====== Ogre Digest, May 16th (Last: May 11th) ======== ===== Combat Drones From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com From: "Robin Rhodes-Crowell" From: "Grant A. Ladue" ===== Ogre Book -- 2nd Ed. From: "Eric T. or Maryann C. Holmes" ============================== From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com Subject: Combat Drones In a message dated 05/11/2002 10:09:13 PM Pacific Daylight Time, hcobb@hagbard.io.com writes: << [Wait until you see the drone rules. (No, not the LAD style immobile remote controlled drones, the flying drones.) (Even though I don't much care for the current drone rules. They should either move as normal units or be subject to Cruise Missile style interception.) -HJC] >> Do I detect the SPI syndrome here? Increasing units on the board reduces playability, which is what Ogre was all about... Ad Astra! Stan Leghorn ===== From: "Robin Rhodes-Crowell" Subject: Combat Drones > From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com > > I suspect the 1-1D1 AP would include these. Making them a seperate unit > from the Ogre would increase game time and also remove what little use INF > have in the game. Just like tactical armor games, INF is chosen last and at > a MUCH lower amount than is historical. I agree that drone sensors are likely included in the existing AP systems. Please don't advocate adding new toys to existing units, that way lies the death of Car Wars, Battletech, ASL, and the madness that is Star Fleet Battles. As for people not taking infantry....on the Ogre map I would gladly trade all that useless armour for more infantry. The only problem with infantry in GEV is that it is too slow, but we have the GEV-PC to fix that now. Espessially with all the spiffy varrient types. Maybe in a hexless mini's game INF is no longer queen of battle, but I play Old School on the hex maps, an follow Jackson's Maxim : "The quality of player is reflected in how he handles his infantry". ===== From: "Grant A. Ladue" Subject: Combat Drones > [Wait until you see the drone rules. (No, not the LAD style immobile > remote controlled drones, the flying drones.) (Even though I don't much > care for the current drone rules. They should either move as normal units > or be subject to Cruise Missile style interception.) -HJC] Quit teasing us Henry! What are the drone rules from? > Something I noticed this week, if I may quote from Ogre Minis page 13, > about the Hovertruck it says "...the infantry unit is considered to be > inside..." and Sockwave 3.02 "...are assumed to be riding inside..." so > this is very clear and straight forwards. > > Now, take a look at the picture that was just posted for > > http://www.sjgames.com/miniatures/ogre/combineset10/ > > Note that Hovertrucks are flattops. (At least some of the Combine ones > are.) There is no "inside" other than a small cabin at the front and no > way are two squads of battlesuited grunts going to fit in there. This is how I would explain it without changing the current rules: The infantry is not actually "inside" the hovertruck, but they still can't fire from it, so that makes it a convenient shorthand for phrasing the rule. Think of it like this, the hovertrucks are cargo carriers, not military vehicles. They lack the stabilizers and gyro's sufficient to allow for a stable enough ride for infantry to fire accurately from (especially in combat where shells and explosions are everywhere). Similiarly, they don't have the ECM/ECCM suite that would sync up with the infantry's suits to compensate for the movement of the hovertruck. It's this lack of ECCM that makes the infantry more vulnerable when on the hovertruck. This makes more sense than the infantry being actually "inside" the hovertruck anyways. After all, would a canvas or thin metal wall really be a deterrent to the kind of weapons used by battlesuited infantry in a nuclear environment? grant ===== [Drones are found in Battlesuit and Gurps Ogre. The development of drones leaves open the question of why to continue building giant Ogre targets if smarts can be made small. Yes, but what keeps the grunts from jumping off in the middle of an overrun? Truckblitz rules: Infantry can ride on top of certain "non-military" units, i.e. flatbed trucks and flatbed hovertrucks. These units do not include the sensors or stability for infantry to fire from these units, so the infantry must always dismount before firing. (Insert suggestion to move mounting onto vehicles as the last action in a player's turn here.) In an overrun, infantry on top of non-military units may dismount at the end of their first fire phase. (So they lose their first fire phase if overrun and lose their first fire phase plus get a chance of being shot while mounted if overruning another unit.) This is due to weak sensors of non-military units being unable to precisely pinpoint the enemy units in time. -HJC] ============================== From: "Eric T. or Maryann C. Holmes" Subject: Ogre Book -- 2nd Ed. Fellow GEV Jockies: Well, I finally got a copy of the 2nd Edition Ogre Book. I'm a bit disappointed in the fact that nearly 90% can be found on-line. Then, the glue decided to "dissolve" and the cover fell off, and I've only had the book 24 hours, and opened it once before.....yeah, I know, tell Steve....so, I'll put the thing in a 3-ringed binder in vinyl sheet protectors. Maybe I wanted to do that anyways. Henry, I think your unit cost article had the "12" left out of the formula, please verify. Roll sixes, Eric ===== [I know I goofed up the Superheavy cost, and I submitted that as errata quite some time ago (perhaps I need to try again?), but did you see something else wrong? (Who proofreads the proofreader?) The thing I don't understand is how my decade old copy of Ogre Minis is beat up along the spine but hasn't lost a page while all my new SJGames softbacks just fall apart. But it does make it easier to but them in binders. -HJC] List Moderator: Henry J. Cobb ogre@sjgames.com Archives for this mailing list may be found at http://www.io.com/~hcobb General online support for the OGRE game is at http://www.sjgames.com/ogre Ogre, G.E.V., Shockwave and other products mentioned here are trademarks or registered trademarks of Steve Jackson Games. All rights are reserved by SJ Games. This material is used here in accordance with the SJ Games online policy at http://www.sjgames.com/general/online_policy.html