====== OGRE Digest, Jul 27th, 2003 (Last: Jul 19th) ======== ===== Tank power From: Sethkimmel@aol.com ===== Aggressive Wars From: "Chris French" ===== Super Squads From: David Morse ============================== From: Sethkimmel@aol.com Subject: Tank power > From: Sethkimmel@aol.com > >HANDWAVE: All AFV's have an AIP source. > > Nope. Sorry. Nukes. :) I disagree for the same reason their AI's aren't Ogre level: COST....I love the quote in the old Ogre book: "A navy with nothing but battleships is a poor excuse for a Navy, but I wouldn't want to be the first one it got mad at." If an AFV has the same power plant as an Ogre, why build it? Just build Ogre's.... A tank doesn't NEED a nuclear power plant to survive the nuclear battlefield. Modern tanks can do it today. It just has to have NBC protection, and a source of onboard O2 for crew and powerplant. Diesel subs have been using this (LOX tanks to provide O2 to the diesels for sprinting) for years; I don't see how it can't be used in 60 years, especially as it's probably WAY cheaper than NPU's....It's probably a LOT easier to work on a diesel or gas turbine powerplant w/ AIP than a nuclear one (especially if it's nuclear-turboelectric like an Ogre [or a CVN for that matter....}). ===== [Part of the backstory of the Ogreverse is that the world has run out of Oil. So no diesel for your tanks. -HJC] ============================== From: "Chris French" Subject: Aggressive Wars > From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com > << And, of course, in Reality, the first nation to even contemplate > building an OGRE is going to be set up by the international com- > munity for "waging aggressive war". :) >> > > Does not seem to be affecting the US yet. Wish the administration and > Congress were required to watch Terminator, and see what they are risking with > robotic military forces. Hell with that -- I'm waiting for the US Gov't to secretly take over a couple of online multiplayer game sites, and start feeding them real-world military data in a fictional construction. Would give new meaning to the phrase "all-volunteer army" -- we could get so- called pacifists involved in blasting seven bales of s*** out of people we don't like, and *they'd* pay for the privilige! :) > [Yes, and as noted previously, the Combine is coming to be at such a > hectic pace that it's hardly worth mentioning anymore. -HJC] Actually, this week's _The Economist_ had an article on how Europe's birthrate is declining so precipitously that the white populations are likely to be overrun entirely by refugees from the Middle East, India, and other vacation spots; and all those old ethnic hatreds will be coming with them. By the time 2085 rolls around, not only might there not be an EU, there might not even be a France, a Germany, or an Italy.... CF ===== [The Italians have a fix for this. Firing warning shots into the refugee boats. -HJC] ============================== From: David Morse Subject: Super Squads Henry J. Cobb wrote: > > [If targeting infantry under cover is very hard then you'll attack the > first squad at low odds and the rest of the squads stacked in the hex at > even lower odds. > > On the other tread, if targeting infantry under cover is simply > impossible then you just spray the hex with nukes and every squad has the > same chance of getting blown up. > > The difference between these two is D9 in town per squad with the > standard rules vs D3 in town per squad with spillover fire only. > > > So, let's take a 9 point attack against three squads in a town hex. > > Under the published rules you have a 1 in 3 chance of getting all the > infantry and a 1 in 3 chance of getting one squad for an average damage of > 1.33 squads. > > With super defense squads you get a 2 in 3 chance on the first squad > followed by a 1 in 6 chance on the other two squads for an average damage > of 1.0 squads. > > With the spillover only super squads you get a flat 1 in 3 chance at > each squad for an average damage of 1.0 squads. > > The same attack against three squads in woods gives 1.33 (standard), > 1.5 (D4) and 1.5 (spillover only) and it's even worse in the clear. -HJC] I'm somewhat lost. What constitutes "worse", or good/bad in this situation? So if its six-of-one versus half-dozen-of-the-other, then I vote for "super defense squads" over the more complex "spillover only super squads". What are "super defense squads" again? D1-clear D4-trees D9-towns? Its depressing that a HVY can't even dent the paint of a super-squad in town. Well I guess three turns to rubbleize the town, then finally get a 1-1 shot... :( ===== [They could always take their chance with an overrun and drop the infantry down to D3. Here's a setup I'm working on for basic Raid for standard infantry. Howitzers in 0911 and 2315, a squad in each of 0413 and 1808 and nine more squads stacked with each gun. CP-A in 0101 and CP-B in 1207. There's not many targets south of the stream line and any GEVs that go north of there get wacked. The platoons line up two hexes from the guns and swivel around to block the GEVs. The two "speedbump" squads are there to ensure that the roads through their town hexes are blocked. And they achieve this by either getting blown up on on the first turn, cutting the road (but not destroying the town) in their own hex or inviting a bunch of GEVs (at least three) to overrun their hex. -HJC] ============================== Send all submissions or mailing list changes or problems to ogre@sjgames.com Archives for this mailing list may be found at http://www.io.com/~hcobb/ General online support for the OGRE game is at http://www.sjgames.com/ogre Ogre, G.E.V., Shockwave and other products mentioned here are trademarks or registered trademarks of Steve Jackson Games. All rights are reserved by SJ Games. This material is used here in accordance with the SJ Games online policy at http://www.sjgames.com/general/online_policy.html