From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Tue Oct 19 22:40:40 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA13864 for ; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:40:40 -0500 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id WAA10296 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:38:48 -0500 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:38:48 -0500 Message-Id: <199910200338.WAA10296@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1367 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Tuesday, October 19 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1367 In this digest: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> Roles and Songs of Fruitation Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> Furfur's Word Re: IN> Drive Skill Re: IN> Furfur's Word Re: IN> Furfur's Word Re: IN> Drive Skill Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> no dinero IN> Calabim and Nukes (Re: Roles and Songs of Fruitation) Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> Drive Skill Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> A question. IN> Another question. Re: IN> A question. Re: IN> Another question. Re: IN> Another question. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:31:06 -0500 (CDT) From: paranial@creighton.edu Subject: IN> A question. A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? Bradley Paranial, Mercurian Vassal of War. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 18:46:01 -0500 From: Kris Overstreet Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 10:31 PM 10/18/99 -0500, you wrote: > >A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of >control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? > Yes. Accident or not, intentional or not, Mercurians -CANNOT- harm humans or they take Dissonance. Redneck Kris Overstreet, too many websites.... http://www.detnet.com/redneck/ - Personal homepage http://www.wren-spot.com/wlp/ - Business webpage http://www.antarctic-press.com/ - Someone else's page ... not enough time ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:52:12 -0700 (PDT) From: john karakash Subject: Re: IN> Roles and Songs of Fruitation - --- Whistling in the Dark wrote: > Well, sure, throw *that* at me. Heh, heh, heh. > > Seriously, I just reread the text. And clearly, > you're right -- but > it's not intuitively obvious that you are. In part > because his band > isn't identified, but also because the phrase in > question was "he > didn't want to jinx it," which I interpreted as he > didn't want to > risk disturbance. I hate blatantly mentioning things like Bands and Choirs in my fiction, so I try to make it obvious from actions/attitudes. Most demons keep their Soldiers on a short leash, information-wise, and Rawmeat obviously hadn't filled in Johnny on the ins and outs of being a member of one of the more fun Bands. ;) -john 'the WORLD is a china shop, baby!' karakash- ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 23:44:20 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 10:31 PM -0500 10/18/99, paranial@creighton.edu wrote: >A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of >control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? I would think he'd feel horrible, but this is not a violent response. So no. (If a Mercurian falls in the woods, does it make a sound celestially?) - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 00:20:37 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> A question. >At 10:31 PM 10/18/99 -0500, you wrote: >> >>A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of >>control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? >> >Yes. > >Accident or not, intentional or not, Mercurians -CANNOT- harm humans or >they take Dissonance. No. The Merc has to have intended it, or at least recklessly made it possible to happen. Otherwise, Mercs are going to have an impossibly hard time of it (or, to put it another way, they'd impossible to play). The causal chains get too long. Everything you do harms someone sooner or later. Intent is crucial (especially to an angel). Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 00:59:28 EDT From: "Jason Schneiderman" Subject: Re: IN> Furfur's Word > Gluttony: Ha'agenti. (Gottal stops always add flavor to demonic >names. Such as Ba'al). And comic book aliens. As if there's a difference. :) > Greed: Mammon > Lust: Andre > Wrath: Furfur > > Pride,Envy,Sloth Hm. If I had to assign them using previously existing superiors: Sloth: Saminga. Death is the eternal sleep. There's nothing you can do to avoid it, so why struggle? Why act? Why scheme? All things will eventually die. It's sloth in its modern incarnation as apathy. It doesn't hurt, of course, that the previous holder of the Word is *dead*. Envy: Nybbas. One of the cornerstones of The Media is advertising. Advertising is the industry devoted to making you want to have things other people have. Television and movies display lives of luxury led by people we'll never know. (Seen "Fight Club" yet? Talk about a Nybbas-Kobal-Furfur production! IMC, Servitors of Furfur are going to take that film straight to the top.) The Media also feeds envy in the form of the sense of entitlement: Warhol said everyone would be famous for 15 minutes, and a generation has risen to claim that quarter-hour as their birthright. "Where's my prize?" Stephen Sondheim, _Assassins_ Pride: I almost chose Kobal for this one. Funniest man in the heavens? Secret mission from God? Knower of the Cosmic Riddle? Sure. Right. Tell us another one. Instead, however, I pick Vapula. The DP of Technology is all about Pride - the confident exercise of your own superior knowledge to affect the rest of the world, sure of the benefits to come and the praise to be lauded. Jason Schneiderman ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 00:04:35 -0700 From: EDG Subject: Re: IN> Drive Skill At 01:36 AM 10/19/99 +0100, you wrote: >Mmm. I tend to take the opposite view, that celestials can drive (and >eat, and make love, and speak the local language, and whatever) as a basic >skill. If you need a justification, well, most of them *aren't* fresh out >of heaven or hell, and have had a least a basic course in walking upright >from their Corporeal Orientation Officer :-) It's something that is . o O ( There's a course on making love? Dominic's training aside? ;) >commonplace in a lot of societies, after all, and not being able to drive >(as an adult) is frequently notable, and no sane orientation course is >going to let its graduates be spotted that easily. I could easily believe You'd be surprised. Out of the people I commonly associate with where I live now, two out of seven can't drive a car (and only two of seven can drive a stick-shift, if that. Lazy bums); out of those I knew at school, nearly half (of maybe twenty or thirty people) had never been behind the wheel. I know several university and college professors who routinely ride bicycles or take the bus because they've never learned to drive a car. (One of my friends managed to hit a tree with my car when it wasn't even /on/. "Don't turn the wheel!" "Okay." *crank crank*) >that celestials who spend all their time in out of the way places don't >know how to drive -- Jordi's angels would be particularly prone to this -- >but most of them shouldn't have much problem. Particularly if they're >driving automatics :-) Lazy bums. ;) >Of course, when they have to drive under stress conditions (i.e. make >rolls), they might well decide that investing a few character points in >Driving/1 or /2 might have been a good design decision. Keep in mind also that angels are theoretically, if not practically, immortal, and many of them started their stints on Earth long, long before the invention of the automobile (and many have been in Trauma since those times). Actually being in control of a car is something a good number of angels have never experienced. - -EDG and it's wildebeest. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 05:45:02 -0400 From: Ehrbar Subject: Re: IN> Furfur's Word >Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:18:37 -0700 >From: Steel Angel >Subject: Re: IN> Furfur's Word > No offense to whoever did that writeup, but that Word hardly seems worthy >of even a -minor- Prince. It also seems to overlap a -lot- of the bigger Words >out there, like Jealousy, Hate (now a Prince of Hate writeup would be fun), >Wrath (a writeup I have to tweak before I post to the list), and scores of >other nasty, violent Words. > Unless it was all a joke at Kobal's urging. > >- - Abracax: Shedite of Riots Well, remember it was Furfur's Word before his elevation, that Furfur asked to become the Demon Prince of Rock & Roll, that Furfur's intent was to attack the entire "Prince" system of Hell that Lucifer set up, and that Furfur's method was not very respectful of Lucifer himself. In short, Furfur deserved to be stuck with a Word hardly worthy of even a minor Prince while being thrust into the cutthroat world of Princely politics. I imagine Mammon is already taking bets on how long until Furfur gets toasted, with "more than a decade" being considered a long-shot... Steven Ehrbar ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:38:53 +1000 From: bichwa@telstra.easymail.com.au Subject: Re: IN> Furfur's Word >> >Since I don't have the relevant supplement, could someone tell >> >me what Furfur's Word ("Hardcore," I think) means? >> Before he became a prince it meant Hardcore music. After princedom he >> expanded it to anything that has gone Hardcore (such as going from longing >> to obsession, going from anger to insane rage), focusing mostly on the >> violent aspects of his Word. > > No offense to whoever did that writeup, but that Word hardly seems worthy >of even a -minor- Prince. It also seems to overlap a -lot- of the bigger Words >out there, like Jealousy, Hate (now a Prince of Hate writeup would be fun), >Wrath (a writeup I have to tweak before I post to the list), and scores of >other nasty, violent Words. Isn't that the point? Hardcore is jealousy, hate, wrath, gratuitous sex and violence (if Nybbas hasn't snaffled that). Hardcore is forgetting to do what's right, and acting purely out of your rage, your anger, and yes your hatred of The Man, of Whitey, of Death, of aging, of the futility of life, of yourself. Hardcore is slashing yourself with broken glass to feel something, it's doing stuff that no normal sane person would ever contemplate doing. It's taking on twelve men, and winning (why yes, I do realise that that does seem to describe some malakim), it's getting into a fight which could leave you arrested, hospitalised or dead because you can. It's about lashing out. > Unless it was all a joke at Kobal's urging. Possible. Remember, Kobal's last joke anything like that got him a major helper/dogsbody/bodyguard in the person of Haagenti. Kobal on his own was scary enough (he did hold off Yves on his own and everyone forgets that), but Kobal supported by both the Impudite Alliance and Saminga and Malphas is a lot nastier. If one of his "whims" gets Hell a major new Prince, I'm certain that everyone overlooks him. After all, even the concept of a battle over a world which destroys the world is sort of amusing. Kris, getting that out of my system. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:36:21 +0100 From: "Liam" Subject: Re: IN> Drive Skill From: Rhodri James > Mmm. I tend to take the opposite view, that celestials can drive (and > eat, and make love, and speak the local language, and whatever) as a basic > skill. If you need a justification, well, most of them *aren't* fresh out > i don't know about you, but i can't drive, because i haven't been taught it yet, and possibly never will. i certainly wouldn't consider it a "basic skill" that i was born with like being able to eat or shag. IMC if angels want to have been trained at something, they take the skill. i could see a lot of celestials not bothering to learn how to drive "these new-fangled noisey wheeled boxes", especially the ones working for less technically-minded superiors liam ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:40:38 +0100 From: "Liam" Subject: Re: IN> A question. > > A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of > control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? > i'd say no. it's in a similar vein to tripping over and accidentally smacking someone. otherwise we go back to the whole "what if you pick up a mercurian and hit people with him" thing. i think the merc has to have intent to harm. btw, IIRC mercurians gain dissonance for resorting to violence with anything (except demons, who deserve it). so do they get dissonance for punching fellow angels, or losing their temper and kicking inanimate objects, or being cruel to animals? liam ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:30:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Rev. Pee Kitty" Subject: Re: IN> A question. On Tue, 19 Oct 1999, Liam wrote: > btw, IIRC mercurians gain dissonance for resorting to violence with anything > (except demons, who deserve it). so do they get dissonance for punching > fellow angels, or losing their temper and kicking inanimate objects, or > being cruel to animals? I'd say yes, no, yes, personally. - -- Rev. Pee Kitty, of the order Malkavian-Dobbsian Meow! "Punctuality, regularity, discipline, industry, thoroughness, are a set of slave virtues." -- G. D. H. Cole ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 11:58:00 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> no dinero At 12:43 PM -0400 10/18/99, Jason Schneiderman wrote: >>The latter -- if you're basing something off of current events, TELL us. >>(Also, it's a rather political-slanted adventure, which does violate normal >>SJ Games policies to some extent -- check the writer's guidelines.) > >*nod* I did. Of course, it seems that those, too, can be relaxed when it >comes to In Nomine and games like Technomancer. As with many things, it >seems to be related to context. Oh, definitely. However, don't count on it -- especially if now that there's a vigilant Line Editor looking at stuff as it comes in... (No Dinero, for instance, might well have had some editing to make things more nicely gray and fuzzy instead of "Heroic No Dinero" vs. "Pig Cops" in the setup. It's so much more complex when the "Bad Guys" have homes and families and little kids who love their Mommy/Daddy... ) (Did I mention I _like_ complexity and No Easy Answers to Pressing Social Problems? And, of course, the occasional opportunity to trash a demon who's evil through and through and thus remove a problem simply.) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 11:57:58 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: IN> Calabim and Nukes (Re: Roles and Songs of Fruitation) At 4:09 PM -0400 10/18/99, Whistling in the Dark wrote: >At 12:08 PM -0700 10/18/99, john karakash wrote: >>--- Whistling in the Dark >>wrote: >> > In the Corporeal Player's Guide, the demon specifically had the human >> > build the bomb that would destroy the Tether, because that way, he >> > avoided [disturbance]. So I think it's more steps than simply giving >> > the bomb to them. >> >> Dude, that was a Calabite. Imagine you are Random Q. Calabite >>and you want to build a nuclear bomb. Do you take the chance that >>your entropy field will screw it up or worse, set it off >>prematurely? >> Furfur has a LOT of Calabim. They match his Word pretty well, but >>are somewhat useless for precision work! ;) >> >> -john 'I wrote the darned thing' karakash- > >Well, sure, throw *that* at me. > >Seriously, I just reread the text. And clearly, you're right -- but >it's not intuitively obvious that you are. In part because his band >isn't identified, but also because the phrase in question was "he >didn't want to jinx it," which I interpreted as he didn't want to >risk disturbance. Considering that disturbance _does_ get into fuzzy areas of cause and effect, I could easily see a celestial figuring that the less he had to do with it, the less chance of a jinx -- either due to a Calabite entropy field, _or_ due to Massive Disturbance. (Possibly of the kind which would "stick" to the one who caused it...) So how about using both reasons as the total explanation? They're both plausible. (One of my characters is certainly paranoid enough about disturbance that _she_ wouldn't want to risk building something that went BIG BOOM...) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:48:14 -0400 From: Walter Milliken Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 23:31 -0400 10/18/99, paranial@creighton.edu wrote: >A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of >control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? I would think so. "Not my fault" isn't a valid defense against dissonance (Cherubim run into that a lot). Of course, it isn't violence, per se, but it is harm to a human that he might have avoided. (Driving too fast for the conditions, should have gotten an Ofanite to drive, etc.) If he didn't get dissonant, he ought to at least be *really* unhappy. - ---Walter ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:09:53 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 12:40 PM +0100 10/19/99, Liam wrote: >btw, IIRC mercurians gain dissonance for resorting to violence with anything >(except demons, who deserve it). so do they get dissonance for punching >fellow angels, or losing their temper and kicking inanimate objects, or >being cruel to animals? Check the errata. www.sjgames.com/in-nomine/errata - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:07:02 -0400 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 10:31 PM -0500 10/18/99, paranial@creighton.edu wrote: >A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of >control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? I'd give it to him, yup. (I'd give it to him if he spun out of control and hit the Hellsworn jogger he was tailing, too.) He was driving the car. He'd get dissonance if he was cleaning his gun and it went off to hit his mortal servant, too. There's a direct chain -- Mercurian at wheel of car, car hits human. If he were possessed, or hit with a Song of Sleep, and the car went out of control while he was utterly out of it (Celestial Song of Entropy would count), then he's safe. But he'd better be _very_ upset about it or I'd think real hard about slapping him with dissonance for not caring enough. If he cut someone off in traffic during a high-speed chase, and there were a pile-up behind him (the person he cut off jams on her brakes, and then gets rear-ended), then that's iffier. I'd probably not give him dissonance -- but he shouldn't be blase' about it. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:31:09 CDT From: "Wade Hursman" Subject: Re: IN> A question. >A Mercurian is Driving on a winter when hits an ice slick spinns out of >control and hits, child. Does he get dissonance? Oh yeah. Big time. Wade Habbalite of Technology, Demon of Telemarketers ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:05:33 -0600 From: "Ben Glickler" Subject: Re: IN> Drive Skill On things driving... I'd not let 'em drive. Anyone seen the Prophecy? "Why?" "I can't drive. But I can wait... until the stars burn out, if necessary." (Gabriel talking to a poor mortal he's forcing to help him.) Ben ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 00:42:41 +0100 From: "Liam" Subject: Re: IN> A question. From: Elizabeth McCoy > > If he cut someone off in traffic during a high-speed chase, and there > were a pile-up behind him (the person he cut off jams on her brakes, and > then gets rear-ended), then that's iffier. I'd probably not give him > dissonance -- but he shouldn't be blase' about it. > but surely in a situation like that the angel would be far more to blame for any damage to people. he knows that if he goes hareing around in traffic there's a good chance someone might crash. whereas if i understood the previous example it was saying the incident was purely accidental. i kind of think of it in a similar manner to other angelic resonances - i wouldn't give a seraph dissonance if they said something they believed to be true (but was actually untrue). maybe if the mercurian was recklessly driving in icy weather i'd give him dissonance, he knew the risks of what he was doing, but if it's purely accidental i wouldn't liam ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:11:40 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> A question. >From: Elizabeth McCoy > >> >> If he cut someone off in traffic during a high-speed chase, and there >> were a pile-up behind him (the person he cut off jams on her brakes, and >> then gets rear-ended), then that's iffier. I'd probably not give him >> dissonance -- but he shouldn't be blase' about it. >> > >but surely in a situation like that the angel would be far more to blame for >any damage to people. he knows that if he goes hareing around in traffic >there's a good chance someone might crash. whereas if i understood the >previous example it was saying the incident was purely accidental. Yeah, I agree. Not a good example, Elizabeth. >i kind of think of it in a similar manner to other angelic resonances - i >wouldn't give a seraph dissonance if they said something they believed to be >true (but was actually untrue). No, you definitely can't do that. Otherwise the seraph's resonance becomes WAY too powerful, dropping unexpected bits of information on the angel at random. To give an example from canon... in "Fall of the Malakim" (minor spoiler alert! minor spoiler alert!), the Mal Maximilian goes berserk and kills every Celestial in L.A. Except it's not really Max who does it... it's a construct, a fake Maximilian created as part of an elaborate plot by Malphas and Kobal. So imagine two Seraphs discussing it -- "... then Francis was standing there, and Maximilian just walked in and shot him..." [BONG] "Ow! What just happened?" (Another seraph) "Uhh, Francis was just standing there... someone walked in... someone shot Francis... that someone was Maximilian..." [BONG] "Ow." The two angels look at each other. "Hey, we better check this out..." >maybe if the mercurian was recklessly >driving in icy weather i'd give him dissonance, he knew the risks of what he >was doing, but if it's purely accidental i wouldn't I'd agree. Other comparisons: - -- An Ofanite is driving recklessly, as usual. Suddenly he hits an unexpected patch of ice. Pow, and now the Ofie is pinned in the wreckage, unable to move 'til a cop with the Jaws of Life shows up. Dissonance? (I'd say no). - -- A Mal of Eli has sworn to harm no human work of art. He's driving across Daley Plaza in Chicago, hits a patch of ice, and crashes into the Picasso sculpture. Dissonance? (I'd say no). Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 09:05:58 -0500 From: Kris Overstreet Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 08:11 PM 10/19/99 -0400, you wrote: >Other comparisons: > >-- An Ofanite is driving recklessly, as usual. Suddenly he hits an >unexpected patch of ice. Pow, and now the Ofie is pinned in the wreckage, >unable to move 'til a cop with the Jaws of Life shows up. Dissonance? >(I'd say no). The Ofanite -can- still shift to Celestial form and move; hence, I'd say that if he stays there long enough, he -does- take dissonance. (If he has the Bound Discord, then no, he doesn't take dissonance.) >-- A Mal of Eli has sworn to harm no human work of art. He's driving >across Daley Plaza in Chicago, hits a patch of ice, and crashes into the >Picasso sculpture. Dissonance? (I'd say no). Yes, if the sculpture is broken. (IMC, however, that dissonance would be gone if the Mal of Eli can make the sculpture good as new- no harm, no foul.) Redneck Kris Overstreet, too many websites.... http://www.detnet.com/redneck/ - Personal homepage http://www.wren-spot.com/wlp/ - Business webpage http://www.antarctic-press.com/ - Someone else's page ... not enough time ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 21:23:07 -0500 From: "Trent" Subject: Re: IN> A question. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas Muir To: Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 1999 7:11 PM Subject: Re: IN> A question. > > -- An Ofanite is driving recklessly, as usual. Suddenly he hits an > unexpected patch of ice. Pow, and now the Ofie is pinned in the wreckage, > unable to move 'til a cop with the Jaws of Life shows up. Dissonance? > (I'd say no). > Ofanites don't get disonance if they can't move; they get disonance if they don't try to move. (ah the rush of Nitpicking Essence) Trent Ofanite of Doubt ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:13:15 -0400 From: Ben Aldred Subject: IN> Another question. if a seraph were to say to someone I am going to shave your head, fully intending to do it. Then suddenly a calabite rushes in and destroys said head does the seraph take dissonance because they cannot now shave the head? Ben ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 23:08:55 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> A question. At 9:05 AM -0500 10/14/99, Kris Overstreet wrote: >At 08:11 PM 10/19/99 -0400, you wrote: > >Other comparisons: > > > >-- An Ofanite is driving recklessly, as usual. Suddenly he hits an > >unexpected patch of ice. Pow, and now the Ofie is pinned in the wreckage, > >unable to move 'til a cop with the Jaws of Life shows up. Dissonance? > >(I'd say no). > >The Ofanite -can- still shift to Celestial form and move; hence, I'd say >that if he stays there long enough, he -does- take dissonance. (If he has >the Bound Discord, then no, he doesn't take dissonance.) This is one of the few situations where I'd rule he does take dissonance, even though technically he can't go celestial to escape. Discords, as a rule, are terrible things. Having them means having a part of your very nature broken in a way you're not able to cope with - -- dissonance converted to something stable. So, the more Discord someone has, the more they're "on the slope," and the more liberally I assign dissonance. If the Ofanite could have escaped before he started slipping towards Hell, and now he can't... well, the Symphony can be cruel. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:20:31 -0500 From: "Prodigal" Subject: Re: IN> Another question. From: Ben Aldred > if a seraph were to say to someone I am going to shave your head, fully > intending to do it. Then suddenly a calabite rushes in and destroys said > head does the seraph take dissonance because they cannot now shave the head? I would say no, because the important thing was the Seraph's intention matching her words. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 23:29:51 -0400 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Another question. At 10:13 PM -0400 10/19/99, Ben Aldred wrote: >if a seraph were to say to someone I am going to shave your head, fully >intending to do it. Then suddenly a calabite rushes in and destroys said >head does the seraph take dissonance because they cannot now shave the head? > >Ben Well, no. The conditions have changed. That which is true before skippy came in and blew the true thing up doesn't mean he wasn't speaking the truth to begin with. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1367 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.