From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Jun 8 04:34:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA01961 for ; Mon, 8 Jun 1998 04:34:42 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) id EAA07281 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 8 Jun 1998 04:41:56 -0500 Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 04:41:56 -0500 Message-Id: <199806080941.EAA07281@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #813 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, June 8 1998 Volume 01 : Number 813 In this digest: Re: IN> Career Paths for Diabloic Servants IN> career paths of the damned IN> Ascension-inspired Seed Re: IN> career paths of the damned Re: IN> career paths of the damned Essence Reserves (was Re: IN> Word Forces, was Re: IN> Placing credit) Re: Word Forces (was Re: IN> Placing credit) IN> Dread Cthulhu IN> Character Sketch Re: IN> A soldier of Hell's choice Re: IN> Career Paths for Diabloic Servants Re: IN> Career Paths for Diabloic Servants IN> Communist Manifesto (was Re: IN> Re: IN- Plot device) IN> World News RE: IN> IN Campaign Seed: The Third Avatar IN> Word Forces (longish) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 17:16:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Ben-Prime Subject: Re: IN> Career Paths for Diabloic Servants On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, Nana Yaw Ofori wrote: > At 10:20 PM -0400 6/5/98, Peter Frederick wrote: > > >I know I've said this before, but I do have apersonal problem with this and > >I'll try to illustrate. > > > >A small thought experiment. A uniquely honest demon appears to you and > >points out in no uncertain terms that you are an Evil Person. [SNIP!] > >1. Soldier of Hell. You get access to possible power and privilege as > >well as becoming part of a power structure that has some limited interest > >in your welfare, as long as you support itís aims. You live no longer than > >you would otherwise and when you die you to go to Hell and suffer > >excruciating torment for all eternity. > > If this is true, they're certainly not going to tell you the > latter. Not much of an incentive to serve the cause of Hell. Either they're > going to tell you that Eternal Torture doesn't happen (And how are you > going to check? Not like you can learn Celestial Projection), or that with > excellent servitude, you can buy your way out of it. Plus you get all this > neat supernatural power (Compared to what you had before), and may be > considered to be granted Immortality, or Sorcery. Or that there is no > afterlife, and you'll just cease to exist anyway. Remember that the original supposition stipulated 'a uniquely honest demon'. So of course, the average demon isn't going to mention the downside, but if we've already established that this Demon speaketh true, then we've established that he *would* mention the downside. Mind you, I try to avoid honest demons. They don't have long to live or much to lose. :) Ben - ----- emrys@netrox.net ---------------- http://www.netrox.net/~emrys/ ------ "When I am working on a problem, I never think about beauty. I think only how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong." -- R. Buckminster Fuller - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- WhHi6G2>3 LCJRo hBrc+++g b69/83 B3^E1# a27+ sM1N10~ K8p k3BdSAbCehIOpRrTtxX QbEKLMRTtO v64s opLSO X6#7 w7T r6IsLM E+++ p9f7v4&g4s8 D36C(c*P*!# Hco+usFL7 - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 19:00:42 -0700 From: "Gerry Mckelvey" Subject: IN> career paths of the damned I wonder if undeath is the only way to remain immortal. isn't it possible that the other princes would at least try to come up with another alternative to offer potental recruits? Immortality (such as it is) would be a very powerful recruiting tool of saminga, and i'm sure that alot of princes wouldn't want to let him have all the fun on earth...eternity as a vampire or mummy wouldn't be the only thing out there....how about being some sort of shapeshifter? not immortal, but very powerful short term critter...just the thing for human servants of baal...and it might give them a shot at annoying a malakim long enough for a few demons to escape. Or, maybe just teaching a valuable soldier to switch souls with an unsuspecting mortal and escape death by 'body hopping'. eventually, he's gonna make a mistake and end up in hell, but you don't have to tell him that. Plus, they'd make great infiltrators...I'm not sure, but maybe Alchemey (sp?) could offer something like eternal youth but require a 'booster shot' once a century or something...and only demonic forces could offer the formula or that 'special sauce' as incentive to obey... just some thoughts on the subject... any comments? Jerry McKelvey Exitus Acta Probat. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 20:15:13 EDT From: SienarFLT@aol.com Subject: IN> Ascension-inspired Seed Well I thought it was about time I stopped lurking, OR making an occasional comment or disagreement, and actually contribute some ideas that I've had. Recently I picked up several issues of a comic called Ascension published by Top Cow, which started me noggin to tickin' away. Those of you who are into comics and haven't checked this out yet, I highly recommend it. Before I go into this I want to present a disclaimer: I have not read through "the Marches" completely, so some of what follows may severely contradict the material there (not that that's ever stopped me before); I also twist canon around on its ear to suit my gaming group's and campaign's needs, so those of you get queasy over the blatant disregard of canon may want to stop reading now, although I'm not sure how much of that I do in this particular instance. Lastly I make no claims that characters are ones that I have created; for that I give Top Cow all the credit. I'm only modifying some of it to fit my campaign. Here goes... Somewhere in the Border Marches exists another tower, a tower unlike Blandine's or Beleth's and yet strangely similar to them as well, in a domain known as the Dead Land. It is instead a tower of rock, encircled by a bottomless moat, and atop this tower sprawls a strange and twisted mansion, described by some as a gothic temple complex, by others as a writhing mausoleum. It used to be the home of Voivodul, Demon of the Killing Dream. He started out as a servant to Beleth, but his Word slowly got the attention, and later the aggrivation of Saminga. Saminga was slightly amused with the creative inspiration of people dying as a result of a dream (something which he probably never would have come up with himself), but when Voivodul found a way of trapping souls in the Dead Land (a part of the background I am still working on) instead of creating masses of corpses and not to mention "soul- fodder" in Hell, it raised the ire of not only Saminga, but Lucifer as well, and it did not take long for Asmodeus and his agents of the Game to send a raid into the Marches to drag Voivodul back to Hell for punishment. After refusing to volunteer her own servants in Asmodeus' hunt, Beleth seethingly conceded to stand back and not interfere as she had plans of her own. Voivodul proved to be stronger than anyone realized, having a cadre of servitors himself, not to mention the help of many of his trapped souls and ethereal spirits. However, in the end Asmodeus himself picked Voivodul apart Force by Force and scattered the demon across much of the Marches leaving one last force trapped within an "ethereal cage," as Beleth had called it, which was no larger than a snow-globe. She promised Asmodeus that she would place a guard over it, which he skeptically agreed to, but what she hadn't told him, was that the "cage" was actually the very small dreamscape of an infant human. She had not lied about her intentions of placing a guard over it though, nor had she lied about the fact that his last Force was indeed trapped within it. But she knew that as the human child grew (and subsequently the size of the dreamscape also), so would Voivodul, and sometime in the near future her servant would reemerge, hopefully a little more controllable. Since the dispersement of Voivodul's forces, his tower has been overrun by servant demons, ethereal spirits etc. Most claim to be keeping watch over the place until such time as Voivodul returns (they believe this even though Beleth has not uttered the merest breath of her true plans), others have agendas of their own and hope to fill the gap that Voivodul left. (okay, this is all well and good, but here's how I tie it into my campaign) Voivodul knew a secret though, a secret known only to a couple of ArchAngels: Yves, Eli, and then of course God himself. During the Creation, God had created a team of the first Angels to aid in the great project, and Eli created an artifact called the Adoil, sort of like a "creation bomb" or a catalyst to jump-start the whole creation process (think of the Genesis device from ST "the Wrath of Khan"). The great secret was that God was unsure whether or not this whole creation experiment would work and he had Eli make TWO. Eli used the first during the Creation, hiding the second to use in case a second Creation was needed to cancel out the first. As it turned out, less harsh measures were used and the Flood happened instead. Eli hid the second Adoil in the Far Marches, gave it its own domain protected by Ethereals and Angels who were given the isolated and lonely mission of protecting something no one had ever seen or heard about.... that is until Voivodul stumbled upon it. At first Voivodul wasn't sure what he had found, although he knew it must have been of great importance to have its own domain floating in the Far Marches and having its own army of celestials keeping watch. He kept hidden, returned to his tower and didn't think much about it. Then, through the grapevine, a rumor spread that Eli had exiled himself to Earth for unknown reasons, and Voivodul thought back to another event when he spied Eli and then Yves making a couple of different trips deep into the Marches (to make doubly sure that the second Adoil was safe). "It might be best that even *you* forget about the existence of this." Yves warned. Before he was able to put the information to use Voivodul was called back to his tower. A warning had sounded that Asmodeus and his minions were on the attack. Voivodul made the best of a desperate fight but fell in the end. Hoookay. Yes, there are some plot elements that might be questioned like why would Eli decide to hide something like this deep in the Marches anyway? Eli fits into my campaign in a BIG way, and I had to come up with some explanation for his self exile, and this just all seemed to fit together in an odd way. I really have only used a small part of the Ascension story, and there's lots more that could be used in a variety of ways. Hope you enjoyed! -- Thom Dawson (reply to SienarFLT@aol.com) "...one man's mundane and desperate existence is another man's Technicolor." -- from the movie Strange Days. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 17:17:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Graveyard Greg Subject: Re: IN> career paths of the damned - ---Gerry Mckelvey wrote: > > I wonder if undeath is the only way to remain immortal. isn't it possible > that the other princes would at least try to come up with another > alternative to offer potental recruits Well, Cain, the First Murderer, is an immortal due to the curse God put on him, and he's a Wild Card in the In Nomine universe... Huh? What's that? You say Cain isn't in the IN universe? Heh heh heh...He is NOW! :) Graveyard Greg, Malakite of Creation _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 20:34:39 EDT From: SienarFLT@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> career paths of the damned In a message dated 98-06-07 20:23:47 EDT, you write: > Well, Cain, the First Murderer, is an immortal due to the curse God > put on him, and he's a Wild Card in the In Nomine universe... > > Huh? What's that? You say Cain isn't in the IN universe? > > Heh heh heh...He is NOW! :) > > Graveyard Greg, Malakite of Creation Oh, come one. You should know better by now not to tease us with that kind of remark :-) What's your idea? -- Thom D. (reply to SienarFLT@aol.com) "Men rarely (if ever) manage to dream up a god Superior to themselves. Most gods have the Manners and morals of a spoiled child." -- Lazarus Long. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 01:01:58 +0100 From: Julian Breen Subject: Essence Reserves (was Re: IN> Word Forces, was Re: IN> Placing credit) [Walter:] >For my own games, I've been treating Superiors as though they were all >6/6/6 Forces, plus *big* Essence reserves, such that they seem capable >of pretty much anything in a single encounter. But their reserves *are* >finite, which is one reason they need Servitors -- if they tried to do >everything themselves, they *could* run low on Essence. The concept that Superiors are all-powerful and untouchable by lesser beings has always bugged me. It is the sheer size of their essence caches, really, and their skillful use of them, that makes Superiors, effectively what they are. Yet the supply is indeed finite. A carefully staged plan, perhaps as part of a strategic move in the war, *could* succeed in overthrowing a Superior, in my opinion. Even if executed by 'minor' celestials. (Note that I do not think that this is highly likely, nor do I advocate power-gaming along these lines. What I *am* saying is that I see it as a possibility. It is not a case of players only finding enjoyment in a game from stomping the Big Guns or feeling that the only way that they can influence the campaign is by managing to do so. What it *is* about, is in game developments that might bring the characters to this situation, possibly in a climactic finale.) I wonder if you have any guidelines for approximate reserve levels of major/minor Word holders? I presume that this is something that you'll be incorporating into Tethers, though. > I also >postulate that they recharge much faster than regular celestials -- at >the moment I am working this into my proposed Tether canon, but I don't >know if this will fly. > If by chance it doesn't, Walter, then will you be posting this? - -- Julian jules@bigjules.demon.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 22:51:05 +0100 From: Julian Breen Subject: Re: Word Forces (was Re: IN> Placing credit) Pee Kitty... >I do agree with this 100%. But unless you dictate how ALL chracter points >must be spent, some PCs are going to buy up their Forces as fast as they >can. This hasn't been a problem yet in my game, but afew a few months, >most of the PCs *have* gained a Force...what will keep happening >eventually is that they'll all have 18 Forces and then what? > Hmmm. Can't tell if you're being serious... If you are, then howabout retiring them? Start a new campaign or move in a new direction (higher power level). Or, maybe the 18 forcers become patrons (Word-bound or not), for a new generation of PCs? A lot of this might be dependent on your style of game anyway. If its the sort of campaign that's working toward a definite objective, e.g. Armageddon, then you may reach the campaign end before the PCs become too unmanageable anyway. - -- Julian jules@bigjules.demon.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 02:06:08 +0100 From: Julian Breen Subject: IN> Dread Cthulhu Gerry Mckelvey wrote on 2nd June >I have a question about the the marches...if I read the source book right, >then just about >anything that mankind has ever dreamed of is *somewhere* in the >marches...not just the good things but the bad things too...if they have >the essence, then they can cross into earth. could pseudo-demons or devils >form from the collective unconscious of the marches? by that, I mean could >archtypical 'things from beyond' gain a foothold on earth and become a >threat to both sides in the War? >Just a thought on a 'mixed' campaign...I'm trying to get as much use out of >my Call of Cthuluthu books as I can... > >Any suggestions or thoughts on that are very welcome.. > What if Cthulhu is *not* an ethereal being but something much, much worse... Rahab, or Leviathan? This would fit a very grim, dark IN, which is kind of required when including Cthulhu within your game. Maybe he is imprisoned within the Far Marches or even Limbo? When those old stars are right, it is *he* whom will herald armageddon... Of course, your rationalisation of God would need to change from the IN standard. He has no place in a Lovecraftian universe so you could alter Him as you see fit. Maybe He didn't create the universe? Maybe He's a mad god Himself, and we, like the angels, are the products of His genetic engineering? Maybe He truly has deserted us now? Perhaps He's dead? Do the angels know this? Some may have figured it out. The Lightbringer did...What to do? Many would no doubt still be loyal to God (may firmly believe that He'll return) yet others..? Maybe His absence causes Gabe's instability? Torn between burning with divine fire, and yet listening to Lucifer's reasoning that the only chance that they stand is to rally under one banner (his, naturally). etc, etc. There would be *alot* of work to do but it would no doubt be very rewarding, and a sure-fire way to get mileage out of your CoC books. (Actually, this whole idea is somewhat similar to the background of the Armageddon (tm) game, where both the Heavenly *and* Infernal Host are united against a common threat. You might take a look at it for inspiration.) Just a few thoughts, anyhow. I hope that they fester in deranged minds. :P - -- Julian jules@bigjules.demon.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 21:13:24 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) From: "Emily K. Dresner" Subject: IN> Character Sketch Em says: This is basically a character sketch, based on a character that I envisioned in a hallucinatory daze on an airplane to England at 4 am. He's clearly not a starting character. He's also not a: A) Worded Character B) Generic drop in NPC in a campaign C) For the INC. (Which is, I ain't putting it there.) He's an antagonist for a set of stories I'm sort of working on loosely in some spare time. There is a companion character to him, the Drifter, a Mercurian of Stone, but he hasn't been written yet. The only reason I'm submitting this to the List is because none of the included text will be appearing in any stories I write, it was just to get the cantor of the voice down. It was sitting on my desktop, so I figured, what the hell. Oh, BTW, all of my ideas come from something Walter said a while back, about Armageddon and a mechanic out in Omaha. That's pretty much all I'm going to say on the subject of plot. ********************************************************************** The Preacher Man Habbalite Knight of Fate Corporeal: 4 Strength: 7 Agility: 9 Ethereal: 4 Intelligence: 6 Precision: 10 Celestial: 5 Perception: 8 Will: 12 Vessel: Human/3 Skills: Ranged Weapon (S&W 586 Revolver .38 Special)/2, Fighting/1, Detect Lies/1, Dodge/2, Emote/1, Lying/1, Survival/1 Songs: Charm (Ethereal/3, Celestial/3), Entropy (Corporeal/4, Ethereal/3, Celestial/3), Healing (Corporeal/3) Attunements: Habbalah of Fate, Impudite of Fate, Fated Future, Knight of the Winged Chariot The Preacher Man walks down the dusty in his run down heels, black leather over coat flapping in the wind, the flat brimmed hat pulled down low over his eyes. Slung low around his waist is a leather holster, in which sits a side-loaded S&W 586 Revolver. In his hand he carries a Bible, in which to communicate God's Work. He walks the back roads of America's Dust Bowl, bringing with him penance and the Word. ************************************************************************** Em says, "What I imagined the best was the gun. It had to a be a swing out revolver which would take 6 bullet speed-loads. There's just something menacing about a S&W .38 Special, hanging low on a hip. After that was the run down heels of the cowboy boots, covered with dust and walking along the road between the fields of corn." *************************************************************************** The Preacher Man came to Salvation, South Dakota. He passed by Joe's Donut and Video Shop, its sign hanging cockeyed on one broken peg and flapping in the dull breeze. He passed by Maria's Mexican Resturant, loudly proclaiming the best enchiladas in town in tawdry neon fliers in the window. He passed by the Sunoco, the smell of gasoline and the sounds of Johnny Cash wafting in the air. Old Johnny was just needin' a pickup truck and some lovin' from his woman. He passed by the Salvation General Feed Store, with the bags of grain lying open and half spilt on the front porch, the kernels spread like a puddle of grease on the bleached wooden slats. He passed the rows upon rows of flashing aluminum trailer homes, insides baking like the center of a potato under the hot sun. He passed them all on by. The Preacher Man reached out his hand and pushed aside the door of the 1st Congregationalist Church, letting the door glide open on its own hinges. He took two steps into the gloom, his eyes fixating on the figure before him. He licked his lips, and grinned. Salvation had come to Salvation. "There ain't no God here, prayerboy," the Preacher Man said. "I gone lookin' for it. He stopped about fifty miles back, I reckon, up along the interstate." The minister stopped, frozen, standing at the doorway of his office. He blinked, trying to comprehend what had just been said to him. He didn't. "Excuse me?" "This place is God forsaken," the Preacher Man said, drawing out each syllable of the final word, making them sound individual and equally important. "Only the Devil is gonna come on home to Salvation. You done gone and run Him out of town, prayerboy. You showed him the door. You, lettin' people get away with their tv and their sex and their MTV voted politicians and forgettin' what is important, not tellin' 'em what they should be doin'. That's a damn shame, son. The Devil's here, and he's taken up root. He's everywhere." The Preacher Man suddenly smiled, a grin that showed far too much yellowed teeth and bright pink gum for comfort. "But I'll bring Him on back, I will. Yessir, I will. I know all about God." The minister felt a sudden and tremendous fear. His knees began to shake, and he fiddled with his shirt cuffs with an unconscious nervous twitch. "Now, look here..." he said, trying to explain. The Preacher Man walked up the aisle between the pews, his run down bootheels making soft clicking noises on the tiled floor. His duster swung side to side, swishing across the back of his calves. "There ain't no God here, anymore then there was God with Jesus when Jesus hung on the cross alone and the buzzards poked at his eyes. But don't you worry, I'm gonna bring God back to Salvation, and I'm gonna start here with you, prayerboy." "I, um..." The minister was swept up in a feeling of fear and loathing, loathing for himself, loathing for everything around him. He was sickened by what he was, whatever that could be. He did the only thing he knew to do at that moment. He held up a Bible, hoping to ward off the stranger. "I've got the Lord right here." The Preacher Man laughed, long and low. "Ain't gonna work, prayerboy. You've read too many of them dime store paperbacks instead of payin' attention to that which you got in your hand. Why dontcha get down on your knees and pray, prayerboy. Pray to that Devil who you've gone and let into Salvation. Why dontcha do that for me right now?" The minister put the book back down, slowly, ever so slowly. And then, beneath the withering stare of the Preacher Man, he got on his knees. The Preacher Man walked so that he was hovering over the minister, his long, tall shadow falling over the cowering man on the floor. He spoke low, in a menacing whsiper. "I know what you've been doin', prayerboy. I know all about you and you goin' behind the back of your darlin' wife who's given you two fine sons with that whore girl on your desk back there. I know all about you starin' and thinkin' about them MacGregor boys, and I must say those have been some mighty sinful thoughts, if I say so myself. You're a bad man, prayerboy. You let the Devil into your life, and then out to the people of Salvation. You're supposed to lead them to the promised land, prayerboy. So you better be prayin' down there, you better be hopin' that I can let God see past what you've done, and save all these other good people." The minister was shocked and sickened. He nodded, on his knees, a sweaty forelock of hair falling across his temple and into one eye. "You need to be punished, prayerboy." The Preacher Man pushed back his duster, to reveal the S&W .38 sitting on his hip. "You need to confess your sins to the Lord." The minister was still nodding. "God is cruel, prayerboy," The Preacher Man said in a lecturing tone. "Sometimes you can't sugar coat it. Oh, I know you gone and try, but you can't. God, see, He's like a teacher. He's gotta teach, and sometimes He's gotta do that the hard way, or you never learn. You know what the Good Book says, prayerboy. The Good Book says sparin' the rod spoils the child. And you've done some pretty good spoilin' if I do say so myself. But I can't do that. I gotta do God's work. I gotta do what God says to do, and that means teachin' you." The minister was starting to blubber on about his sins, down on his knees, confessing his tryst with Mary Lou Rettinburg to the cold tile floor. The Preacher Man shook his head sadly, and pulled the .38 from his hip, and examined it with interest. "That ain't good enough, prayerboy. You don't sound particularly sincere." The minister's head shot up, and his eyes went wide. He fixated on the gun, and gave a low, soft moan. "Oh please. Oh please don't kill me. I have kids. I have a wife..." "And where were you when you were betrayin' 'em, prayerboy?" the Preacher Man said, as he looked down at the cowering man with detacted interest. "Where were they then? Where were they when you were thinkin' them lustful thoughts about those two boys? It ain't gonna help you, prayerboy. You done gone sold yourself to Satan." "Don't kill me. I'll make it up to God. I'll make it up to them. Oh, please, no..." The Preacher Man said, as he pointed the .38, "It's a little too late for that, prayerboy. The Devil's already here. There's only one way to remove him, and I gotta start with you." The minister prayed and grovelled, but in the end, it didn't do him any good. It was too late for this man to make it up to God. He'd done too much sinning, it was time to send him on hom. At least, thought the Preacher Man, the tiles wouldn't be hard to clean. The Preacher Man walked up to the podium, and set down his gun. Oh, yes sir, he would clean the Devil from Salvation. He would bring in the Lord. They would all see the light, every one of them. Even if he had to kill them all. ********************************************************************** Em says, "Killing the priest is not very satisfying, granted. What would be more satisfying is if the Preacher Man got the priest to kill the girl he slept with, which would be the more natural direction to take a longer tale. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 23:12:22 +0900 From: Simon Hailes Subject: Re: IN> A soldier of Hell's choice After all this discussion on how a human chooses the path of Hell I thought it a lovely point for a little fictional example.... It was yet another cold and windy Chicago night, no rain but it was right and well threatening, most on the street had come un to shelter of some sort, and business for the seedy continued as usual. Now one of these working girl, a teenage prostitute earning her living through performing all means of sordid acts for cold hard cash, she was a special for her pimp, she would do just about anything with just about anyone, and so was in high demand. Tonight she stood near a trash can fire, all guadily done up, watching those around her, and the passers-by with hungry eagerness, she wished to be away from these streets, and in a nice hotel room, which was the kind of place her customers usually took her. And now came one of her regualars, Tessa, looking kind and aloof, with a strength that Caitlin had always admired, and good looks she had always desired. Tessa stopped in front of her and smiled. "Hello Caitlin," she said simply. "Hello, looking for a little company on this cold night?" "Something like that," Tessa muttered, then dragged Caitlin away, away from the leering bums, the hostile drug pushers, the watchful pimps, away from the Chicagos underside amd up to Tessa's residence, a luxurious house that fit in perfectly in the ritzy neighbourhood it inhabited. They went in. Demetrious was as usual keeping his silent guard, because Tessa was involved in things which endangered her life, this much Caitlin knew. He gave Caitlin non-spoken acknowledgment then turned back to his duties, every now and then shattering a pop-stick he held in his hands. "Well-" Tessa cut her off "You are ready me thinks for what I am going to tell you," Caitlin looked up in surprise, wondering what this could mean. "I'm a demon, Demetrious is a demon, and we are fighting a costly War against Heaven," Caitlin was dumbfounded, confused, shocked, disbelieving yet believing at the same time. "Costly in that we are losing soldiers all the time, we need new ones, and you unlike s many others already have the potential," "The potenital?" "The extra pazaz which will make all the difference-" "But you seve Hell right?" "In the War against tyrannical Heaven," Caitlin had no reply for this, yet she knew she had a choice, on one side was lovely Tessa and her lovely home and no need for further prostitution, no need fear, on the other side was the stark street and her demeaning occupation, she came to her conclusion rather quickly, and would never quite regret it. Simon, Demon Prince of Pearls ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 05:41:00 +0100 From: Jo Hart Subject: Re: IN> Career Paths for Diabloic Servants At 17:16 07/06/98 -0400, you wrote: > > > Remember that the original supposition stipulated 'a uniquely >honest demon'. So of course, the average demon isn't going to mention the >downside, but if we've already established that this Demon speaketh true, >then we've established that he *would* mention the downside. > So is the uniquely honest demon going to mention that there is a reasonable chance that the undeath ritual will go wrong and the recipient will end up spending forever as a Zombie? ;) jo "Whatever was required to be done, the Circumlocution Office was before hand with all the public departments in the art of perceiving HOW NOT TO DO IT." -- Dickens (Little Dorrit) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:02:21 From: Peter Frederick Subject: Re: IN> Career Paths for Diabloic Servants >> Remember that the original supposition stipulated 'a uniquely >>honest demon'. So of course, the average demon isn't going to mention the >>downside, but if we've already established that this Demon speaketh true, >>then we've established that he *would* mention the downside. >> > >So is the uniquely honest demon going to mention that there is a reasonable >chance that the undeath ritual will go wrong and the recipient will end up >spending forever as a Zombie? ;) Sure, but is that worse than spending the rest of forever the bottom of a pecking order of sadistic and largely bored Supernatural beings in the Afterlife? Reply to peterf@wr.com.au May the Goddess shelter you in the palm of her hand until we meet again. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:10:22 From: Peter Frederick Subject: IN> Communist Manifesto (was Re: IN> Re: IN- Plot device) >> >> Oh BTW, Happy 150th aniversry of the Communist Manifesto. >> >> Regards, Peter. >> > >> >You're celebrating the anniversary of one of the most self-destructive >> >philosophies ever to come out of a drunken stupor? >> >> Have you read it, before you condemn it? >> jo >yep. Know you're enemy...economics written by a man who never worked a day >in his life...facinating system, but Carl got alot of people thinking about >a bad idea. Then they got to killing about 6 or 7 million folks in >russia..not to mention the enviro damage! I think it'd make a great In >Nomine plot line (or historical point...). It's got self delusion, >arrogance, rejection of any moral structure...Machevelli would've been >proud. All in the name of 'the people'....heh. Lucifier would laugh his >self silly.... >more honest thieves just kill thier victims and don't bother with preaching >at them before buring them in that unmarked grave in the Ukraine... >Jerry McKelvey >Exitus Acta Probat. All the more reason to remember it. I prefer to think of it as a prime example of Hell coming from Good Intentions. I doubt many prophets would recognise the results of their followers and a large number of them would probably be regarded as heretics if they returned. But as the song says You're only as Good as your Fans. Thanking you for your indulgence. Regards, Peter. Reply to peterf@wr.com.au May the Goddess shelter you in the palm of her hand until we meet again. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:55:32 From: Peter Frederick Subject: IN> World News Dear List saw this is a new age magazine I buy occassionally. It's always good for a bit of a bit of a chuckle and sometimes has things that may fair, but odd plot seeds. The following short piece screams IN meets the Twilight Zone to me. If you would like to see more of their mix of conspiracies, new age-ism, ET theories and odd ball technology surf over to http://www.peg.apc.org/~nexus/ Hope someone getes inspired. Regards, Peter ***** Vatican Interest in Extraterrestrial Contact Monsignor Carrado Balducci, a Vatican Theologian and insider close to the Pope has five times in recent months appeared on Italian national television to proclaim that extraterrestrial contact is a real phenomenon. The prelate announced that the Vatican is receiving much information about ET’s and their contacts with humans from it’s nuncios (papal ambassadors) in various countries such as Chile, Mexico and Venezuela. Monsignor Balducci said that he is on a Vatican commission looking into ET encounters and how to cope with the emerging general awareness of the reality of ET contact. Balducci provided the Catholic Church’s analysis of ET’s emphasizing the ET encounters “are not demonic, they are not due to psychological impairment, they are not a case of entity attachment, but these encounters deserve to be studied carefully.” Since Monsignor Balducci is a Vatican expert exorcist, and since the Catholic Church has historically demonised many new phenomena that are poorly understood, his proclaiming the Vatican’s non-censure of these encounters is all the more remarkable. Balducci revealed to a visiting American clinical professional from the Academy of Clinical Close Encounters Therapists that the Vatican is closely following this phenomenon. Parallel information from MJ-12 scientist Dr Michael Wolf suggests that the Vatican is concerned that it will have a major doctrinal updating on it’s hands when ET contact becomes authoritatively announced by world governments over the next several years. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:10:19 +0100 From: "Hart, Joanna" Subject: RE: IN> IN Campaign Seed: The Third Avatar Robert Addy wrote: >But what if, instead of Lilith being the third avatar, she has the *potential* >to be the third avatar? Or _had_ the potential ;) Maybe when the prophecy was made she really was intended to be the mythical third avatar but she blew it and chose 'freedom' instead. So maybe the actual avatar is mankind in general or some specific descendent of Adam & Eve in particular, and Lilith met with her fate to become an evolutionary dead-end, together with all her offspring! She has all the power associated with a DP but the one thing she really can't do is go back and make that choice again... *hides* jo. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 10:23:22 +0100 From: "Hart, Joanna" Subject: IN> Word Forces (longish) Walter Milliken wrote: >I mostly want Word Forces to help explain various aspects of the IN >universe that are already canon, but don't have any clear mechanism >behind them. This includes issues like "why are Superiors so powerful?" >(they have lots of Word Forces, and thus lots of Essence to play with) >and "why is promoting your Word important?" (for demons especially -- >with Word Forces, it's obvious that's the way to increase your personal >power). Well, that sounds fair enough and I don't have any arguments with it ;) I do have some spam though... These are just some thoughts I had. I'm not entirely convinced the Word forces are necessary but I don't have a problem with invisible cp-eating mechanics ;-) I don't think I need them but maybe some people do. Problems a new rule is going to have to deal with: 1. Some words are inherently more powerful than others. Whichever way you split it, and however much cp a character sinks into forces, 'Compassion' is always going to be a more powerful word than 'Accidentally Crossed Telephone Lines.' People write award winning books and plays about compassion -- I don't think people get inspired to write much except farces, sit-coms and rude letters to the phone company about crossed lines. 2. Power associated with a word may fluctuate in a way independent of cp expenditure. Telecomms technology has improved enough that people just don't routinely get crossed lines any more. Compassion wasn't really the word of the '80s either. Things come in and out of fashion. 3. Personality Shifts. There are some aspects to being word-bound that a mechanic just can't cover IMO. Taking on a word involves surrendering some of yourself and immersing in the Word. 4. What if the word has a matching holder amongst the 'opposition'? - -- (My thoughts on the above) 1. Any given word will have a maximum number of word forces which it can provide to its holder. One of Lucifer's little joke words just doesn't have the same potential as the more severely contested concept-words given out by the seraphim council. It doesn't matter how many cp someone has to spend, if their word cannot provide more word forces then they simply can't buy them. See step 3, below. 2. A newly worded celestial will have to work its way up to fulfilling the maximum potential held in it's word. This is why people like the demon of strippers (NM) are so vulnerable. Newly worded, with a high-potential word, and not yet enough time to really consolidate and become the word. It is a good time for enemy action -- the new wordbound is not yet really on top of things. The ratio between the number of word forces the word-bound actually _has_ and the number which its word can support is one measure of how completely they have become their word. It is debatable whether superiors and ancient word-bound celestials have any of their original personality left at all, or whether their word would have moulded any other holder into exactly the same as they have now become. Sometimes words become spontaneously more or less powerful, due to mortal activity. When this happens, the maximum potential of the word can change. If it decreases and the word-bound had reached that maximum, then the word-bound loses an appropriate amount of word forces and also the equivalent percentage of _all_ other forces too. So if the divine word of War drooped a bit in the 60s during the flower-power era and Michael lost a word-force, from his maximum of (lets say) 200, then he also lost 1/200 of all other forces -- a pinprick, but not unbearable. If, however, telephones just continue to get more and more reliable and the old(ish) demon of accidentally crossed phone lines finds that its maximum word forces have just dropped from 2 to 1, then it will also lose half of it's corporeal, ethereal and celestial forces alongside. Ouch! ie. celestials whose words completely fade away _will_ be discorporated. If it had been newly worded and only had one word force to start with, then the maximum will have changed but the demon will not actually lose anything from it. That's the drawback of really becoming your word. When it hurts, then so do you. If you hadn't put as much effort into immersing your own personality, then you are more able to withstand sweeping word-changes. 3. Word potentials can be increased by concerted work on earth, usually by the word-bound as that is the celestial which has the most at stake. If you work hard enough and for long enough, you can increase the maximum potential of your word. This is what most word-bound would like to spend their time doing. This is also why it is good for heaven and hell to give out plenty of words -- it guarantees that there are celestials out there who are really working away to increase the influence of heaven (or hell) over earth in very specific ways. Unfortunately, once a celestial is word-bound, it is sometimes difficult for them to think as flexibly as they used to do. Everything they do, see and think is coloured by their word. It might be a good idea for a superior to give a word-bound some help from non-wordbound servitors. They can see ways to help which the word-bound would have missed. Maybe Eli made a practice of lending his servitors out like this _way_ before he ever decided to go walkabout. (That might be a fun assignment for non-wordbound PCs in a mixed group). 4. Words can be subsumed or in conflict. Some words are very obviously aligned with 'larger' words, in which case it is likely that the new wordbound was already working very closely with its associated celestial. Its also possible for one word to subsume another and completely take over its function, which subtracts from the potential of the old word and adds to the potential of the new word. Deliberate take-over bids like this might be not uncommon amongst demons. Angels are more likely to come to some sort of working arrangement, but if one of them is unusually ambitious, then who knows? 5. Words can be split between heaven and hell. Any given word has a set maximum number of word forces which it can resource. If an angel and a demon both hold the same word, then they are fighting over the same pool of potential. If one of the holders does a lot of work to increase the word's maximum, then unless they are quick to capitalise on this, their opponent may be able to jump in and 'steal' their gains. A word like this will have an infernal side and a divine side which are very well understood by the holders. If all of the potential forces are actually used, then the demon can undermine some of the divine side; their opponent may lose word forces if they succeed (which they can try to move in and pick up) -- but it will have to be done carefully because if the demon accidentally undermines some of the infernal side as well, it will also be hurt. 6. (This is the tricky one ;) ). The power of some words can vary geographically/ thematically. Some buildings, events, cities, or areas just happen to be particularly harmonious with some words, or particularly disharmonious with others (a tether is maybe the ultimate expression of this, but doesn't need to be). If the word-bound goes to one of these places, then their temporary maximum word forces may increase or decrease for the duration, along with an equal proportion of other forces. This can mean that even a fairly weak word-bound can be massively powerful if it can be at exactly the right place at the right time, and that maybe even a superior can be severely weakened under the right circumstances. Word-bound are more delicate than normal celestials in some ways, more sensitive to how powerful their word is in some places, so they need to be more careful. It also means that even a powerful word-bound needs to be cautious about meeting another word-bound celestial on its 'home turf.' A superior is unlikely to need to worry too much about this, their words are all fairly universal but still... but still... eg. The angel of roses goes to the Chelsea Flower Show to see some new roses which have been bred and exhibited, an annual event which lasts for 2 weeks and is one of the high-points for the world's horticultural population. Her power _doubles_ whilst she is in the roses section there. If she then takes a trip to a nuclear wasteland, her power may halve. ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #813 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.