From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon May 4 16:14:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20418 for ; Mon, 4 May 1998 16:14:22 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id PAA15792 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 4 May 1998 15:40:52 -0500 Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 15:40:52 -0500 Message-Id: <199805042040.PAA15792@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #750 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, May 4 1998 Volume 01 : Number 750 In this digest: Re: IN> Npcs Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) IN> Dark Destiny, Bright Fate Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Shedites and dead hosts Re: IN> Dominic Re: IN> Angels and Dicey Words Re: IN> Re: IN- Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Re: IN> Angels and Dicey Words Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Re: IN> Stray Thought... Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Re: IN> Dominic IN> IN: 144,000 IN> A newbie, a plot point, and a question (all in one!) Re: IN> Npcs Re: IN> A newbie, a plot point, and a question (all in one!) Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Re: IN> Playing IN for laughs... Re: IN> Re: IN- Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Re: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment IN> IN: LARP Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Re: IN> IN: LARP Re: IN> Playing IN for laughs... Re: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 13:10:32 +0200 (DFT) From: Anders Gabrielsson Subject: Re: IN> Npcs On Sat, 2 May 1998, MarkDEddy wrote: > Loganberries are the active ingredient of Swedish Pancakes. > (Think blackberries or raspberries, only slightly different...) Hm. This must be some kind of Swedish Pancakes that don't come from Sweden, or at least aren't very popular here. :) Anders Gabrielsson, Angel of [SNIP]ping anders@stp.ling.uu.se The contents of this message belong to me and nobody else. So there! "I kick arse for the Lord!" - Father McGruder ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 08:32:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment > In general I don't think Lovecraft's world and In Nomine are > compatible, because HPL's fiction depends on a mechanistic, godless > universe (ours) for its impact. So I don't intend to do any sort of > IN/CoC crossovers. No munchkinful Lucifer-vs.-Nyarlathotep > square-offs. No? Not even a little one? But having Nyarlathotep running around in your game doing utterly random things would be fun! Fun, I say! FUN! (Laurence stands in the Dreamlands, staring at Yog-Sothoth. He's quiet for a long time, holding his sword. Finally, he says, "You remember the Purity Crusade? Maybe it wasn't such a bad idea after all.") Actually, I put the Lovecraftian Mythos as 'A Good Reason Not To Walk Out Into The Far Marches'. You really don't know what's out there, and this is very possibly some of it. I believe that, in the Marches, if Human Beings have thought of it and gone so far as to popularize it to nearly mainstream for some largish (over 1 million) part of the population, then it is probably crawling around out there. It doesn't make it any more Real in the Amber sense, but don't be surprised to hear tales of lost Purity Malakim just now staggering in from the Marches about their war buddies getting eaten by the Goat of a Thousand Young while Elvis stood to one side and sang "Hound Dog" and an away team beamed back to the Enterprise. - - Em. Happy Fun Balseraph! Zoinks! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 09:04:33 -0400 From: Andrew Frades Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Perry M. Lloyd wrote: > It is Dissonant for a Seraph to lie. > > How does a Seraph know what the Truth is without a Resonance Roll? > How will a Resonance Roll help when the Truth is only revealed on CD > of 6? > > Do the Seraphim just speak and see if they gain Dissonance or not? > I doubt it. > > How do the Seraphim know what the Truth is? > > It is Dissonant for a Seraph to lie, but can a Seraph avoid lying when > he cannot perceive Truth except on a CD of 6? It is dissonant for a Seraph to speak an untruth. If the Seraph does not know the truth they would have to say that they do not know. Saying anything else is a lie, so yes they would gain dissonance and be well on the way toward falling. It is the provence of the Balseraph to invent the truth. Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 09:14:41 -0400 From: Andrew Frades Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Pee Kitty wrote: > Knowingly speaking a falsehood is lying. Unknowingly speaking a falsehood > is being mistaken. Seraphim are allowed to be mistaken, but they cannot > lie. If I've managed to totally convince John Q. Seraph that I'm a Cherub, > and he believes it, then he doesn't get dissonance for calling me a > Cherub. OTOH, if he knows that I'm a Habbalite, he cannot call me a Cherub > without gaining dissonance. However, speaking a supposition as if it were the truth would be dissonant. Speaking it as a supposition would be fine. Seraph can have opinions, but they need to be careful at times about the fact that others see them as bastions of truth. Not every word a Seraph says is the Truth, just the truth as they know it. Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 98 08:32:46 -0400 From: Shadowstar Subject: IN> Dark Destiny, Bright Fate Greetings, The following is the prologue to a story used as background for a LARP oneshot that I plan on running this summer. Yes, many of you will recognize some of the influences of the highly amusing 'Dark Victory' by Redneck Gaijin. I'm not worthy! I'm not worthy! More will be added once play has commenced. Never know when prying eyes might be lurking these lists... *grin* I also apologize in advance for the style of the voice of the Symphony. *evil grin* - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Dark Destiny, Bright Fate - ------------------------- by Josh V. 05-03-98 Prologue: Decrescendo <> It was bad enough, dealing with the disgusting echoes rippling before me. The brilliant perfection of the notes, adding to my already aggravating headache. The subtle undertones of chimes and bells, grating my very being. But did God have to disturb me as I bathed? There are days I suspect my trusted Prince Kobal to be another wretched reflection of most Holy. "I no longer am interested in our little bets. Even when I win, I feel myself to be on the receiving end of some terribly amusing joke. Do you see me laughing?" I didn't hear the jolly laughter, or a small giggle. Not even a mirthful smirk. I didn't like this, not in any sense of the word. <> Bugger, and humbug. I was wondering when High-n-Mighty'd get around to giving me the time of day about that. My pride doesn't allow me the privilege of admitting to the righteous bastard. Lest I am seen becoming selfless in my resolve once more. I hate being wrong. "And this effects me, how?," I'm smug in my reply. "Let the forces of all that is bland, and stagnant, consul my agents of liberation." <> Again, there is no humor to that resonant voice. I'll skin that damnable harlequin's hide for all eternity, if he's even -remotely- involved in this. I begin to look for the rubber waterfowl that must be floating in my burbling cauldron of ichor. <> <> <> <> There was that unnerving pause. Did I mention I hate being wrong? <<...Ah yES, LIgHTBrINger. kROnOS...>> I narrowed my gaze, knowing the Host wants me to ask the stupidly obvious. "And what of him?" <<...KRonOs cANnoT aLlOw yOu tO bECoMe tHe SYmPhOny. HiS FAte lIEs wIth oNlY tHE DisCOrdAnT PiT LeFt.>> There was that lack of merriment again. I was getting worried, but I quickly washed aside my doubts. I wasn't about to let the awful Truth effect my position. Not after so much time. "Again, this effects me how?" <> The room trembled in the mighty reverberations. <> Pity, I didn't have anyone convenient to throttle at that moment. I'll have to remember to do so once Show-N-Tell is over with. "If this is to be my Destiny, then what of my Fate?" I could feel the grin this time. Damn, I knew I was screwed now. <> I thought it over. Civilizations arose, and crumbled in the meantime... "What do you propose?" * * * I sat musing on my granite throne. The discordant screams of the pit doing nothing to improve my spirit. I, Lucifer ­ The Lightbringer, was trapped. I'll hate myself in the morning for agreeing to the Symphony's Grand Plan. Now, where'd Kobal run off too? - - J. - - Blaseraph Marquis of Fate, Demon of Delusions of Grandeur = shadowstar@centuryinter.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 10:16:47 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Simon Hailes wrote: > Lovecraft was not a perpetual Goth, and don't let me hear you say > that again, he was one of the greatest horror writers of the 20th > Century and has influenced the likes of Robert Bloch (Psycho) > Stephen King and Ramsey Campbell. Live E. E. "Doc" Smith, Lovecraft founded a genre. (Space opera, in Smith's case.) Like Smith, his creativity lay in founding the genre, not in his literary abilities. Both wrote atrocious prose. Both are good for a giggle, if you're in the right mood. > Also, there are some who would say that what he wrote about was > not completely fancy either, his dad was a member of a mystical > Freemason lodge, and owned many esoteric books of lore.... "There are some who would say" just about anything. Loecraft was pretty public about being a skeptic and materialist. You can, of course, suppose that this was cover for a more secret mystical position, but then that line of "reasoning" becomes impervious to any evidence whatever. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 10:20:27 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Armand wrote: > During the very beginning, 144,000 are to be saved. (I > heard a priest state this as fortunate news. Unfortunately, I > know that number doesn't even equal one tenth of the pop. of my > city, much less the world. Gosh, math sucks!) If you read the actual passage where the 144,000 are first introduced, you will find that, shortly thereafter, a "multitude that no man was able to number" are also also saved. The 144K, based on their later appearances in Revelation, appear to be elite forces of Heaven, but not the whole human population thereof. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 10:27:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> Shedites and dead hosts On Sun, 3 May 1998, Sean McCarthy wrote: > As I was rereading the largely-overlooked rules part of the core book > today(The pictures in the second half of the book are better, right?) > I noticed something in the dissonance rolls section. > > (p57) > For either outcome, the check digit determines how many hours he must > wait before using /any/ supernatural aspect of his resonance again! > > A Shedite whose host dies out from under them gains a point of > dissonance but it not zapped back to Trauma if they can find a new > host in time. But barring Intervention, their resonance will be > useless for at least 1 hour...and they don't have that much time. I'm surprised I never noticed that before. You're absolutely right; this needs some sort of clarification or errata. > This has, of course, all kind of new problems. Balseraphs in > particular are in trouble, because of how easily they gain > dissonance...and how hard it is to shed said dissonance without their > resonance. No, not really. They just have to wait a while before they can lie to the person again and eliminate their dissonance. There's no time limit.... Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! And finally, a special message to \|/ ____ \|/ anyone who thinks I give a damn... ~@-/ oO \-@~ /_( \__/ )_\ \__U_/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 10:27:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Elizabeth Bartley Subject: Re: IN> Dominic On Sun, 3 May 1998, Jesse wrote: > Anyway, does anyone run a game where Dominic is a good guy? It seems to me > that he has been a victim of bad press, prehaps one of Micheal's saints > works at SJG? Of course Heaven needs a police force, it lost one third of > its populace in a rebellion. Dominic is moderately sympathetic in his expanded writeup; it's just the short form in the first book which makes him sound like a paranoid totalitarian. And since the first book consisted of what archangels did, not why (and what they thought about each other -- and *everybody* hates internal security) it's natural for Dominic to look bad there. Elizabeth Bartley e-bartley@pobox.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 11:30:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Highway Star Subject: Re: IN> Angels and Dicey Words According to Elizabeth McCoy: > "[...] The Final Trumpet has expanded writeups on Michael, Baal, > Kobal and Malphas; two new Superiors -- Khalid, Archangel of > Faith, and Magog, Demon Prince of Cruelty; [...]" So it's going to have two Archangel write-ups and 4 Demon Princes? Will any of the other supplements even this out? I'm just curious as to why when other supplements came out with it even they decided to favor the DPs this time.:) SeanMike - -- __^\ | SeanMike Whipkey | Smile! The Illuminati are __/ * | | Professional Student| watching. / \ | GWAR Cyberslave | I don't see you, so don't - --------- | Hail Eris! FNORD | pretend you're there. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 08:38:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Shumaker Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN- Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Well I dont know about all of you, but I use mapboards so I can draw funny pictures and then get my fingers blue. To each their own... Jim The Impudite ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 11:48:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Angels and Dicey Words > > "[...] The Final Trumpet has expanded writeups on Michael, Baal, > > Kobal and Malphas; two new Superiors -- Khalid, Archangel of > > Faith, and Magog, Demon Prince of Cruelty; [...]" > > So it's going to have two Archangel write-ups and 4 Demon > Princes? > > Will any of the other supplements even this out? I'm just > curious as to why when other supplements came out with it even > they decided to favor the DPs this time.:) Maybe because Kobal is Cooler then Soup. :) That's my pet theory, and my personal favorite. My other theory is that there is something in the adventure that requires the additional superiors and the expanded writeups. Although this theory can be rather incorrect - it hasn't been exactly supported in the previous supplements, other then superfluosly. As in, we ended up with Christopher and Fleurity because NPCs in the adventure required their existence, but the existance of say, Mammon in H&H was not supported by anything other then passing mention in some of the text. Ahem. I'm feeling a Superior in Revelations Sourcebooks Rant #27 come on, so I'll leave it at that. - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 12:06:08 -0400 From: Jesse Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment >Natch again - the characters I mentioned (Nyarlathotep, Randolph >Carter, super-Cats in general, and Pickman) were all figurs of the >Dreamland mythos, not the Cthulu mythos, correct? >Enosh I am not postive about Carter, I think he was the one taken over by his great-grandfather. It was in my Lovecraft anthology, "Dreams of Terror and Death" but nothing seemed particularly dreamlike about it. Conversly it was not a Cthulu tale either, so I don't know what that makes it. All the others are from Dreamland, yes. But I think the Creeping Chaos is mentioned in Cthulu's tales too, although to a lesser extant that in the Dreamlands. - -Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 16:53:34 +0100 From: Jo Hart Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) At 14:33 03/05/98 EST, you wrote: > >It is Dissonant for a Seraph to lie, but can a Seraph avoid lying when >he cannot perceive Truth except on a CD of 6? > He can tell people the degree of certainty he has on any given fact ;-) I'm sure you don't need to make a CD of 6 to look outside and see if the sun is shining. jo ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 16:55:17 +0100 From: Jo Hart Subject: Re: IN> Stray Thought... At 07:24 04/05/98 +1000, you wrote: >> First of all, the Shedim would have to make a contest of wills check to see >> if he can convince the host that drinking the Cerepax is a "good" idea. >> Humans can resist the actions of Kyrios and Shedim. Especially this. > > Bear in mind that I was specifically thinking of a Shedim of Malphas, who >don't have to make a contest of wills with their host. > I don't know about Shedim but it would be a truly evil thing to do if you had a song of possession, just before it ran out. (Not sure what would happen if you were possessing a vessel) jo ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 11:43:46 -0500 From: Bob the Dancing Monkey Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment It is somewhat difficult to seperate the Dreamlands from the Cthulhu Mythos. If you read enough of hs work, you note that he uses many of the same gods and beings, even if only mentioned in passing. I recall Nyarlathotep mentioned in particular in both the journeys in Greater Slumber as well as as in the greater world. It is easiest to think of them simply as part of the same greater Mythos created by Lovecraft and his colleagues. What's more, once you get into modern Mythos literature and Chaosium's excellent game, there is really no difference at all. - -Drew Who's been reading more Lovecraft and Pagan Publishing releases than are really good for him... Drew Johnson - CLA - Office of Info Tech x5-4885 - http://www.econ.umn.edu/~djohnson/ No-daaaaa... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 12:55:21 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Jesse wrote: > I am not postive about Carter, I think he was the one taken over > by his great-grandfather. Carter was the one who went on a time-trip and got somehow merged with a previous incarnation of himself, who was, unfortunately, a horrific extraterrestrial. The ET Carter was last seen trying to undo the time-snarl, so far as I know. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 12:56:03 -0400 (EDT) From: "York H. Dobyns" Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat eswhanu@juno.com wrote: >On Sat, 02 May 1998 18:42:51 -0400 Ron Carnegie >writes: [...] >>Not only do I disagree with this statememnt, but I disagree that what >>is >>happening on the map board IS roleplay rather than wargame. I do >>sometimes>act out manuevers in full scale. Now that we've had one annoyingly didactic statement, I'll provide an appropriate counter: Roleplaying games are wargames where the pieces also have personalities. [...] >That is why I prefer to run In Nomine as Live Action as opposed to >tabletop. You get to move the players around, and people can appreciate >such things as cover and distance (OK, you hide behind that pillar, and >tell me how much you stick out). > > That, and the Lilim that dress the part... :) Well, that last bit could be fun, but...IN has never struck me as a game that adapts well to LARP. I can see where heroic fantasy with more-or-less human characters can work, either archaic or modern day: fake swords, paintball guns, little packets of chalk or whatever to throw for "spells." But IN? What do you do when somebody goes celestial to walk through a wall? Casts *any* variety of the Song of Motion? Switches to an animal Vessel -- especially a small one that fits a crawlspace too narrow for a human? What about a Kyrio being in three or more places at once? Or Shedim switching bodies? What do you do with the more gung-ho varieties of information-gathering Resonance --- time stops while the player being scanned goes and whispers in the resonator's ear? The only thing making it more feasible than LARP Champions is that celestials run out of essence a lot faster than superheroes run out of endurance. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 19:14:09 +0200 (DFT) From: Anders Gabrielsson Subject: Re: IN> Dominic On Mon, 4 May 1998, Titus 3 11 wrote: > Nien - God "...intervened and acquited Micheal, not because he was > innocent but because without pride and glory - and Micheal - Heaven's > greatest battles would be lost." > I don't read that to mean that God TOLD everyone that Micheal was guilty > but tough, he's allowed to break my laws. > No. > As players and readers of the book, we get a little more info then we as > characters do. So Heaven in general doesn't know why God did what he did, > probably thinking that Micheal actually was innocent. Dominic might have > gotten a personal explaination (we all know he ... touchy... he can be). > But to the celestial realm at large, Micheal was acquited. True, I didn't remember the exact wording. The way you explain it, that sounds ver reasonable, though I do think it can be read both ways. Oh, the perils of scripture! :) Anders Gabrielsson anders@stp.ling.uu.se The contents of this message belong to me and nobody else. So there! "I kick arse for the Lord!" - Father McGruder ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 19:19:47 +0200 (DFT) From: Anders Gabrielsson Subject: IN> IN: 144,000 On Mon, 4 May 1998, Earl Wajenberg wrote: > If you read the actual passage where the 144,000 are first > introduced, you will find that, shortly thereafter, a "multitude > that no man was able to number" are also also saved. The 144K, > based on their later appearances in Revelation, appear to be > elite forces of Heaven, but not the whole human population thereof. The Soldiers of Heaven, perhaps? Anders Gabrielsson, Angel of [SNIP]ping anders@stp.ling.uu.se The contents of this message belong to me and nobody else. So there! "I kick arse for the Lord!" - Father McGruder ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 10:38:20 -0700 From: alloni@ibsystems.com (Alloni Kramer) Subject: IN> A newbie, a plot point, and a question (all in one!) Hi. My name is Alloni, and I'm about to start running an In Nomine game. (Cries of, "Hi Alloni!") So I was brainstorming, and I thought up an... odd idea which I thought I would get people's opinion on. Distinctions. Is it possible to turn down a Distinction? Is it an actual change in the character, or is it just a title? Is it possible for Demon Princes to give angels Distinctions? My idea: Kobal gets thwarted in a plot by a PC angel. Kobal gets angry. Kobal gives the angel a Distinction, giving the angel grief, making all his friends mock him, making Dominic start paying him extra special attention, and generally making his life Hell. It's quite possible that, if it is more of an actual change than a simple title, that it would just be done by all of Kobal's Servitors calling the angel by the title ("Look! It's Bobiel, Knight of Derision!" "STOP CALLING ME THAT!"), and generally spreading it around. Still. What do y'all think? Would it work? Is it twisted enough for Kobal? I could even see some angels taking a twisted form of pride in it. Thanks! Alloni ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 13:39:54 EDT From: MarkDEddy Subject: Re: IN> Npcs In a message dated 5/4/98 3:16:21 AM, anders@strindberg.ling.uu.se writes: >On Sat, 2 May 1998, MarkDEddy wrote: > >> Loganberries are the active ingredient of Swedish Pancakes. >> (Think blackberries or raspberries, only slightly different...) > >Hm. This must be some kind of Swedish Pancakes that don't come from >Sweden, or at least aren't very popular here. :) Swedish Pancakes a la U.S.A.: Crepes, Loganberry compote, whipped cream. Add syrup as desired. (This may simply be the Washington State version...) Mark.(I was afraid that was coming...) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 12:53:47 -0500 (CDT) From: Elizabeth Bartley Subject: Re: IN> A newbie, a plot point, and a question (all in one!) On Mon, 4 May 1998, Alloni Kramer wrote: > Distinctions. Is it possible to turn down a Distinction? Is it an actual > change in the character, or is it just a title? Is it possible for Demon > Princes to give angels Distinctions? Huh. *Most* Distinctions come with expanded powers, but not all. They can be just a rank (more than a title, a position in the hierarchy) -- though normally in those cases they're granted together with some goodies to help the celestial deal with his new responsibilities. Certainly a Demon Prince could give an angel a rank or title, and there wouldn't be anything anyone could do about it. My guess would be that a Demon Prince could give an angel additional abilities without the angel's consent, but the angel's Archangel could strip away said abilities. Elizabeth Bartley e-bartley@pobox.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 14:01:37 -0400 From: Charybdis GreyDragon Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) >> Knowingly speaking a falsehood is lying. Unknowingly speaking a falsehood >> is being mistaken. Seraphim are allowed to be mistaken, but they cannot >> lie. If I've managed to totally convince John Q. Seraph that I'm a Cherub, >> and he believes it, then he doesn't get dissonance for calling me a >> Cherub. OTOH, if he knows that I'm a Habbalite, he cannot call me a Cherub >> without gaining dissonance. And I'd guess that if John Q Seraph really thought you were a Cherub, mistakenly told others that you were a Cherub, and then later learned that you were in fact a Habbalite, he'd probably have to tell everyone he inadvertently misinformed that you that he was wrong. ******************************************************* Peace, Charybdis GreyDragon charybdis@krilion.cnchost.com http://www.krilion.cnchost.com **"If you talk to God, it's called prayer. ** ** If God talks to you, it's called schizophrenia." ** ** --Fox Mulder, The X Files ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 13:22:42 -0500 From: Uncle Wolf Subject: Re: IN> Playing IN for laughs... Graveyard Greg wrote: > > ---Dataweaver wrote: > > > > > Maxwell's Demon... (sorry; just finished a Chemistry final). > > > > Actually, that could be quite fun; the Demon of Bad Luck. A > Balseraph of > > Kronos, no doubt; or perhaps Kobal? > > > > OTOH, does anyone have any suggestions for the Other Side? Thus > far, all > > of the suggestions have been demons... > > Sure, I got plenty of sugestions fer angels.... > > The Angel of Satire....the Angel of Fast Food(!)....the Angel of > Satori....the Angel of Good Health...the Angel of Snappy > Comebacks...the list goes on, by the way.... Like I said in another post, the Angel of Filking and the Angel of Karaoke. Oooh, brain flash...the Angel of Godzilla Movies! [I volunteer! Me! Me!] tom timberlake, wannabe-Angel of Godzilla ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 09:23:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Knop Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN- Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat > Well I dont know about all of you, but I use mapboards so I can draw funny > pictures and then get my fingers blue. I call that GM's disease... although, with the prevalence of whiteboards, I sometimes get that during group meetings at work as well. - -Rob === Rob Knop === rknop@crl.com ==== http://www.wco.com/~rknop === Amiga PGP information at http://www.wco.com/~rknop/amiga_pgp Visit the Dramatic Exchange at http://www.dramex.org/ ================================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 14:21:35 -0400 From: "Mark McKenzie" Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat York H. Dobyns wrote: > - -snip- > > Well, that last bit could be fun, but...IN has never struck me as a game > that adapts well to LARP. LARP games that are adapted from "something else" do not, in general, work out without lots of monkeying. Having written more than one LARP system from the ground up, I can tell you first hand that it is *fraught* with problems. > I can see where heroic fantasy with > more-or-less human characters can work, either archaic or modern day: > fake swords, paintball guns, little packets of chalk or whatever to > throw for "spells." That depends on how far you want to go into "phyical representation", a matter of taste similar to the cats/dogs, Mac/PC, Bab5/Trek questions that seem to constitute about 75% of Usenet traffic. However, it is *possible* to simulate almost anything you choose, as long as the rules are consistent and agreed upon by all participants. Some (maybe "many") effects end up being impractical or downright stupid (of what utility is "Telepathy" if the game mechanic is exactly identical to normal conversation); however, it can be done. The difficult bit is retrofitting an established game and environment > But IN? What do you do when somebody goes celestial > to walk through a wall? Casts *any* variety of the Song of Motion? Well, you actually don't "cast" Songs. They're not spells, they're...well, songs. In theory, a large portion of any IN LARP would seem to require players/PCs to actually sing. > Switches to an animal Vessel -- especially a small one that fits a > crawlspace too narrow for a human? What about a Kyrio being in three or more > places at once? Or Shedim switching bodies? Or assumes Celestial form, etc. This is what I was talking about above. It *can* be done - see Usenet rec.games.frp.live-action for much, much more on LARP and its various joys and terrors, as well as the occasional religious wars between design philosophies. - -- Mark McKenzie or someone like him markadv@kinekom.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 15:14:08 EDT From: MarkDEddy Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment In a message dated 5/4/98 6:34:42 AM, earlw@mc.com writes: >Simon Hailes wrote: >> Lovecraft was not a perpetual Goth, and don't let me hear you say >> that again, he was one of the greatest horror writers of the 20th >> Century and has influenced the likes of Robert Bloch (Psycho) >> Stephen King and Ramsey Campbell. > >Live E. E. "Doc" Smith, Lovecraft founded a genre. (Space opera, >in Smith's case.) Like Smith, his creativity lay in founding the >genre, not in his literary abilities. Both wrote atrocious prose. >Both are good for a giggle, if you're in the right mood. > >> Also, there are some who would say that what he wrote about was >> not completely fancy either, his dad was a member of a mystical >> Freemason lodge, and owned many esoteric books of lore.... > >"There are some who would say" just about anything. > >Loecraft was pretty public about being a skeptic and materialist. >You can, of course, suppose that this was cover for a more >secret mystical position, but then that line of "reasoning" >becomes impervious to any evidence whatever. > >Earl Of course, the In Nomine question is, "Was Lovecraft's father secretly a Sorcerer? If so, did Lovecraft *accidentally* write Truth? How would that affect a campaign?" IMC, the answers are yes, yes, and ask Alisteir Crowly, he's around here somewhere... Mark(grinning oddly) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 15:24:45 -0400 From: eswhanu@juno.com Subject: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat Hey, I ran a 46 person In Nomine LARP at a con, and it worked great. The lone Kyriotate was a blast (actually, two people playing the same character, talking to each other once in a while to exchange notes about what 'he' saw, and to account essence.) It's called using your imagination... a wonderful thing. :) You're thinking of live weapon combat, where people strike each other with prop weapons. We don't use that. Someone wants to go celestial to go through a wall, the pull out their 'celestial' card, hold it up, spend the essence, and describe walking though the wall. Simple enough. Trust me, it works... Brian Ward On Mon, 4 May 1998 12:56:03 -0400 (EDT) "York H. Dobyns" writes: >eswhanu@juno.com wrote: > >>On Sat, 02 May 1998 18:42:51 -0400 Ron Carnegie > >>writes: >[...] >>>Not only do I disagree with this statememnt, but I disagree that >what >>>is >>>happening on the map board IS roleplay rather than wargame. I do >>>sometimes>act out manuevers in full scale. > >Now that we've had one annoyingly didactic statement, I'll provide >an appropriate counter: Roleplaying games are wargames where the >pieces >also have personalities. > >[...] >>That is why I prefer to run In Nomine as Live Action as opposed to >>tabletop. You get to move the players around, and people can >appreciate >>such things as cover and distance (OK, you hide behind that pillar, >and >>tell me how much you stick out). >> >> That, and the Lilim that dress the part... :) > >Well, that last bit could be fun, but...IN has never struck me as a >game >that adapts well to LARP. I can see where heroic fantasy with >more-or-less human characters can work, either archaic or modern day: >fake swords, paintball guns, little packets of chalk or whatever to >throw for "spells." But IN? What do you do when somebody goes >celestial >to walk through a wall? Casts *any* variety of the Song of Motion? >Switches to an animal Vessel -- especially a small one that fits a >crawlspace too narrow for a human? What about a Kyrio being in three >or more >places at once? Or Shedim switching bodies? What do you do with the >more >gung-ho varieties of information-gathering Resonance --- time stops >while >the player being scanned goes and whispers in the resonator's ear? The >only thing making it more feasible than LARP Champions is that >celestials >run out of essence a lot faster than superheroes run out of endurance. > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 15:30:37 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment Here's an alternative to the idea of Lovecraft ickies being very far, very bad Ethereals -- Suppose the IN archangels and demon princes, and Lucifer himself, are concerned almost wholly with Earth. I believe it even says so in canon somewhere. The Cthulhu gang could be another set of fallen celestials from off-planet. This is very nearly what Lovecraft says they are, anyway. Cthulhu would then be the equivalent of a Demon Prince, subordinate to Nyarlathotep and the "daemon sultan Azathoth," who appear to form a dyarchy of brains and muscle respectively among the Mythos crowd. Uriel could be very well used, defending against them. And, of course, the terrestrial fiends wouldn't like these guys muscling in on their turf. (Join forces? *snicker* Sure. It might even be amusing while the pretense lasts.) Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 16:00:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Emily Dresner Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment > Of course, the In Nomine question is, "Was Lovecraft's father secretly a > Sorcerer? If so, did Lovecraft *accidentally* write Truth? How would that > affect a campaign?" > > IMC, the answers are yes, yes, and ask Alisteir Crowly, he's around here > somewhere... Aleister Crowley - - Em ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 May 1998 22:06:04 +0200 (DFT) From: Anders Gabrielsson Subject: IN> IN: LARP I think one of the biggest problems would be disturbances to the Symphony. A lot of problems can be solved with handsigns, as long as you've got some imagination. (For example, the "Using Obfuscate sign" from Vampire (crossing your arms over your chest) could mean "I'm in Celestial Form" or something.) But how do you model something that is not seen, but sensed, through walls, possibly hundreds of yards away? I guess you could have GM's running around telling everyone that "There's been a disturbance over there!" pointing towards the next room, but that would be quite detrimental to the mood, I think. :) Anders Gabrielsson anders@stp.ling.uu.se The contents of this message belong to me and nobody else. So there! "I kick arse for the Lord!" - Father McGruder ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 16:03:42 -0400 From: Jesse Subject: Re: IN> Uriel's next assignment >Of course, the In Nomine question is, "Was Lovecraft's father secretly a >Sorcerer? If so, did Lovecraft *accidentally* write Truth? How would that >affect a campaign?" > > IMC, the answers are yes, yes, and ask Alisteir Crowly, he's around here >somewhere... Alisteir Crowly dated Sophia Green who later married Lovecraft. Chances are Crowly knew Lovecraft. Some people belive that it was from Crowly that Lovecraft got the idea for the Necronamicon, which might be a real book that Crowly knew. - -Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 16:14:33 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> IN: LARP Anders Gabrielsson wrote: > But how do you model something that is not seen, but sensed, > through walls, possibly hundreds of yards away? Hnadbells come to mind. Or beepers. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 14:50:00 -0400 From: Nana Yaw Ofori Subject: Re: IN> Playing IN for laughs... At 2:51 PM -0400 5/3/98, Brandon Quina wrote: >> Or, for all you 2nd edition AD&D fans out there: >> >> The Tana'ri of Listservs! > >Tanar`ri, actually ;) You were close, and its the thought that >counts, right?? ::smiles:: > And actually, Daemons became Yugoloths, not Tanar'ri. Demons became Tanar'ri. \|=) = http://members.tripod.com/~maltesh ============== nofori@pop3.utoled.edu === Nana-Yaw "The Fish" Ofori, Freelance Soldier of Heck, presenty serving Trudy, Impudite Captain of Gluttony, the Demon of Popcorn ===== ><{{"> ============ "Life's a Fish, then you Fry." ======= <"}}>< ====== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 16:27:32 -0400 From: "Mark McKenzie" Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN- IN Mapboard Combat eswhanu@juno.com wrote: > - -snip- > You're thinking of live weapon combat, where people strike each > other with prop weapons. I suspect that you're correct, although the continuum between LC/boffer and IL/imagination is not as clear-cut as it might initially seem. There are as many 'middle grounds' as there are LARP troupes. When I was involved in LARP, some events (typically convention events) had little in the way of "physical representation"; other games using the exact same ruleset featured costuming, props, sets, special effects and "real world challenges", although we avoided actual physical combat. > We don't use that. Someone wants to go > celestial to go through a wall, the pull out their 'celestial' card, hold > it up, spend the essence, and describe walking though the wall. Simple > enough. Trust me, it works... > For the uninitiated, the usual alternative to prop weapons is "card-based" combat of some variety. For instance, if your PC owns a "gun", you have a card (or other "counter") representing it. In some systems, this card contains the rules for "using" the gun/spell/song/tactical nuke/thingie, meaning you only have to know how "your stuff" functions, not several hundred pages of rules on things you might (or might not) someday run into. - -- Mark McKenzie Senior Web Developer Managed Services Division * Kinekom, a CSS company 1006 Longley Place LaGrange, GA 30240 USA - ----- WWW: http://www.kinekom.com * E-mail: markadv@kinekom.com ICQ 7946364 Phone: 706.884.4400 Ext. 303 * 800.762.0020 * FAX 706.883.6373 - ----- Macintosh Specialist * Imaging Specialist HTML Writer's Guildmember * Site Builder Network * WIP Member ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #750 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.