====== OGRE Digest, Jun 5th, 2003 (Last: Jun 2nd) ======== ===== Digging In From: stephan beal From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com ===== BYOO back online From: stephan beal ===== OGRE/G.E,V question From: "Chris French" ===== Jammer rules v.4 From: "Paul Chapman" ============================== From: stephan beal Subject: Digging In > From: "Chris French" > the rules about how INF and OGREs treat D results were disregard- > ed, and the aforementioned units took D results the way "normal" > units do. In INF's case, it would be as per standard rules (unit may ... While i haven't ever used the "disabled treads" rule (a matter of bookkeeping), i have used the disabled infantry alternate, and i find it quite okay. Simply call it "pinned down" instead of "disabled" and it's justifiable. ===== From: AvaheilDotter@aol.com Subject: Digging In << > No, a powered suit will appear first in industrial uses. And thus the > ability to dig, move large objects, and assemble things will be available > to them. And the current US military is not a bunch of sluggards about > digging in... Digging is still a time-consuming process, unless one has a backhoe available. Hands are somewhat limited in the amount of dirt they can shift. (Oh, and suppose you're on hardpan....) >> That's what the grenades are for... But, in all seriousness, I don't see digging in as physical digging as much as the laying of local ECM screens/active camo. And any actual digging will be more like swimming into the ground so as to leave as little trace at the surface. Read Leo Frankowski's "A Boy and his Tank" for some hints of this... Ad Astra! Stan Leghorn ============================== From: stephan beal Subject: BYOO back online Yo, A few months after a drive crashed killed the Build Your Own Ogre server, i've finally got it back online: http://stephan.rootonfire.org/byoo/ (both the same thing) i don't /think/ i lost any user-submitted Ogres, but a couple may have gotten nuked (so to say). Feel free to experiment... ============================== From: "Chris French" Subject: OGRE/G.E,V question > From: Steve Jackson > 8.03 is talking about destroying town hexes for victory points. This > is relatively easy and does not turn the whole area into rubble . . . > it just renders the area unusable for homes or work, and cuts the > roads and railroads. > > 8:06 is talking about turning the whole hex into a sea of broken > bricks, smoking pits, and splinters. This is far past the "destroyed" > of 8.03. Y'know, I'd oft wondered about this.... (I'm reading John Ringo's _Gust Front_ at the moment, and apparently in the book preceding, the Good Guys stop a Bad Guy force in part by dropping a couple megaskyscrapers on them; I'd wondered about levels of devastation in hexes in _O_.) > [Thanks, now if only the Ogre Minis rules could be brought into > agreement. (If you're finding the defense in RAID difficult, try using the > rule from OM49 where any group of less than 6 GEVs CANNOT destroy a city > hex.) -HJC] Umm, which rule is this? And from which edition (I have 1st. ed)? [Ogre Minis page 49. It takes 12 points of attack in one blow to destroy cities. -HJC] > [Would you be ready to accept Inf that DO NOT combine into platoons, so > you can only put five squads in a hex, but you have to pick them off > one by one? (The 3/1 counter is purely notational. You have to fire at > the squads one at a time.) Yes. INF "combining" always struck me as kinda goofy, especially on a NUCLEAR BATTLEFIELD. ("We're inside the range of that Big Nuke-Shell-Firing Tank -- close ranks!" Right up there with _Car Wars_ biker-gang players who would run fast-moving close-order formations behind convoys.) The INF will, by human nature, scatter so as to prohibit a single well-placed shot from wiping out the whole squad. Since they will be dispersing, there's only so many suits that can be fitted into a 1.5-km hexagonal area (tho' a mere 18 seems a bit low to me, as INF aren't much bigger than 2 meters*). [*: THE FIRST PERSON TO MAKE A _STAR WARS_ REFERENCE GETS AN "AVEDA KEDAVRA" SPELL SENT HIS WAY! :) ] > A 1/1,D1,M2 squad that does not suffer at all from D results has a DM > of 2.25 so the cost is 1 * (2 +1 +4*1.5) + 2 * 1 * 2.25 * (2) = 9 + 9 or > 1.5 VPs. > > If you give them M3 and eliminate their road bonus (they're flying, how > is the road going to help them?) then the cost is close enough to 2 VPs. Assuming a DM of 3, yes, that matches my calculations. > > You'd need to give the Heavy Tanks a single AP gun each to remain > balanced and Missile Tanks would still suck as much as usual. -HJC] MSL tanks are easily fixed -- change the Movement Mode to HVY (that is, 1&1/3 by the Formula). That brings them to an even 72 pts. (40 on Attack, 32 on Defense). As for HVYs -- and most other units, actually -- unless the INF are hiding in shrubbery or other such terrain, the HVY's At. 4 will kill a squad 5 times in 6 (4:1 odds),and this combined with the tank's equivalent speed and terrain capabilities (TNKs and INF handle forest about equally; in swamps, armor is FUBAR anyway) should allow the HVY to pay off the INF most of the time (a standard INF platoon of 3 squads only gets a 1:1 attack once; after that, it's 1:2, and then No Chance). GEVs will eat INF alive in open terrain. One thing I'm thinking of at the moment: The job of armor is to take ground, while the job of INF is to hold ground. Thus, shouldn't the rules state that for purposes of gaining/losing VP, only INF may be counted towards hex ownership? Now publish _OGRETHULHU_ already! :) CF ===== [Ni! -HJC] ============================== From: "Paul Chapman" Subject: Jammer rules v.4 Ok, here's version 4. I think I've cleared up everything, so I'm going to post it to the Yahoo lists. Henry, feel free to pop it up on the Official list. Jammers, or jamscreens, emit a wide variety of signals which spoof every detector a cruise missile can use to orient itself. Any cruise missile which moves within 15 hexes/30" of the jammer immediately loses control. It moves a random distance (1d+2 hexes or 3d inches) in a random direction (spin a pencil), then crash-lands. On a roll of 4 or greater on one die, the missile explodes; otherwise it harmlessly self-destructs. The cost of a jammer varies depending on the scenario, if it is allowed at all. Jammers [start with 20 SPs and -HJC] no longer function once they has been reduced to 10 SPs, but are not counted as destroyed for VPs until the building is reduced to 0 SPs. Optional Rules Notes These optional rules are currently being playtested, so their balance may need a bit of tweaking. If you use these rules, and encounter a problem, have a question, or just want to make a suggestion, email Paul Chapman. These options replace the above rules concerning the effect of the jammer. Each option represents a different type of jammer. Each type must be purchased separately, and be represented separately; one structure cannot operate more than one jammer. Players should note which type of jammer they have purchased. Opponents should not know which type of jammer they are facing until they are effected. If multiple jammers have been purchased, the specific location of each type should also be noted, to prevent unsportsmanlike conduct. Optional rules Jammers come in a variety of types, depending on which frequencies they interfere with, and at what strength. Each type of jammer must be purchased separately. Overlapping jammers of the same type do not have a cumulative effect. However, an area can be under the effect of multiple jammers. BASIC JAMMER For 6VP, this jammer may disrupt any missile (cruise or Ogre) within 15 hexes/30". Any units which attempt to intercept a disrupted missile add 2 to their roll. ANTI-OGRE JAMMER For 3VP, this jammer can reduce the attack strength of any Ogre missile by 1, if either the firer or the target are within a 15 hex/30" radius. DECOY JAMMER For 1VP, this "jammer" is little more than an empty shell, with only 10 SPs. However, it looks and scans exactly as a jammer of indeterminate type. It has no effect on any unit. DIRECTED JAMMER For 6VP, this jammer can chose to direct its effects narrowly, into a cone 10 hexes/20" long and 11 hexes/22" wide at the widest point. All units within the area of effect subtract 1 from their attack strength, for as long as they are within the area of effect. Units with adjusted attack strengths of 0 or less cannot attack, but can defend normally. Ogres subtract 1 from the attack strength of each weapon. Infantry are unaffected. COUNTER JAMMER For 6VP, this jammer can negate the effects of another jammer within a 15 hex/30" radius. PULSE JAMMER For 12VP, this jammer can tune its effects into a weapon. It focuses a blast of disrupting signals at a spot within 5 hexes/10". Each unit within this hex or the six surrounding hexes (or, for hexless games, within 4" of the targeted point) are considered disabled on a roll of 4 or greater on one die. Ogres and infantry are unaffected. Units disabled by a jamming pulse recover normally. Units which are already disabled, and fail the roll, are considered destroyed -- their electronics are useless for the duration of the battle! BROAD SPECTRUM JAMMER For 12VP, this jammer can prevent any unit within a 15 hex/30" radius from combining its fire with any other unit. Infantry may still combine into platoons. Ogres may still combine the fire on any of its own weapons. Units within the effective radius of this jammer lose all advantages from Sensor Grids and Command Posts. ANTI-CRUISE MISSILE JAMMER For 18VP, this jammer can destroy any Cruise Missiles within a 15 hex/30" radius. Any affected CM travels for (1 die + 2) hexes/ 3 dice inches in a random direction, then crashes, with a 50% chance of exploding on impact. ===== [And I want a Jam Ogre! Take a Mk-IIIB, replace the four missiles with two (D3) Jammer Pods. The cost is 140 VPs plus the cost (from the list above) of the two Jammers, that need not be the same type. Scenario: The one and only Jam Ogre and two Ninja buddies take out Paris. -HJC] ============================== Send all submissions or mailing list changes or problems to ogre@sjgames.com Archives for this mailing list may be found at http://www.io.com/~hcobb/ General online support for the OGRE game is at http://www.sjgames.com/ogre Ogre, G.E.V., Shockwave and other products mentioned here are trademarks or registered trademarks of Steve Jackson Games. All rights are reserved by SJ Games. 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