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in_nomine-digest         Thursday, May 1 1997         Volume 01 : Number 148



In this digest:

   [none]
   IN> DOMINIC.NET
   IN> thought...
   IN> Newbies and Management
   Re: IN> Archangel of Children
   Re: IN> Song of Fire
   Re: IN> Problems with an adventure
   Re: IN> thought...
   Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145
   Re: IN> thought...
   IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #142
   Re: IN> Archangel of Children
   [none]
   [none]
   Re: IN> vessel types...
   Re: IN> Re: Know the enemy from Dominic's PoV
   Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET
   Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment
   FireFluff... (Re: IN> Song of Fire)
   IN> Re: Arcangels
   Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145
   Re: Word of Anarchy (Re: IN> Demon Prince Bazur)
   Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment
   Re: IN> New Archangel
   IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #143
   Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET
   Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145
   Re: Word of Anarchy (Re: IN> Demon Prince Bazur)
   Re: Word of Anarchy (Re: IN> Demon Prince Bazur)
   IN>Test and Hello
   IN> Character sheet in GIF format
   IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #147
   IN> DOMINIC.NET
   Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment
   Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET
   Re: FireFluff... (Re: IN> Song of Fire)
   IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145
   Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET
   Re: FireFluff... (Re: IN> Song of Fire)
   IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #146

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 14:42:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: gibsonc@nku.edu
Subject: [none]

one quick question:

what does it take to be an arcangel? many angels posted on various web 
pages have words that fall under other words. for example, melody the aa 
of music falls under eli. do you have to have a certain kinda word or do 
you just need special rank from God?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 12:00:13 -0700
From: Hollis McCray <mccrayh@yoda.cochise.cc.az.us>
Subject: IN> DOMINIC.NET

Let's play a joke on DOMINIC.NET. Let's send them joke books till they get a
sense of humor.

Hollis, who thinks Dominic needs to get stoned.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:57:06 -0600 (CST)
From: "The Incredibly Unremarkable Cliffy Q. Scrimshaw" <cliffyqs@VAX2.WINONA.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: IN> thought...

Since we have an angel of Fire, one of earth (Stone), and one of air
(Wind), why no angel of Water?  I guess Novalis gets some of that, but I
am a bit curious anyway..

matt s.

"Life is like a yo-yo:                       .-.
it has its ups and downs,               __ __| |
plus a few loops now & then."           \ V / (()
 --Matt, a.k.a. CliffyQS@Earthling.net   |_|

------------------------------

Date: 30 Apr 97 15:01:17 EDT
From: Moriah - Steve Jackson Games <73407.515@CompuServe.COM>
Subject: IN> Newbies and Management

>From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" <johnk@ascc01.ascc.lucent.com>
>Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #144
>
>On Apr 29,  2:04pm, Walter Milliken wrote:
>> Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #144
>> [Rogue:]
>> >><sigh> I hope that someone is keeping track of these newbies and
>> >>sending them the *correct* way to sign up?
>> >
>> >Oh, uhm, we thought *you* were doing, ArchBeth.
>>
>> She's not in charge of the list, just the archives.
>
>        Ayup.  I usually mail the person a quick set of
>instructions when I see stuff like this come up.  I'm not
>sure who has all the passwords and stuff to actually administer
>the list.  My guess is Moriah.

   Thanks for catching this, John.  When they post to the list like that, I'm 
not sure (cause it takes too long to check) whether they signed themselves up 
or not and whether the post we see is just an extraneous message.

   I do get a lot of bad sign-up messages posted to -request, majordomo, or 
the list (with the magic code words which cause them to bounce) which all 
then bounce to me personally.  At that point I just go ahead and manually add 
them to the list.

Peace,

Moriah 
IN NOMINE List Manager <all managers/owners have the passwords>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:22:18 -0700
From: Roger Carbol <rog@col.ca>
Subject: Re: IN> Archangel of Children

So, maybe I mised this in the writeup, but what 
constitutes a child?

Is it an age thing?  If so, might the Archangel
get cut off in the middle of a mission due to
a birthday?



Roger Carbol .. rog@col.ca .. spare the Rod

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 15:47:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: IQJason@aol.com
Subject: Re: IN> Song of Fire

<<"Your friend will *BURN*" --Belial@Hell.org
"Your friend will *BURN*" --Gabiel@Heaven.org>>

"All well and good, but where's the song of Candle Wax to go with it?"
- --AndreLuv@shalmaru.hell.org

yours,
- -j

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:30:11 -0700
From: Roger Carbol <rog@col.ca>
Subject: Re: IN> Problems with an adventure

> a rather nasty Diabolic chemical 


Well, the most interesting point (as I've so kindly isolated)
is the concept that non-mortal, non-spiritual, non-organic
things can be Diabolical.  Symmetry might suggest that there
might also be Angelic substances.


Kinda reminds me of alchemists, base matter, the Stone,
and all that good stuff.  Any chance of an Alchemy supplement?



Roger Carbol .. rog@col.ca .. war is heck

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:21:52 -0700
From: "Robert Coon" <robcoon@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: IN> thought...

> 
> Since we have an angel of Fire, one of earth (Stone), and one of air
> (Wind), why no angel of Water?  I guess Novalis gets some of that, but I
> am a bit curious anyway..
> 
The Aristotlean elements are just an idea made by mankind -- there's
nothing that says that they all have to be represented in Heaven...

Although, interestingly enough, aren't the Chinese elements all represented
in Heaven as well (except Water, if that is one... I can't recall...)?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 16:38 EDT
From: Walter Milliken <milliken@bbn.com>
Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145

[Rogue:]
>I know.  It's just fun to tease the poor Archbeth.

This is generally unwise....


- ---Walter

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 17:07:36 -0400
From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" <johnk@ascc01.ascc.lucent.com>
Subject: Re: IN> thought...

On Apr 30,  1:57pm, \The Incredibly Unremarkable Cliffy Q. Scrimshaw\, wrote:
> Subject: IN> thought...
>
> Since we have an angel of Fire, one of earth (Stone), and one of air
> (Wind), why no angel of Water?  I guess Novalis gets some of that, but I
> am a bit curious anyway..

	There quite possibly will be an Archangel of the seas, but
not in any currently slated release.  Waterways have been important
to humans for long enough that _probably_ there was a powerful
entity in charge of them.  A demon prince of Oceans was mentioned
in a short story, for the flipside.


- -- 
 ___________________________________________________
/                                                   \
|John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) |
|           (919)380-4629                            |
| "A fundamental principle of economics is that the  |
| more you tax something, the less you get of it.    |
| In this country we tax success most of all."       |
\___________________________________________________/

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 18:39:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kim Foster <nexus@uky.campus.mci.net>
Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #142

At 06:23 PM 4/30/97 -0500, you wrote:
>ARGGGG!!!!!!!!! LEARN THE SACRED ART OF <SNIP>PING BEFORE SOMEONE KILLS YOU!!!
>
>not to be hostile or anything, but when 2 of your messages, with only 4 or
>so lines of origional (non quoted) content take up an ENTRIE issue of the
>digest it is NOT a happy time....  You COULD HAVE SAID "Could anyone send
>me the KNOW THY ENEMIES posts, I seem to be missing some pieces" instaed of
>saying, "send me the rest of THIS" and quoting the WHOLE god forsaken
>thing!!!!
>
>Now I'm not a fanatical snipper either and am pretty nice and fairly
>lenient with the adjucation of Netiquite (generally leaving it to
>DOMINICNET) to handel but WOW this is the worst case of bandwidth disregard
>I HAVE EVER SEEN (and thats saying quite a bit since I've been around (on
>the net) since I was 5...
>

And you obviosly haven't matured much sense then. I made a mistake and some
people POLILTlY informed of it, I apolgized,  and I will not repeat it into
the future. But this was the most childish peice of drek I have seen outside
of grade school. If this is the extent of your social skills its plain you
have spent to much on the Net. Its people like yuou that give other Internet
users a bad name. Get a life. 


Thank you to those people who have been nice enough to inform me of my
mistake in a mature way and I apolgize again. 


Snipped:much repeated drek from my previous error.
	I'd give my right arm to be ambidexterous!
			Crowe T. Robot-MST 3K

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:09:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: gibsonc@NKU.EDU
Subject: Re: IN> Archangel of Children

also on the children kick, do adults get an archangel? 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 97 18:46 EDT
From: Walter Milliken <milliken@BBN.COM>
Subject: [none]

>what does it take to be an arcangel? many angels posted on various web 
>pages have words that fall under other words. for example, melody the aa 
>of music falls under eli. do you have to have a certain kinda word or do 
>you just need special rank from God?

I suspect the Seraphim Council promotes angels to Archangel status --
God is notable in IN for his total absence from the current scene.  The
older Archangels like Yves and Michael presumably got their rank
directly from God, but newer ones probably didn't.

As near as I can tell, you have to make your word an important component
of the Symphony to be promoted.  As the Symphony shifts, some Archangels
may lose that status, and others gain it.

Personally, I would have made the Angel of Music a servitor of Eli,
albeit a high-ranked one (Ambassador?).  Not all the major Word-bound
need be archangels.....


- ---Walter

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:17:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: gibsonc@nku.edu
Subject: [none]

i am currently "fleshing" out the city of St.Louis in the campaign i am 
running. i have several celestials running about. some of whom i 
mentioned in the other posting and more who are out there in various jobs 
doing various things. all of which i will post if any are interested. 
however, i would like to add some more diabolicals. i need some from any 
who will respond. this is to give a nuetral edge to my group. i've seen 
several word-bound demons but does anyone have any regular-joe-servitors 
to list. if so please add them to the list or give up your web page.

thanx

jahon the St.Louis obsessed maniacal wizard of Booyukyuk 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 09:42:14 GMT+10
From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au>
Subject: Re: IN> vessel types...

In reply to:

> 	For the sake of my own sanity, I'd have to say no to
> this.  Insects, 'bugs', arachnids, etc are all going to be lumped in
> the same category.
> 
I thought only Jordi's kyriotates could posess swarms of insects, and 
that any Kyrio could possess one (and have a very weak vessel, but 
could use the 'fly on the wall' trick. As far as insect vessels are 
concerned, if you buy it, you can use it. Possessing a living 
creature is one thing, creating an insect form as an extension of 
celestial will is another. I'd allow it.

Leath.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:23:18 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: Re: IN> Re: Know the enemy from Dominic's PoV

At 8:12 AM -0400 4/29/97, Joseph R. Watt wrote:
>Corey wrote:
>> 
>>         Hey Archangel Beth, if, by the fates' whim, you  should find the
>> time, could you do a Know the enemy from Dominic's point of view.  Thanks
>> in advance.
>
>Starting, Presumably, with Seraphs..?

Funny you should mention that... O;>  (Well, I *didn't*, but
it was *hard* to resist the temptation!)


- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:40:31 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET

At 12:00 PM -0700 4/30/97, Hollis McCray wrote:
>Let's play a joke on DOMINIC.NET. Let's send them joke books till they get a
>sense of humor.

(But that *IS* the humor!)

>Hollis, who thinks Dominic needs to get stoned.

(Nah -- you see, when he's off-duty, he's busy dandling some baker's
dozen of Relievers on his tail, all of them calling him "Daddy"
(or "Mommy," depending...), and telling them stories of how Heaven
used to be, and how those poor, deluded angels turned into demons
because they were selfish...)



- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:27:00 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment

At 10:31 AM -0500 4/30/97, Shadowcat wrote:
>On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote:
>
>> #3: As delivered by a Servitor of Dominic (Judgment)
>> 
>> [When I first undertook this, I had this strong temptation to run 
>> through the *Choirs* and *Archangels*, and then footnote it, "Oh, and 
>> there are demons out there too."  But I didn't. Though it's easy 
>> enough to stereotype Judgment (*Nobody* likes Internal Security), 
>> it's probably, well, unjust. DominicNet should have little complaint
>> here.]
>
>	 I for one would like to see this.  And DominicNet be damned.

<grin> Well, once I'm done with "Know Your Diabolicals" and 
"Know the Enemy" (Saminga is hanging me up here...), I'm going
to do a "Know your Rivals" (Demonic) and "Know Your Allies" (angelic).

In the case of Asmodeus and Dominic, "Know Your Allies" may mutate
into "Know Your Subjects"...


- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:42:51 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: FireFluff... (Re: IN> Song of Fire)

At 5:15 PM +0000 4/30/97, Walt Mazur wrote:
>On Wed, 30 Apr 1997 01:50:57 -0400 (EDT), Calabim@aol.com wrote:
>
>>A friend of mine, who gets way too much email and is not on the list asked me
>>to post this and gather reactions to it. Enjoy...
>>
>>*** Songs of Fire ***
>
>"Your friend will *BURN*" --Belial@Hell.org
>"Your friend will *BURN*" --Gabiel@Heaven.org

I would have done Belial@Fire.Hel and Gabriel@Fire.Hev, myself...
Or maybe Belial@Fire.Hell.Cel and Gabriel@Fire.Heaven.Cel (For Celestial,
of course!)



- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:38:29 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: IN> Re: Arcangels

At 2:42 PM -0400 4/30/97, gibsonc@nku.edu wrote:
>one quick question:
>
>what does it take to be an arcangel? 

You have to be me, arcangel@io.com. O;>

>many angels posted on various web 
>pages have words that fall under other words. for example, melody the aa 
>of music falls under eli. do you have to have a certain kinda word or do 
>you just need special rank from God?

To be an Archangel, you have to (IMO) have worked your way up 
from a lowly reliever (or newly-created angel), through getting
an important Word with a wide-ranging concept (this is why all
the existing Archangels tend to be older -- they got their
Words long ago, when Words weren't as subdivided -- and the
few young ones are for very new aspects... Note that Jean is
*Lightning*, not Technology; Yves obviously volunteered one of
his Servitors from a ways back!), through doing a Good Job and
having the politics right... Until the existing Archangels
and/or the Seraphim council decide that you're ready for the
big leagues, managing all *sorts* of things relating to your 
Word.

(But since I hear the AA of Children in _Night Music_ is going
to be a "young" AA, this may be utterly off-base.)

Basically, the GM decides when he thinks your character might
get a chance at that brass ring -- and it shouldn't be soon, IMO.


- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:48:19 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145

At 4:38 PM -0400 4/30/97, Walter Milliken wrote:
>[Rogue:]
>>I know.  It's just fun to tease the poor Archbeth.
>
>This is generally unwise....

It is often unwise. Especially never call my bluff. (I know a 
certain Ofanite who was surprised when he did that... and I
wasn't bluffing.)

At 10:14 PM -0500 4/29/97, RogueLdr wrote:

>>[When I first undertook this, I had this strong temptation to run 
>>through the *Choirs* and *Archangels*, and then footnote it, "Oh, and 
>>there are demons out there too."  But I didn't. Though it's easy 
>>enough to stereotype Judgment (*Nobody* likes Internal Security), 
>>it's probably, well, unjust. DominicNet should have little complaint
>>here.]
>
>WE FIND YOUR LIST ACCEPTABLE, ARCHBETH.  WE HOPE THIS MEANS YOU HAVE
>ABANDONED YOUR SOMETIMES HERETICAL VIEWS.  CARRY ON.

<bland expression -- or at least as bland as Kyrios get> I'm just
making sure that everyone gets a fair deal here. We'll get to the
"Identifying Your Suspect" list eventually.

So, does that mean the other DominicNet I've been talking to isn't
the real one?

>Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 18:08:37 -0500 (CDT)
>From: Thany <sherlock@ksu.edu>
>X-Sender: sherlock@cbs.ksu.ksu.edu
>To: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
>cc: You lot <in_nomine-l@lists.io.com>
>Subject: Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Sender: owner-in_nomine-l@lists.io.com
>Precedence: bulk
>Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com
>
>
>On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote:
>
>> [When I first undertook this, I had this strong temptation to run 
>> through the *Choirs* and *Archangels*, and then footnote it, "Oh, and 
>> there are demons out there too."  But I didn't. Though it's easy 
>> enough to stereotype Judgment (*Nobody* likes Internal Security), 
>> it's probably, well, unjust. DominicNet should have little complaint
>> here.]
>
>JUST KEEP TELLING YOURSELF THAT.
>
>Dominic.Net - keeping Heaven safe from heresy
> 
>--
>"Illuminati
>Do they truly rule the world?
>You're not cleared to know."
>
>Disclaimer: They're my opinions, but they're your problem. 

(See? We seem to have two of them...)


- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:21:39 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: Re: Word of Anarchy (Re: IN> Demon Prince Bazur)

At 10:04 PM -0400 4/29/97, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote:
>> (*Is* there a celestial manifestation of Geasa? Of the ones that
>> you're owed as well as the ones you owe? It seems to me there
>> should be...)
>
>	Tricky question, that.  I would say that there is a
>sign, but it is _very_ well hidden and usually subject to
>inspection.

The Geas-bound celestial, of course, can probably take a look
and whine whenever s/he wants. ("Here's a six month one, and
the five hour-ones, and this big old one-year nasty...")

>[...] And the Geas-holder has a Celestial key or string
>for each Geas (or some other symbolic representation of
>the Geasa).

I would hope so -- makes it easier to trade around. "Okay, Karen,
here's an hour-Geas from, oh, who was that -- Joe, I think, and
then a day-Geas from Bess, and this Month-Geas from Sharleen. Now,
that settles the favor you just did me, *and* the day-Geas of mine
you got from Zarlig, right? Okay, how much for a week-Geas on 
Jasnoc?"

I just got the most shuddersome vision of Lilim trading around
Geasa like MTG cards...


- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:49:09 -0400
From: Elizabeth McCoy <emccoy@nh.ultranet.com>
Subject: Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment

At 9:10 PM -0500 4/29/97, Thany wrote:
>On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote:
>
>> At 6:32 PM -0500 4/29/97, Thany wrote:
>> >On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote:
>> >
>> >> Heh heh heh... What, you think there's something heretical in
>> >> that lot? Name it. <manic Kyrio expression -- as much as they
>> >> have one...>
>> >
>> >WE HAVE NOT MADE ANY ACCUSATIONS OR ACTIONS AGAINST YOU... YET. CONSIDER 
>> >THIS A WARNING. DO NOT ABUSE YOUR LICENSE TO RELEASE THESE ANNOUNCEMENTS, 
>> >LEST IT AND MORE BE REVOKED.
> 
>> But *Yves* likes them.
>
>Then he wouldn't be too surprised either way, would he?

<grin> True enough -- but what if he was the one who decreed that
they be posted?


- --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 10:15:11 GMT+10
From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au>
Subject: Re: IN> New Archangel

In reply to:

> Don't they already do this at higher check digits? Perhaps they just
> get a boost to the CD?
> 
At high check digits the Seraph can tell if a subject is lying and 
know what the truth is. However, if the subject believes himself 
(herself, not trying to be sexist) to be telling the truth, the 
Seraph will only register the statement as true, and get no more 
additional information. For example. A Seraph of Andariel and a 
Seraph of Miscellaneous Superior are questioning a woman about her 
husband. Seraph of Miscellaneous asks "Is your husband having an 
affair?" The woman believes this to be the truth and replies "Yes". 
The Seraph is satisfied with the truth and leaves. The Seraph of 
Andariel asks the same question, again the woman relplies "Yes", but 
the angel looks further into her mind and sees that she doesn't 
actually know. She merely found some undated love letters and 
detected perfume on his clothing. The woman still believes that her 
husband is having an affair (it is her truth), but now the angel 
knows that this isn't necessarily the case, and can explore other 
avenues to find the truth (the letters may have been from an old 
girlfirend and he (stupidly) didn't get rid of them, and the perfume 
could have been from sitting too close to an over-perfumed woman on 
the train home, I don't know).  

This is MO, does it clear things up?



> 
> 
> Bet he hates Malphus...
> 
> 
> --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net
> GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ 
> 
> 
> 
Leath.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 20:12:53 -0500
From: Mage Bob <magebob@iastate.edu>
Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #143

on Mon, 28 Apr 1997 08:53:04 -0400, "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC"
<johnk@ascc01.ascc.lucent.com> wrote this about "Re: IN> vessel types..."

>	The rationale is that you cannot have a single insect
>vessel (it's too small and simple to contain an angel)

WHAT? I thoguht the answer to "how many angels can dance on the head of a
pin?" is, "all of them" angels being native to the celestial plane, true
conductors of the symphany do NOT actually take up any "space" in 3
dimenstional reality, that is part of the reason that when they manifest in
their "true" (or celestial) form on the Corporial plane that they "cannot"
be seen except for by those rare individuals gifted with heavenly (or
hellish) perseption ability. 

Their Vessels are just "projections" or "manifestations" of their psyche in
our relm, built from thier own (or thier superiors or gods) will.  They
need a vessel to interact with OUR world (aka conventional reality) just as
WE (humans) need to shed our Vessels to enter Their world(s) (Celestial
planes). The differece beeing that humans can only shed their vessels
through death (barring celestial intervention or expendature of massive
amounts of will <more than a human can have>) while it is fairly easy for
an celestial to create a corporial vessel...

My point is this, an angel can create anything they want as a vessel, King
Kong size apes, bunnies, grashoppers, humans whatever, it don't matter, I
also disagree with the "smarm" of insects idea (except for kyrios).
HOWEVER non human vessels are rare, why? because taking mosterus vessels
tends to make humans who see it come up with explanations and those
explanations vary rarely include "angels" and only marginaly more often
include demons, thus these vessels will tend to DESTROY faith something
that neither Heven or Hell wants.  Taking Animal vessels is ok, and done
quite a bit, but really not all that usefull comparitively.  Rarely will a
celestial take ONLY an animal vessel using them usually as auxillery, as
IMHO verry few animals are in danger of going to hell, animals do what
their mind tells them, they don't think about it they are by nature
automaticly in tune with the universe, they are so rarely dissonent that
heaven doesn't neccisarly need to do anything to keep them away from hell,
and the demons figure them to be a lost cause. (not that simply being "in
tune" will get one into heaven, you gotta take risks to be rewarded, so
animal spirits end up reincarnating again and again). Insects quite frankly
not only are compleatly in tune with nature, but also in tune with their
hive in many cases, insects have barring intervention NO CHANCE IN HELL of
rising to the celestial plane.  So both camps largely ignore them.  Also
just like with the "monster" vessel point insect vessels lifting cars
really weirds out humans, so its recomended that if a celestial must take a
`setoid form that he/she/it be careful not to engage in any "impossible"
behavior... (color it a Masqurade if you want, thats what it is).

Basically its not a matter of what vessels an angel CAN have its a matter
of what vessels an angel (or demon) WILL themselves to have (with clearence
from their superiors of course).  In game terms if a player can justify it
to HIS SUPERIOR not TO THE GM that he SHOULD be able to have a FLEA as a
vessel well then he can, but if he does anything a flea cant (lift a
pencil, talk, throw a fireball down main street), his ass will be jerked
back to heaven so fast his halo will spin.

Thus celestials will generally choose (be permited) vessels that acurately
reflect their own abilities, someone with 5 corporial may be a huge biker,
a pro wrestler, etc... one with 5 etherial may be a "geeky computer
dweeb"... one with 5 celestial will be a priest, or a witch, or whatever...
celestials tend to be verry steriotypical if you havent noticed (in
apearance at least, often in midset (resonence anyone) as well) most will
fall in between, your milage my varry...

anyway, I'll shut up...
~Mage Bob <magebob@earthling.net> WEB:http://www.public.iastate.edu/~magebob/

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 18:39:43 -0700
From: Roger Carbol <rog@col.ca>
Subject: Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET

Hollis McCray wrote:

> Hollis, who thinks Dominic needs to get stoned.


Are you kidding?  I think stoning was probably Dominic's
idea in the first place.  Though I'm sure burning at
the stake is his other favourite method for
heretic extermination.


Roger Carbol .. rog@col.ca .. burn mother burn

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 20:49:10 -0500
From: tom timberlake <tomtimb@ionet.net>
Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145

what, you think AA Dom. can't keep track of two browsers at the same 
time? how, then, would he keep track of all heresies and defend his own 
Word? just think of it as multiple screens-within-a-screen, each 
browsing a different suspect, on a VERY large display, big enough to 
make Jean jealous, or so he would have us believe...
 
James, Davidian Malakim

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 20:52:58 -0500
From: tom timberlake <tomtimb@ionet.net>
Subject: Re: Word of Anarchy (Re: IN> Demon Prince Bazur)

what do you think inspired Wahtsi? you see, he was in a demonic tether 
one day, nursing wounds some !@!#@$$%%^% angel had delivered upon his 
pointy ears, when these two Lilim walked in....

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 21:32:34 -0400
From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" <johnk@ascc01.ascc.lucent.com>
Subject: Re: Word of Anarchy (Re: IN> Demon Prince Bazur)

> I would hope so -- makes it easier to trade around. "Okay, Karen,
> here's an hour-Geas from, oh, who was that -- Joe, I think, and
> then a day-Geas from Bess, and this Month-Geas from Sharleen. Now,
> that settles the favor you just did me, *and* the day-Geas of mine
> you got from Zarlig, right? Okay, how much for a week-Geas on
> Jasnoc?"
>
> I just got the most shuddersome vision of Lilim trading around
> Geasa like MTG cards...

	Sorta like that, but they are actually worth something.
<*ducks quickly!*>  ;)


- -- 
 ___________________________________________________
/                                                   \
|John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) |
|           (919)380-4629                            |
| "A fundamental principle of economics is that the  |
| more you tax something, the less you get of it.    |
| In this country we tax success most of all."       |
\___________________________________________________/

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:16:31 -0700
From: "J.D. Frazer" <jd@parasun.com>
Subject: IN>Test and Hello

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_01BC559B.02C6B500
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hey all,
I hope this works ok. I joined the list about a week ago, but since then =
I spent the last five nights down at a conference in Santa Clara. Boy, =
do I have a bunch of mail to go through.
Anyway, oughta be fun. I am made of Enternal Things and all of that.
jd
and everyone thought reading Dante and Milton would never come to any =
use. Hah.


- ------=_NextPart_000_01BC559B.02C6B500
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML 3.2//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"Trident 4.71.0544.0"' name=3DGENERATOR>

</HEAD>
<BODY>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hey all,</FONT>

<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I hope this works ok. I joined the list =
about a week=20
ago, but since then I spent the last five nights down at a conference in =
Santa=20
Clara. Boy, do I have a bunch of mail to go through.</FONT>

<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Anyway, oughta be fun. I am made of =
Enternal Things=20
and all of that.</FONT>

<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>jd</FONT>

<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>and everyone thought reading Dante and =
Milton would=20
never come to any use. Hah.</FONT><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2></FONT></P>

</BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_01BC559B.02C6B500--

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 23:16:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: TSRInc@aol.com
Subject: IN> Character sheet in GIF format

Now on my page:  

  http://users.aol.com/skreyn

I'll be modifying the sheet a bit in the next few days
(currently there is info for only one form's role/status/
charisma ... more will be added for other forms).

- - Sean

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 22:27:17 -0500 (CDT)
From: rogue@ez-net.com (RogueLdr)
Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #147

[snip DP Ralph]

Great stuff!  Not much use for it, admittedly.... but funny as (pardon the
expression) hell!

>> [When I first undertook this, I had this strong temptation to run 
>> through the *Choirs* and *Archangels*, and then footnote it, "Oh, and 
>> there are demons out there too."  But I didn't. Though it's easy 
>> enough to stereotype Judgment (*Nobody* likes Internal Security), 
>> it's probably, well, unjust. DominicNet should have little complaint
>> here.]
>
>
>	 I for one would like to see this.  And DominicNet be damned.

EXCUSE US?

>	  Shadowcat one of the last Human priests of Bast
>***************************************************************************
*****
>"I have fought reality for 30 years and I am glad to say that I have won."

Elwood P. Dowd?

- -Rogue, who portrayed Mr. Dowd in the play "Harvey" a few months ago.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 21:32:58 -0700
From: Hollis McCray <mccrayh@yoda.cochise.cc.az.us>
Subject: IN> DOMINIC.NET

Let's give DOMINIC.NET a virus that won't let him do anything till he gives
the correct punchline. I've got a joke they'll never get. Something about a
road and a chicken...
Hollis McCray
Madman at Large
email: Mccrayh@yoda.cochise.cc.az.us


"No matter where you go, there you are."
- -Buckaroo Banzai

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 00:10:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Gregory Littmann <gmlittmn@email.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: IN> Know Your Diabolicals: #3, Judgment

> >
> >> 
> 
> <grin> Well, once I'm done with "Know Your Diabolicals" and 
> "Know the Enemy" (Saminga is hanging me up here...), I'm going
> to do a "Know your Rivals" (Demonic) and "Know Your Allies" (angelic).
> 
  Now those would be *hugely* useful - after all, you spend more time with
those on your own side than with the Enemy.  BTW, keep up the terrific
work - I've really been enjoying these posts!  :)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 21:30:56 -0700
From: Hollis McCray <mccrayh@yoda.cochise.cc.az.us>
Subject: Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET

At 07:40 PM 4/30/97 -0400, you wrote:
>At 12:00 PM -0700 4/30/97, Hollis McCray wrote:
>>Let's play a joke on DOMINIC.NET. Let's send them joke books till they get a
>>sense of humor.
>
>(But that *IS* the humor!)
>
>>Hollis, who thinks Dominic needs to get stoned.
>
>(Nah -- you see, when he's off-duty, he's busy dandling some baker's
>dozen of Relievers on his tail, all of them calling him "Daddy"
>(or "Mommy," depending...), and telling them stories of how Heaven
>used to be, and how those poor, deluded angels turned into demons
>because they were selfish...)
So let's slip him some anyway. Haven't you ever heard of spiking punch?
Hollis McCray
Madman at Large
email: Mccrayh@yoda.cochise.cc.az.us


"No matter where you go, there you are."
- -Buckaroo Banzai

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 May 1997 06:08:33 GMT
From: w_mazur@primenet.com (Walt Mazur)
Subject: Re: FireFluff... (Re: IN> Song of Fire)

On Wed, 30 Apr 1997 19:42:51 -0400, Elizabeth McCoy
<emccoy@nh.ultranet.com> wrote:

>>"Your friend will *BURN*" --Belial@Hell.org
>>"Your friend will *BURN*" --Gabiel@Heaven.org
>
>I would have done Belial@Fire.Hel and Gabriel@Fire.Hev, myself...
>Or maybe Belial@Fire.Hell.Cel and Gabriel@Fire.Heaven.Cel (For Celestial,
>of course!)

Or Gabriel@Fire.org and Belial@Fire.com?

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 May 1997 02:15:16 -0500
From: Mage Bob <magebob@iastate.edu>
Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #145

rouge (i think) said some of the quoted material... mabey...

[snip PBEM bit]

>I'd like to join one, as well.  Hell, with everyone wanting to, we could
>form our own.  Does anybody know how?

I was toying with starting one, and would join one, but I'm not 100% sure
that I will have regular acess to E-Mail over the summer...  If I do I may
get on it depending on how much I'm working... and how much time runnign
Live Action Vampire the Masqurade sucks up...

[Snip bit on rolls being tough as hell]

>Humans have been on Earth their whole lives.  They're used to the common
>things they encounter (chain link fence).  So I give them auto-successes on
>a lot of things that normal humans can do.

I agree with that, but probably would never even consider making someone
roll to climb a fence, especially if they had any sort of climbing skill.

HOWEVER rolls are not all that tough, if the human actaully buys skills,
Angels and Demons cant really afford to get that many skills (esp. if they
have more than one vessel, and they need songs and rolls and a retinue and
artifacts) but humans pretty much spend ALL thir points on skills... so it
all works out...
I'd also like to point out that IN's system REALLY REALLY REALLY sucks as a
system, but its ok because it is there to be ignored... (and actaully for
all its simplicity I have a slow go with it, all that addition! Sure I can
do calculus but DONT ASK ME TO ADD!)

[snip a few other good points]

>

Then IOTA (methinks) says...

>   No Angelic or Infernal character is altogether "pure" either.  I have
>trouble thinking of Yves, Dominic, and Michael as pure all at the same time.
>Pure to their Words, maybe, altogether pure, something else entirely...

Pure to their words, thier chior, and their superior(s) is all that really
matters, I see IN as compleatly skirting the ideas of good and evil, simply
put there is "harmony" and "dissonance" for celestials and as long as they
avoid being dissonent they CANNOT Fall or Rise no matter how greedy,
lawless, evil, ugly, stupid they are (course as I've said before they wont
FALL or RISE at all just stagnate right where they are, probably why there
are relitively few malikite superiors) only dissonance can make one "fall"
(or rise for demons) and only selfishness for demons and selflessness for
angels can "tip the scales" and "improve" their station. Even this however
one can see this as simply obeying the resonance of their ultimate
superiors (god or lucifer).

that is ONLY humans can be sinners, and that sin is theirs not only by deed
but also by will.  That is humans have come up with the idea of sin on
their own and are thus will forever suffer from their own free will. Not to
say celestials arnt in control of themselves, rather that there are
spiritual punishments placed on them for acting against their nature, where
as humans should NEVER gain dissonance unless they CHOOSE to fetter
themselves to some sort of "diety" and freely give up a portion of their
free will...

~Mage Bob, demon of rambling <magebob@earthling.net>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 01:25:03 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thany <sherlock@ksu.edu>
Subject: Re: IN> DOMINIC.NET

On Wed, 30 Apr 1997, Hollis McCray wrote:

> Let's play a joke on DOMINIC.NET. Let's send them joke books till they get a
> sense of humor.

I DON'T GET IT.

Dominic.Net - keeping Heaven safe from heresy
 
> Hollis, who thinks Dominic needs to get stoned.

Y'never know, though, that might only make him worse.

- --
"Illuminati
Do they truly rule the world?
You're not cleared to know."

Disclaimer: They're my opinions, but they're your problem. 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 May 1997 01:32:19 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thany <sherlock@ksu.edu>
Subject: Re: FireFluff... (Re: IN> Song of Fire)

On Wed, 30 Apr 1997, Elizabeth McCoy wrote:

> I would have done Belial@Fire.Hel and Gabriel@Fire.Hev, myself...
> Or maybe Belial@Fire.Hell.Cel and Gabriel@Fire.Heaven.Cel (For Celestial,
> of course!)

_Scud: the Disposable Assassin_ (see below) had a computer link-up to 
Hell in the most recent issue, with the domain being .gov, but I'm not 
sure I buy that...
 
- --
"Illuminati
Do they truly rule the world?
You're not cleared to know."

Disclaimer: They're my opinions, but they're your problem. 

P.S. Scud is a surrealistic comic book parody (of just about anything it 
can lay its hands on, but mostly other action comics), whose current plot 
would make a very, um... different variant for IN ;)

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 01 May 1997 02:52:15 -0500
From: Mage Bob <magebob@iastate.edu>
Subject: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #146

Someone asked...
>Are ghosts Celestial, or Ethereal? I haven't found any mention of them in 
>the book, yet.

There Ethereal, they are the result of a mind too fettered to pass totally
from this world into the next though they should be rare if existing at
all... and soem ghosts are just the imprint on reality left by the passing
on of a human with a particularly strong will...  all in all it really
doesn't matter all that much, I don't see ghosts as having much of a role
in the game, and they really dont fit in either of the other 2 so lets
stick them in the Etherial with the greek gods and other stuff we don't get
and don't really care about...
:)

Then the guy from Lucent Tech. said this...

>	The NON-Canon answer to that is that is yes.  I've made up
>some rules and they are being scrutinized carefully by the gods
>(small 'g') of In Nomine.  Until they decide, I can't give a
>Canon answer to that question.  You might note that the Children
>of the Grigori are out there and are descended from both humans
>and angels.  If that's the case, it seems reasonable that two
>celestials could do so as well.

howabout 2 vessels of the same angel? kyrio's of Michael can have more than
one vessel, and inhabit em at the same time, no reason why one cant be male
and the other female, does this just ammount to angelic masterbation? would
it offend DOMINICNET? would god himself get off his high horse to stop it?
would michael disown the angel? And what would the children look like?

anyway...
~Mage Bob, sicker than thou!

------------------------------

End of in_nomine-digest V1 #148
*******************************

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All rights reserved.