From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Tue Mar 25 17:45:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by deliverator.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA11071; Tue, 25 Mar 1997 15:25:43 -0600 (CST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA30951 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Tue, 25 Mar 1997 15:28:26 -0600 Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 15:28:26 -0600 Message-Id: <199703252128.PAA30951@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #90 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Tuesday, March 25 1997 Volume 01 : Number 090 In this digest: IN> Yersinia - Demon Princess of the Plague Re: IN> An Unusual Angel Re: IN> IN character sheet Re: IN> In Nomine: Rules Questions Re: IN> Yersinia - Demon Princess of the Plague Re:IN> In Nomine: Rules Questions IN> Abandoning Vessels IN> Perception of people and celestials IN> Ranks of Angel - A New Celestial Order Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials IN> Angel of Style - the numbers bit Re: IN> IN character sheet Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials Re: IN> Abandoning Vessels Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials IN> Party Animals? (Fluff!) Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials Re: IN> Abandoning Vessels Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials IN> A quick question. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 13:16:02 -0800 From: John Gonzalez Subject: IN> Yersinia - Demon Princess of the Plague I don't know if I missed it, but I posted a Demon Princess that I worked up to this list a couple of days ago, and never saw it actually make the rounds... did anyone else see it... I want to know if I'm doing something incorrect before I post the final version and the AA that I am also working on... Anyone ever see her? Her name was Yersinia. Any help is appreciated... Thanks in advance. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 16:58:05 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> An Unusual Angel At 9:16 AM -0500 3/21/97, Hatcher Rhanyr wrote: >I was perusing a file Elizabeth McCoy sent me >and came across an unusual entry: > >Abel-meholah -- mourning of sickness > >heheheheehe.....would this guy be the Angel of Morning Sickness? Ooooog! One hopes not... He's probably Fallen, if he is. Habbalah. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 17:38:42 -0500 (EST) From: TSRInc@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> IN character sheet >your .PDF character sheet has a font that some of our computers can't read >- -- it seems to be called "Berolina" ? can you do something about this, by >any chance? Hmm, AFAIK, that shouldn't make a difference when you _view_ the document (I don't have Berolina here at work, and I can view it just fine), only if you try and _modify_ the document in Acrobat Exchange. >What is with your e-mail address TSRINC isn't that tthe old tsr homepage >address? Like I said, I'm posting this from my work account. - - Sean (who works for TSR but is allowed to play In Nomine) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 17:40:42 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine: Rules Questions On Mar 24, 2:02pm, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine: Rules Questions > At 11:09 AM -0500 3/22/97, John Karakash - Lucent ASCC wrote: > >On Mar 21, 4:52pm, Elizabeth McCoy wrote: > >> Subject: Re: IN> In Nomine: Rules Questions > >> At 12:04 PM -0800 3/21/97, Clinton Wolf wrote: > >> >Greetings, > >> > >> >1) Shedim "have full knowledge of their hosts' thoughts, feelings, and > >> > memories" (p. 151)... does this include Skills? What about songs > >> > and attunements? > >> > >> I would say yes. It might have trouble with Basic Rites, though. > > > > I would say no on attunements and I'm wavering on Songs. > >Attunements are new strings in a person's soul, if you will. > >In other words, the only way to access those abilities is to > >_be_ that person. Songs are trickier since they act sorta like > >skills, but, at their basis, they are more like Attunements. I > >would say no for Songs as well. > > But Marcus, using the Song of Possession, was able to access the > "munch anything I want" Servitor Attunement of Gluttony. Why > wouldn't a Shedim be able to do as much? Good point. I also must note that Song of Possession gives use of Attunements. Still no mention of Songs yet. I Will Ask. =) And, given the story as an example, it must be the case that Song of Possession can give control over a Celestial's Vessel. I will also ask about Shedim/Kyriotate doing the same! - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 13:27:53 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: Re: IN> Yersinia - Demon Princess of the Plague > Anyone ever see her? Her name was Yersinia. > Yeah, I saw her. Short girl, brown hair? Just kidding. AFAIK, she came through alright (I read her somewhere, so if it wasn't here, I don't know who's head I've been in).... Leath. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 20:29:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Michael C. Nutt" Subject: Re:IN> In Nomine: Rules Questions >>> >1) Shedim "have full knowledge of their hosts' thoughts, feelings, and >>> > memories" (p. 151)... does this include Skills? What about songs >>> > and attunements? >>> >>> I would say yes. It might have trouble with Basic Rites, though. >> >> I would say no on attunements and I'm wavering on Songs. >>Attunements are new strings in a person's soul, if you will. >>In other words, the only way to access those abilities is to >>_be_ that person. Songs are trickier since they act sorta like >>skills, but, at their basis, they are more like Attunements. I >>would say no for Songs as well. > >But Marcus, using the Song of Possession, was able to access the >"munch anything I want" Servitor Attunement of Gluttony. Why >wouldn't a Shedim be able to do as much? Because Shedites aren't using the Song of Possession. After all, their resonances *are* different from the effects of the Song... just ask your friendly neighborhood Kyriotate! And not even the Song of Possession allows you to use Songs known by the target. I *personally* see Songs as different from Attunements, in that Songs require active use of Essence *and* have varying levels of skill. They're ways to affect the Symphony, whereas Attunements are modifications to the basic *celestial*. >At 11:55 PM -0800 3/23/97, Clinton Wolf wrote: >>Elizabeth McCoy wrote: >> >> [ Example of poor, innocent, defenseless Shedite being cruelly tricked >> into a tether by heartless angels deleted... ] > >[] I don't think *any* Shedite is >"innocent." "Guilty until proven not present", eh? Michael Decadence is its own reward. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Mar 97 03:15:44 EST From: Moriah - Steve Jackson Games <73407.515@CompuServe.COM> Subject: IN> Abandoning Vessels >From: Steven Feldon >Subject: IN> Definition of "abandoning vessels"? > >Michael's Kyriotates can generate vessels. . . but can't abandon them. >Laurence's Kyriotates are bound into the vessel of a warrior who died >too early. . . but can't abandon them. > >What's the proper and total definition of "abandoning a vessel"? Does >this mean that each of these Kyriotate vessels exists, on Earth, 24 by >7? That they can't ever dematerialize? That they constantly count >against the limited number of forces that the Kyriotate can inhabit? So >even when the Kyriotate goes Celestial, they're still _always_ in that >body? And a starting Kyriotate of Michael or Laurence will not be able >to inhabit (a word I like much better than possess) a human until they >get their tenth Force? This means that the Kyriotate has that many Forces 'tied up' in that Vessel. So, if in both cases, a Kyriotate has 5 Forces tied up in the non-abandoning Vessel, then he still has 4 Forces worth of possession to normally do (unless Michael's Kyriotate *creates* more Vessels with the left over Forces). The Kyriotate can still take Celestial Form, and the Vessel disappears into Potentiality. But 5 Forces is still taken up by that non-abandoning Vessel and can not be used for any other type of possession. Peace, Moriah ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 09:50:53 GMT From: w_mazur@primenet.com (Walt Mazur) Subject: IN> Perception of people and celestials A couple questions: Imagine two celestials' vessels, unknown to each other, are walking towards each other from opposite ends of a very long and busy street. By what game mechanism(s) and at what distance can one perceive that the other is not a human, especially if neither is using essence or is dissonant? The FAQ seems to say that celestials can't be distinguished from humans (or animals or objects) at any distance unless they cause distubance. When a disturbance is caused, what are the mechanisms and distances for determining whether the other celestial is a demon or angel? IOW, if a celestial sees someone spending essense or otherwise disturbing the Symphony, what are the ways he might figure out which side they're on? The opportunities for friendly fire seem . . . limitless. Manual references would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 21:07:32 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Frederick Subject: IN> Ranks of Angel - A New Celestial Order Dear Friends, Celestials Divine and Diabolic #Bing - Notification - This transmission is being monitored by Dominic-Net - Keeping Heaven Safe from Heresy# I have for sometime being considering the Celestial Hierarchy and, with consideration to the possible promotion of new Word-Bound Celestials, would like to suggest some rethinking of the current arrangements. At first glance I can see 4 broad ranks of Celestials; Celestial, Minor Word-Bound, Major Word-Bound and Principle. I take the distinction between Major and Minor Word-Bound to be level at which the Word-Bound provides different Servitor Attunments to each Choir/Band of their Servitors. Below that the Word-Bound is just embroidering around the edges of their Superior's work, rather than doing new and original work of their own. The two Principles are God and Lucifer, they are the coordinating unifying themes of their bloc. The Major Word-Bound are major independent employers that operate within the economic structure of their Principle furthering particular enterprises and providing employment to the lesser ranks of Celestials. Minor Word-Bound are minor employers, like master tradesmen, who organise detail work within the enterprises of the Majors, but whose workers might still be employees contracted to the Major who they are working for. Celestials are base employees who do the work as directed by their employer. Rather than shoving the newly Word-Bound out to fend for themselves, even if they get political support from their previous Superior, they might be able to start by working with other servitors of their Major Word-Bound Superior building up the new Word and developing the Attunements, Rites and Distinctions that go with it. When the Word is strong enough to stand by itself, at about the point that the Word-Bound has a good range of Attunements and Rites and possibly some Distinctions, they will be in a good position to attract servitors of their own and move on, returning their previous Superior's servitors, or perhaps "head hunting" a few. I think it is likely that the new Major is likely to remain closely associated with their previous Superior, but now as equals rather than master and protege. This will provide a career path for developing Word-Bound Celestials and more secure development of Celestial Word's. While it may seem that this is more like the behaviour of the Divine, it also makes sense for the Diabolic. A Diabolic Major knows that as soon as one of his Minors gains independence he can kiss any investment made in that Minor goodbye. A newly promoted Diabolic Major might find that his Word coordinates better with his old Superior's than with any other, making joint enterprises a possibility, but there is no loyalty in Hell. So it makes sense that the Major should keep hold of a rising Minor for as long as possible, milking the Minor's increasing power for all that he can. The relationship between the Major and Minor Word-Bound then becomes similar to the relationship between the Major Word-Bound and their Principle. It is the Principle's Plan and the Major's handle detail work which furthers some part of the Plan. By developing their own part of the Plan they advance the whole Plan, although of course there is no possibility of a Major gaining advancement to the Rank of Principle. #Buzt - You are approaching Heresy - Please report to the nearest Seraph of Judgement# If this structure is adopted then it becomes possible for a Celestial at any Rank to be servitor to a Celestial of the Rank above and servitor to the Celestial that their Superior is servitor to in the next Rank. This expands rather than replaces the chain of control from the normal Celestial to Word-Bound and Word-Bound to Principle allowing more interaction between the Ranks. Celestials may be servitor to a Minor and that Minor's Major. Minor Word-Bound may be servitors to both a Major Word-Bound and that Major's Principle. Major Word-Bound are servitor to a Principle. Of course there is no rank above Principle, though it is an intriguing thought. #BUZT - HERESY - Report to Dominic immediately for Examination#. Hmm I'd better finish this quickly, I'll just pack here while I continue. This would make for more coordination of effort between those Word-Bound whose Words are related and give more variety for lesser Celestials. See you in the Corporeal Plane, May the Goddess Bless you all. Thanking you for your indulgence. Phasekiel Elohim of Yves, Angel of Heresy. "All Paths may lead to God" replies by the usual channels, or via my servant Peter on peterf@magna.com.au Email to peterf@geko.net.au "Whoso loveth God truely must not expect to be loved by Him in return." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 21:17:21 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Frederick Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials Dear Walt (and List) just my thoughts. Walt Mazur asked **Snipped to get to the point** >The FAQ seems to say that celestials can't be distinguished >from humans (or animals or objects) at any distance unless they cause >distubance. Correct. If you don't make any ripples no one can tell you are any different to any other Joe, or Jane. **Snipped again** >what are the ways he might figure out which side they're >on? The opportunities for friendly fire seem . . . limitless. Correct again. Everyone here is a Celestial. You might guess if you saw someone do something that you associated with a particular type of Celestial, but otherwise they are all just people stiring the pot and making a lot of ripples. Opps maybe they are a Soldier or a Faerie or ..... >Manual references would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! I don't believe that there are any Manual references, but I think this is the solid opinion so far on the list. Watch out it can be a damned cold war out there. Thanking you for your indulgence. Yours Peter. Email to peterf@geko.net.au "Whoso loveth God truely must not expect to be loved by Him in return." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 21:54:05 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Frederick Subject: IN> Angel of Style - the numbers bit Dear List not that anyone asked, but my prospective players made me write up the numbers bit of my Angel of Style, so I thought I'd share it with you all too. Olivia, Mercurian of Eli, The Angel of Style "Chins up, confidence. Now my Darlings give it to me one more time, with _flair_." Corpreal Forces 3 Str 5 Dex 7 Fighting 2, Song of Motion 5, Song of Tongues 3. Ethereal Forces 4 Int 7 Prec 9 Artistry 5, Detect Lies 3, Emote 5, French 2, Japanese 2, Lying 3, Firearms (Pistols) 3, Savior-Faire 6, Song of Charm 3, Song of Tongues 3. Celestial Forces 5 Will 8 Percp 12 Fast Talk 4, Seduction 4, Song of Form 4, Song of Tongues 3. Attunements - Mercurian of Eli, Ofanim of Eli Distinctions - Vassel of Flowers Vessels - Beautiful Blond Human Female - Level 3, Charisma 3, Body hits 30 - Large Persian Cat - Level 2, Charisma 2, Body Hits 25 Role - Olivia D'Mode - Fashion designer - Level 3, Status 4. Thanking you for your indulgence. Yours Peter. Email to peterf@geko.net.au "Whoso loveth God truely must not expect to be loved by Him in return." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 08:29:15 -0500 From: Erik Menard Subject: Re: IN> IN character sheet At 05:38 PM 3/24/97 -0500, you wrote: >>your .PDF character sheet has a font that some of our computers can't read >>- -- it seems to be called "Berolina" ? can you do something about this, by >>any chance? > >Hmm, AFAIK, that shouldn't make a difference when you _view_ the document >(I don't have Berolina here at work, and I can view it just fine), only >if you try and _modify_ the document in Acrobat Exchange. Well apparentaly it does matter (to PC users at least) because I got the same message. Acrobat refuses to convert this "Berolina" Font properly. but from what I can see you've put a lot of work in to your sheet, and I for one would still like to say thank you, even though I can use it as is! I'm sure those of you who can use it should like it a great deal Erik >- Sean (who works for TSR but is allowed to play In Nomine) ********************************************************************** Erik Menard * Wouldn't it be awful if life *were* fair, and we emenard@total.net * really deserved all the terrible things that Laval, Quebec * happen to us? --- Marcus Cole (Babylon 5) Canada * ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 10:08:26 -0500 (EST) From: "Paul F. Strack" Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials On Tue, 25 Mar 1997, Walt Mazur wrote: > By what game mechanism(s) and at what distance can one perceive that > the other is not a human, especially if neither is using essence or is > dissonant? You don't. Unless Celestial does something supernatural, their vessel is in every respect human. > When a disturbance is caused, what are the mechanisms and distances > for determining whether the other celestial is a demon or angel? There isn't any way. See the first paragraph on p. 56 of the IN rules: "To all but a few gifted Celestials, a change made by an angel sounds exactly like the same change made by a demon." The only exception I know of is Malakim of Yves, whose Choir Attunement lets them tell the difference between angelic and demonic disturbances. You can use Resonances to scope out a person, reading their emotions, their honor and their relation to to other people. These might give hints to whether a person is a demon, but won't tell you for sure. > The opportunities for friendly fire seem . . . limitless. Well, yes, but the Heavenly war is a cold one. Finding another Celestial doesn't mean you attack immediately, even if you *know* its on the other side. First you follow it, find out what its up to, and find out who its buddies are. Once your learn all that, you'll probably know whose side it is on, and whether or not you want to kill it. Paul Strack | Madness takes its toll. pfstrack@math.unc.edu | Please have exact change. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Web Page - http://www.math.unc.edu/Grads/pfstrack/wod.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 12:10:23 -0500 (EST) From: Calabim@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Abandoning Vessels >From: 73407.515@CompuServe.COM (Moriah - Steve Jackson Games) >Subj: IN> Abandoning Vessels > This means that the Kyriotate has that many Forces 'tied up' in that >Vessel. So, if in both cases, a Kyriotate has 5 Forces tied up in the >non-abandoning Vessel, then he still has 4 Forces worth of possession to >normally do (unless Michael's Kyriotate *creates* more Vessels with the left >over Forces). > The Kyriotate can still take Celestial Form, and the Vessel disappears >into Potentiality. But 5 Forces is still taken up by that non-abandoning >Vessel and can not be used for any other type of possession. Siiiigh...the more people answer these Kyriotate questions, the more questions it raises and the more confused I become? Why did they ever have to give up on 4/4 time anyway? Y'know, Moriah, this gives me an idea! These Kyriotates are sooo bizaare we could give them a questions and answer section of their own... ;-) - -Calabim ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 11:47:06 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials At 9:50 AM +0000 3/25/97, Walt Mazur wrote: >A couple questions: > >Imagine two celestials' vessels, unknown to each other, are walking >towards each other from opposite ends of a very long and busy street. >By what game mechanism(s) and at what distance can one perceive that >the other is not a human, especially if neither is using essence or is >dissonant? If you are a Seraph of Yves (or have that attunement), you can touch someone and tell -- I believe the minimum is whether the person is human, angel, or demonic and/or what their true name is. With better check digits (just roll the CD die, I guess, since the attunement seems to be an auto-success), you can get more detail. >The FAQ seems to say that celestials can't be distinguished >from humans (or animals or objects) at any distance unless they cause >distubance. Bingo. Unless there's some artifacts kicking around that let you get a clue... >When a disturbance is caused, what are the mechanisms and distances >for determining whether the other celestial is a demon or angel? IOW, >if a celestial sees someone spending essense or otherwise disturbing >the Symphony, what are the ways he might figure out which side they're >on? The opportunities for friendly fire seem . . . limitless. Again, some Choir and Servitor attunements allow identification, and the Aura discord will also aid in this somewhat. If you don't have those attunements, then yes, you're out of luck unless you see the celestial form of the other celestial. Friendly fire is, indeed, a problem... >Manual references would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! I'm going to concentrate on things that would reveal a mostly "hiding" celestial -- Gabriel's Malakim can make flaming hands, Malakim of David can "become immovable and indestructible", etc., which is a pretty good clue about whether they're celestial, and who they serve, and what Choir attunement they have... Though the Janus/Valefor pairings won't tell you whether someone's demonic or angelic... p. 82: Numinous Corpus Song of Wings -- "creates a pair of wings, reflecting your celestial heritage" could be read to reveal angelic or demonic nature when this song is invoked. (Bat-wings on demons, feather-wings on angels.) 'Course, it only works on the Singer. p. 87: Aura. An angel looking at an Aura-Discordant Lilim will know that he's looking at a demon (and, therefore, at which Band...). Don't ask me why -- I'd be more amused to say that anyone knows which Choir/Band pair it was, but not *which* (which would leave Lilim and Malakim as the "odd ones out" -- though a slightly-tarnished Bright Lilim could also be possible...). p. 94: Seraphim resonance -- with the right questions, a Seraph has a chance of spotting a celestial fibbing about their nature, their Superior, etc. The higher the check digit, the easier it will be to discover a person's true nature without getting into really nit-picky questions. p. 99: Elohim resonance -- even trickier than the Seraph one, but it's still possible to pick up on some things. Celestial motivations are likely to be different from human ones, and demonic and angelic motivations are likewise often different. This only works with higher check digits. p. 101: Malakim resonance -- demons are often selfish, and sometimes what's noble and ignoble to someone will provide a clue to that person's true nature. And a roll of 6 will pick up Balseraphs. p. 104: Mercurian resonance -- on things like a check digit of 3, you get "geographic and cultural origins"... This should probably call for a roll against Role, to see which "origin" gets picked up, but... p. 106: the Children of the Grigori "shun demons almost instinctively". p. 113: David's "Cold Touch" attunement can suggest whether someone is celestial or not -- by how quickly they escape. :) Also, if you see a statue moving around, there's a good chance it's a Kyrio of Stone. p. 114: Mercurians of Judgment probably have a better chance than normal Mercurians, since they get "a human's most deviant behavior" -- either they get celestial deviancy, or they don't get anything of that when they expected it, and can tell they're looking at a celestial. Dominic's Servitor Attunement of Heavenly Judgment can also work, if the circumstances are right, but few demons have Wills low enough to yield to the Friend of Judgment distinction! p. 117: Cherubim of Eli can get basic facts about the maker of an object: human, angel, or demon is always answered; more on better CDs. p. 118: All of Gabriel's servitors have Choir attunements that allow them to detect certain kinds of cruelty at a glance -- I would suspect that demonic cruelty would register, though not necessarily that it was demonic! Still, it's a clue. Also, if you toast someone and get 3 Essence, you just killed a demon with fire... :) p. 127: Seraphim of the Sword can "tell at a glance whether or not the foes they engage in battle are *ultimately* on the side of good or evil." (Emphasis mine.) p. 129: With luck and a good choice, a Malakite of Trade may be able to divine someone's nature by what something means to that person. Mercurians of Trade may also get lucky, if a celestial "earned" money via some unnatural means. p. 133: Novalis' Crown of Joy Servitor Attunement -- the duration of its effects will reveal whether the subject is demonic or not. p. 134: Seraphim of Yves are obnoxious... And they get bemused by people who won't shake hands with them. Malakim of Destiny "can tell a divine disturbance in the Symphony from a diabolical one." A Kyrio of Destiny who happened to possess a (likely very surprised) celestial would have complete access to the host's memories, which would undoubtedly provide *much* interesting data... Using Divine Destiny on a celestial either gets a "null reading" (it does say "mortal" in the description), or something along the lines of: "Destiny: to achieve a Word (or higher!); Fate: to be Fallen." That last may or may not show "current state," according to GM whim. p. 146: Habbalah may be able to detect Elohim -- they know which emotion would be worst for their subject's stability, after all. And they're more vunerable to Habbalah, too. p. 148: Lilim detect needs -- and if the need they detect is something like "locate and kill the demon who's around here somewhere," then she knows this is no ordinary mundane (though it might still be a loony human). p. 151: "Shedim have full knowledge of their hosts' thoughts, feelings and memories." If they've gotten into a celestial vessel, they'll know it. Nasty little things, Shedim. p. 154: "If an Impudite uses his resonance on a Cherub, an Elohite, a Kyriotate or a Mercurian, then the angel not only gets a Will roll to resist but a Perception roll as well. [...If made,] he realizes that he's being attacked by an Impudite..." p. 160: Asmodeus' Band Attunements permit his servitors to detect others of their own Band with a Perception roll. (And the Servitor Attunements include "Humanity," which "lets a demon pass as human under any circumstances, to anyone -- except Lucifer.") And his Captains of Integrity can detect liars or hypocrites, allowing careful questioning to spot a celestial and probably the nature of said celestial. p. 167: You can track down the Djinn of Belial via a permanently- attuned person's brand, if you're a Cherub, Djinn, or just know the Celestial Song of Attraction. p. 168: Haagenti's Consume attunement specifies "human," which suggests that one of his Servitors could spot a celestial via the "blank spot" approach. ("I can't read him. Must be celestial.") p. 171: If you get lucky, and you're a Baron of Hysteria, then you can tell what someone thinks would be funny -- which has a chance of being specific enough to determine nature... p. 173: Impudites of Fate know someone's personal history on a successful Perception roll while touching that person. Also, the Fated Future servitor attunement might catch something like "Worst Fate: to Fall." p. 174: Impudites of Factions might get the trust between an angel and Superior... And the amount it would take to break that! p. 179: Saminga's Knights of the Dead know cause of death -- such as the Malakim with the Claws Numinous Corpus who's about to step out from behind that curtain... p. 182: many of Vapula's servitors have little tech-toy goodies -- if you know what to look for. (But what happens if a Kyrio of Jean tries to possess the laptop of a Shedite of Vapula??) I think that's the lot of 'em... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 12:57:54 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Party Animals? (Fluff!) Servitors of Judgment are stuffy about the poor Servitors of Creation and their parties... But why don't they get upset about some of Jordi's? His Seraphim deal with marine life, right? Like dolphins? And dolphins are known to be one of the most *randy* species on the Earth... Seraphim of Jordi, the unknown party-angels... Obviously they get away with it by being so far out to sea. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 12:50:55 +0000 From: "Bodhi" Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials > >Manual references would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! HUGE SNIP!! >I think that's the lot of 'em... WOW!!! Ms. McCoy, thanks for your efforts on this question! I would've been tempted to leave it at "it's really hard to tell, unless you've got some sort of specific attunement or resonance that might be interpreted in such a way that you get a CLUE as to their nature". ... a far cry from the detailed piece you did! Your work here was outstanding! Walk in Beauty, Rob Wolff / Bodhi rob@v-wave.com Nicholas Copernicus, Master Astronomer Stood up and Shouted, addressing the throng, "Abandon poor Ptolomy, Stand up and follow me, Heliocentrically, Ptolomy's Wrong!!" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 15:08:38 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials At 12:50 PM +0000 3/25/97, Bodhi wrote: > >> >Manual references would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance! >HUGE SNIP!! >>I think that's the lot of 'em... > >WOW!!! Ms. McCoy, thanks for your efforts on this question! [...] >Your work here was outstanding! And here I thought that I was fufilling a Rules-Lawyer Rite... He asked for references. I gave them... (Now, does that count as a Geas/1? ;) Or just an Odius Personal Habit?) Hope that it's useful for many people, and not just a few... - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com // emccoy@jade.mv.net GURPS characters, Roleplayers; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 15:07:04 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Abandoning Vessels > Siiiigh...the more people answer these Kyriotate questions, the more > questions it raises and the more confused I become? Why did they ever have to > give up on 4/4 time anyway? > > Y'know, Moriah, this gives me an idea! These Kyriotates are sooo bizaare we > could give them a questions and answer section of their own... ;-) They will/do. ;) Just the Kyriotate of Yves section in the FAQ was 6-9 questions depending the last time I looked. And more coming. - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 15:11:21 -0500 From: "John Karakash - Lucent ASCC" Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials [Question and Elizabeth's answers snipped] As far as I can tell at first glance, she's hit all the high points (and some of the not-so-high points as well) in her answer. Good job! - -- ___________________________________________________ / \ |John Karakash - Lucent Technologies (formerly AT&T) | | (919)380-4629 | | "A fundamental principle of economics is that the | | more you tax something, the less you get of it. | | In this country we tax success most of all." | \___________________________________________________/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 1997 12:37:41 -0800 From: John Gonzalez Subject: Re: IN> Perception of people and celestials SNIP > > WOW!!! Ms. McCoy, thanks for your efforts on this question! > > Your work here was outstanding! > I echo those kudos... Bravo! Either you really know your stuff or you have FAR too much time on your hands. (or both...) Thanks for the exhaustive info. Again, Bravo. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 1997 10:00:30 GMT+10 From: "Leathal Weapon" <938269@wrpc.riv.csu.edu.au> Subject: IN> A quick question. Hi, While reading IN last night, I stumbled upon something I had not seen before (not having read all the DPs that thoroughly yet). Under the description of Kronos' Balseraph's Choir Attunement it says (paraphrasing) that they may take the Resonance of any one Angelic Choir. Okay, simple enough. BUT, if said Balseraph takes the resonance of a Malakim (with oaths like "I will kick people when they are down", "I will use superior weaponry at every chance" etc etc) and then passes itself of as a Malakite to other Malakim, their resonance says they can detect Baseraphs because of their intense selfishness. OKAY, this is the question (finally), does the Basleraph imitating a Malakim still show up like a beacon to this resonance, or does the fact that they are 'hiding' extinguish it? Or maybe a mixture occurs, where the Malakite gets a 'twinge' of something, but can't immediately trace it to the Balseraph. If the Malakim can still detect the Balseraph, it means they are very effective at policing themselves. If not, it means that they are probably thoroughly infiltrated, and leads to interesting adventure ideas (and at least one way of mixing Demons with Malakim parties). Thanks. Leath. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #90 ****************************** The material here is (C) 1996 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.