From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Thu May 7 10:04:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27870 for ; Thu, 7 May 1998 10:04:16 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id JAA20749 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Thu, 7 May 1998 09:59:53 -0500 Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 09:59:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199805071459.JAA20749@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #761 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Thursday, May 7 1998 Volume 01 : Number 761 In this digest: Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... IN> Furfur's attunements Re: IN> Two NPCS for your perusal IN> Gorethiel, Demon of BFGs Re: IN>Demon Prince Audition Re: IN> Supergirl: Kara Ofanim of Gabriel Re: IN> Writing Canon Re: IN> Furfur's attunements Re: IN> Lying (was Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Re: IN> djinn and healing Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... Re: IN> djinn and healing Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... Re: IN> Lying (was Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) Re: IN> Jordi's big move Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... Re: IN> Jordi's big move Re: IN> A Question IN> Djinn - hurting their attunements IN> Drat! But thank you.... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 23:15:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... On Wed, 6 May 1998, Anders Gabrielsson wrote: > As I've mentioned earlier, I've played a demon once, and it scared me. > Really. *shudders* To each his own. My players like ruining NPCs lives and spreading evil. They're not evil people, but it's just roleplaying; it's not like they're really ruining REAL people's lives. > But then, a Habbalite of Malphas isn't the nicest demon to play, I guess. > :) I dunno...such a 'demon' redeemed in my game...:) Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! And finally, a special message to \|/ ____ \|/ anyone who thinks I give a damn... ~@-/ oO \-@~ /_( \__/ )_\ \__U_/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 23:22:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Pee Kitty Subject: IN> Furfur's attunements On Wed, 6 May 1998, Jesse wrote: > Try a Habbalite of Furfur. They are scary little power-mongers. Okay, I'd like to bring up the well-known fact that Habbalah of Furfur are insanely overpowered. And Balseraphs of Furfur make no sense (a bonus to tell the TRUTH? ...the hell?). I'd like to share with the list my changes to these two band attunements, and see if y'all like 'em. BALSERAPHS Furfur's Balseraphs can add their Celestial Forces to their resonance when telling a lie that will really piss off the victim. HABBALAH Habbalah of Hardcore can add their Celestial Forces to the check digit of any resonance roll, except one to inspire Love. However, if the subject resists, the Habbalah do not have the option of taking dissonance - they MUST live out the emotion. Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! And finally, a special message to \|/ ____ \|/ anyone who thinks I give a damn... ~@-/ oO \-@~ /_( \__/ )_\ \__U_/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 23:29:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Pee Kitty Subject: Re: IN> Two NPCS for your perusal On Wed, 6 May 1998, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > At 12:33 AM -0400 5/6/98, eswhanu@juno.com wrote: > >>(1) No one can have skills above 6, except Superiors. Just as no > >>non-Superiors can have attributes above 12. If your group has a house > >>rule>that makes it legal, cool, but I wanted to let you know it's > >>*definitely*>non-canon. > > > >OK, these are all the celestials I found that break with canon then, out > >of the books: > > > >- Furfur (Pre Demon Prince, NM) 14 Strength, Will 13 > > Everyone in Heaven & Hell who went over 12 has errata. For some > reason, I have not noticed Furfur before this. Probably because > my Night Music book is fragile back there. I will do errata there > now. ... Ah, I don't need to, there already *is* errata there. Your humble (potential) servant bows before you, m'lady. When I noticed the foul error, I was quick to alert Hunter. (You never answered me about the Kobalite rite, either...:) Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! And finally, a special message to \|/ ____ \|/ anyone who thinks I give a damn... ~@-/ oO \-@~ /_( \__/ )_\ \__U_/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 04:31:56 +0100 (BST) From: Steve Jessop Subject: IN> Gorethiel, Demon of BFGs Apologies for the delay to those who requested this guy last week. Oh, and a canon nitpick: he is a Calabite of Vapula, and hence officially doesn't exist. If that bothers you, make him a Habbalah or something, and rewire his personality. - --------- Gorethiel, the Demon of Big F**king Guns. Several centuries ago, Vapula was briefly interested in the idea of creating some less unstable Calabim, in the hope of harnessing their destructive tendencies. Despite the inclusion of Forces from servitors of Novalis, the experiment was a failure. The only subject of any great note was 'No. 0054', or Gorethiel. Gorethiel showed a certain amount of promise: he quickly grasped the basics of laboratory procedure, and within months was able to assist experiments without always destroying anything. Well, anything valuable. Okay, anthing *essential*. His tastes still lay in the traditional direction of his Band: he wanted to Blow Stuff Up. However, he had sufficient control that his entropy field was not a major problem. Which is not to say he didn't resent having to hold back, but more of that later. Gorethiel became interested in ways of applying maximum force with maximum efficiency. After a few more decades, he reached the point where he no longer just Blew Stuff Up. He Blew Up the right Stuff, he Blew it Up fast, and he Blew it Up at great range. With Vapula's support, he petitioned Lucifer for the word of Heavy Ordinance. He received the word of Big F**king Guns, which was good enough for him. Gorethiel has been active ever since. In addition to his obvious work in collaboration with Nybbas (supplying props and special effects for 'Men in Black'), he has been responsible for many innovative developments in machine guns, bazookas, mortars, the 'Iraqi Supergun' and, most recently, the 'Metal Storm' automatic weapon. However, he is not entirely happy. Ever since the early days, Gorethiel's main passion has been for the whine of capacitors, the crackle of ionising energy, and the 'BOOM!' of a ball of plasma reducing its target to vapour. The Powers That Be, and most directly Vapula, have always refused him permission to introduce human scientists to his 'toys'. He suspects that Saminga would not be so squeamish, but he knows Vapula would never approve a transfer. So, Gorethiel has taken his plans for the prototype Spiritualizer Mk II, and gone renegade. Unfortunateley for the players, he has gone rengade in their direction... Personality Gorethiel has a boundless enthusiasm for destruction. He constantly crushes things in his hands, picks the petals off flowers, bounces his servants' heads off the walls, anything that makes a satisfying crunching noise. This applies to his conversation too: he is not stupid, and will demolish any argument put to him, regardless of whether he thinks it has any merit. He doesn't use his resonance as often as one might expect: once he gets that close, he would far rather get physical. Gorethiel's aims are currently to complete the Spiritualizer II, and either get Saminga's patronage, establish himself as an independent power if possible or, as a last resort, go to Furfur. He considers Furfur to be a bit beneath his dignity, however, especially considering that barely five minutes ago they were roughly equal in power. Plot Seed - Gorethiel hits Oxford [or any other University town...] Gorethiel wants to give Saminga something pretty impressive as a sweetner when he asks to be admitted into his service. The Spiritualizer II will be a unique weapon, affecting the body and soul of its targets equally [In game terms, all damage done is split equally between Body and Soul hits. Yes this does affect Celestials in vessels, and yes it can strip Forces]. Unfortunately, the SII doesn't work. Yet. It lacks only two things: firstly the Celestial power source, and secondly the means to deliver this through a Corporeal medium. Some would say that in fact the gun is currently no more than a half-baked pipe dream. Gorethiel would chuckle, and throw them through a wall... Gorethiel arrives in town, along with his entourage. His objectives are: 1) The work of a scientist, Professor Arthur Stanton, working in the High Energy Physics Department. Stanton is into new laser techniques, and it just so happens that he has developed a new high-power, light-weight system. It is still nothing like powerful enough for use alone as a weapon, but Stanton has been approached by the military, who want an ultra-long range, smoke penetrating targeting system. Linus, a Balseraph in Gorethiel's service, has been assigned to 'persuade' Stanton to sell the goods. He has drawn up a contract: all he needs to do is get Stanton alone long enough for him to sign it and hand over the blueprints. Linus will then kill him, to ensure the rights are kept exclusive. Meanwhile, Laurence-Michael Industries (a front company for a Soldier organisation) have independently got wind of the lasers, and are also interested. Depending on the player group, this may or may not become known. Stanton is an experimental physicist. He hasn't a clue how his inventions might be applied, but will witter on about targeting, since he liked the idea. He also loves debating the ethics of science, and will talk for hours on the Manhatten Project, anthrax, and the invention of the crossbow. His opinion is that scientists are *not* responsible for the uses of their inventions, which might rub angels the wrong way. He is, however, harmless. 2) 'A Treatise on the Music of the Divine Spheres, with Practical Applications': an anonymous 17th century manuscript in the Bodleian library. This is a book about the Symphony, including some pretty deep stuff (GM discretion). Gorethiel is interested in the bit about converting between the Realms: he reckons he can use this information to build the SII. He is right. He will send a Soldier of Hell, Rob Matthews, an ex-undergraduate at Oxford, to retrieve the book. Note: The Bod is not a lending library, and stealing books isn't exactly easy, especially when there is a Malakite of Yves working there. Complications: a) There is a Sorcerer who has already replaced the book with a fake. When Gorethiel finds out, he will go ballistic. Research will reveal that Justin Farquar, of All Souls college, was the only person to use the book in living memory. Berek (a failed 'stable' Calabite, who is utterly unhinged, and acts like Gorethiel without the intelligence) will be dispatched to deal with him, and the book (noisily) recovered. b) The book is a load of old rubbish. Gorethiel is, basically, stuffed, and will have to present Saminga with some other 'present'. A massacre in the town centre will be the first thing he thinks of, and probably the most likely to work. Introducing the PCs 1) Berek greases the Sorcerer, Farquar. The PCs hear it or are told to investigate. Berek can be ID'd by the two students who were in a tutorial at the time of the killing, and traced either to Linus or Gorethiel. 2) (Angels only) Stanton is annoying L-M Industries by wavering over contractual details. They ask the PCs to find out why, and the PCs find Linus. 3) Berek, being a bit unhinged, randomly Blows Something Up. The resulting disturbance is heard all over town, and brings PCs (and others) running. [I used this one: they loved the chance to hunt, capture, torture, question and kill a small baddie]. 4) (Demons only) The Azzies have tracked Gorethiel down, but need someone with knowledge of the city to actually find him. Plot Summary Gorethiel turns up and Does Bad Things. The PCs find him. He is kicked. Note, however, that he is insanely hard, so they might want to call in L-M Industries or the Azzies to do the actual fighting. Details of Gorethiel's Hideout are left to inventive GMs. Gorethiel: the Stats. Special Rites: Destroy a Celestial (or its vessel) with a BFG. Use a BFG in an amusing and highly destructive fashion. Gorethiel's attunement: Gorethiel can make BFGs out of practically anything. With a Will roll, and minimal materials (a toaster and a screwdriver), Gorethiel can whip up a BFG in d6 minutes. Its power is the CD of the roll, and it takes 1 Essence to fire. However, if the weapon is over-powered (natural check die of 6, on *any* firing roll), it explodes, utterly destroying it and dealing 6+Power damage to its operator. If Gorethiel is not the operator, he gains one Essence from his rite... CorF 5 EthF 4 CelF 6 Str 12 Int 6 Will 12 Agi 8 Pre 10 Per 12 Body 132 Mind 24 Soul 72 Note: Ignoring his Discord, Gorethiel has 72 character points: 60 for his forces, plus 12 because I felt like it. Damaged Sense (Hearing)/5 [too many explosions...] Vessel/6 (Grizzled combat veteran, crew cut, wearing kakhis, toting several large guns.) Role/6, Status/1 (Nutter with guns - see Taxi Driver) Ranged Weapons (BFGs)/6 Fighting/6 Dodge/4 Knowledge (Guns)/6 Engineering (Guns)/3 Celestial Song of Light/4 Song of Thunder/6 NC: Claws/6 Talisman (Spiritualizer I): +5 Ranged Weapons (BFG) skill. The Spiritualizer I, with which Gorethiel arms his servants (theirs are not talismans) is a Power 10 weapon with a range of 100 yds, accuracy 0. It costs 1 essence to fire, and has no storage ability. It does only Body damage, despite the name. Summary of Gorethiel: he gets auto hits with his gun, at +9 CD. That means 19+d6 damage per hit. He's not bad in celestial combat either, espicially with those claws. GMs who want to combat-max him can fine-tune quite a bit here and there: Pre 12 and Art of Combat (from Baal) for a start. Linus, Balseraph of BFGs Berek, Calabite of BFGs Assorted Soldiers (according to taste) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 May 1998 20:37:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Knop Subject: Re: IN>Demon Prince Audition > I hereby change my vote and second the nomination for Rowan Atkinson. He > can be a jaded, cynical jerk and still carry an undertone of irrepresible > humor better than anyone else. I can't think of anyone better to play a > character who's always funny, yet sick to death of being so. I have to admit, when I think of Kobal, I see Jack Nicholson. There's a man who, when he smiles, you think, "Run." - -Rob ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 00:38:32 -0400 From: Frank Lazar Subject: Re: IN> Supergirl: Kara Ofanim of Gabriel At 10:53 AM -0700 05/06/1998, Graveyard Greg wrote: >> > >:) I like....except I still wonder how Supergirl can BE an angel, but >this is not the place for such a discussion... > >Still, I would love to know--considering I knew her origin during the >Byrne-Superman era... > It's not that far off base. The explanation, which Linda isn't totally sure of, is that she's part of a special Choir that numbers only three members at a time.. The Earth-Bound Angels, that in turn represent Light, Life, and Fire. Earth Bound Angels are created when one mortal selflessly sacrifices oneself on behalf of another who had no redeeming values whatsoever. And this Linda Danvers was one nasty piece of work. Perhaps that's the number of "full-blooded" surviving Grigori on Earth at this time.... food for thought. The only things that I would have changed in this description was 1. Wrote her up as something a bit more powerful than a starting character... she's simply not "super" enough as Angel Average. 2. I would have left the "Supergirl" out of the description.... let'em figure it out. The Superior is right on the money though, the way she handled that demon when her wings first manifested would have indeed been worthy of PsychoPyroBabe. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- | _ | | We are dreamers, shapers, singers and makers. /_\ | | We study the mysteries of laser and circuit, // \\ | | Crystal and scanner, holographic demons, \\ //___\\ | | And invocations of equations. \\ // \\ | | \\__// \\ | | These are the tools we employ. And we know... many things. \\ | | \\ | | | Frank Lazar http://www.interactive.net/~fmlazar | \\ | - ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 01:34:20 -0400 From: eswhanu@juno.com Subject: Re: IN> Writing Canon PLEASE do not send attachments to the list. 1) we don't all know each other, and don't feel comfortable downloading from you 2) some of us recieve our list mail on non-Web based mail (i.e. Juno), and all we get is the mess of characters you see at the end of this message Best thing to do is if you have something you want people to see, post it to a web page, and send us the URL. This way, we can look at it at our leisure. Thanks. Brian Ward On Wed, 6 May 1998 21:43:42 -0400 ixDragons writes: > >------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7938.DB311B80 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > >Uh.... hmmm.... what about art? >I have something that I am working on... >It isn't finished, but I'll email it to you and you tell me if I have >= >talent >deal? > >P.S. >I am wearing anti Geas undies :=DE >------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7938.DB311B80 >Content-Type: application/ms-tnef >Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 > >eJ8+IiIBAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy >b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAyAEAAAEAAAAQAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL >AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAATwAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGluX25vbWluZS1sQGxp >c3RzLmlvLmNvbQBTTVRQAGluX25vbWluZS1sQGxpc3RzLmlvLmNvbQAAHgACMAEAAAAFAAAAU01U >UAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABkAAABpbl9ub21pbmUtbEBsaXN0cy5pby5jb20AAAAAAwAVDAEAAAADAP4P >BgAAAB4AATABAAAAGwAAACdpbl9ub21pbmUtbEBsaXN0cy5pby5jb20nAAACAQswAQAAAB4AAABT >TVRQOklOX05PTUlORS1MQExJU1RTLklPLkNPTQAAAAMAADkAAAAACwBAOgEAAAAeAPZfAQAAABkA >AABpbl9ub21pbmUtbEBsaXN0cy5pby5jb20AAAAAAgH3XwEAAABPAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZnW4A >3QEPVAIAAAAAaW5fbm9taW5lLWxAbGlzdHMuaW8uY29tAFNNVFAAaW5fbm9taW5lLWxAbGlzdHMu >aW8uY29tAAADAP1fAQAAAAMA/18AAAAAAgH2DwEAAAAEAAAAAAAAAtljAQSAAQAWAAAAUkU6IElO >PiBXcml0aW5nIENhbm9uANkGAQWAAwAOAAAAzgcFAAYAFQArACoAAwBNAQEggAMADgAAAM4HBQAG >ABUAJwAYAAMANwEBCYABACEAAABCNEE0NjhCMTI5RTVEMTExOTgzNTQ0NDU1MzU0MDAwMADDBgED >kAYAXAQAACEAAAALAAIAAQAAAAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAAAAAAAwA2AAAA >AABAADkAAJcYkVl5vQEeAHAAAQAAABYAAABSRTogSU4+IFdyaXRpbmcgQ2Fub24AAAACAXEAAQAA >ABYAAAABvXlZkRCxaKS65SkR0Zg1REVTVAAAAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAA >GQAAAGl4ZHJhZ29uc0BtaW5kc3ByaW5nLmNvbQAAAAADAAYQoliYhgMABxCMAAAAHgAIEAEAAABl >AAAAVUhITU1NV0hBVEFCT1VUQVJUP0lIQVZFU09NRVRISU5HVEhBVElBTVdPUktJTkdPTklUSVNO >VEZJTklTSEVELEJVVElMTEVNQUlMSVRUT1lPVUFORFlPVVRFTExNRUlGSUhBVgAAAAACAQkQAQAA >ADkBAAA1AQAAkgEAAExaRnXc1d4YAwAKAHJjcGcxMjUWMgD4C2BuDhAwMzOdAfcgAqQD4wIAY2gK >wGBzZXQwIAcTAoB9swqACMggOwlvDjA1AoDZCoF1YwBQCwNjAEELtRAgVWguFeEgaG37FkAV43cR >AAVAAaAIYBbxLQAgPwqiCoBJFiBhdlhlIHMDcBFAaAuAZ84gGMAW4RgQYW0WsAWwfmsY4gIgFeEX >tQVABABuWicFQGYLgAQAaAmALEQgYhdBSSdsAyBlCwDAAxFpBUB0byB5kwhgFwBuZB1jdGUcgbsH >gBsQZhlhGDMBkGwJ8D50F7QBAAdAF6UXtFAuhlMahQr0bGkzNhFgHxl0ICAFEBjxAHB0aSB2RyAg >BCB1HcAIkAQgOtxcJwEAFPEBQHADYB4wFmMfpRHxACYQAAAAAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAAMAgBD/ >////QAAHMECwzfZYeb0BQAAIMECwzfZYeb0BCwAAgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAA4UAAAAA >AAADAAKACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAAQhQAAAAAAAAMABYAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAA >AFKFAAC3DQAAHgAlgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAVIUAAAEAAAAEAAAAOC4wAAMAJoAIIAYA >AAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAAAAGFAAAAAAAACwAvgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAADoUAAAAAAAAD >ADCACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAARhQAAAAAAAAMAMoAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAAABiF >AAAAAAAAHgBBgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAANoUAAAEAAAABAAAAAAAAAB4AQoAIIAYAAAAA >AMAAAAAAAABGAAAAADeFAAABAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAeAEOACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAA4hQAA >AQAAAAEAAAAAAAAAHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAAADAA00/TcAALnI > >------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7938.DB311B80-- > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 09:39:36 +0100 From: Kevin Walsh Subject: Re: IN> Furfur's attunements On Wed, May 06, 1998 at 11:22:43PM -0400, Pee Kitty wrote: > > Try a Habbalite of Furfur. They are scary little power-mongers. > > Okay, I'd like to bring up the well-known fact that Habbalah of Furfur are > insanely overpowered. And Balseraphs of Furfur make no sense (a bonus to > tell the TRUTH? ...the hell?). I think it's hilarious, actually. Besides, Furfur's dissonance conditions should be remembered, as they should in the case of Habbalah. Besides, it's a well known fact that Balseraphs don't lie. In any event, the thing to remember about the Habbalah of Hardcore attunement is the dissonance condition of Servitors of Hardcore. If they can react violently to a situation, they must do so (or something very similar). Habbalah of Hardcore, unless they failed their resonance roll, can _always_ make sure that the outcome to a situation is violent. This is, to say the least, quite dangerous for the Habbalite concerned, who almost certainly is never going to be able to build up political power of any description. The dissonance binds them more tightly to match the power of their attunement. It'd be interesting to play one sometime, for a session or so, but I can't imagine one surviving to be a long-term character. (I bet most of them invest in Corporeal Form.) Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. - -- "In the period of dictatorship, surrounded on all sides by enemies, we sometimes manifested unnecessary leniency and unnecessary softheartedness." N.V. Krylenko. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 19:06:24 +1000 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: Re: IN> Lying (was Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) > >And another digression on lies: as noted above, Celestial tongue does > >not allow the speaker to lie. Doesn't that make the Seraph resonance > >fairly pointless in Heaven? Or are all Seraphs in their natural home > >looking for CDs of 6, so they can detect speakers who are honestly > >deluded? > > Well, Kyriotate Resonance tends to be just as useless in Heaven. In a world without real physical distances or physical bodies, the Ofanim resonance is also useless (although you could use the Area Knowledge bonus). Down in Hell, meantime, only the Shedim loses their resonance power-ups. This is one reason why (like they say in Heaven & Hell) there are more possibilties for fun playing in Hell than Heaven... - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia They may walk hand in hand Like lovers through the market square Selecting leathergoods, pretending that they just don't care They say all the boys are monsters, all the girls are whores SQUIRREL NUT ZIPPERS, "Plenty More" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 10:29:56 +0100 From: Kevin Walsh Subject: Re: IN> djinn and healing On Wed, May 06, 1998 at 01:23:19PM -0500, Titus 3 11 wrote: > > > IN the IPG, itsays that a Djinn whohas harmed the object of his attunement > > > can remove the dissonace by undoing the hardm he has done. (Song of > > > healing) My question therefore is, would the corp song of healing work on > > > an inanimate object? > > > > No reason why not, but why does the Djinn bother harming an inanimate > > object? > Because they are demons, and enjoy destruction of all types. You appear to be implying that all demons enjoy destruction of all types. This suggests a rather fundamental misreading of what demons are. Yes, Calabim are interested in destruction, but other demons have different goals. Balseraphs are interested in Truth, Shedim are interested in questions of ethics, and so forth. Also, many Demonic Words have no more destructive focus than similar Angelic Words. Some of us are concerned with questions of Truth and Accuracy; others with discovering new knowledge and fostering a spirit of inquiry; still others concern themselves with efficient and consistent administration, and others devote their existence to the pleasure of others. Is this destructive? > Your lack of understanding of Diabolic goals should perhaps be brough to > the attention of the Game. In the specific example we were discussing, the Djinn would be incurring dissonance by destruction. The Game does not encourage dissonant behaviour to the best of my knowledge. If you have evidence that it does, may I suggest that it be brought to the attention of the Media, so that such abuses can be brought to the notice of all. Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. - -- "In the period of dictatorship, surrounded on all sides by enemies, we sometimes manifested unnecessary leniency and unnecessary softheartedness." N.V. Krylenko. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 10:47:36 +0100 From: Kevin Walsh Subject: Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... On Wed, May 06, 1998 at 10:21:18PM +0900, Simon Hailes wrote: > A) Bad Guys are now cool, look at Pulp Fiction and Reservoir Dogs, hell, Now? I always thought Starscream was the best Transformer. D) Demons are hip, while angels brood and > sternly watch and judge human beings on their own codes and ethics, demons > are out there having fun any which way, they keep up with the trends, and > indeed create new ones, they have all the good lines, and charm, What kind of generalisation is this? I'd rather be at a party with Servitors of Flowers than the Game, if I had to go to a party. Of course, Servitors of Factions are more entertaining than either, in my humble opinion of course. I don't think very many angels are broody, though I could be wrong. Mithredath doesn't brood most of the time because she's too busy doing things, and then staggering at the consequences. (I'm beginning to think she's resonating with the Word of the Domino Effect. She decides to wait around a museum when everyone else wants to leave, and a large chunk of New York gets blown up and becomes an Infernal Tether. She didn't do it, she just precipitated it.) and there > not afraid to tell it how it is. Not at all like Seraphim. I had a lot of fun last night accusing the NYPD of incompetence and how my arrest was a ridiculous and a farce. (It was too, there were lots of bodies we were responsible for, and they picked one we weren't to arrest us for.) Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. - -- "In the period of dictatorship, surrounded on all sides by enemies, we sometimes manifested unnecessary leniency and unnecessary softheartedness." N.V. Krylenko. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 06:59:38 -0500 (CDT) From: Titus 3 11 Subject: Re: IN> djinn and healing On Thu, 7 May 1998, Kevin Walsh wrote: > On Wed, May 06, 1998 at 01:23:19PM -0500, Titus 3 11 wrote: > > > > IN the IPG, itsays that a Djinn whohas harmed the object of his attunement > > > > can remove the dissonace by undoing the hardm he has done. (Song of > > > > healing) My question therefore is, would the corp song of healing work on > > > > an inanimate object? > > > > > > No reason why not, but why does the Djinn bother harming an inanimate > > > object? > > > Because they are demons, and enjoy destruction of all types. > > You appear to be implying that all demons enjoy destruction of all > types. This suggests a rather fundamental misreading of what demons are. > Yes, Calabim are interested in destruction, but other demons have > different goals. Balseraphs are interested in Truth, Shedim are > interested in questions of ethics, and so forth. Also, many Demonic > Words have no more destructive focus than similar Angelic Words. > Some of us are concerned with questions of Truth and Accuracy; others > with discovering new knowledge and fostering a spirit of inquiry; still > others concern themselves with efficient and consistent administration, > and others devote their existence to the pleasure of others. Is this > destructive? > > > Your lack of understanding of Diabolic goals should perhaps be brough to > > the attention of the Game. > > In the specific example we were discussing, the Djinn would be incurring > dissonance by destruction. The Game does not encourage dissonant > behaviour to the best of my knowledge. If you have evidence that it > does, may I suggest that it be brought to the attention of the Media, so > that such abuses can be brought to the notice of all. Despite the aquisacions of fellow listers suchas Graveyard Greg, I am still a member in good standing of my choir. The Malakim are well aware, of how sweet and clean a talented demon can make Hell and its servants appear, and you are defintly a talented demon sir, serving a mighty Princess indeed. And dn't worry about your fellows, dissonant or not; if the Game misses them, God will not; nor will his Virtues Enosh Malakite of Creation In service to Michael ( I swear) > > Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. > -- > "In the period of dictatorship, surrounded on all sides by enemies, we > sometimes manifested unnecessary leniency and unnecessary softheartedness." > N.V. Krylenko. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 07:01:29 -0500 (CDT) From: Titus 3 11 Subject: Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... Because - "Sin is in...Sin is in, and so we begin..." Enosh Malakite of Creation In service to Micheal (feeling all mucky and -angel- like...ugghh) On Wed, 6 May 1998, Matt 'Badger' Rossi III wrote: > Something that's been occuring to me lately: > > I like playing IN, and I think it's one of the more interesting > games out there..but I never, ever, EVER play anything infernal. > EVER. The idea of it makes me cringe...I've layed a Malakite > of Gabriel, an Elohite of Lawrence, a Seraph of Novalis, and > a Grigori Outcast who formerly served Typhonioi, the > Grigori Archangel in my game...but never anything on the > infernal side. The idea doesn't > even appeal to me. (Hell, my Malakite had a bitch of a time in > Austin...) > > I'm wondering, fo those of you that prefer the inferbnal side of > things, why? Mind you, this isn't a judgement thing...I'm seriously > interested in your answers. > > Badger > > Currently playing Ranger, the Angel of Backfire > Malakite servant of Gabriel > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 07:02:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Titus 3 11 Subject: Re: IN> Lying (was Re: IN> Seraphim and the TRUTH. (help!) On Wed, 6 May 1998, Graveyard Greg wrote: > > > > > > ---Titus 3 11 wrote: > > > > I am a Seraph. > > You Nit-pick too much. > > (Look! I didn't get any dissonance! I must be a Seraph!) > > Let it *go* people > > and others > > Enosh > > Hah! I know for a fact that you are a Malakite! Either that, or you're > a Balseraph...So of course you didn't get any dissonance. :) - -shush!_ you're going to blow my cover. > > Graveyard Greg > --who would rather be a nit-picker than a NOSE-picker! LOL! > enosh - --who understands the sad fate of those who are both :) > > _________________________________________________________ > DO YOU YAHOO!? > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 13:38:57 +0100 From: Kevin Walsh Subject: Re: IN> Jordi's big move On Wed, May 06, 1998 at 10:45:56PM -0400, Pee Kitty wrote: > Nope. IPG, p. 34, "Djinn acquire dissonance one of two ways: by harming > the object of their attunement or by becoming too attached. [...] Usually > this [(fighting)] is easy to avoid - the Djinn can simply retreat or stand > by and let his friends beat the [attuned] into a bloody pulp." I don't > have the main book with me or I'd quote from that instead. > I already acknowledged this point, and have never disputed it. > > The example I gave was an example of standing by and letting someone else > > do the whomping, if a bit dubious. However, saying "I want you to kill > > this guy" is not standing by, it is instigating direct harm to the > > object of attunement. > > In other words, it is not directly harming them; it is getting someone > ELSE to harm them for you. Not dissonant. > I just looked through the IPG and the main book, and found that the situation isn't made clear. The examples given could be interpreted as supporting either side of the argument. I believe that a previous list ruling was that instigation counted as causing harm (no, harm does not have to be direct), but I don't have the time to look through the list archives. Basically, I see a qualitative difference between standing by while an object of the attunement is destroyed, and instigating damage to the object of the attunement. One is inaction, another is action, and to me that is the crucial distinction. In practice, it doesn't restrict the Djinn to any great extent. The Djinn can point to the target and say "That's the Renegade.", but can't say "That's the Renegade. Kill him.". The fact that in practice, pointing out that someone is a Renegade may well result in that person getting killed is irrelevant as far as Dissonance is concerned; the Djinn isn't making the decision itself, so it doesn't have to accept responsibility. I'm not going to say any more on the subject, because I've made all the points that I reasonably can, and am frankly sick of the argument. Kevin Walsh, Balseraph of Nitpicking, Demon of Off-Topic Trivia. - -- "In the period of dictatorship, surrounded on all sides by enemies, we sometimes manifested unnecessary leniency and unnecessary softheartedness." N.V. Krylenko. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 15:12:57 +0200 (DFT) From: Anders Gabrielsson Subject: Re: IN> In the hands of Angels... On Wed, 6 May 1998, Pee Kitty wrote: > On Wed, 6 May 1998, Anders Gabrielsson wrote: > > > As I've mentioned earlier, I've played a demon once, and it scared me. > > Really. *shudders* > > To each his own. My players like ruining NPCs lives and spreading evil. > They're not evil people, but it's just roleplaying; it's not like they're > really ruining REAL people's lives. I guess it makes me realize just how evil and perverted my mind really is. :) Anders Gabrielsson anders@stp.ling.uu.se The contents of this message belong to me and nobody else. So there! "I kick arse for the Lord!" - Father McGruder ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 15:16:28 +0200 (DFT) From: Anders Gabrielsson Subject: Re: IN> Jordi's big move On Thu, 7 May 1998, Kevin Walsh wrote: > In practice, it doesn't restrict the Djinn to any great extent. The > Djinn can point to the target and say "That's the Renegade.", but can't > say "That's the Renegade. Kill him.". The fact that in practice, > pointing out that someone is a Renegade may well result in that person > getting killed is irrelevant as far as Dissonance is concerned; the > Djinn isn't making the decision itself, so it doesn't have to accept > responsibility. I'm not going to say any more on the subject, because > I've made all the points that I reasonably can, and am frankly sick of > the argument. Well, I happen to find the discussion interesting, so I'll continue anyway. :) Even if you tell someone else to kill the one you are attuned to, it's their choice whether they do it or not, so you're not causing the object direct harm, IMO. Anders Gabrielsson anders@stp.ling.uu.se The contents of this message belong to me and nobody else. So there! "I kick arse for the Lord!" - Father McGruder ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 09:37:35 -0400 From: Andrew Frades Subject: Re: IN> A Question Jesse wrote: > I was reading through the archives today and found this little note > at the end of all of the digests: > > The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. > All rights reserved. Its in the Majordomo thing. There are some prices to being on the list. My understanding is that they get the right to post anything off the list into the Archive and might use it later as a stepping stone for their ideas. I don't think this precludes you writing articles etc. using the ideas that came from your head. Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 10:11:56 -0400 From: Andrew Frades Subject: IN> Djinn - hurting their attunements IN p. 143, "... but he can't bring himself to cause it harm by his own hand." IN p. 144, "While attuned to something, the Djinn himself cannot cause it harm, either physical or emotional. If following his target's desires brings it to harm, and if the attuned person relieved the demon of responsibility, then the Djinn acquires no dissonance from the action." I don't know about the rest of you but I will not divorse a person who ordered an action from responsibility for that action. In other words, if a Djinn orders, asks, or gives a strong direct hint to hurt the object of his attunement then the demon will gain dissoance. This also means that the Djinn can not follow and be the pointer for a group of demons who intend to plaster the attunement as the demon knows what the others intend. This is IMC the finest line of all the fine lines that demons walk. Often Djinn will attune to a person and stalk them, waiting for their attunement to run out before they strike walking the fine line of staying close enough to attack when the attunement runs out and far enough away not to be noticed so as to casue emotional distress. Another tactic used by Djinn is to be very close to their attunements, talking to them and offering ther help. Once the attuned mentions what they want the demons turns it around with a quick, "I might be able to help, but no promises..." If the attuned agrees all bets are off. This makes Djinn nearly as subtle as Shedim and creates yet another reason for their rivalry. Shedim: "I take actions and the humans are corrupted because they think that it was their idea." Djinn: "When I corrupt humans, it was their idea." Shedim: "I connect with a humans darker side and push them toward their own destruction." Djinn: "I don't care. When I'm done I get to do the nasty work with my own hands." Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 10:44:45 -0400 From: Twila Oxley Price Subject: IN> Drat! But thank you.... Thanks to Pee Kitty and Elizabeth and everyone else who commented on my poor waifs. I *had* been using Night Music as a template, so that's why I screwed up. Sigh. But they are now fixed with acceptable Skill Levels, Forces, etc. and slightly improved descriptions. Caidel and Jereth are now going to huddle and explain to me exactly *what* they're doing which will get them into trouble... this time. Thanks again, Twila (who *ought* to be at least a vassal of nit-picking, since she's a copy editor in Real Life, not to mention an anal-retentive Virgo perfectionist... but who feels totally incompetent when it comes to IN...) ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #761 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.