====== OGRE Digest, December 30th (Last: December 27th) ======== ===== Suggested _OGRE_ units From: "Chris French" ===== Suggested _OGRE_ units From: Servitor@aol.com ===== Open Field Ogre From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com ===== An Ogre marketing concept: Ogre for Old Folks From: stephan beal ============================== From: "Chris French" Subject: Suggested _OGRE_ units > [The Fuzzy rule is in Ogre Scenario Book 1, > http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/scenariobooks/ and limits each side to no more > than one fourth of its force in identical units, which would seem to > prohibit taking any Ogres at all... -HJC] That's the problem with rules like that, esp. in a game like _OGRE_ where one piece can be an entire f'ing assault group. Thank you. > [Before you reinvent the Turtle, please go to > http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/ take a look at the upgunned Mark VI miniature > pics, select the ARTICLES link, read through the Variants and New Units > section then select bibliography and scroll down to Warren, Jim Gould Left > This In My Mailbox and see what horrors were unleashed by the first > version of the formula. -HJC] Ah, but you are missing one important piece of information: I have _OGRE Book_ 2nd ed., and have read the addendum to your "Back To The Drawing Board" article, which spells out what is and is not "possible". I kept that in mind while working on this. Also, realize that any military project has to have some sort of logic behind its creation (even if said logic is not going to work in "reality"). When coming up with my ideas, I asked myself, "Self, exactly what is this unit's job?". For example: GEV-PCs tend to get pounded like a narc at a biker rally in any terrain that is not tree- and/or stream-free. One stream can stop a "BubbleBlitz" dead in its tracks -- er, skirts. (When I play "Raid" or "Breakthrough", I only ever use the easternmost passage; the others are too track- and infantry-friendly.) What is needed is some way for the infantry to follow the trackslappers over the river (stream) and through the woods. Hmm -- why not remove a HVY's turret, fill the space with INF, give it a spitball gun for defense, and send it in behind the HVYs? (The original version of this idea was a Canadian tank, the Ram, which was converted to an infantry hauler sinply by removing the turret and main gun.) In congested terrain, the tracked PC is a better option than the GEV; in more open terrain, the GEV is better. The Mortar is best employed behind stream hexes; two Mobile Mortars can clobber two GEVs while the Bubbles are parked be- hind the stream, whereas a HWZ can only clobber one. The Mobile OGRE Batteries were based on the Emplaced OGRE Batteries from _OM_; note that the MB costs 1.5 armor units. (The 1AP gun on the MOMB is there to bring the points up to 107&2/3, just under 108.) These are functionally equivalent to WW2's Sherman Firefly (M4 with UK-built 17-lb.'er cannon -- ef- fective vs. Tiger tanks!) or Sherman 105s (M4 with DF-equipped 105mm howitzer -- effective against *KING TIGER* tanks! :) ) -- basically, some fool^H^H^H^Hperson decides to strap the big- gest f'ing gun he can get away with onto a given chassis. Finally -- and here's the important part -- I do not make any claims to these units being "official" or "canonical". That job resides with the game designers -- if they approve, fine; if not, shucky- darn and slop the chickens. If folks want to try them out -- well, the stats are there, so have a blast. :) > (But the Ogre hit 2x 1:2 attacks vs Inf in > that same time period, re-affirming my "the Ogre Always Rolls Higher" > theorem.) It affirms my "Hand The Offending Player A Dice Cup And Watch His Average Drop" Theory. :) CF ===== From: Servitor@aol.com Subject: Suggested _OGRE_ units > [Before you reinvent the Turtle, please go to > http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/ take a look at the upgunned Mark VI miniature > pics, select the ARTICLES link, read through the Variants and New Units > section then select bibliography and scroll down to Warren, Jim Gould Left > This In My Mailbox and see what horrors were unleashed by the first version > of the formula. Ahh, memories. I've still got the Space Gamer with that article. (Oh, God. Who let grandpa out of the retirement home?) HWI = "Heavy Weapon Infantry" Fuzzy Rule: Originally an article in Space Gamer (later, The Ogre Book) by Lawrence Duffield entitled "Ogres and the Fuzzy Wuzzy Fallacy" (which made it to the 2nd edition in an updated form). Basically, Lawrence was the first to point out (and exploit) the original game's "point" system was heavily biased towards massive formations of GEVs instead of a "balanced force" Although the next printing of Ogre fixed the problem, "Fuzzy" forces were still viable -though no longer the One True Way to win. Shooting at the Tower: A while back I proposed an optional rule for shooting at Ogre towers, but I have since decided that the "It's factored into the rules" is not only the best way to do it, but the most logical. The "Tread" points on all Ogres do not just represent the actual treads, but everything on the beast that isn't a weapon system. The Fencer may not have a tower, so it probably has more drones. "Alternate" basic Ogre terrain: Play on the "Necromancer" map! You will need the rules for "slopes" from the SJ Games website. Both can be accessed from the SJ Games' site or from my (badly in need of an update) site. Bridges become a LOT more important as GEVs can't "float" across a one hex wide canyon. Warning! The potential for Cruise Missile abuse on the Necromancer map cannot be understated! Best, John Hurtt (Servitor@aol.com) -Yes, I'm a Game Geek. How did you know? -Please visit my website at: http://hometown.aol.com/Servitor/Ogreindex/ogrindex.htm "Walk softly and carry a big stick" Personally, I prefer a taser. Lots more fun... ============================== From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com Subject: Open Field Ogre << When I was in college, the way we played was on a huge map (Air and Armor, IIRC). We each got "metroplexes" or something, and you could schedule production, whatever you wanted from inf-1 to Mark V. In such a scenario GEVs ruled the battlefield (it was a little more open than standard GEV terrain, but not much). We eventually made GEVs and LGEVs cost about 20% more than the other armor units, since their ability to reform and outflank, not to mention run away, totally ruled. >> Yep, and that is why Cavalry ruled the European Battlefield. You needed rules for Dragon's teeth and other Anti-Armor obstacles... Ad Astra! Stan Leghorn ===== [Free range Ogres are the tastiest, just ask any LGEV pilot. Speaking of LGEVs, my design for the Combine LGEV in GURPS OGRE terms is at: http://www.io.com/~hcobb/gev/gurpsogre/gremlin.xls.gz -HJC] ============================== From: stephan beal Subject: An Ogre marketing concept: Ogre for Old Folks Hi, fellas, i've spent much of this week playing out the Basic Scenario on my old Ogre Deluxe Edition set, mostly for a reason which never occured to me: the 1/2" pieces of the standard set are hard on some people's eyes. My brother complained that he couldn't read them without straining himself, and that it was very uncomfortable to have to bend down and squint at them all night. Suddenly the idea comes to me that in a number of years (hopefully many) my eyes will find it hard to read the 1/2" pieces as well. So... to counter that i would propose [to Pat] that SJG think about doing an Ogre for Old Folks set: use the standard maps/pieces, blown up to use 3/4"-1" pieces. i don't have a copy of the minis-based Deluxe Edition, so i can't say if pieces this size would work on those maps, but i think they would, increasing the play value of those maps. On the other hand, we could argue that anyone who needs to actually read the counters doesn't need to be playing Ogre... ----- stephan stephan@einsurance.de - http://www.einsurance.de i need a woman who can say, 'honey, can you please take a look at this stack trace while I order the pizza?' and really mean it. ============================== Send all submissions or mailing list changes or problems to ogre@sjgames.com Archives for this mailing list may be found at http://www.io.com/~hcobb/ General online support for the OGRE game is at http://www.sjgames.com/ogre Ogre, G.E.V., Shockwave and other products mentioned here are trademarks or registered trademarks of Steve Jackson Games. All rights are reserved by SJ Games. This material is used here in accordance with the SJ Games online policy at http://www.sjgames.com/general/online_policy.html