From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Nov 15 00:22:11 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA29907 for ; Mon, 15 Nov 1999 00:22:11 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id AAA22093 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 15 Nov 1999 00:24:00 -0600 Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 00:24:00 -0600 Message-Id: <199911150624.AAA22093@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1412 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, November 15 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1412 In this digest: IN> Words and Anti-Words Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words IN> Read Only If Serious About Retiring in 2-3 Years.. Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words IN> Read Only If Serious About Retiring in 2-3 Years.. Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words Re: IN> How and Why Laurence Became the General of the Host IN> Fudge -- In Nomine conversion IN> The Fall, Again IN> Dogma Spoilers (was Words and Anti-Words) IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words Re: IN> The Fall, Again Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon IN> Re: How To Meet Beautiful Women Re: IN> One Good Demon Re: IN> One Good Demon ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:34:56 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Words and Anti-Words >>>But then we come back to that damn Demon of Spam thing. Spam has two meanings, both in English. I don't think a programmer in India is using the word 'spam'. So how do you go from the Celestial 'canned meat' to 'annoying email'?<<< This is covered in the GMG. (Basically, the Demon of Spam was a stupid bit of canon someone wrote originally to be cute, making the Demon of Spam cover both meanings, but it really screwed up how Words should make. So I did an obvious retrocon explaining that Lucifer made a special exception for the Demon of Spam, and let his Word actually be, roughly translated from the celestial, "The Demon of Things Called 'Spam' In English." Yeah, it's a kludge. But the alternative is a nightmare. - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:25:32 -0700 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words > But then we come back to that damn Demon of Spam thing. Spam has two >meanings, both in English. I don't think a programmer in India is using >the word 'spam'. So how do you go from the Celestial 'canned meat' to >'annoying email'? Because Spiced Ham by Hornel(tm) is a human concept, a specific product. Its Symphonic theme is tied dirctly into human perception. His Word was actually the word spam in addition to the substance. Beyond that the term spaming comes from the monty python routine where Spam is the only thing on the menu, thus tying the two concepts together and allowing the demon to switch over. Thus now his Word is, or at least includes, annoying email, but he uses demon of spam still (at least when talking to americans). Timothy, Angel of Rambling If you have a hankering for waffles or chicken i know the place for you: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 15:58:19 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words In a message dated 11/14/99 4:31:53 AM Central Standard Time, steelangel@cruzers.com writes: << Seen Dogma yet? God uses The Metatron as her/his/its "voice" since if a human heard God directly, their mind would collapse and their body explode. Speaking of Dogma, Loki was -so- very much an Outcast Malakite of Gabriel. I got a -lot- of story and RP ideas from that film. On a side note, in what book and when will the Grigori writeup be published? >> Bartleby was described as a Grigori, but his talent for seeing the life history of everyone around him was very Mercurian, INHO. Great movie! I recommend it highly. Rev. Brian ------------------------------ Date: 14 Nov 99 3:04:37 PM From: billy@admiralkirk.com Subject: IN> Read Only If Serious About Retiring in 2-3 Years.. Look, we don't want to waste your time...or ours You must be determined to earn a bare minimum of $10,000 in the next 30 - 45 days and to develop a net worth of over 1 Million Dollars Cash in the next 24-36 months. My mission is to help other people develop their life long dreams. And Part of what I'm looking for are those people who are committed to that BIG of a picture and are not afraid to work for it. We can help you: REGARDLESS OF YOUR CURRENT AGE OR YOUR DEBT LOAD! NOT MLM or FRANCHISE Don't bother to call unless you are serious. Learn the Facts CALL 1-800-598-3255 (24 hrs) This is one of those "Fixed Cost" 800#s so feel free to call back if you don't get all of the exciting details. EASY $10,000 IN 30 - 45 DAYS ==================================================== If you wish to be removed from t future mailings, please CLICK HERE-- mailto:joseph@admiralkirk.com?subject=REMOVE and this will automatically block you from their future mailings. =================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:03:25 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words In a message dated 11/14/99 1:04:44 PM Central Standard Time, in-sabre@annotations.com writes: << There was a clear Impudite, Mercurian and Saint in that too. And some Calabim and a Djinn of Haagenti now that I think about it. And a Soldier of God. And air freshener. Definite air freshener. >> And a couple of stoners who are called prophets for some reason. Rev. B ------------------------------ Date: 14 Nov 99 3:05:40 PM From: billy@admiralkirk.com Subject: IN> Read Only If Serious About Retiring in 2-3 Years.. Look, we don't want to waste your time...or ours You must be determined to earn a bare minimum of $10,000 in the next 30 - 45 days and to develop a net worth of over 1 Million Dollars Cash in the next 24-36 months. My mission is to help other people develop their life long dreams. And Part of what I'm looking for are those people who are committed to that BIG of a picture and are not afraid to work for it. We can help you: REGARDLESS OF YOUR CURRENT AGE OR YOUR DEBT LOAD! NOT MLM or FRANCHISE Don't bother to call unless you are serious. Learn the Facts CALL 1-800-598-3255 (24 hrs) This is one of those "Fixed Cost" 800#s so feel free to call back if you don't get all of the exciting details. EASY $10,000 IN 30 - 45 DAYS ==================================================== If you wish to be removed from t future mailings, please CLICK HERE-- mailto:joseph@admiralkirk.com?subject=REMOVE and this will automatically block you from their future mailings. =================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:14:32 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words At 3:58 PM -0500 11/14/99, BillionSix@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 11/14/99 4:31:53 AM Central Standard Time, >steelangel@cruzers.com writes: > ><< Seen Dogma yet? God uses The Metatron as her/his/its "voice" since if a > human heard God directly, their mind would collapse and their body explode. > Speaking of Dogma, Loki was -so- very much an Outcast Malakite of Gabriel. I > got a -lot- of story and RP ideas from that film. On a side note, in what >book > and when will the Grigori writeup be published? >> > > >Bartleby was described as a Grigori, but his talent for seeing the life >history of everyone around him was very Mercurian, INHO. Actually, Serendipity seemed more Mercurian to me, despite her stated position. And Azrael seemed *very* Impudite (albiet a dissonant one.) - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:15:25 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words At 4:03 PM -0500 11/14/99, BillionSix@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 11/14/99 1:04:44 PM Central Standard Time, >in-sabre@annotations.com writes: > ><< There was a clear Impudite, Mercurian and Saint in that too. And > some Calabim and a Djinn of Haagenti now that I think about it. And > a Soldier of God. And air freshener. Definite air freshener. >> > >And a couple of stoners who are called prophets for some reason. Because they are. Besides, it's a Kevin Smith film. You don't have one of those without Jay and Silent Bob. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:57 EST From: BillionSix@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words In a message dated 11/14/99 3:21:16 PM Central Standard Time, in-sabre@annotations.com writes: << Because they are. Besides, it's a Kevin Smith film. You don't have one of those without Jay and Silent Bob. >> Hey, I wasn't complaining. I love Jay and Silent Bob. Only Jay could be kissed by God and get... "exited" Rev. B ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:40:47 EST From: Samovar3@aol.com Subject: Re: IN> How and Why Laurence Became the General of the Host David Edelstein wrote: >No, I don't think he'd stick Dominic and his Servitors on the front >lines, and murder Dominic if the Archangel of Judgment questioned >Michael's judgment. That would be petty and stupid. Michael is the one who has nursed a grudge for a time period that I'm guessing is at least two thousand years. (I assume the GMG timeline will have the exact trial date.) Also, from Michael's perspective, I would say that since God restored him to his position, he would consider questions of his orders to be questioning God. I would think that Michael is completely capable of regarding this a treason against God. While perhaps it would be a bit much to have him kill Dominic, I think he would throw Dominic out of Heaven (like he did Lucifer). From Michael's and Dominic's extended writeups, I got the impression that Michael feels that neither Dominic nor his servitors help the Heavenly Host. As such, I think it's completely likely that he'd move them to the front lines. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 15:57:23 -0600 From: David Edelstein Subject: IN> Fudge -- In Nomine conversion Sometimes I just get into a project and keep writing it until it's finished. So you may now find on my homepage a (more or less) complete set of Fudge rules for In Nomine. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/AmadanSJG/Innomine/IN-Fudge.htm - -David ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 17:26:42 -0500 From: Adam Canning Subject: IN> The Fall, Again >Date: Fri, 12 Nov 99 11:47:49 PST >From: "Azrael" >This brings the question why was Lucifer given the "Michael >treatment" From the only Eyewitness account we have, Secondhand at that as it was what a prophet said a somewhat unconventionally sane Seraph told him. From the Koran: THE CHAPTER OF THE HEIFER (II. Medina.) [...] And when thy Lord said unto the angels, 'I am about to place a vicegerent in the earth,' they said, 'Wilt Thou place therein one who will do evil therein and shed blood? we celebrate Thy praise and hallow Thee.' Said (the Lord), 'I know what ye know not.' And He taught Adam the names, all of them; then He propounded them to the angels and said, 'Declare to me the names of these, if ye are truthful.' They said, 'Glory be to Thee! no knowledge is ours but what Thou thyself hast taught us, verily, Thou art the knowing, the wise.' Said the Lord, 'O Adam declare to them their names;' and when he had declared to them their names He said, 'Did I not say to you, I know the secrets of the heavens and of the earth, and I know what ye show and what ye were hiding?' And when we said to the angels, 'Adore Adam,' they adored him save only Iblis, who refused and was too proud and became one of the misbelievers. And we said, 'O Adam dwell, thou and thy wife, in Paradise, and eat therefrom amply as you wish; but do not draw near this tree or ye will be of the transgressors. And Satan made them backslide therefrom and drove them out from what they were in, and we said, 'Go down, one of you the enemy of the other, and in the earth there is an abode and a provision for a time.' [...] THE CHAPTER OF AL AARAF (VII. Mecca.) [...] We have established you in the earth, and we have made for you therein livelihoods; little is it that ye thank; and we created you, then we fashioned you, then we said unto the angels, 'Adore Adam,' and they adored, save Iblis, who was not of those who did adore. Said He, 'What hinders thee from adoring when I order thee?' he said, 'I am better than he; Thou hast created me from fire, and him Thou hast created out of clay.' Said He, 'Then go down therefrom; what ails thee that thou shouldst be big with pride therein? go forth! verily, thou art of the little ones.' He said, 'Respite me until the day when they shall be raised.' He said 'Verily, thou art of the respited;' said he, 'For that Thou hast led me into error, I will lie in wait for them in Thy straight path; then I will surely come to them, from before them and from behind them; and most of them Thou shalt not find thankful.' He said, 'Go forth therefrom, despised, expelled; who so follows thee, I will surely fill hell with you altogether. But, O Adam, dwell thou and thy wife in Paradise and eat from whence ye will, but draw not nigh unto this tree or ye will be of the unjust.' But Satan whispered to them to display to them what was kept back from them of their shame, and he said, 'Your Lord has only forbidden you this tree lest ye should be twain angels, or should become of the immortals;' and he swore to them both, 'Verily, I am unto you a sincere adviser;' and he beguiled them by deceit, and when they twain tasted of the tree, their shame was shown them, and they began to stitch upon themselves the leaves of the garden. And their Lord called unto them, 'Did I not forbid you from that tree there, and say to you, Verily, Satan is to you an open foe?' [...] THE CHAPTER OF THE NIGHT JOURNEY (XVII. Mecca.) [...] And when we said to the angels, 'Adore Adam;' and they adored, save Iblis, who said, 'Am I to adore one whom Thou hast created out of clay? Said he, 'Dost thou see now? this one whom Thou hast honoured above me, verily, if Thou shouldst respite me until the resurrection day, I will of a surety utterly destroy his seed except a few.' Said He, 'Begone! and whoso of them follows thee- verily, hell is your recompense, an ample recompense. Entice away whomsoever of them thou canst with thy voice; and bear down upon them with thy horse and with thy foot; and share with them in their wealth and their children; and promise them,- but Satan promises them naught but deceit. Verily, my servants, thou hast no authority over them; thy Lord is guardian enough over them!' [...] Both a little odd [Is Johael [The first and seven syllable Metatron] speaking in concert with god at the beginning of this scene, or was Gabriel saying she was one with god in telling the angels to adore humans.] Of course taking this seriously relies on Gabriel evaporating anyone who attempted to change this document. Which considering she is a seraph and short on temper would seem reasonable. This does not really clear up the Peacock Angel's motivation and somewhat implies the fight starts when He doesn't leave peacefully. Adam ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:02:11 +1100 From: "Patrick O'Duffy" Subject: IN> Dogma Spoilers (was Words and Anti-Words) > Bartleby was described as a Grigori, but his talent for seeing the life > history of everyone around him was very Mercurian, INHO. > Great movie! I recommend it highly. Just want to note that DOGMA hasn't been released in the rest of the world yet, and won't be for a few months. I think the English, Australians and other non-US list members would appreciate some spoiler space on this one. (I know I would. Bad enough when I had to erase dozens of MATRIX-based emails off _all_ my mailing lists earlier this year...) - -- Patrick O'Duffy, Brisbane, Australia There's one hole in every revolution, large or small, and it's one word long - people. No matter how big the idea they all stand under, people are small and weak and cheap and frightened. It's people that kill every revolution. - - Spider Jerusalem, TRANSMETROPOLITAN #2 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 17:57:23 -0700 From: Tim Groth Subject: IN> One Good Demon Johnathen's friends always wondered why he didn't go visit relatives on holdiays. Why, for instance, every thanksgiving he was at the homeless shelter cooking up a meal and serving it. His initial answer would always be that he was merely doing the right thing. When pressed he would admit that he had had a falling out with his family, and didn't think they'd understand his life. Everyone he knew left it at that. He was an excellent cop, even if he could be accused of a little brutality at times. But it was only against the real scum. One time his partner had seen him chase someone they just saw setting a fire bomb off in a church down an ally, when his partner caught up there was no body. Johnathen didn't say anything, they both told everyone that the perp got away but most have been scared underground. He was also an excellent cook. That's what he was doing now, cooking up a thanksgiving meal for all of his friends at the shelter. He knew all of the regulars names, and made an effort to learn the names of those who passed through only a few times. The people who ran the shelter were happy to have an extra pair of hands, and the people visiting the shelter enjoyed the excellent food he made. They also enjoyed having a cop who actually cared about them. When Manuel, one of the regualars, stumbled through the doors with streams of tears and blood comning down his face Johnathen rushed over to him. Manuel had seen someone loading bodies into a truck, and when he was noticed by that someone he had been attacked. He barely made it to the shelter, and he kept looking at the doors, expecting at any minute his attackers to burst through. Taking his coat and exusing himself Johnathen headed went outside and took in a breath of clear november air and cursed himself silently. He should have ignored the tickling sensation at the back of his neck. Even now some of the echoes helped him track down Manuel's attackers. Some of the noise wasn't from the attack on the homeless man, they were from what ever he had stumbled upon. He found the truck, still loading bodies. A man, or at least what looked like a man, was overseeing the loading by stiffly moving figures. Turning the man looked at Johnathen, "Yes?" His answer was a furious scream, one that demanded that the man's body be shredded. Collapsing the man clutched his chest, blood was flowing from his mouth. No disturbance, not human. "So demon you wish to take on an angel of the lord?" Instead of letting the Habalah finish he takled him, pinning him to the ground and punching furiously. He struck finally with his resonance and then stood up, the demon below him was twitching but still alive. Pulling him up by his collar Johnathen shook him. "You" he slamned the demon into the van with a *THUD*, "are" *THUD*, "not" *THUD*, "an" *THUD*, "angel." *THUD* *CRACK*. The broken body slid down the truck, the zombies turned to look at what had happened to their master. Not knowing what exactly to do they just stood there, waiting. Johanethen destroyed the Zombis, and the remains of the Habalah's body. He called 911 to report the van and then went back to the shelter. He wanted to make sure the pumpkin pie had fresh whipped cream to go on top of it. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Johnathen Calabite Renegade from the War Corporeal Forces 4 Strength 8, Agility 8 Ethereal Forces 3 Intelligence 6, Precision 6, 18 Mind Hits Celestial Forces 4 Will 10, Perception 6, 40 Soul Hits Vessels - Caucasion Male/5 (Charisma +1, very likeable) 72 Body Hits Role - Cop/6, Status +3 Skills - Detect Lies/3, Dodge/3, Driving/2, Fighting/6, Knowledge (Cooking)/6, Knowledge (New York)/3, Pistol/5, Rifle/3, Tracking/4 Songs - Form (Corporeal/3, Ethereal/3), NC (Acid/4, Wings/4), Shields (Corporeal/5, Ethereal/2, Celestial/2), Thunder/4 Attunements - Calabite of the War, Art of Combat, State of Ophis Discord - Angry/3, Selfless/5 John used to be in the front lines for Baal. He was a favored servitor, a trouble shooter. An excellent hand to hand fighter, with an arsonel of songs to aid him he was a terror for any angel to face. Baal still isn't sure why he deserted. One day he was just gone, his heart shattered and several of the guards missing forces from celestial combat. John also lost some forces in his escape, beating his way out of Ghenna. But he made it back to earth, and became a cop. He's been on the force for five years now. He likes helping people, above and beyond the Selfless Discord. In his years on earth they sort of grew on him. Most of the them seemed much happier than he did, especially when helping eachother. He worked on various construction projects, in soup kitchens and every single kind of charity he could find. He was addicted. He decided that his 'duty' to Hell was getting in the way so he went Renegade. As a cop he has the oppertunity to help people and have human law behind him. He still voulenters, having developed a love of cooking that thankfully is accompanied by a natural knack for it. He's engaged to a fellow voulenteer at the homeless shelter he most frequently voulenteers at. He hasn't yet figured out a way to explain what he is, he may well just go celestial but he's justifiably worried about her reaction to his celestial form. He is content with a life on earth helping people in his own way. He avoids angels, and destroys demons who hurt those he cares for. Often his anger finds an outlet towards acceptable targets, which may eventualy get him up on brutality charges. However he often makes sure there is nothing left of a criminal who sets him off. Johnathen is mostly in the background, most other celestials won't notice one good cop who occasionally takes matters into his own hands. Anyone who witnesses him doing things that are inhuman vanish, since their mostly servants of hell that doesn't bother him. He doubts that any of his coworkers will ever catch onto his secret, so he continues to make a life for himself on earth. Baal has given up the search for him, assuming that he is dead and gone. Asmodeus is a little less convinced, however neither knows how damaging the fight for his escape was. As far as they know he may be little better than a remnant now. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Comments? Death Threats? Insults to my personal hygene? Timothy, Angel of Rambling If you have a hankering for waffles or chicken i know the place for you: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 20:43:06 -0600 (CST) From: paranial@creighton.edu Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon Good Story. Good Write up. All I have to say is this. soon or later, some Servitor of Flowers or Desitny is going to notice this Guy, Call their Supirior, said Superior will off to Redeem Jhonny and another Ofanite will be in the world. Bradley Paranial, Mercurian Vassal of War. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 19:31:30 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> Words and Anti-Words BillionSix@aol.com wrote: > Bartleby was described as a Grigori, but his talent for seeing the life > history of everyone around him was very Mercurian, INHO. > Great movie! I recommend it highly. And the Metatron is a -must- to take notes from for anyone RPing a Seraph. He had that subtle sympathy and arrogance all at the same time. Yeah, Bartleby was a great Mercurian, and I -loved- the 'rant' scene, it was -so- much like IN's Diabolical perspective. The Stygian Triptlets struck me as three Soldiers with the Celestial Song of Motion. Serendipity...hmmm, probably Mercurian of Eli, and Azrael was a fabulous example of a Balseraph in action. Rfus was a Saint (duh) and Bethany a Soldier. But as for Jay and Silent Bob...? Ah hell, they just kicked like usual. But oncemore, this movie is just -full- of RP and story ideas and could be 'contrast-adjusted' quite easily, as if what would happen if Bartlyby was -right- in his view about 'infinite patience'? - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 19:35:09 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> The Fall, Again Adam Canning wrote: > Of course taking this seriously relies on Gabriel evaporating anyone who > attempted to change this document. Which considering she is a seraph and > short on temper would seem reasonable. Nitpick! (my first). Gabriel is an Ofanite. Woo! - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 19:44:33 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon Tim Groth wrote: > Comments? Death Threats? Insults to my personal hygene? Just one thing. He kills people, he's a cop, he has to kill people and rough them up sometimes. The disturbance would attract -someone- eventually, and if he's so nice, why does he avoid angels and not Redeem? He'd have the same life and a whole network of Celestials who actually might -care- for him. Unless all the hellborn prejudices are keeping him from that. But an inherantly Selfness nature means (to me) he's not going to remain a demon for too long. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 20:57:37 -0700 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon > Just one thing. He kills people, he's a cop, he has to kill people and >rough >them up sometimes. The disturbance would attract -someone- eventually, Roles as I understand them mute disturbance. Although if he used his resonance to do the damage to kill them it would cause disturbance (as far as I understand it) he mostly uses his resonance to get rid of the bodies. I don't think that would cause nearly as much disturbance, if any. I agree he'll probably be Redeemed eventually, but he's not sure that he'll be accepted for it or survive it. Timothy, Angel of Rambling If you have a hankering for waffles or chicken i know the place for you: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 20:00:41 PST From: "Miles 2 Go" Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon >Comments? Death Threats? Insults to my personal hygene? Interesting character, but not mentioning WHY he is selfless makes him rather pointless. The selfless discord never happens randomly, so there must be something he did to gain the discord. If you're offering up this as an NPC for use - it is certainly going to be asked by any group of angels. GM's rule - if you introduce an elephant into a story, be damned sure you know why the elephant is there ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:59:13 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon At 7:44 PM -0800 11/15/99, Steel Angel wrote: >Tim Groth wrote: > > > > Comments? Death Threats? Insults to my personal hygene? > > Just one thing. He kills people, he's a cop, he has to kill >people and rough them up sometimes. The disturbance would attract >-someone- eventually, Eventually, yes -- but it's *very* eventual. He's got a Role/6 as a police officer. If he's in the line of duty, a *lot* of Disturbance just won't happen. He's as invisible as a Celestial can be. And when he does make some -- by the time the Angels and Demons check it out, he'll still have a reason to be on the scene. He's a cop. Now, using his Resonance or Songs might accelerate this, but if he's careful he could go a *long* time without being caught. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 21:29:55 -0700 From: Tim Groth Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon >Interesting character, but not mentioning WHY he is selfless makes >him rather pointless. The selfless discord never happens randomly, >so there must be something he did to gain the discord. If you're >offering up this as an NPC for use - it is certainly going to be asked >by any group of angels. He started to like humanity. While that didn't instantly turn him to being helpful (that hapened when he noticed helpful people were happy). IMC he was made defective, from Hell's point of view at least, he never really had his heart into evil. In fact his initial Discord was Selfless (back when he had only 2 celestial forces). However this is a little odd, and its also possible for him to have developed simply by having more human contact than demonic contact. Timothy, Angel of Rambling If you have a hankering for waffles or chicken i know the place for you: http://d106-h032.rh.rit.edu/~tim/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:46:16 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon Tim Groth wrote: > > Just one thing. He kills people, he's a cop, he has to kill people and > >rough > >them up sometimes. The disturbance would attract -someone- eventually, > > Roles as I understand them mute disturbance. I can't see this working -that- much, or the Role of 'Serial Killer' would be handed out to every one of Saminga's who asked. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:53:48 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon Whistling in the Dark wrote: > > Just one thing. He kills people, he's a cop, he has to kill > >people and rough them up sometimes. The disturbance would attract > >-someone- eventually, > > Eventually, yes -- but it's *very* eventual. He's got a Role/6 as a > police officer. If he's in the line of duty, a *lot* of Disturbance > just won't happen. He's as invisible as a Celestial can be. Again, who -gave- him the Role? If Baal gave it to him (and from what I've read, Superiors have to, if you want real records and Disturbance masking, - -especially- at level 6) I'm sure Baal can -find- him again very easily, just go - -look him up- in a local directory or down at the station. I just can't see anyone with a Role/6 just dropping off the map and -maintaining- that Role and no one notices. Oh also, killing someone because 'you felt like it' (as is implied in the writeup, it's a personal thing, no cop has a 'duty' to act as a vigilante) - -isn't- part of the Role of a cop. Frankly, this logic can then be applied to - -any- Role. "I'm a garbageman, but garbagemen can kill people and crush them in the compactor, so it makes no Disturbance." Much as I liked the writeup, I just can't see anyone with a Role/6 acting so totally contrary to his Celestial nature and his Superior just lost track of him, - -especially- Baal. And as noted above, the Disturbance thing doesn't work unless - -anyone- with a human Role can play vigilante under the same rules. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:55:43 -0800 From: Steel Angel Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon Tim Groth wrote: > IMC he was made defective, from Hell's point of view at least, he never > really had his heart into evil. In fact his initial Discord was Selfless > (back when he had only 2 celestial forces). However this is a little odd, > and its also possible for him to have developed simply by having more human > contact than demonic contact. Is that -possible-? To have a Calabite with Selfless? I doubt he'd get anywhere in Baal's ranks if someone noticed. Again, as interesting as it is, canonically, this idea just seems to be somewhat flawed. - - Abracax: Shedite of Riots ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 00:52:15 -0500 From: Mason Kramer Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon [Excellent write-up snipped] The major question in my mind about this write-up is this: How come he hasn't been tracked down by the Role? A Role/6 takes a *long* time to build up, and has to be backed up by documentation, eyewitnesses, etcetera. Has he done all this since leaving his Prince's service? It couldn't have been granted him *before* leaving, because any Roles he had before going renegade would've been hunted up instantly.... ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 21:58:57 -0800 (PST) From: rosyretter@hotmail.com Subject: IN> Re: How To Meet Beautiful Women Thanks Dodo, I guess I needed that; whatever THAT is. I'll resist the temptation to respond in kind. I'm tied to the ball and chain anyway. 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Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 13:38:10 -0700 To: David Bruner ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 01:03:22 -0500 From: Whistling in the Dark Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon At 9:46 PM -0800 11/15/99, Steel Angel wrote: >Tim Groth wrote: > > > > Just one thing. He kills people, he's a cop, he has to kill people and > > >rough > > >them up sometimes. The disturbance would attract -someone- eventually, > > > > Roles as I understand them mute disturbance. > > I can't see this working -that- much, or the Role of 'Serial Killer' would >be handed out to every one of Saminga's who asked. You can't hand out a Role. You have to build it. The records and information about your Role corrospond to how strong it is. A Serial Killer/6 would have to have a picture in his High School yearbook, driver's license, credit rating, and a police record. The last most significant, as the FBI and police forces would be tracking his patterns of death. If the Serial Killer doesn't do anything to break his role (attunements, resonances or songs) and therefore remains disturbance free, then twenty SWAT team guys showing up and emptying their weapons at the known mass-murderer is going to waste the Role *and* the Vessel without angelic involvement. In other words, it's a colossal waste of resources to create a Role that itself attracts so much of the wrong kind of attention. I could see Saminga using Serial Killer Roles in some situations, but not have the resources to use them commonly. Besides, it's a lot cheaper to create a bunch of Undead and send *them* out, instead. - -- Eric Alfred Burns It was then I felt my heart break like a in-sabre@annotations.com fragile Scooby Snack upon the harsh teeth of http://www.annotations.com Reality -- and it's been broken ever since. http://www.annotations.com/~journal --Johnny Bravo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:19:16 PST From: "Miles 2 Go" Subject: Re: IN> One Good Demon > >Interesting character, but not mentioning WHY he is selfless > >makes him rather pointless. The selfless discord never happens > >randomly, so there must be something he did to gain the discord. > >If >you're offering up this as an NPC for use - it is certainly going to > > be asked by any group of angels. > >He started to like humanity. While that didn't instantly turn him to > >being helpful (that hapened when he noticed helpful people were >happy). > >IMC he was made defective, from Hell's point of view at least, he >never >really had his heart into evil. In fact his initial Discord was >Selfless (back when he had only 2 celestial forces). However this >is a little odd, and its also possible for him to have developed simply >by having more human contact than demonic contact. And that discord would be visible in his celestial form, and Baal gave him a vessel and sent him to Earth with selfless discord? Baal would be more likely to disband his forces and put them to better use. If you want to say he just wasn't that evil, that's a possiblity. Perhaps Baal used some free forces that had been stripped from another demon that was starting to go selfless. However, if it showed up as selfless discord in hell, baby calabim would be diced up before he could win a spot on earth. This could work, but it needs a more credible backstory than he was just always a good demon and nobody noticed. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1412 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.