD AA00/TcAAPm4 - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC3304.807B9600-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Mar 1997 23:26:02 -0500 From: "Stephen B. Mann" Subject: Re: IN> Secret Bible > Though we loved the movie, the fourth or fifth time we > saw it, we did the MST3K bit with some of it. My favorite line > was when the woman was traumatized after meeting lucifer. > "I met the devil tonight" Pause. "He likes flowers." ;) I've never seen the movie, but I'm reminded of that scene in the Rocky Horror Picture Show: Riff-Raff (to Frankie): "Say hello to Oblivion...." Audience: "Hello Oblivion, how's the wife and kids?" - -- Stephen B. Mann sm6439@cnsvax.albany.edu Webmaster Center on English Learning & Achievement http://www.albany.edu/cela ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 01:39:34 -0500 (EST) From: "Michael C. Nutt" Subject: Re: IN> Restoring a Remnant? >> If there is, theoretically, any way at all of restoring a >> remnant, wouldn't angels and Archangels sometimes attempt >> it? Simply out of charity and mercy? It seems to me that >> the angels of In Nomine are in danger of turning into little >> more than secret agents with an amusing set of superpowers >> and eccentric bosses, unless they sometimes just haul off >> and Do Good because it's the right thing to do and thus actually >> act angelic. > > This may sound a bit cold, but the angels-- ALL of >them-- are in a war with the Ultimate Enemy. There >are many, many drains on an Archangel's time and Essence. >If the energy could be better spent in some other part of >the war, it _will_ be spent there. And if the cost is >high enough an archangel might simply refuse to allow any >of his/her servitors from helping the unfortunate. Also, >it is very likely that the Remnant is viewed as a failure. >Why spend all that effort on a failure? > It's sort of like a Celestial Triage. Some angels >get better from wounds without care. Some angels need help, >but will be fine afterwards. > And some aren't worth the time. Frankly, this sounds more like a Demon Prince, to me, as cited on p. 155 : "Theoretically, a Prince will help out his Servitors when he can. In fact, your Prince will write you off if the cost of replacing you -- or your mission -- is less than the risk of helping you." Archangels are supposed to be nobler in spirit. I see them as willing to *help* a celestial who has suffered grievously in the name of the Cause. I personally like the idea that a Remnant just wouldn't be the *same* person, once he had Celestial forces restored to him, as what made him the unique person he once was is gone, forever. Angels don't actively hunt for Remnants, true, since that would take *amazing* resources... but if they *do* run across one, then they'll do what they can to help, even though it gives them the heebie-jeebies to be around the Remnant. "But for the Grace of God, there go I." And losing sight of who you are, and of the Cause that you're fighting for, seems to me to be the surest way to Fall. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 02:08:15 -0500 From: Shawn Goldman Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: > > On Mar 18, 10:19am, Leathal Weapon wrote: > > Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music > > A comment on: > > > > > [Patrick O'Duffy:] > > > > Anyway, I'd have the Angel of Music be a Mercurian. I think they'd > > > >dig the job the most. No idea who their superior would be. > > > > > I would allow there to be an Archangel of Music, who is obviously not > > one of the more powerful at the moment. Generally I like these things > > to be balanced, so there would need to be a Demon Prince of Music as > > well. > > Upcoming adventure has a Demon trying to become the > Demon Prince of Rock and Roll. Look for it in _Night Music_ > around April. ;) I thought you said that he was the demon prince of rock and roll but he was losing power and had a plant to regain it ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 21:03:43 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Frederick Subject: IN> Tether Seneschals Dear List I gotta problem. In a small city, about 5 million people, I want a fair balance of Tethers. That comes down to 2 Heavenly, 2 Diabolic and 1 a mystery. But how partisan are Tether Seneschals. If the Tether Seneschals are servitors of Laurence and Dominic, both of who are hostile to Eli, how cold a place is it going to be for Servitors of Eli. Obviously not as bad as for Diabolical agents whose local tethers are run by servitors of Demon Princes who are hostile to their Master, but how little comfort are they going to get from these obvious sources of succor. Or are the Seneschals operating under a more open policy to work for their side rather than a particular faction. I guess another slant is to make it dependant on the personality of the particular Seneschal. The other thing that I am hazy about is the power level of the Seneschals. Are they much bigger than PC starting level? Are their powers/abilities/Forces tied to their Tether? Any thoughts?? Thanking you for your indulgence. Yours Peter. Email to peterf@geko.net.au "Whoso loveth God truely must not expect to be loved by Him in return." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 07:09:49 -0600 (CST) From: Brian Emord Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music On Mon, 17 Mar 1997, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: > On Mar 18, 10:19am, Leathal Weapon wrote: > Upcoming adventure has a Demon trying to become the > Demon Prince of Rock and Roll. Look for it in _Night Music_ > around April. ;) > DOH!?!?!? And here I just finished my own write up for a Demon-prince of music and was going to ask the list for name suggestions...:( ahh well... win some, lose most, c'est la vie.... Brian Shedim of Nybbas Whose word is Psychotics ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 09:10:00 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Angel of Music > > Upcoming adventure has a Demon trying to become the > > Demon Prince of Rock and Roll. Look for it in _Night Music_ > > around April. ;) > I thought you said that he was the demon prince of rock and roll but he > was losing power and had a plant to regain it Me? I didn't say anything on the topic. According to the blurb on the SJG website, however, Furfur is the demon of Speed Metal and _that_ word is waning so he wants to upgrade to a better one. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Mar 1997 09:14:17 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Tether Seneschals On Mar 18, 9:03pm, Peter Frederick wrote: > Subject: IN> Tether Seneschals > Dear List > > I gotta problem. In a small city, about 5 million people, I want a fair > balance of Tethers. That comes down to 2 Heavenly, 2 Diabolic and 1 a > mystery. But how partisan are Tether Seneschals. If the Tether Seneschals > are servitors of Laurence and Dominic, both of who are hostile to Eli, how > cold a place is it going to be for Servitors of Eli. Obviously not as bad > as for Diabolical agents whose local tethers are run by servitors of Demon > Princes who are hostile to their Master, but how little comfort are they > going to get from these obvious sources of succor. Case by case. But I don't imagine most angels would be willing to turn away another angel who needed shelter. They might not help them forward their plans or anything of that nature, and they might extract a high cost. Whether it's done with ill grace or not is another matter entire! > Or are the Seneschals operating under a more open policy to work for their > side rather than a particular faction. I guess another slant is to make it > dependant on the personality of the particular Seneschal. Exactly so. > The other thing that I am hazy about is the power level of the Seneschals. > Are they much bigger than PC starting level? Are their > powers/abilities/Forces tied to their Tether? Not decided yet. But you can expect that, yes they are quite a bit tougher than starting characters and, yes they may have powers that are uniquely related to their position. There are no canon answers to these questions yet. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #76 ****************************** The material here is (C) 1996 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.