From owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Mon Dec 13 21:37:51 1999 Return-Path: Received: from lists.io.com (majordom@lists.io.com [199.170.88.15]) by pyramid.sjgames.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07945 for ; Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:37:50 -0600 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by lists.io.com (8.9.3/8.9.1a) id VAA27768 for in_nomine-digest-outgoing; Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:28:56 -0600 Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:28:56 -0600 Message-Id: <199912140328.VAA27768@lists.io.com> From: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com (in_nomine-digest) To: in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Subject: in_nomine-digest V1 #1459 Reply-To: in_nomine-l@lists.io.com Sender: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Errors-To: owner-in_nomine-digest@lists.io.com Precedence: bulk in_nomine-digest Monday, December 13 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1459 In this digest: IN> Long posts IN> Trailer : The End Of Days Is Not Enough Re: IN> The Soul of a New Machine IN> Another IN Movie Trailer - 'Falling Stars' Re: IN> How powerful are Heaven and Hell? Re: IN> a coupla (odd?) questions Re: IN> Possible Tether Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1457 Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1457 Re: IN> Shedim possession of a PC Re: IN> Trailer : The End Of Days Is Not Enough Re: IN> Possible Tether Re: IN> a coupla (odd?) questions Re: IN> Possible Tether Re: IN> Possible Tether Re: IN> Possible Tether Re: IN> What Demons are Really After Re: IN> Possible Tether IN> INS/MV [SPOILERS] (Was: What Demons are Really After) Re: IN> Possible Tether ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:55:30 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: IN> Long posts >Doug, she said no 40K files - that was too long for the list. She did NOT >say 'no scenarios'. Well, at the time she said, >>DO NOT POST A SCNERIO TO THE LIST, EVEN IN SEVERAL PARTS. - -- and I'll admit, this had my nose out of joint a little. However, we have since clarified matters by private correspondence; the objection was to length, not scenarios as such. The specific standard given was 10k, with the "_very occasional_" excursion as high as 20k. So, okay. This is reasonable, not arbitrary. I may not be happy with it but I concede the point. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 22:58:00 -0000 From: "Genevieve Cogman" Subject: IN> Trailer : The End Of Days Is Not Enough This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_00F3_01BF45BD.810E5980 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Okay, okay. So I went to the cinema recently. - --- THE END OF DAYS IS NOT ENOUGH - --------------------------------------------------------- DOMINIQUE, blonde hair neatly coiffured, in a white suit, sitting behind = a desk in what is clearly an Important Person's study. Her face is = harsh. She snaps into the telephone, "I have no time for this." VOICE : We're counting down the days . . .=20 LILITH, gorgeous in a deep jewel-toned wrap, sits with her hair falling = loose round her shoulders on the end of a rumpled bed. Slowly, she = murmurs, "I was kidnapped. The policy was that no ransom would be paid." Tearing explosion that takes out the side of the Old Bailey in London. = Flames. Camera follows away from it, down towards an alleyway . . . LAURENCE turns, smiles thinly, and puts his sword at HAAGENTI's throat = - -- HAAGENTI (fat, bearded, well-dressed) is pinned against the wall. = "Talk." VOICE : . . . Till the end of the world. LILITH glances at LAURENCE over her shoulder as she makes her way down a = mountainside. "And how close to me have you been ordered to stay?" DOMINIQUE turns a photograph of ASMODEUS between her hands, and glances = to LAURENCE. "We read law at Oxford together. I owe his daughter this = much." The camera continues to pan down the alleyway, showing a tall, = brutal-looking man's shadow. There's an axe and a bazooka slung across = his back. VOICE : And it takes so little to destroy a world . . . LAURENCE and LILITH, skiing down the mountainside, avoiding Vaputech = minihelicopters strafing them. Wild stunts. DOMINIQUE running down a narrow alleyway, heels clattering, the sound of = feet fast behind her. She turns on her pursuers, thuggish types, and = takes them down with three fast kicks. There is a momentary pause, then = the building behind her goes up in a billow of fire. LAURENCE pulls LILITH into an embrace, and she bends backward at the = waist, melting into his arms. Behind them, the sound of a New Year's Eve = party hammers in the background, with much exotic music. VOICE : All it takes . . . JEAN, to LAURENCE, in a scientific laboratory, "I am very well aware = that a virgin sacrifice is not scientific, 007. However, it appears to = be required." LILITH, into a telephone, "The world is not enough -- they wouldn't pay = it for me, and I won't accept it now." DOMINIQUE in her study, brings her revolver round to aim it at the = camera -- an unseen figure backhands her, knocking her into the wall. More flames and explosions. VOICE : . . . is one person. A silhouette advances through the flames, buildings crumbling as he = passes. There is a rather obvious axe slung across his back. LAURENCE dashes across some catwalk, machine pistol in one hand, sword = in the other. Bullets everywhere. Several goons do swan dives and = screams. LILITH, in a room with wall-screens showing maps of the world, watches = as the lights on the maps begin to go out one by one. She murmurs, "It's = up to you now, 007 . . ." Above in the sky, the moon is eclipsed. A trumpet-call echoes across the = night sky, dark angelic figures blotting out the stars as they descend. DOMINIQUE, chained to an altar-stone in the middle of a vast dark = ampitheatre, struggles. MICHAEL and LAURENCE cross blades, silhouetted dramatically against = flames and darkness, a shattered London (or Heaven?) in the background. MICHAEL's VOICE : Time for the end of days. - --- - ------=_NextPart_000_00F3_01BF45BD.810E5980 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Okay, okay. So I went to the cinema=20 recently.
 
---
 

THE END OF DAYS IS NOT ENOUGH

---------------------------------------------------------

 

<SCENE>

DOMINIQUE, blonde hair neatly coiffured, in a white suit, sitting = behind a=20 desk in what is clearly an Important Person's study. Her face is harsh. = She=20 snaps into the telephone, "I have no time for this."

</SCENE>

VOICE : We're counting down the days . . .

<SCENE>

LILITH, gorgeous in a deep jewel-toned wrap, sits with her hair = falling loose=20 round her shoulders on the end of a rumpled bed. Slowly, she murmurs, = "I=20 was kidnapped. The policy was that no ransom would be paid."

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

Tearing explosion that takes out the side of the Old Bailey in = London.=20 Flames. Camera follows away from it, down towards an alleyway . . .

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

LAURENCE turns, smiles thinly, and puts his sword at HAAGENTI's = throat --=20 HAAGENTI (fat, bearded, well-dressed) is pinned against the wall.=20 "Talk."

</SCENE>

VOICE : . . . Till the end of the world.

<SCENE>

LILITH glances at LAURENCE over her shoulder as she makes her way = down a=20 mountainside. "And how close to me have you been ordered to = stay?"

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

DOMINIQUE turns a photograph of ASMODEUS between her hands, and = glances to=20 LAURENCE. "We read law at Oxford together. I owe his daughter this=20 much."

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

The camera continues to pan down the alleyway, showing a tall, = brutal-looking=20 man's shadow. There's an axe and a bazooka slung across his back.

</SCENE>

VOICE : And it takes so little to destroy a world . . .

<SCENE>

LAURENCE and LILITH, skiing down the mountainside, avoiding Vaputech=20 minihelicopters strafing them. Wild stunts.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

DOMINIQUE running down a narrow alleyway, heels clattering, the sound = of feet=20 fast behind her. She turns on her pursuers, thuggish types, and takes = them down=20 with three fast kicks. There is a momentary pause, then the building = behind her=20 goes up in a billow of fire.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

LAURENCE pulls LILITH into an embrace, and she bends backward at the = waist,=20 melting into his arms. Behind them, the sound of a New Year's Eve party = hammers=20 in the background, with much exotic music.

</SCENE>

VOICE : All it takes . . .

<SCENE>

JEAN, to LAURENCE, in a scientific laboratory, "I am very well = aware=20 that a virgin sacrifice is not scientific, 007. However, it appears to = be=20 required."

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

LILITH, into a telephone, "The world is not enough -- they = wouldn't pay=20 it for me, and I won't accept it now."

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

DOMINIQUE in her study, brings her revolver round to aim it at the = camera --=20 an unseen figure backhands her, knocking her into the wall.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

More flames and explosions.

</SCENE>

VOICE : . . . is one person.

<SCENE>

A silhouette advances through the flames, buildings crumbling as he = passes.=20 There is a rather obvious axe slung across his back.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

LAURENCE dashes across some catwalk, machine pistol in one hand, = sword in the=20 other. Bullets everywhere. Several goons do swan dives and screams.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

LILITH, in a room with wall-screens showing maps of the world, = watches as the=20 lights on the maps begin to go out one by one. She murmurs, "It's = up to you=20 now, 007 . . ."

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

Above in the sky, the moon is eclipsed. A trumpet-call echoes across = the=20 night sky, dark angelic figures blotting out the stars as they = descend.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

DOMINIQUE, chained to an altar-stone in the middle of a vast dark=20 ampitheatre, struggles.

</SCENE>

<SCENE>

MICHAEL and LAURENCE cross blades, silhouetted dramatically against = flames=20 and darkness, a shattered London (or Heaven?) in the background.

</SCENE>

MICHAEL's VOICE : Time for the end of days.

---

 

- ------=_NextPart_000_00F3_01BF45BD.810E5980-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:12:34 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> The Soul of a New Machine At 6:27 PM -0500 12/13/99, Rev. Pee Kitty wrote: >On Mon, 13 Dec 1999, Douglas Muir wrote: > [...] >> 10k at a time, but have received no reply yet. As a public note on a tangent... I almost never log on during weekends. Anything sent to me on a Friday will languish till Monday, or, depending on how much work I get buried under, Tuesday or Wednesday. (I had 150 messages showing up in my box today... And executive playtest comments to make, and other stuff that took precidence...) So if you send me something on Friday, don't be surprised if you don't see something till _late_ Monday! O:> (And, on another tangent, I hope the scenerio can find a home -- somewhere I can go skim it on my browser.) - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:15:52 -0600 From: Shadowstar Subject: IN> Another IN Movie Trailer - 'Falling Stars' Since I think 'tis the season for Movie Trailers based on In Nomine (can't let Maya soak up _all_ the spotlight either), I present my own movie trailer. . . You may find said trailer here: http://home.centurytel.net/shdwstar/in-nomine/falling_stars/movie_trailer.html Comments, Scorn, what have you, always welcome _privately_. (I also admit that I intentionally made bits of it Cheezy. Deal. };;;>) Be seeing you, - - Tafka J. = shadowstar@centurytel.net # Balseraph of Fate, Marquis of Delusions of Grandeur * http://home.centurytel.net/shdwstar/in-nomine ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:31:00 -0500 From: neelk@cswcasa.com Subject: Re: IN> How powerful are Heaven and Hell? J. Michael Smith wrote: > >Creation could just be destroyed by the sheer destructive power of the >War, as well. The best analogy is a full scale war between global >nuclear powers. Neither side really wants to do that much damage, but >that doesn't mean it won't happen. That brings me to a question >though: Exactly how powerful are Heaven and Hell as complete entities? Superiors I suggests that David could, with difficulty, destroy an entire city with giant earthquakes. This is rather weaker than I made the archangels and demon princes IMC. To pick a typical example: Jean was considered a moderately powerful archangel, and he had the job of maintaining the laws of physics and preventing Vapula from rewriting them. (Yes, that meant that unchecked Vapula could do things like change fundamental constants and physical laws.) However, IMC the princes and archangels avoided manifesting on the corporeal realm because their very presence distorted reality to fit their word. Hence the hallucinatory imagery of the book of Revelations: once angels and demons entered the universe /en masse/, things got screwy. Even the presence of an AA or DP on Earth caused enough of a disturbance that it could be detected from the celestial plane. So they were hesitant to intervene directly, and preferred to work with relatively weak proxies like the PCs. And even they had to be careful to avoid doing things that could create large disturbances. IMO, this is a decision that should be made on a per-campaign basis -- if you want to do the men-like-gods thing, it is reasonable to say that sufficiently advanced tech can give humans powers as good as or better than anything a demon can do. How bad is a Balseraph in a world where MKULTRA has mind-control drugs? OTOH, you may (as I did IMC) want a universe where H&H are at the top of the food chain, and humanity is the focus of attention of powers that were old when the universe was young. Then it makes sense to have powerful supernatural forces. - -- Neel Krishnaswami neelk@cswv.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:32:07 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> a coupla (odd?) questions > >In my campaigns, the Undead can repent. Archangels can remove any >Discord > >they have and can realign them with Heaven. HOWEVER, Laurence doesn't > >really approve too heartily of it and so these reformed undead are >usually > >paired with a angel to keep and eye on them. >[major snipping] > >Neat ideas, you could also use a variation of something that appeared in a >campeign I played in. Some of the gods assosiated with the undead had an >attunement for them that made their physical body have to be totally >destroyed to actually kill them. Sort of burning them, droping them in >acid, etc you merely had a corpse that would come back to life. Neat. :) >Another thing one can do is have Archangels grant them very high level >vessels (above 6). This would allow them to survive a much greater >beating. While the undead *can't* get a NEW vessel (as their soul is bound to their current one, except under GM house rules), they might be able to have a Superior up the level of their current vessel. :) >Also you mention that some of your modifications would make the Undead too >tough in celestial combat, however I was under the impression the Undead >couldn't enter into celestial combat because they didn't have a celestial >form. Oh, no, I was making reference to Celestial combat as the normal arena in which the stripping of forces takes place. Until the undead can seperate soul from body (thus, becoming NOTundead, or unundead :), then Celestial combat would be, you're right, an impossibility. - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com Believe those who are seeking the truth; doubt those who find it. - --Andre Gide ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:46:06 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether >From: Gregory Gietzen > > Yves: "What a piece of work is a man, how noble in reason, how infinite >in > > faculties, in form and moving how express and admirable, in action how >like > > an angel, in apprehension how like a god" (Hamlet, II.2.303-6). > > Shakespeare's work continues to inspire and illuminate, which would >indicate > > Yves. > >but isn't hamlet saying that in bitter sarcasm? i can see yves having a >hand >in shakespeare, but too many of his plays end in tragedy for kronos not to >have one too, IMHO But is the audience doomed to repeat the mistakes of the characters, or learn from them? Bah, I shall say Kobal. SFAIK, Shakespeare had very little original work, but did very well with what he stole. A bit of a cosmic joke, really, having such a talented man do wonders with other people's work. Then again, that is something like the basis of science, I believe. anyway.... - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five. - --Groucho Marx ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:51:36 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1457 > > Perry Lloyd > > >Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > >> > > >>Yes, I think Hell, as well as Heaven, can be divided into War and > > >>Peace parties. The difference is that, in Heaven, War vs. Peace > > >>is approximately Justice vs. Mercy, while in Hell, War vs. Peace > > >>is approximately Destruction vs. Corruption. > > > > > >So, why would the ultimate battle between Heaven and Hell be the > > >end of Creation? Or is that only if HEAVEN wins? > >Creation could just be destroyed by the sheer destructive power of the >War, as well. The best analogy is a full scale war between global >nuclear powers. Neither side really wants to do that much damage, but >that doesn't mean it won't happen. That brings me to a question >though: Exactly how powerful are Heaven and Hell as complete entities? CDAU Oh, I'd say that up the specific GM, but I'd hazard a guess at, oh . . . 36. - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused. - --Anonymous ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:51:54 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Re: in_nomine-digest V1 #1457 > > Perry Lloyd > > >Earl Wajenberg wrote: > > >> > > >>Yes, I think Hell, as well as Heaven, can be divided into War and > > >>Peace parties. The difference is that, in Heaven, War vs. Peace > > >>is approximately Justice vs. Mercy, while in Hell, War vs. Peace > > >>is approximately Destruction vs. Corruption. > > > > > >So, why would the ultimate battle between Heaven and Hell be the > > >end of Creation? Or is that only if HEAVEN wins? > >Creation could just be destroyed by the sheer destructive power of the >War, as well. The best analogy is a full scale war between global >nuclear powers. Neither side really wants to do that much damage, but >that doesn't mean it won't happen. That brings me to a question >though: Exactly how powerful are Heaven and Hell as complete entities? CDAU Oh, I'd say that up the specific GM, but I'd hazard a guess at, oh . . . 36 each. - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused. - --Anonymous ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:59:21 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: Re: IN> Shedim possession of a PC > > Ok, the whole issue of is a human possessed in control or is the Shedim >is > > deliberately blurred in the rules. The answer is they both are. Which > > works out pretty good for NPCs. However, one of my player characters is >now > > possessed so any advice on how to handle this? > >Personally, I would just privately tell the player what had happened to >them, ask them to keep it a secret, and roleplay accordingly... if the >Shedite has an agenda, give the player an idea of it, and ask him to >subtlely work towards it. > >Of course, my players are all just evil enough to ENJOY the situation... >making the other players wonder just "what the hell happened to Bert? He's >acting pretty damn strange all of a sudden...." Bitchin' :) I whole-heartedly agree. - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn. - --Alvin Toffler ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:19:47 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> Trailer : The End Of Days Is Not Enough At 10:58 PM +0000 12/13/99, Genevieve Cogman wrote: >
Okay, okay. So I went to the cinema >recently.
Microsoft Outlook Express does it again. - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:14:05 -0400 From: Douglas Muir Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether >I just accidentally sent this on to the INWO list. Whoops. Apologies if >anyone got stuck reading it twice. > >As I procrastinate working on my final project for theatre history, a >possible tether springs to mind, one that could, conceivably, be linked to >any (or all) of three Superiors: The Globe Theatre, in London. Sure. Cool. >Now granted, we're on Globe Three at this point, and it isn't even were >Globe One stood. However, the potency of the idea behind the Globe might be >strong enough to make it a tether. Oh certainly. >Marc: Sounds odd, but in 1576, Richard Burbage build The Theatre, just >north of London, which was the first commercial theatrical establishment in >the West. In 1599, when he got into a dispute with the landlord, Burbage >and pals, Shakespeare included, disassembled The Theatre in the night, moved >it across the London Bridge, and built into the Globe, using the same >timbers. Sounds almost like Janus... >Yves: "What a piece of work is a man, how noble in reason, how infinite in >faculties, in form and moving how express and admirable, in action how like >an angel, in apprehension how like a god" (Hamlet, II.2.303-6). >Shakespeare's work continues to inspire and illuminate, which would indicate >Yves. Yeah. Shakespeare's Fate was to be a bad actor, worse husband, thwarted homosexual, truckle-boy to various creepy noble patrons, and finally to die in a tavern brawl a la Marlowe... except under circumstances so scandalous as to discredit English theater for a generation or more. Good thing for all of us, Yves' people were on the job. >Gabriel: "O for a muse of fire, that would ascend / The brightest heaven of >invention." The inspiration behind Shakespeare, the divine spark might >point to Gabriel. Yeah. Most plausible of the three, especially with the Belial connection. But what about Eli? Surely he'd be a strong contender. Remember, he was still an AA in good standing back then. Doug M. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:52:24 -0500 From: Elizabeth McCoy Subject: Re: IN> a coupla (odd?) questions At 8:44 AM -0500 12/13/99, nukenin@concentric.net wrote: >1) can the undead repent, and if so, what happens? Yes. They remain undead. See the Corporeal Player's Guide... >2) does a Jordi kyrio gain any dissonance if members of his swarm get >squished? Yes. >would the corporeal song of healing help? It can; it's up to the GM, but if the swarm is healed up to normal hits, that generally serves to make the survivors healthy enough that dissonance can be avoided. (Unless you're a very strict GM!) > would the corporeal >song of form give you a bunch of *very* swat-resistant flies? Yes. Or at least one very swat-resistant fly! >would the >celestial song of form let you change one bug type to another (ants to >scorpions, for example)? can you use a numinous corpus with a swarm? Ooooooooog..... On both of those, I'd be inclined to say no, you have to apply those Songs to a single bug at a time. Mostly because I can't think of how it would work! Of the two, Form is more likely to be swarm-friendly (so long as the same changes were made to all). - --emccoy@nh.ultranet.com // arcangel@io.com In Nomine Line Editor GURPS, Roleplayers, In Nomine stuff; Art: http://www.io.com/~arcangel/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:53:11 -0500 From: "Gregory Gietzen" Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether > Yeah. Shakespeare's Fate was to be a bad actor, worse husband, thwarted > homosexual, truckle-boy to various creepy noble patrons, and finally to die > in a tavern brawl a la Marlowe... except under circumstances so scandalous[...] Actually, Marlowe was a secret agent for Wolsingham's government, and the tavern-brawl story was actually a cover. Marlowe had gotten a little too out of line with the playboy routine, and Wolsingham wanted him to take a VERY long vacation. Let's see -- a famous playwright whose chief work deals with the summoning of demons, and a smoke-and-mirrors cover-up of his death. I don't think it would take very much alteration at all to turn into an IN situation. > [...]as to discredit English theater for a generation or more. Kronos wasn't needed. I think Kobal had CATS in the works for eons... > But what about Eli? Surely he'd be a strong contender. Remember, he was > still an AA in good standing back then. I thought about Eli, but somehow he just didn't nab me as strongly as Gabriel. (Of course, it was like 4 A.M. when I was thinking of this.) One of my other ideas for tether areas involves 42nd Street -- it used to be Shal-Mari on Earth, but now the Disney store has moved in, purchased a couple of theatres, and worked with the mayor to clean up the street -- or at least get the prostitutes into mouse ears... Anyway, I can easily see this as a play by, Children, Protection, and backed by Trade against the Shal-Mari faction. But on the other side of it, maybe they're playing into Mammon's hands? G ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 21:26:42 -0600 From: Kris Overstreet Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether At 07:14 PM 12/13/99 -0400, you wrote: >But what about Eli? Surely he'd be a strong contender. Remember, he was >still an AA in good standing back then. Two things here. First, Eli isn't concerned with the stature of the creation so much as the act. The act of creating a play, IMHO, does -not- necessarily happen at the theater. Second, considering how much revisionist press has been put out about Slick Willie S' 'plagarism,' one wonders just how much creating Shakespeare actually -did- do there. In general, no, I wouldn't put Eli in as a possible Tetherholder at the Globe. Blandine is much more likely. Redneck Kris Overstreet, long may he wave.... http://www.detnet.com/redneck/ - Personal homepage http://www.wren-spot.com/wlp/ - Business webpage - -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.12 GO d-(++) s+:+ a- C++>$ U@ P?>++ L E? W++$ N+++ o? k- w O? M>+ V? PS+ PE Y+ PGP- t---(OS++) 5++ X-- R+(+++) tv- b+++ DI++ D- G e h+ r- y+ - -----END GEEK CODE BLOCK----- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 21:29:26 -0600 From: Kris Overstreet Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether At 07:53 PM 12/13/99 -0500, you wrote: >One of my other ideas for tether areas involves 42nd Street -- it used to be >Shal-Mari on Earth, but now the Disney store has moved in, purchased a >couple of theatres, and worked with the mayor to clean up the street -- or >at least get the prostitutes into mouse ears... Anyway, I can easily see >this as a play by, Children, Protection, and backed by Trade against the >Shal-Mari faction. But on the other side of it, maybe they're playing into >Mammon's hands? Nobody who does any serious looking into the business affairs and work ethic of the Disney corporation after Walt's death could -ever- consider its actions to be even remotely angelic. 42nd Street is a strictly diabolic power struggle, IMHO. Redneck Kris Overstreet, long may he wave.... http://www.detnet.com/redneck/ - Personal homepage http://www.wren-spot.com/wlp/ - Business webpage - -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.12 GO d-(++) s+:+ a- C++>$ U@ P?>++ L E? W++$ N+++ o? k- w O? M>+ V? PS+ PE Y+ PGP- t---(OS++) 5++ X-- R+(+++) tv- b+++ DI++ D- G e h+ r- y+ - -----END GEEK CODE BLOCK----- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 99 11:29:43 PST From: "Azrael" Subject: Re: IN> What Demons are Really After > If anything, the Shedite is in a better moral position, because it is > forced to spread evil under duress. I assume that you are talking about dissonance conditions? Their dissonance conditions reflect their nature, it is who they are, and thus IMO does not put them in a better moral position. If you are talking about being told by a Prince, then they would be chosen because of their abilities and desires. Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 99 11:38:14 PST From: "Azrael" Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether > I just accidentally sent this on to the INWO list. Whoops. Apologies if > anyone got stuck reading it twice. What manner of a list is that? Azrael ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:03:49 PST From: "Perry Lloyd" Subject: IN> INS/MV [SPOILERS] (Was: What Demons are Really After) >Perry Lloyd wrote: > > > > I find it hard NOT to do a Christian IN, especially after reading the > > original INS/MV upon which the game is based. > >I'd love to do this, but my French sucks. Care to give us a comparison? > >Doctor TOC > >P.S. Hi folks, I'm back! Well, I'm not sure how much I'm allowed to say because of copyright legal crap. But I believe that a comparison would be okay for the list. Here ya go, Doc.! In Nomine Satanis / Magna Veritas spoilers ahead!!!! (I'll assume you're familiar with IN ala SJGames) My copy of INS/MV (In Nomine Satanis / Magna Veritas) is a small, brown hardback book, one side is Magna Veritas, the other is In Nomine Satanis. So, once you reach the end of the Magna Veritas side you've also reached the end of the In Nomine Satanis side, because they meet in the middle. Anyway! INS/MV doesn't seperate things into Corporeal/Ethereal/Celestial INS/MV has no Forces, but still six attributes: * Force (Stength of Body), * Volonté (Strength of Mind/Will), * Perçeption (guess what that is), * Agilité (again, take a stab in he dark as to its meaning), * Précision, and * Apparence (Appearance for the kids at home, but it means more than physical appearance, its a combination of Personality/Charisma and Physical Appearance, if you will) In INS/MV, Skills and stats are still measured on a 1-6 scale, but its not an equal distribution, there's more distance between 4 and 5 than there is between 1 and 2. For example, Climbing/1 costs 1pt, Climbing/2 costs 2pts, Climbing/3 costs 4pts, Climbing/4 costs 8pts. Since beginning characters can't buy a skil higher than 4 (players only get 8pts to distribute between skills) there's no cost listed for skills higher than 4. Attributes are purchased at a 1:1 ratio, but beginning characters only receive 20pts to distribute between the six. So, that's 3 average, plus 2 to place elsewhere. Maximum attribute level at character creation is 5. *Every* celestial starts off with the equivilant of Discord, called "Limitations" or Limitations in english. Yeah, yeah. Anyway, these "limitations" are sometimes doled out as puinishments by Superiors, much like Discord. Oh, yes, there's no Symphonic references anywhere and I have yet to see anything in the book resembling "disturbances" or anything. And there's no Perception/Willpower split, because as there are no choir/bands, thus no "resonances." There are no "Words", except to Superiors, so far as I can tell. INS/MV is very obvertly based upon the Catholic faith. INS/MV has no Vessels, thus no vessel costs. So far as I understand it, Angels and Demons are bound into the bodies of once-living humans, trapped there until they are killed. No innate ability to insubstantiate and float through walls or return to the Celestial plane. But they do have the innate ability to produce an Aura by which they may reveal their true nature. When celestials die in INS/MV, they cannot return to earth for 1d6 New incarnation in . . . 1-2 1d6 x 1000 years 3-4 1d6 x 100 years 5 1d6 x 10 years 6 1d6 years 7+ 1d6 months You get bonuses/minuses to the die roll bases uopn good service, how useful your skills/abilities would be to a given mission, whether or not the GM wants you back in play, if your character's limitations would be poor for a mission. It's kinda chart-heavy at times. Oh, and Superiors. There's no attunements or anything, no references to "songs" or anything, just super powers. Superiors can still be summoned, though. Each Superior also has an Avatar, who's a manifestation of the Superior on Earth. Differences in Superiors: DEMON PRINCES Abalam, DP of Insanity Baalberity, DP of Messengers Bifrons, DP of the Dead Caym, DP of Animals Crocell, DP of Cold Furfur, DP of Heavy Metal Gaziel, DP of Earth Kronos, DP of Eternity Malthus, DP of Disease Morax, DP of Artistic Works Nog, DP of Sloth Ouikka, DP of the Air Saminga, DP of Vampires Scox, DP of Souls Shaytan, DP of Ugliness Uphir, DP of Pollution Vephar, DP of Oceans There is no Fleurity ARCHANGELS Catherine, AA of Women, Gabriel, AA of Fire, Georges, AA of Purification, and Jésus, AA of God, all have no Servitors It is clearly stated in the GM's guide that "Dr. Janus and Mr. Valefor" are one and the same, with Janus being a secret agent in Hell. Alain, AA of Cultures Ange, AA of Converts Daniel, AA of Stone Didier, AA of Communication Dominique, AA of Justice Emmanuel, AA of the Double Life (essentially his angels masquerade as demons, then betray them and dice 'em up good) Francis, AA of Diplomancy Guy, AA of Caretakers (healers, essentially, who tend to the wounded) Jean-Lur, AA of Protectors Joseph, AA of the Inquisition Walther, AA of Exorcists Yves, AA of Origins There is no Zadkiel. There is no Khalid. Oh, and the dice system isn't like the IN system, they use die 1 as the 10's place, dice 2 as the One's place and the Third die to measure degree of success and failure. There's a chart and stuff . . . I'm pooped for now. Anything else? - -Perry perrylloyd@hotmail.com I would feel more optimistic about a bright future for man if he spent less time proving that he can outwit Nature and more time tasting her sweetness and respecting her seniority. - --E. B. White ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 03:27:20 GMT From: "Trey Reilly" Subject: Re: IN> Possible Tether > >But what about Eli? Surely he'd be a strong contender. Remember, > >he >was still an AA in good standing back then. (text wanders off into the dark and is eaten by a Grue) >First, Eli isn't concerned with the stature of the creation so much as the >act. The act of creating a play, IMHO, does -not- necessarily happen at the >theater. Oooh. Ouch. :-) The entire theatrical profession got dissed there. Forget the techies, the costumers, and the director. Forget an actors interpretation of role. Here's the thing about theatre. Live theatre is different every night. The stage manager calls things slightly differently, the lighting op has slightly different timing, the actors find new ways of understanding...(none of these things are really supposed to happen, but they do) every single night. Every night the audience is different. You'd be surprised how much that changes things, and how big an impact it really has. But it does. With an audience that laughs, you hold certain moments more. With one that's only responding to more poignant moments, you turn up the emotion there. (when they get bored, you rush monologues..) The same script with the same actors and the same costumes and the same set can be an utterly different production from one night to the next. That's why people go see theatrical productions instead of just staying home and renting the video. There's something about the energy between actors and audience. One heck of a lot of creation there, in rehearsal and performance. IMHO. - --Trey lighting geekette ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ End of in_nomine-digest V1 #1459 ******************************** The material here is (C) 1999 Steve Jackson Games, Incorporated. All rights reserved.