From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Sat Sep 12 19:47:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA22309 for ; Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:47:05 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) id TAA23920 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:31:38 -0500 Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:31:38 -0500 Message-Id: <199809130031.TAA23920@lists.io.com> X-Authentication-Warning: lists.io.com: majordom set sender to owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com using -f From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #944 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Saturday, September 12 1998 Volume 01 : Number 944 In this digest: IN> Seraphim Shapings Re: IN> Seraphim Shapings IN> FotM - In Defense IN> In Nomine Club IN> Millenium IN> AWOL Eli (was Re:IN> Archangel of Death) IN> Song of Healing? IN> Manna IN> Adam and eve Re: IN> Re: IN- Archangel of Death IN> Lying ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:05:05 PDT From: "Steve Marco" Subject: IN> Seraphim Shapings Dear Sirs, Could you please explain to me why the Seraphim look like a feathered many-eyed dragon, and where that dragon is from? In references in the Bible, they resemble a six winged human. Thank You, Steve Marco ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 15:23:16 -0500 From: Earl Wajenberg Subject: Re: IN> Seraphim Shapings Steve Marco wrote: > Dear Sirs, > Could you please explain to me why the Seraphim look like a > feathered many-eyed dragon, and where that dragon is from? In > references in the Bible, they resemble a six winged human. It is based on a speculation about the origin of the word "seraph." It resembles the Hebrew word for "prince" but it also resembles the Hebrew word for "firey serpent." In medieval art, they kept the "firey" aspect but dropped the "serpent." Seraphim were often depicted robed in red, and spoken of in poetry in terms of flames and burning love. I think it would be nice if In Nomine seraphim lined up better with the fragmentary description in Isaiah. I would give them six wings, and hands and feet. The end result would look something like a Chinese dragon. Earl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:58:48 -0400 From: Andrew Frades Subject: IN> FotM - In Defense Though I picked up FotM a week or so back I have not had a great deal of free time to read it until the past few days. It is with that statement that I contribute a few lines in its defense. I found the writeups of Lilith and David to be on par with those of any of the other Superiors. Particularly David (no offense to resident Archangels ;)) as I have a Malakim of David IMC. Much of the David writeup included information that I had already thought about but some of it was wonderful in its unexpectedness (Geomancy, feeling dumb for not thinking of it). The bright Lilim stuff was wonderful as (no surprise here) I have a bright Lilim of Flowers NPC in my game. The expansions and details fit in nicely with some of the stuff I have planned for little Corinth, thanks Beth. LA seems to be fairly consistant as a fictional setting and has more that a passing similarity to he real life LA. As I don't live there this is all I can say. AS far as the adventures go... There needed to be soemthing extra, but there is more than enough information in place in the book to work with. As far as some of the detractors have said to it being implausible or unlikely, well that is their opinion and they are entitled to it. IMC my Malakim of Stone will likely have a few blue book sessions (kind of like a character journal) where he meets Max at some previous time (when he wasn't Discordant). It might make the impact of the Fall all the more dramatic, we'll see. All in all it was worth the price of admission and is not a bad little suppliment without Final Trumpet, though I look forward to seeing FT in the near future. Peace, Andrew ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:53:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Graveyard Greg Subject: IN> In Nomine Club I posted this a long time ago, but guess what? I messed up the addy (d'oh!)! Anyway, here we go.... I made up a club for In Nomine on Yahoo! and the address is: http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/innomine (and I'm sure the addy is right this time!) All are invited, so stop by, and we'll chat. See you soon! Graveyard Greg _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:32:43 -0700 From: Gryph Clarke Subject: IN> Millenium For anyone who might care.... The Millenium being played on Fox this evening should be the one titled "Somehow, Satan Got Behind Me", if their Website's schedule is accurate. This is the show about four demons who get together to gossip and commiserate about their time with humanity. I watched it the first time it aired, and it's a great episode. Definately very In Nomine and worth a look, if you've got an hour. I'm not sure how many of you already watch the show, but I figured I'd let you all know that this particular episode was on so that if you don't, you could choose to take a gander at one on a subject that might interest you. Enjoy. :) - - Gryph ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 00:38:40 +0100 From: Julian Breen Subject: IN> AWOL Eli (was Re:IN> Archangel of Death) FotM SPOILER!!! >>Speaking of Eli, is there any canon on how long ago he left heaven? I thought >>I remembered there was, but haven't been able to find it. > >I believe his writeup in the core rules implies that he started giving >up his Servitors within the last century, but I don't think there's any >specific date for when he was last in Heaven/at Council. > >I've been assuming about 1950 or so for my game; most of the Servitors >of Eli I have in my game are about a century old or more. > In FotM it specifically mentions 1948 (in the write-up of the Watts Towers tether). - -- Julian ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 01:33:45 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Song of Healing? >>>I know this was discussed a bit in the development of the Songbook (Liber Cantorum). I don't recall if the clarification made it in or not. David?<<< Per the Liber Canticorum, a CD of 6 with the Song of Healing will heal a point of characteristic loss. Diseases can be cured _if_ all underlying damage (e.g. lost characteristics and Body hits) is healed. So while the Corporeal Song of Healing can heal cancer or AIDs, it won't necessarily do so with a single performance. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 01:33:40 -0400 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Manna Manna will also make an appearance in the Liber Canticorum (there's a Song that creates it). - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 08:41:27 PDT From: "Martin Arnold" Subject: IN> Adam and eve Hello everyone! Ok, i have an idea for a campaign, but what i need is some resolution regarding one of the basic plots. so i present the following idea to you in the hope that i can get some positive feedback and suggestions. so, thanking you in advance. Here we go; it concerns a young man named Adam. "In the beginning, well a little bit later on actually, Eve ate of the Tree of Knowledge. This awakened her to the true nature of existence. (in my game, it was Lucifer who tempted Eve after Lilith helped him get into the Garden, but that's another story!) As a result of her transgression she became mortal - bound to a finite, weary existence of hard work and toil. Now Adam never actually partook of the Forbidden Fruit, dsptire eve's hearty recomendations; thus he remained immortal - the state God had intended for his new children (something more akin to the angelic existence). He watched eve die; it was his punishment (God felt that Adam was respeonsible for his wife's behaviour - he's old fashioned like that), doomed to live as a 'perfect man' to remind him of eve's sins - and of what humanity may one day become. thus he still exists, living out a reclusive existence, with few allies (most notably a Grigori named Semjaza). No one knows he still exists and as far as God is concerned, is content to allow Adam's continued existence. God knows what the Archangels would make of this (Yves of course knows, but he's content alos to let Adam live his life as he sees fit - he's no troublemaker)..." Then i thought: "Maybe Adam DID eat the fruit and condemn himself to die at the end of his mortal existence. However, he spent the rest of his life searching for a way to reverse the process - away from the scrutiny of God's angels (and Hell's demons, see below). In this he succeeded, but it was too late for Eve, now he lives as an immortal, patron of huamnity who are in effect his own flesh and blood." This is more problematic because im sure God would have something to say about this. tha main difficulty i have is having adam get away with things without Divine forces knowing. As far a im concerned i am content to let Lucifer remain relatvivel ignorant, this will change during the gamne. The most imprtant thing is that Adam is steadfastly neutral at the moment and very reclusive (much like the Grigori IMHO). Well there it is! Whaddya think! Marnie ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 15:30:06 +0100 From: Roland Ward Subject: Re: IN> Re: IN- Archangel of Death Brandon Quina wrote: > Bartholomew Hammerly wrote: > > > > > Ive considered giving the 'Word of Death' to one of Yves(how do you > > > make Yves plural) > Well not that I've done much reading up recently, but I seem to remember the Angel of Death appearing in Vengance sort of a situation - eg not letting Moses leave Egypt etc. Maybe Gabriel fits the bill ? And I asked before but what about Azriel? Can't remember what function he/she performed, but I know a lot of black cats named Azriel. Roland ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 20:33:11 -0400 From: "James H. Foreman" Subject: IN> Lying I'm not a member of the mailing list, so if someone could reply to me directly, I'd appreciate it. My question regards lying. Can angels do it? Seraphs, I know, can't (even slightly), but what about the others? I remember reading somewhere that the heavenly language is incapable of communicating falsehoods. If that's true, then wouldn't angels have a hell of a time dealing with it? It's a subject I've not seen dealt with much at all in the six books I own (all of them except Night Music and the Marches). I have only recently begun running an In Nomine campaign (after running a home-grown angels campaign for a while), and at first I punished my players with Dissonance if they lied. That seemed too harsh, so I simply said that they were incapable of it, and when they tried to lie (accidentally, of course) I made them recant. It just seems to me that lying is a tool of the Infernals (isn't misleading a person or people a hallmark of Diabolical machinations? It would seem to me that angels don't lie simply for that reason). Certainly, lying to save someone's life, or "little white lies" won't tip the Symphonic balance toward Hell, but isn't God in the details? Thanks, Jim Foreman ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #944 ******************************* The material here is (C) 1997 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.